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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:22:29 PM EST
[#1]
Had to Google saps.
Also never heard of brass knuckles being illegal. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:22:32 PM EST
[#2]
A friend of mine had to travel through the gates of Mordor to NYC from time to time, so he'd carry one of these "coin purses" so as not to be completely unarmed:
 Attached FileNever had an occasion to use it. I suppose if it was full of quarters it would leave a mark. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:24:06 PM EST
[#3]
I would love explaining to the cops why I used throwing stars in self defense.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:25:13 PM EST
[#4]
I’m glad I live in Kansas.. I grew up thinking brass knuckles and auto knives were unregulated until I was old enough to understand that leftist states had separate and unequal rules
BTW, here’s a nifty link to some 3d printed knuckles if your local specifically bans only metal knuckles |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:25:33 PM EST
[#5]
I used to carry a DeSantis " City Slicker" coin purse in my back pocket with 16oz of change in it when I worked in downtown Seattle. Used it to pay for the bus a couple times. Thought I was going to use it once on a screaming homeless guy at the trainstation but he passed me by and went to hassle someone else.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:25:37 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would love explaining to the cops why I used throwing stars in self defense. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:26:48 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A friend of mine had to travel through the gates of Mordor to NYC from time to time, so he'd carry one of these "coin purses" so as not to be completely unarmed: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/31657/71fjVO271GL___AC_SX342_QL70_ML2__jpg-2340555.JPG Never had an occasion to use it. I suppose if it was full of quarters it would leave a mark. Saps need a decent amount of weight to be useful. People, including me have tried to make them with a silver ounce coin or two, it is just to light. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:27:28 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A friend of mine had to travel through the gates of Mordor to NYC from time to time, so he'd carry one of these "coin purses" so as not to be completely unarmed: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/31657/71fjVO271GL___AC_SX342_QL70_ML2__jpg-2340555.JPG Never had an occasion to use it. I suppose if it was full of quarters it would leave a mark. Mean Gene Your pic ain't his. His are seriously well built. Bought one specifically for travel to NYC. Worth every penny!!! |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:27:34 PM EST
[#9]
Skull loses before your hand with brass knuckles
Also using correctly you punch slightly different. Almost as if you're trying to hit with your smaller knuckles |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:29:36 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Saps need a decent amount of weight to be useful. People, including me have tried to make them with a silver ounce coin or two, it is just to light. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: A friend of mine had to travel through the gates of Mordor to NYC from time to time, so he'd carry one of these "coin purses" so as not to be completely unarmed: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/31657/71fjVO271GL___AC_SX342_QL70_ML2__jpg-2340555.JPG Never had an occasion to use it. I suppose if it was full of quarters it would leave a mark. Saps need a decent amount of weight to be useful. People, including me have tried to make them with a silver ounce coin or two, it is just to light. Nope. Fill it with change (not just quarters) to be able to explain it. You nail someone right with it. Lights out! |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:29:48 PM EST
[#11]
Auto knives are cool toys. Useful box openers
until you get tape on the blade. Saps are freaking amazing. My homemade one(golf club grip, 1/4 wire with a piece of lead casted on, and filled with silicon) will take chunks out of a 2x4. No practical use. If I have to get it on, I'm using a 9mm. Brass knuckles. I have a one finger made of titanium. Punched some shit lightly and could feel a hand injury brewing. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:32:13 PM EST
[#12]
You forgot to mention a steel cosh (like a coil spring whip)
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:33:43 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Had to Google saps. Also never heard of brass knuckles being illegal. I've never had a hand weapon charge where I thought there really was a chance the defendant was going to attack someone. Either it was a guy with a record who didn't know his $ 20 auto knife was illegal, or the cops were called about a loud party or pot smoke and someone had nunchucks or brass knuckles edit upstate rural White boys rarely use hand weapons unless -they're scared and stab with a screwdriver or knife they weren't really carrying to fight with -or they nutcases and use a bat and inflict horrible head wounds |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:38:03 PM EST
[#14]
I’ve been told that with a sap, the real ones with lead, you sort of want to slap the person not full on clobber them or you can kill them. I’d like a sap, I think they are still illegal here.
