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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:09:27 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lowdown3: I know of probably 5 or more BJJ gyms that allow local LEOs to train for free. You know how many show up? Occasionally, one will show up, get rough with one of the 15 year olds who will then handle them, their ego gets bruised and they don't come back. Grow up, everyone's ego gets bruised doing combatives, let it go cupcake and learn.. We see more COs both current and previous train than we do normal LEOs. The place is non-profit and has always bent over backwards to meet scheduling demands. Most just don't want to continue. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:14:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: fargo007]
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ironknife: I get what Fargo is saying, I went through Norfolk Sheriff academy in 95( navy used it for security training)most of the hands on was pain compliance techniques, I have no idea what cops get taught now. I don’t think he is saying beat heads in or breaking ribs. Most of us aren’t as talented as you are and don’t have the time to get that good. A prod here to keep someone where u want them or move them where u want them is how I read it. I think striking does have a place for sure, but shouldn’t be the first technique to go to unless that’s all u got. Still think the sap moves the bar over to everyone deciding fighting isn’t worth it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ironknife: Originally Posted By Underscore_O_Three: Thanks for the Judo compliments. I don't do a lot of wrestling takedowns after 12 stitches on the eyebrow from a knee. Also thanks for not clowning the Facebook reel that didn't hotlink. I'm slow and fat. My comment still stands that 3x per week for 3 month of BJJ at the academy would be excellent training. Good PT that builds confidence and the ability to deal with resistant opponents. They won't be "good" probably the equivalent of a 1 stripe white belt but they would have good understanding of a takedown, side control and mount positions as well as a few armlocks. I understand that grappling presents the opportunity for suspects to grab service weapons, etc. But sometimes you don't get a choice. I see all to often the favored technique expressed in posts here about beating their face, smashing ribs and pain compliance. If you are down there beating their face you could be gift wrapping them up instead. I get what Fargo is saying, I went through Norfolk Sheriff academy in 95( navy used it for security training)most of the hands on was pain compliance techniques, I have no idea what cops get taught now. I don’t think he is saying beat heads in or breaking ribs. Most of us aren’t as talented as you are and don’t have the time to get that good. A prod here to keep someone where u want them or move them where u want them is how I read it. I think striking does have a place for sure, but shouldn’t be the first technique to go to unless that’s all u got. Still think the sap moves the bar over to everyone deciding fighting isn’t worth it. He's arguing against a straw man here. You are correct. I'm not saying that at all, and I never used the term "break ribs." He did, and then he continues using that as the background for everything else he said. I also agree on the sap, which is basically the same thing I'm saying - pain compliance. At some point you need to win decisively, and if someone is that uncooperative (and in the video even producing a knife), the longer it goes on, the worse it's going to get for everyone involved. But of course you already know this. And since he's never done the job and had to get a dramatically uncooperative and combative person who will punch, bite, scratch & gouge into handcuffs under a UoF policy before it escalates into another level of force, his remarks about what LEO's should or should not do are more than a little hollow for me. I can see how it seems from the outside that grappling martial arts and USPSA are the answer to any law enforcement situation when they are only helpful in a much smaller part of it all. You need to be in good shape, and be able to handle yourself capably against a physically uncooperative person. Those are the only two absolutes. There's no world in American law enforcement (or personal combat of any kind) where striking is not a skill, and will not be required at all. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:20:11 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jodan1776: So why is only the black girl's face blurred? Due to embarrassment over her weak contribution to the effort? |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:21:58 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bmason63: lol @ trying to patent a gift wrap. These techniques have been around forever but I guess someone has to bring it to the mainstream (and make a little money off of it). You dont even know. North Carolina is currently reworking the state level DT material and while a lot of it is BJJ based, many of the things being put in the program have to be re-named or taught a different way due to trademark issues the clan at Torrance have in place. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:22:19 PM EDT
[#5]
At my agency, officers were provided ammo, instructors, range time all on agency time, and we had trouble getting officers to regularly practice shooting. They might come out just before qualification in hopes that that one practice session would help them qualify.
Other than me, there was only one other officer in the entire agency that trained in any martial art (aikido) on his own time. But neither firearms training nor the lack of martial arts training was unusual for most law enforcement agencies. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:23:44 PM EDT
[#6]
A solid DT material should be grappling heavy but has to include striking and defense against striking. All too often agencies that get into the BJJ side of things tend to push their programs way into the realm of BJJ and leave striking on the shelf with very little mention of it made.
