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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:26:27 PM EDT
[#1]
I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go.
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:27:18 PM EDT
[#2]
Mutha-effin’ OST.
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:27:26 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go. The LOP limit that is not written anywhere in the United States code? |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:28:08 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So will everyone be very angry? Or will they get thrown under the bus like "Muh Bumpstock"? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is just the tip of this massive iceberg. In the near future they will be coming hard and fast for the brace/pistol crowd with a vengeance. So will everyone be very angry? Or will they get thrown under the bus like "Muh Bumpstock"? There are a helluva lot more pistol braces out there than bump stocks. They are immensely popular (especially with the poors, lol) |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:28:11 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The LOP limit that is not written anywhere in the United States code? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go. The LOP limit that is not written anywhere in the United States code? Or the CFR or anywhere on paper. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:28:27 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go. Low hanging fruit, for the reasons you mentioned, for the JBTs. They don't think it will piss off that many people if they go after the richies. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:28:49 PM EDT
[#7]
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:28:58 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Government Magic: Poof! We have just created thousands more felons for our dogs to prosecute. More dogs to shoot and people to burn alive in their homes. More 12 year olds to shoot in the back, and mothers holding infants to snipe at.  |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:29:04 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go. I guess gun owners will have to "compromise" again-you know,give up something,so we get to keep what's left. Until the next "compromise"... |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:29:27 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This back and forth bullshit just makes me care less and less about gun laws  Yup. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:29:33 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The LOP limit that is not written anywhere in the United States code? > ATF > We legislators now > pick up that can |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:30:04 PM EDT
[#12]
Anyone else filling out a Form 1 right now?
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:30:25 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The ATF can make interpretations of law and enforce their interpretations with criminal charges and confiscation of property at will. They can even change interpretations they have previously put in writing to manufacturers. Basically they can do whatever they want and are not subject to any oversight. I know... that ambiguity and the capricious real time interpretation is a huge part of the problem. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:30:31 PM EDT
[#14]
Like others have said, it's probably the LOP.
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:30:42 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go. SB tactical makes the Honey Badger brace, its not a coincidence they look extremely similar.  Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:31:04 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Anyone else filling out a Form 1 right now? Do you own one? Please measure the length of pull for us |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:31:10 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is my guess as well. Nothing else about it is unusual. Even the 13" LOP "limit" hasn't been expressly stipulated, so this should shake that out? |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:31:19 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/73787/IMG_0954_JPG-1623108.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/73787/IMG_9119_JPG-1623109.JPG I think at this point a solid argument can be made that SBR and SBS laws are stupid and pointless. Pistol braces and "firearms" that are 14" barreled shotguns have been around and very popular for about eight years now and there has not been any adverse effects through their use in regards to violent crime. The NFA is a tax scheme and a violation of the 2nd. https://i.imgur.com/cdgOyed.gifv |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:31:29 PM EDT
[#19]
Feel bad for the 87 people who own them.
Yes, that's envy for the few who have one, and yes I really really want a badger. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:31:32 PM EDT
[#20]
This is why AR pistols are stupid. Just SBR them and you don't have worry about Trump and the ATF making them illegal.
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:31:35 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hope for a Trump win,so the 12 year assault on our 2nd Amendment ends!!! 12 years? try 80 years.. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:31:48 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The ATF has trouble with the telescoping pistol brace. I have heard rumblings of this as well. When I bought my first pistol two different FFL holders told me "Fixed brace good; telescoping brace bad". Even though both are/were legal(?) they were of the opinion that easily adjustable braces would one day be declared "stocks." |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:32:33 PM EDT
[#23]
Sounds like the ATF is struggling with a fundamental understanding of their role in American society.
Come to think of it, I am too. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:33:07 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I also thought Kevin was the CEO? What happened there? Go back under your rock 
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:33:10 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go. We'll see, but that sounds like wishful thinking. The dominoes might be gettin' ready to fall. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:33:30 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I know... that ambiguity and the capricious real time interpretation is a huge part of the problem. At least the IRS and EPA are more or less consistent about following their own rulings. If the IRS acted like the ATF they would audit you for returns you filed that were correct when you filed them. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:33:34 PM EDT
[#27]
And if an ATF agent or 10 are shot in the face, there will be weeping and wailing, here, for those brave LEOs. Mourning for their poor family. Calls for the shooter to be dismembered and burnt alive.
