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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:39:44 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OP had one job 
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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:41:20 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess what I'm thinking is that it'll see some mission creep and eventually be pressed into service as a GP vehicle. I was only in for a short time and only in one MOS so I don't know how the whole Army works but as a former MP the idea of a team being assigned multiple vehicles or a squad having it's own vehicle above and beyond the team's vehicles seems unlikely. Then again I'm sure it happens in some units. Please stop. |
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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:41:56 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I understand that but mission creep will put guys in those vehicles, into situations where it was not meant to be at some point. Shit happens. I've been stuck in a minefield in an unarmored GMV 1.1 before too. Problem is, whenever you decide every vehicle has to beat every contingent situation, you end up with a vehicle that also cannot execute a significant portion of your missions. This especially relevant once you aren't engaged in a narrow spectrum like COIN. Armor reduces mobility, which is why we have an extensively tiered line of military vehicles ranging from tanks to dirtbikes. |
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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:44:15 PM EDT
[#4]
For the intended application I think it fits fine. It can also act to plus up the throw weight of a wpns squad, now that you can strap a M2 and ammo to the truck. Or more 60 ammo. or Carl G ammo or... etc
Sure, mission creep happens. But I assure you that the dudes driving also fully realize they are not in a tank like vehicle, soldiers tend to be cognizant of things like that and act accordingly. Besides, beats the hell out of walking |
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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:44:42 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Outstanding truck platform, I'm on my 2nd ZR2. 1st one 30k miles, no problems, 2nd one 12k miles, no problems |
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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:45:03 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Welcome to GD Fuck I know man. If we were discussing astro physics, sure. This is as simple as Army buys lots of unarmored JLTV, some units with very specific needs request a truck that is air transportable for a limited mission set. And its 4 pages of, how will it handle GIs bolting armor on, be it gets used to get donuts etc. |
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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:46:37 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Fuck I know man. If we were discussing astro physics, sure. This is as simple as Army buys lots of unarmored JLTV, some units with very specific needs request a truck that is air transportable for a limited mission set. And its 4 pages of, how will it handle GIs bolting armor on, be it gets used to get donuts etc. |
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Posted: 10/27/2020 11:48:48 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess what I'm thinking is that it'll see some mission creep and eventually be pressed into service as a GP vehicle. I was only in for a short time and only in one MOS so I don't know how the whole Army works but as a former MP the idea of a team being assigned multiple vehicles or a squad having it's own vehicle above and beyond the team's vehicles seems unlikely. Then again I'm sure it happens in some units. In Iraq in 2007 single crews had Bradleys, humvees, and MRAPs assigned to them, all out of tiny patrol bases. In this case its more leveraging units for certain types of missions versus leveraging multiple vehicles to conduct all types of missions. Heavy units will be doing heavy shit, light airmobile units will be pushed forward to rapidly take key terrain and wait for the heavies using these vehicles for mobility and sustainment. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 12:15:46 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Doesnt look like a gm. Both headlights are working. No shit. How many days until the head gaskets leak or the suspension wears out? |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 12:17:12 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Literally saw one on a flatbed semi about an hour ago in a parking lot. Prob going in for repairs or recalls. Or both |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 12:21:18 AM EDT
[#11]
We've done this topic already and the posts were just as retarded then as they are now.
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Posted: 10/28/2020 12:24:48 AM EDT
[#12]
Why would we trust something as valuable as our troops to something as shitty as GM?
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Posted: 10/28/2020 12:50:52 AM EDT
[#13]
Did the “Big Guy” get his dime?
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Posted: 10/28/2020 1:17:53 AM EDT
[#14]
So, the first one's are going to Ft Lewis, right????
Washington State Rain Festival, Jan 1st through Dec 31st..... |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 2:55:22 AM EDT
[#15]
How many pissed off Marines will it hold as apposed to how many pissed off Marines will be needed to push it?
