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Matthew 7:21-23
""Not everyone who calls out to me, 'Lord! Lord!' will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter. On judgment day many will say to me, 'Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.' But I will reply, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God's laws.'" |
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I know his Dessault and Airbus ACJ319 pilots. He’s a tier one douche only slightly surpassed by his wife.
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I don’t like him because he’s a false teacher selling self-help advice and calling it Christianity. No, he’s not the only one. I don’t like the others either.
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6 out of 10 on the troll thread rating. Definitely more entertaining than what we've seen lately .
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Quoted: People hate him because he's made a fortune from his "evangelism" work. His home. https://investormint.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/joel-osteen-mansion.png View Quote I thought that was the standard of living well GD home. |
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Quoted: His philosophy is that people mostly already know what they're doing wrong, and that's better to forgive, and lead them in the correct direction gently, vs. clubbing them over the head with damnation. He does say we need to repent, frequently actually. If he leads tens of thousands of people to believe in Christ, will Christ reject them because they chose the wrong guide? When Jesus walked the earth, the religious leaders complained He was doing it all wrong too. View Quote But he isn't leading anyone to believe in Christ, if you have a biblical understanding of what it means to believe in Christ. There are uncountable numbers of passages one could work through to demonstrate Osteen's anti-biblical teachings, but the one I'll leave you with is this: In John 16 we learn that the Holy Spirit will 'convict the world of sin, righteousness, and judgement'. A quick google search turned up a halfway decent explanation of this. I don't know this site - at all - but skimming over the entry for that passage they seem to explain it well (I don't have time, right now, to be honest). https://www.gotquestions.org/convict-world-sin-righteousness-judgment.html But I want you to focus on this part of that passage: Jesus said that the Holy Spirit would do these things - convict the world of sin, righteousness, and judgement. In the bolded part of your post, you imply that Osteen thinks he's smarter than that and can 'win' people by avoiding hard talk about man's sin, God's righteousness, and the coming judgement. I submit to you that when he tries to 'preach' without addressing these topics with all the seriousness that they deserve, the Holy Spirit has no part in his 'ministry'. He's trying to 'hack' his preaching by skipping over the work of the Spirit (ie the conviction of sin, righteousness, and judgement). When the Spirit of God convicts a man of his sin, the man doesn't mind the hard words. When God saves a man, He does so with all three persons of the Triune Godhead working together - Father, Son, and Spirit working together. But when Osteen avoids these things, we can say, if we believe Scripture, that the Holy Spirit has no part in his work. And we can then say that nobody is getting saved by hearing such foolishness - because he's purposefully avoiding the very topics through which the Spirit works (according to Jesus's words). Again, I could literally go forever on this topic, if I had time, but I do not. A word to the wise is sufficient. Believe me, or not, but I am telling you - Scripture refutes Osteen's claims to be any sort of minister. Scripture condemns him. Do with that information what seems best to you. |
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America's greatest sin is idolatry. Osteen along with a large percentage of Christian preachers are guilty of pushing people toward idolatry.
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Quoted: OP. Hello. Sincere questions... 1. You obviously "follow" him right? Nope, like I said, I don't even know what he sounds like. I just know his face and creepy smile from walking through Barnes and Noble over the years. 2. How much have you donated? None 3. What "reasons/issues" encouraged you to follow him? Just fascination with how people make money. 4. Lastly why did you feel a need to defend him here? Not defending him. I'm defending truth. I'm not sure if there is an opposite term to virtue signaling but the news about him has several of those. I meant this thread to be more about an objective look at a guy and how everything the media says is wrong and inflammatory. I'm pretty skeptical of all news and like to pick them apart. Any time a story contains a blurb about a corporate jet, you know logic is going out the window and they are appealing to the fact that you don't have one and someone else does. View Quote |
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This thread is quite funny. Dude stands on a stage and gives motivational speeches using a religious aspect, and even says if you want real religion join another church. And people are butthurt over him making bank.
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God doesn’t exist, nor does “heaven”
The devil might be real. Probably in your best interests to not be evil. When you die, that’s it. You’re gone. I have no problem with “religion” because in general it makes humans act better. But for those that are expecting heaven/hell- I think they’re going to end up disappointed. Especially people that believe in Joel Osteen or any priest/preacher. Same as a used car salesmen |
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Matthew 19:16-30
16 A man came to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to have eternal life?” 17 Jesus answered, “Why do you ask me about what is good? Only God is good. But if you want to have eternal life, obey the law’s commands.” 18 The man asked, “Which ones?” Jesus answered, “‘You must not murder anyone, you must not commit adultery, you must not steal, you must not tell lies about others, 19 you must respect your father and mother,’[a] and ‘love your neighbor[b] the same as you love yourself.’[c]” 20 The young man said, “I have obeyed all these commands. What else do I need?” 21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, then go and sell all that you own. Give the money to the poor, and you will have riches in heaven. Then come and follow me!” 22 But when the young man heard Jesus tell him to give away his money, he was sad. He didn’t want to do this, because he was very rich. So he left. 23 Then Jesus said to his followers, “The truth is, it will be very hard for a rich person to enter God’s kingdom. 24 Yes, I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter God’s kingdom.” |
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Quoted: This thread is quite funny. Dude stands on a stage and gives motivational speeches using a religious aspect, and even says if you want real religion join another church. And people are butthurt over him making bank. View Quote |
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OP: Do you feel that if you listen to him, donate to his church, buy his books etc you have a better chance of going to Heaven?
