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I think this is correct. Especially like with arterial bleeding, the vessel is like a fire hose. Old Newton's laws of motion. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. Arterial bleeds are spray blood and so you can have it travel up and away from the entry wound. Necessitating you apply the TQ up above the wound aways. If I'm wrong though, someone correct that. I don't want to put out bad info. There are too many variables to throw off an unseasoned provider. As you say: the fire hose and spraying. If the guy has been bleeding for a bit the blood pressure is going to drop and it isn’t going to squirt like it just happened, but it still needs to be stopped. Next would be looking for amount of blood lost. But if it is soaking into the ground trapped in boots and clothing where it is not visible, it might not be easy to make a 2 second decision on what to apply. That’s why I say if you are really unsure and it’s bleeding really bad, high and tight TQ it. Within a few minutes, you should have someone else on scene who can downgrade it if needed. Again my opinion and I am sure someone here will disagree. ETA: Another that can throw you for a loop. You may be sitting at a light and see a motorcycle get t boned and it rips his leg in half or off. It might not be be bleeding much at all. Everything restricts and then you look back and it opened like a dam let loose. Any amputations or partials, don’t wait for the blood, TQ it right up. |
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Care to elaborate on not needing to resuscitate someone for 2 hours due to a tourniquet? |
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Question about Tourniquet application. Do you apply the T right above the wound or at the top of the limb. Eta: For example: on a severe hand wound would you apply the T on the forearm or top of arm. I took a stop the bleed class a while back and I remember the instructor saying "high and tight" I obviously need to take a refresher. |
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It can...I know the guy that was run over in this article https://www.kwtx.com/content/news/Tractor-accident-sends-man-to-local-hospital-with-major-injuries-441556963.html The police chief in the town down the road from the field just happed to be driving that direction the accident happened in and thankfully had a couple of TQs in his car. Here is the plow that he got under..luckily he didn’t go under the whole thing. Tough bastard called the guy in the tractor with his cell phone while being dragged by the plow. Ever since this accident, I’ve kept a couple of TQs and other medical stuff in my truck https://media.graytvinc.com/images/810*455/Bell-County-tractor-accident-08.23.17.jpg Quoted:
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Eh, I'm not sold on the notion that a tourniquet in your car does much good for events that happen outside of your car. But I agree your card should have tourniquets (and a bunch of Izzy bandages). https://www.kwtx.com/content/news/Tractor-accident-sends-man-to-local-hospital-with-major-injuries-441556963.html The police chief in the town down the road from the field just happed to be driving that direction the accident happened in and thankfully had a couple of TQs in his car. Here is the plow that he got under..luckily he didn’t go under the whole thing. Tough bastard called the guy in the tractor with his cell phone while being dragged by the plow. Ever since this accident, I’ve kept a couple of TQs and other medical stuff in my truck https://media.graytvinc.com/images/810*455/Bell-County-tractor-accident-08.23.17.jpg |
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I'm not saying it has never saved someone (there's a reason there are three of them in my truck). I'm just saying a TQ on your body is far more likely to be where you need it when you need it. |
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I'm not saying it has never saved someone (there's a reason there are three of them in my truck). I'm just saying a TQ on your body is far more likely to be where you need it when you need it. |
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You are not totallly wrong. A property applied tourniquet is probably safe for two hours without need for resuscitation. My concern, we’ve implemented these programs so rapidly, there may be a significant number of people improperly applying the tourniquet. Between two and four hours I’d be prepared to resuscitate, after four, probably wouldn’t take down outside the hospital and in the hospital I’d be actively resuscitating. Some people point to the pilot who had one on for 16 hours. 1. That’s rare, 2. The extremity was cooled. There are cases in the Battle of the Bulge, tourniquets were left on six to eight hours without associated morbidity. This is because the limbs were cold. Cold limbs mean longer tourniquet time. Another issue with tourniquets, because we’ve put them out for everyone to use, there are a lot of people who speak about tourniquets without knowing the data and backing studies. I’m not implying you haven’t, but in general, I’m sure you would agree, throughout social a lot of people talk out their ass, but claim to know about tourniquets. For reference, I’m a on the Committee on Tactical Combat Casualty Care and current member of the tourniquet review working group. Quoted:
