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Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:25:45 PM EDT
[#1]
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Quoted:
There may be a God of some sort that kicked this universe off, but I believe religion is a man made construct to make humans feel better about dying.

I don't believe in an afterlife, this existence is what you get and there are no do overs. I don't like the idea of returning to eternal nothingness but I'm afraid that is what is in store for every living creature. One and done.

I also don't begrudge people for believing, and I think Christianity for most of its history has been a boon for mankind.
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Religion wasn't created to spare people the anxiety of mortality.  It was ancient stories of ignorance to explain sciences we didn't understand yet, stories twisted to build power for individuals whether it be a cult leader wanting endless pussy at small scale or governments hoping to control the masses because you can't rebel against an invisible ruler with omnipotent power than can make you suffer after death.  

People are mostly sheep. Now that most religions have become too retarded to believe due to our understanding of science the political party has become the new god and religion and their chosen propaganda outlets the new bibles
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:25:57 PM EDT
[#2]
I haven't stopped.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:26:02 PM EDT
[#3]
About the same time I stopped believing in Santa.  

Came to the realization that people in general are afraid to die.  The belief in an afterlife in heaven is how many cope with that fear.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:26:31 PM EDT
[#4]
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:27:22 PM EDT
[#5]
During "confirmation."
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:30:08 PM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:
Never started.
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Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:32:36 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:
Religion has killed more people than any other group.

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nope.  more have been killed in the pursuit of a godless society.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:35:27 PM EDT
[#8]
A very long time ago.


Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:35:37 PM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:
About the same time I stopped believing in Santa.  

Came to the realization that people in general are afraid to die.  The belief in an afterlife in heaven is how many cope with that fear.
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That is exactly what I thought for my first three decades. Weaked willed sissies. Toughen up buttercup

Then God smacked me upside the head during a NDE. All that stuff in the Bible is real.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:35:41 PM EDT
[#10]
I've never stopped. My faith grows stronger as I age.

Yes, I've seen some horrible,  evil things done by humans. We were given free will by God. Some use that free will for good  some for evil. It's as simple as that.

Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:36:32 PM EDT
[#11]
In 2001 when my father passed away from cancer. At 53.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:37:11 PM EDT
[#12]
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:37:35 PM EDT
[#13]
Like 18.

Then I actually grew up, opened my eyes to the reality of the world and found my way back to Christ and quit being an edgy atheist parroting tired tropes.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:37:59 PM EDT
[#14]
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Too many times I saw inexplicable, unjust human suffering explained away as part of "God's plan." An omnipotent being would have to be sadistic to have a plan like that.
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Yep.....I was raised in the church and the older I got I noticed God only got credit for the good stuff in people's lives.  If God is all powerful then he gets to take credit for the bad along with the good......if he gets credit for grandma beating the flu, then he gets credit for a 3 year old dying of cancer.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:40:35 PM EDT
[#15]
13 or 15.  Some in this thread may like the book Caesar's Messiah.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:42:08 PM EDT
[#16]
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Quoted:

Yep.....I was raised in the church and the older I got I noticed God only got credit for the good stuff in people's lives.  If God is all powerful then he gets to take credit for the bad along with the good......if he gets credit for grandma beating the flu, then he gets credit for a 3 year old dying of cancer.
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That is happening right here in this thread.  People are attributing some good event in their life to God, not others or their own doing.  People are responding to others about bad events, saying that particular event was the act of a human, not God.

They are selecting and assigning credit and blame, as it best fits what they want.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:42:09 PM EDT
[#17]
My Gaod is my light and salvation...still going on since 1972 (when I was 21 years old) --- I'm 71 now, and still praying for guidance...
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:42:22 PM EDT
[#18]
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Quoted:
Too many times I saw inexplicable, unjust human suffering explained away as part of "God's plan." An omnipotent being would have to be sadistic to have a plan like that.
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Playing devil's advocate...so to speak:

If God exists on the level it would take to be as described, we couldn't comprehend much less have the words to discuss what "His plan" could possibly be or encompass.

On a more parochial level; How many fantastic things have been done by people who went through unimaginable circumstance?

I can and have sat and discussed these things for many hours for the sheer exercise of it because it will not be figured out in this existence.

Faith is valuable, even if only for the fact that it brings people through things they may not otherwise bear.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:42:52 PM EDT
[#19]
In 1986 during Reagan machine gun ban. God given rights were violated. Oh wait, there's no god, only bad men.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:43:48 PM EDT
[#20]
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Quoted:
There may be a God of some sort that kicked this universe off, but I believe religion is a man made construct to make humans feel better about dying.

I don't believe in an afterlife, this existence is what you get and there are no do overs. I don't like the idea of returning to eternal nothingness but I'm afraid that is what is in store for every living creature. One and done.

