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Posted: 3/17/2017 7:48:56 PM EDT
[#1]
I just got this email from peacemaker. I am a member there. It's confusing to me, how this is even possible. How did this not get thrown out?
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Posted: 3/17/2017 7:50:38 PM EDT
[#2]
I'm pissed! That means my information is going to some anti gun fuckstick and their lawyers. Fucking bullshit.
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Posted: 3/17/2017 8:01:42 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No. Only ATF. And in very rare cases Cuban Colonels. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Does that court even have jurisdiction to release 4473s? And in very rare cases Cuban Colonels. 
Wolverines!!!!!  Red Dawn Gun Control.avi |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 8:12:15 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
http://www.legis.state.wv.us/wvcode/ChapterEntire.cfm?chap=61&art=6§ion=23 b) Except as provided in this section, a person may not maintain a nuisance action for noise against a shooting range located in the vicinity of that person's property if the range was established as of the date of the person acquiring the property. If there is a substantial change in use of the range or there is a period of shooting inactivity at a range exceeding one year after the person acquires the property, the person may maintain a nuisance action if the action is brought within two years from the beginning of the substantial change in use of the range, or the resumption of shooting activity.
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Posted: 3/17/2017 8:23:35 PM EDT
[#5]
That sucks. I used to live in Inwood and went there several times. Its a nice facility and at one time had a 1000yd range.
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Posted: 3/17/2017 8:46:18 PM EDT
[#6]
This appears to be the primary residence as verified by and using information provided by Frederick County VA. The owners have 8 parcels listed, mostly in fairly close proximity and all are about as close as possible to the border. There is no "last sold" transaction date for what is listed as the primary residence but a few completely undeveloped parcels show their purchase was 1989; the rest are 2009 or later. My guess, they want to build up right there, and while they could have potentially been living there since before the range, the house was built in 1977, and the residence on the adjacent parcel they own was built in 1990. Sitting on a decent sized parcel of almost completely undeveloped land, it's not hard to figure out the motive here. Zoom the map out two clicks and you can see the range. The owner is 69 and 74 years old. I bet if they turn their hearing aids off they don't even notice. The long and the short of it is the range has been there for a reasonably long amount of time and just now they want to do something about it. Eat shit. If this counts as "doxxing" I will remove this, but it is all public info given from the Frederick county VA website and can be found in about 15 seconds. Fair is fair if they are gaining access to all the records of unrelated parties. |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 9:01:25 PM EDT
[#7]
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Because like it or not LE agencies have a better chance of making a phone call to someone that will stop this silly shit like the state AG. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Why are they special? The entire fiasco is an outrageous overreach by the "judicial" system. I'd look at extreme measures if they released my information. |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 9:29:46 PM EDT
[#8]
That sucks. I used to live in Inwood and went there several times. Its a nice facility and at one time had a 1000yd range.
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Posted: 3/17/2017 9:38:34 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hopefully the range wins the suit and then turns around and has a free machinegun shoot day with free ammo for all those that attend. Then I hope they set up a few General Electric M134 Miniguns and the event goes into the wee hours of the night/early morning culminating in an GE M134 tracer and explosion show. You know..kind of like the machinegun shoot in what is it...Tennessee? Or is it Kentucky? |
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Posted: 3/17/2017 9:39:24 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The moral of the story is this: never keep any records you are not legally obliged to keep. |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 9:32:08 AM EDT
[#11]
If it has not already been discussed, there has been a legal defense fund set up.
Please help if you can. Peacemaker's Legal Defense Fund |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 9:33:52 AM EDT
[#12]
<Removed. Do NOT do this. --tbk1>
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Posted: 3/18/2017 9:36:00 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Probably Liberal out of Stater moved in. From NJ, NY, MD Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I have a lot of friends that shoot there. Not good. From NJ, NY, MD Frederick County is where all the Washintonians have their weekend homes |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 3:40:32 PM EDT
[#14]
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Yes and I'll bet I know Mr. Goldstein's occupation. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Trying to bully them out of existence. |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 4:16:01 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm pissed! That means my information is going to some anti gun fuckstick and their lawyers. Fucking bullshit. |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 4:37:04 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mobolize $25K cash to cover legal fees once you are sued. That's for starters! |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 5:29:59 PM EDT
[#17]
The plaintiff, lawyers, AND judge should all be raked over the coals for this. Judges should not be immune from prosecution or civil suits resulting from stupid decisions. The fact that the suit has no merit and is expressly forbidden aside, there is absolutely no reason for the release of private information. Lawyer up, refuse to release the info, and counter-sue for legal fees and damages if any info is released. Name the judge.
I'm not a lawyer and I expect most of this isn't possible, but it really needs to be. Our legal system is a fucking travesty and it's people like this that made it that way. |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 5:59:24 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Absolutely. It sounds like this is released under a protective order though. So it will still be "protected." But still. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
THIS. @LawyerUp : I'm not a WV lawyer, so I'm asking you whether third parties can file as intervenor to stop the release of this info to plaintiffs, even under Protective Order? My experience is mainly limited to Texas, but both State and Federal courts here appear extremely hesitant to allow discovery of membership lists and other personal data unless directly relevant to the matter at hand in the case. I've had similar experiences in Fed court in Florida and even, yes, California. |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 6:32:57 PM EDT
[#19]
The Goldsteins deserve a blanket party
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Posted: 3/18/2017 6:41:11 PM EDT
[#20]
Kiss that range goodbye.
