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Posted: 7/12/2023 11:46:49 AM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Doesn't matter where it originates from or what it says. If it doesn't meet the Uke talking points, it's Russian propaganda and the messenger is a Russian spy. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 11:48:22 AM EST
[#2]
That's like being a grown man and bragging about your skeeball record at the local Chuck-e-Cheese.
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Posted: 7/12/2023 11:57:24 AM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Doesn’t matter where it originates from or what it says. If it doesn’t meet the Uke talking points, it’s Russian propaganda and the messenger is a Russian spy. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Report: Russian losses are XX,XXX UkeBot response - Bullshit! Literal Russian propaganda! Go away Putin Jr.! Russian losses are literally 87 times the reported number! Report: Ukranian losses are XX,XXX UkeBot response - Bullshit! Literal Russian propaganda! Go away Putin Jr.! Ukrainian losses are literally 1/87 of the reported number! Doesn’t matter where it originates from or what it says. If it doesn’t meet the Uke talking points, it’s Russian propaganda and the messenger is a Russian spy. It is source is the Russian Defense Minister and was a story from Russian state media. I hope you are just a little bit critical of say an NPR report on Defense Secretary Austin speaking about transgenders or right wing extremism in the military. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:05:25 PM EST
[#4]
Is that you Pete?
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:07:52 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So you believe this report? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Doesn't matter where it originates from or what it says. If it doesn't meet the Uke talking points, it's Russian propaganda and the messenger is a Russian spy. Muh "Trump didn't get 'dirt' on Biden from Zelensky, therefore I hate Ukraine." Crowd.  "The fucking best President in our Lifetime!!!!" Didn't win because Zelensky he didn't get "dirt" from Zelensky. 
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:12:50 PM EST
[#6]
Watching Maxxpro's burn makes my skin crawl
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:13:17 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I won't believe OP's post here until the real authority weighs in. How bout it Sketti? 
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:14:08 PM EST
[#8]
It is an unbiased source, I am sure.
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:17:13 PM EST
[#9]
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:20:50 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This one needs to be rated Troll before page (2). C'mon y'all, hit that Troll button... Surely by the end of page (2)... |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:21:35 PM EST
[#11]
Yet, they lead their media push with a single 'running' Bradley that is still conveniently in the exact spot where it was knocked out.
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:22:06 PM EST
[#12]
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:22:53 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ukraine is going to win any minute. My congressman and the news said so. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:26:12 PM EST
[#14]
Quoted: Russia: Ukraine’s “Counter-Offensive” Lost Over 26.000 Men, 1200 Tanks and APCs, 21 Planes and 5 Choppers Since June 4 https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/07/russia-ukraines-counter-offensive-lost-26-000-men/  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGRP49ojUTUThe Ukrainian army has lost over 26,000 men and over 3,000 items of military hardware in its failed Spring Counter-Offensive, said Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu., including 12 US Bradley fighting vehicles and 17 German Leo II tanks. Since the start of the Ukrainian counter-offensive on Kharkiv and Zaporizhzhia June 4, Ukraine’s losses “have reached over 26,000 servicemen and 3,000 items of various pieces of armament,” Shoigu said, according to TASS. According to the Russian Defense Minister, Russian troops destroyed 21 planes, five helicopters, 1,244 tanks and other armored vehicles, 17 German-made Leopard tanks, five AMX tanks produced by France and 12 US-made Bradley infantry fighting vehicles in the counter-offensive. Shoigu claimed Russian forces eliminated 914 pieces of automotive equipment, two air defense systems, 25 multiple-launch rocket systems (MLRS), 403 field artillery cannons and mortars. He said Russian air defense systems shot down 176 HIMARS rockets, 27 Storm Shadow air-launched cruise missiles and 483 drones of the Ukrainian armed forces. OP, you are aware nothing from the Russian govt. is true. Don't be a Putin sock puppet. No doubt Ukraine has losses but in anyone's wildest dreams, should you ever trust Russian propaganda. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:27:56 PM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Over 1200 tanks? Ukraine don't have 1200 tanks. Fake reporting. Sounds like "The Battle of Kirsk'' on Soviet Storm to me! These dick faces aren't even trying anymore. 
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:29:00 PM EST
[#16]
Russia is FOS and Ukraine is FOS.