I suspect the answer is no, and that's great. The problem is there are a lot of people who listen to people like him and donate and buy books thinking it will help them be saved. He is making money off those people's fears and insecurities and that isn't very Christian as far as I am concerned. |
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One of the great entertainers. I wish I had a radio station.
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As I recall, his father was a genuine person, and I think many feel Joel was handed a opportunity to continue the good works, but he retooled the message to be one that works good for getting him as many income opportunities as possible. I don't see him giving back in the ways even the furniture store guy 20 miles up the road does, Mack isn't preaching about anything, but expounding on the worth of hard work, and will have twice or more the legacy Joel ever will.
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Quoted: Joel Osteen to return $4.4M pandemic loan. https://nypost.com/2021/10/10/joel-osteens-lakewood-church-to-repay-4-4m-in-ppp-loans/ So a few things about Osteen. 1. Returning a loan isn't really doing much since you were supposed to pay it back in the first place. (that's why it's called a loan.) But the media is reading this as some sort of admission of wrongdoing. 2. Small thinkers like to point out separation of church and state but the PPP loans were for organizations who employ people regardless of their mission. He employee 350 people at his church. (I bet some of them aren't even Christians. Just really good at organizing events.) The loans were granted to support employees, not to set up a national religion. 3. He doesn't take a salary from his church for his religious activities. Folks wonder how he can be worth $50, well, he sold 100 million copies of one of his books and he has 13 other best sellers. He gets paid 100-200k per speaking engagement and can easily do three a day because of his private jet. Why on earth shouldn't he be worth that much? And his jet is nice, I'm sure, but there is a good business purpose for it. If it costs 10k a day to fly and he can eek out 3 instead of 2 speaking engagements over flying coach, then it's paid for itself. 4. During the floods they had that goofy notion that he's supposed to turn his church into a hotel. It holds 16,800 spectators. As if it's stocked with bedding, food, and toiletries for people to sleep there. They just have concrete floors and uncomfortable stadium seats. I believe they tried this with the New Orleans Superdome during Katrina with terrible results. Yeah I wouldn't want to do that to my church either. If he had opened his church up to people the media would be all over about how it isn't a shelter and the terrible conditions. He made the right choice. 5. How on earth can anyone think he's skimming from his church when he has a perfectly lucrative side business and probably views his church as a loss leader to sell his books and speaking engagements? This is different from Jim and Tammy Baker. They actually did take money directly from the plate. 6. And there are lots of motivational speakers who refer to God and religion as a base for what they do. Is he just suffering from McDonald's syndrome where he happens to be the biggest target? No I'm not a follower. Never read his book, never attended his events. I don't even know what he sounds like. Just tired of media BS and think he hasn't gotten a fair deal. View Quote Yeah, about Harvey. I walked out of my house and saw the median of the road had become a refugee camp due to the flooding, and that was only day 2. Plenty of other churches and private businesses opened up and took people in for shelter. None of them were set up like hotels, either. He made the wrong decision and for you to take the other stance makes me think you're extremely biased with an agenda. |
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Quoted: As I recall, his father was a genuine person, and I think many feel Joel was handed a opportunity to continue the good works, but he retooled the message to be one that works good for getting him as many income opportunities as possible. I don't see him giving back in the ways even the furniture store guy 20 miles up the road does, Mack isn't preaching about anything, but expounding on the worth of hard work, and will have twice or more the legacy Joel ever will. View Quote Mattress Mack made his money moving cocaine through the port of Houston. I thought everyone knew that. Hard work? I guess, if you count his business being a tax front for a huge drug smuggling operation in the 80s and 90s as being hard. |
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He's taking millions of people to hell but besides that I'm sure he's a swell guy.
