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Posted: 11/28/2018 10:44:53 AM EDT
[#1]
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. 
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Posted: 11/28/2018 10:47:46 AM EDT
[#2]
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 10:48:44 AM EDT
[#3]
The war on drugs needs a new enemy with legal weed falling by the wayside.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 10:51:57 AM EDT
[#4]
What if there was a fast way to ID worthless people, that not only nudged them into state-legitimized-beating/shooting situations but gave middle-class stick-in-the-muds a moral rationalization for hurting the out-tribers and those attached to them?
Drugs aren't the problem - they're the answer. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 10:52:19 AM EDT
[#5]
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Denver is setting up a "safe" place to inject drugs, with free needles and medical supervision. You want more IV drug users? This is how you get them. 
High Cap Mag  Call SWAT!
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Posted: 11/28/2018 10:54:02 AM EDT
[#6]
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This is what I am talking about. This line of thinking is just absolutely delusional. It blatantly ignores everything we know about human nature and drugs. People like to get fucked up. They always have, they always will. Nothing you do is going to change that. Nothing. This is equatable to a leftist thinking that just a few more gun control laws will somehow magically make criminals not have access to guns anymore. You are using the exact same logic and reasoning as the anti's.....and no matter how many times it's pointed out to you, just like the leftists you stick your fingers in your ear and scream "lalalalalalalala". Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Think of all the money we will save and lives we will change by putting more people in prison. This line of thinking is just absolutely delusional. It blatantly ignores everything we know about human nature and drugs. People like to get fucked up. They always have, they always will. Nothing you do is going to change that. Nothing. This is equatable to a leftist thinking that just a few more gun control laws will somehow magically make criminals not have access to guns anymore. You are using the exact same logic and reasoning as the anti's.....and no matter how many times it's pointed out to you, just like the leftists you stick your fingers in your ear and scream "lalalalalalalala". You think you're smart but overlook all the pain these drugs cause..... and not just for the user. Answer the question. Do you think that making drugs legal will do ANYTHING to curb drug usage ? blah blah blah ..... money spent. How much is spent on medical care for these users? How much is spent in child care/welfare of children the parents abandon , abuse and don't support ? How much does it cost society in crime? How much does it costs in insurance claims for accidents and theft? Your logic sucks. You think decriminalization will curb usage? LOL! Really , you seem to suggest people use drugs to be rebels. If you think legalization will do ANYTHING to help the problems associated with drug abuse you are delusional. All your looking for is the ability to escape penalty of law. ETA : AND, people bitch about " the war on drugs " and what it costs and how ineffective it is. Tell ya what. If the liberals would get on board and REALLY have a war on drugs, the supplies could be all but eliminated in a very short time. But, your pals don't want to build a wall, don't want to enforce our borders. They want no borders , no ICE. You actually are a useful idiot..... big time. You support those who's true mission is to bring the US to it's knees and as long as there are no penalties for your precious drugs, you are on board. A fucked up society dependent on drugs and government handouts is an easy society to control. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 10:59:14 AM EDT
[#7]
I think EDs should be able to refuse to treat drug overdoses in adults.