I also don't begrudge people for believing, and I think Christianity for most of its history has been a boon for mankind.
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This is where i'm at.

For me there has to be something higher.

But I don't think closing my eyes and talking to that something higher does a fuck all of good.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:44:15 PM EDT
[#21]
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As you say, nature doesn’t have a moral law. So it’s not any sort of applicable parallel. Animals aren’t made in the image of God as we are. We even walk upright physically in additional to behaviorally.

One thing I learned recently, and I immediately thought of you, is that stoicism is basically the second-best religion possible. It’s only flaw, and a fatal one at that, is spiritual pride. Lacks any need for salvation as it were.

Something to stick in the back of your mind if you like.
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I don't know if there is or isn't. I allow for the possibility.

For us to have free will, which, as much as I can postulate for myself if this is one big test, would be necessary. Free will would encompass the most good as well as the most evil.

Then I can look at nature which does not assign good or evil. A boar grizzly eats his own cubs to prevent competition. We say," That's just nature".

As you say, nature doesn’t have a moral law. So it’s not any sort of applicable parallel. Animals aren’t made in the image of God as we are. We even walk upright physically in additional to behaviorally.

One thing I learned recently, and I immediately thought of you, is that stoicism is basically the second-best religion possible. It’s only flaw, and a fatal one at that, is spiritual pride. Lacks any need for salvation as it were.

Something to stick in the back of your mind if you like.

It has been there since I was a kid. I almost wish I hadn't been exposed because I cannot divorce the pondering I have now, from the indoctrination I received then.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:45:14 PM EDT
[#22]
Gave up on organized religion when it became apparent it's designed by men to generate power, income and control.  Several incidents with the Catholic church man made rules.  I hope there's something out there after this, honestly not sure.  Bible written hundreds of years after Christ's death based on hand me down stories, then changed to delete what they didn't want. I don't deny anyone their faith, if it gives them comfort so be it.  We all have an inner voice that tells us right from wrong, I try to listen.  Is it God?  I don't know.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:46:52 PM EDT
[#23]
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Quoted:
I don't know if there is or isn't. I allow for the possibility.

For us to have free will, which, as much as I can postulate for myself if this is one big test, would be necessary. Free will would encompass the most good as well as the most evil.

Then I can look at nature which does not assign good or evil. A boar grizzly eats his own cubs to prevent competition. We say," That's just nature".

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This.  I stopped believing completely 5-6 years ago.
I don't believe there is a God but hope I'm wrong.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:47:38 PM EDT
[#24]
God gives us free will, and He gives us choices to make. Some people choose to be horrible. That is their doing, not God.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:50:54 PM EDT
[#25]
I’m not sure either way. But I’m thankful for the moral structure the church provided me and billions of other across the globe. As for evil acts providing you evidence there is no god, it’s quite clear that there is free will with or without god… and according to the teachings, that kid is now in paradise for eternity and the wrongdoers are in hell. I’m not saying that what I believe, but that’s how the Bible would explain it.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:51:02 PM EDT
[#26]
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Quoted:
When I found out Santa wasn't real at about six i became enlightened that tooth fairy, Easter bunny, and religion was all complete fairy tale bullshit. It has always been baffling to me that anyone is dumb enough to buy into any organized religion.  Is it possible something created the universe? Sure.  But the ideas of sky dad that so many people believe are absolutely ridiculous.
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Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:51:26 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
I think I may have posted this before, but the "do you believe in spirits" etc. thread got me thinking again.  What was the turning point for you to renounce religion?

Myself?  My daughter was 2, our second was on the way, and locally some sick fucks locked a 3 year old in a dog crate and starved/tortured him to death.  At that point I decided that if there was a god, he was a fucking douche bag.  It hit me hard, I don't know why, but I sobbed when I read what happened to that little boy.  I'd rather burn in hell than be associated with a "god" that allows such acts to happen.
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Nothing good in life can occur without evil. Without evil there is no sacrifice, no honor, no generosity, no mercy and nothing to overcome.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:52:12 PM EDT
[#28]
I have not.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:54:34 PM EDT
[#29]
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Quoted:
A vegan, a Crossfitter and an atheist a Baptist preacher looking for a discount walk into a bar. How do you know which one is which?

Don't worry, they'll tell you.
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Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:55:38 PM EDT
[#30]
Man fell. God just gave someone the opportunity to think and act on their own. Without Him as well unless they wanted otherwise. Men walking around committing heinous crimes and lawlessness are the result in many cases. Sin, is sin and we have all fallen short. Even if you say, "God doesn't exist," this doesn't release you from God's responsibility to judge and evaluate you when your days are through. You will be held to account. This is the price of freedom and because of God's grace for you. Not against you. Your reasoning and attitude completely belong to you. You may use it as you will. God is the epitome of all strength and knowledge. So, why aren't we too by now?
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:57:49 PM EDT
[#31]
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Quoted:

Yep.....I was raised in the church and the older I got I noticed God only got credit for the good stuff in people's lives.  If God is all powerful then he gets to take credit for the bad along with the good......if he gets credit for grandma beating the flu, then he gets credit for a 3 year old dying of cancer.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Too many times I saw inexplicable, unjust human suffering explained away as part of "God's plan." An omnipotent being would have to be sadistic to have a plan like that.

