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Posted: 4/14/2022 12:13:58 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In the last 8 months, I have spent 2 hours each in an early 00's Viper and a '14 Stingray. Enough time to figure out the pros/cons of each and without crashing either car or going to jail. I'd read all the stories from day one, just like in this thread, that driving (really driving!) the Viper is just like trying to fly a helicopter: its mission is to kill you. And they were not wrong. At its upper limits, you could tell it was getting a bit nervous, a bit dicey, a bit skittish. The Vette, with its dozen+ years of R&D was solidly planted, more compliant and more confidence inspiring all the way up to and well beyond where the Viper had been exercised. But that confidence inspiring will kill you just as fast, LOL. Had several discussions with a couple of friends shooting the sh*t recently. If you decided to throw 40K at one or the other, which would you choose? Corvettes are better cars than Vipers in terms of being more user friendly. The Viper (year for year) is more fun....in short bursts, but if you really want to drive the thing a lot, again, the Vette is a far better choice. The Viper also gives you a fair bump in exclusivity. It will get far, FAR more attention than a Vette. The cost of owning the Viper is also going to be higher. Hell, the Corvette (year for year) had more and better technology....but the economy of scale still make it cheaper to own. Vipers are not "exotic" but do command higher repair and parts prices. One must also be honest and realize that, as fun and cool as Vipers are, its a damned Dodge....and in most cases, now, an old Dodge. The build quality on all but the last gen was horrible. The first Gen cars are essentially a kit car. Many of the parts on the Viper are off the shelf Chrysler parts....from the 90's and early 2000's. You dont get much Viper for 40K. Prices are rising fast, but you can still get a Viper for that. You can get a lot of Vette for 40K. If it was going to be my only car, you have to pick the Vette. If it is going to be my only toy, and fixing it could get painful, again, pick the Vette. If you want to take long trips in it, pick the Vette. If you want a community of like minded car people that do lots of stuff, pick the Vette. If you want a far more raw experience, being noticed more and far more likely the one that will rise in value....pick the Viper. If Porsche prices had not gone insane recently, I would tell you a 40K 911 is a far better choice than the Vette, but still, for the same reasons, not the Viper....but such P car options are just about gone. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 12:26:13 AM EDT
[#2]
And that was every point we had come up with in our discussions. The only reason I was able to drive the Viper, was I was fixing the window regulator. Only option was used at $500 exchange or make a part to fix what was broken. I have skills and my dad was a TV repairman, LOL. Just kidding about the TV repairman. So I made a part to fix it. Part of my payment was seat time. Driver seat time. Car is well cared for, relatively unmolested and clean. 40k would buy it, if it was for sale. Now is the time to buy into those years Viper. Parts pricing and availability would be a concern. But nothing looks like it still this day, when you see one on the road.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 12:35:20 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Vipers are brutally powerful. Obviously they are not drag cars as the light rear end always wants to walk around and get in front of the heavy lump it's trying to push down the road. They are for driving at speed on track. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 12:37:53 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I did that with 800hp on cold tires a little more than a month ago. But I kinda know how to drive. Put a little English into the wheel and kept her straight. 4 out of 5  'sok andrettii |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 12:49:18 AM EDT
[#5]
 1997 Dodge Viper Heads and Cam Idle Chop- Best You've EVER heard! |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:01:11 AM EDT
[#6]
Vipers are notoriously hard to drive. First time I drove one I got loose going around a corner and almost lost it. Scared the hell out of me.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:11:19 AM EDT
[#7]
You know what’s worse than crashing your Viper? Crashing your Viper while losing a race against a riced out Integra.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:15:37 AM EDT
[#8]
GOOD.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:17:02 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Leno had a garage show on his a couplea years ago... one a those clamshell hoods is like 25k  https://i0.wp.com/hooniverse.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/Viper.jpg?resize=1024%2C768&ssl=1 Should have bought a C4 Corvette. Better car all around and not an over priced POS. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:23:04 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should have bought a C4 Corvette. Better car all around and not an over priced POS. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Leno had a garage show on his a couplea years ago... one a those clamshell hoods is like 25k https://i0.wp.com/hooniverse.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/Viper.jpg?resize=1024%2C768&ssl=1 Should have bought a C4 Corvette. Better car all around and not an over priced POS. Yeah but they’re still making Corvettes while the Viper total is now minus one. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:27:59 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Vipers are notoriously hard to drive. First time I drove one I got loose going around a corner and almost lost it. Scared the hell out of me. Close friend is retired Boeing engineer and pilot. Has an exquisite early Viper with very low mileage. I think he paid $25K I cash for it. He is an accomplished driver and told me it is very easy to have your skills outrun by the torque. It is an awesome car. If I were a car guy, I would want one. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:28:13 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should have bought a C4 Corvette. Better car all around and not an over priced POS. Judging by the last few posts, a "get off my lawn" version of this guy showed up.  I also have cars I like and brands I gravitate to, but the Viper, for what it was, was a better track and performance weapon than the vette, in almost all years. The vette was better in most other ways. Its all about whats important to you. It was anything but a POS. It is also far more exclusive and future values are likely to reflect that. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:28:14 AM EDT
[#13]
The gen 1 vipers are such pieces of shit, giant engine with truck suspension and other garbage thrown on.