No narcan, nothing, just let them fucking die. When the safety net is removed, see how many morons are willing to spin the cylinder. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:00:57 AM EDT
[#8]
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One of my drywall contractors for 20 years is now on meth. great finisher made great money. Probably 6 figures a year easy. Just got out of jail for theft or receiving stolen property. was doing heron now meth. Easier to get or cheaper. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:01:15 AM EDT
[#9]
My pain management Dr said that the opiod crisis is just the next bandwagon bullshit. Tiny % of Dr's over prescribe. VA being the biggest offended in past years. Meth and fentinol are the problem drugs and rare that any of those addicts started those because of addiction created by RX.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:06:37 AM EDT
[#10]
The opioid "crisis" never made sense on what I see on the street when working drug and criminal interdiction. I still find Meth 95% of the time. Sure, more people die on the front end but the health issues that the meth users have on the back end will kill them soon enough.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:07:23 AM EDT
[#11]
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I think EDs should be able to refuse to treat drug overdoses in adults. No narcan, nothing, just let them fucking die. When the safety net is removed, see how many morons are willing to spin the cylinder. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:09:14 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This right here. The county drug guys went from two meth labs in 5 years, both the same guy, to 6 in the first half of 2018. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted:
cracking down on pain meds and pill mills did not cure the addicts ,they just use an alternative drug. The county drug guys went from two meth labs in 5 years, both the same guy, to 6 in the first half of 2018. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:18:15 AM EDT
[#13]
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Yeah, that's why there were no heroin or opium addicts before narcan was introduced. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think EDs should be able to refuse to treat drug overdoses in adults. No narcan, nothing, just let them fucking die. When the safety net is removed, see how many morons are willing to spin the cylinder. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:19:34 AM EDT
[#14]
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:21:25 AM EDT
[#15]
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This isn't your grand dads junk on the street today. Narcan saves plenty of lives. The junk today is way more powerful and different than years ago. It's way easy to OD today and many users do. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think EDs should be able to refuse to treat drug overdoses in adults. No narcan, nothing, just let them fucking die. When the safety net is removed, see how many morons are willing to spin the cylinder. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:22:29 AM EDT
[#16]
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Yep. My sister started her addiction problems with prescription drugs, when she could not get those anymore she start meth Quote HistoryQuoted:
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cracking down on pain meds and pill mills did not cure the addicts ,they just use an alternative drug. The county drug guys went from two meth labs in 5 years, both the same guy, to 6 in the first half of 2018. Or did the doc prescribe something else and she switched to meth because she likes to get high and meth is cheap and available? |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:23:55 AM EDT
[#17]
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Think of all the medical expenses (including ambulance crews and ER costs as well as in-hospital care), personal security costs (such as security cameras) and other expenses we could avoid, and think how much more freedom of movement WE would have if we didn't allow But folks who use drugs are the only people who don't understand how drug use harms others. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:23:58 AM EDT
[#18]
Seems like a guaranteed destroyer of lives. Not sure how any smart person would ever try that shit.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:29:19 AM EDT
[#19]
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People we're ODing before Narcan too. The threat of ODing doesn't stop junkies from shooting up, and it doesn't stop people from becoming opioid addicts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think EDs should be able to refuse to treat drug overdoses in adults. No narcan, nothing, just let them fucking die. When the safety net is removed, see how many morons are willing to spin the cylinder. Narcan is credited with reversing more than 10,000 overdoses from 1996 to 2010, according to the Centers for Disease Control. But while recovering addicts like Goyer praise the drug’s effectiveness, there are concerns that drug abusers are viewing it as a safety net. Police officers, who are often the first responders to an overdose, see a blurring of the line between saving a life and enabling an addiction. Some police and policy experts say that the combination of cheap, potent heroin, lack of treatment options, and Narcan’s availability has allowed addicts to push their drug use over the edge. But without long-term treatment options, they say, Narcan allows the addiction cycle to continue. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:29:57 AM EDT
