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Originally Posted By Iamhere: China doesn't want to find out. Last 5 years been having my own war with China by not buying their goods. You can help, but will you ever learn. View Quote I like this notion, but it gets harder when the business' involved don't care and buy crap from the modern far east asia co-prosperity sphere!! |
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Originally Posted By SkyFive: It would be a no win situation for everyone involved. It would look like WWII only worse. It would truly be a 'world' war. View Quote But we're not going to let countries like Vietnam and the PI tell us if we have forward bases there, to have to check out with them first whether we take action against anyone or not. I wouldn't do it either. Let them continue crying or STFU and let us do our job. |
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Originally Posted By brickeyee: But are, at best, barely able to reach us. They could strike at some of our allies that are closer. View Quote ? Attached File Attached File |
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Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/B040B6D1-D875-4296-903A-1F3CB5B1A5BD_jpe-1412729.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/C81C7CC2-2F79-428E-9FF5-AEBD4B1ADC2B_jpe-1412730.JPG View Quote They have to come out of them sometime...... |
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Originally Posted By Bama-Shooter: Commie propaganda is best propaganda. View Quote The real question is whether they believe their own lies. Miscalculation based on saving face is likely how they trigger a war Attached File |
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All yll keep alluding to nuke or naval blockades or conventional warfare...but if you think Covid-19 is their only contagion your missing the boat.
Hell...given China's obfuscation of Covid-19 and it's ongoing effects...they have either 'warned' us - or they have already initiated hostilities. |
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Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: ? https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/E9132C60-4016-4CBE-8105-811F7C1E48AB_jpe-1412761.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/AF54C311-9C3E-47D8-A614-8603B46E3D35_jpe-1412762.JPG View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Originally Posted By brickeyee: But are, at best, barely able to reach us. They could strike at some of our allies that are closer. ? https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/E9132C60-4016-4CBE-8105-811F7C1E48AB_jpe-1412761.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/AF54C311-9C3E-47D8-A614-8603B46E3D35_jpe-1412762.JPG Doubt anyone can talk about details but .mil that do air defense I've talked to seem pretty confident in THAAD. Scenario where we would have to put that to the test get froggy fast. |
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Originally Posted By cyclone: They have to come out of them sometime...... View Quote May hug their coast and peek out like a turtle head and just launch at Guam and Hawaii all day long https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/chinas-navy-could-have-76-submarines-2030-report-149431 Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Short version is China hopes lots and lots of their missiles keep us stuck in Hawaii https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/2183972/china-releases-footage-guam-killer-df-26-ballistic-missile-clearhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/EA9CC3A3-16ED-48DB-994D-26C3187B17FB_jpe-1412737.JPGhttps://bulletin.facs.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Guam-Map.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: I haven't spent a lot of time studying US military plans with respect to China, so could someone explain what a war with China would actually look like? It seems like any full scale war between China and the US would quickly escalate into the use of nuclear weapons. I doubt the Chinese are going to allow the US navy to sit off the coast of mainland China and launch weapons into it. Likewise, invasion and occupation of mainland china seems impossible. I mean really, what's the end game here? Short version is China hopes lots and lots of their missiles keep us stuck in Hawaii https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/2183972/china-releases-footage-guam-killer-df-26-ballistic-missile-clearhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/EA9CC3A3-16ED-48DB-994D-26C3187B17FB_jpe-1412737.JPGhttps://bulletin.facs.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Guam-Map.jpg Reading that article and considering the distance between Taiwan and China is about 100 miles, it seems like anything floating near Taiwan would be in range of everything they have. They wouldn't even need the DF-26 to hit us if we tried to intervene in Taiwan. |
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Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: Doubt anyone can talk about details but .mil that do air defense I've talked to seem pretty confident in THAAD. Scenario where we would have to put that to the test get froggy fast. View Quote Limiting my reply to open source former Pentagon officials, I’ve heard 51/49 circa 2017 info. Their were some exercises in Alaska to improve that about a year or two ago so maybe 60/40? China’s plan is sheer numbers and overwhelm us with quantity of missiles |
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Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: Reading that article and considering the distance between Taiwan and China is about 100 miles, it seems like anything floating near Taiwan would be in range of everything they have. They wouldn't even need the DF-26 to hit us if we tried to intervene in Taiwan. View Quote My impression is they believe they have wins in Korean Peninsula, Taiwan and South China Sea. In their minds they think it’s a guaranteed lock |
