10mm Glock KaBoom - >>> UPDATE: PISTOL RETURNED <<< - Page 6

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - 10mm Glock KaBoom - >>> UPDATE: PISTOL RETURNED <<< (Page 6 of 9)

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:12:00 PM EST

[#1]

EVERYONE LOVES PICTURES, RIGHT?

Someone suggested the cartridge ruptured out of battery.
It appears to me that the barrel is still fully locked to the slide.

Also, it appears the case head fully separated from the rest of the brass.
Very difficult to get a good photo. Shining a light down the barrel though,
I could clearly see light all the way around the brass case.
These photos were the best I could do.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:19:57 PM EST

[#2]

There's your proof of what an unsupported barrel does right there in your last photo....

That and the ammo was probably too hot.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:22:23 PM EST

[#3]

glock should warranty that... serioiusly. they are pretty damn good about warranty repairs, and it doesnt appear that it is modified or that a modification caused the failure. this could even initiate a recall on the barrels... but i doubt it.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:24:15 PM EST

[#4]

AVK - G-20 - March 1994
http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1287557

I'm glad you're ok OP. and I hope that Glock makes everything better.... I bet they do.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:29:14 PM EST

[#5]

Quoted:
Someone dicked with that feed ramp. Someone.

Looks like glock used a monkey with a chisel to machine their chambers back in the day.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:31:39 PM EST

[#6]

Man. Can't say I would have shot the barrel you knew had issues. I would have sent it back to glock and been done with it. But at least you are still mostly in one piece.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:39:47 PM EST

[#7]

Crazy pictures. Glad you are ok. Have you contacted Glock and DT?

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:45:54 PM EST

[#8]

Quoted:
<snippage>
Very difficult to get a good photo. Shining a light down the barrel though,
<snippage part 3>

Not to be contrary, but those are quite good photos.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:47:04 PM EST

[#9]

Quoted:
Crazy pictures. Glad you are ok. Have you contacted Glock and DT?

I emailed DT to send them a link to this thread.
I thought they would be interested to see the photos.
At this point I'm pretty confident their ammo was probably within SAAMI specs.
Fat_McNasty is going to look at some brass I sent him to see if it looks similar to some known good brass.

I called Glock and simply asked where to send a gun to be evaluated.
I shipped it today.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:48:36 PM EST

[#10]

Quoted:

Quoted:
<snippage>
Very difficult to get a good photo. Shining a light down the barrel though,
<snippage part 3>

Not to be contrary, but those are quite good photos.

Thanks. I was trying to get good focus on the brass case head.
The auto-focus simply refused to lock on to it.
I tried locking the focus and moving the camera closer and farther from it, until it looked like it was in focus.
These were the best of those attempts.

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:51:00 PM EST

[#11]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Crazy pictures. Glad you are ok. Have you contacted Glock and DT?

I emailed DT to send them a link to this thread.
I thought they would be interested to see the photos.
At this point I'm pretty confident their ammo was probably within SAAMI specs.
Fat_McNasty is going to look at some brass I sent him to see if it looks similar to some known good brass.

I called Glock and simply asked where to send a gun to be evaluated.
I shipped it today.

Did you have to pay stupid high $ shipping for a handgun, or as something else, since its no longer a firearm

Edit: Sorry for your loss and glad you are okay

Posted: 11/15/2011 4:56:51 PM EST

[#12]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Crazy pictures. Glad you are ok. Have you contacted Glock and DT?

I emailed DT to send them a link to this thread.
I thought they would be interested to see the photos.
At this point I'm pretty confident their ammo was probably within SAAMI specs.
Fat_McNasty is going to look at some brass I sent him to see if it looks similar to some known good brass.

I called Glock and simply asked where to send a gun to be evaluated.
I shipped it today.

Did you have to pay stupid high $ shipping for a handgun, or as something else, since its no longer a firearm

Edit: Sorry for your loss and glad you are okay

I had to pay stupid high prices for the overnight delivery. $89.

Posted: 11/15/2011 5:02:25 PM EST

[#13]

Send it in and get a gen 4 with an unmodified barrel. I dont care what anyone says, that barrel has been "modified", and got dicked up in the process.

Posted: 11/15/2011 5:07:06 PM EST

[#14]

Quoted:
Send it in and get a gen 4 with an unmodified barrel. I dont care what anyone says, that barrel has been "modified", and got dicked up in the process.

Did you read the thread and see all the examples of you being wrong about the barrel being modified?

Posted: 11/15/2011 5:14:51 PM EST

[#15]

Quoted:
Send it in and get a gen 4 with an unmodified barrel. I dont care what anyone says, that barrel has been "modified", and got dicked up in the process.