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The last medical training I went thru was in August - so this might have changed - but my understanding is that a properly applied CAT or SOFTTW is safe for at least 2 hours. After 2 hours, it should be reevaluated and the TQ might be left in place, replaced, or removed and the wound treated with a hemostatic agent or something else. TQs are used in hospital surgical settings for mich longer than 2 hours at a time. This personally happened to me after my 3rd deployment. Aside from my arm being a little cold there were no effects of the prolonged use of a TQ that I felt by the time the anesthesia wore off. Between two and four hours I’d be prepared to resuscitate, after four, probably wouldn’t take down outside the hospital and in the hospital I’d be actively resuscitating. Some people point to the pilot who had one on for 16 hours. 1. That’s rare, 2. The extremity was cooled. There are cases in the Battle of the Bulge, tourniquets were left on six to eight hours without associated morbidity. This is because the limbs were cold. Cold limbs mean longer tourniquet time. Another issue with tourniquets, because we’ve put them out for everyone to use, there are a lot of people who speak about tourniquets without knowing the data and backing studies. I’m not implying you haven’t, but in general, I’m sure you would agree, throughout social a lot of people talk out their ass, but claim to know about tourniquets. For reference, I’m a on the Committee on Tactical Combat Casualty Care and current member of the tourniquet review working group. My apologies for thinking you were some type of ingenue on this subject. What is the line of thinking for the latest change in chest seal application (back to vented, if I understand correctly). |
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As mentioned two hours is probably safe if applied properly. After that it’s a little bit up in the air on when the limb begins to become ischemic. Furthermore, compartment syndrome may be occurring. Therefore, between 2-4 hours, if I decide to take it down, I’d be prepared to resuscitate with LR. Of course, I wouldn’t convert or take down a TQ if someone was in hemorrhagic shock. Quoted:
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Care to elaborate on not needing to resuscitate someone for 2 hours due to a tourniquet? |
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For those who don’t know who fisherad1 is, and before more people have to say ooops.:
MAJOR ANDREW D. FISHER, PA-C, SP, MS-2, ARNG 2018 ARMY HERO OF MILITARY MEDICINE Major Andrew D. Fisher joined the Army in 1992 as an Infantryman. He successfully completed the Regimental Indoctrination Program and was subsequently assigned to the 1st Battalion, 75th Ranger Regiment in 1993. While assigned to 1st Battalion, 75th Ranger Regiment, he completed an Emergency Medical Technician (EMT) course and discovered his desire to work in the medical field. His enlistment ended in 1996 and returned to Indiana to attend school. While attending Indiana University, he also served in the Indiana National Guard as a combat medic. During this time, he served as a squad leader and platoon sergeant. In 2000, he graduated from Indiana University with an Associate’s Degree in Paramedic Science and continued his work in EMS as a paramedic. In 2004, he attended the Interservice Physician Assistant Program, graduating in 2006. Major Fisher’s first assignment as a physician assistant was to the Joint Security Area, Republic of Korea. In 2007, he attended the 75th Ranger Regiment’s Regimental Orientation Program, upon successful graduation was again assigned to the 1st Battalion, 75th Ranger Regiment as the senior physician assistant. In August 2013, he was assigned to the 75th Ranger Regiment’s Special Troops Battalion in Fort Benning, GA. Finally, in April 2015, he was promoted to the Regimental Physician Assistant for the 75th Ranger Regiment in Fort Benning, GA. Major Fisher has been extensively involved in ketamine use at the point of injury for analgesia, the development and implementation of the Group O low titer whole blood program, Resuscitative Endovascular Balloon Occlusion of the Aorta (REBOA) for the Role 1 and point of injury, pain and sedation in prolonged field care, and TCCC adherence. He has also advocated for the utilization of social media for dissemination of education for medics. In 2015, he was accepted at Texas A&M College of Medicine. He is a second-year medical student and continues to serve in the Texas National Guard as a physician assistant. Currently he is a voting member on the Committee on Tactical Combat Casualty Care and Chairman for National Stop the Bleed Day. His awards and recognitions include, Bronze Star Medal (w/ 2 Bronze Oak Leaf Clusters and 1 Valor Device), Purple Heart, Meritorious Service Medal (w/ 2 Bronze Oak Leaf Clusters), Joint Service Commendation Medals (w/ 2 Bronze Oak Leaf Clusters), Army Commendation Medal (w/ 1 Bronze Oak Leaf Cluster), Army