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OFFICIAL Russo-Ukrainian War (Page 3794 of 5592)
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Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:35:34 AM EDT
[#1]
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Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:


Can read the report in the tweet.
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I'm really hoping I have some time this weekend to sit down and read through the material that's come out but, probably not until next weekend.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:38:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Saltwater-Hillbilly] [#2]
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Originally Posted By Capta:

Russia’s biggest mistake here (outside of their initial decision to invade of course) was backing Europe into a corner where they were forced to call any raise.  Once Europe shook off their disbelief and inertia, they understood they were the ultimate target of this war.  Then Putin played his energy card and directly attacked the economy of Europe.  As the Euros saw it, it was already an existential war with everything short of missiles flying.
The US could walk away from this and survive, but Europe can’t.  Putin left Europe no option but to go all-in.  The best he has been able to do is to deter supply through nuclear threats, but even that is questionable, and the other interpretation is that the west is grinding Russia to powder using Ukraine.
Neither Putin nor Europe can back down and survive.  The only option is for Russia to save itself and deal with Putin.
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Originally Posted By Capta:
Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly:
Originally Posted By Capta:
Originally Posted By Freiheit8472:
Originally Posted By HIPPO:

Just saw video of him being led into Lefortovo in Moscow.


Well Russia, If you want to ensure the west doesn’t get tired of helping Ukraine- this is how you ensure the west doesn’t get tired of helping Ukraine.

There are still a few in the west (meaning besides the actual quislings) who think Russia can be dealt with reasonably and there can be a return to status quo ante.
That may have been true early on (say before April-May 2022 or so) but I think this is out of our hands now.  Russia is in a death spiral entirely of their own making and there’s nothing anyone outside of Russia can do to change that.


Pretty Much.  The flaw with the Russian "Escalate to Deescalate" is that it requires the enemy/opponent to actively try to defuse the situation.  Absent a major diplomatic effort to pressure the Ukrainians, the Russians are caught in a spiraling series of escalation with no off-ramp absent a serious and acceptable proposal to end the fighting on their part.  I do not see a clean ending to this for Russia.

Russia’s biggest mistake here (outside of their initial decision to invade of course) was backing Europe into a corner where they were forced to call any raise.  Once Europe shook off their disbelief and inertia, they understood they were the ultimate target of this war.  Then Putin played his energy card and directly attacked the economy of Europe.  As the Euros saw it, it was already an existential war with everything short of missiles flying.
The US could walk away from this and survive, but Europe can’t.  Putin left Europe no option but to go all-in.  The best he has been able to do is to deter supply through nuclear threats, but even that is questionable, and the other interpretation is that the west is grinding Russia to powder using Ukraine.
Neither Putin nor Europe can back down and survive.  The only option is for Russia to save itself and deal with Putin.


It goes back to the part of the Russian psyche in which "Respect=Fear".  The Russians have a need for other peoples people to submit out of fear.  Putin thought that he could leverage European greed + fear to enlarge "Russiaworld", and many Russians (not just Putin) were annoyed that the West didn't "respect" (fear) Russia enough.  Unfortunately for Russia, the Western reaction to their newfound "respect" for Russia has been to start handing out baseball bats (diplomatic, economic and military) to anyone who wants to take a shot at what the West sees as a problem.  Cowering is a response to fear, popping mags and shooting until the threat is over is another response, and taking a flamethrower to the problem is something else that can alleviate fear.  Russia is in the position where they are the ones who have to initiate the de-escalation cycle with serious action against their own interests or face some form of national destruction.  When the West "fears", you get things like the absolute destruction of the Japanese Empire, enough nukes to obliterate the problem several times over, or major wars that ravage entire continents.  Putin played his cards well for many years.  I even had some sympathy for the Russian arguments prior to the invasion of Georgia, and was jealous that Russia had a leader who could at least say "national interest" without it looking like a comedic punchline (as is usually the case with Western politicians).  Putin played his cards well, bluffed like a champ, and would often walk away from the table with most of the pot despite not having the best cards.  In this case, he is sitting on a low pair and everyone with better cards is raising the pot.  I can't see any realistic scenario where this ends well for Russia, especially with all the new players getting in on the game.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:42:36 AM EDT
[#3]
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Originally Posted By Capta:

Neither Putin nor Europe can back down and survive.  The only option is for Russia to save itself and deal with Putin.
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That is likely what is going to happen. Putin is like the head of a mafia family who went rogue, threatening the established order and the survival of his people. The ICC marking him as a common war criminal is the signal that he is sanctioned for a hit by all the other members sitting at the table. Take him out, and you will receive applause from the Western world for delivering justice.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:48:20 AM EDT
[#4]
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:51:09 AM EDT
[#5]
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Originally Posted By HIPPO:
they have completely astro-turfed or buried stuff that came out and shed negative light on ruZZia and her psycho-boyars. Smoking gun. What’s not totally clear is if they started of or were later compromised and co-opted…
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Originally Posted By HIPPO:
Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:

Interesting. Can wikileaks really be an FSB asset, or are they just corrupt and stupidly biased like 99% of "media" in the USA? It seems that Assange and wiki existed to embarrass ONLY the US Military and foreign policy but why ignore obvious acts or terror and illegal aggression by Russia?
they have completely astro-turfed or buried stuff that came out and shed negative light on ruZZia and her psycho-boyars. Smoking gun. What’s not totally clear is if they started of or were later compromised and co-opted…


I think Wikileaks went over to the "dark side" when Western Governments (particularly our own three-letter agencies) started going after them in a big way after the Bradley Manning and Snowden affairs.  The whole "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" thing.  Of course, letting the FSB in on your operation tends to work as well as making deals with the Devil works for your spiritual health.  At this point, they are mostly- or wholly-compromised and everyone I am familiar with in certain circles just assumes anything released by Wikileaks has been, at the very least, vetted in some form by the Russian government before release.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:51:27 AM EDT
[#6]
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Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:

Which pipelines is Europe getting Russian gas? Not disputing you but I'm curious. I was told that Russia blew up their own pipeline...
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A pipeline is still feeding Europe that transits Ukraine, believe it or not. Russia is still paying Ukraine a transit fee.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:52:20 AM EDT
[#7]
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Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:

This is a little confusing for a novice like me. First we hear that Europe is still getting Russian oil (early in the war). Then we hear they stopped getting oil/gas and everyone is saying Europe will freeze to death. Then we hear they managed to store up enough oil/gas to survive the winter of 22/23. Then we hear it was an unusually mild winter but they will all freeze next year. Then we hear Nordsteam 2 got blown up but dont worry it wasnt pumping anything. Now we hear there are pipelines everywhere and gas/oil is flowing status quo. I'm waiting to hear news about how a Russian company got the contract to build nuke plants in Berlin...

All of these can and probably were true at one time or another but they cannot ALL be true and correct now. So WTF?
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Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:
Originally Posted By strykr:

I understand that is the plan, but it will still take time to completely wean themselves off using this energy. Once these pipelines were built, the receiving countries designed their whole delivery system around it. There are refineries in place that are not easy to move. Whole cities are hooked up to such pipes. Sure, Hamburg or Rotterdam can easily replace a pipeline, but cities in the former GDR, Romania, Slovakia? Not so easy to say.

Here's another gas pipeline to Poland and Germany. This was a pipeline Russia used to "punish" Poland and Bulgaria for not paying in Rubles by shutting off gas to them. However, they still send gas to Germany, and "As of 29 September 2022, eastward flow of gas from Germany to Poland through the Yamal Europe pipeline is stable". Not so easy for Poland to replace the infrastructure, even though they are trying, it is going to take some time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamal%E2%80%93Europe_pipeline


This is a little confusing for a novice like me. First we hear that Europe is still getting Russian oil (early in the war). Then we hear they stopped getting oil/gas and everyone is saying Europe will freeze to death. Then we hear they managed to store up enough oil/gas to survive the winter of 22/23. Then we hear it was an unusually mild winter but they will all freeze next year. Then we hear Nordsteam 2 got blown up but dont worry it wasnt pumping anything. Now we hear there are pipelines everywhere and gas/oil is flowing status quo. I'm waiting to hear news about how a Russian company got the contract to build nuke plants in Berlin...

All of these can and probably were true at one time or another but they cannot ALL be true and correct now. So WTF?


Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but here's the way I understood it.

The only NG Nordstream 2 carried was to test it for the certification process and keep it pressurized until certification was complete, but it didn't happen because of the invasion.

There are signed contracts between Russia and European countries that neither side can break without massive penalties, so Russian NG still flows through the pipelines. Whether the flow rate is reduced flow now I don't know, and hopefully someone who does know can jump in here.

Europe was going to have serious economic troubles IF their usage rate didn't change and it had been a cold winter even with extra LNG from Norway (?) and the US. They reduced their usage, had a very mild winter, and got a lot of LNG from the US. So much so, that other US LNG customers didn't get theirs on time because it went to Europe instead.

Again this is my understanding of how things happened and I could be wrong so someone please jump in here if I'm incorrect.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 10:59:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: stone-age] [#8]
Originally Posted By Freiheit8472:


Speaking of Russian expats, anyone been keeping tabs on that Constantine fellow?

Last I saw he had new years with his family in Tashkent. I don’t know if they were just visiting or made the move.

He works in the solar energy field and was reluctant to leave but did, more or less, at last call leaving his family behind.