I want one |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:32:29 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "The first-generation Viper V10 engine had a displacement of 7,990 cc (8.0 L; 487.6 cu in) and produced 400 hp (406 PS; 298 kW) at 4600 rpm and 465 lb·ft (630 N·m) of torque at 3600 rpm." 1st gens curbed around 3000lbs. lol Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I don’t care how dangerous Viper were, a 90s Viper will always be one of my dream cars and I would buy one if I had the disposable income. Back in the early 2000s when I street raced there were a few of them around. I befriended a guy with one and raced around with it my 99’Z28 that I had. Fun times. "The first-generation Viper V10 engine had a displacement of 7,990 cc (8.0 L; 487.6 cu in) and produced 400 hp (406 PS; 298 kW) at 4600 rpm and 465 lb·ft (630 N·m) of torque at 3600 rpm." 1st gens curbed around 3000lbs. lol American engines are so pathetic. 8L v10 and all you get is 50hp/l |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:32:57 AM EDT
[#15]
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Posted: 4/14/2022 1:37:39 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I took one out that belonged to a customer of mine. He threw me the keys and said: “have fun.” I took my colleague with me, and we went down a long dead end road. When I turned around, I jumped on it with everything it had. My colleague was desperately looking for something to grab on to in sheer panic. You know that feeling on a really fast sport bike when it feels like the bike will come out from under you? That’s what the Viper felt like. I made it halfway through second gear and chickened out. I knew it was going to get away from me. Torque steer is VERY real. Torque steer? And here I thought the viper was RWD. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 2:01:13 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: American engines are so pathetic. 8L v10 and all you get is 50hp/l Emissions tunes are where the real bullshit lay. By 2013 the hp was 640-650 which is a helluva a lot better. My fuel injected SBF 331 is 380+ rwhp @6300rpm and roughly 360ft/lbs at 4400rpm. Compare to my 95 Cobra's 302 and it was barely 225-235hp stock at the crank, there is no reason it could not have been 280-320 at the crank from the factory other than emissions. Little 66 coupe is a 2800 pound car on 225/45-17 tires and also keeps you in mind of your own mortality. Gen 1 Vipers have the lowest used sale value for a reason. They have zero sophistication. The melted plastic super basic dash is fuckin ugly to look at and burnt legs on exhaust side pipes is a thing. The last gen Viper is an amazingly beautiful car. If I ever won the lottery I would have ACR versions of every generation of Viper. Was shopping them in 2015 when I was looking for a new car, used 997.5 Porsches, C6 Z06s, Gen 3 Vipers, Boss 302 Laguna Secas, and the new GT350 were what I was considering. I started dating a chick and dropped my overtime of 60 hours a pay period and I compromised buying my 2015 GT Perf Pack, regret that decision. Any of my other choices would have been better but I had never bought a new zero miles car before, it is likely my first and last "new car." |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 2:10:09 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Emissions tunes are where the real bullshit lay. By 2013 the hp was 640-650 which is a helluva a lot better. My fuel injected SBF 331 is 380+ rwhp @6300rpm and roughly 360ft/lbs at 4400rpm. Compare to my 95 Cobra's 302 and it was barely 225-235hp stock at the crank, there is no reason it could not have been 280-320 at the crank from the factory other than emissions. Little 66 coupe is a 2800 pound car on 225/45-17 tires and also keeps you in mind of your own mortality. Gen 1 Vipers have the lowest used sale value for a reason. They have zero sophistication. The melted plastic super basic dash is fuckin ugly to look at and burnt legs on exhaust side pipes is a thing. The last gen Viper is an amazingly beautiful car. If I ever won the lottery I would have ACR versions of every generation of Viper. Was shopping them in 2015 when I was looking for a new car, used 997.5 Porsches, C6 Z06s, Gen 3 Vipers, Boss 302 Laguna Secas, and the new GT350 were what I was considering. I started dating a chick and dropped my overtime of 60 hours a pay period and I compromised buying my 2015 GT Perf Pack, regret that decision. Any of my other choices would have been better but I had never bought a new zero miles car before, it is likely my first and last "new car." Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: American engines are so pathetic. 