User Panel
Posted: 2/17/2014 9:49:36 AM EST
I applied to a local manufacturing shop for an ad they posted about a trainee, I would love to get into machining but I have no experience in the field. I guess I answered all their questions correctly and today I was told they wanted me to come in for a blueprint and math assessment. This is all new to me, any info on what I should expect for the math and blueprints? What should I wear, my whole family are electricians and they said wearing a suit would be too much for this type of job?
I was very upfront about having no experience but mentioned how I am very eager to learn and everything in this field is completely new to me, I just don't want to walk in lost. |
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Little bit of Trig
Calculating Angles Ability to identify features and dimensions on a print... Simple stuff really. |
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If their math skill assessment tests are anything like the one I use for prospects it will contain basic geometry, some trigonometry, fraction to decimal conversions and metrics. Blueprint reading is different altogether and is not as standardized as it used to be and should be IMHO. If you have had any technical drawing classes you should be able to stumble through a blueprint reading assessment but that does not mean you will be proficient at their particular type of drawings until you become accustomed to their interpretation. My business is a job shop and we get drawings and models in from a lot of different customers and few of them follow the same format; commercial aviation drawing are vastly different from automotive for example. New hires, usually even experienced ones, always need supplemental training on correct drawing interpretation and geometric dimensioning.
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Most of the math (Should be) basic math with algebra and geometry. Understanding units (Inch/Metric conversion) and scale. Blueprint reading is exactly that, someone should show you some basics, but who knows how much they expect. Understanding a orthographic layout I'm sure is a must, along with understanding view call-outs, like detail and section views.
I'm sure you could Google and learn some of this online on your own. Understanding the difference between a distance versus an offset versus scale would be of some help. Since dealing with offsets is basically what you will be dealing with all the time. Just a fyi that they would expect you to understand is "machinists" lingo is everything is based on a "Thou" or thousandths of an inch 1 thou = 0.001 10 thou = 0.010 100 thou = 0.100 1 tenth = 0.0001 Just about the opposite of what you learned in regular math classes from a lingo standpoint. |
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Also google ANSI hole callouts http://academic.kellogg.edu/cad/pdf/Hole_callouts.pdf |
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Hello,
Wear closed toe shoes (steel toe boots preferably) and clean jeans with a button down collared shirt. Bring your own eye protection and put it on without being prompted if you go in to the shop. Don't wear any jewelry or a watch. Don't check your phone during the formal interview or informal shop tour. Don't have long hair or baggy sleeves. Math: previous poster covered the basics. Know your inch fractions and their corresponding decimal values to an eighth if you can. Perhaps go by a pawn shop and buy an inexpensive dial caliper and an 0-1 mic and familiarize yourself with their use. Good luck. A lot of it is just showing up on time, peeing clean, and demonstrating an ability and drive to learn. |
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You guys are great, I really appreciate it. I'll make sure to brush up on everything mentioned.
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This is really just an old style tag because I'm an amateur machinist, but jvhuse's post is packed to the gills with wisdom.
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what the shop manufactures will greatly influence what their blueprint assessment involves
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Tell the owner you have primo pawn shop connections and you can hook him up.
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Am I the only person who pays attention to how everyone else dresses when I go to a company?
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A math and print test could run the gamut.
Could be as simple as knowing decimal/fractions and reading a scale, mics, calipers. Could be applied trig so you have to figure a dimension over rolls given a sharp corner dimension of a tapered part. Or, finding tangent points of intersecting arcs. Print reading could be as simple as "find the OAL of this part". It could be "Explain the difference between first and third projections", "Explain geometric tolerance" Basically (and it sounds like you have done it right) Don't try to bull shit your way through a machine shop. You won't. An assessment could be just a tool for them to know where/how to place you. |
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Sneak up on a dimension or you killed the part.