The truth lies somewhere in the middle which will probably be a massive disappointment and surprise for the people who have been unquestionably buying into the narratives that Ukraine and western media outlets have been spinning. Eventually the real details will shake out |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:29:44 PM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like "The Battle of Kirsk'' on Soviet Storm. This dick faces aren't even trying now. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:32:31 PM EST
[#18]
Stopped reading at
thegatewaypundit |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:36:32 PM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like "The Battle of Kirsk'' on Soviet Storm to me! These dick faces aren't even trying anymore. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Over 1200 tanks? Ukraine don't have 1200 tanks. Fake reporting. Sounds like "The Battle of Kirsk'' on Soviet Storm to me! These dick faces aren't even trying anymore. Just like those cocksuckers claim they shot down something like 700 of our F-86 Sabers in Korea and took minimal loses in their Mig-15s. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:36:53 PM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Muh "Trump didn't get 'dirt' on Biden from Zelensky, therefore I hate Ukraine." Crowd. "The fucking best President in our Lifetime!!!!" Didn't win because Zelensky he didn't get "dirt" from Zelensky. If "getting dirt" would have made a difference then Trump didn't deserve to win. I voted for Trump twice but if dirt is a requirement to be president, I'll find someone else to vote for. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:38:41 PM EST
[#21]
Both sides are lying.
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:38:43 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like "The Battle of Kirsk'' on Soviet Storm. This dick faces aren't even trying now. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Over 1200 tanks? Ukraine don't have 1200 tanks. Fake reporting. Sounds like "The Battle of Kirsk'' on Soviet Storm. This dick faces aren't even trying now. I'm glad you posted this. The high end estimate is that the Axis lost 1,200 tanks during the Battle of Kursk (which contrary to popular belief, wasn't the largest tank battle in history). It really puts into perspective how ridiculous the numbers the Russians are sharing are. Since this was the Russian Minister of Defense and TASS reported it, I'd bet that the intended audience for this propaganda was Russian civilians, and Gateway pundit just happened to grab it and OP lapped that shit up. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:44:05 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If "getting dirt" would have made a difference then Trump didn't deserve to win. I voted for Trump twice but if dirt is a requirement to be president, I'll find someone else to vote for. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Muh "Trump didn't get 'dirt' on Biden from Zelensky, therefore I hate Ukraine." Crowd. "The fucking best President in our Lifetime!!!!" Didn't win because Zelensky he didn't get "dirt" from Zelensky. If "getting dirt" would have made a difference then Trump didn't deserve to win. I voted for Trump twice but if dirt is a requirement to be president, I'll find someone else to vote for. That's what I'm saying man. Zelensky lives rent free in ForeverTrump voters heads though. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:45:45 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Russia is FOS and Ukraine is FOS. The truth lies somewhere in the middle which will probably be a massive disappointment and surprise for the people who have been unquestionably buying into the narratives that Ukraine and western media outlets have been spinning. Eventually the real details will shake out Sounds like something a Russian Putin puffer would say... |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:56:46 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Report: Russian losses are XX,XXX UkeBot response - Bullshit! Literal Russian propaganda! Go away Putin Jr.! Russian losses are literally 87 times the reported number! Report: Ukranian losses are XX,XXX UkeBot response - Bullshit! Literal Russian propaganda! Go away Putin Jr.! Ukrainian losses are literally 1/87 of the reported number! Use your head, does 1200 destroyed tanks in a month sound like propaganda? |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 12:56:55 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If this was true … Russia would be plastering the loses via drone video left and right … But no we just get the same losses from different angles … There are Ukrainian losses but not what you, OP, reporting on this thread. They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:00:53 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yup... ...oh, and coincidentally, your avatar looks like a Russian. Its prolly nothing though Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Report: Russian losses are XX,XXX UkeBot response - Bullshit! Literal Russian propaganda! Go away Putin Jr.! Russian losses are literally 87 times the reported number! Report: Ukranian losses are XX,XXX UkeBot response - Bullshit! Literal Russian propaganda! Go away Putin Jr.! Ukrainian losses are literally 1/87 of the reported number! Well, since both of the reports originated from Russia.... Doesn't matter where it originates from or what it says. If it doesn't meet the Uke talking points, it's Russian propaganda and the messenger is a Russian spy. Yup... ...oh, and coincidentally, your avatar looks like a Russian. Its prolly nothing though Hey man, shim is a representative of the great state of Montana! |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:02:45 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. A post worth reading for a second time. