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User Panel
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 4:47:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: boboluv]
[#1]
in the concealed weapon class they play a video where a woman finds a man in her room. she pulls a revolver from her drawer, points it at him and tells him to get out. he advances slowly but in an appealing manner assuring her that he won't hurt her and she isn't in any danger. he keeps saying, "i haven't done anything" as he slowly moves toward her. he then grabs the gun and reveals that he is a satanist and will kill her.
when asked the question, "when was it okay for her to shoot", the instructor replied, "when he advanced after she pointed the gun and said to get out." it was the forward motion that crossed the line. my understanding from this training is that once the old man brandished the pistol and stated to back off and do not get within 3 feet of me or i will kill you, if orange shirt said "i'm going to kill you", picked up a board and moved toward the old man, then it was lawful for the old man to fire reasonably in self defense. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:18:39 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 3rdpig:
It's amazing to me how different some of us here see the exact same event. It's also surprising how some just invent things that aren't in the video, or are in the video but are the exact opposite of their invention, or hasn't been reported on at all. The most egregious of these are "fatties came with the intent" and "fatty Dad came out with gun in hand". And there are others as well. Seriously, if you're saying this stuff you need to stop and listen carefully. You don't really know these things, you made them up. While you may believe it's true, you had to make it up first. And that's a mental illness right there. If I were you I'd stop doing this because it's only going to cause you serious grief in life. And that's my PSA for the day. Now I'll crack a beer and enjoy the stupidity.  |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:22:04 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Doom85:
http://i.4cdn.org/k/1537487940814.png |
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:22:37 AM EDT
[#4]
"Go get me a baseball bat/deadly weapon so these guys (who will then be forced to shoot me) will be found to have acted in self-defense."
Orange's brain was plainly malfunctioning on many levels. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:27:37 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By toastandjam:
Dead guy should have taken his anger out on the mattress and then it would have fit Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By toastandjam:
Originally Posted By Pike:
"...trying to impose his own will with the garbage situation..." 
It's the city's rules for use of a shared can. Retard with the cell phone said: "If it's not in the can they won't take it!". No shit lady, a mattress/box spring is bulky trash and has separate handling rules. Any moron would understand if you can't close the lid, vermin get in the garbage and spread garbage all over the place. Any moron would understand an entire mattress IN the can uses up pretty much all the space even if closing the lid weren't important (which it is). I'm surprised Abilene requires sane (even if fat) people to share a single trash can with neighbors (especially when those neighbors are both profoundly stupid and insane). |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:40:22 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CAsoldier:
Who’s the idiot that went inside to get a fucking baseball bat? Did he actually think that was going to help? |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:41:28 AM EDT
[#7]
Both were wrong, dead guy was more wrong though...
I wouldn't be upset if they walked, i don't expect them to though. You can't instigate a situation and then expect to be able to claim self defense. They should have walked away. Randy fron trailer park boys should not have said "suck my dick" They should not have dared him to come at them. They should have said "if you come any closer i'll shoot" because "i'll kill you" implies that instead of "stopping" him, your goal is to end his life. These are the reasons they are both in deep shit... |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:45:06 AM EDT
[#8]
This was real?
I thought it was a joke clickbailt story when I saw it scroll by in my FB feed.
