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Posted: 9/3/2023 7:41:19 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Risking Kansas City for Kiev is not something I’m signing up for. Well, when The Day After occurs for real, we can all huddle around the last operating Hallicrafters SW radio to hear the results of the Donetsk Sewer and Water Board elections. 
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Posted: 9/3/2023 7:42:38 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, when The Day After occurs for real, we can all huddle around the last operating Hallicrafters SW radio to hear the results of the Donetsk Sewer and Water Board elections. I’d watch a remake of that movie but they would woke it up too much. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 7:46:48 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought this thread was about legitimacy of news sites. I was wrong. If it was, it would be a page long, and everyone would agree that ZH is propaganda. Ultimately, it’s about egos. One or two guys that enjoy duping people, and the rest of them, who suspect deep down they got duped, but are loathe to admit it, even to themselves.  |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 7:47:45 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Truth. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Ukraine broke this website The mods have allowed a handful of posters to "own" an issue in stark contrast to the actual sentiment of the userbase. Truth. I guess you missed R0N, FlyNavy75 and myself being called Russian shills. You know, in this thread. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 7:53:41 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess you missed R0N, FlyNavy75 and myself being called Russian shills. You know, in this thread. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Ukraine broke this website The mods have allowed a handful of posters to "own" an issue in stark contrast to the actual sentiment of the userbase. Truth. I guess you missed R0N, FlyNavy75 and myself being called Russian shills. You know, in this thread.  " />
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Posted: 9/3/2023 7:54:48 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Correct, I have not answered your questions. They are a distraction and purposely tangential on your part to avoid discussing your posting style as I questioned in my very first quote of one of your posts. I don't have a "hard on" for you. You just happen to be the perfect example to point out the posting style and behavior that haunts any thread on Ukraine. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: EVERY single news website makes money by selling ads. Generating clicks with eyeballs looking at those ads is done by selling people what they want to hear. It's even more effective and profitable when you can trigger the "outrage index". WaPo markets news to liberals just like Fox News markets news to conservatives (heh). The truth is nuanced, and the gratification of a site legitimizing what you want to hear is a dopamine hit. ETA - They also sell the analytics information from your activity.... So for the old dudes out there, that's why every ad you see on Fox is for horny grannies after you watch some grey bush porn. Your premise happens to be a bit wrong. ZeroHedge and Epoch times don’t make a ton of money selling ads. That should have been the first clue. Here you make a factual statement about their income. Do you have any citations to support this claim? Do you work for them? Go ahead and post up the numbers. The ads I’ve seen, don’t look very lucrative to me. At all. Post up the financials though, if you can find them. We all know they can’t be faked. I have to cut grass today and air conditioning to fix, etc, but I’ll check back in later to see what you’ve revealed. I’m curious, but not curious enough to waste hours searching. There’s only so much time in each day. YOU made a "factual" statement. " ZeroHedge and Epoch times don’t make a ton of money selling ads. " When asked for proof, it turns out it was just your opinion......and then demand that someone else find the information to support YOUR assertion.   First you change the subject. Then can't remember what I may have posted, but call me out for what you can't remember.  At one point you said: "That’s how propaganda works. You take well known Facts, and then you twist and redirect them with your own skillful wording." Clearly you know this well, as it is an apt description of your posting style. As I said before: "You aren't interested in conversation, debate or finding answers. You are berating people into agreeing with you, or if not, then deriding their viewpoint." Like the good propagandist. You’ve got such a hard on for me, but you’re just spewing nonsense. Trying to argue, over literally Nothing. You haven’t even answered the first basic question that I asked. Let me simplify it: US To Arm Ukraine With Toxic Depleted Uranium Munitions Tyler Durden's Photo BY TYLER DURDEN SUNDAY, SEP 03, 2023 - 07:35 AM In the latest manifestation of the War State's depraved indifference to human suffering in Ukraine, the United States will soon pour depleted-uranium munitions into its proxy war against Russia, according to an exclusive report from Reuters. I posted This, as an example of Pro-Russian propaganda. Do you agree, or do you dispute it? We can’t have an argument unless you take a position. Stop equivocating and answer the Question. It’s the Internet for Christ sake. There’s nothing to be scared of. Correct, I have not answered your questions. They are a distraction and purposely tangential on your part to avoid discussing your posting style as I questioned in my very first quote of one of your posts. I don't have a "hard on" for you. You just happen to be the perfect example to point out the posting style and behavior that haunts any thread on Ukraine. Lolz. Even the worst trolls, are willing to take a stand. You lack all conviction, and yet you hope to chalk up a win based on semantics. I’ve argued with the most contentious and cantankerous minds on Arfcom. Hannibal Lectors who could make you swallow your tongue with a quick turn of phrase. You’re terrible at this. Just blahhhh. The Joe Biden of ArfArguments. I never argued with Deej, because I felt sorry for him, but he could put you to shame. Is a man that stands for Nothing, really a Man at all? |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 7:56:58 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought this thread was about legitimacy of news sites. I was wrong. Every thread is a Ukraine pissing match in disguise. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:00:32 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Every thread is a Ukraine pissing match in disguise. It's LARPing of a day in America's past where free men had debates and arguments of the issues of the day. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:01:52 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Every thread is a Ukraine pissing match in disguise. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I thought this thread was about legitimacy of news sites. I was wrong. Every thread is a Ukraine pissing match in disguise. Haha no shit.... I've been wondering if the usual players should just shag and get it over with. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:06:50 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't think you have the faculties to understand an "argument." Considering that you have to resort to ad hominem attacks, you must feel that your argument is unbelievably weak. You're right. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:07:54 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess you missed R0N, FlyNavy75 and myself being called Russian shills. You know, in this thread. Don't take it too personal, the folks saying that are not exactly critical and deep thinkers. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:08:40 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Ukrainian partisans have a singular problem that their pet foreign policy problem is in the hands of, shall we say, a military and foreign policy team pretty unencumbered by prior success. I'm just quoting this because it's so well said. It's poetic. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:13:11 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's LARPing of a day in America's past where free men had debates and arguments of the issues of the day. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Every thread is a Ukraine pissing match in disguise. It's LARPing of a day in America's past where free men had debates and arguments of the issues of the day. I have a question I thought about posting, but I don’t feel like wading through pages of idiotic replies. You and Ron have the only interesting-educated-mature opinions on the anti side of the isle, anyway. (There’s Probably a couple more I left out). Perhaps we can salvage this thread? Anyway, Who do you think is the ultimate over-riding power, who is giving the orders to help Ukraine resist Russia? We know Germany was pretty cozy with Russia. We know Great Britain is pretty pacified and not all that great anymore. We know that Biden is non-coherent. It’s actually a little surprising that resistance to Russia has been as strong and unified as it is. (And I’m not saying it’s very strong or unified) Obviously, Putin didn’t expect it. You guys tell me your theories, and I’ll tell you mine. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:17:31 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And yeah, I am not surprised at all that you think the United States is a big threat to the world and that you have all your FSB talking points ready as to why Americans should see their own government as the enemy. I doubt you are in direct cahoots with the FSB, that doesn't fit your profile. What does fit is that you have been well and truly turned by their propaganda so that you have effectively become an enemy of your own country, even if that's not how you see it Damn, dude, take some meds. That was out of line. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:20:26 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Zerohedge specializes in non mainstream stories and leaks about Putin always premiere on CNN and such. People's inclination to believe the Egypt villa story could be for similar reasons they pay special attention to This Website is Not Secure warnings for .ua domains. That shit is very commonplace over there. It doesn't take the Russain propaganda apparatus for them to know we are sending billions to a shady country. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: You are deliberately keying in on one story to distort the pattern. Citing the Russian MoD is hardly the issue here. You were in the Egyptian Villa thread, proudly accepting it as unvarnished truth. That story, like so many others, likely started in the Kremlin. But, it's difficult to prove. What is easy to prove is it has zero credibility. And the media sources who managed to discover it and amplify it aways seem to find such obscure sources of information perfectly credible, with each link in the chain making bolder and bolder assertions of credibility, all while not even claiming to have done anything to validate the veracity of the story. And, these stories always seem to advance the same narrative. You never find, say, the many stories on the internet about Putin's alleged foreign property portfolio making the "ZeroHedge" cut. Funny that. Instead, we get articles about Putin's soaring domestic popularity or Russia's