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:05:41 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If this was true … Russia would be plastering the loses via drone video left and right … But no we just get the same losses from different angles … There are Ukrainian losses but not what you, OP, reporting on this thread. They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. The Russians are claiming they destroyed as many tanks as they did* during the Battle of Kursk, which until David Glantz's research in Soviet archives after the fall of the USSR was was generally accepted as the largest tank battle in history. Do you think one of history's largest tank battles took place over the last month, and with all the social media out there today as opposed to 1941, we would not have known about it if it weren't for the Russian Minister of Defense sharing the Ukranian losses? * based off of actual numbers of losses from Axis documents |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:08:37 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If this was true … Russia would be plastering the loses via drone video left and right … But no we just get the same losses from different angles … There are Ukrainian losses but not what you, OP, reporting on this thread. They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:10:29 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Doesn't matter where it originates from or what it says. If it doesn't meet the Uke talking points, it's Russian propaganda and the messenger is a Russian spy. Lolz.  . Well, it literally IS Official Russian Propaganda. I don’t think we’re allowed to call OP a Russian Agent. Wouldn’t be entirely accurate, when it’s far more likely he’s spreading their lies for free. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:14:46 PM EST
[#32]
Some of you must have been incredibly lonely and without purpose prior to this “special operation.”
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:15:22 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. Ukraine has never lost a war without losing 1/3 of their adult men first. Russia is running out of convicts and guys willing to join the military to get AIDS medication. Your move. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:24:13 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. If you're only fed at diet of Ukrainian IO, its easy to see why confirmation bias and sincere desire to see the good guys win would drive you to think that. This is a separate issue from Russian IO, with its own obvious end states. Reality is always more complex, starting with in coalition operations of any sort, your 'friends' are lying to you as much as your enemies. This was as true in WWII as today. Coalition operations are not the "It's a Small World" boat ride. They are the interplay of lots of nations trying to get to their end states, which may or may not have 51% Venn overlap with your own. The Ukrainians have all sorts of good and bad reasons for pushing the Ukraine is Winning Bigly! narrative. The problem is with such narratives is that a credibility gap emerges. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:29:33 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: If this was true … Russia would be plastering the loses via drone video left and right … But no we just get the same losses from different angles … There are Ukrainian losses but not what you, OP, reporting on this thread. They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. It’s only in GD that so many people think Russia is winning (and appear to take pleasure in that erroneous view). Most everyone else who has the ability to reason observes that this foray amounts to one of the largest strategic blunders in modern times and will cost Russia economically, politically, and demographically for decades in ways that far surpass the value of the lands they presently occupy within Ukraine or whatever goal post shifting objectives they might actually walk away obtaining at this point. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:31:08 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: If this was true … Russia would be plastering the loses via drone video left and right … But no we just get the same losses from different angles … There are Ukrainian losses but not what you, OP, reporting on this thread. They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. That makes no sense. Right now, the entire civilized world is supporting Ukraine, vs. Russia. Obviously, those supporting Nations think Ukraine can win, and will win, as long as the support holds out. Half of America’s erstwhile conservatives are living in this weird little Tucker bubble. Russia is counting on them, but I don’t think it will be enough. Hell, We couldn’t even get the important stuff done, like our own Border security. Russia is pinning all their hopes on a political Hail Mary. Best they can hope for is a negotiated peace which preserves Crimea. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:33:23 PM EST
[#37]
Take those numbers and divide by ten....and then ignore them altogether.