Achievement Medal (w/ 2 Bronze Oak Leaf Clusters), Presidential Unit Citation (w/ Bronze Oak Leaf Cluster), Meritorious Unit Commendation, Army Good Conduct Medal, National Defense Service Medal (w/ Bronze Service Star), Afghanistan Campaign Medal (w/ 4 Bronze Campaign Stars), Iraqi Campaign Medal (w/ 2 Bronze Campaign Stars), Global War on Terrorism Service Medal, NCOPD Ribbon, Army Service Ribbon, Korean Defense Service Medal, Overseas Service Ribbon (w/ numeral ‘2’), NATO Medal (ISAF), Combat Medical Badge, Ranger Tab, Senior Parachutist Badge, Flight Surgeon Badge, Expert Field Medical Badge, Italian Jump Wings, Infantry Order of Saint Maurice Medallion (Legionnaire), U.S. Army Physician Assistant of the Year (2010), Distinguished Hoosier (2012), Clarence Sasser Scholarship (2016), Pat Tillman Scholarship (2016). He was a Resident ILE Select and a graduate of the AMEDD Captain’s Career Course. |
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Can someone point me towards a decent resource for information on tourniquet use, or trauma response in general, for a civilian with no formal training? I know there are many videos on YouTube, but as this thread shows, there are conflicting ideas and less than stellar information floating around. I'd also be interested in, in person training if someone can point me towards an group/instructor in central Ohio |
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Can someone point me towards a decent resource for information on tourniquet use, or trauma response in general, for a civilian with no formal training? I know there are many videos on YouTube, but as this thread shows, there are conflicting ideas and less than stellar information floating around. I'd also be interested in, in person training if someone can point me towards an group/instructor in central Ohio I recommend the Stop the Bleed course. Others have posted the link, however here it is: bleedingcontrol.org |
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Can someone point me towards a decent resource for information on tourniquet use, or trauma response in general, for a civilian with no formal training? I know there are many videos on YouTube, but as this thread shows, there are conflicting ideas and less than stellar information floating around. I'd also be interested in, in person training if someone can point me towards an group/instructor in central Ohio |
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What do you want to know? I recommend the Stop the Bleed course. Others have posted the link, however here it is: bleedingcontrol.org Quoted:
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Can someone point me towards a decent resource for information on tourniquet use, or trauma response in general, for a civilian with no formal training? I know there are many videos on YouTube, but as this thread shows, there are conflicting ideas and less than stellar information floating around. I'd also be interested in, in person training if someone can point me towards an group/instructor in central Ohio I recommend the Stop the Bleed course. Others have posted the link, however here it is: bleedingcontrol.org Im aware of the Stop the Bleed program, and have been off and on looking for a class which I can attend. Unfortunately I missed one about a month ago due to an issue at work Thank you |
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Quoted: if we can come to some sort of a conclusion on that and someone will @ me or PM me it I will add it to the OP to save people some time Stop the bleed is a good choice for folks starting out. There is a link two posts above yours. It has some online stuff and a class locator. A few of us here teach it. I teach the regular class to normal folks and add some extras for public safety and hospital types. If you want to follow up with a gunfighter type course, then look for a local tccc class. Depending who does it determines how involved it will be. Some involve shoot houses, live fire etc. |
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“Warfarin?” Is that a drug that lets old dudes continue to participate in warfare in middle age? Prescription only or OTC? Quoted:
Quoted: Get an old fuck using warfarin and you don’t need an arterial injury to bleed out.  Prescription only or OTC? |
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I think this is correct. Especially like with arterial bleeding, the vessel is like a fire hose. Old Newton's laws of motion. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. Arterial bleeds are spray blood and so you can have it travel up and away from the entry wound. Necessitating you apply the TQ up above the wound aways. If I'm wrong though, someone correct that. I don't want to put out bad info. |
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Chest Seals: I was recently taught to tape down petro gauze on one hole (assuming through and through) and tape 3 sides of the wrapper on the other hole for it to vent. I wondered about tape holding the petro gauze, but we didn't practice it. Does that just not work at all or is it suitable for short term until EMT's arrive? |