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Posted: 9/21/2018 5:52:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: waterglass]
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By netofficer3710:
Both were wrong, dead guy was more wrong though... I wouldn't be upset if they walked, i don't expect them to though. Me neither, Prosecutors will probably want them as a notch in their belts to look good for when they seek higher office. You can't instigate a situation and then expect to be able to claim self defense. You don't know that they instigated anything. Dead guy has a loooong history of unprovoked violence. They should have walked away. Randy fron trailer park boys should not have said "suck my dick" They were waitin for the police in a public area. The right to Self defense doesn't require lessons in rhetoric. They should not have dared him to come at them. They should have said "if you come any closer i'll shoot" because "i'll kill you" implies that instead of "stopping" him, your goal is to end his life. Shooting someone in the head with a 12 gauge generally ends in death. If you shoot someone what other intent could you possibly be entertaining? These are the reasons they are both in deep shit... |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:05:43 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By waterglass: I'm just stating that those are the arguments that are going to be used against them in court. You have to be careful what you say in the moment because it will be warped when it is recited back to the jury. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:09:59 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By netofficer3710:
I don't disagree with your opinions on the subject. I'm just stating that those are the arguments that are going to be used against them in court. You have to be careful what you say in the moment because it will be warped when it is recited back to the jury. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By netofficer3710:
Originally Posted By waterglass: I'm just stating that those are the arguments that are going to be used against them in court. You have to be careful what you say in the moment because it will be warped when it is recited back to the jury. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:11:12 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AzAgLover: Being lawfully armed when someone threatens to kill you is. He's just daring them to shoot him, while MillerSr is daring him to throw a punch, and MillerJr is trying to goad him into it. I'll git ma BB gun and kill ya both. You come within 3' and I'll kill ya. Oh, yeah? Well, I'm at 3', you gonna kill me now? Not sure he's guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but Miller Jr is guilty by a preponderance of the evidence. OTOH, if the Millers were wearing badges, they could escalate much harder than the Millers did, magdump on him, and get commendations for it. What's unclear to me is where the stick/board/bat came from, and what Howard did with it. Were there other men there on Howard's side making it not 2 on 1 and they handed it to him, did Howard pick it up off the ground, did girlfriend/fiance with the camera give it to him, did Howard's kid give it to him? |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:18:02 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Taxmantoo:
That was my first reaction, but in watching it again I don't think the threats were credible. He's just daring them to shoot him, while MillerSr is daring him to throw a punch, and MillerJr is trying to goad him into it. I'll git ma BB gun and kill ya both. You come within 3' and I'll kill ya. Oh, yeah? Well, I'm at 3', you gonna kill me now? Not sure he's guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but Miller Jr is guilty by a preponderance of the evidence. OTOH, if the Millers were wearing badges, they could escalate much harder than the Millers did, magdump on him, and get commendations for it. What's unclear to me is where the stick/board/bat came from, and what Howard did with it. Were there other men there on Howard's side making it not 2 on 1 and they handed it to him, did Howard pick it up off the ground, did girlfriend/fiance with the camera give it to him, did Howard's kid give it to him? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Taxmantoo:
Originally Posted By AzAgLover: Being lawfully armed when someone threatens to kill you is. He's just daring them to shoot him, while MillerSr is daring him to throw a punch, and MillerJr is trying to goad him into it. I'll git ma BB gun and kill ya both. You come within 3' and I'll kill ya. Oh, yeah? Well, I'm at 3', you gonna kill me now? Not sure he's guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but Miller Jr is guilty by a preponderance of the evidence. OTOH, if the Millers were wearing badges, they could escalate much harder than the Millers did, magdump on him, and get commendations for it. What's unclear to me is where the stick/board/bat came from, and what Howard did with it. Were there other men there on Howard's side making it not 2 on 1 and they handed it to him, did Howard pick it up off the ground, did girlfriend/fiance with the camera give it to him, did Howard's kid give it to him? Keep in mind they were waiting for the police in a public area, and Orange shirt could have set down quietly to wait instead of taking a baseball bat from his brother in order to attack the shirtless duo. |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:22:44 AM EDT
[#14]
It’s strange how these guys always get killed just when they were turning their lives around.