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Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: Doubt anyone can talk about details but .mil that do air defense I've talked to seem pretty confident in THAAD. Scenario where we would have to put that to the test get froggy fast. View Quote Also Attached File |
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Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: The latest think tank seems to be that the USMC response would be inserting units to operate in a more autonomous or semi-autonomous role in non-permissive AOs. Trending away from trying to establish a foothold in country and operating with relative regional dominance. So nothing like what some here are talking about with us trying to occupy mainland China. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: I haven't spent a lot of time studying US military plans with respect to China, so could someone explain what a war with China would actually look like? It seems like any full scale war between China and the US would quickly escalate into the use of nuclear weapons. I doubt the Chinese are going to allow the US navy to sit off the coast of mainland China and launch weapons into it. Likewise, invasion and occupation of mainland china seems impossible. I mean really, what's the end game here? The latest think tank seems to be that the USMC response would be inserting units to operate in a more autonomous or semi-autonomous role in non-permissive AOs. Trending away from trying to establish a foothold in country and operating with relative regional dominance. So nothing like what some here are talking about with us trying to occupy mainland China. So use the USMC as a guerrilla force to wreak havoc in Chinese controlled territory? Sounds like a logistical nightmare to keep units like that supplied for any length of time. |
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China's Achilles heel is the fact that they would have to support a war machine and domestic supply lines for its people at the same time. Huge resources from allied countries. Those allies would also have to have the ability to fight off US influence.
I think China has done a good job with propaganda making some believe that it is this mighty dragon that cannot be beaten because of its size... but what seems like a tiny weakness on a giant, is a foothold to slay a giant. Its 1.3 billions people is its weakness and the requirement to feed them, heat them, cool them, becomes an issue in of itself. I believe China would inflict so much damage on itself economically that it would not be able to sustain losses over - OVER A SHORT PERIOD! China has an iron will in regards to controlling its people but the second you try to do that globally, it fails! We can see how people inside the US in many institutions- media, education, tech, might be swayed with money... most of the US would not be. sorry... my money is on the US |
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Originally Posted By sabre_kc: Ballgame. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/55357/ohio7_jpg-1412704.JPG View Quote This. Our subs pick off their subs. Then, our subs pick off their fleet. Let them try to invade Taiwan with RORO’s. TC |
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Step one: Turn entire Chinese Surface Fleet into a Submarine Fleet at 0300 local time on a given day.
Step two: Turn entire Chinese Submarine Fleet into artificial reef's at 0300 local time on a given day. Adjust the times above to include realistic timing. Implement Navel Blockade Implement Aerial Blockade |
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Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: So use the USMC as a guerrilla force to wreak havoc in Chinese controlled territory? Sounds like a logistical nightmare to keep units like that supplied for any length of time. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: I haven't spent a lot of time studying US military plans with respect to China, so could someone explain what a war with China would actually look like? It seems like any full scale war between China and the US would quickly escalate into the use of nuclear weapons. I doubt the Chinese are going to allow the US navy to sit off the coast of mainland China and launch weapons into it. Likewise, invasion and occupation of mainland china seems impossible. I mean really, what's the end game here? The latest think tank seems to be that the USMC response would be inserting units to operate in a more autonomous or semi-autonomous role in non-permissive AOs. Trending away from trying to establish a foothold in country and operating with relative regional dominance. So nothing like what some here are talking about with us trying to occupy mainland China. So use the USMC as a guerrilla force to wreak havoc in Chinese controlled territory? Sounds like a logistical nightmare to keep units like that supplied for any length of time. Put sneaky Pete out there and start zapping some tax collectors. It might take some clandestine blood money to gear this puppy up. |
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Quoted: https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/6F92BDA7-D116-47B7-8497-3925945FC8B2_jpe-1412642.JPG View Quote I’m relatively new here. You do know that global times is a state run Chinese propaganda arm, right? Like straight up axis-sally propaganda. This is like me linking to my own tweet calling my penis big. thats like, your opinion man |