[#20]
My BiL it's an opioid addict. Because of new guidelines he can't get all he wants. He is snoring meth now. You would think it would kill you pretty fast if you did this.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:32:31 AM EDT
[#21]
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I'm no expert on drug usage but I thought users usually had a drug of choice. Was your sister prescribed meth by a doctor and when he did not provide it anymore she started buying it on the street? Or did the doc prescribe something else and she switched to meth because she likes to get high and meth is cheap and available? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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cracking down on pain meds and pill mills did not cure the addicts ,they just use an alternative drug. The county drug guys went from two meth labs in 5 years, both the same guy, to 6 in the first half of 2018. Or did the doc prescribe something else and she switched to meth because she likes to get high and meth is cheap and available? started in high school stealing presrip stuff from friends parents etc etc, many years later that supply is gone and shes onto meth. Addicts don't think like you or I |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:33:12 AM EDT
[#22]
So it looks like there was a 78% increase in the cost of treating meth-induced health issues, but it should be noted that US healthcare costs increased by 40% for that same 12 year period.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:34:32 AM EDT
[#23]
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https://www.themarshallproject.org/2015/08/14/narcan-it-saves-lives-does-it-enable-addicts Narcan is credited with reversing more than 10,000 overdoses from 1996 to 2010, according to the Centers for Disease Control. But while recovering addicts like Goyer praise the drug’s effectiveness, there are concerns that drug abusers are viewing it as a safety net. Police officers, who are often the first responders to an overdose, see a blurring of the line between saving a life and enabling an addiction. Some police and policy experts say that the combination of cheap, potent heroin, lack of treatment options, and Narcan’s availability has allowed addicts to push their drug use over the edge. But without long-term treatment options, they say, Narcan allows the addiction cycle to continue. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think EDs should be able to refuse to treat drug overdoses in adults. No narcan, nothing, just let them fucking die. When the safety net is removed, see how many morons are willing to spin the cylinder. Narcan is credited with reversing more than 10,000 overdoses from 1996 to 2010, according to the Centers for Disease Control. But while recovering addicts like Goyer praise the drug’s effectiveness, there are concerns that drug abusers are viewing it as a safety net. Police officers, who are often the first responders to an overdose, see a blurring of the line between saving a life and enabling an addiction. Some police and policy experts say that the combination of cheap, potent heroin, lack of treatment options, and Narcan’s availability has allowed addicts to push their drug use over the edge. But without long-term treatment options, they say, Narcan allows the addiction cycle to continue. How many junkies would not be junkies if Narcan didn't exist? What percentage of people would stop being junkies if they took Narcan off the market? |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:35:49 AM EDT
[#24]
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Addiction started in high school stealing presrip stuff from friends parents etc etc, many years later that supply is gone and shes onto meth. Addicts don't think like you or I Quote HistoryQuoted:
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cracking down on pain meds and pill mills did not cure the addicts ,they just use an alternative drug. The county drug guys went from two meth labs in 5 years, both the same guy, to 6 in the first half of 2018. Or did the doc prescribe something else and she switched to meth because she likes to get high and meth is cheap and available? started in high school stealing presrip stuff from friends parents etc etc, many years later that supply is gone and shes onto meth. Addicts don't think like you or I |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:38:02 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Copy of Seattle's program. What a great idea.
High Cap Mag Call SWAT! |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:38:10 AM EDT
[#26]
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Sorry man. Waiting for the freedom/victimless crime/legalization crowd to show up. These single swinging dicks can't look past their noses to see how these drugs don't just effect the user but a long chain of people..... for just about every user. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. Waiting for the freedom/victimless crime/legalization crowd to show up. These single swinging dicks can't look past their noses to see how these drugs don't just effect the user but a long chain of people..... for just about every user. The children... 
Why, we should declare war on this problem! That's it; we could have a WAR on drugs. That'd show 'em!! 
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:38:53 AM EDT
[#27]
I sometimes wonder if opioids made the press not due to actual statistical representation, but because of the state's need to pressure big pharma to reduce prices to make the ACA successful. The timing and the ramp of the "epidemic" seem a little cooked.
