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Posted: 10/28/2006 11:13:11 AM EDT
[#1]
It has to do with people disliking their attitude to the public shooting community, and they focus all their attention to the LEO/Military side.
Also the fact that people will pay outrageous sums of money for anything with the Colt (Cult) name. I have a Colt Officers 1911, and I bought it because the price was right. Oh yeah, FLAME AWAY ARFCOM! |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 11:24:31 AM EDT
[#2]
Colts rule.
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Posted: 10/28/2006 11:30:15 AM EDT
[#3]
Nothing 
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Posted: 10/28/2006 11:57:33 AM EDT
[#4]
+1 I don't think anyone has an issue with the quality of current Colt products. What some people have a problem with are policies of the Colt company. What other people have a problem with is the pricing of Colt products. What yet other people have a problem with are the attitudes of some Colt product owners. I think Colt makes great rifles, and I'd buy them if the price was right - I just won't overpay for them. |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 12:55:03 PM EDT
[#5]
They make great rifles, now if their attitude toward us civilians would change.
 Elvis |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 1:03:18 PM EDT
[#6]
I really like them. I have no problem if others think RRA or Bushy are as good. It is just stupid when these owners start trashing Colt for no reason.
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Posted: 10/28/2006 2:10:35 PM EDT
[#7]
Nothing is wrong with Colt. They make a great rifle. The problem is that their mystique has people paying way too much for a rifle. Basically, they are no better than other tier 1 rifles out there. The military just happens to issue Colt rifles, so everybody thinks they are the best. They are very good, but not the best.
Personally, I would say that they share the top tier with several manufacturers. But, people are willing to shell out more money for a rifle with a prancing pony on the side. I say: let them. I would buy a Colt because I appreciate quality AR's. But, the price would have to be right. I can have an LMT (who is on the same tier as Colt) for about $500 less than a Colt. Oh, and Colt, as a company, is too high on themselves to acknowledge the civie shooter population. |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 2:15:41 PM EDT
[#8]
That's why everyone "In the Know" have/or want at least one!! 
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Posted: 10/28/2006 3:15:07 PM EDT
[#9]
From what I can piece together, I believe the price is more supply and demand related than mystique. I recently tried eight dealers on the web who are advertising Colt rifles, to try and find an LE6920, and only one dealer had them in stock. According to that dealer, the current CEO William M. Keys (a retired U.S. Marine Lt. General) is in favor of civilians owning Colt products, but most of the production currently goes to the military. However, it would be nice to see a press release or public statement from him acknowledging Colt's position. I won't hold my breath on it though......... |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 3:57:40 PM EDT
[#10]
Quite a bit of it comes from folks who think Colt "just happened" to get USGI contracts. For example:
This ignores the fact that Colt bought the rights and the AR-15 name, and then over the next few decades spent millions on R&D and got several rifles/carbine adopted as Standard A. The typical AR manufacturer simply copies items developed by Colt that are not patented, or the patent has expired (sometimes before). Another aspect of Colt bashing is that Colt is against civie sales, so they buy LMT. Here is an example:
Colt sells carbines to distributors who are free to sell to whom ever they can (legally). Same as does Remington, Mossberg, etc. LMT won't. You have to be LEO to purchase a LMT carbine (unless you build one from parts, beware of tax issues if you do). Colt's are scarce because demand is up, and supply is down since Colt is delivering over 50,000 M4/A1 Carbines a year to RIA. |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 3:58:54 PM EDT
[#11]
Great Product [ARs]
Shitty Management 
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Posted: 10/28/2006 4:25:09 PM EDT
[#12]
Most people are just mad that their non Colt rifles don't have all the Colt goodies that make them "Mil-Spec". These are special features such as the official Colt sear block, front take down screw and large pin fire control groups, along with other "Mil-Spec" items like the half moon bolt carrier and high shelf lowers. As you can see, all of these features are used by the military so Colt is the only company that produces a Mil-Spec rifle. Everybody else is just jealous that they can't have these special military only features that are available only on a Colt. Maybe one day the other manufacturers will catch up and obtain the intensive technological skills needed to produce all of these "Mil-Spec" features, but that may be several hundred years from now at best.
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Posted: 10/28/2006 4:35:46 PM EDT
[#13]
The only problem I have with Colt is the fact that Colt has snubbed the civilian firearms market; electing to do business only with military and law enforcement agencies only.