How to hold a part so you don't have a, " Oh Shit when you flop or do the other end." Shimming a part on the surface grinder so its flat when your done. The list goes on and on. You wont never learn it all. If you think you have, load your roll away on your truck and go home. Your done and wont be much help to anyone else. |
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http://www.halseymfg.com/assets/blue-print-symbols.gif http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geometric_Tolerancing View Quote The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. |
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. |
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Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. |
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flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. I have yet to see someone use it for a good short cut my little old English mentor showed me. Place scale on mag chuck. Place angle plate "upside down" next to scale and turn on magnet. Place workpiece on plate and let it slide down to rest on scale, making sure one end is shy of edge of plate. C-clamp in place. Undo chuck. You now have a workpiece that is about .02 proud of the angle plate and true, ready to grind the first edge. (Side against and side parallel the plate are already ground). When they get to "finger nail cleaner and coffee stirrer", you know you have a seasoned veteran of a tool maker. |
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Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. does the interview end right then and there if the first answer is NOT coffee stirrer? speed |
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flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. Coffee stir stick. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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In a machine shop? Probably. Last two interviews I did were in steel toes and work clothes. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Am I the only person who pays attention to how everyone else dresses when I go to a company? In a machine shop? Probably. Last two interviews I did were in steel toes and work clothes. Which tells you want you need to know... Are they business casual? Work wear (Flannels, jeans)? Ts and Carharts (Which I put a bit below workwear)..l Do they do their milling in full Tux and Tails? (Because I would seriously consider paying extra for that kind of service. Especially if they talked with english accents and treated everyone like they were butlers). |
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flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. Manicure tool Plastic deburring tool Decision making tool (We made the "Lunch Spinner™" to to decide where we were ordering lunch from) |
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I have yet to see someone use it for a good short cut my little old English mentor showed me. Place scale on mag chuck. Place angle plate "upside down" next to scale and turn on magnet. Place workpiece on plate and let it slide down to rest on scale, making sure one end is shy of edge of plate. C-clamp in place. Undo chuck. You now have a workpiece that is about .02 proud of the angle plate and true, ready to grind the first edge. (Side against and side parallel the plate are already ground). When they get to "finger nail cleaner and coffee stirrer", you know you have a seasoned veteran of a tool maker. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. I have yet to see someone use it for a good short cut my little old English mentor showed me. Place scale on mag chuck. Place angle plate "upside down" next to scale and turn on magnet. Place workpiece on plate and let it slide down to rest on scale, making sure one end is shy of edge of plate. C-clamp in place. Undo chuck. You now have a workpiece that is about .02 proud of the angle plate and true, ready to grind the first edge. (Side against and side parallel the plate are already ground). When they get to "finger nail cleaner and coffee stirrer", you know you have a seasoned veteran of a tool maker. we destroyed three scales by using them to hold a piece in place on a blanchard grinder. everything just kinda exploded. |
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Coffee stir stick. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. flat head screwdriver spider fucker'upper when applied right, bottle cap remover back scratcher with the right gauge pin, improvised compass bookmark when used with sin bars, very shallow angles can be used as a rough 0.750" or 0.0468" gauge Shit, with enough time they should be able to at least fill two pages. Coffee stir stick. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Then WTF do I do with my 3" standard? |
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I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale When they get to "finger nail cleaner and coffee stirrer", you know you have a seasoned veteran of a tool maker. C'mon, I'm a rookie and I know the coffee stir stick... I don't even drink coffee! Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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You can make a bad ass siren out of a TNMG insert, Rod type ID mic, and a blow gun.
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C'mon, I'm a rookie and I know the coffee stir stick... I don't even drink coffee! Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale When they get to "finger nail cleaner and coffee stirrer", you know you have a seasoned veteran of a tool maker. C'mon, I'm a rookie and I know the coffee stir stick... I don't even drink coffee! Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile It's the combo, man. The combo. Actually, I observe with suspicion, anyone who puts shit in perfectly black coffee. I like my coffee like my women. Bitter. |
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3" standard? Now I'll show my rookie stripes... Never heard of one of those. (At least not by that name)
I told a new guy to ask the supervisor what drawer he kept the hole shrinker in. He thought about it. :) Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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It's the combo, man. The combo. Actually, I observe with suspicion, anyone who puts shit in perfectly black coffee. I like my coffee like my women. Bitter. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale When they get to "finger nail cleaner and coffee stirrer", you know you have a seasoned veteran of a tool maker. C'mon, I'm a rookie and I know the coffee stir stick... I don't even drink coffee! Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile It's the combo, man. The combo. Actually, I observe with suspicion, anyone who puts shit in perfectly black coffee. I like my coffee like my women. Bitter. Haha! Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Place it between the tool bit and part to see if your machining close to center.