With the curtain down and some horrific Orwellian internal KGB suppression kicking off-I hope they left. He seems like a genuine good guy. Has family in Maine.
View Quote




@Freiheit8472
Konstantine made it out of the country as the door was closing. He later brought his family with him. He is in one of the stans, Uzbekistan I think. He plans to use this country as a temporary place until he moves to his final destination. He is not willing at this point to reveal where that will be. He currently is surviving on his youtube income which is not good enough for a proper living, but is good enough to survive. I watch him very frequently. As he was going through the border to get out of russia, people in the same line as him were getting denied. He got lucky as it was normal for him to leave the country for business, so they let him through at that point.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 11:29:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: MFP_4073] [#9]
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Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly:


....  Georgia in 2008 should have been a wake up call to everyone, and it was to some extent for the US military (particularly the Army), but we were balls deep in Iraq, Afghanistan, and the rest of GWOT, and the rest of the USG effort tended to be of the "strongly worded letter" category. Looking back, we can see Georgia was where Russia was perfecting it's "hybrid war" techniques.
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you're correct.   many can recall Mitt Romney's comments on Russia during the 2012 Presidential race -- he was basically laughed off the stage for saying Russia was a major threat.   many were sleeping but Romney -- as much as we bash him as a RINO - was prescient.  of course as you say -- our 'sights' were zeroed on GWOT - GWOT - and more GWOT.   24/7 GWOT...

-------------------------------------------------

It’s time to admit it: Mitt Romney was right about Russia

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/22/politics/mitt-romney-russia-ukraine/index.html

Analysis by Chris Cillizza, CNN Editor-at-large    Updated 10:30 AM EST, Sun February 27, 2022

CNN  —

A decade ago, Mitt Romney went on CNN and made a statement that was widely perceived as a major mistake.

“Russia, this is, without question, our number one geopolitical foe,” Romney, who would be the Republican presidential nominee in the 2012 race against President Barack Obama, told Wolf Blitzer in March of that year. “They — they fight every cause for the world’s worst actors.”

Obama and his team pounced on the comment, insisting that it showed Romney was hopelessly out of touch when it came to the threats facing the US.

In the third presidential debate between the two candidates in October 2012, Obama went directly after Romney for that remark. “When you were asked, ‘What’s the biggest geopolitical threat facing America,’ you said ‘Russia.’ Not al Qaeda; you said Russia,” Obama said. “And, the 1980s are now calling to ask for their foreign policy back, because the Cold War’s been over for 20 years.”

The 80s called! Boom! Roasted!

At the time, the attack worked. Obama cast himself as the candidate who understood the current threats – led by al Qaeda. Romney was the candidate still stuck in the Cold War age, a black-and-white figure in a colorful – and complex – world.

But today, after Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered Russian troops into eastern Ukraine, Romney’s comments look very, very different. And by “different,” I mean “right,” as even some Democrats are now acknowledging.

“This action by Putin further confirms that Mitt Romney was right when he called Russia the number one geopolitical foe,” California Democratic Rep. Ted Lieu said on CNN Monday night.

Given that, it’s worth revisiting the context around what Romney said and why.

He was reacting to a hot-mic moment between Obama and then-Russian President Dmitry Medvedev earlier in 2012. In that exchange, Obama told Medvedev: “This is my last election. And after my election, I have more flexibility.”

Republicans were up in arms, insisting that Obama was taking a hard line with Russia publicly while, apparently, making clear to the country’s leader that he was open to compromise.

In his original interview, Blitzer was asking Romney about Russia in the context of that Obama hot-mic moment. And while his comment about Russia as America’s “number one geopolitical foe” is what drew the most attention and derision, it was far from the only comment Romney made about that subject in his interview with Blitzer.

“Russia is not a friendly character on the world stage,” Romney said at one point. “And for this President to be looking for greater flexibility, where he doesn’t have to answer to the American people in his relations with Russia, is very, very troubling, very alarming.”

Pressed by Blitzer on his assertion about the threat posed by Russia, Romney added this:

“Well, I’m saying in terms of a geopolitical opponent, the nation that lines up with the world’s worst actors. Of course, the greatest threat that the world faces is a nuclear Iran. A nuclear North Korea is already troubling enough.

“But when these – these terrible actors pursue their course in the world and we go to the United Nations looking for ways to stop them, when – when Assad, for instance, is murdering his own people, we go – we go to the United Nations, and who is it that always stands up for the world’s worst actors?

“It is always Russia, typically with China alongside.”

What looked like a major flub during the 2012 campaign – and was used as a political cudgel by Obama – now looks very, very different. It should serve as a reminder that history is not written in the moment – and that what something looks like in that moment is not a guarantee of what it will always look like.

---------------------------------------
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 11:34:12 AM EDT
[#10]
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Originally Posted By stone-age:





@Freiheit8472
Konstantine made it out of the country as the door was closing. He later brought his family with him. He is in one of the stans, Uzbekistan I think. He plans to use this country as a temporary place until he moves to his final destination. He is not willing at this point to reveal where that will be. He currently is surviving on his youtube income which is not good enough for a proper living, but is good enough to survive. I watch him very frequently. As he was going through the border to get out of russia, people in the same line as him were getting denied. He got lucky as it was normal for him to leave the country for business, so they let him through at that point.
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Originally Posted By stone-age:

Originally Posted By Freiheit8472:


Speaking of Russian expats, anyone been keeping tabs on that Constantine fellow?

Last I saw he had new years with his family in Tashkent. I don’t know if they were just visiting or made the move.

He works in the solar energy field and was reluctant to leave but did, more or less, at last call leaving his family behind.

With the curtain down and some horrific Orwellian internal KGB suppression kicking off-I hope they left. He seems like a genuine good guy. Has family in Maine.




@Freiheit8472
Konstantine made it out of the country as the door was closing. He later brought his family with him. He is in one of the stans, Uzbekistan I think. He plans to use this country as a temporary place until he moves to his final destination. He is not willing at this point to reveal where that will be. He currently is surviving on his youtube income which is not good enough for a proper living, but is good enough to survive. I watch him very frequently. As he was going through the border to get out of russia, people in the same line as him were getting denied. He got lucky as it was normal for him to leave the country for business, so they let him through at that point.


What is his YouTube channel?
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 11:42:28 AM EDT
[#11]
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Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
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That second one was the embodiment of "You can run but you'll only die tired."
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 11:44:04 AM EDT
[#12]
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Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:

Interesting. Can wikileaks really be an FSB asset, or are they just corrupt and stupidly biased like 99% of "media" in the USA? It seems that Assange and wiki existed to embarrass ONLY the US Military and foreign policy but why ignore obvious acts or terror and illegal aggression by Russia?
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Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:


Can read the report in the tweet.

Interesting. Can wikileaks really be an FSB asset, or are they just corrupt and stupidly biased like 99% of "media" in the USA? It seems that Assange and wiki existed to embarrass ONLY the US Military and foreign policy but why ignore obvious acts or terror and illegal aggression by Russia?


I”ll take Left-Wing Russian assets for $50, Bob.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 12:21:45 PM EDT
[#13]
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Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


No surprise here:

Trump's Best People List Regarding Russia

1) Paul Manafort - Trump's campaign manager was on the Kremlin payroll as the Russian controlled Party of Regions (note the name, bylaws to split Ukraine up into autonomous pro-Russian oblasts) candidate Yanukovych's campaign manager. He succeeded (with election cheating) and ousted pro-western Yuschenko from office. Yanukovych began to start Russian reforms like: change Ukrainian schoolbooks to reflect Russian history, make Russian an official language equal to Ukrainian, stopped ALL Ukrainian military modernization projects, and the big one: pushed to allow Russian troops to be station on multiple Ukrainian military bases for "cooperation"- that was the last straw which got him thrown out (he fled to Russia - big surprise). General Flynn and others connected to Manafort pushed the narrative that a Nazi Ukrainian government threw out a democratically elected leader.

While in Cleveland at the Republican National Convention, Manafort attempted to steer the RNC to change its policy from favorable to arm Ukraine to unfavorable. He did this BEFORE any initiatives to declare Trump as the party candidate. Manafort was part of Putin's Plan A for Ukraine and he has blood on his hands (his daughters words as well in texts revealed).

2) Carter Page - was on the Russian payroll for years and influenced US government officials to be in favor of Russian interests regarding foreign policy.

3) George Papadopoulos- another pro-Russian between man who passed pro-Russian policy wish lists between the Kremlin and US officials.

4) Sam Clovis - Russian expert along the lines of Clinton Ehrlich (Tucker Carlson's Russian expert who was employed by the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs) as far as twisting Ukrainian history in favor of Russia (and old technique used for hundreds of years by the Muscovites). He was Trump's academic adviser on Russia and if you look at ANY of his video lectures, you will see strong favoritism toward Russia. A classic Russian apoligist similar to Stephen Cohen who appeared on many talk shows like Coast to Coast.

5) Roger Stone - appeared on talk shows (like Info Wars)  and made HUNDREDS of statements praising Putin and Russia and spread Kremin lies about Ukraine.

6) Genral Flynn- past and present apologist for Russia. Spread Kremlin "US is poking the bear"  lies and propaganda about Russian invasion. Flynn's son is a big Alexi Joneskov fan and has appeared on several talk shows (as well as posting online) 100% defense of Russia.

7) Steve Bannon - has ALWAYS taken Russia's side on the conflict and continues to this day to host guests on his show which tow the Kremlin line.

Trump pardoned Manafort, Stone, and Papandopolis.

Trump so praised Putin SEVERAL times for invading Ukraine. Regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Trump said Putin's action was "so smart."

“Well, he’s done an amazing job of taking the mantle," Trump said of Russian president Vladimir Putin in an interview with Fox News' Eric Bolling. "And he’s taken it away from the president, and you look at what he’s doing. And so smart. When you see the riots in a country because they’re hurting the Russians, okay, ‘We’ll go and take it over.’ And he really goes step by step by step, and you have to give him a lot of credit."

