fauw

fgm

ever since they screwed the bond holders

and gave it to the uaw

what's the fucking point

fail fail fail

GM should furlough everybody for 6 months...go from n vacation, lock the doors, turn off the lights, and not even speak to the UAW.

Just walk.

You don’t negotiate with people holding you hostage.

I don't buy their vehicles, but from an objective perspective the Union is trying to maximize benefit to the workers, make as much as they can while not drying up the work completely due to costs and on the other end the business is trying to reduce costs, maximize productivity and not drive the workers away due to reductions in compensation.

Its no different being non-union...they don't pay me as much and someone else will...I leave.  There are people who have worked  longer than myself and get more even if they don't produce as much output...this is much more or a large corporation characteristic than union vs non-union based on what I can observe and have experienced.

UAW can last for 22.7 weeks, assuming GM's publicly disclosed insurance costs are accurate and taking into account the $250 per member per week strike pay.

How long the UAW members can survive on $250 per week (which they will owe taxes on!) is another story. I'd be surprised if the UAW could make it more than 7 weeks (which would be two mortgage payments for most members).

Uncle Sam wanted the stock thinking that they’d come out ahead, but only Uncle Sam can lose money in this market.

The .gov gambled and lost, that’s on the .gov. GM has completely fulfilled their end of the deal.

Sec. 7. [§ 157.] Employees shall have the right to self-organization, to form, join, or assist labor organizations, to bargain collectively through representatives of their own choosing, and to engage in other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or other mutual aid or protection, and shall also have the right to refrain from any or all of such activities except to the extent that such right may be affected by an agreement requiring membership in a labor organization as a condition of employment as authorized in section 8(a)(3) [section 158(a)(3) of this title].

UNFAIR LABOR PRACTICES

Sec. 8. [§ 158.] (a) [Unfair labor practices by employer] It shall be an unfair labor practice for an employer--

(1) to interfere with, restrain, or coerce employees in the exercise of the rights guaranteed in section 7 [section 157 of this title];

(2) to dominate or interfere with the formation or administration of any labor organization or contribute financial or other support to it: Provided, That subject to rules and regulations made and published by the Board pursuant to section 6 [section 156 of this title], an employer shall not be prohibited from permitting employees to confer with him during working hours without loss of time or pay;
——————————————

Apparently striking is covered under " other concerted activities for the purpose of collective bargaining or other mutual aid or protection", so firing them en masse is considered "unfair labor practices" under section 8.

Also under section 8, if the employees vote to unionize, then they get to unionize and tough shit if the employer doesn't like it.  Your only other option at that point is to close up shop.

but you probably knew all this already.

Geez, the average UAW GM worker doesn’t even know the details of GM’s last offer.

removed because ......

From the union members I know, they're usually full of debt. Motorcycles, RV's, homes, credit cards and other stuff. Most will be in dire shape in about 2 months like you said.

See NLRB....

Yep.  Pretty soon, it's rank and file will run out of money.  Most people live paycheck to paycheck.  As weeks go by, people will need to cross the picket line and go back to work.   GM might offer a little bonus or pay raise for those that chose to do so early.  

See NLRB regulations, or a whitewashed erosion on their website:
https://www.nlrb.gov/rights-we-protect/rights/employer-union-rights-and-obligations

In that case, GM should stretch this out until the new year.

Then offer the UAW 40% of what they had in their last contract.

I'll be keeping an eye out for foreclosure properties close to the nearest UAW plant.

You should work in labor relations.  It's fun!

Lol, what is their average pay now anyway?

Worked for the UAW in the late 90's right out of high school.  Not even adjusting for inflation, the most money I have made vs calories burned.  Paid good money to sit on my butt and go crazy.  Tried getting other stuff done in my down time and got reprimanded.  This was for CTS corp, a manufacturer of throttle position sensors, not even an auto manufacturer.  Screw them, just driving costs up.

Got invited to go to a union hall to get my pins.  Asked my dad what goes on there.  His response was "that is where they decide what windows to knock out and tires to slash".

Involvement from the state.

*Cough*

@40xb

I have a serious question for you, and I hope this doesn't get passed over too quickly, considering how fast the thread is moving.

Do you truly support modern unions and all that they stand for (including all of the bad things, such as Democratic donations, bribery, theft, embezzlement, threats, violence, vandalism, assault, etc...), or do you support the idea of unions as they once were, as seen through nostalgia-tinted glasses?

You have been very staunch in your support of unions, but I've noticed an interesting similarity in your support of unions when compared to SWIRE's unwavering support from the NRA.

In both examples, it seems to me that the idea of a union (or the NRA, in SWIRE's example) somehow means more to you than what the union actually accomplishes. More importantly, this nostalgic idea of what unions mean is somehow able to completely overshadow all of the horrible things they have done in recent history, things that are blatantly obvious to those not blinded by nostalgia.

Just as WLP's rampant abuse of NRA funding was often overlooked, ignored, or even excused by the most staunch NRA supporters, the UAW's blatant history of wrongdoing by management (embezzlement, theft, fraud, etc...) never seems to get addressed by you.