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Can someone point me towards a decent resource for information on tourniquet use, or trauma response in general, for a civilian with no formal training? I know there are many videos on YouTube, but as this thread shows, there are conflicting ideas and less than stellar information floating around. I'd also be interested in, in person training if someone can point me towards an group/instructor in central Ohio - what is your experience (I note you say you have no formal training)? - how old are you? Here are the general recommended first steps. 1. Learn CPR + (with) AED, learn basic First Aid. If possible, sit an actual class where you are required to practice all skills shown/taught. 2. Do a "bleed control" class. Same applies as above - you absolutely must go hands on. 3. No matter how good you are, skills - and especially for skills applied under stressful conditions, our ability to properly execute these deteriorates over time without practice and frequent exposure. Of course, how well and deeply a new skill is embedded in you will determine (among other things) how much you retain. In my experience, people who do not visualize and practice CPR/TQ skills tend to lose the sharp edge after a few months, and lose enough of the big picture just outside of a year. Furthermore, standards of care are always evolving. 4. Have a good idea for where your best/closest hospital is, if there is a dearth of EMS services where you live or work. |
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if we can come to some sort of a conclusion on that and someone will @ me or PM me it I will add it to the OP to save people some time Quoted:
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Can someone point me towards a decent resource for information on tourniquet use, or trauma response in general, for a civilian with no formal training? I know there are many videos on YouTube, but as this thread shows, there are conflicting ideas and less than stellar information floating around. I'd also be interested in, in person training if someone can point me towards an group/instructor in central Ohio Attached File Nothing can replace real training but it’s a start, especially for folks that at least have some background and just want to stay up to date. I don’t know anyone in OH for training- VA or the Capitol Region I could help you |
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Chest Seals: I was recently taught to tape down petro gauze on one hole (assuming through and through) and tape 3 sides of the wrapper on the other hole for it to vent. I wondered about tape holding the petro gauze, but we didn't practice it. Does that just not work at all or is it suitable for short term until EMT's arrive? Honestly it’s not a great solution. Better than nothing but that’s about all I can say for it. Commercial chest seals are cheap compared to their utility, and you’ll likely only have to buy it once. Just by a Hyfin set or SAM |
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This article by Fisherad1 is a really good read.
https://havokjournal.com/nation/fake-news-studies-show-that-current-military-tourniquets-are-inherently-flawed/ The CoTCCC guidelines state to stop life-threatening external hemorrhage by using a recommended limb tourniquet for hemorrhage that is anatomically amenable to tourniquet use.17,18 The limb tourniquet may be applied over clothing, and if the site of hemorrhage is not obvious, the tourniquet may be placed “high and tight” on the wounded limb. Once this is accomplished, the casualty is moved to cover.17,18 When there is no threat, the tourniquet can be placed 2-3 inches above the wound. Whether these guidelines are taught or consistently followed in combat it isn’t clear. In 2018, DoD instruction 1322.24 Medical Readiness Training, stated that everyone will be instructed in TCCC. Whether this will help increase proficiency with TQ use is still questioned. Currently, the CoTCCC is reviewing TQs, this is the first time since the initial evaluation that this is occurring and it’s a good thing. A TQ review should probably happen every few years. |
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It’s not the gauze alone- you need the Mylar wrapper on top. Honestly it’s not a great solution. Better than nothing but that’s about all I can say for it. Commercial chest seals are cheap compared to their utility, and you’ll likely only have to buy it once. Just by a Hyfin set or SAM Quoted:
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Chest Seals: I was recently taught to tape down petro gauze on one hole (assuming through and through) and tape 3 sides of the wrapper on the other hole for it to vent. I wondered about tape holding the petro gauze, but we didn't practice it. Does that just not work at all or is it suitable for short term until EMT's arrive? Honestly it’s not a great solution. Better than nothing but that’s about all I can say for it. Commercial chest seals are cheap compared to their utility, and you’ll likely only have to buy it once. Just by a Hyfin set or SAM Do you even need the gauze? I'll buy more chest seals. |
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Quoted: I've know a few people that should have had neck tourniquets applied. 