"Interestingly, I own the Miss Universe pageant," Trump added. "We just left Moscow. He could not have been nicer. He was so nice and so everything. But you have to give him credit that what he’s doing for that country in terms of their world prestige is very strong."

Trump also said in the interview that "the people of Crimea, from what I've heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were."

Trump's comments made in May 2014 speech to the National Press Club:

“And another country, wants to come in and join—they love Russia," he said then. "They say—now we send in our pollsters, we say, ‘That’s not true.’ Well, you know, guess what? They want to form with Russia. How the hell are we involved? Okay, we’re involved in all of this. Isn’t Europe supposed to be involved in this?”

So, either Trump is a dunce and useful idiot for the Kremlin OR he knew what he was doing on their behalf. Pick one.
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Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


No surprise here:

Trump's Best People List Regarding Russia

1) Paul Manafort - Trump's campaign manager was on the Kremlin payroll as the Russian controlled Party of Regions (note the name, bylaws to split Ukraine up into autonomous pro-Russian oblasts) candidate Yanukovych's campaign manager. He succeeded (with election cheating) and ousted pro-western Yuschenko from office. Yanukovych began to start Russian reforms like: change Ukrainian schoolbooks to reflect Russian history, make Russian an official language equal to Ukrainian, stopped ALL Ukrainian military modernization projects, and the big one: pushed to allow Russian troops to be station on multiple Ukrainian military bases for "cooperation"- that was the last straw which got him thrown out (he fled to Russia - big surprise). General Flynn and others connected to Manafort pushed the narrative that a Nazi Ukrainian government threw out a democratically elected leader.

While in Cleveland at the Republican National Convention, Manafort attempted to steer the RNC to change its policy from favorable to arm Ukraine to unfavorable. He did this BEFORE any initiatives to declare Trump as the party candidate. Manafort was part of Putin's Plan A for Ukraine and he has blood on his hands (his daughters words as well in texts revealed).

2) Carter Page - was on the Russian payroll for years and influenced US government officials to be in favor of Russian interests regarding foreign policy.

3) George Papadopoulos- another pro-Russian between man who passed pro-Russian policy wish lists between the Kremlin and US officials.

4) Sam Clovis - Russian expert along the lines of Clinton Ehrlich (Tucker Carlson's Russian expert who was employed by the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs) as far as twisting Ukrainian history in favor of Russia (and old technique used for hundreds of years by the Muscovites). He was Trump's academic adviser on Russia and if you look at ANY of his video lectures, you will see strong favoritism toward Russia. A classic Russian apoligist similar to Stephen Cohen who appeared on many talk shows like Coast to Coast.

5) Roger Stone - appeared on talk shows (like Info Wars)  and made HUNDREDS of statements praising Putin and Russia and spread Kremin lies about Ukraine.

6) Genral Flynn- past and present apologist for Russia. Spread Kremlin "US is poking the bear"  lies and propaganda about Russian invasion. Flynn's son is a big Alexi Joneskov fan and has appeared on several talk shows (as well as posting online) 100% defense of Russia.

7) Steve Bannon - has ALWAYS taken Russia's side on the conflict and continues to this day to host guests on his show which tow the Kremlin line.

Trump pardoned Manafort, Stone, and Papandopolis.

Trump so praised Putin SEVERAL times for invading Ukraine. Regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Trump said Putin's action was "so smart."

“Well, he’s done an amazing job of taking the mantle," Trump said of Russian president Vladimir Putin in an interview with Fox News' Eric Bolling. "And he’s taken it away from the president, and you look at what he’s doing. And so smart. When you see the riots in a country because they’re hurting the Russians, okay, ‘We’ll go and take it over.’ And he really goes step by step by step, and you have to give him a lot of credit."

"Interestingly, I own the Miss Universe pageant," Trump added. "We just left Moscow. He could not have been nicer. He was so nice and so everything. But you have to give him credit that what he’s doing for that country in terms of their world prestige is very strong."

Trump also said in the interview that "the people of Crimea, from what I've heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were."

Trump's comments made in May 2014 speech to the National Press Club:

“And another country, wants to come in and join—they love Russia," he said then. "They say—now we send in our pollsters, we say, ‘That’s not true.’ Well, you know, guess what? They want to form with Russia. How the hell are we involved? Okay, we’re involved in all of this. Isn’t Europe supposed to be involved in this?”

So, either Trump is a dunce and useful idiot for the Kremlin OR he knew what he was doing on their behalf. Pick one.


I’m inclined towards useful idiot. At the time, the MSM reported he hired Manafort because he had experience on the Convention when he worked for Ford’s Re-Election bid…..and most importantly was about the only experienced hand willing to work for him. And the press was full of Manafort’s kvetching that Trump wasn’t listening to most of his advice. You make a good case that Manafort was working in Putin’s interest…but I’m not convinced Trump is/was doing so wittingly. I have come to the conclusion he’s clueless and easily manipulated by anyone willing and able to do it.  Thoroughly disqualifies him for Re-Election in my book.

As far as Page, wasn’t he working with the CIA?
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 12:25:33 PM EDT
[#14]
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Originally Posted By m24shooter:

That second one was the embodiment of "You can run but you'll only die tired."
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It shook that initial hit off pretty well.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 12:38:55 PM EDT
[#15]
That is a body flying up about 100 feet and to the right I think.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 12:41:33 PM EDT
[#16]
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Originally Posted By Dagger41:

Should ad to that. Kazakhstan has seized Russian assets at Baikonur. Virtually ending Russia's space program.

Putin not paying the bills so they took his shit.

LOL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSqkp-V2nIs
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Is that where OneWeb had its stolen sats?
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 12:46:19 PM EDT
[#17]
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Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
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That's a few months old
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 12:49:46 PM EDT
[#18]
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Originally Posted By tuckybill:
That is a body flying up about 100 feet and to the right I think.
View Quote


Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:04:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ITCHY-FINGER] [#19]
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Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
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When the second tank hit the mine you can see a crewman going for the record body-toss...

beaten. But I will argue that THIS IS the world record for body-tossing!
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:08:23 PM EDT
[#20]
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Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


No surprise here:

Trump's Best People List Regarding Russia

1) Paul Manafort - Trump's campaign manager was on the Kremlin payroll as the Russian controlled Party of Regions (note the name, bylaws to split Ukraine up into autonomous pro-Russian oblasts) candidate Yanukovych's campaign manager. He succeeded (with election cheating) and ousted pro-western Yuschenko from office. Yanukovych began to start Russian reforms like: change Ukrainian schoolbooks to reflect Russian history, make Russian an official language equal to Ukrainian, stopped ALL Ukrainian military modernization projects, and the big one: pushed to allow Russian troops to be station on multiple Ukrainian military bases for "cooperation"- that was the last straw which got him thrown out (he fled to Russia - big surprise). General Flynn and others connected to Manafort pushed the narrative that a Nazi Ukrainian government threw out a democratically elected leader.

While in Cleveland at the Republican National Convention, Manafort attempted to steer the RNC to change its policy from favorable to arm Ukraine to unfavorable. He did this BEFORE any initiatives to declare Trump as the party candidate. Manafort was part of Putin's Plan A for Ukraine and he has blood on his hands (his daughters words as well in texts revealed).

2) Carter Page - was on the Russian payroll for years and influenced US government officials to be in favor of Russian interests regarding foreign policy.

3) George Papadopoulos- another pro-Russian between man who passed pro-Russian policy wish lists between the Kremlin and US officials.

4) Sam Clovis - Russian expert along the lines of Clinton Ehrlich (Tucker Carlson's Russian expert who was employed by the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs) as far as twisting Ukrainian history in favor of Russia (and old technique used for hundreds of years by the Muscovites). He was Trump's academic adviser on Russia and if you look at ANY of his video lectures, you will see strong favoritism toward Russia. A classic Russian apoligist similar to Stephen Cohen who appeared on many talk shows like Coast to Coast.

5) Roger Stone - appeared on talk shows (like Info Wars)  and made HUNDREDS of statements praising Putin and Russia and spread Kremin lies about Ukraine.

6) Genral Flynn- past and present apologist for Russia. Spread Kremlin "US is poking the bear"  lies and propaganda about Russian invasion. Flynn's son is a big Alexi Joneskov fan and has appeared on several talk shows (as well as posting online) 100% defense of Russia.

7) Steve Bannon - has ALWAYS taken Russia's side on the conflict and continues to this day to host guests on his show which tow the Kremlin line.

Trump pardoned Manafort, Stone, and Papandopolis.

Trump so praised Putin SEVERAL times for invading Ukraine. Regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Trump said Putin's action was "so smart."

“Well, he’s done an amazing job of taking the mantle," Trump said of Russian president Vladimir Putin in an interview with Fox News' Eric Bolling. "And he’s taken it away from the president, and you look at what he’s doing. And so smart. When you see the riots in a country because they’re hurting the Russians, okay, ‘We’ll go and take it over.’ And he really goes step by step by step, and you have to give him a lot of credit."

"Interestingly, I own the Miss Universe pageant," Trump added. "We just left Moscow. He could not have been nicer. He was so nice and so everything. But you have to give him credit that what he’s doing for that country in terms of their world prestige is very strong."

Trump also said in the interview that "the people of Crimea, from what I've heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were."

Trump's comments made in May 2014 speech to the National Press Club:

“And another country, wants to come in and join—they love Russia," he said then. "They say—now we send in our pollsters, we say, ‘That’s not true.’ Well, you know, guess what? They want to form with Russia. How the hell are we involved? Okay, we’re involved in all of this. Isn’t Europe supposed to be involved in this?”