I understand completely if you truly support the idea of unions, and the ideals that they were intended to represent, but how can you in good conscience support the current UAW, given it's extensive and well-documented history of crooked union bosses, scams, and schemes? How do you justify supporting what is now essentially a criminal organization, and one that goes against our very constitutional rights?

To me, the cancer at the top of the UAW is almost identical to the cancer that has consumed the NRA. How anyone can continue to support these organizations while they are rotten to the core is completely beyond me. I support the idea behind both, but only if they are completely purged of the rot and the filth that now consumes them, and then rebuilt to their once proud ideals.

Even if the original cause was just, how can one continue to support an organization that is now ran almost entirely by criminals?

If my premiums were $150/mo I could drive a new Z06 with just the money saved on insurance. Not kidding. Our insurance premiums are as much as the house payment.

They never do, negotiations are behind closed doors, and unless the union agrees to put it to a vote, the workers will never know what’s discussed.

When I was living under a communist regime as a kid.  State radio and street posters hate just about everything capitalism.  Yet they affectionally called union workers "comrades in arm".

That is not even remotely close to how it works. I don't know from what reality you are pulling that fantasy, but it is not the reality we both inhabit.

It's more like you spend the $500,000,000, then a union comes in and convinces your employees to unionize, they then 'bargain' a rate of $750,000,000 but produce only 40% of the previous productivity levels. And now you can't get rid of them, or the union, because the US government will stop you from doing so. All the while, a significant part of that extra $250,000,000 you are paying is going to politicians that hate your business and want to see you fail, but also want to see you pay $1,250,000,000 for labor while you fail.

Doesn’t the strike fund cover GM, Ford, and FCA?

If so, they can’t burn it all on GM.

The difference is the federal gov’t interfering, on the side of UAW.

"A GM plant in Lansing, Mich., that builds the Cadillac ATS and CTS and Chevrolet Camaro is running at just 33 percent capacity, while the GM Orion Township, Mich., facility that builds the Chevrolet Bolt electric car and the Chevrolet Sonic subcompact runs at 34 percent capacity. A Bowling Green, Ky., plant that builds the Chevrolet Corvette works at just 27 percent of its potential output, according to LMC data.

"Until GM gets more flexibility in its platforms, it will continue to have to play whack-a-mole with its plants as the market transitions — and it will happen again," said LMC analyst Bill Rinna.

In all, the four GM car plants that will remain open have a combined capacity of more than 800,000 vehicles a year, but are expected to produce only 360,000 cars this year, according to LMC.

Industry analysts have said the general break-even point for running an assembly plant profitably is around 80 percent. Barra said on Monday GM's North American plants are running at 70 percent capacity — including light-truck plants that are working overtime."

https://www.autonews.com/article/20181128/OEM01/181129725/gm-s-plan-only-partly-solves-gap-between-capacity-and-sedan-demand

Henry Ford implementing all the things unions take credit for?

Sure they can....

Then they'll just increase the dues to make it all back.

1. They are not forced. The employee is forced to join the union or not be allowed to work by the Unions employees.

2. They agree to allow the union to operate as long as they supply a reliable work force.

3. Ask caterpillar union clowns what happens if you f around too much. They are not forced to play ball with the unions but they can’t stop employees from joining a union.

IMO they should show UAW workers the door. They can go work somewhere else. Oh wait, making cars is pretty specialized, not sure there is much out there along those lines for them.

Seems to me it would be in everybody’s interest to ditch the union/commie scammers and build the best product possible.

JMO though

GMUAW

GMUAW

Well said.

Aren't Ford and FCA on indefinite contracts now?  (Not being snarky.  I don't know the answer 100%.)

No they won't.  The union has no interest in making things better for their members.  They have to keep them hungry for the next time the evil corporations have screwed them.

And FGM

A dangerous game, but they’ve played it before.

Hopefully that would be enough to get a decent number of members to jump ship, but I’m not gonna hold my breath.

Apparently, the UAW folks there want to strike as well.

Ford, Fiat-Chrysler workers call for all-out strike alongside GM workers

Do it!!

GM cannot do that, it’s is deemed by the federal gov’t to be an unfair labor practice and a violation of good faith negotiations.

State by state.

Some are employee at will and others are right to work.

The non-union company I work for pays way better than that.  But the unions hate our CEO, because we're not union.  In other words, the unions don't care about workers nearly as much as they care about unions.

My understanding is that it’s extended for an undetermined amount of time. Basically, they could end it whenever, or let it run.

Y'all can banter about the pros and cons of the UAW and unions ad infinitum.

In my mind it comes down to the simple fact that I never needed anyone to negotiate my remuneration for me, nor was I willing to tie my potential for advancement - and earnings potential - to people with less motivation, skills, drive, and potential than me. Be a lazy dumbass if you want...just don't limit me with your bullshit.

In other words, I'm not willing to sacrifice my potential and be satisfied with earning what the lowest common denominator working for a company earns. Wages should reflect production, not longevity.

Why should I have to do my job and pick up the slack for some schmoe while he earns the same 'scale' as me? Why should I work hard if I can ghost and make the same 'scale'?

Anyone who thinks that shit is rational or fair is a socialist.

This is from a different article

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