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Posted: 10/28/2020 2:58:05 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I sold off a 2003 Ranger with 340k miles on it a few years ago. Other than regular maintenance the only thing I ever had to do to it was an alternator at 200,000 or so. But 30k miles tho.  Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Outstanding truck platform, I'm on my 2nd ZR2. 1st one 30k miles, no problems, 2nd one 12k miles, no problems 30k miles and 12k miles. Wow that is impressive. They've only been out since the 2017 MY  I sold off a 2003 Ranger with 340k miles on it a few years ago. Other than regular maintenance the only thing I ever had to do to it was an alternator at 200,000 or so. But 30k miles tho. I don't understand all the ignorance coming from that post. Truck has been out 3 years, have 42k miles of drive time behind the wheel of them. Everyone acting that a 3 year old model should already have 200k miles on it is nothing short of retarded. For as much as GD screeches and howls about GM, you'd guess they come from the factory with check engine lights on. 1st one was a lease, I liked it so much, decided to buy a new one. I expect nothing less than the same continued performance I have had thus far |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 2:58:16 AM EDT
[#17]
Didn't we equip ourselves with non armored humvees, got the shit shot out of us and blown to pieces not to long ago?
That vehicle looks like a clusterfuck |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 3:28:55 AM EDT
[#18]
Is it optioned so they can remote detonate the plastic “plenum” in case it falls into enemy hands?
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Posted: 10/28/2020 3:32:55 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My 2014 Silverado hasn't had a single bulb burn out or replaced yet even with the Mexican wiring. Y'all need to get some new material or I'll talk about Toyota frames. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 4:40:57 AM EDT
[#20]
Do Not Want
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Posted: 10/28/2020 4:49:40 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 30k miles and 12k miles. Wow that is impressive. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Outstanding truck platform, I'm on my 2nd ZR2. 1st one 30k miles, no problems, 2nd one 12k miles, no problems 30k miles and 12k miles. Wow that is impressive. 
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Posted: 10/28/2020 4:53:05 AM EDT
[#22]
So they dump the Humvee because it doesn't offer enough protection to occupants, and roll out a glorified pickup truck that has zero protection for occupants.
That doesn't make sense |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 5:00:25 AM EDT
[#23]
This ain’t your pops 1008.
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Posted: 10/28/2020 5:05:44 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Considering the Colorado has been plagued with weak frames that fold, I don't have much optimism for this vehicle. That and the transmissions on them are garbage. GM sucks. This was a poor decision. Doggies are gonna have to learn to hump again.... Some retired General got a huge pay day. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 5:36:53 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe the Military doesnt want a 100 acres of rusted out broken frames... Yes every Toyota dealer has a garbage rusted frame scrape pile with new frames waiting... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: All the chevies will be trashed and broken in 6 months and all the Soldiers will be back in Toyota's. Maybe the Military doesnt want a 100 acres of rusted out broken frames... Yes every Toyota dealer has a garbage rusted frame scrape pile with new frames waiting... You notice I didn't say Tacoma  ............the Hilux doesn't have the same frame, axles, or any other of the weaknesses of the Tacoma. Even the old FJ40's imported to USA were not the same as the rest of the world when it came to running gear.Find a pic of a Hilux frame and one of a Tacoma, the difference is, well, pretty much everything. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 5:41:45 AM EDT
[#26]
How long before VATS wont allow it to start?