So, either Trump is a dunce and useful idiot for the Kremlin OR he knew what he was doing on their behalf. Pick one.
View Quote

Some of that might be true. But how do you explain why Putin attacked Ukraine before Trump and after Trump but never during Trump's term AND Trump was the first and only one to send lethal weapons to Ukraine?

Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:10:24 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsjAOKHX0AA_tnX?format=jpg&name=large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsjAOKAWcAAz8uF?format=jpg&name=large




Probable culprit.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsjAO5JXgAEc1XT?format=jpg&name=large
View Quote

That is super cool. Do we have any open-source info on range? Hopefully that rocket hit something good.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:13:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Saltwater-Hillbilly] [#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


No surprise here:

Trump's Best People List Regarding Russia

1) Paul Manafort - Trump's campaign manager was on the Kremlin payroll as the Russian controlled Party of Regions (note the name, bylaws to split Ukraine up into autonomous pro-Russian oblasts) candidate Yanukovych's campaign manager. He succeeded (with election cheating) and ousted pro-western Yuschenko from office. Yanukovych began to start Russian reforms like: change Ukrainian schoolbooks to reflect Russian history, make Russian an official language equal to Ukrainian, stopped ALL Ukrainian military modernization projects, and the big one: pushed to allow Russian troops to be station on multiple Ukrainian military bases for "cooperation"- that was the last straw which got him thrown out (he fled to Russia - big surprise). General Flynn and others connected to Manafort pushed the narrative that a Nazi Ukrainian government threw out a democratically elected leader.

While in Cleveland at the Republican National Convention, Manafort attempted to steer the RNC to change its policy from favorable to arm Ukraine to unfavorable. He did this BEFORE any initiatives to declare Trump as the party candidate. Manafort was part of Putin's Plan A for Ukraine and he has blood on his hands (his daughters words as well in texts revealed).

2) Carter Page - was on the Russian payroll for years and influenced US government officials to be in favor of Russian interests regarding foreign policy.

3) George Papadopoulos- another pro-Russian between man who passed pro-Russian policy wish lists between the Kremlin and US officials.

4) Sam Clovis - Russian expert along the lines of Clinton Ehrlich (Tucker Carlson's Russian expert who was employed by the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs) as far as twisting Ukrainian history in favor of Russia (and old technique used for hundreds of years by the Muscovites). He was Trump's academic adviser on Russia and if you look at ANY of his video lectures, you will see strong favoritism toward Russia. A classic Russian apoligist similar to Stephen Cohen who appeared on many talk shows like Coast to Coast.

5) Roger Stone - appeared on talk shows (like Info Wars)  and made HUNDREDS of statements praising Putin and Russia and spread Kremin lies about Ukraine.

6) Genral Flynn- past and present apologist for Russia. Spread Kremlin "US is poking the bear"  lies and propaganda about Russian invasion. Flynn's son is a big Alexi Joneskov fan and has appeared on several talk shows (as well as posting online) 100% defense of Russia.

7) Steve Bannon - has ALWAYS taken Russia's side on the conflict and continues to this day to host guests on his show which tow the Kremlin line.

Trump pardoned Manafort, Stone, and Papandopolis.

Trump so praised Putin SEVERAL times for invading Ukraine. Regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Trump said Putin's action was "so smart."

“Well, he’s done an amazing job of taking the mantle," Trump said of Russian president Vladimir Putin in an interview with Fox News' Eric Bolling. "And he’s taken it away from the president, and you look at what he’s doing. And so smart. When you see the riots in a country because they’re hurting the Russians, okay, ‘We’ll go and take it over.’ And he really goes step by step by step, and you have to give him a lot of credit."

"Interestingly, I own the Miss Universe pageant," Trump added. "We just left Moscow. He could not have been nicer. He was so nice and so everything. But you have to give him credit that what he’s doing for that country in terms of their world prestige is very strong."

Trump also said in the interview that "the people of Crimea, from what I've heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were."

Trump's comments made in May 2014 speech to the National Press Club:

“And another country, wants to come in and join—they love Russia," he said then. "They say—now we send in our pollsters, we say, ‘That’s not true.’ Well, you know, guess what? They want to form with Russia. How the hell are we involved? Okay, we’re involved in all of this. Isn’t Europe supposed to be involved in this?”

So, either Trump is a dunce and useful idiot for the Kremlin OR he knew what he was doing on their behalf. Pick one.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


No surprise here:

Trump's Best People List Regarding Russia

1) Paul Manafort - Trump's campaign manager was on the Kremlin payroll as the Russian controlled Party of Regions (note the name, bylaws to split Ukraine up into autonomous pro-Russian oblasts) candidate Yanukovych's campaign manager. He succeeded (with election cheating) and ousted pro-western Yuschenko from office. Yanukovych began to start Russian reforms like: change Ukrainian schoolbooks to reflect Russian history, make Russian an official language equal to Ukrainian, stopped ALL Ukrainian military modernization projects, and the big one: pushed to allow Russian troops to be station on multiple Ukrainian military bases for "cooperation"- that was the last straw which got him thrown out (he fled to Russia - big surprise). General Flynn and others connected to Manafort pushed the narrative that a Nazi Ukrainian government threw out a democratically elected leader.

While in Cleveland at the Republican National Convention, Manafort attempted to steer the RNC to change its policy from favorable to arm Ukraine to unfavorable. He did this BEFORE any initiatives to declare Trump as the party candidate. Manafort was part of Putin's Plan A for Ukraine and he has blood on his hands (his daughters words as well in texts revealed).

2) Carter Page - was on the Russian payroll for years and influenced US government officials to be in favor of Russian interests regarding foreign policy.

3) George Papadopoulos- another pro-Russian between man who passed pro-Russian policy wish lists between the Kremlin and US officials.

4) Sam Clovis - Russian expert along the lines of Clinton Ehrlich (Tucker Carlson's Russian expert who was employed by the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs) as far as twisting Ukrainian history in favor of Russia (and old technique used for hundreds of years by the Muscovites). He was Trump's academic adviser on Russia and if you look at ANY of his video lectures, you will see strong favoritism toward Russia. A classic Russian apoligist similar to Stephen Cohen who appeared on many talk shows like Coast to Coast.

5) Roger Stone - appeared on talk shows (like Info Wars)  and made HUNDREDS of statements praising Putin and Russia and spread Kremin lies about Ukraine.

6) Genral Flynn- past and present apologist for Russia. Spread Kremlin "US is poking the bear"  lies and propaganda about Russian invasion. Flynn's son is a big Alexi Joneskov fan and has appeared on several talk shows (as well as posting online) 100% defense of Russia.

7) Steve Bannon - has ALWAYS taken Russia's side on the conflict and continues to this day to host guests on his show which tow the Kremlin line.

Trump pardoned Manafort, Stone, and Papandopolis.

Trump so praised Putin SEVERAL times for invading Ukraine. Regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Trump said Putin's action was "so smart."

“Well, he’s done an amazing job of taking the mantle," Trump said of Russian president Vladimir Putin in an interview with Fox News' Eric Bolling. "And he’s taken it away from the president, and you look at what he’s doing. And so smart. When you see the riots in a country because they’re hurting the Russians, okay, ‘We’ll go and take it over.’ And he really goes step by step by step, and you have to give him a lot of credit."

"Interestingly, I own the Miss Universe pageant," Trump added. "We just left Moscow. He could not have been nicer. He was so nice and so everything. But you have to give him credit that what he’s doing for that country in terms of their world prestige is very strong."

Trump also said in the interview that "the people of Crimea, from what I've heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were."

Trump's comments made in May 2014 speech to the National Press Club:

“And another country, wants to come in and join—they love Russia," he said then. "They say—now we send in our pollsters, we say, ‘That’s not true.’ Well, you know, guess what? They want to form with Russia. How the hell are we involved? Okay, we’re involved in all of this. Isn’t Europe supposed to be involved in this?”

So, either Trump is a dunce and useful idiot for the Kremlin OR he knew what he was doing on their behalf. Pick one.


Cool, but why stop at Trump?  The Ruskies have done a hell of a job infiltrating our so-called "leadership" class.  The "Kompromat" goes a lot deeper than a few Trump key advisors.  The Obama Administration was famous for it's "Reset" buttons and it's "flexibility".  The only reason Hillary "turned" on Russia was to try to win an election that was going sideways; the ink was barely dry on the Uranium One contract when her run for President failed and she needed a scapegoat for domestic consumption; Putin must have seethed at the betrayal after all the money he funneled into the various Clinton Slush Funds "initiatives" over the years. To be fair though, her husband's State Department helped put him into power to "stabilize" Russia and corrupt oligarchs were good friends and honored guests of the Clintons both in and out of office.  Got to ensure the spice continued to flow.  Most (if not all) of our major banks, energy producers, auto and equipment manufacturers, etc assisted the Russian state through access to economic and technical data (as well as money).  Let us not even talk about the ties between the "Deep State", academia and Russian-aligned and financed "think tanks" focused on Eastern Europe and Central Asia, or all of the Russian-sponsored conferenced these folks vied to attend, usually directly or indirectly on Uncle Sugar's dime, as there is nothing cooler than getting per-diem and an honorarium + gift basket + hotel upgrade at the same time! Someday, when the KGB FSB files open up again, the level of Kompromat exposed will result in crying, finger-pointing, and a lot of sudden flights by private jet to places with no extradition treaty with the US.  It will be worse for the UK, as there is enough stuff there to crash the City of London three times over (at least), and for France and Germany it could discredit their entire Political/Government/Diplomatic/Military/Academic classes (from hard-left to nationalist right, and everyone in between) to the point that the uncompromised national-level leadership of both France and Germany could have their meeting at one of the short tables at a small Gasthaus like the Wackernheimerhof in Rheinland-Pfalz and have seats left over!  Making this about Trump is like focusing on one of the skin legions instead of the stage-four cancer.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:17:05 PM EDT
[#23]
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Originally Posted By AROKIE:

That's a few months old
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Originally Posted By AROKIE:
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:

That's a few months old


There was a few recycled footage postings making the rounds today on Twitter.   I filtered them out but forgot this was a repeat too.  Thanks.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:18:04 PM EDT
[#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Tiberius:


I’m inclined towards useful idiot. At the time, the MSM reported he hired Manafort because he had experience on the Convention when he worked for Ford’s Re-Election bid…..and most importantly was about the only experienced hand willing to work for him. And the press was full of Manafort’s kvetching that Trump wasn’t listening to most of his advice. You make a good case that Manafort was working in Putin’s interest…but I’m not convinced Trump is/was doing so wittingly. I have come to the conclusion he’s clueless and easily manipulated by anyone willing and able to do it.  Thoroughly disqualifies him for Re-Election in my book.

