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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:40:00 AM EDT
[#1]
I've had both. Bought a MkIII for a (now ex) girlfriend, which meant I was the one cleaning it and working on it. The goddamn thing was a jam-o-matic pain in the ass with a mediocre trigger. I ended up putting a bunch of Volquartsen (sp?) parts in it to resolve the jamming, which helped but I don't think completely cured it. Fussy about ammo too. Another person shooting on the same pistol team at the time bought a MkIII and it was constantly jamming too. Not sure what steps they took, but they ended up getting rid of it after trying for 2 years to resolve the issues. While it is nice to read that some people get Rugers that run well, it appears that there is an element of luck involved, as the two I had contact with were not good.
My Buckmark, on the other hand, has been fantastic in 10 years of shooting in a bullseye league, including 2 years ago when I and my team mates took the state championship.  Excellent ergonomics, sweet trigger, easy to strip and clean, not fussy about anything.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:40:09 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You are correct, sir. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The correct answer is a Ruger MK II not the MKIII or Buckmark. You are correct, sir. Yep. I own four MkIIs and one Buckmark. I have NO interest in a MkIII. The only MkIII-ish pistol I have is a MkIII 22/45 frame but with a MkII 22/45 threaded upper (THAT I like). The Rugers are all KMK512 or MK512 variants, and the Buckmark is a 5.5 Target. I like the heft of the Rugers and the ergos of the Buckmark. Both shoot better than I can. The Browning feels more refined but I don't like the aluminum aspect and the screw. It feels "fragile" to me. Takedown and assembly of the Ruger isn't nearly as bad as people say, and I like the parts availability/cost factor of the Rugers.
Find a nice MkII. Get both. Enjoy. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:41:14 AM EDT
[#3]
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:48:16 AM EDT
[#4]
I have 2 Rugers, so I'd get the Browning! Always wanted one and Browning makes good weapons. You can never have too many .22's.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:49:18 AM EDT
[#5]
i have a MkIII. a buddy has a Buckmark. the Buckmark is easier to shoot, easier to shoot well, easier to strip, easier to clean, and a lot easier to reassemble. i am all set to ditch my MkIII for a Buckmark. ar-jedi |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:50:00 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
People who can't figure out how to disassemble and re-assemble a Ruger 22 are people who have trouble figuring out how to change a flat tire, or who get confused when detail stripping a 1911. And votes liberal, wears one piece pajamas, is a pothead, and visits gay bathhouses? 
I've never met anyone who will not admit that the Ruger .22 isn't the worst pistol or rifle to strip . Worst design ever. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:52:37 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And votes liberal, wears one piece pajamas, is a pothead, and visits gay bathhouses?
I've never met anyone who will not admit that the Ruger .22 isn't the worst pistol or rifle to strip . Worst design ever. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
People who can't figure out how to disassemble and re-assemble a Ruger 22 are people who have trouble figuring out how to change a flat tire, or who get confused when detail stripping a 1911. And votes liberal, wears one piece pajamas, is a pothead, and visits gay bathhouses?
I've never met anyone who will not admit that the Ruger .22 isn't the worst pistol or rifle to strip . Worst design ever. Its not that hard...it really isn't... Is it harder than it should be ? Probably...but anyone who has trouble doing it after the 2nd or 3rd time is probably slightly potato. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:53:12 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll bet poster Mak had an older MKI or MKII. My older ones also run OK in the cold but I have not tested them quite that cold.  My guess is that the guys having trouble with them running in the cold have MKIII's with the loaded chamber indicator. The LCI grabs the case rim on the left and the extractor grabs it on the right. They kind of have a tug of war over the brass when it's on its way out of the chamber and sideways stove pipes and fails to feed can result. My MKIII 22/45 did that malfunction about once every mag, getting rid of the LCI stopped that from ever happening again. Some guns have extreme trouble with this, others don't.
Another poster said that the MKII's can bring as much $$$ as a new MKIII and he is correct. Ruger was at the top of their 22 pistol game with the MKII. You can make the MKIII just as good, just get rid of the LCI and put a hammer bushing in it. Tandemkross is one outfit that sells the stuff that will "fix" your MKIII. Cheers and happy shooting. ETA: When you disable the mag disco on the MKIII the mags will drop free when you push the button. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
....I used to use the Rugers for rabbit hunting in South Dakota in the late 80's early 90's. I could take a limit of rabbits shooting them on the run. Accurate and fun. Never had an issue with them functioning. To the person that says they won't function in the cold? I've hunted with them in -20 degree weather in the winter and never had an issue.... I'll bet poster Mak had an older MKI or MKII. My older ones also run OK in the cold but I have not tested them quite that cold. My guess is that the guys having trouble with them running in the cold have MKIII's with the loaded chamber indicator. The LCI grabs the case rim on the left and the extractor grabs it on the right. They kind of have a tug of war over the brass when it's on its way out of the chamber and sideways stove pipes and fails to feed can result. My MKIII 22/45 did that malfunction about once every mag, getting rid of the LCI stopped that from ever happening again. Some guns have extreme trouble with this, others don't.