CRB = complete Russian bullshit |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:33:24 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ukraine has never lost a war without losing 1/3 of their adult men first. Russia is running out of convicts and guys willing to join the military to get AIDS medication. Your move. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. Ukraine has never lost a war without losing 1/3 of their adult men first. Russia is running out of convicts and guys willing to join the military to get AIDS medication. Your move. My move? Peace! Unfortunately I am not in charge. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:34:21 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's only in GD that so many people think Russia is winning (and appear to take pleasure in that erroneous view). Most everyone else who has the ability to reason observes that this foray amounts to one of the largest strategic blunders in modern times and will cost Russia economically, politically, and demographically for decades in ways that far surpass the value of the lands they presently occupy within Ukraine or whatever goal post shifting objectives they might actually walk away obtaining at this point. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:35:12 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A post worth reading for a second time. Yes, it was worth a second read for the laughs. Especially about the bit about how Russia is "weak at trying to milk every victory on social media". How many times did they claim to take Bakhmut before they actually took it again? Sheltie himself had gone through many phases of trying to justify Russia's performance there. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:39:30 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That makes no sense. Right now, the entire civilized world is supporting Ukraine, vs. Russia. Obviously, those supporting Nations think Ukraine can win, and will win, as long as the support holds out. Half of America’s erstwhile conservatives are living in this weird little Tucker bubble. Russia is counting on them, but I don’t think it will be enough. Hell, We couldn’t even get the important stuff done, like our own Border security. Russia is pinning all their hopes on a political Hail Mary. Best they can hope for is a negotiated peace which preserves Crimea. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: If this was true … Russia would be plastering the loses via drone video left and right … But no we just get the same losses from different angles … There are Ukrainian losses but not what you, OP, reporting on this thread. They are plastering them all over Telegram, they are just not discussed here, for the most part anyway. If you want to look it's there for you to see, time-stamped and geolocated. It is very difficult to watch but there is no sugarcoating the Ukraian losses and the Russians do daily commentary and updates, they also do verification videos of past battles. The Ukranian losses are unsustainable, and in many cases very sad to see because it's often due to poor training or using tactics developed by UK or European trainers who have never come under combined drone-corrected artillery and ATGM fire themselves, and especially without air support. The pro-Ukrainian channels have the best social media and PR people in the world working for them, so when they get a win they milk it, and rightfully so. The Russians are rather weak in that area, but they do post a shit load of daily updated content and it is not good for the Ukranians in terms of troops and equipment losses. Russian content that shows them winning is often blocked or removed from Twitter or Youtube, so most people never see their drone or attack footage. I'm sure some people here know how bad it is, but it seems to be verboten to post or discuss. It is only in GD that so many people think Ukraine is winning. Most everyone else in the world seems to be of the opinion that the Ukrainians are getting ground down and cannot sustain this. That makes no sense. Right now, the entire civilized world is supporting Ukraine, vs. Russia. Obviously, those supporting Nations think Ukraine can win, and will win, as long as the support holds out. Half of America’s erstwhile conservatives are living in this weird little Tucker bubble. Russia is counting on them, but I don’t think it will be enough. Hell, We couldn’t even get the important stuff done, like our own Border security. Russia is pinning all their hopes on a political Hail Mary. Best they can hope for is a negotiated peace which preserves Crimea. What? How many people do you talk to a day around the world? Everyone I talk to wants Ukraine to win but many think it is an impossible task and think they are getting ground down. Most YouTube videos I see are of the same opinion and they certainly aren’t Russian bots. There is a strange flow of information through this place on this particular subject that doesn’t line up. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:40:36 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My move? Peace! Unfortunately I am not in charge. You’re not describing peace, you’re describing submission. Have you not read “Give war a Chance”? |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:43:46 PM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes, it was worth a second read for the laughs. Especially about the bit about how Russia is "weak at trying to milk every victory on social media". How many times did they claim to take Bakhmut before they actually took it again? Sheltie himself had gone through many phases of trying to justify Russia's performance there. I will say "shooting the messenger" is the prime TTP for anyone who strays from the Ukraine narrative. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:43:50 PM EST
[#44]
Quoted: Russia: Ukraine’s “Counter-Offensive” Lost Over 26.000 Men, 1200 Tanks and APCs, 21 Planes and 5 Choppers Since June 4 https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/07/russia-ukraines-counter-offensive-lost-26-000-men/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGRP49ojUTUThe Ukrainian army has lost over 26,000 men and over 3,000 items of military hardware in its failed Spring Counter-Offensive, said Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu., including 12 US Bradley fighting vehicles and 17 German Leo II tanks. Since the start of the Ukrainian counter-offensive on Kharkiv and Zaporizhzhia June 4, Ukraine’s losses “have reached over 26,000 servicemen and 3,000 items of various pieces of armament,” Shoigu said, according to TASS. According to the Russian Defense Minister, Russian troops destroyed 21 planes, five helicopters, 1,244 tanks and other armored vehicles, 17 German-made Leopard tanks, five AMX tanks produced by France and 12 US-made Bradley infantry fighting vehicles in the counter-offensive. Shoigu claimed Russian forces eliminated 914 pieces of automotive equipment, two air defense systems, 25 multiple-launch rocket systems (MLRS), 403 field artillery cannons and mortars. He said Russian air defense systems shot down 176 HIMARS rockets, 27 Storm Shadow air-launched cruise missiles and 483 drones of the Ukrainian armed forces. The Russians lost 125000 men, 4500 tanks, 4 s400 systems and 1500 artillery pieces, 30 Su 31 fighters, 15000 Iranian drones, 188 super sonic missiles. See I can do it too! |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:43:51 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You’re not describing peace, you’re describing submission. Have you not read “Give war a Chance”? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: My move? Peace! Unfortunately I am not in charge. You’re not describing peace, you’re describing submission. Have you not read “Give war a Chance”? This conflict is endless. No matter what is done today, they will be at war again. It is better to cede some territory and have peace than perpetual war. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:46:44 PM EST
[#46]
Quoted: Russia: Ukraine’s “Counter-Offensive” Lost Over 26.000 Men, 1200 Tanks and APCs, 21 Planes and 5 Choppers Since June 4. Pretty sure thats more armor than even russia has atm. I want to believe. 