As far as Page, wasn’t he working with the CIA?
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Originally Posted By Tiberius:
Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


No surprise here:

Trump's Best People List Regarding Russia

1) Paul Manafort - Trump's campaign manager was on the Kremlin payroll as the Russian controlled Party of Regions (note the name, bylaws to split Ukraine up into autonomous pro-Russian oblasts) candidate Yanukovych's campaign manager. He succeeded (with election cheating) and ousted pro-western Yuschenko from office. Yanukovych began to start Russian reforms like: change Ukrainian schoolbooks to reflect Russian history, make Russian an official language equal to Ukrainian, stopped ALL Ukrainian military modernization projects, and the big one: pushed to allow Russian troops to be station on multiple Ukrainian military bases for "cooperation"- that was the last straw which got him thrown out (he fled to Russia - big surprise). General Flynn and others connected to Manafort pushed the narrative that a Nazi Ukrainian government threw out a democratically elected leader.

While in Cleveland at the Republican National Convention, Manafort attempted to steer the RNC to change its policy from favorable to arm Ukraine to unfavorable. He did this BEFORE any initiatives to declare Trump as the party candidate. Manafort was part of Putin's Plan A for Ukraine and he has blood on his hands (his daughters words as well in texts revealed).

2) Carter Page - was on the Russian payroll for years and influenced US government officials to be in favor of Russian interests regarding foreign policy.

3) George Papadopoulos- another pro-Russian between man who passed pro-Russian policy wish lists between the Kremlin and US officials.

4) Sam Clovis - Russian expert along the lines of Clinton Ehrlich (Tucker Carlson's Russian expert who was employed by the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs) as far as twisting Ukrainian history in favor of Russia (and old technique used for hundreds of years by the Muscovites). He was Trump's academic adviser on Russia and if you look at ANY of his video lectures, you will see strong favoritism toward Russia. A classic Russian apoligist similar to Stephen Cohen who appeared on many talk shows like Coast to Coast.

5) Roger Stone - appeared on talk shows (like Info Wars)  and made HUNDREDS of statements praising Putin and Russia and spread Kremin lies about Ukraine.

6) Genral Flynn- past and present apologist for Russia. Spread Kremlin "US is poking the bear"  lies and propaganda about Russian invasion. Flynn's son is a big Alexi Joneskov fan and has appeared on several talk shows (as well as posting online) 100% defense of Russia.

7) Steve Bannon - has ALWAYS taken Russia's side on the conflict and continues to this day to host guests on his show which tow the Kremlin line.

Trump pardoned Manafort, Stone, and Papandopolis.

Trump so praised Putin SEVERAL times for invading Ukraine. Regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Trump said Putin's action was "so smart."

“Well, he’s done an amazing job of taking the mantle," Trump said of Russian president Vladimir Putin in an interview with Fox News' Eric Bolling. "And he’s taken it away from the president, and you look at what he’s doing. And so smart. When you see the riots in a country because they’re hurting the Russians, okay, ‘We’ll go and take it over.’ And he really goes step by step by step, and you have to give him a lot of credit."

"Interestingly, I own the Miss Universe pageant," Trump added. "We just left Moscow. He could not have been nicer. He was so nice and so everything. But you have to give him credit that what he’s doing for that country in terms of their world prestige is very strong."

Trump also said in the interview that "the people of Crimea, from what I've heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were."

Trump's comments made in May 2014 speech to the National Press Club:

“And another country, wants to come in and join—they love Russia," he said then. "They say—now we send in our pollsters, we say, ‘That’s not true.’ Well, you know, guess what? They want to form with Russia. How the hell are we involved? Okay, we’re involved in all of this. Isn’t Europe supposed to be involved in this?”

So, either Trump is a dunce and useful idiot for the Kremlin OR he knew what he was doing on their behalf. Pick one.


I’m inclined towards useful idiot. At the time, the MSM reported he hired Manafort because he had experience on the Convention when he worked for Ford’s Re-Election bid…..and most importantly was about the only experienced hand willing to work for him. And the press was full of Manafort’s kvetching that Trump wasn’t listening to most of his advice. You make a good case that Manafort was working in Putin’s interest…but I’m not convinced Trump is/was doing so wittingly. I have come to the conclusion he’s clueless and easily manipulated by anyone willing and able to do it.  Thoroughly disqualifies him for Re-Election in my book.

As far as Page, wasn’t he working with the CIA?


Regarding Carter Page, Yes.  He was Naval Intelligence and a major DIA/CIA source.  They were so desperate to get Trump that the FBI burned a CIA/DIA asset in the process.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:19:01 PM EDT
[#25]
For any of the crowd that -does- want to get out of the boat for a few laughs, the "Bahkmut Has Fallen!!!!" thread is pants on head, weapons grade pluturdium pro-Russian talking points.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:20:16 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:

That is super cool. Do we have any open-source info on range? Hopefully that rocket hit something good.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsjAOKHX0AA_tnX?format=jpg&name=large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsjAOKAWcAAz8uF?format=jpg&name=large




Probable culprit.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsjAO5JXgAEc1XT?format=jpg&name=large

That is super cool. Do we have any open-source info on range? Hopefully that rocket hit something good.


Around 8km based on open source.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:22:23 PM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By m24shooter:
For any of the crowd that -does- want to get out of the boat for a few laughs, the "Bahkmut Has Fallen!!!!" thread is pants on head, weapons grade pluturdium pro-Russian talking points.
View Quote


lol.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:24:27 PM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


"The only option is for Russia to save itself and deal with Putin." - true, I agree. However, Russia also needs to deal with the whole Russian mentality (false history, etc.) over several hundred years regarding its OLDER neighbor which is Ukraine/Kyivan-Rus.

The only way Russia can survive now and save themselves from total economic devastation is to arrest Putin, Mevedev, Lavrov, Peskov, and the rest of their clan, dissolve the Russian Federation, vow to make reparations to Ukraine, as well as Europe and the USA for costs incurred, and shut down the Kremlin-run propaganda machine which includes RT News, Sputnik,  Tass, etc. which would include sending the west ALL intelligence files on who they paid off to spread Kremlin propaganda.
View Quote

Yes. They would really have to clean house. A LOT of cleaning out. And they would have to work on the Russian culture that seems to want and NEED corruption and authoritarianism. They have to learn somehow that they can be better people.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:24:36 PM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MFP_4073:



you're correct.   many can recall Mitt Romney's comments on Russia during the 2012 Presidential race -- he was basically laughed off the stage for saying Russia was a major threat.   many were sleeping but Romney -- as much as we bash him as a RINO - was prescient.  of course as you say -- our 'sights' were zeroed on GWOT - GWOT - and more GWOT.   24/7 GWOT...

-------------------------------------------------

It’s time to admit it: Mitt Romney was right about Russia

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/22/politics/mitt-romney-russia-ukraine/index.html

Analysis by Chris Cillizza, CNN Editor-at-large    Updated 10:30 AM EST, Sun February 27, 2022

CNN  —

A decade ago, Mitt Romney went on CNN and made a statement that was widely perceived as a major mistake.

“Russia, this is, without question, our number one geopolitical foe,” Romney, who would be the Republican presidential nominee in the 2012 race against President Barack Obama, told Wolf Blitzer in March of that year. “They — they fight every cause for the world’s worst actors.”

Obama and his team pounced on the comment, insisting that it showed Romney was hopelessly out of touch when it came to the threats facing the US.

In the third presidential debate between the two candidates in October 2012, Obama went directly after Romney for that remark. “When you were asked, ‘What’s the biggest geopolitical threat facing America,’ you said ‘Russia.’ Not al Qaeda; you said Russia,” Obama said. “And, the 1980s are now calling to ask for their foreign policy back, because the Cold War’s been over for 20 years.”

The 80s called! Boom! Roasted!

At the time, the attack worked. Obama cast himself as the candidate who understood the current threats – led by al Qaeda. Romney was the candidate still stuck in the Cold War age, a black-and-white figure in a colorful – and complex – world.

But today, after Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered Russian troops into eastern Ukraine, Romney’s comments look very, very different. And by “different,” I mean “right,” as even some Democrats are now acknowledging.

“This action by Putin further confirms that Mitt Romney was right when he called Russia the number one geopolitical foe,” California Democratic Rep. Ted Lieu said on CNN Monday night.

Given that, it’s worth revisiting the context around what Romney said and why.

He was reacting to a hot-mic moment between Obama and then-Russian President Dmitry Medvedev earlier in 2012. In that exchange, Obama told Medvedev: “This is my last election. And after my election, I have more flexibility.”

Republicans were up in arms, insisting that Obama was taking a hard line with Russia publicly while, apparently, making clear to the country’s leader that he was open to compromise.