In my opinion, it's like the saying when you have a hammer everything looks like a nail. The mil gave out the Cats and made a big deal out of everyone carrying one in a pocket, to the detriment (IMO) of better first aid training. So you had a bunch of people running around throwing tourniquets on everything they could because it was easy and if it wasn't safe why did the Army issue them one? Saw that with the quikclot also. Being used for minor injuries that a simple pressure dressing could have handled. I personally had to stop a guy from using quickclot on me for a wound that barely required stitches (training accident, not downrange). In combat i have 2-3 sec to make a determination if you need treatment, apply that treatment and pick up a rifle and start shooting again. In that case the TQ makes sense as it WILL stop the bleeding and keep people in the fight until medical aid can be properly arranged. you are not worried about long term complications beyond survival This works. When you are only really given one skillset and set of tools it is all you know. |
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Quoted: I think more than the military implementation, is the rapid implementation within the civilian sector. We've told everyone to apply tourniquets and that they are safe. Well, probably safe for 2 hours, if properly applied. BTW. Everyone should check out Jeff-Kirkham.com. |
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Question about Tourniquet application. Do you apply the T right above the wound or at the top of the limb. Eta: For example: on a severe hand wound would you apply the T on the forearm or top of arm. I took a stop the bleed class a while back and I remember the instructor saying "high and tight" I obviously need to take a refresher. |
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Yeah, as long as we don't have people recommending knock off, and shoddily made TQs to replace the actual US military reviewed, tested and approved TQs. To save a few bucks. Quoted:
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Lots of good input in this thread. You know I bet 95%+ of the people who have commented here have never seen a "concerning" amount of blood loss or know the difference on an injury that warrants TQ placement or something that can be controlled with dressings and pressure. Some of us have though and know the difference. I recommended (and still do) a cheaper alternative to the NAR CAT. If someone has more of something then they are more likely to have it in a handy location when it's needed (such as a car or garage or wherever) in the extremely unlikely event that they will actually need it. If items are of the same quality (the the NAR vs Recon are IMO) why would i not get the cheaper one? If you google the Recon TQ for reviews you'll see skinnymedic (and I like his videos, he has a number reviewing real world TQ usage and placement that I'd recommend but then again I don't know WTF I'm talking about.....) saying that anything other than the NAR CAT is junk. Well guess what..... He sells the NAR CAT. You don't think he's not going to promote his products and talk shit about the competitor? You know how common life threatening blood loss in in every day life? Not very. It may be somewhat common in .mil/combat operations but in daily Joe/Jane citizen life it's not that common at all. In the extremely unlikely event I need a TQ then I'm confident that the Recon will do. People thought the world was once flat. They used to teach never use a TQ New things are always discounted at first. Flame on..... |
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I'm not saying it has never saved someone (there's a reason there are three of them in my truck). I'm just saying a TQ on your body is far more likely to be where you need it when you need it. |
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part of the issue with mil training is that they are not training you in first aid. they are training you in immediate action to keep someone alive while being shot at. Those are different skill sets and mentalities. On the civ/non combat side i have more than enough time to properly asses a patient and apply the appropriate pressure dressing. We are worried about survival and also lessening long term complications as rapid intervention of severe wounds is the norm. In combat i have 2-3 sec to make a determination if you need treatment, apply that treatment and pick up a rifle and start shooting again. In that case the TQ makes sense as it WILL stop the bleeding and keep people in the fight until medical aid can be properly arranged. you are not worried about long term complications beyond survival This works. When you are only really given one skillset and set of tools it is all you know. This was a huge barrier. By the end of the training...I was able to get these guys to recognize life threats and treat them accordingly...but they didn’t really understand the “why”. Which is ok for your CLS guy..not ok for a medic. I would say our non-medical community is very similar to this. No, they aren’t dumb or uneducated..they just don’t need nor have the inclination to learn the “why”. This may be one of the contributing factors to Tourniquets being used on non life threats. There is also the mindset of “well, the tourniquet will stop all the bleeding. So I fixed the problem and the guys down the line can take care of everything else.” Great for combat. Probably should be revised in our EMS/police system. There is also the question of how much time should a police officer or civilian contritubte to this training. It’s easy for a Ranger battalion to put tons of time into the training...by easy..I mean they own you and your time. The days are as long as they need to be to finish the mission. I do not think non mil jobs have the bandwidth nor $ to spend on extensive training for their first line responders. Just an opinion. No facts here.