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Quoted: Matthew 19:16-30 16 A man came to Jesus and asked, "Teacher, what good thing must I do to have eternal life?" 17 Jesus answered, "Why do you ask me about what is good? Only God is good. But if you want to have eternal life, obey the law's commands." 18 The man asked, "Which ones?" Jesus answered, "'You must not murder anyone, you must not commit adultery, you must not steal, you must not tell lies about others, 19 you must respect your father and mother,'[a] and 'love your neighbor[b] the same as you love yourself.'[c]" 20 The young man said, "I have obeyed all these commands. What else do I need?" 21 Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, then go and sell all that you own. Give the money to the poor, and you will have riches in heaven. Then come and follow me!" 22 But when the young man heard Jesus tell him to give away his money, he was sad. He didn't want to do this, because he was very rich. So he left. 23 Then Jesus said to his followers, "The truth is, it will be very hard for a rich person to enter God's kingdom. 24 Yes, I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter God's kingdom." View Quote 26But Jesus looked at them and said to them, "With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible." |
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My Mom watches him sometimes, so I'll watch too. Hes not bad. He doesn't ask for money, generally has an uplifting, positive message. Tells people to find a church that fits them. *shrug*
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Prosperity preaching. He's speaking to the innate greed (a sin) of people instead preaching the gospel, which has zero to do with receiving riches and rewards while on this earth. The only prosperity he cares about is his own. A charlitan and a wolf in sheep's clothing who has probably led millions away from God. Wouldn't want to be in his place someday.
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Quoted: But he isn't leading anyone to believe in Christ, if you have a biblical understanding of what it means to believe in Christ. There are uncountable numbers of passages one could work through to demonstrate Osteen's anti-biblical teachings, but the one I'll leave you with is this: In John 16 we learn that the Holy Spirit will 'convict the world of sin, righteousness, and judgement'. A quick google search turned up a halfway decent explanation of this. I don't know this site - at all - but skimming over the entry for that passage they seem to explain it well (I don't have time, right now, to be honest). https://www.gotquestions.org/convict-world-sin-righteousness-judgment.html But I want you to focus on this part of that passage: Jesus said that the Holy Spirit would do these things - convict the world of sin, righteousness, and judgement. In the bolded part of your post, you imply that Osteen thinks he's smarter than that and can 'win' people by avoiding hard talk about man's sin, God's righteousness, and the coming judgement. I submit to you that when he tries to 'preach' without addressing these topics with all the seriousness that they deserve, the Holy Spirit has no part in his 'ministry'. He's trying to 'hack' his preaching by skipping over the work of the Spirit (ie the conviction of sin, righteousness, and judgement). When the Spirit of God convicts a man of his sin, the man doesn't mind the hard words. When God saves a man, He does so with all three persons of the Triune Godhead working together - Father, Son, and Spirit working together. But when Osteen avoids these things, we can say, if we believe Scripture, that the Holy Spirit has no part in his work. And we can then say that nobody is getting saved by hearing such foolishness - because he's purposefully avoiding the very topics through which the Spirit works (according to Jesus's words). Again, I could literally go forever on this topic, if I had time, but I do not. A word to the wise is sufficient. Believe me, or not, but I am telling you - Scripture refutes Osteen's claims to be any sort of minister. Scripture condemns him. Do with that information what seems best to you. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: His philosophy is that people mostly already know what they're doing wrong, and that's better to forgive, and lead them in the correct direction gently, vs. clubbing them over the head with damnation. He does say we need to repent, frequently actually. If he leads tens of thousands of people to believe in Christ, will Christ reject them because they chose the wrong guide? When Jesus walked the earth, the religious leaders complained He was doing it all wrong too. But he isn't leading anyone to believe in Christ, if you have a biblical understanding of what it means to believe in Christ. There are uncountable numbers of passages one could work through to demonstrate Osteen's anti-biblical teachings, but the one I'll leave you with is this: In John 16 we learn that the Holy Spirit will 'convict the world of sin, righteousness, and judgement'. A quick google search turned up a halfway decent explanation of this. I don't know this site - at all - but skimming over the entry for that passage they seem to explain it well (I don't have time, right now, to be honest). https://www.gotquestions.org/convict-world-sin-righteousness-judgment.html But I want you to focus on this part of that passage: Jesus said that the Holy Spirit would do these things - convict the world of sin, righteousness, and judgement. In the bolded part of your post, you imply that Osteen thinks he's smarter than that and can 'win' people by avoiding hard talk about man's sin, God's righteousness, and the coming judgement. I submit to you that when he tries to 'preach' without addressing these topics with all the seriousness that they deserve, the Holy Spirit has no part in his 'ministry'. He's trying to 'hack' his preaching by skipping over the work of the Spirit (ie the conviction of sin, righteousness, and judgement). When the Spirit of God convicts a man of his sin, the man doesn't mind the hard words. When God saves a man, He does so with all three persons of the Triune Godhead working together - Father, Son, and Spirit working together. But when Osteen avoids these things, we can say, if we believe Scripture, that the Holy Spirit has no part in his work. And we can then say that nobody is getting saved by hearing such foolishness - because he's purposefully avoiding the very topics through which the Spirit works (according to Jesus's words). Again, I could literally go forever on this topic, if I had time, but I do not. A word to the wise is sufficient. Believe me, or not, but I am telling you - Scripture refutes Osteen's claims to be any sort of minister. Scripture condemns him. Do with that information what seems best to you. Thanks for the time you put into that. I looked at the link, and will study further. |
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If you can't tell what he is in relatively short order, I feel sorry for you and am left wondering how you survive in life without special assistance.