4 great examples of 2nd gen guns with the same feedramps.

Page #1

Page #2

Page#4

Page#5

Posted: 11/15/2011 5:30:00 PM EST

[#16]

The top half of the gun looks fine. I suspect Glock will replace the frame, any dicked-up small parts and the barrel and send it back.

Posted: 11/15/2011 5:32:00 PM EST

[#17]

Took a couple pics of my 10mm chambers for giggles.

Posted: 11/15/2011 6:11:44 PM EST

[#18]

Well, the good news is that it looks like it only did about $30 worth of damage.

Posted: 11/15/2011 6:22:02 PM EST

[#19]

Quoted:
Well, the good news is that it looks like it only did about $30 worth of damage.

Seriously, from Glock's standpoint, that is proababally right.

Posted: 11/15/2011 6:46:24 PM EST

[#20]

Glock 20, purchased new in april/may 1991, #UT9XX, factory barrel (dirty)

About 2k rounds with no issues so far.

Posted: 11/15/2011 8:37:02 PM EST

[#21]

Quoted:
Glock 20, purchased new in april/may 1991, #UT9XX, factory barrel (dirty)

About 2k rounds with no issues so far.

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l30/HK94dude/2011-11-15_20-15-47_127.jpg

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l30/HK94dude/2011-11-15_20-15-41_252.jpg

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l30/HK94dude/2011-11-15_20-16-36_940.jpg

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l30/HK94dude/2011-11-15_20-16-26_259.jpg

see how the ramp cutouts are not as deep..

Posted: 11/15/2011 9:00:29 PM EST

[#22]

87 vintage DE stock ramping.

Also I was wrong. the bridge on my delta was cut out. Its been forever since Ive taken it apart. And I spaced it out. I was not cracked at the time, it was too keep from cracking.

Posted: 11/15/2011 10:42:40 PM EST

[#23]

Quoted:
No need for a 10mm except for animals and people in cars.

Or animals in cars.

And I really want to see that poisonous bear.

Posted: 11/15/2011 10:43:53 PM EST

[#24]

Quoted:
Sorry about what happened, thanks for posting it and informing us.. I have a Gen3 20, AND... a bunch of DT ammo.... time to get rid if the DT ammo.

I'll take it off your hands :)

Posted: 11/15/2011 10:46:50 PM EST

[#25]

I completely missed the part about the OP trying to induce case setback until this thread came up at dinner.
Play stupid games, blow up GLOCKS that deserved better treatment.
"Thinking it might take a few rounds to cause bullet setback,

I loaded the first round again, and then two others.

Chambered the round, and fired into the berm. KaBoom"

Posted: 11/15/2011 11:06:17 PM EST

[#26]

I FUCKING LOVE PEOPLE...

that know what the fuck the 'macro' function is on their cameras.

Posted: 11/16/2011 12:51:27 AM EST

[#27]

Quoted:
I completely missed the part about the OP trying to induce case setback until this thread came up at dinner.

Play stupid games, blow up GLOCKS that deserved better treatment.

I was attempting to test whether a cartridge was experiencing setback.
A cartridge that was never going to be fired during the test, or ever fired if the bullet moved in the case at all.
How is that, in and of itself, dangerous?

Posted: 11/16/2011 12:53:44 AM EST

[#28]

Quoted:
I FUCKING LOVE PEOPLE...

that know what the fuck the 'macro' function is on their cameras.

I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic, serious, or what exactly.

Posted: 11/16/2011 2:20:03 AM EST

[#29]

Quoted:
I have a very early G20 (SR# UAxxx) and my chamber looks very similar to the OPs with the generous chamfer cuts just less tool marks. This G20 has seen some seriously hot hand loads (155gr @ 1475 f/s) when I worked up my loads but NEVER saw a 'Glock smile' like the one in the OPs post. Double tap advertises some high velocities but multiple people have shown them to be exaggerated by 150-200 f/s.

I suspect you had some DT ammo that was overcharged, a factory error.

http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm273/richardv308/Glock005.jpg

If you have any of that ammo left, you need to get it to somebody that can shoot it in a SAAMI PSI barrel...CUP would work, but PSI would be better. I'd be very surprised if DoubleTap didn't want you to send some of it in for testing...that is IF they pressure test their own ammo.

I would bet that Glock will make it right, but I don't think its their problem.

Posted: 11/16/2011 2:24:46 AM EST

[#30]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I FUCKING LOVE PEOPLE...

that know what the fuck the 'macro' function is on their cameras.

I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic, serious, or what exactly.

I think he's commenting on the fact you were actually able to take clear close-ups. It seems to be a skill lacked by most.