I am not denying that there is indeed a big problem with opioids and it is a serious issue impacting tens of thousands of families, but opioids suddenly grabbed all the press while the sheer volume and incidents of crime was still behind meth. Between meth and pharmaceutical opioids we have one which is difficult to control and does not have a deep pockets bad guy to sue that fit the political narrative, and it conveniently fell off the front page. Of course, it could also just have been the typical press rule of "1 bad guy at a time". Maybe tales of multiple problems at a time are just too much for people to handle. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:39:31 AM EDT
[#28]
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Think of all the money we will save and lives we will change by putting more people in work camps. Atleast then they can still live fufilling lives and not be intermingled with the general population 
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:40:47 AM EDT
[#29]
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. Yeah, she was a good one.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:44:28 AM EDT
[#30]
there's the illegal cartels and the government protected cartels
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:46:11 AM EDT
[#31]
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Not to mention how rapid the negative affects are too. Smoking tobacco is bad for you but people don't really see and feel it for decades sometimes so I understand it. But meth use starts physically wreck shit in days to weeks. Often yeah you'd be right, it's obvious when they become meth monkeys but all I'm saying is the amount of casual or occasional use would surprise you. Not everyone has the same addiction response. Office workers, truckers, HVAC techs to rodeo workers and even some god damn nurses and social workers. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: And I don't get it. There can't be anyone left that doesn't know that meth is horrifically bad. You would have to literally point a gun at my head to even get me thinking about trying a substance like that. The irony being that many meth user end up with guns pointed at their heads because they are on meth and committing a crime. Quoted: IME users make themselves pretty obvious eventually. Meth is a death spiral of addiction, homelessness, violence and self destruction. Based on the people I have seen throw their lives away because of meth, it alters your brain chemistry almost to the point where it makes once a tweeker always a tweeker. Shit also makes you look like a fucking zombie. My town is infested with fucking tweekers. Cant' say that I have met a casual tweeker, eventually it becomes your very reason to exist. Not saying they don't exist because I know a crapton of high functioning pot smokers and drinkers but I can't say that I have ever met a casual yet regular meth user. I have known a few "former" addicts, many of them have issues that will haunt them for the rest of their lives. For clarification, I am talking about street methamphetamine users, not people who used prescription stimulants. Meth is one of those things that I have a personal, deep seeded hatred for. I have seen firsthand the destruction caused by it. Several of my high school friends went down that dark path and it didn't end well for any of them. I feel for you on here that are dealing with the impact of it taking hold in your family (those raising their grandkids because their kids got hooked). It was bad enough watching very close friends spiral, trying to help before finally having to sever ties to protect myself from the scum and criminality that comes along with it. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:47:04 AM EDT
[#32]
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So cost, potency, treatment availability, and Narcan were all cited, but getting rid of Narcan is what will solve the problem that existed before Narcan? Just some of it. Not all of it. BUT, let's get something straight ok? Don't act like the problem is the same today as it was 10,20,30 ...... years ago. Yes, we have always had addicts but not at the level we have today . The problem today is vastly different in the number of users , the potency of the drug , the costs to society, the costs to family , etc. Why is that? It wouldn't have ANYTHING to do with the higher availability, more social acceptance , more social safety nets, more lax laws , etc. would it ? How did we get here? The war on drugs ? I don't buy that. Must be something else. How many junkies would not be junkies if Narcan didn't exist? Those that would die ...... not sure how many that would be but probably a significant number. What percentage of people would stop being junkies if they took Narcan off the market? Same answer as above. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I think EDs should be able to refuse to treat drug overdoses in adults. No narcan, nothing, just let them fucking die. When the safety net is removed, see how many morons are willing to spin the cylinder. Narcan is credited with reversing more than 10,000 overdoses from 1996 to 2010, according to the Centers for Disease Control. But while recovering addicts like Goyer praise the drug’s effectiveness, there are concerns that drug abusers are viewing it as a safety net. Police officers, who are often the first responders to an overdose, see a blurring of the line between saving a life and enabling an addiction. Some police and policy experts say that the combination of cheap, potent heroin, lack of treatment options, and Narcan’s availability has allowed addicts to push their drug use over the edge. But without long-term treatment options, they say, Narcan allows the addiction cycle to continue. Just some of it. Not all of it. BUT, let's get something straight ok? Don't act like the problem is the same today as it was 10,20,30 ...... years ago. Yes, we have always had addicts but not at the level we have today . The problem today is vastly different in the number of users , the potency of the drug , the costs to society, the costs to family , etc. Why is that? It wouldn't have ANYTHING to do with the higher availability, more social acceptance , more social safety nets, more lax laws , etc. would it ? How did we get here? The war on drugs ? I don't buy that. Must be something else. How many junkies would not be junkies if Narcan didn't exist? Those that would die ...... not sure how many that would be but probably a significant number. What percentage of people would stop being junkies if they took Narcan off the market? Same answer as above. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:48:42 AM EDT
[#33]
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Seems like a guaranteed destroyer of lives. Not sure how any smart person would ever try that shit. one guy that worked for me was prca saddlebronk rookie of the year. he said he got started during that time because you have to make a lot of shows to make any money.he talked about staying up for 30 days at a time, then sleeping for 4 days, then going again. he said there's lots of stuff that goes on behind the chutes. another woman i knew was married to an eye surgeon. she got on the Jenny Crank diet, wound up losing her husband, got her daughter on the shit, lost it all. once, when she got out of jail, a guy that worked for me that was also a tweaker picked her up from jail. they were on their way somewhere and she was going through her mail that he'd been picking up from her house. there was a settlement check from her ex-husband for $$$$$. they managed to go through it in a few days.iirc, she had some 30k nights at the cherokee casino in tulsa. one thing i've heard from multiple leos and tweakers is the attraction of meth. they say the first time you stick yourself, if feels like having 10 orgasms at once. you spend the rest of your time chasing that initial feeling, but you can never quite get there. i have lots of tweaker stories. i've been on the BOD for a non-profit rehab for years. one of our programs is a six month in/out patient where they are in patient for 30 days and for the next 150 days they live at the facility and work to pay room and board. i employed several of our consumers while they were during this phase and got to hear lots of stories. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:52:36 AM EDT
[#34]
(Comes now the folks who will say, "The solution is to legalize meth and opioids." That would be fine if non-drug users didn't have to deal with and pay for the medical care of drug users---not to mention dealing with the threat of theft and robbery to support their habit.)
do you think we don't pay for it already? making it legal and easily available should cut theft/crime |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:52:38 AM EDT
[#35]
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Think of how many children are affected. The children...
Why, we should declare war on this problem! That's it; we could have a WAR on drugs. That'd show 'em!! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. Waiting for the freedom/victimless crime/legalization crowd to show up. These single swinging dicks can't look past their noses to see how these drugs don't just effect the user but a long chain of people..... for just about every user. The children...
Why, we should declare war on this problem! That's it; we could have a WAR on drugs. That'd show 'em!! ETA: oh and the children ? You mean like the baby that got eaten alive by maggots while wearing a shitty diaper for 9 days, got a blood infection and died a horrible death? You mean children like that? Something similar happened in my home town not long ago with a bunch of other shit. These the children you talking about? Mr. Edgy? Meh, who cares right? just take the penalties off muh drugs!!!! |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:54:17 AM EDT
[#36]
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I may be tired and a little off but ....... WTF are you talking about? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. Waiting for the freedom/victimless crime/legalization crowd to show up. These single swinging dicks can't look past their noses to see how these drugs don't just effect the user but a long chain of people..... for just about every user. It's like trying to argue with a liberal about gun control....no matter how many facts are presented, you will respond with same bullshit. I don't get why any of you are upset....these are your policies causing all of these problems. This is exactly what you want and exactly what the never ending WoD looks like, has always looked like, and will always look like. Hopefully we can import some of these Mexican Cartels to the US and get them operating properly here....that would be like a wet dream to you guys, eh? Would you support a new prohibition law? Should we round up anyone caught sneaking a pull of booze and throw them in prison? I mean, alcohol ruins just as many lives as dope. So using your WoD logic, why wouldn't you support returning to the age of violent criminal organizations controlling the alcohol industry instead of these legal corporations like Budweiser? You obviously