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:23:57 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By waterglass:
His brother brought him the bat from the house and orange shirt threw it at and hit the elder Miller. Seems elder miller might have shot just as he was throwing it. Keep in mind they were waiting for the police in a public area, and Orange shirt could have set down quietly to wait instead of taking a baseball bat from his brother in order to attack the shirtless duo. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By waterglass:
Originally Posted By Taxmantoo:
Originally Posted By AzAgLover: Being lawfully armed when someone threatens to kill you is. He's just daring them to shoot him, while MillerSr is daring him to throw a punch, and MillerJr is trying to goad him into it. I'll git ma BB gun and kill ya both. You come within 3' and I'll kill ya. Oh, yeah? Well, I'm at 3', you gonna kill me now? Not sure he's guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but Miller Jr is guilty by a preponderance of the evidence. OTOH, if the Millers were wearing badges, they could escalate much harder than the Millers did, magdump on him, and get commendations for it. What's unclear to me is where the stick/board/bat came from, and what Howard did with it. Were there other men there on Howard's side making it not 2 on 1 and they handed it to him, did Howard pick it up off the ground, did girlfriend/fiance with the camera give it to him, did Howard's kid give it to him? Keep in mind they were waiting for the police in a public area, and Orange shirt could have set down quietly to wait instead of taking a baseball bat from his brother in order to attack the shirtless duo. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:30:44 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By perfectsilence:
Intermittent explosive disorder? I have never heard of that, but it sounds like a clinical term for being a jackass whose mouth writes checks his ass can't cash. Exhibit A. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By perfectsilence:
Originally Posted By MaxxII: Dead guy had mental health issues. I've never heard of Intermittent Explosive Disorder, but I'd bet money he's got multiple assault priors in his criminal history based solely on his response to the two armed tele-chubbies. Wife admitted he was armed with a baseball bat and threw at them after threatening them with death. I seriously doubt they are getting convicted of murder. I could easily see them getting off completely. Exhibit A. It fits that the acronym is IED. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:31:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: IceStationZebra]
[#17]
The dynamic duo will likely be found guilty for good reason. Stand your ground does not apply, or is significantly limited, by mutual combat.
If the dynamic duo had backed up and shut up and hadn’t told him to take his swing they would largely be okay when the guy produced the bat. I’m 100% pro gun and pro stand your ground but when being video taped and seeming to egg the guy on when they could have walked away a few feet and waited for police, that was the tipping point for me. I live in a stand your ground place and I can tell you that I will move heaven and earth to avoid shooting someone to avoid the court costs, arrests, lawyers, depositions and everything else. Plus shooting and killing someone isn’t the arfcom wet dream many here think it is. Even when justified, I think there’s a part which will haunt you forever. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:37:34 AM EDT
[#18]
Looks like this thread is a dupe
https://www.ar15.com/forums/General/Abilene-Tx-alleyway-shooting-over-trash/5-2148185/ |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:39:31 AM EDT
[#19]
WTF did I just watch!!??
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:39:44 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AmericanPeople:
Looks like this thread is a dupe https://www.ar15.com/forums/General/Abilene-Tx-alleyway-shooting-over-trash/5-2148185/ We can keep the other thread going as a backup for when this one gets locked. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:42:12 AM EDT
[#21]
Mr. Orange Shirt is heavily medicated apparently
https://www.facebook.com/kristopher.robinson2/posts/2098646950159761?__tn__=K-R 
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:43:02 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By IceStationZebra:
The dynamic duo will likely be found guilty for good reason. Stand your ground does not apply, or is significantly limited, by mutual combat. If the dynamic duo had backed up and shut up and hadn't told him to take his swing they would largely be okay when the guy produced the bat. I'm 100% pro gun and pro stand your ground but when being video taped and seeming to egg the guy on when they could have walked away a few feet and waited for police, that was the tipping point for me. I live in a stand your ground place and I can tell you that I will move heaven and earth to avoid shooting someone to avoid the court costs, arrests, lawyers, depositions and everything else. Plus shooting and killing someone isn't the arfcom wet dream many here think it is. Even when justified, I think there's a part which will haunt you forever. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:45:08 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By toastandjam:
Based on his previous history, that would never happen. Just ask the mailman. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By toastandjam:
Originally Posted By waterglass:
Originally Posted By Taxmantoo:
Originally Posted By AzAgLover: Being lawfully armed when someone threatens to kill you is. He's just daring them to shoot him, while MillerSr is daring him to throw a punch, and MillerJr is trying to goad him into it. I'll git ma BB gun and kill ya both. You come within 3' and I'll kill ya. Oh, yeah? Well, I'm at 3', you gonna kill me now? Not sure he's guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but Miller Jr is guilty by a preponderance of the evidence. OTOH, if the Millers were wearing badges, they could escalate much harder than the Millers did, magdump on him, and get commendations for it. What's unclear to me is where the stick/board/bat came from, and what Howard did with it. Were there other men there on Howard's side making it not 2 on 1 and they handed it to him, did Howard pick it up off the ground, did girlfriend/fiance with the camera give it to him, did Howard's kid give it to him? Keep in mind they were waiting for the police in a public area, and Orange shirt could have set down quietly to wait instead of taking a baseball bat from his brother in order to attack the shirtless duo. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:46:49 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RDak:
WTF did I just watch!!?? They have now been indicted. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:50:53 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Miami_JBT:
Mr. Orange Shirt is heavily medicated apparently https://www.facebook.com/kristopher.robinson2/posts/2098646950159761?__tn__=K-R https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236039/1-677685.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236039/2-677683.JPG |
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:53:41 AM EDT
[#26]
Orange shirt guy is one of the biggest imbeciles I've ever seen on an internet video. That having been said, the father son non-dynamic fat duo are going to be convicted of murder. You can't brandish a firearm for 3+ minutes to try and gain leverage in your argument over a mattress and then shoot a guy because he's not accepting your version of the argument while standing in a public alley. All parties should have walked back to their respective properties which were mere feet away and called the police over the mattress dumping.
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:55:07 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 6winchester2:
You just watched a piece of evidence that has caused the local DA to charge both shooters with murder. They have now been indicted. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 6winchester2:
Originally Posted By RDak:
WTF did I just watch!!?? They have now been indicted. KTXS reached out to Taylor County District Attorney Jim Hicks for a comment. He had not yet seen the video and asked us to send him a copy. "Video evidence like this is always graphic and very difficult to watch. But, it is consistent with the charges," Hicks said. |
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 6:57:34 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RDak:
Did the big guy put a mattress where the two short guys said he can't put it??? |
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:00:02 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 79CJ7:
Ironically, it seems dead guy was right about the mattress. You're not supposed to put it on the ground for trash pickup, but you are supposed to put it in the dumpster, which he did. Then the two fatasses took it out of the dumpster and threw it onto orange shirt guys property. He was in the process of putting it back in the dumpster when the other two inbreds showed up with guns. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 79CJ7:
Originally Posted By RDak:
Did the big guy put a mattress where the two short guys said he can't put it??? |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:05:29 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CAsoldier:
Who’s the idiot that went inside to get a fucking baseball bat? Did he actually think that was going to help? |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:05:53 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kiran04:
The two guys with guns may have been total and utter morons, but they weren't the ones who escalated the situation. The guns were out already. Everyone knew the score, but captain A-hole in the bright orange shirt just couldn't control himself. The other guy repeated, "Back off" over and over again, even while captain A-hole threatened to kill him multiple times. It wasn't until captain A-hole went for a weapon of his own and came at the gunmen that he got turned into swiss cheese. What a stupid, stupid, stupid move. That was more like suicide by red neck. And his dumbass wife. "You're not gonna kill my husband." Uhm... yeah... |
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:08:29 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By toastandjam: Did the dumpster lid close all the way with the mattress in it? |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:08:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6gunfighter2]
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Baldmonk:
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Baldmonk:
Originally Posted By Kiran04:
The two guys with guns may have been total and utter morons, but they weren't the ones who escalated the situation. The guns were out already. Everyone knew the score, but captain A-hole in the bright orange shirt just couldn't control himself. The other guy repeated, "Back off" over and over again, even while captain A-hole threatened to kill him multiple times. It wasn't until captain A-hole went for a weapon of his own and came at the gunmen that he got turned into swiss cheese. What a stupid, stupid, stupid move. That was more like suicide by red neck. And his dumbass wife. "You're not gonna kill my husband." Uhm... yeah... There is a great deal of extant case law on this. Point here being: if you carry a gun for self defense (and I hope you do), you better make damn sure you understand what you can and cannot do in situations like this. Verbal taunts are NEVER a good idea, no matter how "in the right" you are otherwise. They are most especially not a good idea when someone happens to be making video of the entire situation. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:13:33 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 79CJ7:
Ironically, it seems dead guy was right about the mattress. You're not supposed to put it on the ground for trash pickup, but you are supposed to put it in the dumpster, which he did. Then the two fatasses took it out of the dumpster and threw it onto orange shirt guys property. He was in the process of putting it back in the dumpster when the other two inbreds showed up with guns. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 79CJ7:
Originally Posted By RDak:
Did the big guy put a mattress where the two short guys said he can't put it??? 
