Back to Allen Engineering and the AEM-5 and AEM5-30’s, I kinda recall Ron making some AEM-5’s bored out to .30 cal. Same length and size as an AEM5, not the bigger AEM5-30. Does anyone have any experience on these? How would it fare as a suppressor for the AR platform in bigger calibers like 6.5,6.8 and 300 Blackout? Possibly bolt action scenarios

I have one of the AEM5s in 30 cal.  Works great on a 6.5 Grendel.

I saw a couple of AEM5s bored for 6.5mm on EE a couple of months ago. Kicking myself a bit for not jumping on one.

Thanks for that info. I’m hoping my SCAR20 is concentric. I wanted an MK20 SSR clone, which used the 1 piece Surefire mount for the unobtainium FA762SV/SS which is also a reflex can.  But it was easier to get the AEM5-30. Hopefully I’ll find a way to mount it on this rifle.  

So, if I reading this correctly, it turns it into every muzzle threaded suppressor out there?

At this point you could eyeball it for concentricity, but I’ll still use my alignment rods.  I do not “freak out” if the alignment rod is not perfect, but I do not shoot it as such either.

This exists out there. It was sold in the EE not too long ago. I don’t know if it was made by Ron, but I asked him to make me one and he politely declined due to his backlog.

I still don't get how indexing then off a correct muzzle thread shoulder is bad when that's how most any other QD suppressor mount works. If then the requirement is (by dogmatic approach or something else...) to use the barrel with a two-piece mount, there's additional chance of error since a completely separate item is used to hopefully center the can. Makes me think if Ops Inc started with a reflex-style over-the-barrel one-piece mount, now people would be calling a two-piece mount a bad idea.

I can put my AEM5 on other barrels and not need to pay for a specialty barrel or profiling service. Seems like I get to win with a one-piece mount.

My 18” WOA didn’t even have the step for the collar correct. It was 2.2” from crown when the spec calls for 2.4” from crown. Was really surprised to see that from WOA. Had to send it back and have them push the step back.

Then buy it. Run it. And do t worry about what other people are saying. But if you have a strike just know some people were letting you know that this could happen.

Will 5w50 work in my engine? Yes. Was it manufacturered around that weight? No. So I use 10w60  

It's always good to listen to the people who are experts in the field. Just my .02

Oh yea AE pic thread!

And that tight bore is EXACTLY why people are saying you should not fuck with the mounting system.

I am not really sure what all the fuss is.  I have seen a certain manufacturer who makes a one piece mount that is lose around the barrel and depends upon a right angle of the barrel for his mount to work, calling out the original collar system as dumb.

No, the collar mount is not dumb.  When it fails, it fails because of poor barrel runout, poor barrel profiling or sheer cutting of a barrel at a point of non-concentric alignment.  If properly installed, the collar is preferred.

I think this one-piece has a lot of utility, and opens up the AEM market to other uses, like u see the rail installations, but still, it has a failure point at the barrel threads and/or the outer diameter of the barrel.

Is one design better or worse?  I do t think so.

I think either design requires alignment, attention to tollerences and other technical installation.

But, why should one manufacturer call out Ron’s work?

Some of this name calling is getting old.  Oh, and this manufacturer also sells collars and brakes (made to Ron’s spec). WTF ?

Ok, so from me, this all came about b/c i want a one piece mount for my Scar20. Why, you may ask? Well it’s b/c i want a clone of a MK20 SSR. I have the old scar 20 that was profiled for the SureFire FA762SV setup.

What’s odd is i have a SureFire MB762SSAL/RE and an AAC 51t SCAR MITER mount, but no cans that match those mounts. On the other hand, i have an AEM5-30 but no mount for that can. Getting a custom 1 piece mount made looks to not be an option unless i find a 3rd party willing to do the work. I don’t know who that would be.  Taking an existing 1/2x28 mount and converting it to 5/8x24 seems to not be a good idea. So it looks like i may dedicate this can to a 6.5 Grendel build or something.

Well, A) I was not referring to your company.  B) I don’t think Phil really did a whole lot of design work.  C) the over the barrel one-piece can be done as well as the collar two piece, but my point is one is not any better than the other in design.  What matters is execution.  A properly designed and well documented collar (2 piece) is perfect.  Not junk (quoted by another manufacturer).  The junk occurs in barrel manufacturing.  100% true.  Like wise, the OTB desig is junk if the inner diameter of the flange assembly is not rock solid right against the OD of the barrel (which the current design is not), which leaves the product wobbly and dependent upon a solid 90 degree cutoff of the barrel where the threads stop.  Ron has said repeatedly that he has attempted this deign and it fails often.  

My opinion is either design can work, but the manufacturing of the current OTB is not within tight enough tolerances to hold the alignment straight.

Bore is currently 7mm(.275). Just FYI. Switched to a slightly larger bore last fall when I started seeing the 1 piece mounts.

And this is why you are the FUCKING MAN. Stop the problem before it starts even though someone else created the problem.

People are just not grasping the fact that not all suppressor bore to caliber ratings are the same.

THIS! Thanks for everything you do Ron. Don’t know why anyone would give their money to that other company.

Pic Thread:
Attached File

Perfect.  The only Allen can "failures" that I have seen are those caused by someone else's product or poor installation, the latter usually being a function of the former.  I can think of several, Ron.  

1- barrels being sold as SPR / Mk12 that are NOT SPR profiled.  btw, there are a great many of these being sold.

2- rifle makers and others taking short cuts and making their own collars and brakes.  I think much of this is in the past, but you will notice very few Mk12 rifles being sold, as most of those companies stopped either making uppers and rifles or stopped using collars and brakes not being make by AE.