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Originally Posted By Janden: China's Achilles heel is the fact that they would have to support a war machine and domestic supply lines for its people at the same time. Huge resources from allied countries. Those allies would also have to have the ability to fight off US influence. I think China has done a good job with propaganda making some believe that it is this mighty dragon that cannot be beaten because of its size... but what seems like a tiny weakness on a giant, is a foothold to slay a giant. Its 1.3 billions people is its weakness and the requirement to feed them, heat them, cool them, becomes an issue in of itself. I believe China would inflict so much damage on itself economically that it would not be able to sustain losses over - OVER A SHORT PERIOD! China has an iron will in regards to controlling its people but the second you try to do that globally, it fails! We can see how people inside the US in many institutions- media, education, tech, might be swayed with money... most of the US would not be. sorry... my money is on the US View Quote You have no idea what kind of suffering and losses they’d be willing to impose on their own people simply to hold onto their own power, much less fight a war against outsiders. They’ll let a billion starve before letting go. |
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Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Also https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/FCA8E2A8-CB72-4EED-A180-D5AA726255BD_jpe-1412788.JPG View Quote I wonder if "prized arms projects" is their pet name for padding pockets versus actually replacing or maintaining equipment. Definitely don't want to get into another Cold War era spend off with China instead of bringing production home to undermine them. |
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Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: ? https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/E9132C60-4016-4CBE-8105-811F7C1E48AB_jpe-1412761.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/459941/AF54C311-9C3E-47D8-A614-8603B46E3D35_jpe-1412762.JPG View Quote the sneaky ones off their coast can beat those times. |
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Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: I wonder if "prized arms projects" is their pet name for padding pockets versus actually replacing or maintaining equipment. Definitely don't want to get into another Cold War era spend off with China instead of bringing production home to undermine them. View Quote I figure it’s been so long, it’s baked into the cake and you won’t get one without the other. Joes down at E-4 and below will eat shit sandwiches while someone else is living la vida loca. At best you minimize the egregious over the top crap if you’re lucky |
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Originally Posted By scrolledandtabbed: I’m relatively new here. You do know that global times is a state run Chinese propaganda arm, right? Like straight up axis-sally propaganda. This is like me linking to my own tweet calling my penis big. thats like, your opinion man View Quote Some South Koreans actually edited a Wikipedia penis size entry back in the 90s as well as average male height |
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Who is behind this Global Times commie propaganda news and why is Op a member of their readership? Sounds like a bunch of Fake News BS just like CNN, MSNBC, and NPR. Op really needs to re-evaluate where he gets his misinformation. Tomorrow he'll be quoting Russia Today, Al-Jazeera, Izvestia, and Info Wars.
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Originally Posted By Finslayer83: the sneaky ones off their coast can beat those times. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Finslayer83: the sneaky ones off their coast can beat those times. I figure 8-10 minutes in some areas. Maybe less. You would have to maybe even back off for breathing room in some cases. |
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How is victory defined? There's no way we can sustain a long ground war with China on their doorstep.
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LMMFAO! There's no way in hell that those little commie faggots could even stand a chance. Stupid fucking idiots.
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Originally Posted By INV136: Who is behind this Global Times commie propaganda news and why is Op a member of their readership? Sounds like a bunch of Fake News BS just like CNN, MSNBC, and NPR. Op really needs to re-evaluate where he gets his misinformation. Tomorrow he'll be quoting Russia Today, Al-Jazeera, Izvestia, and Info Wars. View Quote https://www.defensenews.com/pentagon/2019/10/01/the-pentagon-has-created-a-new-office-solely-focused-on-china-is-that-a-good-idea/ Attached File |
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Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: My bigger question is do they believe their own bullshit {match against other sources in China} or is it simple posturing? Chinese pride can be one hell of a drug https://i.gifer.com/3qWQ.gif View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Originally Posted By scrolledandtabbed: I’m relatively new here. You do know that global times is a state run Chinese propaganda arm, right? Like straight up axis-sally propaganda. This is like me linking to my own tweet calling my penis big. thats like, your opinion man My bigger question is do they believe their own bullshit {match against other sources in China} or is it simple posturing? Chinese pride can be one hell of a drug https://i.gifer.com/3qWQ.gif Plenty of people in this thread that believe it, let alone what they over there do. I appreciate being aware of what a wanna be world power is doing to shape the narrative. |
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Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: https://33.media.tumblr.com/8962c5f903cbe98173822d3c19ebf326/tumblr_nkwzk6zrOR1tkh0v7o1_400.gif View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Originally Posted By INV136: Who is behind this Global Times commie propaganda news and why is Op a member of their readership? Sounds like a bunch of Fake News BS just like CNN, MSNBC, and NPR. Op really needs to re-evaluate where he gets his misinformation. Tomorrow he'll be quoting Russia Today, Al-Jazeera, Izvestia, and Info Wars. https://33.media.tumblr.com/8962c5f903cbe98173822d3c19ebf326/tumblr_nkwzk6zrOR1tkh0v7o1_400.gif Appropriate. |