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:14:48 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Baldmonk:
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Baldmonk:
Originally Posted By Kiran04:
The two guys with guns may have been total and utter morons, but they weren't the ones who escalated the situation. The guns were out already. Everyone knew the score, but captain A-hole in the bright orange shirt just couldn't control himself. The other guy repeated, "Back off" over and over again, even while captain A-hole threatened to kill him multiple times. It wasn't until captain A-hole went for a weapon of his own and came at the gunmen that he got turned into swiss cheese. What a stupid, stupid, stupid move. That was more like suicide by red neck. And his dumbass wife. "You're not gonna kill my husband." Uhm... yeah... |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:15:18 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CoyoteGray: They didn't shoot him over a trash can. They shot him after he threatened their lives, told them he was going to kill them, and then attempted to follow through on his threat. Makes me sad. Feels Bad Man. |
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:15:48 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RDak:
Jesus Christ!!! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RDak:
Originally Posted By 79CJ7:
Originally Posted By RDak:
Did the big guy put a mattress where the two short guys said he can't put it??? Google City of Abilene solid waste. Ignorance at Tsar Bomba levels. 
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:16:16 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Pike:
Total bullshit. Google City of Abilene solid waste. Ignorance at Tsar Bomba levels. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Pike:
Originally Posted By RDak:
Originally Posted By 79CJ7:
Originally Posted By RDak:
Did the big guy put a mattress where the two short guys said he can't put it??? Google City of Abilene solid waste. Ignorance at Tsar Bomba levels. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:16:49 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RR_Broccoli:
This place is infested with liberal-thinkers that can't separate causality, intent, and facts from feelings. Goddamn media consumption and public schooling. Makes me sad. Feels Bad Man. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RR_Broccoli:
Originally Posted By CoyoteGray: They didn't shoot him over a trash can. They shot him after he threatened their lives, told them he was going to kill them, and then attempted to follow through on his threat. Makes me sad. Feels Bad Man. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:19:02 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pcsutton:
The father seemed within his rights to use deadly force to defend himself...but junior may be fucked for escalating the conflict by grabbing his crotch and arguing with the aggressor. I've never heard of beating a shooting on the grounds of self defense after you contributed to escalating the situation. My money is on the father being 'no billed' and junior going away for 2nd degree murder. 99% of the time...it's a lot easier to just walk away. |
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:20:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Pike]
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RDak:
Why did they go out there with a gun in the first place? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RDak:
Originally Posted By Baldmonk:
Originally Posted By Kiran04:
The two guys with guns may have been total and utter morons, but they weren't the ones who escalated the situation. The guns were out already. Everyone knew the score, but captain A-hole in the bright orange shirt just couldn't control himself. The other guy repeated, "Back off" over and over again, even while captain A-hole threatened to kill him multiple times. It wasn't until captain A-hole went for a weapon of his own and came at the gunmen that he got turned into swiss cheese. What a stupid, stupid, stupid move. That was more like suicide by red neck. And his dumbass wife. "You're not gonna kill my husband." Uhm... yeah... Deceased was batshit nuts, huge and violent and kept trying to fill up a SHARED trashcan with a fucking mattress and THEN threatened to take the 60 something father's gun away and shoot him through the head, Mr. Orange having previously asked for, and received a baseball bat to accomplish Mr. Orange's goal. |
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:21:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Pike]
[#42]
Gateway
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:21:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: RDak]
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ProudVeteran:
I agree with this. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ProudVeteran:
Originally Posted By pcsutton:
The father seemed within his rights to use deadly force to defend himself...but junior may be fucked for escalating the conflict by grabbing his crotch and arguing with the aggressor. I've never heard of beating a shooting on the grounds of self defense after you contributed to escalating the situation. My money is on the father being 'no billed' and junior going away for 2nd degree murder. 99% of the time...it's a lot easier to just walk away. If it was me and I went out there with a gun...….once I saw it was my neighbor I would say "oh sorry, didn't know it was you". |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:22:54 AM EDT
[#44]
I almost always have a gun with me. Often...but not close to 100%...two guns.