In his original interview, Blitzer was asking Romney about Russia in the context of that Obama hot-mic moment. And while his comment about Russia as America’s “number one geopolitical foe” is what drew the most attention and derision, it was far from the only comment Romney made about that subject in his interview with Blitzer.

“Russia is not a friendly character on the world stage,” Romney said at one point. “And for this President to be looking for greater flexibility, where he doesn’t have to answer to the American people in his relations with Russia, is very, very troubling, very alarming.”

Pressed by Blitzer on his assertion about the threat posed by Russia, Romney added this:

“Well, I’m saying in terms of a geopolitical opponent, the nation that lines up with the world’s worst actors. Of course, the greatest threat that the world faces is a nuclear Iran. A nuclear North Korea is already troubling enough.

“But when these – these terrible actors pursue their course in the world and we go to the United Nations looking for ways to stop them, when – when Assad, for instance, is murdering his own people, we go – we go to the United Nations, and who is it that always stands up for the world’s worst actors?

“It is always Russia, typically with China alongside.”

What looked like a major flub during the 2012 campaign – and was used as a political cudgel by Obama – now looks very, very different. It should serve as a reminder that history is not written in the moment – and that what something looks like in that moment is not a guarantee of what it will always look like.

---------------------------------------
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Originally Posted By MFP_4073:
Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly:


....  Georgia in 2008 should have been a wake up call to everyone, and it was to some extent for the US military (particularly the Army), but we were balls deep in Iraq, Afghanistan, and the rest of GWOT, and the rest of the USG effort tended to be of the "strongly worded letter" category. Looking back, we can see Georgia was where Russia was perfecting it's "hybrid war" techniques.



you're correct.   many can recall Mitt Romney's comments on Russia during the 2012 Presidential race -- he was basically laughed off the stage for saying Russia was a major threat.   many were sleeping but Romney -- as much as we bash him as a RINO - was prescient.  of course as you say -- our 'sights' were zeroed on GWOT - GWOT - and more GWOT.   24/7 GWOT...

-------------------------------------------------

It’s time to admit it: Mitt Romney was right about Russia

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/22/politics/mitt-romney-russia-ukraine/index.html

Analysis by Chris Cillizza, CNN Editor-at-large    Updated 10:30 AM EST, Sun February 27, 2022

CNN  —

A decade ago, Mitt Romney went on CNN and made a statement that was widely perceived as a major mistake.

“Russia, this is, without question, our number one geopolitical foe,” Romney, who would be the Republican presidential nominee in the 2012 race against President Barack Obama, told Wolf Blitzer in March of that year. “They — they fight every cause for the world’s worst actors.”

Obama and his team pounced on the comment, insisting that it showed Romney was hopelessly out of touch when it came to the threats facing the US.

In the third presidential debate between the two candidates in October 2012, Obama went directly after Romney for that remark. “When you were asked, ‘What’s the biggest geopolitical threat facing America,’ you said ‘Russia.’ Not al Qaeda; you said Russia,” Obama said. “And, the 1980s are now calling to ask for their foreign policy back, because the Cold War’s been over for 20 years.”

The 80s called! Boom! Roasted!

At the time, the attack worked. Obama cast himself as the candidate who understood the current threats – led by al Qaeda. Romney was the candidate still stuck in the Cold War age, a black-and-white figure in a colorful – and complex – world.

But today, after Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered Russian troops into eastern Ukraine, Romney’s comments look very, very different. And by “different,” I mean “right,” as even some Democrats are now acknowledging.

“This action by Putin further confirms that Mitt Romney was right when he called Russia the number one geopolitical foe,” California Democratic Rep. Ted Lieu said on CNN Monday night.

Given that, it’s worth revisiting the context around what Romney said and why.

He was reacting to a hot-mic moment between Obama and then-Russian President Dmitry Medvedev earlier in 2012. In that exchange, Obama told Medvedev: “This is my last election. And after my election, I have more flexibility.”

Republicans were up in arms, insisting that Obama was taking a hard line with Russia publicly while, apparently, making clear to the country’s leader that he was open to compromise.

In his original interview, Blitzer was asking Romney about Russia in the context of that Obama hot-mic moment. And while his comment about Russia as America’s “number one geopolitical foe” is what drew the most attention and derision, it was far from the only comment Romney made about that subject in his interview with Blitzer.

“Russia is not a friendly character on the world stage,” Romney said at one point. “And for this President to be looking for greater flexibility, where he doesn’t have to answer to the American people in his relations with Russia, is very, very troubling, very alarming.”

Pressed by Blitzer on his assertion about the threat posed by Russia, Romney added this:

“Well, I’m saying in terms of a geopolitical opponent, the nation that lines up with the world’s worst actors. Of course, the greatest threat that the world faces is a nuclear Iran. A nuclear North Korea is already troubling enough.

“But when these – these terrible actors pursue their course in the world and we go to the United Nations looking for ways to stop them, when – when Assad, for instance, is murdering his own people, we go – we go to the United Nations, and who is it that always stands up for the world’s worst actors?

“It is always Russia, typically with China alongside.”

What looked like a major flub during the 2012 campaign – and was used as a political cudgel by Obama – now looks very, very different. It should serve as a reminder that history is not written in the moment – and that what something looks like in that moment is not a guarantee of what it will always look like.

---------------------------------------


It’s typical of the libtard that wrote this to omit the sheer damage they did to Romney….they completely emasculated him and worse, discredited the idea that Russia was an enemy, much less a threat. Of course, they don’t want to be held accountable for that.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:32:29 PM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By dcs12345:
Looks to be another video in the series that included the little trench in the corner of the field from a couple of days ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8a_A_L0KAqw
View Quote

Interesting. Looks like some RU guy looting a dead body. What are those white packages he was looting? I'm assuming some RU guy carrying extra rations or some supplies for the group got hit so this guy goes out to get some. Didnt work out. It's also interesting that the UA arty or mortar team had the ammo to target individual mobiks like this guy.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:34:31 PM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly:


Cool, but why stop at Trump?  The Ruskies have done a hell of a job infiltrating our so-called "leadership" class.  The "Kompromat" goes a lot deeper than a few Trump key advisors.  The Obama Administration was famous for it's "Reset" buttons and it's "flexibility".  The only reason Hillary "turned" on Russia was to try to win an election that was going sideways; the ink was barely dry on the Uranium One contract when her run for President failed and she needed a scapegoat for domestic consumption; Putin must have seethed at the betrayal after all the money he funneled into the various Clinton Slush Funds "initiatives" over the years. To be fair though, her husband's State Department helped put him into power to "stabilize" Russia and corrupt oligarchs were good friends and honored guests of the Clintons both in and out of office.  Got to ensure the spice continued to flow.  Most (if not all) of our major banks, energy producers, auto and equipment manufacturers, etc assisted the Russian state through access to economic and technical data (as well as money).  Let us not even talk about the ties between the "Deep State", academia and Russian-aligned and financed "think tanks" focused on Eastern Europe and Central Asia, or all of the Russian-sponsored conferenced these folks vied to attend, usually directly or indirectly on Uncle Sugar's dime, as there is nothing cooler than getting per-diem and an honorarium + gift basket + hotel upgrade at the same time! Someday, when the KGB FSB files open up again, the level of Kompromat exposed will result in crying, finger-pointing, and a lot of sudden flights by private jet to places with no extradition treaty with the US.  It will be worse for the UK, as there is enough stuff there to crash the City of London three times over (at least), and for France and Germany it could discredit their entire Political/Government/Diplomatic/Military/Academic classes (from hard-left to nationalist right, and everyone in between) to the point that the uncompromised national-level leadership of both France and Germany could have their meeting at one of the short tables at a small Gasthaus like the Wackernheimerhof in Rheinland-Pfalz and have seats left over!  Making this about Trump is like focusing on one of the skin legions instead of the stage-four cancer.
View Quote


I'm sure quite a few European politicians are squirming right now.

Might be similar to East Germany when the Stasi files were opened and operatives were exposed.

No doubt there are a lot of politicians being fed off of Russian tits.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:39:23 PM EDT
[#32]
Russia is about to take the rotating presidency of the UN security council for the month of February.

Could the Western allies organize a boycott of the UNSC, so that the Russian UN rep meets alone and can conduct no business? Just an idea.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:49:11 PM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly:


It goes back to the part of the Russian psyche in which "Respect=Fear".  The Russians have a need for other peoples people to submit out of fear.  Putin thought that he could leverage European greed + fear to enlarge "Russiaworld", and many Russians (not just Putin) were annoyed that the West didn't "respect" (fear) Russia enough.  Unfortunately for Russia, the Western reaction to their newfound "respect" for Russia has been to start handing out baseball bats (diplomatic, economic and military) to anyone who wants to take a shot at what the West sees as a problem.  Cowering is a response to fear, popping mags and shooting until the threat is over is another response, and taking a flamethrower to the problem is something else that can alleviate fear.  Russia is in the position where they are the ones who have to initiate the de-escalation cycle with serious action against their own interests or face some form of national destruction.  When the West "fears", you get things like the absolute destruction of the Japanese Empire, enough nukes to obliterate the problem several times over, or major wars that ravage entire continents.  Putin played his cards well for many years.  I even had some sympathy for the Russian arguments prior to the invasion of Georgia, and was jealous that Russia had a leader who could at least say "national interest" without it looking like a comedic punchline (as is usually the case with Western politicians).  Putin played his cards well, bluffed like a champ, and would often walk away from the table with most of the pot despite not having the best cards.  In this case, he is sitting on a low pair and everyone with better cards is raising the pot.  I can't see any realistic scenario where this ends well for Russia, especially with all the new players getting in on the game.
View Quote

Another excellent post. I also felt some admiration for Russia (before the 2014 invasion) for the same reason. They had (at least the appearance) of a leader who prioritized their nation's interests rather than apologizing for every flaw.