Yep.....I was raised in the church and the older I got I noticed God only got credit for the good stuff in people's lives.  If God is all powerful then he gets to take credit for the bad along with the good......if he gets credit for grandma beating the flu, then he gets credit for a 3 year old dying of cancer.

People are fallible and generally not all that deep thinking, honestly.

However, it says to be thankful for all things. That is good and the bad. If one ever truly believes in a Supreme Being Creator, they must believe that all that happens or doesn't happen is within what that omnipotent being knew was going to be when They created the universe and whar we perceive as time.

My grandpa came as close as I ever knew someone to get to walking the walk. He gave the eulogy for his mom with a great big, genuine smile. I'll never forget that.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 12:59:38 PM EDT
[#32]
I never believed in any higher power. No one in my family did either.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:01:37 PM EDT
[#33]
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God gives us free will, and He gives us choices to make. Some people choose to be horrible. That is their doing, not God.
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How does that fit with little kids getting cancer?  Does that fall under the "God works in mysterious ways" or "It must be the devil"?
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:01:44 PM EDT
[#34]
Never stopped and it's foolish to think otherwise.

To think that everything you and everyone are living in miraculously appeared and evolved from NOTHING. Believing in that is a kind of faith that few Christians - or others - can match. "First there was nothing. Then it exploded. Now we have puppies."

Bad things happen to innocents. And it sucks. How/why this happens is hard to understand if not impossible at this time.

On the other side of the same coin, ever notice that when there is a disaster and people are in danger that many go to save them? Some hikers get lost or some sort of calamity and there is never a lack of volunteers. Some times it's 1 person but 50 people will put their life on the line to save them. How do you explain this? From a simple math problem it makes no sense whatsoever to risk 50 for 1 but it still happens. Every day. Why? There is a lot of unexplained bad and good in the human condition.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:03:44 PM EDT
[#35]
High school.
I was in Rome - Catholics.

Two of them priests tried stuff on me. But I already loved pussy, so I didn't let them - but I still remember vividly that that killed religion for me.

I'm still a Christian - have been for all my life - and my belief is not anymore of a white bearded God the way we've been told.
I've become spiritual in other ways and I think Christianity is still the healthiest form of spirituality there is - especially for us westerners.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:03:47 PM EDT
[#36]
36 years old, believe in the God of the Bible as much if not more so than at any point in my life.

People are jerks, but a loving God would give us free willm
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:04:09 PM EDT
[#37]
I started really believing in God when I prayed for a reason to keep on living, didn’t get one, and then my 1911 went Click instead of Bang against the side of my head, twice.

I’ve not been the best Christian, but I keep trying.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:04:34 PM EDT
[#38]
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People are fallible and generally not all that deep thinking, honestly.

However, it says to be thankful for all things. That is good and the bad. If one ever truly believes in a Supreme Being Creator, they must believe that all that happens or doesn't happen is within what that omnipotent being knew was going to be when They created the universe and whar we perceive as time.

My grandpa came as close as I ever knew someone to get to walking the walk. He gave the eulogy for his mom with a great big, genuine smile. I'll never forget that.
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Quoted:
Too many times I saw inexplicable, unjust human suffering explained away as part of "God's plan." An omnipotent being would have to be sadistic to have a plan like that.

Yep.....I was raised in the church and the older I got I noticed God only got credit for the good stuff in people's lives.  If God is all powerful then he gets to take credit for the bad along with the good......if he gets credit for grandma beating the flu, then he gets credit for a 3 year old dying of cancer.

People are fallible and generally not all that deep thinking, honestly.

However, it says to be thankful for all things. That is good and the bad. If one ever truly believes in a Supreme Being Creator, they must believe that all that happens or doesn't happen is within what that omnipotent being knew was going to be when They created the universe and whar we perceive as time.

My grandpa came as close as I ever knew someone to get to walking the walk. He gave the eulogy for his mom with a great big, genuine smile. I'll never forget that.

My guess is that most of it comes down to confirmation bias, people want to believe and want to see things in the world that reinforce their beliefs.  

Like I said, I was raised in the church, and most of my immediate family is still very active in the church.  I don't think poorly of people who choose to believe and choose to be active in religion.....I've just decided that it's not for me.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:04:55 PM EDT
[#39]
Around 12-14 I'd guess.