Another poster said that the MKII's can bring as much $$$ as a new MKIII and he is correct. Ruger was at the top of their 22 pistol game with the MKII. You can make the MKIII just as good, just get rid of the LCI and put a hammer bushing in it. Tandemkross is one outfit that sells the stuff that will "fix" your MKIII. Cheers and happy shooting. ETA: When you disable the mag disco on the MKIII the mags will drop free when you push the button. Although my MKIII's function just fine... went ahead and ordered a few LCI and mag disconnect kits from Tandemkross. The LCI kit is a nice replacement for fit/finish compared to the damn fugly Lawyer indicator bar. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:53:30 AM EDT
[#9]
 at all the people whining about MKIII disassembly.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:57:59 AM EDT
[#10]
Get the Ruger MK II
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:58:00 AM EDT
[#11]
I love my Ruger Mark III.
Note that there is a big difference between the Mark III and the 22/45. The 22/45 is a cheap plastic pistol. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 5:58:13 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Its not that hard...it really isn't... Is it harder than it should be ? Probably...but anyone who has trouble doing it after the 2nd or 3rd time is probably slightly potato. Not impossible - but of the ~30 or so firearm designs it's the worst. By a large margin. 
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Posted: 1/18/2014 6:00:28 AM EDT
[#13]
Buckmark all day long. They have good triggers that can be made awesome in 5 minutes doing the Heggis flip.
Heggis Flip |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 6:04:27 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And votes liberal, wears one piece pajamas, is a pothead, and visits gay bathhouses?
I've never met anyone who will not admit that the Ruger .22 isn't the worst pistol or rifle to strip . Worst design ever. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
People who can't figure out how to disassemble and re-assemble a Ruger 22 are people who have trouble figuring out how to change a flat tire, or who get confused when detail stripping a 1911. And votes liberal, wears one piece pajamas, is a pothead, and visits gay bathhouses?
I've never met anyone who will not admit that the Ruger .22 isn't the worst pistol or rifle to strip . Worst design ever. Damn...there are a lot of pajama wearers on this board. 
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Posted: 1/18/2014 6:56:14 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Don't buy the "don't disassemble the ruger!" bullshit. People who can't figure out how to disassemble and re-assemble a Ruger 22 are people who have trouble figuring out how to change a flat tire, or who get confused when detail stripping a 1911. . I've rebuilt engines, transfercases, turbochargers and differentials, the Ruger is a pain in the fucking ass 
And detail stripping a 1911 is shockingly easy. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:14:08 AM EDT
[#16]
I am curious as to why everyone is finding it so hard to strip the MKIII? I will agree it is confusing at first, but once you do a couple times and understand how it works, it is very easy.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:20:17 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: at all the people whining about MKIII disassembly.Yep. It requires very close concentration for approximately two to three seconds at a specific point in the process. That seems to be beyond many, unfortunately. Oh well, it keeps the prices reasonable for what is likely the best pistol configuration out there. I like the MKII more, but only on principle of the lawyer fucked loaded chamber indicator cut into the frame on the MKIII models. They're fine machines as well. Just because, 'merica, fuck yea!  |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:22:01 AM EDT
[#18]
I can say nothing bad about the Browning, I like them, but look around for one of these MKII's....it is the most accurate handgun I own.
EDIT- The guys saying that Rugers are tough to strip aint lying....but they are NOT junk. Saying it's a KIA compared to a BMW is complete horse shit. I actually think the Browning feels a little "cheaper" in the hand. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:22:26 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh good. Thanks. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Buckmark. But both are excellent. Eta- what's with the rip fiver option? Something happen? No, Fiver is fine. Just a parody thread started last night. That someone got the ban hammer for. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:22:28 AM EDT
[#20]
Neither, M&P22 FTW
ETA- Bring on the hate. Zero fucks given. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:34:40 AM EDT
[#21]
I have 2 x Buckmark Lite 5.5 (Green and Gray) and the Buckmark Sporter Rifle.