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Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: Plenty of people in this thread that believe it, let alone what they over there do. I appreciate being aware of what a wanna be world power is doing to shape the narrative. View Quote The Pentagon has been having a war of words with China lately, so I’m merely piggybacking off the White House to be honest but even if that wasn’t the case I still want to know what’s up given the Pentagon’s switch from war on terrorism to prepping for great power war after Obama’s half hearted Pacific pivot policy Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Originally Posted By mrcatbert: You have no idea what kind of suffering and losses they’d be willing to impose on their own people simply to hold onto their own power, much less fight a war against outsiders. They’ll let a billion starve before letting go. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By mrcatbert: Originally Posted By Janden: China's Achilles heel is the fact that they would have to support a war machine and domestic supply lines for its people at the same time. Huge resources from allied countries. Those allies would also have to have the ability to fight off US influence. I think China has done a good job with propaganda making some believe that it is this mighty dragon that cannot be beaten because of its size... but what seems like a tiny weakness on a giant, is a foothold to slay a giant. Its 1.3 billions people is its weakness and the requirement to feed them, heat them, cool them, becomes an issue in of itself. I believe China would inflict so much damage on itself economically that it would not be able to sustain losses over - OVER A SHORT PERIOD! China has an iron will in regards to controlling its people but the second you try to do that globally, it fails! We can see how people inside the US in many institutions- media, education, tech, might be swayed with money... most of the US would not be. sorry... my money is on the US You have no idea what kind of suffering and losses they’d be willing to impose on their own people simply to hold onto their own power, much less fight a war against outsiders. They’ll let a billion starve before letting go. I took two semesters of East Asian history in college. The CPC's rise to power has several points where millions of Chinese people were allowed to starve for political objectives. I don't doubt that they would let millions die again. |
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Quoted: I don't know what's worse, how terrible Chinese propaganda is, or the fact that some people actually seem to buy into it. View Quote Yep. I don't believe it's translation thing either. They're just bad at it. You can say it, we all know. Democrats. Useful idiots. Enemies of the Republic. But I repeat myself. |
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They are right.
Whether we have the weapons and the ability or not, the politicians will fuck it up and turn certain victory into defeat. We don’t win wars anymore, we quit because we get tired. |
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Quoted: I took two semesters of East Asian history in college. The CPC's rise to power has several points where millions of Chinese people were allowed to starve for political objectives. I don't doubt that they would let millions die again. View Quote Life has no value to communists. It seems that even in the US, after 60 years of (communist) social engineering...life is losing its value here too. |
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Originally Posted By SAE: Put sneaky Pete out there and start zapping some tax collectors. It might take some clandestine blood money to gear this puppy up. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By SAE: Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: Originally Posted By OddAtmosphere: Originally Posted By C3H5N3O9: I haven't spent a lot of time studying US military plans with respect to China, so could someone explain what a war with China would actually look like? It seems like any full scale war between China and the US would quickly escalate into the use of nuclear weapons. I doubt the Chinese are going to allow the US navy to sit off the coast of mainland China and launch weapons into it. Likewise, invasion and occupation of mainland china seems impossible. I mean really, what's the end game here? The latest think tank seems to be that the USMC response would be inserting units to operate in a more autonomous or semi-autonomous role in non-permissive AOs. Trending away from trying to establish a foothold in country and operating with relative regional dominance. So nothing like what some here are talking about with us trying to occupy mainland China. So use the USMC as a guerrilla force to wreak havoc in Chinese controlled territory? Sounds like a logistical nightmare to keep units like that supplied for any length of time. Put sneaky Pete out there and start zapping some tax collectors. It might take some clandestine blood money to gear this puppy up. I can see that working for a while. I don't believe the average rural Chinese person has a great love for the urban parts of their country. Kill off CPC political and police power in the rural areas, spread around some money, and foment rebellion. Sounds like it could at least give the urban centers heartburn. |
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America's Current War Plans for China, Russia Will Not Work, New Report Says