I'm honestly surprised my gun club hasn't been shut down, it's surrounded on 3 sides by a neighborhood. |
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Posted: 3/18/2017 8:50:04 PM EDT
[#21]
Thanks to all who have shown support and donated to the legal fund.
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Posted: 3/18/2017 9:15:09 PM EDT
[#22]
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The Goldsteins deserve a blanket party 1) I am a Goldstein. 2) I am of no relation to those Goldstein's. 3) I am a member of Peacemakers, and have been since the second year they opened. 4) I've already donated and will likely do more in the coming weeks. Broad brushes paint friends and enemies alike. Carry on. |
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Posted: 3/19/2017 9:40:17 AM EDT
[#23]
Please help spread the word via social media, and other communities. We need all the help we can get.
None of us want to see this become the start of a nationwide trend. If you can't donate, simply share the original message far and wide. Thank you to everyone for the continued support. |
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Posted: 3/19/2017 11:50:29 AM EDT
[#24]
We are getting some positive responses and support from members of the shooting industry.
Keep spreading the word. We are making an impact. Great job! |
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Posted: 3/19/2017 3:26:39 PM EDT
[#25]
I have talked to Keith Morgan of the WVCDL. They are aware and are on this!
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Posted: 3/19/2017 5:07:25 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have talked to Keith Morgan of the WVCDL. They are aware and are on this! The release of private information is the really disturbing part of this. Again, we find ourselves in an incremental battle to keep our rights and privacy intact. We all need to hold the ground we have gained in this country. We cannot let things begin to backslide. Continue to spread the word. This could be your favorite range or gun shop next. |
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Posted: 3/19/2017 6:33:53 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The fact that the suit has no merit and is expressly forbidden aside... If they have convinced a judge that those conditions appear to have been met, and they have convinced him that they need access to those documents in order to establish their case fully, then what they are doing may be the correct application of the law in that jurisdiction. I guess it depends on what their fishing trip laws are like. It would be interesting to hear from the people involved-enough to actually know what it being argued. |
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Posted: 3/19/2017 6:42:24 PM EDT
[#28]
Donated $50 for now, will probably add to it later.
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Posted: 3/19/2017 7:54:07 PM EDT
[#29]
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Posted: 3/19/2017 9:16:09 PM EDT
[#30]
Posted just now on Peacemaker's Facebook page:
URGENT UPDATE: We have just been informed that the Plaintiff's attorneys under the court order will be reviewing privacy related documents beginning Wednesday March 22nd 2017. https://www.facebook.com/PNTCWV/ @PNTCWV |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 3:41:13 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Posted just now on Peacemaker's Facebook page: URGENT UPDATE: We have just been informed that the Plaintiff's attorneys under the court order will be reviewing privacy related documents beginning Wednesday March 22nd 2017. https://www.facebook.com/PNTCWV/ @PNTCWV 
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Posted: 3/20/2017 6:19:00 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If the range was smart they would contact every LE agency that ever trained there and make them aware that their officers information was about to be shared with a private party or made public. That might get something moving. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 6:47:26 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They are the defendant. If they fail to comply, judgment can be entered against them, in which case, the plaintiffs will get everything they are asking for put into an enforceable court order. They should be seeking a "writ of prohibition" from the WV Supreme Court before complying. Likewise, the affected customers should be hiring lawyers to send the plaintiffs, and their lawyers, letters that they are about to get sued. <----licensed WV lawyer  Attached File |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 7:14:32 AM EDT
[#34]
another reason to hate lawyers.
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Posted: 3/20/2017 10:20:42 AM EDT
[#35]
They should offer some free memberships to some 4chan guys. I'm sure they wouldn't take too kindly to their info being released and those aren't the guys that you want to piss off. Just ask Shia LaBeouf.
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Posted: 3/20/2017 11:46:02 AM EDT
[#36]
Assault on 2A just got personal
Let's keep this going. Continue to spread the word and help out any way possible. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 11:57:36 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was going to ask if they could file an appeal currently based on the court's denial of motions. We have a similar statute in PA which says that the ordinance or lack thereof that was in place when construction began controls. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/113377/Screenshot-20170320-065151-170052.JPG |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 11:59:56 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The existence of the protective order would suggest that the D's counsel moved to exclude personal data evidence and failed, with the protective order being issued either in the alternative as a fallback, or by the Judge as a consolation. I'm unfamiliar with the realities of WV court practice, but would you assume that to be the case here? My experience is mainly limited to Texas, but both State and Federal courts here appear extremely hesitant to allow discovery of membership lists and other personal data unless directly relevant to the matter at hand in the case. I've had similar experiences in Fed court in Florida and even, yes, California. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
THIS. @LawyerUp : I'm not a WV lawyer, so I'm asking you whether third parties can file as intervenor to stop the release of this info to plaintiffs, even under Protective Order? My experience is mainly limited to Texas, but both State and Federal courts here appear extremely hesitant to allow discovery of membership lists and other personal data unless directly relevant to the matter at hand in the case. I've had similar experiences in Fed court in Florida and even, yes, California. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:27:38 PM EDT
[#39]
Does Peacemaker have competent representation (attorney)?