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Posted: 10/28/2020 5:45:20 AM EDT
[#27]
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Posted: 10/28/2020 5:58:35 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So they dump the Humvee because it doesn't offer enough protection to occupants, and roll out a glorified pickup truck that has zero protection for occupants. That doesn't make sense Don’t any of you people read and research before opening your mouths? This vehicle is designed for the quick movement of troops to an objective that normally would have to leg it(Light Infantry, Airborne & Airmobile...etc). It’s designed to be cheap, slung under a UH-60 or transported inside a CH-47. It’s not going to everybody, Heavy Brigades will keep their Bradley’s, Stryker Brigades their Stryker’s. https://www.armyrecognition.com/october_2019_global_defense_security_army_news_industry/u.s._army_to_test_chevrolet_colorado_zr2_based_infantry_squad_vehicle.html https://www.armyrecognition.com/june_2020_news_defense_global_security_army_industry/us_army_awards_contract_to_gm_defense_for_initial_delivery_of_isv_infantry_squad_vehicles.html The contract is only for 650 vehicles, that’s enough to equip the above units and that’s it, really. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:00:38 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Shit happens. I've been stuck in a minefield in an unarmored GMV 1.1 before too. Problem is, whenever you decide every vehicle has to beat every contingent situation, you end up with a vehicle that also cannot execute a significant portion of your missions. This especially relevant once you aren't engaged in a narrow spectrum like COIN. Armor reduces mobility, which is why we have an extensively tiered line of military vehicles ranging from tanks to dirtbikes. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I understand that but mission creep will put guys in those vehicles, into situations where it was not meant to be at some point. Shit happens. I've been stuck in a minefield in an unarmored GMV 1.1 before too. Problem is, whenever you decide every vehicle has to beat every contingent situation, you end up with a vehicle that also cannot execute a significant portion of your missions. This especially relevant once you aren't engaged in a narrow spectrum like COIN. Armor reduces mobility, which is why we have an extensively tiered line of military vehicles ranging from tanks to dirtbikes. I bet being in a minefield in an unarmored vehicle had a high pucker factor 
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:01:41 AM EDT
[#30]
 I like my ZR2. Even has the same engine. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:10:50 AM EDT
[#31]
The CUCV was a pretty good blazer which used military fuel and voltage so it took mil radios. So the field grade officers wanted the vehicles for com to look the same as the other unarmored vehicles, and got hummers that weren't as good, then gave the MPs turtle back hummers for the field and the blazers for garrison LE.
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:19:09 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don’t any of you people read and research before opening your mouths? This vehicle is designed for the quick movement of troops to an objective that normally would have to leg it(Light Infantry, Airborne & Airmobile...etc). It’s designed to be cheap, slung under a UH-60 or transported inside a CH-47. It’s not going to everybody, Heavy Brigades will keep their Bradley’s, Stryker Brigades their Stryker’s. https://www.armyrecognition.com/october_2019_global_defense_security_army_news_industry/u.s._army_to_test_chevrolet_colorado_zr2_based_infantry_squad_vehicle.html https://www.armyrecognition.com/june_2020_news_defense_global_security_army_industry/us_army_awards_contract_to_gm_defense_for_initial_delivery_of_isv_infantry_squad_vehicles.html The contract is only for 650 vehicles, that’s enough to equip the above units and that’s it, really. In that case, they should have just went with Polaris; cheaper, more capable, better build quality |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:23:24 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Jesus fuck, its like a bunch of people who are smart enough to read, but too lazy to do so. I read the shitty article posted in the OP. But I'm also not so dense as to think that the "well just use it until the right equipment arrives" mentality won't prevail again. Just look at the number of vehicles of all types that were up-armored in Iraq. Supply trucks, open hummvies etc. The reality we all know is some pencil pusher with a sweet kickbag gig designs these, they arrive to the troops and all the flaws get exposed. Next thing you know Joe bob has his welder out and suddenly the whole "sweet off road cool guy" aesthetics goes right out the window. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:25:58 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In that case, they should have just went with Polaris; cheaper, more capable, better build quality I don’t know why they didn’t buy Polaris or one of the GD-OTS Flyer variants(they’ve been in the system for years and hundreds in use throughout DOD). I think some palms were greased or kickbacks applied. 