I read someone their horoscope with a Surefire 6Z, I used the bezel end. That motherfucker was seeing stars, bleeding, and wobbly as hell. I thought I was going to jail. I’ve always thought brass knuckles would hurt your hand if you tried to hit someone. I’ve seen too many auto knives fail, usually because the owner lets them get gunked up. A LEO friend of mine is fascinated with the things, consistently has issues, and keeps carrying the damn things! Those old bar ashtrays were great, the thick glass ones. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:39:57 PM EST
[#15]
Carry a microtech d/e OTF every day. It's far from a toy. It's not as good as my pocket carry but between the 2 they beat a swift kick in the balls.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:40:50 PM EST
[#16]
From a realistic self defense perspective, well...it's laughable this stuff is "outlawed". It's in the same category as ninja stars and wizard staffs.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:42:42 PM EST
[#17]
Quoted: I've represented criminals who were caught with these or seen a few that were either possessed legally by police or out of NY or were just arguably illegal (auto knives are legal here while hunting and fishing). But no one ever admitted to using any of this stuff in a fight. Saps were prohibited by department policy before my time. I know in old Batman comics everyone seemed to have them but still got their asses beat (course that's true of Thompsons) Brass knuckles seem like you could break your fingers if you strike something hard like a skull (besides from also killing someone). Brass knuckles have seen to have made a come back as a fancy knife maker novelty. They are also making a come back as an illegal weapon bought off the internet from China or eBay, some are actually plastic. Auto knives seem to have a reputation here as fragile and no faster than wave or flipped knives. I'm still considering a Boker AK they seem to have an okay reputation and aren't $ 400. I realize I'm lumping together out the front and regular auto opening knives. I've seen saps and handled them but don't know anyone who has clobbered someone with one. It seems like they were really talked up by the prior generation of police Officers Even where legal or sort of legal they also seem like "you got some 'splainin' to do Lucy" items, particularly if you poke or wallop someone with one My grandfather was Chief of police in the next town over. Was a cop from the 50's to late 70's. He spoke fondly of his blackjack which he called a name I won't mention here. Said he carried it in a cutout rear pocket with a wrist strap and a hook on the crease of the strap that hooked on to his rear pocket. If someone got froggy he said you'd grab it with your pinky and then the wrist strap wrapped around to strengthen the grip. He said one crack with it would drop a guy, cold! Having owned and handled a lot of them over the years I can say I have ZERO doubt of their effectiveness. My microtechs on the other hand have taken trips back to the factory and I'd NEVER rely on them or any OTF for SD. Personally, out of knucks, chucks, black jacks, sap gloves, etc..... my Mean Gene sap is the only one I have carried and would feel confident using. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:43:55 PM EST
[#18]
Think of everything as a fist and the trick is to avoid it. This allows for grapling techniques. Decades ago I carried a lignum vitae club in my sap pocket. Never hit anybody with it.
The only person I know to use a sap was a deputy I gave it to. He rode BART home and one day a drunk was cussing everyone out. When the drunk got to him, he shouted, "What are you going to do you fat f*ck?!" My buddy stood up and then struck him on the side of the head with the sap. Lights out. All the passengers turned to look away. Next stop he hauled the guy out of the car onto the platform and them jumped back in the seat. No one saw or said anything. Only time I heard of brass knuckles being used was when a virbrant fellow enriched a nun (she was in her habit so there's no mistaking she wasn't armed or incapable of self defense) a with a punch to the face. I don't think he was ever caught either. 
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:47:34 PM EST
[#19]
I've used a sap before. But I've also gotten a legitimate buttstroke in on someone's face with an M4 stock as well.
Blackjacks and saps definitely have their uses. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:47:55 PM EST
[#20]
I have my old sap. It is good sized and filled with lead shot. I bought it as a rookie and my PD banned them before I ever got to use it. The old timers swore by them. They called saps light switches because they were excellent at turning people's lights out.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:49:59 PM EST
[#21]
All of my EDC pocketknives are automatic in some fashion but that’s not illegal here so it’s no big deal.
Brass knuckles are effective if you use them correctly and you won’t break your fingers. I don’t really know of anyone who carries them on a regular basis though. I’ve never owned a proper “sap”, but I did own a pair of “sap gloves” with lead shot sewn in the back side. They worked as advertised it you hit something with them. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:53:12 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You forgot to mention a steel cosh (like a coil spring whip) Are you talking about a BlackJack, about 3 lbs of lead wrapped in leather on a spring? Years ago, police pants had a sap pocket on the rear right leg of the pants, Guys would carry saps and blackjacks in that pocket. Most often, the fight started before you had time to grab it so they were mostly used to hit the traffic light boxes at intersections when the lights became stuck. I still have one and also a sap somewhere around the house. If used, you never, ever, hit someone in the head...way too much blood. Body shots, hurts, and bruises didn't show for a day We were in a huge fight (rival gangs) during a basketball game and I was on the ground with one guy and another was coming at me, my partner swung his blackjack at the guy and missed, hitting me on the backhand, across my knuckles. Hand swelled up like a football but we did kick some ass that night before I went to the ER. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:55:08 PM EST
[#23]
I'm pretty fast with my folding EDC. The thought of carrying a spring-loaded blade near my junk has never appealed to me. Call me paranoid.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 10:58:23 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've used a sap before. But I've also gotten a legitimate buttstroke in on someone's face with an M4 stock as well. Blackjacks and saps definitely have their uses. A friend in the army did a muzzle strike on an Iraqi that was making a move for a gun, knocked the guys front teeth out. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 11:02:26 PM EST
[#25]
I've had a couple Boker Autos. They're pretty good. Wife lost the first, I lost the second.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 11:16:50 PM EST
[#26]
Brass knuckles, saps, auto knives, gravity knives, swords, axes, Bowie knives, suppressors, machine guns, SBR, SBS, and ASPs all legal in Texas.