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:49:05 PM EST
[#47]
Without a viable air force Ukraine really can't do much and so I never expected any massive Desert Storm like two week ground offensive that recaptured all lost territory.
Air power is a fundamental and critical component to combined arms modern warfare, without it Ukraine would be better off just fighting defensively until they can acquire it. Remember, Russia has ISR assets. Russia has its own spy satellite, ISR aircraft, and drones along with human intelligence. It is impossible for Ukraine to launch a "surprise" armored thrust. The Russians have a multi-layered defense set-up along what is essentially just huge expanses of farm fields with little cover. Under such circumstances, air power is going to be absolutely critical and Ukraine just doesn't have much of it to make any real strategic difference. I will also once again say that I think Ukraine suffers from a lack of competent officers. Most of their high ranking officer corps is still biased toward Soviet doctrine just as a product of coming up under that system. It takes a long time to develop leaders who are competent at the operational level (takes decades in the USA under our existing military culture). A PMC option is what is required to stop the blood shed and bring this conflict to a speedy resolution that results in a Ukrainian victory. Western leaders, western leased equipment, western contractors providing logistics, and a western air PMC option akin to the flying tiger. In short, NATO needs its own version of Wagner PMC to go into Ukraine and get things done. With someone like Erik Prince as the head of such an effort the Russians could be pushed out of Ukraine proper in a matter of weeks. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:49:40 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You're not describing peace, you're describing submission. Have you not read "Give war a Chance"? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: My move? Peace! Unfortunately I am not in charge. You're not describing peace, you're describing submission. Have you not read "Give war a Chance"? |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:50:40 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That makes no sense. Right now, the entire civilized world is supporting Ukraine, vs. Russia. Obviously, those supporting Nations think Ukraine can win, and will win, as long as the support holds out. Half of America’s erstwhile conservatives are living in this weird little Tucker bubble. Russia is counting on them, but I don’t think it will be enough. Hell, We couldn’t even get the important stuff done, like our own Border security. Russia is pinning all their hopes on a political Hail Mary. Best they can hope for is a negotiated peace which preserves Crimea. "Civilized world?" Estonia? The UK? Sure. The UK sent 40 tanks. Not out of their "strategic reserve." They shuttered an active unit. NATO and the US (and importantly none of our Asian allies) are basically committed to Ukr success, though I still haven't seen a Potsdam Declaration moment for what that exactly means, 500 days in. Meanwhile, India and China are certainly no weaker for the invasion, and those two nations alone represent 1/3rd of the humans on this rock. If you're thinking that we are just turning off Tucker from some grand compromise that ushers in an era of consensus government, I don't know what to tell you. I can post the President's own words on that ad nauseum. I tend to agree that Russia might only get a negotiated peace that preserves Crimea, for the billions they've spent and the irreplaceable resources they've burnt. That is a Russian problem, and what I need out of the Russians as an American realist is fundamentally different than what Russia or even a putative Western European would want. The same is true for Kyiv, as well. |
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Posted: 7/12/2023 1:51:21 PM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My move? Peace! Unfortunately I am not in charge. King Canute the Great called, he wants his "The leadership can do anything, if they only wanted to" back. |
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