Occasionally three guns. Having a gun is not intent. All are for defensive purposes.....or target shooting when I have the shotgun. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:25:15 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By boboluv:
in the concealed weapon class they play a video where a woman finds a man in her room. she pulls a revolver from her drawer, points it at him and tells him to get out. he advances slowly but in an appealing manner assuring her that he won't hurt her and she isn't in any danger. he keeps saying, "i haven't done anything" as he slowly moves toward her. he then grabs the gun and reveals that he is a satanist and will kill her. when asked the question, "when was it okay for her to shoot", the instructor replied, "when he advanced after she pointed the gun and said to get out." it was the forward motion that crossed the line. my understanding from this training is that once the old man brandished the pistol and stated to back off and do not get within 3 feet of me or i will kill you, if orange shirt said "i'm going to kill you", picked up a board and moved toward the old man, then it was lawful for the old man to fire reasonably in self defense. In your house is "imminent threat" territory and it's good shoot. Been tested too, one case a guy got it with a shotgun from a second floor balcony (this did not make the news much, guy was a dirtbag nobody missed.) Another some young idiot hiding from the cops busting an underage drinking party on a screened in porch nearby. No "Get out of my house" conversation necessary. They might have been conservative about the shoot / no shoot scenarios in class. You should read your state laws yourself if you haven't. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:26:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: RDak]
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AmericanPeople:
I almost always have a gun with me. Often...but not close to 100%...two guns. Occasionally three guns. Having a gun is not intent. All are for defensive purposes.....or target shooting when I have the shotgun. They felt threatened by where the guy was going to put the mattress but were on his trash area? When you realized it was about where to put the trash that would make it initially a non self defense situation......right? |
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USA
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:28:09 AM EDT
[#47]
Read all the facts about this case before you judge folks because they have a gut and are shaped like a pear.
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:28:57 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Pike:
Read all the facts about this case before you judge folks because they have a gut and are shaped like a pear. Has NOTHING to do with how they looked. |
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:31:43 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 79CJ7:
Orange shirt guy is one of the biggest imbeciles I've ever seen on an internet video. That having been said, the father son non-dynamic fat duo are going to be convicted of murder. You can't brandish a firearm for 3+ minutes to try and gain leverage in your argument over a mattress and then shoot a guy because he's not accepting your version of the argument while standing in a public alley. All parties should have walked back to their respective properties which were mere feet away and called the police over the mattress dumping. 
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Posted: 9/21/2018 7:34:56 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 79CJ7:
Orange shirt guy is one of the biggest imbeciles I've ever seen on an internet video. That having been said, the father son non-dynamic fat duo are going to be convicted of murder. You can't brandish a firearm for 3+ minutes to try and gain leverage in your argument over a mattress and then shoot a guy because he's not accepting your version of the argument while standing in a public alley. All parties should have walked back to their respective properties which were mere feet away and called the police over the mattress dumping. Stay out of the rest of the country. Having a firearm out in response to a threat is not "brandishing." All parties should have walked away, however one was out of control raging so turning your back on him probably meant getting attacked. The neighbors likely KNEW this guy was like this already. And, likely they also knew he would spend a bunch of time fucking with them later as well. Some of you guys need to look up the definition of some words. Start with "brandishing". If your loved ones have mental illness, get them into institutions. The rest of us do not deserve to be subjected to their bullshit. Take them out of society if they can't handle it, or society may solve the problem in other ways. |
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