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:30:11 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's just meant to be a light fast mover to shuttle troops around who would otherwise be humping. Similar to the sand rail thingy spec ops had for a while which the name of eludes me at the moment. There's a lot of reasons to shit on this thing (mostly because it's a Generally Miserable product) but lack of armor isn't one of them. That's not the point of this thing at all. FAV/DPV The Marines also had an M151 based FAV, and an Mercedes IFAV. The Rangers took a page out of the SAS' book and went with the landrover based RSOV As much as the goobers want to wag their jaws about adding armor, this concept has been a thing, it's just a very niche thing most people don't notice. It's almost like light infantry units feel the need to have some mobility they can pack up into an aircraft and take with them. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:35:17 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Italians got it right in 1942 https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/172926/s7LeY37_jpg-1654409.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/172926/r9sZGyd_jpg-1654417.JPG Though the wall of gas cans looks dubious, actually they had 11/16" armor all around and they could throw a very heavy punch. The jerry cans were probably a combination of fuel and water. Not going very far in the desert without both. I wouldn't be worried about anything that wasn't going to kill me anyway regardless of the presence of fuel. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 6:57:21 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Had to make weight somehow. There's probably a canvas tent contraption that makes it theoretically tolerable. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: No troop protection from the elements? Have to strap your ruck to the top? Seriously? I am sure I can imagine a worse vehicle. I am not sure how just yet, but if I get drunk enough I will figure something out. That thing sucks in almost every way possible. This open caged rig would work great in the desert and almost nowhere else. The vehicle will be almost useless in states with moderately inclement weather and completely useless in areas with truly inclement weather. It is like some POG bred their ideas of a WW2 Jeep, with all the downsides of every other useless military vehicle ever invented. They then tossed in the drunken random video game based ideas of a FOBBIT high on Rip It's. Once they completed that step, they bred the abortion with a giant pile of hate for ground troops. Yet again our military procurement process has managed to move from SNAFU, right past TARFU, and roared on past FUBAR as well, in one long expensive chain of seriously bad decisions. I want to know which general is getting a job with GM at retirement and which Senators got their dicks sucked to make this ridiculous thing happen. If they had consulted the Fobbits during the design phase, we would have told them that the lack of protection from the elements, and lack of cargo space, was a deal-breaker.
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Posted: 10/28/2020 7:15:31 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: GM is retarded if they don't turn that into a Jeep/Bronco killer. I promise. They could sell it as is, no r&d costs and make $ by just selling it as a utv thing. Let the end user figure out plates and shit. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 7:42:04 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The jerry cans were probably a combination of fuel and water. Not going very far in the desert without both. I wouldn't be worried about anything that wasn't going to kill me anyway regardless of the presence of fuel. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 7:56:22 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don’t know why they didn’t buy Polaris or one of the GD-OTS Flyer variants(they’ve been in the system for years and hundreds in use throughout DOD). I think some palms were greased or kickbacks applied. Quote HistoryQuoted: I don’t know why they didn’t buy Polaris or one of the GD-OTS Flyer variants(they’ve been in the system for years and hundreds in use throughout DOD). I think some palms were greased or kickbacks applied. You ever put 9 guys plus gear on an MRAZR? How many MRAZRs can you fit in a chinook? Quoted: I bet being in a minefield in an unarmored vehicle had a high pucker factor Kind of. After the first vehicle exploded I was on foot anyway, so its a moot point. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 7:58:03 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The jerry cans were probably a combination of fuel and water. Not going very far in the desert without both. I wouldn't be worried about anything that wasn't going to kill me anyway regardless of the presence of fuel. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The Italians got it right in 1942 https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/172926/s7LeY37_jpg-1654409.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/172926/r9sZGyd_jpg-1654417.JPG Though the wall of gas cans looks dubious, actually they had 11/16" armor all around and they could throw a very heavy punch. The jerry cans were probably a combination of fuel and water. Not going very far in the desert without both. I wouldn't be worried about anything that wasn't going to kill me anyway regardless of the presence of fuel. Now they will fill them with DexCool. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 7:59:56 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So they dump the Humvee because it doesn't offer enough protection to occupants, and roll out a glorified pickup truck that has zero protection for occupants. That doesn't make sense Yeah. And it can't even fly either. What a bunch of morons those factory workers are. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:01:27 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Outstanding truck platform, I'm on my 2nd ZR2. 1st one 30k miles, no problems, 2nd one 12k miles, no problems 