think it's preferable to have violent drug dealers and cartels running the drug industry instead of a legalized system of corporations, so why shouldn't we return to the age of Al Capone for alcohol? But drugs are different....because your little feels said so. If you support the WoD (which you obviously do), then things are going exactly as they should. You support maintaining the status quo...which is massive drug cartels, violence, and illegals streaming across our border every day....all caused by the WoD. More laws, more gov, more taxes, more civil liberties stripped in the name of "safety" and the WoD. This is what the WoD has looked like since day one. 40 years, thousands of new laws, millions in jail, and trillions of dollars later....here we are. In the exact same place with the exact same problems. It's insanity and your entire argument is rooted in liberal logic. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 11:58:47 AM EDT
[#37]
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It's not the government's job to rehabilitate addicts. They should be locked away if they can't get control of themselves. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:00:08 PM EDT
[#38]
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Which part didn't you understand? As usual, you drug warriors are incapable of understanding exactly how these WoD policies actually affect real world black markets. How many bootlegging gangs are we fighting on a daily basis? Oh that's right....none. Ending prohibition eliminated the entire black market for alcohol and with it, the violent gangs that ran it. Would you support a new prohibition law? Should we round up anyone caught sneaking a pull of booze and throw them in prison? I mean, alcohol ruins just as many lives as dope. So using your WoD logic, why wouldn't you support returning to the age of violent criminal organizations controlling the alcohol industry instead of these legal corporations like Budweiser? You obviously think it's preferable to have violent drug dealers and cartels running the drug industry instead of a legalized system of corporations, so why shouldn't we return to the age of Al Capone for alcohol? But drugs are different....because your little feels said so. If you support the WoD (which you obviously do), then things are going exactly as they should. You support maintaining the status quo...which is massive drug cartels, violence, and illegals streaming across our border every day....all caused by the WoD. More laws, more gov, more taxes, more civil liberties stripped in the name of "safety" and the WoD. This is what the WoD has looked like since day one. 40 years, thousands of new laws, millions in jail, and trillions of dollars later....here we are. In the exact same place with the exact same problems. It's insanity and your entire argument is rooted in liberal logic. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And who raises the dopeheads kids??? In MANY cases it's the grandparents. If you ask 10 random people if they know of someone who's raising grandkids because the youngster's parent/ parents are dope addicts I'd wager a case of good beer that AT LEAST 60% will answer in the affirmative My wife (66 years old ) and myself (73 years old ) are raising our 4 year old granddaughter for that precise reason.......and I suspect there are many,many thousands of folks like us who will do whatever it takes to keep an innocent baby out of foster homes and adoption rackets. Waiting for the freedom/victimless crime/legalization crowd to show up. These single swinging dicks can't look past their noses to see how these drugs don't just effect the user but a long chain of people..... for just about every user. It's like trying to argue with a liberal about gun control....no matter how many facts are presented, you will respond with same bullshit. I don't get why any of you are upset....these are your policies causing all of these problems. This is exactly what you want and exactly what the never ending WoD looks like, has always looked like, and will always look like. Hopefully we can import some of these Mexican Cartels to the US and get them operating properly here....that would be like a wet dream to you guys, eh? Would you support a new prohibition law? Should we round up anyone caught sneaking a pull of booze and throw them in prison? I mean, alcohol ruins just as many lives as dope. So using your WoD logic, why wouldn't you support returning to the age of violent criminal organizations controlling the alcohol industry instead of these legal corporations like Budweiser? You obviously think it's preferable to have violent drug dealers and cartels running the drug industry instead of a legalized system of corporations, so why shouldn't we return to the age of Al Capone for alcohol? But drugs are different....because your little feels said so. If you support the WoD (which you obviously do), then things are going exactly as they should. You support maintaining the status quo...which is massive drug cartels, violence, and illegals streaming across our border every day....all caused by the WoD. More laws, more gov, more taxes, more civil liberties stripped in the name of "safety" and the WoD. This is what the WoD has looked like since day one. 40 years, thousands of new laws, millions in jail, and trillions of dollars later....here we are. In the exact same place with the exact same problems. It's insanity and your entire argument is rooted in liberal logic. You are a useful idiot to blind to see the game. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:02:32 PM EDT
[#39]
Natural selection.