If its tilting one way or another move tool post up or down until scale is vertical to the part. |
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Yeah, only I use a little Allen wrench. They can throw sparks if they slip off the wrench onto a piece of steel. I bet they get up to 30 or 40k rpm. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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You can make a bad ass siren out of a TNMG insert, Rod type ID mic, and a blow gun. Yeah, only I use a little Allen wrench. They can throw sparks if they slip off the wrench onto a piece of steel. I bet they get up to 30 or 40k rpm. We always used a coat hanger. I was joking about the ID mic. It would trash a mic rod in a hurry. |
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It's the combo, man. The combo. Actually, I observe with suspicion, anyone who puts shit in perfectly black coffee. I like my coffee like my women. Bitter. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale When they get to "finger nail cleaner and coffee stirrer", you know you have a seasoned veteran of a tool maker. C'mon, I'm a rookie and I know the coffee stir stick... I don't even drink coffee! Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile It's the combo, man. The combo. Actually, I observe with suspicion, anyone who puts shit in perfectly black coffee. I like my coffee like my women. Bitter. I will send my ex your way........... speed |
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Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. That's a good one. Another is to hand them a 1" mic and piece of round bar. See if they hold the mic properly or if they act like they wish they had three hands. Moot point. I rarely get applicants that claim experience any more. |
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Yeah, only I use a little Allen wrench. They can throw sparks if they slip off the wrench onto a piece of steel. I bet they get up to 30 or 40k rpm. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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You can make a bad ass siren out of a TNMG insert, Rod type ID mic, and a blow gun. Yeah, only I use a little Allen wrench. They can throw sparks if they slip off the wrench onto a piece of steel. I bet they get up to 30 or 40k rpm. Went and grabbed a TNMG insert and some wire earlier, been playing with it making noise. |
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That's a good one. Another is to hand them a 1" mic and piece of round bar. See if they hold the mic properly or if they act like they wish they had three hands. Moot point. I rarely get applicants that claim experience any more. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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The only time I quiz anyone on GD&T is when they're purporting experience. I don't on entry level trainee types. I didn't see it mentioned but I may have missed it. Fractions will probably be on the math quiz. By 64ths. Why? You don't like to see folks squirm? I've resorted to one test for an interview of someone who claims experience. Hand them a 6" scale and ask them to list all of the uses for this tool. I'll be able to tell how long they've been in a shop by how long the list is. That's a good one. Another is to hand them a 1" mic and piece of round bar. See if they hold the mic properly or if they act like they wish they had three hands. Moot point. I rarely get applicants that claim experience any more. Also give them a piece of flat plate. If they clamp the plate to the desk with the mic, give them a welding hood. |
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hand them an vernier caliper and ask them to read it. View Quote We had a guy with a claimed 25 years of experience. He may have been telling the truth, he was damn good with a lathe. He had to be shown how to read a vernier caliper. He said he had always used dial calipers. Our shop only had dial calipers up to 24". He knew how to read a mic so it only took a second, just thought it was strange he could not figure it out on his own. |
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Depth mics are good too. The whole backward thing screws with a lot of lesser experienced people.
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Basically (and it sounds like you have done it right) Don't try to bull shit your way through a machine shop. You won't.
An assessment could be just a tool for them to know where/how to place you. View Quote ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This above all. Show a keen interest to learn on your own if certain prior-knowledge requirements are missing from your repetorie. |
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This above all. Show a keen interest to learn on your own if certain prior-knowledge requirements are missing from your repetorie. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Basically (and it sounds like you have done it right) Don't try to bull shit your way through a machine shop. You won't.
An assessment could be just a tool for them to know where/how to place you. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This above all. Show a keen interest to learn on your own if certain prior-knowledge requirements are missing from your repetorie. Yup. Knowing more will help, but a LOT of machine shops will hire without any knowledge. They can find a spot for you. It might be shipping, cleaning machines, and sweeping until the other machinists have a couple minutes to show you something. |
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I started off running a manual lathe, rotary broaching parts in 1000 piece lots.
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Quoted: That's a good one. Another is to hand them a 1" mic and piece of round bar. See if they hold the mic properly or if they act like they wish they had three hands. View Quote I'm currently teaching machine shop. After observing some of the students, I confiscated everyone's digital calipers. It was pretty obvious no one was going to actually learn how to read a mic as long as they could use a digital caliper. |
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I'm currently teaching machine shop. After observing some of the students, I confiscated everyone's digital calipers. It was pretty obvious no one was going to actually learn how to read a mic as long as they could use a digital caliper. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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That's a good one. Another is to hand them a 1" mic and piece of round bar. See if they hold the mic properly or if they act like they wish they had three hands. I'm currently teaching machine shop. After observing some of the students, I confiscated everyone's digital calipers. It was pretty obvious no one was going to actually learn how to read a mic as long as they could use a digital caliper. That should be easy enough to handle. Make everything +.001 -.000 and let them measure with whatever their little hearts desire |
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I'm currently teaching machine shop. After observing some of the students, I confiscated everyone's digital calipers. It was pretty obvious no one was going to actually learn how to read a mic as long as they could use a digital caliper. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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That's a good one. Another is to hand them a 1" mic and piece of round bar. See if they hold the mic properly or if they act like they wish they had three hands. I'm currently teaching machine shop. After observing some of the students, I confiscated everyone's digital calipers. It was pretty obvious no one was going to actually learn how to read a mic as long as they could use a digital caliper. We damn near had to confiscate them from the Industrial Engineer the company hired as an inspector (Owners son). He was rejecting parts because he did not zero the damn things correctly. When I left he was still trying to implement that lean manufacturing black belt shit. He said we were wasting time by finishing all shafts on one side, then finishing them on the other side. He said we needed to completely finish each shaft, one at a time. This was for manual AND CNC. |
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