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Posted: 4/6/2022 11:18:20 PM EST
[#27]
what, no nunchucks?
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Posted: 4/6/2022 11:23:07 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: From a realistic self defense perspective, well...it's laughable this stuff is "outlawed". It's in the same category as ninja stars and wizard staffs. Uh a good sap or blackjack will do some major damage. |
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Posted: 4/6/2022 11:26:18 PM EST
[#29]
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Posted: 4/6/2022 11:34:15 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you talking about a BlackJack, about 3 lbs of lead wrapped in leather on a spring? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: You forgot to mention a steel cosh (like a coil spring whip) Are you talking about a BlackJack, about 3 lbs of lead wrapped in leather on a spring? Saw it in a book once. Issued to European LE. |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 12:19:21 AM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Isn't it more like a flexible baton? Saw it in a book once. Issued to European LE. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: You forgot to mention a steel cosh (like a coil spring whip) Are you talking about a BlackJack, about 3 lbs of lead wrapped in leather on a spring? Saw it in a book once. Issued to European LE. They’re not anywhere close to three pounds. Blackjacks like the ones pictured above are more like 8 - 10 ounces. That’s more than enough to kill someone if you don’t know what you’re doing. |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 12:37:18 AM EST
[#32]
Only ever seen a SAP used one time on two people, two drunk people from south of the Texas border.
Outside a titt... adult entertainment establishment. They got thrown out by the bouncer. They decided to try to fight him ( stupid, he was a retired center from the NFL). Anyway these to little guys came out of the door and dropped the two drunks like a bad habit with SAPs. The two little guys were UC vice officers. The SAPs were effective. I did have some SAP gloves, broke some stuff with them, but they killed my hand speed. Never thought they would be very useful in a fight. |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 12:50:30 AM EST
[#33]
Is there a question in there somewhere, OP?
Brass knuckles are tools, and they work well, and your fist is protected by them when used properly and made well. And they aren't illegal here. Saps are a nice tool to drop someone unconscious with minimum effort. Auto knives are getting better each decade. Old switchblades I have ai would never use in a fight, but new OTF or even traditional knives can be almost as rigid as a fixed blade if designed properly. |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 1:47:59 AM EST
[#34]
Even during the dark days in Oklahoma, any type of weapon was legal if it was carried for a "legitimate hunting purpose".
Almost as cool as the Mississippi "Peacable Journey" law. So when some rookie cop pulled you over and started bitch'n about your katana... "I use that for killing coyotes, occifer." "Carry on." The last thing you would want to do, in a confrontation with a methbilly, is get their blood on you. Unless that's is your fetish. I always lol at people who carry a knife for elf defense. Probably the best "weapon" is a pair of leather gloves. That way you can stike them anywhere at full power and not have to worry about getting their blood on your hands, especially hands that could get cuts on them from beating the shit out of someone who probably has hepatitis, at minimum...(teeth are sharp, and methbillies usuallyhave at least one in front, wiggling while they talk.. Also you can catch a blade with less chance of getting cut and use the leverage to disarm them. Also if you put the gloves on and act (OK, maybe it wasn't an act) excited to beat some thug that was previously making threats a few seconds earlier, they tend to run away yelling "what's wrong with you?!?!" I think muttering about "how long it's been since I got to do this" really sold it.  I've never known anyone who carried a sap or brass knuckles. Everyone carries a knife. If not leather gloves, carry at least some of those rubber dipped knitted cloth gloves, like mechanics wear.. No security guard or cop is going to think twice about someone having work gloves or fashionable leather gloves, but they add power to a punch. They are hard and have some weight to them. Thinner gloves at least protect your hands. Or you could just carry a gun. |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 2:17:53 AM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have my old sap. It is good sized and filled with lead shot. I bought it as a rookie and my PD banned them before I ever got to use it. The old timers swore by them. They called saps light switches because they were excellent at turning people's lights out. Sometimes permanently. That's why they banned them 
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Posted: 4/7/2022 2:48:21 AM EST
[#36]
I like to think my states legislators watched too many 30's-40's gangster movies and 1970-1980's martial arts/ninja movies. And they think that fighting in the real world uses the weapons from those movie. Saps, throwing stars and especially - nunchucks. When have you ever really seen someone in the real world using one of those weapons? We need to outlaw them, I saw Enter the Ninja last weekend and was terrified!