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Now your looking foolish. Quoted:
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Or it could just be left in the car or something, instead of being worn like its a fucking fashion item.  
Prepare yourself for things you can control, and just live your fucking life, instead of walking around with 30 lbs of crap in your pockets because the zombie apocalypse might happen. |
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they are safe well beyond that time frame assuming proper followup care. |
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No, I'm not. Unless you are a cop, soldier, etc, your likelihood of using a TQ is tiny. I've been a field paramedic for almost 15 years, and my experience is the TQ is needed in industrial accidents, car crashes, and mass shootings. Carrying a pocket TQ (or even sillier, on your belt or ankle) is just tactical dress up. Take it with you camping, etc, sure. I work as camp medic for a boys camp, and you can be damn sure I have them in my bag, but EDC of a TQ is silly.
Prepare yourself for things you can control, and just live your fucking life, instead of walking around with 30 lbs of crap in your pockets because the zombie apocalypse might happen. One comment that is always said in one form or another is "I can't believe we have to train for this. We live in such a crazy world." There are several ways to respond... 1. The chances of you ever utilizing this training is very slim. Just like the chances of you having to use a fire extinguisher or evacuate the school building for a fire. But you probably train for that monthly...with fire drills. 2. While everyone immediately thinks bombs and guns...you are more likely to use a tourniquet for a car wreck or some kind of accident at work. In a school setting..some kid falling off the playset and having an open fracture is more likely to happen than some father deprived young male shooting up your school. One school I taught at was on fucking stilts. These kids went up and down 2 stories of metal stairs daily...I'm surprised one of them hasn't ate shit yet... Slowly...we are starting to see "bleeding kits" next to the AED in some of the public areas around where I live and work. It is nice to see. It just takes time and education to fix the ignorance that surrounds the use our tourniquets. You have to remember...the most people know about medicine is what they learned from their nursing cousin or some TV show. Of course you can shock asystole...They do it on TV all the time. 
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@fisherad1 Log out and back in please. Please follow this up with an email to [email protected] from your .mil address. This will get you the little dog tag icon you see under the avatars of a number of us, denoting your military service. Perhaps more importantly, it gains you access to the restricted military forums. We have cookies and beer. Come on in and say Hi. |
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Quoted: I have to agree. The chances are slim. Nothing wrong with having it for the slim odds. But I wouldn't make it a daily carry. We go to different school systems around the area and teach the STOPTHEBLEED class. One comment that is always said in one form or another is "I can't believe we have to train for this. We live in such a crazy world." There are several ways to respond... 1. The chances of you ever utilizing this training is very slim. Just like the chances of you having to use a fire extinguisher or evacuate the school building for a fire. But you probably train for that monthly...with fire drills. 2. While everyone immediately thinks bombs and guns...you are more likely to use a tourniquet for a car wreck or some kind of accident at work. In a school setting..some kid falling off the playset and having an open fracture is more likely to happen than some father deprived young male shooting up your school. One school I taught at was on fucking stilts. These kids went up and down 2 stories of metal stairs daily...I'm surprised one of them hasn't ate shit yet... Slowly...we are starting to see "bleeding kits" next to the AED in some of the public areas around where I live and work. It is nice to see. It just takes time and education to fix the ignorance that surrounds the use our tourniquets. You have to remember...the most people know about medicine is what they learned from their nursing cousin or some TV show. Of course you can shock asystole...They do it on TV all the time. 