Russia and their form of respect seems somewhat similar to how an inner-city hoodlum sees and NEEDS respect. It's all they have in their mind and losing respect is worse than death. In a dangerous world where you have abused and terrorized your neighbors, losing respect means you are nothing and will be devoured. Like a lion tamer in the cage losing his chair and whip. What is scary is that in this mentality, it may be better to die fighting (keep some respect) then to submit (lose everything).
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:49:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest] [#34]
10 min video.




Highlight reel.

Link Posted: 3/31/2023 1:52:56 PM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By m24shooter:
For any of the crowd that -does- want to get out of the boat for a few laughs, the "Bahkmut Has Fallen!!!!" thread is pants on head, weapons grade pluturdium pro-Russian talking points.
View Quote



Yeah, I ventured over there. Yes there are some real idiots at work over their. Can't complain too much though, some of my relatives are real idiots too. Yep, Putin is fighting globohomo, and oppressed Russian speakers, and all of that. Yes, Russian propaganda works.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:06:06 PM EDT
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
10 min video.




Highlight reel.

View Quote


Watch this.

Wow.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:08:09 PM EDT
[#37]
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:08:28 PM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
10 min video.




Highlight reel.

View Quote

That looks an awful lot like the T where the Ukrainian "forward position" was. Just a different angle.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:09:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BerettaGuy] [#39]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly:


Cool, but why stop at Trump?  The Ruskies have done a hell of a job infiltrating our so-called "leadership" class.  The "Kompromat" goes a lot deeper than a few Trump key advisors.  The Obama Administration was famous for it's "Reset" buttons and it's "flexibility".  The only reason Hillary "turned" on Russia was to try to win an election that was going sideways; the ink was barely dry on the Uranium One contract when her run for President failed and she needed a scapegoat for domestic consumption; Putin must have seethed at the betrayal after all the money he funneled into the various Clinton Slush Funds "initiatives" over the years. To be fair though, her husband's State Department helped put him into power to "stabilize" Russia and corrupt oligarchs were good friends and honored guests of the Clintons both in and out of office.  Got to ensure the spice continued to flow.  Most (if not all) of our major banks, energy producers, auto and equipment manufacturers, etc assisted the Russian state through access to economic and technical data (as well as money).  Let us not even talk about the ties between the "Deep State", academia and Russian-aligned and financed "think tanks" focused on Eastern Europe and Central Asia, or all of the Russian-sponsored conferenced these folks vied to attend, usually directly or indirectly on Uncle Sugar's dime, as there is nothing cooler than getting per-diem and an honorarium + gift basket + hotel upgrade at the same time! Someday, when the KGB FSB files open up again, the level of Kompromat exposed will result in crying, finger-pointing, and a lot of sudden flights by private jet to places with no extradition treaty with the US.  It will be worse for the UK, as there is enough stuff there to crash the City of London three times over (at least), and for France and Germany it could discredit their entire Political/Government/Diplomatic/Military/Academic classes (from hard-left to nationalist right, and everyone in between) to the point that the uncompromised national-level leadership of both France and Germany could have their meeting at one of the short tables at a small Gasthaus like the Wackernheimerhof in Rheinland-Pfalz and have seats left over!  Making this about Trump is like focusing on one of the skin legions instead of the stage-four cancer.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly:
Originally Posted By BerettaGuy:


No surprise here:

Trump's Best People List Regarding Russia

1) Paul Manafort - Trump's campaign manager was on the Kremlin payroll as the Russian controlled Party of Regions (note the name, bylaws to split Ukraine up into autonomous pro-Russian oblasts) candidate Yanukovych's campaign manager. He succeeded (with election cheating) and ousted pro-western Yuschenko from office. Yanukovych began to start Russian reforms like: change Ukrainian schoolbooks to reflect Russian history, make Russian an official language equal to Ukrainian, stopped ALL Ukrainian military modernization projects, and the big one: pushed to allow Russian troops to be station on multiple Ukrainian military bases for "cooperation"- that was the last straw which got him thrown out (he fled to Russia - big surprise). General Flynn and others connected to Manafort pushed the narrative that a Nazi Ukrainian government threw out a democratically elected leader.

While in Cleveland at the Republican National Convention, Manafort attempted to steer the RNC to change its policy from favorable to arm Ukraine to unfavorable. He did this BEFORE any initiatives to declare Trump as the party candidate. Manafort was part of Putin's Plan A for Ukraine and he has blood on his hands (his daughters words as well in texts revealed).

2) Carter Page - was on the Russian payroll for years and influenced US government officials to be in favor of Russian interests regarding foreign policy.

3) George Papadopoulos- another pro-Russian between man who passed pro-Russian policy wish lists between the Kremlin and US officials.

4) Sam Clovis - Russian expert along the lines of Clinton Ehrlich (Tucker Carlson's Russian expert who was employed by the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs) as far as twisting Ukrainian history in favor of Russia (and old technique used for hundreds of years by the Muscovites). He was Trump's academic adviser on Russia and if you look at ANY of his video lectures, you will see strong favoritism toward Russia. A classic Russian apoligist similar to Stephen Cohen who appeared on many talk shows like Coast to Coast.

5) Roger Stone - appeared on talk shows (like Info Wars)  and made HUNDREDS of statements praising Putin and Russia and spread Kremin lies about Ukraine.

6) Genral Flynn- past and present apologist for Russia. Spread Kremlin "US is poking the bear"  lies and propaganda about Russian invasion. Flynn's son is a big Alexi Joneskov fan and has appeared on several talk shows (as well as posting online) 100% defense of Russia.

7) Steve Bannon - has ALWAYS taken Russia's side on the conflict and continues to this day to host guests on his show which tow the Kremlin line.

Trump pardoned Manafort, Stone, and Papandopolis.

Trump so praised Putin SEVERAL times for invading Ukraine. Regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Trump said Putin's action was "so smart."

“Well, he’s done an amazing job of taking the mantle," Trump said of Russian president Vladimir Putin in an interview with Fox News' Eric Bolling. "And he’s taken it away from the president, and you look at what he’s doing. And so smart. When you see the riots in a country because they’re hurting the Russians, okay, ‘We’ll go and take it over.’ And he really goes step by step by step, and you have to give him a lot of credit."

"Interestingly, I own the Miss Universe pageant," Trump added. "We just left Moscow. He could not have been nicer. He was so nice and so everything. But you have to give him credit that what he’s doing for that country in terms of their world prestige is very strong."

Trump also said in the interview that "the people of Crimea, from what I've heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were."

Trump's comments made in May 2014 speech to the National Press Club:

“And another country, wants to come in and join—they love Russia," he said then. "They say—now we send in our pollsters, we say, ‘That’s not true.’ Well, you know, guess what? They want to form with Russia. How the hell are we involved? Okay, we’re involved in all of this. Isn’t Europe supposed to be involved in this?”

So, either Trump is a dunce and useful idiot for the Kremlin OR he knew what he was doing on their behalf. Pick one.


Cool, but why stop at Trump?  The Ruskies have done a hell of a job infiltrating our so-called "leadership" class.  The "Kompromat" goes a lot deeper than a few Trump key advisors.  The Obama Administration was famous for it's "Reset" buttons and it's "flexibility".  The only reason Hillary "turned" on Russia was to try to win an election that was going sideways; the ink was barely dry on the Uranium One contract when her run for President failed and she needed a scapegoat for domestic consumption; Putin must have seethed at the betrayal after all the money he funneled into the various Clinton Slush Funds "initiatives" over the years. To be fair though, her husband's State Department helped put him into power to "stabilize" Russia and corrupt oligarchs were good friends and honored guests of the Clintons both in and out of office.  Got to ensure the spice continued to flow.  Most (if not all) of our major banks, energy producers, auto and equipment manufacturers, etc assisted the Russian state through access to economic and technical data (as well as money).  Let us not even talk about the ties between the "Deep State", academia and Russian-aligned and financed "think tanks" focused on Eastern Europe and Central Asia, or all of the Russian-sponsored conferenced these folks vied to attend, usually directly or indirectly on Uncle Sugar's dime, as there is nothing cooler than getting per-diem and an honorarium + gift basket + hotel upgrade at the same time! Someday, when the KGB FSB files open up again, the level of Kompromat exposed will result in crying, finger-pointing, and a lot of sudden flights by private jet to places with no extradition treaty with the US.  It will be worse for the UK, as there is enough stuff there to crash the City of London three times over (at least), and for France and Germany it could discredit their entire Political/Government/Diplomatic/Military/Academic classes (from hard-left to nationalist right, and everyone in between) to the point that the uncompromised national-level leadership of both France and Germany could have their meeting at one of the short tables at a small Gasthaus like the Wackernheimerhof in Rheinland-Pfalz and have seats left over!  Making this about Trump is like focusing on one of the skin legions instead of the stage-four cancer.


I never stopped with Trump. I covered other issues back when this thread was in double digits:

"This was a long-term plan which was preceded by the Budapest Memorandum pushed through by 1960s sovietized Bill Clinton and Moscow frequent flyer left-wing RINO Sen. Dick Lugar. In 2005, Sen. Lugar and then Se. Obama (lifelong Marxist) went to Ukraine and paid off corrupt Ukrainian officials to destroy millions of surplus weapons and billions of round of ammunition plus artillery ammunition - all could have given to the villages and small towns as well as Territorial Defense units to help stop the Russians.