Posted: 11/16/2011 5:07:46 AM EST

[#31]

Quoted:

Quoted:
All the DT 10mm rounds I have shot used Starline brass.

I always considered Starline to be reputable stuff.

How would you know? All of mine says DOUBLE TAP on the case head instead of starline.

I have some old Double Tap ammo that clearly has the "star" on it.

Posted: 11/16/2011 5:32:46 AM EST

[#32]

Quoted:

Quoted:
<snippage>
Very difficult to get a good photo. Shining a light down the barrel though,
<snippage part 3>

Not to be contrary, but those are quite good photos.

Thanks. I was trying to get good focus on the brass case head.
The auto-focus simply refused to lock on to it.
I tried locking the focus and moving the camera closer and farther from it, until it looked like it was in focus.
These were the best of those attempts.

Depth of field is greatly decreased at close focus distances.

Posted: 11/16/2011 5:43:00 AM EST

[#33]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I completely missed the part about the OP trying to induce case setback until this thread came up at dinner.

Play stupid games, blow up GLOCKS that deserved better treatment.

I was attempting to test whether a cartridge was experiencing setback.

A cartridge that was never going to be fired during the test, or ever fired if the bullet moved in the case at all.

How is that, in and of itself, dangerous?

It's not, he just didn't bother reading the part about you measuring the ammo.

Posted: 11/16/2011 8:42:58 AM EST

[#34]

Quoted:

Quoted:
<snippage>
Very difficult to get a good photo. Shining a light down the barrel though,
<snippage part 3>

Not to be contrary, but those are quite good photos.

Thanks. I was trying to get good focus on the brass case head.
The auto-focus simply refused to lock on to it.
I tried locking the focus and moving the camera closer and farther from it, until it looked like it was in focus.
These were the best of those attempts.

Depth of field is greatly decreased at close focus distances.

If I wanted to spend a lot of time on it, I'd put my Canon 40D in manual mode.
I'd narrow the aperature down as far as it would go, then use a slave flash
set to scortch the object if necessary. It gives a lot more depth of field, but
takes more time to set up than just using my wife's point-and-shoot Nikon.

Posted: 11/16/2011 8:49:36 AM EST

[#35]

Quoted:
so you put back in a barrel that was unsupported, and knowing that fired it?

WOW just WOW..

That's what I was thinking. If you already had bulging brass from the original barrel from using it in the past, and you knew it was a problem because it wasn't supporting the case...why in the hell would you put in back in the gun years later and use it?????

Posted: 11/16/2011 9:05:44 AM EST

[#36]

Quoted:

It gives a lot more depth of field, but takes more time to set up than just using my wife's point-and-shoot Nikon.

I thought you said you had to play with the camera and take a shitload of pictures. How does doing it right the first time take longer than doing it wrong over and over to get something useable?

And I won't even get into the whole Canon vs Nikon thing here

Right tool barrel for the right job and all that...

Posted: 11/16/2011 11:48:48 AM EST

[#37]

Quoted:

Quoted:
It gives a lot more depth of field, but takes more time to set up than just using my wife's point-and-shoot Nikon.

I thought you said you had to play with the camera and take a shitload of pictures. How does doing it right the first time take longer than doing it wrong over and over to get something useable?

And I won't even get into the whole Canon vs Nikon thing here

Right tool barrel for the right job and all that...

Because even after the time involved with setting up the camera with right lens, right flash, and a tripod, and securing the gun so it wouldn't move while focusing,
it would still take me a long time to try different settings, make adjustments, etc. Plus, trying to get everything set up with a 2-year old kid running around is not easy.

Compared to using a point and shoot and just snapping several shots and picking the best, using the Nikon point-and-shoot was easier.

So yes, doing it right the first time would take longer, and would be more complicated.

Doing it quick, easy, and not the best way, was good enough for posting pictures here.

Posted: 11/16/2011 12:04:48 PM EST

[#38]

Quoted:
AVK - G-20 - March 1994
http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1287557

I'm glad you're ok OP. and I hope that Glock makes everything better.... I bet they do.

They tried before he blew it up.

Posted: 11/16/2011 12:06:31 PM EST

[#39]

That pistol barrel isn't kosher. Live and learn.

Thanks for the extra pics!

Posted: 11/16/2011 4:38:02 PM EST

[#40]

Label indicates this is a July 2006 barrel:

Posted: 11/17/2011 1:37:33 AM EST

[#41]

I dragged this whole entry over from the Glock Handgun thread.

I ran into the same issue with my gen 2 G20 firing DoubleTap 165 gr GoldDots. They were advertised to run 1400 fps, but I chronoed them at 1440 fps. This was ammo bought 5 years ago...the same time as I bought the gun.

