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Posted: 4/18/2022 4:58:16 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You mean, would I, having been placed in a position of power able to use clever ways to push back against overstepping of authority of other departments, elsewhere, particularly in a matter of Constitutional overreach, the rights of people, and the authority of states in regards of their people and the Federal government; And most particularly to use their own laws against them to effect that pushback while concurrently pointing out inherent hypocrisies in the system or law? Abso-fucking-lutely. The "Clever ways" you describe is a felony in my state. Additionally, if you were elected as in a sheriff, it would also be "official misconduct" a felony in the 3rd degree. |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 4:59:20 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As they should, anywhere and anytime a department is contracted to apply police powers upon the citizenry / residents, and employs officers to do so. Particularly as a profession. Except when it suits you, because that is exactly what you have been advocating. |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 5:00:16 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Except when it suits you, because that is exactly what you have been advocating. Then you haven't been reading, and this topic has already been addressed. You're conflating two different things. |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 5:01:36 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In prior threads you've states as to not perceiving a difference between law, policy, morality, and ethics. To you they are all one and the same. To you, the law is the law and there is no greater ethical / moral framework. I grant to you that in your perception, these issues are linked. You cannot see the one without the other. So yea, every freedom loving LE department in the country should be pencil whipping the heck out of LEOSA prereqs, doing everything in their power by acting on behalf of the citizenry to balance out a gross overstep of Fed and state governments. Either you support the citizenry in finding their way into 'fuck you' territory to fed and other state gov issues. Or not. From all your (and others) posts here, you do not. In your case, it appears as if you do not perceive a difference between what is 'right' and what is 'law.' There can be no agreement. What you'll need to consider in the future is just how far "the law is the law" goes. Nothing new about that argument. It's the same one people have been having since the beginning of time. There is no pencil whipping. A person has to be a current (real) police officer or cumulative 10 years for retired, along with other requirements, like not prohibited, drunk, etc. You either meet the requirements or you don’t. You are suggesting that a cop in Florida commit multiple felonies by issuing an active duty police identification to someone that wants to commit a misdemeanor in California? The fake ID still wouldn’t make carrying in California legal. If you think that there is some magic LEOSA credential, there isn’t. LEOSA doesn’t prevent anyone from carrying anywhere. It’s completely permissive. State laws are what prevents people from carrying. Don’t expect individual officers to commit crimes on your behalf. If you don’t believe in the laws take on that responsibility yourself and just carry when you visit California or NY. No big deal. You want others to assume your risks, assume them yourself. The point has been beat to death. Cop haters are going to continue to attack cops for LEOSA. In reality, it doesn’t change a thing. |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 5:07:24 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is no pencil whipping. A person has to be a current (real) police officer or cumulative 10 years for retired, along with other requirements, like not prohibited, drunk, etc. You either meet the requirements or you don’t. You are suggesting that a cop in Florida commit multiple felonies by issuing an active duty police identification to someone that wants to commit a misdemeanor in California? The fake ID still wouldn’t make carrying in California legal. If you think that there is some magic LEOSA credential, there isn’t. LEOSA doesn’t prevent anyone from carrying anywhere. It’s completely permissive. State laws are what prevents people from carrying. Don’t expect individual officers to commit crimes on your behalf. If you don’t believe in the laws take on that responsibility yourself and just carry when you visit California or NY. No big deal. You want others to assume your risks, assume them yourself. The point has been beat to death. Cop haters are going to continue to attack cops for LEOSA. In reality, it doesn’t change a thing. You gotta make that decision for yourself. Don't ask me to make it for you. Clearly someone did. And... whatever their reasons... the net effect is overall a benefit if writ large. It is the gatekeeping and pearl clutching of self professed freedom loving individuals i'm pointing out. Which actions say different than their words. That's on you. |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 5:12:25 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Then you haven't been reading, and this topic has already been addressed. You're conflating two different things. Why don't you run for Sheriff somewhere (it's a faster track than being selected as the chief somewhere) and issue all the LEO IDs your heart desires? |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 5:19:39 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You mean, would I, having been placed / voted / earned a position of power able to use clever ways to push back against overstepping of authority of other departments, elsewhere, particularly in a matter of Constitutional overreach, the rights of people, and the authority of states in regards of their people and the Federal government; And most particularly to use their own laws against them to effect that pushback while concurrently and pointedly highlighting inherent hypocrisies in the system or law? Abso-fucking-lutely. Unless you are the legislature, and head of the state peace officer training entity, who must make standards which conform to the law, you don't have that kind of power. Not the mayor, not the chief, not the governor. Maybe an emperor, but we don't have one of those. |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 5:21:40 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wonder how many of the prior guys applied to come back when the reformed a police department. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/161929/LAPD_png-2353604.JPG The new chief wasn't on the old roster. 100 some guys on the old one, no one came back? So a new Chief for a department that never existed? how odd |
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Posted: 4/18/2022 5:22:46 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why don't you run for Sheriff somewhere (it's a faster track than being selected as the chief somewhere) and issue all the LEO IDs your heart desires? With friends like you and others of your opinion to support me, I could do naught but succeed. |
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Posted: 4/19/2022 12:34:25 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And how many did New Mexico prosecute? Any? Why not? Depending on NM state law. Unless they have actual records of them individually arresting, citing or doing some other overt LE action as a POST certified officer, probably can't take actions against the individuals who participated in the fraud. Most threats of the state POST agency is to suspend the POST of the individual officers by taking away their certification. Since none of them were actually POST cert officers there is no threat to their license. They were never LEO's in NM. From what I can tell, they did photo ops and little else in any official capacity in a town of 400 people. If however, they presented themselves as LEO's in an official capacity in other states, depending on those state laws they could be open to criminal prosecution, also considering statue of limitations. |
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Posted: 4/19/2022 8:48:21 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Depending on NM state law. Unless they have actual records of them individually arresting, citing or doing some other overt LE action as a POST certified officer, probably can't take actions against the individuals who participated in the fraud. Most threats of the state POST agency is to suspend the POST of the individual officers by taking away their certification. Since none of them were actually POST cert officers there is no threat to their license. They were never LEO's in NM. From what I can tell, they did photo ops and little else in any official capacity in a town of 400 people. If however, they presented themselves as LEO's in an official capacity in other states, depending on those state laws they could be open to criminal prosecution, also considering statue of limitations. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: And how many did New Mexico prosecute? Any? Why not? Depending on NM state law. Unless they have actual records of them individually arresting, citing or doing some other overt LE action as a POST certified officer, probably can't take actions against the individuals who participated in the fraud. Most threats of the state POST agency is to suspend the POST of the individual officers by taking away their certification. Since none of them were actually POST cert officers there is no threat to their license. They were never LEO's in NM. From what I can tell, they did photo ops and little else in any official capacity in a town of 400 people. If however, they presented themselves as LEO's in an official capacity in other states, depending on those state laws they could be open to criminal prosecution, also considering statue of limitations. Thank you….that was exactly what I was eluding to. |
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