I love these guns, the Buckmark just felt better in my hand. I usually put a box of 375 or 525 through one of my Buckmarks every time I go shooting. They shoot a lot better than I do. 
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:42:14 AM EDT
[#22]
Ruger MKII 22/45 is best Ruger
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:53:45 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And votes liberal, wears one piece pajamas, is a pothead, and visits gay bathhouses?
I've never met anyone who will not admit that the Ruger .22 isn't the worst pistol or rifle to strip . Worst design ever. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
People who can't figure out how to disassemble and re-assemble a Ruger 22 are people who have trouble figuring out how to change a flat tire, or who get confused when detail stripping a 1911. And votes liberal, wears one piece pajamas, is a pothead, and visits gay bathhouses?
I've never met anyone who will not admit that the Ruger .22 isn't the worst pistol or rifle to strip . Worst design ever. So the pistol that Ruger was founded around and has been around for 65 years is the worst design in history? 
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Posted: 1/18/2014 7:56:40 AM EDT
[#24]
I love my buckmark. I voted buckmark, but there are several problems to be aware of:
1) I had the screws that hold the rear sight base onto the frame (and keep the slide on the frame) work loose during firing. This can be resolved by some locktite and making sure these screws are tight, but.... 2) Because of (1) I have now stripped the screws. (3) Furthermore, to remove the barrel, you need a long allen key (of a different size than the one required to remove the slide and sight base), or a short one and a lot of patience. Browning now recommends not disassembling (I.E., 1,2,3). When things get less crazy with work, I am thinking of switching everything to torx, if I can find the right screws. The ergonomics are great, the gun is accurate and intensely fun to shoot, but it seems that either the MKIII or the Buckmark are rough when it comes to cleaning. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 9:24:05 AM EDT
[#25]
A big THANKS for the Tandemkross.recommendation!
If I have Trouble, getting parts from them: is ist ANY Problem, except a slit in the pistol, to just remove the CL Indicator? I have NO Trouble with my Mark III with the mags safe and the trigger on mine is EXCELLENT, so I am not sure I want the bushing conversion. Yes, takedown and reassembly is complicated for the frist 2 times, then you should have figured out what´s the clue. ( Hammer position and hammer strut Position ) Hermann |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 9:40:22 AM EDT
[#26]
As an owner of both I would call it a dead heat.
The Browning feels a little better in my hand. I`m 5' 10", medium hands. My stepson likes the feel of the Ruger better. He`s 6' 2", large hands. Both run good with CCI or Federal bulk pack. You cant go wrong with either. Edit If I could only have one it would be the Buckmark. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 9:50:34 AM EDT
[#27]
S&W M&P 22
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Posted: 1/18/2014 9:58:51 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A car is not a firearm. If your firearm needs a toolkit to disassemble it, the firearm was designed badly. How many other firearms out there need a screwdriver or hex key to disassemble? Not an AR, not an AK, not Steyr AUGs, not Makarovs, not 1911s, not Glocks, not BHPs...I could go on and wind up naming probably %99 of the firearms in the world. But somehow needing a hex key, and having a barrel being held on by one bolt with a single attachment point, is "better" than the practically monolithic barreled action of a Ruger? Alrighty then...and when that steel screw strips out the aluminum frame? Yeah, that's a design winner, right there! I can tell years of engineering and design went into that idea!
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
OMG, you need to remove a screw to clean your Buckmark? That's terrible! I need to remove a screw to change oil on my truck too, what a pita! And the Buckmark needs cleaning like every 10,000 rounds, that's just crazy!
Sorry dude, Ruger MKs suck compared to Buckmarks.
A car is not a firearm. If your firearm needs a toolkit to disassemble it, the firearm was designed badly. How many other firearms out there need a screwdriver or hex key to disassemble? Not an AR, not an AK, not Steyr AUGs, not Makarovs, not 1911s, not Glocks, not BHPs...I could go on and wind up naming probably %99 of the firearms in the world. But somehow needing a hex key, and having a barrel being held on by one bolt with a single attachment point, is "better" than the practically monolithic barreled action of a Ruger? Alrighty then...and when that steel screw strips out the aluminum frame? Yeah, that's a design winner, right there! I can tell years of engineering and design went into that idea!