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Posted: 4/7/2022 3:00:54 AM EST
[#37]
I was talking on my phone at a 7-11 5 or so years ago in California and some vagrant approached me while putting on brass knuckles. I flipped out my knife and told him you better get a good shot because I’ll spill all your blood on the parking lot.
He stopped and stared at me for about a minute, turned and walked away. Glad he did because that probably would have hurt no matter where he hit me. Brass knuckles I believe are illegal in California. /shrug |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 3:43:25 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mean Gene Your pic ain't his. His are seriously well built. Bought one specifically for travel to NYC. Worth every penny!!! Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: A friend of mine had to travel through the gates of Mordor to NYC from time to time, so he'd carry one of these "coin purses" so as not to be completely unarmed: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/31657/71fjVO271GL___AC_SX342_QL70_ML2__jpg-2340555.JPG Never had an occasion to use it. I suppose if it was full of quarters it would leave a mark. Mean Gene Your pic ain't his. His are seriously well built. Bought one specifically for travel to NYC. Worth every penny!!! I've got one of Gene's, and it is robust. Can hold a few dollars (probably like $5-7 as a rough guess) worth of quarters in it, I would not want to get hit with it. |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 5:50:49 AM EST
[#39]
The sap was also used to break the collar bone.
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Posted: 4/7/2022 5:54:21 AM EST
[#40]
In some parts of Florida combining a sock and $5 in quarters is a felony.
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Posted: 4/7/2022 5:57:43 AM EST
[#41]
Illegal to carry any of these in VA. There’s a section of the VA legal code that explicitly calls out all sorts of fun stuff as being illegal to carry. Bowie knives and dirks are also mentioned, plus nunchucks I believe
 VA recently passed a law allowing us own auto knives, but I believe they are illegal to carry. I know there’s lots of interest in blackjacks and saps from all the pictures on the internet. But I think that’s the sole purpose of most of these items in ownership today, I.e. being posed for pictures
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:14:30 AM EST
[#42]
I have a tire checker that is really a German Polizei gummi stick. Those will F your life up.
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:14:45 AM EST
[#43]
"If it was good enough for grandpa"
 L.F.&C. WWI M1918 Mk1 Trench Knife |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:17:08 AM EST
[#44]
Quoted: I've represented criminals who were caught with these or seen a few that were either possessed legally by police or out of NY or were just arguably illegal (auto knives are legal here while hunting and fishing). But no one ever admitted to using any of this stuff in a fight. Saps were prohibited by department policy before my time. I know in old Batman comics everyone seemed to have them but still got their asses beat (course that's true of Thompsons) Brass knuckles seem like you could break your fingers if you strike something hard like a skull (besides from also killing someone). Brass knuckles have seen to have made a come back as a fancy knife maker novelty. They are also making a come back as an illegal weapon bought off the internet from China or eBay, some are actually plastic. Auto knives seem to have a reputation here as fragile and no faster than wave or flipped knives. I'm still considering a Boker AK they seem to have an okay reputation and aren't $ 400. I realize I'm lumping together out the front and regular auto opening knives. I've seen saps and handled them but don't know anyone who has clobbered someone with one. It seems like they were really talked up by the prior generation of police Officers Even where legal or sort of legal they also seem like "you got some 'splainin' to do Lucy" items, particularly if you poke or wallop someone with one Carry this daily in waistband, hope I never use it. They can do serious damage. 
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:21:40 AM EST
[#45]
Quoted: I've seen saps and handled them but don't know anyone who has clobbered someone with one. It seems like they were really talked up by the prior generation of police Officers I worked with an older nutcase who carried one (major policy violation) sometimes at work, it was effective. |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:24:47 AM EST
[#46]
I just carry a guardrail nut on some 550 cord. Sure, it's not whiz-bang tactical, but a tap upside the grape and it's coloring books for Christmas.
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:27:59 AM EST
[#47]
I carried a pair of knuckles on duty years ago. Never had to use them except for one time. They were quite effective at stopping a guy from a five minute fight who refused to put his hands behind his back and was wanted for assault first degree in another state. Once I knocked him in the back of the head and the blood started to flow he gave up pretty quickly.
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:28:23 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Had to Google saps. Also never heard of brass knuckles being illegal. As a teen we were always told they were illegal to carry in public in MS without a carry permit.  Attached File |
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:33:25 AM EST
[#49]
I thought this was a thread about all of the stuff you purchased once you arrived in your new state.
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Posted: 4/7/2022 6:33:53 AM EST
[#50]
I've never held a set of knuckles that fit my hand correctly. Always had the feeling I'd break a few fingers if I ever hit anything hard.
I'd rather have some kind of fist load - preferably one that protrudes from either side of my fist for hammer strikes. |
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