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BHS
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:24:26 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fargo007: He's arguing against a straw man here. You are correct. I'm not saying that at all, and I never used the term "break ribs." He did, and then he continues using that as the background for everything else he said. You literally said beat their faces and get the heaviest guy to drive their elbow into Renners rib. "If one of them would have cracked him hard in the face three or four times this would be over in ten fucking seconds. Or lean with a (pointy, eastern-european) elbow on his ribs with the heaviest motherfucker there" Speaking as someone who has had this EXACT THING happen that did result in a broken rib I call bullshit. And yeah, you are calling on cops to start punching people in the face in lieu of good grappling control. You are either lazy or like beating suspects up. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:26:34 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jollyg83: Uh ok. I’ve had to hands on with patients multiple times. I learned early on pressure points and when to apply them. meh...pressure points have a place but arent the best, or even better, tool for most situations |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:32:46 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ironknife: Old school one. There's a reason why they carried them. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:35:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: fargo007]
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Underscore_O_Three: You literally said beat their faces and get the heaviest guy to drive their elbow into Renners rib. "If one of them would have cracked him hard in the face three or four times this would be over in ten fucking seconds. Or lean with a (pointy, eastern-european) elbow on his ribs with the heaviest motherfucker there" Speaking as someone who has had this EXACT THING happen that did result in a broken rib I call bullshit. And yeah, you are calling on cops to start punching people in the face in lieu of good grappling control. You are either lazy or like beating suspects up. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Underscore_O_Three: Originally Posted By fargo007: He's arguing against a straw man here. You are correct. I'm not saying that at all, and I never used the term "break ribs." He did, and then he continues using that as the background for everything else he said. You literally said beat their faces and get the heaviest guy to drive their elbow into Renners rib. "If one of them would have cracked him hard in the face three or four times this would be over in ten fucking seconds. Or lean with a (pointy, eastern-european) elbow on his ribs with the heaviest motherfucker there" Speaking as someone who has had this EXACT THING happen that did result in a broken rib I call bullshit. And yeah, you are calling on cops to start punching people in the face in lieu of good grappling control. You are either lazy or like beating suspects up. Where did I say the "break ribs" part you keep referring to? And as stated over and over again, you have no idea what you are talking about on the law enforcement or UoF end of this. The guy fighting against the officers determines what is required to get him under arrest and under control where he can't hurt himself, or anyone else. I'm not "calling on" anyone to "start" doing anything they don't already have full access and authority to do. Every single UoF policy there is will permit both pain compliance and striking at some point. Nothing at all I suggested - neither a bloody nose, nor an elbow leaning on the ribs to achieve compliance would be considered even remotely excessive in a situation like that video in the OP shows. And that guy happens to be super good at grappling, which is why what they're doing to him isn't working at all. The amount of "skill" it would take to out-grapple Rener Gracie or someone like him (either due to size/strength, or martial arts skill) isn't attainable for well over 99% of patrol officers. If you don't like it, I'm very sorry but that's just the way it is. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:39:22 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fargo007: Where did I say the "break ribs" part you keep referring to? And as stated over and over again, you have no idea what you are talking about on the law enforcement or UoF end of this. The guy fighting against the officers determines what is required to get him under arrest and under control where he can't hurt himself, or anyone else. I'm not "calling on" anyone to "start" doing anything they don't already have full access and authority to do. Every single UoF policy there is will permit both pain compliance and striking at some point. Nothing at all I suggested - neither a bloody nose, nor an elbow leaning on the ribs to achieve compliance would be considered even remotely excessive in a situation like that video in the OP shows. If you don't like it, I'm very sorry but that's just the way it is. A solid strike can be a great motivator at times and open up new opportunities to apply functional grappling techniques 
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FL, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:41:45 PM EDT
[#12]
I'll just say this, being a firearms guy and not a DT guy: pain compliance is totally irrelevant in the truly hard fights against someone truly doped up or crazy. I've seen guys bear spray themselves, break bones, get shot, etc and not even notice. Pain compliance just makes the easy fights easier.