Kept thinking I'd be struck down with a bolt of lightning if I fully denied belief.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:05:34 PM EDT
[#40]
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Nothing good in life can occur without evil. Without evil there is no sacrifice, no honor, no generosity, no mercy and nothing to overcome.
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Is it discomforting to think that all of this could be meaningless save the survival of our species and our emotions? Is that possibility so depressing that we want to believe that we are special and destined for an afterlife with an all powerful God?
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:05:51 PM EDT
[#41]
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Too many times I saw inexplicable, unjust human suffering explained away as part of "God's plan." An omnipotent being would have to be sadistic to have a plan like that.
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I was listening to a neurologist make an analogy. He occasionally treats children.

One of the tests he does in order to make a diagnosis is to run electrical current through the kid's nerve endings. It is very painful. He understands why, the parents understand why, but there is no way you can truly make that child understand why this must be done to him. He may even accept the parent's explanation, but he lacks the reason to truly understand.

Much the same are we, when we look at evils suffered.

Perhaps the child in OPs story caused 4 people to become detectives, who will find and expose more adults who abuse children. We cannot know the good that comes from terrible evils because we lack the entire picture.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:07:33 PM EDT
[#42]
When I was like 6. I don’t want to wake up early Sunday morning to go to church. I’d rather sleep in.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:10:21 PM EDT
[#43]
Never stopped.  I have seen quite a few people die as a soldier.  I have seen two people who saw the devil before they passed. And begged me to help them.   I have seen many people who saw angles before they died.  Just because bad crazy people do bad things doesn't mean there is not a god.  Humans have free will. The people who did bad things will have to answer for that when they check out of hotel earth.  It would be too easy if there wasn't a god.  

Regards
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:10:25 PM EDT
[#44]
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How does that fit with little kids getting cancer?  Does that fall under the "God works in mysterious ways" or "It must be the devil"?
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Quoted:
God gives us free will, and He gives us choices to make. Some people choose to be horrible. That is their doing, not God.

How does that fit with little kids getting cancer?  Does that fall under the "God works in mysterious ways" or "It must be the devil"?

A world in denial about the way things really are. Cancer or any other type of sickness is the same. Children die. Adults and adolescents die. Spiritually, no one ever dies. If dying is an inevitability, everyone must die of something. Maturity has its logic. Maybe you should find some. In your perfect world.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:12:17 PM EDT
[#45]
My mother was an atheist, my father was an atheist, my sister was apathetic and i was a smug atheist. I started going to church with my wife and gradually the fog and gloom of atheism vanished. I to this day cant believe i was so foolish and cheated myself from knowing Jesus for so long. I am thankful everyday God didnt give up on me. My Family? the smart smug ones? Absolutely miserable people whose value system has left them bitter and estranged from each other. I pray for them every day.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:12:26 PM EDT
[#46]
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Quoted:

How does that fit with little kids getting cancer?  Does that fall under the "God works in mysterious ways" or "It must be the devil"?
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Quoted:
Quoted:
God gives us free will, and He gives us choices to make. Some people choose to be horrible. That is their doing, not God.

How does that fit with little kids getting cancer?  Does that fall under the "God works in mysterious ways" or "It must be the devil"?


You (a casual onlooker) seem pretty certain that God cheated that child out of something.

How do you know that, exactly?

Note the unspoken accusation that God--Who intentionally called that child into existence out of nothingness--has somehow wronged that child with His plan for that child's life.  Perhaps you should more carefully scrutinize your prideful/self-righteous accusations.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:13:53 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted:
I think I may have posted this before, but the "do you believe in spirits" etc. thread got me thinking again.  What was the turning point for you to renounce religion?

Myself?  My daughter was 2, our second was on the way, and locally some sick fucks locked a 3 year old in a dog crate and starved/tortured him to death.  At that point I decided that if there was a god, he was a fucking douche bag.  It hit me hard, I don't know why, but I sobbed when I read what happened to that little boy.  I'd rather burn in hell than be associated with a "god" that allows such acts to happen.
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That is silly. You blame God for the behavior of some sicko? What makes you think God is at fault? That little boy is in heaven with the Father. He has a new body and has no pain or disfigurement. The sicko is in hell with Satan. The penalty for sin is death. He sent his Son to pay the price for our sins. What more do you want? God isn't to blame, man is.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:13:57 PM EDT
[#48]
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nope.  more have been killed in the pursuit of a godless society.
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Religion has killed more people than any other group.




nope.  more have been killed in the pursuit of a godless society.



The particular godless you speak of are irrationals, just like the godful. BOTH have contributed greatly to the unnecessary pain in the world.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:14:13 PM EDT
[#49]
I stopped when I was about 16.  Found Him again when I was in my early 30s.  

I’ll pray for all you none believers.
Link Posted: 6/21/2022 1:14:19 PM EDT
[#50]
y'all should read "the case for christ" then come back.
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