How the U.S. Could Lose a War With China How the U.S. Could Lose a War With China It’s not that the Chinese Communist Party would take over Washington. But in its own region, China has the advantage. f a war broke out between the United States and China, the clash between two of the world’s most powerful militaries would be horrific. And the United States could very well lose. That’s a concern among current and former defense officials and military analysts, one of whom told Breaking Defense earlier this year that in war games simulating great-power conflict in which the United States fights Russia and China, the United States “gets its ass handed to it.” US ‘Gets Its Ass Handed To It’ In Wargames: Here’s A $24 Billion Fix “In our games, when we fight Russia and China,” RAND analyst David Ochmanek said this afternoon, “blue gets its ass handed to it.” In other words, in RAND’s wargames, which are often sponsored by the Pentagon, the US forces — colored blue on wargame maps — suffer heavy losses in one scenario after another and still can’t stop Russia or China — red — from achieving their objectives, like overrunning US allies. No, it’s not a Red Dawn nightmare scenario where the Commies conquer Colorado. But losing the Baltics or Taiwan would shatter American alliances, shock the global economy, and topple the world order the US has led since World War II. Body Blows & Head Hits How could this happen, when we spend over $700 billion a year on everything from thousand-foot-long nuclear-powered aircraft carriers to supersonic stealth fighters? Well, it turns out US superweapons have a little too much Achilles in their heels. “In every case I know of,” said Robert Work, a former deputy secretary of defense with decades of wargaming experience, “the F-35 rules the sky when it’s in the sky, but it gets killed on the ground in large numbers.” Even the hottest jet has to land somewhere. But big airbases on land and big aircraft carriers on the water turn out to be big targets for long-range precision-guided missiles. Once an American monopoly, such smart weapons are now a rapidly growing part of Russian and Chinese arsenals — as are the long-range sensors, communications networks, and command systems required to aim them. So, as potential adversaries improve their technology, “things that rely on sophisticated base infrastructure like runways and fuel tanks are going to have a hard time,” Ochmanek said. “Things that sail on the surface of the sea are going to have a hard time.” (That’s why the 2020 budget coming out next week retires the carrier USS Truman decades early and cuts two amphibious landing ships, as we’ve reported. It’s also why the Marine Corps is buying the jump-jet version of the F-35, which can take off and land from tiny, ad hoc airstrips, but how well they can maintain a high-tech aircraft in low-tech surroundings is an open question). Worst of all, Work and Ochmanek said, the US doesn’t just take body blows, it takes a hard hit to the head as well. Its communications satellites, wireless networks, and other command-and-control systems suffer such heavy hacking and jamming that they are, in Ochmanek’s words, “suppressed, if not shattered.” The US has wargamed cyber and electronic warfare in field exercises, Work said, but the simulated enemy forces tend to shut down US networks so effectively that nothing works and nobody else gets any training done. “Whenever we have an exercise and the red force really destroys our command and control, we stop the exercise,” Work said, instead of trying to figure out how to keep fighting when your command post gives you nothing but blank screens and radio static. The Chinese call this “system destruction warfare,” Work said: They plan to “attack the American battle network at all levels, relentlessly, and they practice it all the time.” |
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Originally Posted By Doodles: Wrong. With or without canned sunshine we'd crush them. It would be a long fight for strategic reasons but we'd win if we chose too. How's that for knowing? View Quote Assuming conventional only war, it would be over in weeks, and then the blockade would be established and those f--kers would run out of fuel and starve. Starving might take some time. A lot of long pig there. |
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Originally Posted By Thunder900: The Chinese know that a multi front war would develop that would make it hard for us to fight. Would the US/ASEAN/NATO risk nuclear war over Taiwan, Pacific Islands, S. Korea, the Strait of Hormuz, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia and Poland? I have my doubts. View Quote Why a multi front war? They can't bring it here or anywhere. Sink their coastal defense force they call the People's Army Navy, set up a blockade of the very limited approaches to China and starve them of fuel and food. |
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Originally Posted By Doodles: Wrong. With or without canned sunshine we'd crush them. It would be a long fight for strategic reasons but we'd win if we chose too. How's that for knowing? View Quote It depends on our goals. If we just wanted to remove their capability to hurt us and take them off of the world stage we could do that easily. Occupy/pacify them? I doubt it. But they could do it to us either. |
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The bio-weapon attacks will keep coming, if the chinese know there are no consequences. War is coming. Do it now or do it later. The die has been cast.
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Originally Posted By Hesperus: I would be willing to bet that our fourth generation stuff could fuck up their alleged fifth generation stuff. The problem however would be a ground war. That does not seem like an easy country to occupy. View Quote Our Vietnamese/Taiwanese allies will fill that gap. We could probably scrape a few hundred thousand Koreans together as well. I wonder what a regiment of Saudi ground troops would cost? Put them in the more fractious areas and give them free rein. |
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