After firing 5 rounds over the chronograph I stopped to check out the brass and found this...

I didn't fire any more of these until I recieved a KKM replacement barrel. This was the worst of the five, but all of them showed some version of this ballooning.

With the new barrel in place the same ammo ejected without any deformation.

Here's a comparison of both barrels side by side. From this angle I think the difference in case head support is kinda obvious.

To be fair to Glock, I think they improved the chambers in gen 3 guns. I had a gen 3 G29 that worked fine with the heaviest loads, though that could have been because the shorter barrel released pressure sooner. The chamber was not as heavily beveled around the mouth.

Posted: 11/17/2011 2:21:46 AM EST

[#42]

Would the Glock 20SF be considered Gen 3?

Posted: 11/17/2011 5:24:07 AM EST

[#43]

Quoted:
Would the Glock 20SF be considered Gen 3?

Yes.

Posted: 11/17/2011 11:54:18 AM EST

[#44]

I have a Gen 2 Glock 22 that would bulge brass with just about every factory load. I replaced it with a KKM that has been flawless. The lack of support in the 6 o'clock position in the early Glock barrels is quite obvious when compared with an aftermarket. My KKM barrel hasn't missed a beat with thousands of rounds down it. OP, why were you scared to use the gun with the KKM barrel for defensive purposes?

Posted: 11/17/2011 2:44:15 PM EST

[#45]

Quoted:
I have a Gen 2 Glock 22 that would bulge brass with just about every factory load. I replaced it with a KKM that has been flawless. The lack of support in the 6 o'clock position in the early Glock barrels is quite obvious when compared with an aftermarket. My KKM barrel hasn't missed a beat with thousands of rounds down it. OP, why were you scared to use the gun with the KKM barrel for defensive purposes?

In 2006/2007, I knew a fraction about firearm laws that I do now.
Heck, I now have 3-ring binders with hard-copies of federal, state, and local laws concerning firearms.
(I'm still working on indexing to important laws of particular interest to me)

But back then, I had heard of Herold Fish and the problems he had defending his use of 10mm hollow points for self defense.
I still read debates here about using custom or modified firearms or ammunition for self defense.
People have warned against using different than stock triggers.
People have warned against using home-brew ammo.
In every argument, there are good points for the concern, and good reasons to dismiss the concern.

My thought back then was, I better keep my gun stock to avoid any issues. Just in case.

Since then I've learned a prosecutor will do his best to hang you regardless of what you used.
And a lawyer worth anything shouldn't have any problem defending the tool used so long as the use was justified.

I'm carrying the 45acp G21 until I hear back from Glock.
After that, one way or another I'll be carrying a 10mm Glock 20.
And I'll do this test again.
I'll test the factory barrel with the DT rounds just to see if there is a bulge.
And if there is no signs of a bulge after several rounds, I'll likely keep using the factory barrel.
If there is a bulge, I'll use the KKM barrel without any hesitation.

Posted: 11/17/2011 5:41:36 PM EST

[#46]

The problem here was you knew there was a problem before this happened and Glock told you to send it in and you said no. Sorry but that is not too bright. Its akin to knowing the stove is hot and touching it and getting burned anyway. Also there is nothing illegal about using an aftermarket barrel. There is much hype about using after market parts like triggers yet no cites to cases where this was actually an issue. Here is the deal if its a good shoot its a good shoot. If its a bad shoot its a bad shoot. It does not matter what trick trigger or barrel you have in your gun.
Pat

Posted: 11/17/2011 5:49:56 PM EST

[#47]

Quoted:
<snip>
Thanks. I was trying to get good focus on the brass case head.
The auto-focus simply refused to lock on to it.
I tried locking the focus and moving the camera closer and farther from it, until it looked like it was in focus.
These were the best of those attempts.

Autofocus sucks on close up shots on lots of cameras. Glad you found a way to outsmart it. Some cameras have a setting to force it to focus on the center only, which can help sometimes.

Sorry about your hand and your Glock, BTW.

ETA: after reading more of this thread, you probably know this already (camera settings)

Posted: 11/18/2011 12:40:57 PM EST

[#48]

Quoted:

Small update 11/18/2011 12:34 CDT:

I only called to verify Glock had possession of my gun.

They said they are so backlogged it would be sometime late next week before the gun even moves from

receiving to technical service.

What? A lot of kabooms lately?

Posted: 11/18/2011 12:44:47 PM EST

[#49]

Quoted:

Small update 11/18/2011 12:34 CDT:

I only called to verify Glock had possession of my gun.

They said they are so backlogged it would be sometime late next week before the gun even moves from

receiving to technical service.

Probably backlogged with returned Gen4 pistols.