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:33:40 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OST What does that stand for? |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:34:04 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is why AR pistols are stupid. Just SBR them and you don't have worry about Trump and the ATF making them illegal. Lol Cute that you believe paying the man will make you immune. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:34:16 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is why AR pistols are stupid. Just SBR them and you don't have worry about Trump and the ATF making them illegal. I have SBR’s and the ATF fucking with people over this is fucking stupid |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:34:29 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This back and forth bullshit just makes me care less and less about gun laws Pretty much this........FATF |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:34:35 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How is LOP measured, from where to where? trigger face to end of stock/brace, obviously fully extended |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:34:49 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Novekse also sells pistols with the same brace. The length of pull is my guess as well. Does anyone own one of these lowers that can measure? |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:34:53 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And if an ATF agent or 10 are shot in the face, there will be weeping and wailing, here, for those brave LEOs. Mourning for their poor family. Calls for the shooter to be dismembered and burnt alive. And this is true also. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:34:58 PM EDT
[#35]
The "Chevron deference" is some made up .gov bullshit that needs to be struck down now.
Legislative branch has been hiding behind it ever since it became "doctrine". |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:35:11 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How is LOP measured, from where to where? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is my guess as well. Nothing else about it is unusual. Even the 13" LOP "limit" hasn't been expressly stipulated, so this should shake that out? Trigger to shouldering point. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:35:18 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How is LOP measured, from where to where? Face of the trigger to the rear-most portion of the brace end. Lots of major gun manufacturers attach braces as standard to their weapons. If this was a broad move against braces, we’d see a LOT more notices than just this particular one. The Honey Badger brace looks WAY over the “suggested” limit of 13”, especially in its extended position. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:35:22 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Even the 13” LOP “limit” hasn’t been expressly stipulated, so this should shake that out? It's right there in the Constitution: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed, except the maximum lenght of a pistol pull is 13"." |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:35:22 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Additionally, we encourage you to reach out to the White House and ask President Trump to halt and rollback ATF's efforts to issue arbitrary and capricious decisions affecting millions of legal gun owners. White House Comment Line: (202) 456-1111 / Email LMAO. Shirley you can't be serious??? |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:35:36 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How is LOP measured, from where to where? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Novekse also sells pistols with the same brace. The length of pull is my guess as well. Does anyone own one of these lowers that can measure? Where, exactly, is the "allowable" length of pull codified? |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:35:36 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have SBR’s and the ATF fucking with people over this is fucking stupid Going after the smugglers on the southern border violating hundreds of federal laws and ITAR is dangerous though compared to making some middle aged men spend an extra $200 on a product that was legal when they bought it. It's not even like the ATF has a shortage of real criminals with all of the felons straw buying every day and gangs transporting weapons across state lines by the boatload. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:35:41 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is why AR pistols are stupid. Just SBR them and you don't have worry about Trump and the ATF making them illegal. We can't have NFA items in NY, I have an AR pistol though. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:36:16 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I suspect if this was a broader push to reclassify braces they would have went after the SBA3, which is clearly the most popular brace on the market. The Q Honey Badger is a high end, fairly uncommon niche firearm. It seems odd for the ATF to single them out. If the issue ends up simply being that the LOP is over their arbitrary limit then all Q has to do is shorten the brace slightly and they're good to go. Need precedence to build a broader case on later.
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:36:41 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Basically they can do whatever they want and are not subject to any oversight.  There is oversight, the House is too busy with peach mint to care. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:36:53 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And if an ATF agent or 10 are shot in the face, there will be weeping and wailing, here, for those brave LEOs. Mourning for their poor family. Calls for the shooter to be dismembered and burnt alive. In our system of jurisprudence, we settle these debates in court, not by homicide. You know, civilization and shit..... |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:36:59 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do you own one? Please measure the length of pull for us Nah, too poor. I was referring to a potential generic arm brace ban. |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:37:06 PM EDT
[#47]
dear ATF
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:37:33 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is oversight, the House is too busy with peach mint to care. The House? Is Trey Gowdy going to yap them to death? 
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:38:05 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/73787/IMG_0954_JPG-1623108.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/73787/IMG_9119_JPG-1623109.JPG I think at this point a solid argument can be made that SBR and SBS laws are stupid and pointless. Pistol braces and "firearms" that are 14" barreled shotguns have been around and very popular for about eight years now and there has not been any adverse effects through their use in regards to violent crime. The NFA is a tax scheme and a violation of the 2nd. Stamps are a poll tax, completely unconstitutional... |
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Posted: 10/6/2020 4:38:11 PM EDT
[#50]
Capricious regulation results in capricious compliance.
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