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:05:06 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Are you arguing that decriminalizing meth will make the situation better? That, were it legal, the addicts would disappear? That people are only interested in meth because of its illicit nature? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: You drug warriors and your liberal logic just crack me up. It's like trying to argue with a liberal about gun control....no matter how many facts are presented, you will respond with same bullshit. I don't get why any of you are upset....these are your policies causing all of these problems. This is exactly what you want and exactly what the never ending WoD looks like, has always looked like, and will always look like. Hopefully we can import some of these Mexican Cartels to the US and get them operating properly here....that would be like a wet dream to you guys, eh? We will always have addicts. People will do drugs no matter what. Legal, illegal, it doesn't matter. They aren't going to disappear no matter what we do. Legalizing drugs has nothing to do with "eliminating addicts". What legalization would do is destroy the massive black market that is controlled by violent drug dealers and cartels. Instead of El Chapo, you get Budweiser. If you can't see the benefits to that, I don't know what to tell you. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:05:07 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Think of all the money we will save and lives we will change by putting more people in prison. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It's not the government's job to rehabilitate addicts. They should be locked away if they can't get control of themselves. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:05:40 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Which part didn't you understand? As usual, you drug warriors are incapable of understanding exactly how these WoD policies actually affect real world black markets. How many bootlegging gangs are we fighting on a daily basis? Oh that's right....none. Ending prohibition eliminated the entire black market for alcohol and with it, the violent gangs that ran it. Would you support a new prohibition law? Should we round up anyone caught sneaking a pull of booze and throw them in prison? I mean, alcohol ruins just as many lives as dope. So using your WoD logic, why wouldn't you support returning to the age of violent criminal organizations controlling the alcohol industry instead of these legal corporations like Budweiser? You obviously think it's preferable to have violent drug dealers and cartels running the drug industry instead of a legalized system of corporations, so why shouldn't we return to the age of Al Capone for alcohol? But drugs are different....because your little feels said so. If you support the WoD (which you obviously do), then things are going exactly as they should. You support maintaining the status quo...which is massive drug cartels, violence, and illegals streaming across our border every day....all caused by the WoD. More laws, more gov, more taxes, more civil liberties stripped in the name of "safety" and the WoD. This is what the WoD has looked like since day one. 40 years, thousands of new laws, millions in jail, and trillions of dollars later....here we are. In the exact same place with the exact same problems. It's insanity and your entire argument is rooted in liberal logic. You cannot solve some problems, especially not human vice behavior. You can make dirty, filthy, socially unacceptable behavior illegal and thereby drive the people doing it underground so that taxpaying productive folks don't have to see them, smell them, or step over their filthy, lice ridden, abscess covered, meth smoking pseudo-corpse on their way to work. If you think meth should be legal you are an absolute psycho who has never dealt with a meth overdose/excited delirium patient, end of story. It's a substance that is 100% guaranteed to induce full on stark raving, dog raping, cut your own face off psychosis, sooner or later. I bet your only experience with the "war on drugs" comes from getting busted for your pot stash in 11th grade, and now you're sticking it to the man by being soooo edgy and demanding legal, corporate branded meth. People that sell meth should be hanged and meth users should be locked up in an asylum. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:05:50 PM EDT
[#43]
Here is a good read on opium in China. It shows just how far drug use can go in a country:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_opium_in_China I was told in World History class that the way China eliminated opium dens was they sent police or military into the dens and shot everybody in the head. That would surely put a damper on it. It would be kind of like hunting over a baited field. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:08:11 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Legalizing drugs has nothing to do with "eliminating addicts". What legalization would do is destroy the massive black market that is controlled by violent drug dealers and cartels. Instead of El Chapo, you get Budweiser. If you can't see the benefits to that, I don't know what to tell you. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:08:21 PM EDT
[#45]
If the impact of the war on drugs to date is:
Increased potency; Increased supply; Increased number of users; and Lowered cost per dose Then, we almost have to conclude that the WoD has failed. There is essentially no other conclusion to draw from that data. Sure, one can dispute the data, but taking the data at face value, the only conclusion is failure. Complete failure. Meth and Rx speed are basically the same. Meth more rapidly crosses the blood brain barrier. So, it produces a bit more of a "rush." Otherwise, they are basically the same. (Long story made short). |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:09:24 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lol I have no idea how you could read that and come to that conclusion. We will always have addicts. People will do drugs no matter what. Legal, illegal, it doesn't matter. They aren't going to disappear no matter what we do. Legalizing drugs has nothing to do with "eliminating addicts". What legalization would do is destroy the massive black market that is controlled by violent drug dealers and cartels. Instead of El Chapo, you get Budweiser. If you can't see the benefits to that, I don't know what to tell you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: You drug warriors and your liberal logic just crack me up. It's like trying to argue with a liberal about gun control....no matter how many facts are presented, you will respond with same bullshit. I don't get why any of you are upset....these are your policies causing all of these problems. This is exactly what you want and exactly what the never ending WoD looks like, has always looked like, and will always look like. Hopefully we can import some of these Mexican Cartels to the US and get them operating properly here....that would be like a wet dream to you guys, eh? We will always have addicts. People will do drugs no matter what. Legal, illegal, it doesn't matter. They aren't going to disappear no matter what we do. Legalizing drugs has nothing to do with "eliminating addicts". What legalization would do is destroy the massive black market that is controlled by violent drug dealers and cartels. Instead of El Chapo, you get Budweiser. If you can't see the benefits to that, I don't know what to tell you. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:09:33 PM EDT
[#47]
The meth I'm seeing lately is not being made locally. Sure there are still a few self-styled Heisenbergs but for the most part they just buy it now. It's coming in along the same smuggling routes as the heroin and most of the weed. The problem with weed is that it helps develop profitable smuggling routes that help introduce other products to the market.
As far as I'm concerned the possession of a pound or less of smokable weed that you've grown yourself should be no crime. I'm not talking about counting roots, stems, and spleef leaves in the weight count. Just count the bud. Much like making beer or wine at home it should be totally unregulated as long as you don't cross the threshold into production for sale. Pot is easy to grow indoors and anyone who wants it can easily set up everything they need except the seed. Seed in limited quantities should be available at liquor stores just like any other legal intoxicant. That's as far as I'm willing to go on the War On Drugs these days. That would really put the hammer on the traffickers because suburban and middle class urban buyers put a lot of cash into the revenue stream of the drug trade. Give pot smokers a way to break contact with the criminals and most of them will do it in a heartbeat. Then we build the border wall. That will force the smugglers to work a bit harder. And make possession of any opiate not obtained by prescription punishable by 5, 10, 20, and then 30 lashes with a bull whip. After you reach the 30 lash level you just go to prison for 25 years. |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:11:04 PM EDT
[#48]
Quoted:
(Comes now the folks who will say, "The solution is to legalize meth and opioids." That would be fine if non-drug users didn't have to deal with and pay for the medical care of drug users---not to mention dealing with the threat of theft and robbery to support their habit.) |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:11:28 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: All you are concerned about is the penalty of law. That's it. You and your kind want to be able to buy , sell, use You think you're smart but overlook all the pain these Answer the question. Do you think that making blah blah blah ..... money spent. How much is spent on medical care for these users? How much is spent in child care/welfare of children the parents abandon , abuse and don't support ? How much does it cost society in crime? How much does it costs in insurance claims for accidents and theft? Your logic sucks. You think decriminalization will curb usage? LOL! Really , you seem to suggest people use drugs to be rebels. If you think legalization will do ANYTHING to help the problems associated with ETA : AND, people bitch about " the war on drugs " and what it costs and how ineffective it is. Tell ya what. If the liberals would get on board and REALLY have a war on But, your pals don't want to build a wall, don't want to enforce our borders. They want no borders , no ICE. You actually are a useful idiot..... big time. You support those who's true mission is to bring the US to it's knees and as long as there are no penalties for your precious A fucked up society dependent on |
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Posted: 11/28/2018 12:13:34 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If the impact of the war on drugs to date is: Increased potency; Increased supply; Increased number of users; and Lowered cost per dose Then, we almost have to conclude that the WoD has failed. There is essentially no other conclusion to draw from that data. Sure, one can dispute the data, but taking the data at face value, the only conclusion is failure. Complete failure. Meth and Rx speed are basically the same. Meth more rapidly crosses the blood brain barrier. So, it produces a bit more of a "rush." Otherwise, they are basically the same. (Long story made short). |
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