The screw will never strip out unless someone goes full retard on it. It's a non-issue. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 10:03:15 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've had both. Bought a MkIII for a (now ex) girlfriend, which meant I was the one cleaning it and working on it. The goddamn thing was a jam-o-matic pain in the ass with a mediocre trigger. I ended up putting a bunch of Volquartsen (sp?) parts in it to resolve the jamming, which helped but I don't think completely cured it. Fussy about ammo too. Another person shooting on the same pistol team at the time bought a MkIII and it was constantly jamming too. Not sure what steps they took, but they ended up getting rid of it after trying for 2 years to resolve the issues. While it is nice to read that some people get Rugers that run well, it appears that there is an element of luck involved, as the two I had contact with were not good. My Buckmark, on the other hand, has been fantastic in 10 years of shooting in a bullseye league, including 2 years ago when I and my team mates took the state championship. Excellent ergonomics, sweet trigger, easy to strip and clean, not fussy about anything.
http://emoto.smugmug.com/photos/i-GDQrGvT/0/L/i-GDQrGvT-L.jpg I don't know why some of them work and some don't, but I think part of the problem with the Ruger is the feed angle. I noticed on mine that if I chambered a round and ejected it, it would have a flat spot mashed into the bullet, every time. My Buckmark does not do that. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 10:04:57 AM EDT
[#30]
I'm fixing to order a Buckmark Practical in the very near future.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 10:06:05 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Buckmark all day long. They have good triggers that can be made awesome in 5 minutes doing the Heggis flip. Heggis Flip Does that lighten the trigger? |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 10:11:42 AM EDT
[#32]
Ruger mkIII 22/45. all I replaced was the bushing to let the mags fall. just watch a youtube video as a install guide. it just felt better to me. mine is very accurate with good ammo. dont let the stories of tearing it down scare you, as long as you have any mechanical ability it is not that hard.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 10:13:15 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have both. The Browning Buckmark had a better stock trigger and was more accurate. The Ruger has more aftermarket parts available for it. I have both as well. Agree that the Buckmark is probably the better gun objectively speaking, at least out of the box. That said, I tend to grab the Ruger more often than the Browning. Even though I probably like the Ruger better, if I could only have one, I'd probably pick the Browning. Definitely look at the Lipsey/Talo exclusives, especially if you want a factory TB. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 11:06:02 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
What are the differences / advantages? I know the Ruger is hard to completely strip. Anyone own either or both? I've got a Browning. If I was doing it again I'd buy the Ruger. The finish hasn't worn well on the Browning and it is brain damaged stupid to remove the rear sight to clean the gun. it's worse it takes an allen wrench and doesn't store one in the grip (or elsewhere) where there would always be one. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 11:12:10 AM EDT
[#35]
Ruger has better aftermarket support, and complete strips aren't necessary. I blast mine out with a can of gun scrubber, and have only stripped it to install some target parts.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 11:12:58 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The screw will never strip out unless someone goes full retard on it. It's a non-issue. Ehh...let's agree to disagree  Honestly the only failing(s) of the Buckmark IMO is that you need a hex key to really clean the sucker, and what I think is a crappy way to affix the barrel to the receiver. Ergos wise it's fine, the trigger is actually pretty nice, and it's plenty accurate for what it needs to do. If I weren't a stickler for knowing how to detail disassemble everything I own, and if I didn't have OCD when it comes to keeping firearms as clean as humanely possible after a range session, I'd probably like the Buckmark a lot more...but it's just that much more a pain to disassemble down to component parts and clean, simply because of the tools needed.
I have an old Browning Auto-5 and you should see my face twitch when it comes time to clean it, strictly because I know I can never fully disassemble it
I just prefer Rugers, I think they're made better. Not a huge fan of the safety shit in the Mk3s but Mk2s are just fine. |
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Posted: 1/18/2014 11:20:29 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Buckmark FPNI. I like the feel and function of the buckmark much more than the Ruger. I think its shortcomings are by far less than that of the ruger also. I'm sure the top strap has been mentioned by now. That's an easy fix. The trigger is also quite easy to make significantly better than most anything else out there simply by flipping one spring around.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 11:20:43 AM EDT
[#38]
woohoo! pitcher thread!
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Posted: 1/18/2014 11:26:30 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does that lighten the trigger? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Buckmark all day long. They have good triggers that can be made awesome in 5 minutes doing the Heggis flip. Heggis Flip Does that lighten the trigger? Yes. This is a must do for any buckmark owner.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 11:33:07 AM EDT
[#40]
I have 2 MKIIs and had MKIII. I sold the MKIII as I could not warm up too it. Granted both my MKIIs are 20 plus years old and just seem better.
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Posted: 1/18/2014 1:38:36 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll bet poster Mak had an older MKI or MKII. My older ones also run OK in the cold but I have not tested them quite that cold. Why haven't you? Michigan where I currently live has had plenty of days this month with temperatures at -22 degrees.
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