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No, I'm not. Unless you are a cop, soldier, etc, your likelihood of using a TQ is tiny. I've been a field paramedic for almost 15 years, and my experience is the TQ is needed in industrial accidents, car crashes, and mass shootings. Carrying a pocket TQ (or even sillier, on your belt or ankle) is just tactical dress up. Take it with you camping, etc, sure. I work as camp medic for a boys camp, and you can be damn sure I have them in my bag, but EDC of a TQ is silly.
Prepare yourself for things you can control, and just live your fucking life, instead of walking around with 30 lbs of crap in your pockets because the zombie apocalypse might happen. |
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Quoted: Tourniquets are a simple answer to a life threatening problem. A lot of guys don't have the time or motivation to learn the "why" behind tourniquet use. I remember training some Afghan soldiers were personally selected by their commander to be medics. This was 2 NCO medics working with 3 Afghan soldiers daily. They couldn't read and didn't speak English. This was a huge barrier. By the end of the training...I was able to get these guys to recognize life threats and treat them accordingly...but they didn't really understand the "why". Which is ok for your CLS guy..not ok for a medic. I would say our non-medical community is very similar to this. No, they aren't dumb or uneducated..they just don't need nor have the inclination to learn the "why". This may be one of the contributing factors to Tourniquets being used on non life threats. There is also the mindset of "well, the tourniquet will stop all the bleeding. So I fixed the problem and the guys down the line can take care of everything else." Great for combat. Probably should be revised in our EMS/police system. There is also the question of how much time should a police officer or civilian contritubte to this training. It's easy for a Ranger battalion to put tons of time into the training...by easy..I mean they own you and your time. The days are as long as they need to be to finish the mission. I do not think non mil jobs have the bandwidth nor $ to spend on extensive training for their first line responders. Just an opinion. No facts here. |
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Do you carry a gun or leave it in the car? I would assume you are more likely to utilize an AED during a CPR event than you are to come across an event requiring a tourniquet...as a regular guy walking down street... But I don't think people are carrying AEDs...then again....I guess you could argue some people get a version of an AED (pacemaker/defibrillator) implanted...that is true daily carry... |
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It comes down to preference. I would assume you are more likely to utilize an AED during a CPR event than you are to come across an event requiring a tourniquet...as a regular guy walking down street... But I don't think people are carrying AEDs...then again....I guess you could argue some people get a version of an AED (pacemaker/defibrillator) implanted...that is true daily carry... Quoted:
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Do you carry a gun or leave it in the car? I would assume you are more likely to utilize an AED during a CPR event than you are to come across an event requiring a tourniquet...as a regular guy walking down street... But I don't think people are carrying AEDs...then again....I guess you could argue some people get a version of an AED (pacemaker/defibrillator) implanted...that is true daily carry... 
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Quoted:
No, I'm not. Unless you are a cop, soldier, etc, your likelihood of using a TQ is tiny. I've been a field paramedic for almost 15 years, and my experience is the TQ is needed in industrial accidents, car crashes, and mass shootings. Carrying a pocket TQ (or even sillier, on your belt or ankle) is just tactical dress up. Take it with you camping, etc, sure. I work as camp medic for a boys camp, and you can be damn sure I have them in my bag, but EDC of a TQ is silly.
Prepare yourself for things you can control, and just live your fucking life, instead of walking around with 30 lbs of crap in your pockets because the zombie apocalypse might happen. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Or it could just be left in the car or something, instead of being worn like its a fucking fashion item.
Prepare yourself for things you can control, and just live your fucking life, instead of walking around with 30 lbs of crap in your pockets because the zombie apocalypse might happen. |
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Quoted:
Hopefully, no thinks I'm saying having and knowing how to use a TQ is dumb. I just think EDC of one is overkill unless you are a cop or something. But for other reasons I can’t carry all the time, so when I am, it isn’t a bad idea to have some fix it stuff on hand. |
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Quoted:
Since one of the big reasons you might need a tourniquet is if a limb gets traumatically amputated, I don't think it makes sense to keep it on a limb. Same with the folks that keep tourniquets on their rifles. I think tourniquets belong on your waist, chest or neck. And yea, if the idea of carrying a TQ on a limb doesn't make sense to you, you can carry it elsewhere... 
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