These were all long term plans and as far as the this bullshit from Alexi Joneskov and his crew telling the world that Ukrainian Nazis were overthrowing the "duly-elected" president Yanukovych this is another example of how the so-called patriot (pay-triot) alt right supports communists and Russia. Texas communist and Donetsk "Republic" fighter Russel Bentley is also portrayed as some freedom fighter by these CONservative frauds who use alternative medicine info, 2nd Amendment articles, globalist history, prepper info, immigration issues, etc. as the honeypot to attract unsuspecting conservatives then indoctrinate them with Kremlin BS."


I found out about Manafort's actions in 2010 - briefed at the Ukrainian Embassy in DC, long before Trump "picked" him. You are correct about the Kremlin-funded think tanks. And Tucker Carlson hired one of the biggest ones to ever come put of the propoganda ministry. Yes a large web of disinformation indeed.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:10:30 PM EDT
[#40]
12 min translated video.

Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:16:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: lorazepam] [#41]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
10 min video.




Highlight reel.

View Quote

Remember the video a while back that showed the Ukrainian position that was attacked and flanked? This looks like a different view. This part, from the atgm shot to the tank going through the treeline and heads away from the destroyed trench was cut out. I might be crazy, but it sure looks like a different view, and the destruction of the trench was cut out.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:16:58 PM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER:

When the second tank hit the mine you can see a crewman going for the record body-toss...
View Quote



"Orc tossing!?"



CMOS
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:23:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest] [#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By lorazepam:

That looks an awful lot like the T where the Ukrainian "forward position" was. Just a different angle.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By lorazepam:
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
10 min video.




Highlight reel.


That looks an awful lot like the T where the Ukrainian "forward position" was. Just a different angle.


You are correct, it is the same area.








Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:31:12 PM EDT
[#44]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By lorazepam:

Remember the video a while back that showed the Ukrainian position that was attacked and flanked? This looks like a different view. This part, from the atgm shot to the tank going through the treeline and heads away from the destroyed trench was cut out. I mich be crazy, but it sure looks like a different view, and the destruction of the trench was cut out.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By lorazepam:
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
10 min video.




Highlight reel.


Remember the video a while back that showed the Ukrainian position that was attacked and flanked? This looks like a different view. This part, from the atgm shot to the tank going through the treeline and heads away from the destroyed trench was cut out. I mich be crazy, but it sure looks like a different view, and the destruction of the trench was cut out.


You are correct. Wow.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:34:05 PM EDT
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MFP_4073:



you're correct.   many can recall Mitt Romney's comments on Russia during the 2012 Presidential race -- he was basically laughed off the stage for saying Russia was a major threat.   many were sleeping but Romney -- as much as we bash him as a RINO - was prescient.  of course as you say -- our 'sights' were zeroed on GWOT - GWOT - and more GWOT.   24/7 GWOT...

-------------------------------------------------

It’s time to admit it: Mitt Romney was right about Russia

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/22/politics/mitt-romney-russia-ukraine/index.html

Analysis by Chris Cillizza, CNN Editor-at-large    Updated 10:30 AM EST, Sun February 27, 2022

CNN  —

A decade ago, Mitt Romney went on CNN and made a statement that was widely perceived as a major mistake.

“Russia, this is, without question, our number one geopolitical foe,” Romney, who would be the Republican presidential nominee in the 2012 race against President Barack Obama, told Wolf Blitzer in March of that year. “They — they fight every cause for the world’s worst actors.”

Obama and his team pounced on the comment, insisting that it showed Romney was hopelessly out of touch when it came to the threats facing the US.

In the third presidential debate between the two candidates in October 2012, Obama went directly after Romney for that remark. “When you were asked, ‘What’s the biggest geopolitical threat facing America,’ you said ‘Russia.’ Not al Qaeda; you said Russia,” Obama said. “And, the 1980s are now calling to ask for their foreign policy back, because the Cold War’s been over for 20 years.”

The 80s called! Boom! Roasted!

At the time, the attack worked. Obama cast himself as the candidate who understood the current threats – led by al Qaeda. Romney was the candidate still stuck in the Cold War age, a black-and-white figure in a colorful – and complex – world.

But today, after Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered Russian troops into eastern Ukraine, Romney’s comments look very, very different. And by “different,” I mean “right,” as even some Democrats are now acknowledging.

“This action by Putin further confirms that Mitt Romney was right when he called Russia the number one geopolitical foe,” California Democratic Rep. Ted Lieu said on CNN Monday night.

Given that, it’s worth revisiting the context around what Romney said and why.

He was reacting to a hot-mic moment between Obama and then-Russian President Dmitry Medvedev earlier in 2012. In that exchange, Obama told Medvedev: “This is my last election. And after my election, I have more flexibility.”

Republicans were up in arms, insisting that Obama was taking a hard line with Russia publicly while, apparently, making clear to the country’s leader that he was open to compromise.

In his original interview, Blitzer was asking Romney about Russia in the context of that Obama hot-mic moment. And while his comment about Russia as America’s “number one geopolitical foe” is what drew the most attention and derision, it was far from the only comment Romney made about that subject in his interview with Blitzer.

“Russia is not a friendly character on the world stage,” Romney said at one point. “And for this President to be looking for greater flexibility, where he doesn’t have to answer to the American people in his relations with Russia, is very, very troubling, very alarming.”

Pressed by Blitzer on his assertion about the threat posed by Russia, Romney added this:

“Well, I’m saying in terms of a geopolitical opponent, the nation that lines up with the world’s worst actors. Of course, the greatest threat that the world faces is a nuclear Iran. A nuclear North Korea is already troubling enough.

“But when these – these terrible actors pursue their course in the world and we go to the United Nations looking for ways to stop them, when – when Assad, for instance, is murdering his own people, we go – we go to the United Nations, and who is it that always stands up for the world’s worst actors?

“It is always Russia, typically with China alongside.”

What looked like a major flub during the 2012 campaign – and was used as a political cudgel by Obama – now looks very, very different. It should serve as a reminder that history is not written in the moment – and that what something looks like in that moment is not a guarantee of what it will always look like.

---------------------------------------
View Quote

I remember that well. It's truly amazing how we went from FBHO and Klinton "Russian reset" and our domestic commies loving Russia and Putin. They even worked hard to undermine Ukraine, disarming them with vigor and seemingly pushing them towards Russia. Neo-cons like Romney were roundly scoffed and humiliated for even suggesting Russia was in any way a threat. Yet NOW (actually started around 2015/16) they are apoplectic with rage at Russia and see Russians EVERYWHERE.

I am desperate to know exactly when this happened (obviously sometime between 2012 and 2016) and what the exact cause for this dramatic and sudden 180 shift by the demo-commies. I dont think it was the 2014 invasion since they still did everything they could to undermine Ukraine's resistance, sent blankets instead of aid and tried to play off the invasion as some legitimate internal dispute.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:36:23 PM EDT
[#46]
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:37:21 PM EDT
[#47]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By spydercomonkey:
Convicted Killer Freed by Wagner Goes Home and Kills Again
He made headlines just days before the murder, when residents pleaded for help after he drunkenly wandered around with a pitchfork and ax, yelling, "I'll kill everyone."

https://www.thedailybeast.com/convicted-killer-freed-by-wagner-comes-home-from-ukraine-and-kills-again

A convicted killer sentenced to 14 years in a maximum security prison in Russia got the break of his life when the notorious Wagner Group began recruiting inmates for the war against Ukraine last year and now free, he's murdered someone again.

Ivan Rossomakhin, 28, is accused of another murder in his native village in the Kirov region less than three years after he was ordered to spend more than a decade behind bars, MediaZona reports. During that time, he managed to avail himself of Wagner's prison-recruitment scheme, whereby inmates receive a full pardon if they survive six months fighting in Ukraine.

Rossomakhin had reportedly only been back home in the village of Novy Buryets for eight days "on break" when a local resident discovered their mother's dead body. She'd been badly beaten and was found with stab wounds, according to sources cited by Baza.
View Quote
So the orc squanders his freedom and now has to go back on the front?
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:39:48 PM EDT
[#48]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By K0UA:



Yeah, I ventured over there. Yes there are some real idiots at work over their. Can't complain too much though, some of my relatives are real idiots too. Yep, Putin is fighting globohomo, and oppressed Russian speakers, and all of that. Yes, Russian propaganda works.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By K0UA:
Originally Posted By m24shooter:
For any of the crowd that -does- want to get out of the boat for a few laughs, the "Bahkmut Has Fallen!!!!" thread is pants on head, weapons grade pluturdium pro-Russian talking points.



Yeah, I ventured over there. Yes there are some real idiots at work over their. Can't complain too much though, some of my relatives are real idiots too. Yep, Putin is fighting globohomo, and oppressed Russian speakers, and all of that. Yes, Russian propaganda works.


I did venture over there... and wow. I couldn't bare to go through all 10 pages but you can see the progression on the retardedness scale, and its exponential. And of course Russia's MO of just spewing bullshit and not even responding to calls for sources besides whatever turd they decided to drop that day.

Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:43:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: stone-age] [#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 2A373:


What is his YouTube channel?
View Quote


Almost all of his videos are LIVE streams. Click the LIVE button, not the VIDEOS button.

[youtube]@INSIDERUSSIA/streams[/youtube]

[youtube]@INSIDERUSSIA/featured[/youtube]

I don't know why I can't get the link to go hot. It's inside russia.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 2:48:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: doc540] [#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
10 min video.




Highlight reel.

View Quote


In the first vid that tank shot at 7:55 cleared the first bench.

I think it put appendages into the press box.

By 9:26 the muzzle blast was doing as much damage as the shells.
Page / 5592
OFFICIAL Russo-Ukrainian War (Page 3794 of 5592)
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