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:33:42 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
just pulled the addresses on Google Maps. you'd think that 1/2 mile of dense forest would kill sound quite a bit Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If only whitepages.com would return an address and phone number for a Diane H Goldstein from Winchester, VA... Oh...wait...it does...and she just so happens to live 1/2 a mile from the range as the crow flies. I have shot at PNTC so my name is on the list. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:35:57 PM EDT
[#41]
Has the Plantiffs' home address been published yet?
Sounds like a protest outside of the Plantiffs' home is in order. I think the leftists have shown us how to have a proper protest. 
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:42:29 PM EDT
[#42]
I informed a member of the WVCDL about another range in the area that has had similar complaints.
The WVCDL has good people and resources. That county also has previous cases of noise complaints at shooting ranges. In fact I went to one of the hearings for it. The case I was part of ended up getting tossed out due to them little bitchs not having a leg to stand on. This is also another reason all shooter need to support the HPA. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:45:29 PM EDT
[#43]
Courts are the true menace.
I wish I could go back to school. I'd go to law school just to get in on the front lines of this 'shooting war'. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:45:37 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They could file a petition for writ of prohibition to the WV Supreme Court. That is going to entail a lot of additional attorney fees however. Quote HistoryQuoted:
<strong>Quoted:</strong>
I was going to ask if they could file an appeal currently based on the court's denial of motions. We have a similar statute in PA which says that the ordinance or lack thereof that was in place when construction began controls. <a href="https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/113377/Screenshot-20170320-065151-170052.JPG" target="_blank">https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/113377/Screenshot-20170320-065151-170052.JPG</a> Which I'm sure is part of the offending lawyer's goal. Spend them into the dirt while his lawyer does it for some leftish cash. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:49:01 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote History<strong>Quoted:</strong>
They are the defendant. If they fail to comply, judgment can be entered against them, in which case, the plaintiffs will get everything they are asking for put into an enforceable court order. They should be seeking a "writ of prohibition" from the WV Supreme Court before complying. Likewise, the affected customers should be hiring lawyers to send the plaintiffs, and their lawyers, letters that they are about to get sued. <----licensed WV lawyer Quote History<strong>Quoted:</strong>
<strong>Quoted:</strong>
pffft, why even acknowledge the court? They should be seeking a "writ of prohibition" from the WV Supreme Court before complying. Likewise, the affected customers should be hiring lawyers to send the plaintiffs, and their lawyers, letters that they are about to get sued. <----licensed WV lawyer Would you suggest hiring our own or going with PNTC's attorney? I suspect based on local politics who is representing PNTC but haven't verified it yet. Oh and the WV attorney referenced in the other link, who is helping the CA douchebag attorney - yeah, the wife of one of their attorneys was popped for smoking weed in her car right on the street in front of the office. That whole damned practice leans so far left I'm surprised it doesn't fall over. Quoted:
Sounds like the range needs to have a .50 cal day. <img src="http://www.ar15.com/images/smilies/smiley_smartass.gif" /> I'll bring the M2. |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 12:49:25 PM EDT
[#46]
Who in the blue fuck is that judge that lacks reading comprehension?
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Posted: 3/20/2017 1:14:32 PM EDT
[#47]
I had an idea for counter attack after reading the paperwork last night.
Flood the plaintiff & their attorney's with counter demands from individual members. In exchange for the risk of our personal information being exposed or miss-used, ask them to put up a $10,000 bond, per name. I would think that individual members would have standing but I haven't had a chance to research any specific precedence. Can any WV lawyers comment on the idea? I would think that once the boilerplate is established, it would be pretty easy (inexpensive per member) to flood the plaintiff with individual filings. Any downstream risks of this approach? Edit to add, I see that @LawyerUp suggested something similar earlier in the thread. Any suggestions for pursuing this path? |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 1:39:16 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Has the Plantiffs' home address been published yet? |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 1:46:05 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had an idea for counter attack after reading the paperwork last night. Flood the plaintiff & their attorney's with counter demands from individual members. In exchange for the risk of our personal information being exposed or miss-used, ask them to put up a $10,000 bond, per name. I would think that individual members would have standing but I haven't had a chance to research any specific precedence. Can any WV lawyers comment on the idea? I would think that once the boilerplate is established, it would be pretty easy (inexpensive per member) to flood the plaintiff with individual filings. Any downstream risks of this approach? Edit to add, I see that @LawyerUp suggested something similar earlier in the thread. Any suggestions for pursuing this path? |
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Posted: 3/20/2017 1:54:42 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Someone call the Berkeley Circuit Clerk's Office and ask for a printout (generally a one page list) of everything that has been filed on the case and email it to me. I can tell you what I would need to see and you can request it to be emailed or faxed to me. Then I would be willing to do some individual consults for anyone affected. https://www.facebook.com/groups/WVCDL/ |
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