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:44:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: fargo007]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: A solid strike can be a great motivator at times and open up new opportunities to apply functional grappling techniques Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: Originally Posted By fargo007: Where did I say the "break ribs" part you keep referring to? And as stated over and over again, you have no idea what you are talking about on the law enforcement or UoF end of this. The guy fighting against the officers determines what is required to get him under arrest and under control where he can't hurt himself, or anyone else. I'm not "calling on" anyone to "start" doing anything they don't already have full access and authority to do. Every single UoF policy there is will permit both pain compliance and striking at some point. Nothing at all I suggested - neither a bloody nose, nor an elbow leaning on the ribs to achieve compliance would be considered even remotely excessive in a situation like that video in the OP shows. If you don't like it, I'm very sorry but that's just the way it is. A solid strike can be a great motivator at times and open up new opportunities to apply functional grappling techniques That's a very good point, and I agree. The strikes I'm advocating are exclusively for the purpose of gaining control. I'm NOT saying that anyone should be beaten more than is necessary to accomplish that, but if that works, and it ends the encounter quicker than wrestling on the ground with someone whose skills in that world you know nothing about, I'm all for it. I can wrestle and boxed & kickboxed, but are there people out there better than I am, who could get me into a position where they can get my gun out? Yeah - there are. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:48:11 PM EDT
[#14]
3 cops and a DEI hire.
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Posted: 8/27/2024 2:50:48 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fargo007: That's a very good point, and I agree. The strikes I'm advocating are exclusively for the purpose of gaining control. I'm NOT saying that anyone should be beaten more than is necessary to accomplish that, but if that works, and it ends the encounter quicker than wrestling on the ground with someone whose skills in that world you know nothing about, I'm all for it. I can wrestle and boxed & kickboxed, but are there people out there better than I am, who could get me into a position where they can get my gun out? Yeah - there are. For us a strike is a strike. If I have the opportunity to drop a bomb on someone that is fighting, and we are at the point that strikes are justified, then I'm certainly going to entertain the possibility of doing it. Rener and co dont talk much about it hitting people because 10 they arent good at it 2) it hurts their marketing. |
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AR, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:01:14 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Riply21: now give him pcp Also naked and covered in sweat with about 25 lbs on you. I asked a cop I was rolling with what he'd do if a guy tried some judo or BJJ on him. He acted like he was drawing his pistol and aiming it at me. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:12:18 PM EDT
[#17]
Okay here is the thing about LEOs and striking; it has a limited application in a non-sporting fight and a very high risk both in training and in liability for something like law enforcement (beating someone with batons has bad optics and that isn't going away anytime before we start hanging horse thieves again). There are only a few ways that you can effectively train striking against noncompliant partners (boxing and muy tai come to mind) and a big focus in grappling is (or should be) fighting for grips/control of your opponent so if you end up in a scuffle against a talented/experienced grappler you are gonna be in a world of shit.
So while I don't like the idea of cops being shown tiny little snippets of grappling and being sent out into the world I like the idea of them being given minimal striking training instead even less. Man, @Underscore_O_Three that video you posted has me missing leg grabs. I use to do a split hip marote gari and also a deashi barai hybrid ankle pick / single against opposite stance players. I don't miss the standing submissions mostly because my coach in college liked to spam flying juji gatame when he wasn't throwing me on a drop kata garuma. You know one thing that just occurred to me is we actually have to start a lot of right-handed cops left handed because dropping their right foot back and covering their pistol is so engrained. Haven't had a southpaw LEO come in yet but we actually have a high percentage of them in the club. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:20:07 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ShermanMcCoy: Pffft - that's nothing compared to this woman.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qNDZZTFGfQThat poor kid deserves better. |
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LA, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:23:13 PM EDT
[#19]
This is what tasers are for.