3- barrels with poor concentricity.  This is usually either super crap barrel making, or more often, someone cutting down a longer barrel.  When you cut a button broached barrel, you always need to test for concentricity, as the bore is not concentric throughout it journey to the muzzle.

4- the use of over the barrel contraptions that are not snug to the barrel.  This can be that the maker has chosen to create a device where the ID of the device is too large, thinking that maybe the OD of the host barrel might not to spec, or the user has chosen a barrel with  thin OD.  My personal feeling is that an "over the barrel" mounting device can be a very good thing, but it has to fit the barrel, and/or have internal shims and the barrel must be checked for proper spec at the end of the thread area.

Any of these situations will and has caused damage to an Allen can, and I think all of which, you, Ron, have fixed (while you should have charged the customer, I don't think you did), and none of which were caused by an Allen defect.

The bottom line is that as you increase the bore size, someone else is going to be critical of the decline in sound abatement due to the bigger aperture.  It can be a no-win for you, Ron, in the publicity game.  Which, I also know you pretty much ignore and stick to doing great work.

That is my 2-cents, but nobody paid me my fee.  .  I think the original design Allen cans are great.  I think some innovation to broaden the use of Allen style reflux cans is great (I think that is what they are called), and there have been a few companies prodding that along.  I think the market is what it is with two companies making similar cans.  What I do not think is appropriate is insults.  As a matter of fact, I might be in the minority (would not be the first time here on this forum), but I really do not care much about comparisons of one brand to another.  If the can fits and works, great.  The two entities making reflux Mk12 cans are making a different product that looks and works and fits the same, but are not the same, so I don't care to compare.

I think I am up to 4-cents now, so I will take my leave.  And, I will say, there are a lot of really smart suppressor people on this sub-forum, and I have learned a lot.

Reflex...

The reason the other guy gets so many insults or hate is because his marketing technique for his suppressor was insulting and hateful towards that customer.

Which in turn rubbed every single one of them the wrong way.

All good. He will sell his cans and Ron will sell his.

This all spawned from basically why someone else's muzzle mounted one piece OTB mount is not ideal for an AEM5. It might be great for another suppressor which also ends in M5 or even work just fine on Ron's new larger bore size AEM5.

When the guy who has personally made just about every single one of these suppressors since their adoption in the 90's says he would not run that on the product he makes, people should listen.

Hey guess what? More AE pictures!

My AEM5 came in today after having a good time getting routed all around the state. AAC SPR-M4 at the top, AEM5 .22 cal middle, and AEM5-30 bottom sans mounting system. I think I’m going to have to get the barrel turned down as I don’t think a standard collar is going to fit. The barrel is .780” and the tapered part is .667”.

Ron, is there a specific serial number cut off where you made the change to .275?

What was the bore dimension prior to switching to a slightly larger bore?


@k31user

Just an FYI, I had the barrel on my SCAR 20 profiled for my 12th model and I spun up a custom collar. While it suppressed great, there was significantly more back pressure and I could not get the rifle to cycle reliably unsuppressed. Swapping jets slightly reduced back pressure but did not resolve my cycling issues.

I have the original 1:12 twist barrel, but I would really like to hear if you experience any issues. I would love to run my 12th Model on my SCAR, but I need it to be reliable suppressed and unsuppressed, if you have luck with the new 1:10 barrel, I’ll pick one up and give it a try.

Yes, I’d be curious what mine is from ADCO

Measured mine with calipers - mine has the oversized bore, but was a more recent can. Honestly, I wish it had the tighter bore.

I wonder what kind of sound difference there would be…

I would wager to say negligible to the ear. I also am not planning to shoot a supersonic gas gun without ear pro any time soon.

I'll take a picture of the NT4 bore size and everyone will feel better about their AEM5s.

You can't tell a difference between them  sound level wise. A bit less chance of a baffle strike as well. Don't turn this into an issue because it isn't one.

Do you guys honestly think I would screw up the suppressor on purpose. I made them at .265 for years and finally decided to open it up to .275 last year and see if it would cut down on baffle strikes.
I had to repair 4 last year and would like to see less than that.

Nonissue. I've got one made for 6.8, so a fairly larger bore than the change here. I pretty much use it exclusively with 5.56 these days. If there's a difference in suppression between it and the older 5.56 with the .265 bore size, I sure as heck can't notice.

Frankly, with some of the odd barrel setups I've used (sorry Ron) I've been darn thankful for the larger opening of my can.

It appears my AEM5 that has a Form 3 filing date of December 2020 has the .275 bore size. It resides on an original USGI take off barrel. I am pleased to have a AEM5 made by Ron Allen himself.

Pic for the picture thread.

Tell you what. Anyone that doesn't want the larger bore, message me and I'll take their spot in line. 😉I'll gladly take a second Allen can, 0.010" nonwithstanding! As Ron said, it's a non issue.

when the man speaks, I listen to what he says. If you say there’s no issue and no difference, I’ll continue on with life and not have a second thought about it.

Has anyone ever worn out an AEM5?

Hell I’ll be in for one opened to over 0.300” so I can run my 6.5mm thru it.

Ron, sent you an IM when you have time.

LOL.

Tried to post something from Instagram but did not work.

Nice set up and looks like a super nice place to shoot. Your range? How far?

Ops 16th on my Colt.

ADCO did the barrel work. Nothing about it is clone correct but close enough for the girls I go with. Still need a flashlight mount and I need to krylon the whole thing.

Private range.
They have steel gongs of different sizes and shapes all the way out to 600yrds