It is not that Colt does not make a very good product; or, cannot produce products that the civilian market is not interested in, example, the LE 1020 gas piston AR15 / M4 carbine that was announced and highly touted at the 206 SHOT Show. I much prefer Colt (spare) parts whenever I can get them! Colt just has this Fuc* You attitude to the civilian market; and as we all know, attitude can be everything! |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 4:35:50 PM EDT
[#14]
Naw, it's more like they sold Colt's soul to the State of Connecticut by default. Rumor has it that the State invested all that R&D money through numerous loans/grants and they frown on Colt hitting-the-road to cheaper-to-build pastures. Plus they are surrounded by the money'd-elite of the northeast...who all seem to despise firearms. It's the proverbial rock and a hard spot. I am hereby extending a hardy big Texas welcome to all at Colt and invite them to come on down. Colt is an American institution and should absolutely be built a little further west than downtown Connecticut. :-) Mark LaRue |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 4:37:33 PM EDT
[#15]
No civilian AR15 is mil-spec even Colt,I would say they meet the spec to a degree...a real mil-spec M4A1 is one made by Colt and marked Us Govt Property..forgive the rant im just tired of the word mil-spec when ever AR15s are talked about.If I could get a 6920 up my way id have one but even CMMG has a model equal to the Colt in features that are standard and uses the same stringent testing in parts but doesnt have a mil-spec telestock but you can get it in a SOCCOM barreled model plust the lower has standard parts ..so except for the stock id say the CMMG has the edge and its cheaper than a Colt.Id still have one for my collection though.
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Posted: 10/28/2006 4:39:46 PM EDT
[#16]
People don't dislike their firearms, it's the company's and Colt rifle owners' attitudes.
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Posted: 10/28/2006 4:40:42 PM EDT
[#17]
Others are not real familiar with current Colt products. Here is a good example:
pinned in sear block: Dropped in about 1998 screw front pivot pin: Also dropped in about 1998 neutered half round carrier: Dropped in in about 2005 Colt does still use big hole trigger groups, but at lease they are of high quality. It is true that the lowers are machined so as not to accept a DIAS.
If the other manufactures manage to grow a pair, I suspect they will follow Colt's lead and also use proper bolt carriers. Not aware of any doing that, yet? Suspose it might take "several hundred years". |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 8:23:49 PM EDT
[#18]
Somewhere in the jumble of my shop I have a jen-u-wine Colt catalog of recent vintage. Gun shop where I found it said it was the first one he had seen in some years;he had about five of them. I guess Colt still loves us and would like us to buy their guns.
Yeah, my AR is a Colt, and it works fine and shoots straight, but I get the feeling that, if it gives trouble, I'm on my own. Moon |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 9:31:47 PM EDT
[#19]
Not unless you gotz any worts .... |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 9:36:03 PM EDT
[#20]
Love my Colts. Alot of people try to find reasons to dislike Colt but I'll be damned if I can find any. Colts are reliable, have great fit and finish and are absolute quality. The argument over Colts policy on sales to the public and the price of their products bother me about as much as whether to use single or two ply toilet paper. I'm not bashing other AR type rifles as I have owned two Bushmasters in the past, both of which served their purpose well. My preference just happens to lie in Colt.
Will |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 9:39:50 PM EDT
[#21]
I personally prefer the 4 ply Charmin |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 9:52:00 PM EDT
[#22]
I love my Colt's, even the Brand New In Box 6920 that I picked up last Tuesday  Not bad for a civilian factory worker eh? 
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Posted: 10/28/2006 9:54:37 PM EDT
[#23]
They all beat sage brush. |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 9:08:11 PM EDT
[#24]
Absolutely nothing wrong with a Colt! Colt just decided to build M4s and M4s only! Probably due to the demand. FN took on the M16s A2 through A4. Your guess is as good as mine?....But as far as I'm concerned, there is nothing wrong with a healthy dose of competition! Mort |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 10:08:13 PM EDT
[#25]
 Nothing is wrong with colt, see I have one!!!!   Colt 6920 |
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Posted: 10/28/2006 10:36:53 PM EDT
[#26]
The last ArmaLite 20" M15A2 I picked up a couple of weeks ago had the Proper Bolt Carrier in it, fully shielded firing pin and full circle carrier
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Posted: 10/29/2006 3:46:08 AM EDT
[#27]
People just always want what they can't have or is in low demand. Nothing wrong with Colt but the price. I have had colts and now have bushies and RRA. I personally prefer my RRA over all I have owned so far.
JR |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 4:51:33 AM EDT
[#28]
my only beef with Colt is the odd size pins.
