Indoor range shoes (Page 3 of 3)
You Must Be Logged In To Vote
Member
Joined:
Apr 2023
Posts:
4008
EE: 0% (0)
TX, USA
|
Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung: Most of the research is aimed at kids because developing brains are especially vulnerable. All the literature I can find for adults assumes it's from workplace exposure so OSHA (and state equivalents) require high risk employees to be tested regularly. States have different guidelines but most require employees be removed from the workplace above 10-15 µg/dL until their levels come down, and chelation therapy above 50 or 60. I average 3 matches a week, don't reload, rarely pick up brass and wear gloves when I do. I use D-lead wipes after shooting outdoors, immediately wash my hands after shooting indoors, change and wash my clothes, and shower when I get home after shooting. My BLL has varied between 8 and 16 over the last 3 years (despite all my precautions) so I can't say I am an expert on what works to get it down but reducing exposure as much as possible is common sense. I've stopped doing indoor matches and basically only use an indoor range to test and zero now. An instructor I know, says he can tell when he gets over 20. Symptoms include: High blood pressure, Joint and muscle pain, Difficulties with memory or concentration, Headache, Abdominal pain, Mood disorders, etc. Most doctors don't have a clue how to deal with it. Mine showed some mild concern but then joked about it later. A Navy doctor of an acquaintance on Active Duty freaked out at his test results and his numbers were at the bottom of my range. Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung: Originally Posted By AttachedFile: Link to reading material on lead levels for people that shoot regularly? Are we talking people that test firearms at the factory, people that shoot competitions, regular arfcomers that fire one mag a year while sitting in their rascal scooter? Most of the research is aimed at kids because developing brains are especially vulnerable. All the literature I can find for adults assumes it's from workplace exposure so OSHA (and state equivalents) require high risk employees to be tested regularly. States have different guidelines but most require employees be removed from the workplace above 10-15 µg/dL until their levels come down, and chelation therapy above 50 or 60. I average 3 matches a week, don't reload, rarely pick up brass and wear gloves when I do. I use D-lead wipes after shooting outdoors, immediately wash my hands after shooting indoors, change and wash my clothes, and shower when I get home after shooting. My BLL has varied between 8 and 16 over the last 3 years (despite all my precautions) so I can't say I am an expert on what works to get it down but reducing exposure as much as possible is common sense. I've stopped doing indoor matches and basically only use an indoor range to test and zero now. An instructor I know, says he can tell when he gets over 20. Symptoms include: High blood pressure, Joint and muscle pain, Difficulties with memory or concentration, Headache, Abdominal pain, Mood disorders, etc. Most doctors don't have a clue how to deal with it. Mine showed some mild concern but then joked about it later. A Navy doctor of an acquaintance on Active Duty freaked out at his test results and his numbers were at the bottom of my range. To add some context to the bolded, though, you’re barely cresting the level of the average adult walking around when we still used leaded gasoline. Your lead exposure is so severe, you’re reaching levels almost as high as a 1975 accountant who sat in some traffic on his way to the office. Not saying it’s “good” for you… but that’s what you’ve achieved with three matches a week, consistently for years. You’re almost as high as a non-shooter from 50 years ago. |
|
Originally Posted By VeryAverage: To add some context to the bolded, though, you’re barely cresting the level of the average adult walking around when we still used leaded gasoline. Your lead exposure is so severe, you’re reaching levels almost as high as a 1975 accountant who sat in some traffic on his way to the office. Not saying it’s “good” for you… but that’s what you’ve achieved with three matches a week, consistently for years. You’re almost as high as a non-shooter from 50 years ago. You're absolutely right. The Washington Post did an article recently saying all the Gen Xers are going to have dementia from breathing in leaded gas exhaust. The BLL numbers back then were high for everyone. The article was all conjecture with virtually no cited science to back it up. The medical community doesn't know what level induces damage in adults over the long term. They just say it serves no positive function in the body and it does cause damage (especially in children) so they keep reducing the number that's considered "normal." I still am going to do everything I can to reduce exposure...within reason. I am not going to stop shooting, nor wear a respirator. Keeping an old pair of shoes to throw on while shooting may not make a huge difference but it is pretty easy. The less exposure the better. BTW, it's not just indoor ranges. My brother works at an outdoor range full time and his numbers are a tad higher than mine--as are most of the staff. I also know competition shooters that never shoot indoors but practice a lot, who also have similar levels. |
|
Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung: How many of you experts actually shoot and get your Blood Lead Level tested? From the majority of replies, I am guessing not many. It is an issue for those that do shoot regularly. Lead levels are cumulative. Any way to reduce that exposure helps. My agency had the instructors get an annual hearing test and blood work. In the old days the smoke would hang over the firing line at the old multi agency range if it was a still day with no breezes. I've shot at their new range a couple of times for my LEOSA qual and I suspect that theres no longer an issue with air movement |
*post contains personal opinion only and should not be considered information released in an official capacity*
0110001101101100011010010110001101101011
0110001101101100011010010110001101101011
Member
Joined:
Apr 2023
Posts:
4010
EE: 0% (0)
TX, USA
|
Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung: You're absolutely right. The Washington Post did an article recently saying all the Gen Xers are going to have dementia from breathing in leaded gas exhaust. The BLL numbers back then were high for everyone. The article was all conjecture with virtually no cited science to back it up. The medical community doesn't know what level induces damage in adults over the long term. They just say it serves no positive function in the body and it does cause damage (especially in children) so they keep reducing the number that's considered "normal." I still am going to do everything I can to reduce exposure...within reason. I am not going to stop shooting, nor wear a respirator. Keeping an old pair of shoes to throw on while shooting may not make a huge difference but it is pretty easy. The less exposure the better. BTW, it's not just indoor ranges. My brother works at an outdoor range full time and his numbers are a tad higher than mine--as are most of the staff. I also know competition shooters that never shoot indoors but practice a lot, who also have similar levels. Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung: Originally Posted By VeryAverage: To add some context to the bolded, though, you’re barely cresting the level of the average adult walking around when we still used leaded gasoline. Your lead exposure is so severe, you’re reaching levels almost as high as a 1975 accountant who sat in some traffic on his way to the office. Not saying it’s “good” for you… but that’s what you’ve achieved with three matches a week, consistently for years. You’re almost as high as a non-shooter from 50 years ago. You're absolutely right. The Washington Post did an article recently saying all the Gen Xers are going to have dementia from breathing in leaded gas exhaust. The BLL numbers back then were high for everyone. The article was all conjecture with virtually no cited science to back it up. The medical community doesn't know what level induces damage in adults over the long term. They just say it serves no positive function in the body and it does cause damage (especially in children) so they keep reducing the number that's considered "normal." I still am going to do everything I can to reduce exposure...within reason. I am not going to stop shooting, nor wear a respirator. Keeping an old pair of shoes to throw on while shooting may not make a huge difference but it is pretty easy. The less exposure the better. BTW, it's not just indoor ranges. My brother works at an outdoor range full time and his numbers are a tad higher than mine--as are most of the staff. I also know competition shooters that never shoot indoors but practice a lot, who also have similar levels. Doesn’t hurt to be cautious, but I think it’s just a matter of determining what’s reasonable and if that effort isn’t better applied elsewhere. Someone consistently competition shooting, or around a lot of rifle fire at close range, reloading on a very regular basis, smelting lead often, etc. to the point it approaches “this is my job” levels of time commitment… doesn’t hurt to be a little more diligent in hand washing or changing clothes if it was a particularly intense day at the range. I think the danger to third-parties is pretty minimal. As we established, that average lead level from the 1970s was what adults had accumulated largely from atmospheric exposure- so basically incessant exposure. Stands to reason children would have similar exposure, just not the cumulative time. Carrying on with that thought, either everyone born from… 1940-1980? is hopelessly deficient from childhood lead exposure, or some occasional, incidental, non-atmospheric-vapor encounters to a child today are simply not going to even come close to the same ballpark as what children were breathing in normal air 50 years ago. Avoid it? Sure. But I’d argue the sugar in the ketchup is probably a more consistent and dangerous exposure for most people, including most shooters, unless their training regimen is particularly aggressive like yours is. Even then, I think the risk to a third party, due to the contaminated clothing not being the actual vaporized lead of live fire… it’s got to be just tiny to the point of being difficult to measure. As you said, there isn’t good science on this other than “no useful function”. We know how high was “normal” in the past, though, and we know the primary means lead enters the bloodstream. I don’t know the “answer”, either as far as an exact number and an exact duration of time. I suspect nobody does. I’ll continue washing my hands like a normal person practicing good hygiene, I’ll continue washing my clothes if they get dirty, and I’ll generally choose TMJ bullets if it’s a reasonable option (usually cheaper than FMJ anyway). I’ll also discourage a typical hobbyist from having too many sleepless nights or jumping through too many inconvenient hoops to avoid lead exposure that was never going to be a realistic concern for hobbyist levels of time/quantity. Long reply, but it’s a nuanced topic. |