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:24:05 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Koa: That poor kid deserves better. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Koa: Originally Posted By ShermanMcCoy: Pffft - that's nothing compared to this woman. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qNDZZTFGfQThat poor kid deserves better. Why does every drunk idiot supposedly have a lawyer on retainer? |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:30:32 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Riply21: now give him pcp thank you...all of this is great until they're trying to rip your eyes out and don't feel pain. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:31:28 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ZF-1: Taser Taser Taser. You done resisting? Taser Taser Taser. /thread I’d have used the taser well before I went hands on with a guy with cauliflower ear. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:32:49 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bohr_Adam: Why does every drunk idiot supposedly have a lawyer on retainer? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bohr_Adam: Originally Posted By Koa: Originally Posted By ShermanMcCoy: Pffft - that's nothing compared to this woman. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qNDZZTFGfQThat poor kid deserves better. Why does every drunk idiot supposedly have a lawyer on retainer? She named Morgan and Morgan, which appears to be some giant personal injury firm. Perhaps she did business with them before for some other spurious claim? |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:33:47 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: meh...pressure points have a place but arent the best, or even better, tool for most situations PPs are a minor, momentary distraction, sometimes. Some are better than others. Hooking and yanking someone forward and down by the clavicle is often an attention getter. Probably not a policy approved move.  But, even not intoxicated, you really dont feel much of that thing in a fight. What would be an owie in everyday life goes completely unnoticed. Structural incapacitation or failure is different. Of course that is outside the bounds of encouraging someone into a set of cuffs. So, you're left with force, leverage and position with encouragement from various pain compliance, taser, pepper, joint locks, strikes. It's really too bad the best compliant technique is often against policy. An unconcious person is very easy to handle. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 3:46:11 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lowdown3: I know of probably 5 or more BJJ gyms that allow local LEOs to train for free. You know how many show up? Occasionally, one will show up, get rough with one of the 15 year olds who will then handle them, their ego gets bruised and they don't come back. Grow up, everyone's ego gets bruised doing combatives, let it go cupcake and learn.. We see more COs both current and previous train than we do normal LEOs. In the interest of conversation, how many hours a week would you say that the average LEO would have to commit to on order to be any good at that? I had one guy in my entire career who was pretty good at martial arts, but he brought the skillset to law enforcement from his days in the military. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:11:31 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Windustsearch: There was a reason most quit carrying them too. As related to me from someone with experience- they tend to rip and tear skin. While not an entirely horrible injury, it looks bad enough to freak everyone else out. But effective, especially in close quarters. Oh well |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:12:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Steel-Driver-76]
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ZF-1: Taser Taser Taser. You done resisting? Taser Taser Taser. Yup. That's why I'm not a cop. I'm not big enough to subdue many, and I probably can't subdue anyone but the smallest girls without hurting them. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:13:35 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lowdown3: I know of probably 5 or more BJJ gyms that allow local LEOs to train for free. You know how many show up? Occasionally, one will show up, get rough with one of the 15 year olds who will then handle them, their ego gets bruised and they don't come back. Grow up, everyone's ego gets bruised doing combatives, let it go cupcake and learn.. We see more COs both current and previous train than we do normal LEOs. Nailed it. When I was active our class trained several local LE. Some showed interest (after taking their baton away from them) or their inability to put cuffs on anyone in the class without them offensively resisting. Two were surprised by what a simple ironwood kali stick can do offensively or defensively and commented they would shoot someone wielding sticks. Not sure that what we wanted to demonstrate. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:14:54 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ironknife: But effective, especially in close quarters. Oh well |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:19:06 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Windustsearch: If it was legal to carry one here I would. I don't have a department reputation to babysit. I can here but rarely carry it. Pistol and that makes my pants sag too much. 😂👿😂😂 |
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AL, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:29:23 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WackbiscuitThorazine: And thats why people get fucked up in arrests Just dont know when to quit Cops don't know when to fuck off. |
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USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:35:19 PM EDT
[#32]
Cops from the 20s would solve this problem quick.
THWHACK "Comply." NOOO (THWACK) *sobbing and compliance* |
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USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:37:25 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jollyg83: Uh ok. I’ve had to hands on with patients multiple times. I learned early on pressure points and when to apply them. But sure keep thinking EMS doesn’t go hands on. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jollyg83: Originally Posted By WesJanson: The fight at the beginning is a sham, simply because there's zero attempt being made at getting cuffs on and control of the wrists. The very end, when Gracie is talking about an ideal of having EMS put someone into a "SafeWrap position 2" prior to arrival of law enforcement is so insanely nutty any cop here is already trying to pull themselves off the floor from laughing. EMS doesn't go hands-on with a combative at-large subject by themselves..period. Unless it's life or death and they're being attacked, in which case they're probably using improvised weapons or just running like hell. What's *not* being shown is how you magically get the hostile subject onto the ground and set up for SafeWrap(TM). Because like most techniques, if you train at it for years and you're a large, fit guy, you'll find it relatively easy to subdue most subjects, provided they're not on hallucinogens, dissassociatives, or utterly insane. Getting that technique to work for the 100 lb cop, or work when someone has zero pain receptors and believes they're the Hulk because the voices are telling them so...is a different story. Uh ok. I’ve had to hands on with patients multiple times. I learned early on pressure points and when to apply them. But sure keep thinking EMS doesn’t go hands on. I'm an ignorant wallflower and even *I* know ems and even featherweight female nurses in the ER have to go hands on with crazy wild people. Hang around an ER for a while and listen to see how often a code grey gets called. If you want to hear real stories, talk to people who work psych floors. 