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:03:16 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryNot a GM fan at all...but that's a fine looking pickup. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:03:54 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So they dump the Humvee because it doesn't offer enough protection to occupants, and roll out a glorified pickup truck that has zero protection for occupants. That doesn't make sense It makes perfect sense, if you are one of the 1% in this thread that took the time to figure out this was not a replacement for the humvee before making dumb statements. You do realize that even in the era of the armored humvee and MRAP we were still driving RAZRs and kawasakis off helicopters to perform the exact same mission this vehicle was developed for? Here's a hint, it didn't involve patrolling Rte Irish or Highway 1. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:11:34 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It makes perfect sense, if you are one of the 1% in this thread that took the time to figure out this was not a replacement for the humvee before making dumb statements. You do realize that even in the era of the armored humvee and MRAP we were still driving RAZRs and kawasakis off helicopters to perform the exact same mission this vehicle was developed for? Here's a hint, it didn't involve patrolling Rte Irish or Highway 1. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So they dump the Humvee because it doesn't offer enough protection to occupants, and roll out a glorified pickup truck that has zero protection for occupants. That doesn't make sense It makes perfect sense, if you are one of the 1% in this thread that took the time to figure out this was not a replacement for the humvee before making dumb statements. You do realize that even in the era of the armored humvee and MRAP we were still driving RAZRs and kawasakis off helicopters to perform the exact same mission this vehicle was developed for? Here's a hint, it didn't involve patrolling Rte Irish or Highway 1. ...and for the price tag of this new hotness, you could probably buy a lot more RAZRs and Kawasakis. Admittedly, you can't fit more than 4 people in one, but still... |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:16:14 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don’t any of you people read and research before opening your mouths? This vehicle is designed for the quick movement of troops to an objective that normally would have to leg it(Light Infantry, Airborne & Airmobile...etc). It’s designed to be cheap, slung under a UH-60 or transported inside a CH-47. It’s not going to everybody, Heavy Brigades will keep their Bradley’s, Stryker Brigades their Stryker’s. https://www.armyrecognition.com/october_2019_global_defense_security_army_news_industry/u.s._army_to_test_chevrolet_colorado_zr2_based_infantry_squad_vehicle.html https://www.armyrecognition.com/june_2020_news_defense_global_security_army_industry/us_army_awards_contract_to_gm_defense_for_initial_delivery_of_isv_infantry_squad_vehicles.html The contract is only for 650 vehicles, that’s enough to equip the above units and that’s it, really. I read it I stand by my comment The justification for dumping the Humvee was the lack of protection to occupants. I never said that they were dumping any vehicle currently in inventory to buy this thing, which...offers no protection to occupants. Probably even less than the Humvee did. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:17:09 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Doesnt look like a gm. Both headlights are working. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:18:23 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All the ones on the sides were diesel fuel (I shouldn't have called them "gas" cans), water cans were mounted on the fenders and have a white cross painted on them. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The jerry cans were probably a combination of fuel and water. Not going very far in the desert without both. I wouldn't be worried about anything that wasn't going to kill me anyway regardless of the presence of fuel. I could never understand why the 1stSgts/CSMs have the promo boards and ask stupid questions about marching and shining shoes, but never make sure the future E5 knows the difference between the water and fuel cans (or how to use a range card, or how to do a sleep plan). They made the handles different for a reason. |
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Posted: 10/28/2020 8:25:24 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I read the shitty article posted in the OP. But I'm also not so dense as to think that the "well just use it until the right equipment arrives" mentality won't prevail again. Just look at the number of vehicles of all types that were up-armored in Iraq. Supply trucks, open hummvies etc. The reality we all know is some pencil pusher with a sweet kickbag gig designs these, they arrive to the troops and all the flaws get exposed. Next thing you know Joe bob has his welder out and suddenly the whole "sweet off road cool guy" aesthetics goes right out the window. Ok, i'll try to break it down here. The reality is that these vehicles arent going to do much driving at all. They are meant as a mobile ORP. A platoon of infantry get dropped near a bridge or a train station, they rush forward and take it on foot (it's not an assault vehicle), then their sustainment on these vehicles pushes forward to them, or carries a mortar or machinegun up to high ground, etc. The short drive off the back of a Chinook provides value in that the bird is not exposed on the ground for long periods of time while guys drag a bunch of shit off, the the guys on the ground now have a means of moving support and sustainment equipment a short distance to a more advantageous longer term point. Now that light element can bring mortars, CUAS equipment, ammo, heavy breaching tools, medical ventilators, SCBA, whatever heavy shit the mission requires that they couldn't hand carry in. Bonus points for getting dropped off right into your elevated support by fire positions. The US Army has been doing this exact thing for a long time, regardless if all you noticed was presence patrolling in IED filled alleys. |
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