8L v10 and all you get is 50hp/l Emissions tunes are where the real bullshit lay. By 2013 the hp was 640-650 which is a helluva a lot better. My fuel injected SBF 331 is 380+ rwhp @6300rpm and roughly 360ft/lbs at 4400rpm. Compare to my 95 Cobra's 302 and it was barely 225-235hp stock at the crank, there is no reason it could not have been 280-320 at the crank from the factory other than emissions. Little 66 coupe is a 2800 pound car on 225/45-17 tires and also keeps you in mind of your own mortality. Gen 1 Vipers have the lowest used sale value for a reason. They have zero sophistication. The melted plastic super basic dash is fuckin ugly to look at and burnt legs on exhaust side pipes is a thing. The last gen Viper is an amazingly beautiful car. If I ever won the lottery I would have ACR versions of every generation of Viper. Was shopping them in 2015 when I was looking for a new car, used 997.5 Porsches, C6 Z06s, Gen 3 Vipers, Boss 302 Laguna Secas, and the new GT350 were what I was considering. I started dating a chick and dropped my overtime of 60 hours a pay period and I compromised buying my 2015 GT Perf Pack, regret that decision. Any of my other choices would have been better but I had never bought a new zero miles car before, it is likely my first and last "new car." Meanwhile in 1992 Porsche was putting pretty much the same power to the ground with a 3.6L 6cyl. I like the sketchy early cars, I find the lack of refinement endearing. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 4:06:42 AM EDT
[#19]
Not sure why you would street race a SR1 Viper anyways. They really aren’t that fast. A lot of cars with no tuning could easily beat it and tons of tuned cars. Your just looking to get embarrassed
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Posted: 4/14/2022 4:08:58 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dude was in a Viper, he already won at life! WTF was he doing racing a civic?! I pray for his sake that it was just a rental lol Won at life by being in/owning a Viper? Idk what life that is but I sure don’t want it. You do know that’s a 40k car right? |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 9:49:28 AM EDT
[#21]
If you wreck your Viper while illegally street racing on camera, do you still have the dick extension?
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Posted: 4/14/2022 9:52:40 AM EDT
[#22]
That’s why there are an abundance of Viper motors available to transplant into other project vehicles.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 9:54:39 AM EDT
[#23]
He was winning until he lost.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 9:57:47 AM EDT
[#24]
A friend of mine had a Viper. Scariest car I've ever been in! It was an older 2000's one. I'm sure the later ones don't try to kill you a quickly.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 9:58:17 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've often heard that the viper is the type of car that will kill you if you give it the chance. The best kind of cars. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 9:59:05 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think Gen 4 is still the most dangerous. abs only with the power bumped up to 600. After some extra effort 700hp on mine. (Still small numbers compared to the twin turbo guys at Calvaro Motorsports with 2400hp. Just cause we need more photos. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/77421/7FCD1867-D416-4366-BA3F-8DD798DFA107_jpe-1409487.JPG Looks great! I regret not grabbing a Gen 3 or 4 before the prices went stupid but really had nowhere to keep another car. I'm really loving all the Viper hate here. ShOuLd HaVe BoUgHt a C4, huRrrR DuRrR. 
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:01:44 AM EDT
[#27]
I know a couple people with early gen vipers that have had to change their pants on numerous occasions. Lots of torque, no driver aids, and big egos = yeeting into shit sideways
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:03:58 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks great! I regret not grabbing a Gen 3 or 4 before the prices went stupid but really had nowhere to keep another car. I'm really loving all the Viper hate here. ShOuLd HaVe BoUgHt a C4, huRrrR DuRrR. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I think Gen 4 is still the most dangerous. abs only with the power bumped up to 600. After some extra effort 700hp on mine. (Still small numbers compared to the twin turbo guys at Calvaro Motorsports with 2400hp. Just cause we need more photos. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/77421/7FCD1867-D416-4366-BA3F-8DD798DFA107_jpe-1409487.JPG Looks great! I regret not grabbing a Gen 3 or 4 before the prices went stupid but really had nowhere to keep another car. I'm really loving all the Viper hate here. ShOuLd HaVe BoUgHt a C4, huRrrR DuRrR. Same. Friend bought a C6Z when they started to become affordable on the used market and I was searching Viper ads almost weekly. Couldn’t bring myself to pull the trigger on anything. Now everything is in the stratosphere and unreachable. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:08:36 AM EDT
[#29]
Buddy and I randomly rented one in Oahu years ago. Drove all around North Island. I remember my knees being hot as hell from heat radiating from the engine compartment.