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:38:54 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlashMan-7k: I'm an ignorant wallflower and even *I* know ems and even featherweight female nurses in the ER have to go hands on with crazy wild people. Hang around an ER for a while and listen to see how often a code grey gets called. If you want to hear real stories, talk to people who work psych floors. In our ER if a patient got antsy it wasn't long before the nurse would appear with a needle full of happiness to knock them unconscious into tomorrow. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:51:34 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WackbiscuitThorazine: And thats why people get fucked up in arrests Just dont know when to quit |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:58:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: NCPatrolAR]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alien: Watching body cam videos, it's fucking crazy to see how many people escalate a situation and fight with multiple police officers. It's also unbelievable how far the police go to treat the violent resisters with kid gloves. People need a fucking ass whooping a lot more often than they get one unfortunately. As a whole cops use WAY too little force when going hands on with suspects. People also tend to not like the way decisive force looks but then criticize cops for using too little |
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USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 4:59:50 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alien: Watching body cam videos, it's fucking crazy to see how many people escalate a situation and fight with multiple police officers. It's also unbelievable how far the police go to treat the violent resisters with kid gloves. People need a fucking ass whooping a lot more often than they get one unfortunately. Think of how many people never discipline their kids in any meaningful way. Not just that the kid never gets a finger laid on them, but that they aren't disciplined at all, in any way. Till the parent loses it and goes on a scream-smack the kid around fest (and than they wonder why their kid is an out of control brat). Now imagine all those kids are grown up. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:07:16 PM EDT
[#38]
The Gracie marketing hype is strong. My BJJ instructor (black belt) offers free classes at the local sheriff office's DT room. There were two deputies that attended and were like "this is BS. This stuff isnt practical." So where do they end up going.....the Gracie school that is ran by a blue belt.
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TX, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:14:47 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alien: Watching body cam videos, it's fucking crazy to see how many people escalate a situation and fight with multiple police officers. It's also unbelievable how far the police go to treat the violent resisters with kid gloves. People need a fucking ass whooping a lot more often than they get one unfortunately. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:18:16 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ridgerunner9876: Yeah. Made of 1/16" dyneema, folded in a special CO2 charged compartment on their Bat Belt, right next to the grappling hook apparatus so they can walk up buildings. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ridgerunner9876: Originally Posted By nightstalker: Cargo nets make more sense. Yeah. Made of 1/16" dyneema, folded in a special CO2 charged compartment on their Bat Belt, right next to the grappling hook apparatus so they can walk up buildings. |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:20:16 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ZF-1: Taser Taser Taser. You done resisting? Taser Taser Taser. CHTPT. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:21:27 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alien: Watching body cam videos, it's fucking crazy to see how many people escalate a situation and fight with multiple police officers. It's also unbelievable how far the police go to treat the violent resisters with kid gloves. People need a fucking ass whooping a lot more often than they get one unfortunately. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alien: Originally Posted By WackbiscuitThorazine: And thats why people get fucked up in arrests Just dont know when to quit I also watch a lot of bodycam (I think I've watched nearly every video on the PoliceActivity youtube channel) and one thing that always amazes me is how awkward takedowns are, even when it's 2 or more on 1. |
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AL, USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:39:38 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlashMan-7k: Think of how many people never discipline their kids in any meaningful way. Not just that the kid never gets a finger laid on them, but that they aren't disciplined at all, in any way. Till the parent loses it and goes on a scream-smack the kid around fest (and than they wonder why their kid is an out of control brat). Now imagine all those kids are grown up. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlashMan-7k: Originally Posted By Alien: Watching body cam videos, it's fucking crazy to see how many people escalate a situation and fight with multiple police officers. It's also unbelievable how far the police go to treat the violent resisters with kid gloves. People need a fucking ass whooping a lot more often than they get one unfortunately. Think of how many people never discipline their kids in any meaningful way. Not just that the kid never gets a finger laid on them, but that they aren't disciplined at all, in any way. Till the parent loses it and goes on a scream-smack the kid around fest (and than they wonder why their kid is an out of control brat). Now imagine all those kids are grown up. The government isn't our parent. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:43:44 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FlashMan-7k: Think of how many people never discipline their kids in any meaningful way. Not just that the kid never gets a finger laid on them, but that they aren't disciplined at all, in any way. Till the parent loses it and goes on a scream-smack the kid around fest (and than they wonder why their kid is an out of control brat). Now imagine all those kids are grown up. Most people nowadays make it to adulthood without ever being punched in the face |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 5:55:23 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryYeah that's not happening. This isn't Logan's Run |
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USA
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Posted: 8/27/2024 6:18:30 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BamaMarine: The government isn't our parent. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BamaMarine: Originally Posted By FlashMan-7k: Originally Posted By Alien: Watching body cam videos, it's fucking crazy to see how many people escalate a situation and fight with multiple police officers. It's also unbelievable how far the police go to treat the violent resisters with kid gloves. People need a fucking ass whooping a lot more often than they get one unfortunately. Think of how many people never discipline their kids in any meaningful way. Not just that the kid never gets a finger laid on them, but that they aren't disciplined at all, in any way. Till the parent loses it and goes on a scream-smack the kid around fest (and than they wonder why their kid is an out of control brat). Now imagine all those kids are grown up. The government isn't our parent.  Here and I just meant what my words meant. People who's parents don't parent them tend to wind up as ... see vids of people fighting cops like idiots. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 6:31:31 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ZF-1: Taser Taser Taser. You done resisting? Taser Taser Taser. This, or hard enough take down, enough to take the air out of lungs/sense out of them, by the time the do come to there senses, already in cuffs. Simply put, if your LEO, and having to play grappling games once the suspect is down to get cuffs on them, you already fucked badly. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 6:36:14 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By tc556guy: In the interest of conversation, how many hours a week would you say that the average LEO would have to commit to on order to be any good at that? I had one guy in my entire career who was pretty good at martial arts, but he brought the skillset to law enforcement from his days in the military. We have some blue belts that can really handle some shittake. For blue, 2 years most places with regular attendance and showing progress. Less if they are training more. BJJ tends to not trend towards the "belt factory" McDojo non sense and most places will tend to promote slowly. I was 19 months to blue missing only 5 regular classes during that time period, but my instructor promoted very slowly. Back then there wasn't a BJJ gym on every corner, so we literally had to drive a couple hours to train with a black belt who ok'ed my instructor for me to go to blue. 10 seems to be average to black belt and then you really start learning IMO. |
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Posted: 8/27/2024 6:39:51 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NCPatrolAR: The Gracie marketing hype is strong. My BJJ instructor (black belt) offers free classes at the local sheriff office's DT room. There were two deputies that attended and were like "this is BS. This stuff isnt practical." So where do they end up going.....the Gracie school that is ran by a blue belt. This. It's like the "online" blue belts. We have had a few come in over the years, the whites trounce most of them. You can only "study" something like this by yourself, you can't really practice it nor truly get proficient with it just watching stuff. Kinda like all the guys that watch Utube videos about shooting but don't train.
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Posted: 8/27/2024 6:46:09 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lowdown3: We have some blue belts that can really handle some shittake. For blue, 2 years most places with regular attendance and showing progress. Less if they are training more. BJJ tends to not trend towards the "belt factory" McDojo non sense and most places will tend to promote slowly. I was 19 months to blue missing only 5 regular classes during that time period, but my instructor promoted very slowly. Back then there wasn't a BJJ gym on every corner, so we literally had to drive a couple hours to train with a black belt who ok'ed my instructor for me to go to blue. 10 seems to be average to black belt and then you really start learning IMO. Which pretty much confirms my belief that the reason you guys aren't seeing LEOs regularly attending these training schools is that the officers just dont have the time to predictably dedicate to the extensive course of instruction. Especially if they're married with kids and holding down multiple jobs |
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