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Because he is slimy, perhaps the slimiest Televangelist to have ever walked the surface of the Earth (granted, he never said he could bring back the dead like Benny Hill Hines). Every time I see him it reminds me of how much I hate Evangelists. The all drive expensive cars and live in McMansions and have perfect skin and hair and wives who eventualy look like Tami Fae Bakers-dozen.
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Quoted: Joel Osteen is a terrible person, but I'm quite certain that he has no control over that. You need to read the Bible. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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Quoted: How? He seems to make a lot of people happy and improve themselves. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: The fact that he makes suffering people hurt more kinda bugs me. Some "motivational" speaking that is. How? He seems to make a lot of people happy and improve themselves. The follow on effects of that for people who are suffering is pretty obvious. If you're seriously interested, hit the second link below the youtube video I put in my post earlier in the thread - the one going to sermonaudio. WOF is some pretty vile stuff. |
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Quoted: Would Jesus wear a Rolex? View Quote Maybe if Jesus bought one off a street corner. I paid $50 for one, was a good watch till the battery ran out. Looks like a used car salesman. |
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Quoted: People like him that pervert the gospel for personal gain are likely going to hell. If Jesus was around today, do you think he’d be doing $100k speaking engagements, writing bestsellers, and jetting around the world on a private jet? Obviously not. View Quote If Jesus was around today, how do you think he would speak to the masses? 1 on 1? Standing on a soap box on a corner? I am not a fan of JO, but like OP, I don't understand the hate. |
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He's a motivational speaker at best or a prosperity preacher at worst.
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He is a modern incarnation of the health and wealth cult.
Health and Wealth cult Dr Walter Martin No minister of the Gospel should be a millionaire, live on a mansion, etc. off of the proceeds of ministering. If wealth is obtained through a completely unrelated profession or business, even if it is Christian based, that’s fine, as long as the success is not based on being a famous minister or pastor. The money, wealth, and possessions are worldly things, and the Gospel and Christianity are not of this world and can’t bring worldly favor, only persecution if presented truthfully. JO obscures the truth with the feel good message. |
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Quoted: Is it wrong to want people to be successful, to show them to change their negativity? I do believe God wants us to live our best life now. When you're down and out, it's hard to bring anything to the world. Then again, the metaphysical God as the Universe speaks to me more than anything in the Old Testament. People really like to hear good news and positive things. That's all he's selling, no different than Norman Vincent Peale, also a minister. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: If you are a Bible-believing Christian, you know that Osteen is leading people to Hell. Ready proof: Osteen published a book called Your Best Life Now. If you believe the Bible, you know that there is someone who wants this to be your best life, and it ain't God. Is it wrong to want people to be successful, to show them to change their negativity? I do believe God wants us to live our best life now. When you're down and out, it's hard to bring anything to the world. Then again, the metaphysical God as the Universe speaks to me more than anything in the Old Testament. People really like to hear good news and positive things. That's all he's selling, no different than Norman Vincent Peale, also a minister. If that's what you want to hear, knock your socks off. But that's not Christianity. |
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Quoted: Quoted: OP. Hello. Sincere questions... 1. You obviously "follow" him right? Nope, like I said, I don't even know what he sounds like. I just know his face and creepy smile from walking through Barnes and Noble over the years. 2. How much have you donated? None 3. What "reasons/issues" encouraged you to follow him? Just fascination with how people make money. 4. Lastly why did you feel a need to defend him here? Not defending him. I'm defending truth. I'm not sure if there is an opposite term to virtue signaling but the news about him has several of those. I meant this thread to be more about an objective look at a guy and how everything the media says is wrong and inflammatory. I'm pretty skeptical of all news and like to pick them apart. Any time a story contains a blurb about a corporate jet, you know logic is going out the window and they are appealing to the fact that you don't have one and someone else does. Attached File |
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Quoted: People hate him because he's made a fortune from his "evangelism" work. His home. https://investormint.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/joel-osteen-mansion.png View Quote What a dick. None of those buildings are a shop. He probably doesn't even have a lift. |
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Op if you can't recognize blatant con artists, you've got big gullibility problems.
Of course, that won't make you lonely. |
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