Got a ton of attention from some weird ass Hawaiians. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:11:25 AM EDT
[#30]
Well, if it weren’t for this video, he could have claimed medical condition.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:12:07 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks expensive My question is: if you have a Viper, why lower yourself to racing some clapped out piece of ricer shit? |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:15:02 AM EDT
[#32]
Other car looks like a lawnmower.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:25:24 AM EDT
[#33]
Well, that's what happens when you have never put the power to a big HP rear wheel drive car......they can get away from you in a hurry. Take away any driver-nannys like traction control, and they can get away from you in a hurry.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:30:39 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep, Vipers are so cool until you lay into them, have heard a few stories about that. I know a girl whose sister was getting married. The groom to be bought a Viper for a wedding present. He took himself and his best man out for a drive the day before the wedding. Crashed the Viper. DRT. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:33:34 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just checked. It's still in the garage. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Nope, not him, his Viper is a different color. Just checked. It's still in the garage. changed your name... |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:33:43 AM EDT
[#36]
The front fell off.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:35:48 AM EDT
[#37]
Douche is lucky he didn't kill somebody on that busy street.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:37:59 AM EDT
[#38]
The old guy just walks away in shame, bet he felt like shit after embarrassing himself so bad
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:38:03 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've often heard that the viper is the type of car that will kill you if you give it the chance. they were notoriously a handful |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:40:01 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Meanwhile in 1992 Porsche was putting pretty much the same power to the ground with a 3.6L 6cyl. I like the sketchy early cars, I find the lack of refinement endearing. Derp comment is derp. Only with the help of a turbo... Nothing from a factory in the 90s was doing 450+hp naturally aspirated unless you had the displacement. Coevette ZR1s barely made 400+ from 5.7liters with a DOHC. Compared to 500+ all day every day from lower displacement engines of today. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:42:27 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All Dodge people are the same. Quote History Honest Dodge Commercial (Part 1) Click To View Spoiler |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:42:43 AM EDT
[#42]
Viper was my dream car. Then I went to a DSM shootout and watched every single 4cyl in the parking lot smoke half a dozen vipers left over from the mopar day before. Over and over again ending with one of the viper boomers whipping his helmet across the parking lot in disgust. Was a life changing day for me.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:48:14 AM EDT
[#43]
That's what those pieces of shit get for street racing. I hope he died.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:49:47 AM EDT
[#44]
Quoted: Judging by the last few posts, a "get off my lawn" version of this guy showed up. https://www.corvetteforum.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/franztheman1.jpg I also have cars I like and brands I gravitate to, but the Viper, for what it was, was a better track and performance weapon than the vette, in almost all years. The vette was better in most other ways. Its all about whats important to you. It was anything but a POS. It is also far more exclusive and future values are likely to reflect that. This is Arfcom, get both..... 
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:51:03 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Derp comment is derp. Only with the help of a turbo... Nothing from a factory in the 90s was doing 450+hp naturally aspirated unless you had the displacement. Coevette ZR1s barely made 400+ from 5.7liters with a DOHC. Compared to 500+ all day every day from lower displacement engines of today. Who cares how the power is made? Are you against hight octane?? |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:51:03 AM EDT
[#46]
Good he deserved it. Shame he didn't take out the fart box mobile along with himself.
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Posted: 4/14/2022 10:58:38 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Derp comment is derp. Only with the help of a turbo... Nothing from a factory in the 90s was doing 450+hp naturally aspirated unless you had the displacement. Coevette ZR1s barely made 400+ from 5.7liters with a DOHC. Compared to 500+ all day every day from lower displacement engines of today. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Meanwhile in 1992 Porsche was putting pretty much the same power to the ground with a 3.6L 6cyl. I like the sketchy early cars, I find the lack of refinement endearing. Derp comment is derp. Only with the help of a turbo... Nothing from a factory in the 90s was doing 450+hp naturally aspirated unless you had the displacement. Coevette ZR1s barely made 400+ from 5.7liters with a DOHC. Compared to 500+ all day every day from lower displacement engines of today. How about BMW then? The standard 4cyl M3 was making almost 100hp/l in 1991. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 11:09:08 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wait wait a sec. Is a turbo a bad thing?? Who cares how the power is made? Are you against hight octane?? Nope. But I am against fake news. A 911 Turbo did not even make 400hp in 92. I was doubting it so I went to look and sure enough, it is quite bit less. Maybe compare displacement naturally aspirated to displacement to start. And not try to inflate the impressiveness of the turbo which actually wasn't all that impressive. 911 may have been a hell of a lot more refined than a Viper but power/torque curve is not even close even if you throw the 911 turbo in there. Do not start trying to offer examples of modified 911s because Vipers have been getting aftermarket boost too. |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 11:11:36 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How about BMW then? The standard 4cyl M3 was making almost 100hp/l in 1991. So was a 2.3l 4 banger ford. I dont get your point... Multiply displacement times 4 and call the hp a direct relationship to displacement and compare to viper engine... For the time period everything was pretty close... |
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Posted: 4/14/2022 11:13:56 AM EDT
[#50]
He needs to stick to slow cars with traction controo.
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