If you gave me one I would not complain, but I would not buy one. |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 5:14:15 AM EDT
[#29]
[quote]Quoted:
Most people are just mad that their non Colt rifles don't have all the Colt goodies that make them "Mil-Spec". These are special features such as the official Colt sear block, front take down screw and large pin fire control groups, along with other "Mil-Spec" items like the half moon bolt carrier and high shelf lowers. As you can see, all of these features are used by the military so Colt is the only company that produces a Mil-Spec rifle. Everybody else is just jealous that they can't have these special military only features that are available only on a Colt. Maybe one day the other manufacturers will catch up and obtain the intensive technological skills needed to produce all of these "Mil-Spec" features, but that may be several hundred years from now at best. this is one example of why colt is not even on my radar. had an interested party in an ar i listed years back. once he discovered it was not "COLT" he backed out. of course he had no clue as to why he did not want it. "had to be a colt" so i sold him the colt 6520 i had for considerably more. the colt was an investment bu prior to the Crime Bill. as mentioned above, the i"f it ain't colt" mantra keeps their price high. their cust svc like some other (H&K) gun mfg's is lacking. as is their attitude towards the civvie market. myself i prefer to support the little guy's like CMMG who do have good cust svc. they also remember when they were a start up business, their cust base small as it was grew as they did. as for colt. good firearm but overpriced considering competitors product. which shoots the same ammo, accepts same accessories, and does the same thing to a paper target or varmit @ 0-X yards. |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 5:24:35 AM EDT
[#30]
Colt is: 1) Overpriced 2) Very anti-civillian Both of these make them less than competitive vs the other AR makers... |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 5:50:59 AM EDT
[#31]
I look using Colt parts: barrels, handguards, upper receivers (small hole), buttstocks, etc. I would never buy a complete rifle, simply because I can build the same thing for half the price. My SP1 clone cost me $475 to build and has a mil-spec pivot pin. If I had bought a complete, used Colt it would have cost $800 and I would be stuck with a large hole receiver. I think Colt's would be worth a good 25% more if they used standard receivers.
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Posted: 10/29/2006 6:02:32 AM EDT
[#32]
+1 |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 6:25:48 AM EDT
[#33]
My M15 mid length from Armalite also had a full BCG and the GG&G upper I got last week got one as well.
Is Colt anti civilian or is it they have a right as a US company to produce a product as they see fit and sell it to the group they see fit to sell it to? There is a huge difference between a company deciding that military/LEO is where they want to concentrate their effort and being anti civilian as some are claiming. Personally I don't care either way I don't waste time wringing my hands over issues like this. As a greedy capitalist pig I am all for a company deciding their own direction. |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 9:41:03 AM EDT
[#34]
CMMG has been selling rifles with a proper bolt carrier for quite a while (if you want it). |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 10:09:04 AM EDT
[#35]
DITTO! |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 10:12:08 AM EDT
[#36]
I like small AR manufacturers who value the civillian market but also make dynomite products and have dynomite customer service.
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Posted: 10/29/2006 10:16:40 AM EDT
[#37]
IMO, Colt makes the best factory rifle out there.
However, you can build a rifle of equal quality, and better suited to your needs, for the same (or less) money. |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 10:21:00 AM EDT
[#38]
When I'm finally done building my AR we can test it with a Colt rifle side-by-side.
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Posted: 10/29/2006 10:32:31 AM EDT
[#39]
+1 Most people would rather not spend the extra few hundred bucks for Colt so they blame their company policies and whatnot, even though nobody has ever been able to establish that Colt is inferior to any other AR in any way. |
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Posted: 10/29/2006 10:47:03 AM EDT
[#40]
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Posted: 10/29/2006 11:16:44 AM EDT
[#41]
I have nothing against Colts. I just will not pay the extra money for a rifle whos parts are not interchangeable with my other ARs. It kinda defeats the purpose of having such a modular weapons system when they use non standard parts. If they biult them to accept standard Ar15/M16 pins, parts etc I would probably have owned one by now. I look at it as what do you get for your money. If you want a highly colectable rifle you will not madify buy a colt. If you want something you can mod till your hearts content and have no intention of selling it buy an RRA, LMT, Stag, etc..
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Posted: 10/29/2006 1:03:15 PM EDT
[#42]
Quality is good. I hate their out of spec pin/holes though, personally.
You can get in spec parts at a better price with quality just as good or better if you build your own AR-15. |
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