announcement of free grain for certain African countries. Zerohedge specializes in non mainstream stories and leaks about Putin always premiere on CNN and such. People's inclination to believe the Egypt villa story could be for similar reasons they pay special attention to This Website is Not Secure warnings for .ua domains. That shit is very commonplace over there. It doesn't take the Russain propaganda apparatus for them to know we are sending billions to a shady country. Yawn. Here’s an interesting story, no? No big Western coverage that I’ve seen. Will ZeroHedge report it? https://themessenger.com/news/top-russian-rocket-scientist-dies-of-mushroom-poisoning-weeks-after-moscows-failed-moon-landing |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:21:17 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Uke guys crying about the discourse of the topic and at the same time saying you are an enemy of your own country. Tiresome and transparent. Like many other subjects, you can find idiots on both sides of the argument. Sometimes I wonder if they act like that just to discredit a group with outrageous behavior, and they don't really believe in that particular side at all. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:30:41 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lolz. Even the worst trolls, are willing to take a stand. You lack all conviction, and yet you hope to chalk up a win based on semantics. I’ve argued with the most contentious and cantankerous minds on Arfcom. Hannibal Lectors who could make you swallow your tongue with a quick turn of phrase. You’re terrible at this. Just blahhhh. The Joe Biden or ArfDebates. I never argued with Deej, because I felt sorry for him, but he would have done far better than you. Can a man that stands for Nothing, really consider himself a Man? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: EVERY single news website makes money by selling ads. Generating clicks with eyeballs looking at those ads is done by selling people what they want to hear. It's even more effective and profitable when you can trigger the "outrage index". WaPo markets news to liberals just like Fox News markets news to conservatives (heh). The truth is nuanced, and the gratification of a site legitimizing what you want to hear is a dopamine hit. ETA - They also sell the analytics information from your activity.... So for the old dudes out there, that's why every ad you see on Fox is for horny grannies after you watch some grey bush porn. Your premise happens to be a bit wrong. ZeroHedge and Epoch times don’t make a ton of money selling ads. That should have been the first clue. Here you make a factual statement about their income. Do you have any citations to support this claim? Do you work for them? Go ahead and post up the numbers. The ads I’ve seen, don’t look very lucrative to me. At all. Post up the financials though, if you can find them. We all know they can’t be faked. I have to cut grass today and air conditioning to fix, etc, but I’ll check back in later to see what you’ve revealed. I’m curious, but not curious enough to waste hours searching. There’s only so much time in each day. YOU made a "factual" statement. " ZeroHedge and Epoch times don’t make a ton of money selling ads. " When asked for proof, it turns out it was just your opinion......and then demand that someone else find the information to support YOUR assertion. First you change the subject. Then can't remember what I may have posted, but call me out for what you can't remember. At one point you said: "That’s how propaganda works. You take well known Facts, and then you twist and redirect them with your own skillful wording." Clearly you know this well, as it is an apt description of your posting style. As I said before: "You aren't interested in conversation, debate or finding answers. You are berating people into agreeing with you, or if not, then deriding their viewpoint." Like the good propagandist. You’ve got such a hard on for me, but you’re just spewing nonsense. Trying to argue, over literally Nothing. You haven’t even answered the first basic question that I asked. Let me simplify it: US To Arm Ukraine With Toxic Depleted Uranium Munitions Tyler Durden's Photo BY TYLER DURDEN SUNDAY, SEP 03, 2023 - 07:35 AM In the latest manifestation of the War State's depraved indifference to human suffering in Ukraine, the United States will soon pour depleted-uranium munitions into its proxy war against Russia, according to an exclusive report from Reuters. I posted This, as an example of Pro-Russian propaganda. Do you agree, or do you dispute it? We can’t have an argument unless you take a position. Stop equivocating and answer the Question. It’s the Internet for Christ sake. There’s nothing to be scared of. Correct, I have not answered your questions. They are a distraction and purposely tangential on your part to avoid discussing your posting style as I questioned in my very first quote of one of your posts. I don't have a "hard on" for you. You just happen to be the perfect example to point out the posting style and behavior that haunts any thread on Ukraine. Lolz. Even the worst trolls, are willing to take a stand. You lack all conviction, and yet you hope to chalk up a win based on semantics. I’ve argued with the most contentious and cantankerous minds on Arfcom. Hannibal Lectors who could make you swallow your tongue with a quick turn of phrase. You’re terrible at this. Just blahhhh. The Joe Biden or ArfDebates. I never argued with Deej, because I felt sorry for him, but he would have done far better than you. Can a man that stands for Nothing, really consider himself a Man? I'm not arguing with you. I am using you as an example. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:32:56 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted: Now I see arfcommers repeating this bullshit. Is there validity to it? Seems like most of their articles are simply reposted from other sites, with a few being organically zerohedge. I've been reading ZH for quite a while, there's most assuredly a bias (but show me a "news" site with no bias and I'll show you the image of a sucker in a mirror). The first time I heard this it was on some leftist media watchlist or something, now arfcommers are calling it Russian Prop as well? I call BS. Show me, prove it, or at least provide some reasonable evidence. You are Russian propaganda.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:42:12 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess you missed R0N, FlyNavy75 and myself being called Russian shills. You know, in this thread. I mean obviously you must be, you arent parroting the ukebro anthem, I bet you didnt even rate this as a troll thread.... /s |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 8:46:05 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Like many other subjects, you can find idiots on both sides of the argument. Sometimes I wonder if they act like that just to discredit a group with outrageous behavior, and they don't really believe in that particular side at all. lol, there has to be at least one. Seems like the legit pro-Ukraine info ops posters would be the ones compiling lists of posts and trying to get people banned once they identified a particular poster as needing to be shut up to protect from hybrid russian influence or whatever they call it. If you see somebody calling people russian shills but not putting much effort into winning the argument, that's probably what is going on. They are hoping the other person will be like "Ok, I am a russian shill now, fuck you" out of spite. But I would wager the legit pro-ukraine posters generate the most hate for ukraine. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 9:29:55 PM EDT
[#21]
I hate that fucking site. It’s the source of most of my dad’s opinions these days. He used to be a run of the mill religious right guy as I grew up. He distrusted the media, but interacted with the real world, his friends, and his church. Now he doom scrolls through most of his days on zerohedge and related sites.
In theory, I’m against censoring the web and social media until I see what it’s done to old people like him. It makes me think they’re aught to be rules. I understand the guy who runs the site is going through a contentious divorce and doesn’t want the government to know what he makes or how it might impact his alimony. But the anti-US tilt has gone into loon territory. And no, I don’t fact check every post. This type of fringe site exists on the “why can’t you ask questions?” approach of half truths and hype. It’s made conversation in our family impossible on so many topics. If you read it, I feel sorry for you and the people who have to deal with you on a regular basis. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 9:35:39 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I hate that fucking site. It’s the source of most of my dad’s opinions these days. He used to be a run of the mill religious right guy as I grew up. He distrusted the media, but interacted with the real world, his friends, and his church. Now he doom scrolls through most of his days on zerohedge and related sites. In theory, I’m against censoring the web and social media until I see what it’s done to old people like him. It makes me think they’re aught to be rules. I understand the guy who runs the site is going through a contentious divorce and doesn’t want the government to know what he makes or how it might impact his alimony. But the anti-US tilt has gone into loon territory. And no, I don’t fact check every post. This type of fringe site exists on the “why can’t you ask questions?” approach of half truths and hype. It’s made conversation in our family impossible on so many topics. If you read it, I feel sorry for you and the people who have to deal with you on a regular basis. No matter the question, the answer is never censorship |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 9:46:27 PM EDT
[#23]
Has ZH ever disagreed with the Russian narrative?
I love that there’s no attempt at defense, just instant counter accusations. Predictable. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 10:04:51 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Has ZH ever disagreed with the Russian narrative? I love that there’s no attempt at defense, just instant counter accusations. Predictable. Just ignore every piece of evidence and try to make the subject thread about Biden or the “MSM.” That’s the general gist for these things. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 10:05:11 PM EDT
[#25]
No I don’t favor censorship or Facebook determining what is truth. But I see how social media conspiracies prey on people like my father and yes, it inclines me to favor whatever would shut them down. Real life is messy like that.
Having gone through a divorce that wrecked my life, I can imagine how “Tyler Durden” can hate the courts, the government, and everything threatening to turn him into an indentured servant to his ex wife; but the way his site has twisted a man who I used to know is unforgivable. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 11:18:22 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No I don’t favor censorship or Facebook determining what is truth. But I see how social media conspiracies prey on people like my father and yes, it inclines me to favor whatever would shut them down. Real life is messy like that. Having gone through a divorce that wrecked my life, I can imagine how “Tyler Durden” can hate the courts, the government, and everything threatening to turn him into an indentured servant to his ex wife; but the way his site has twisted a man who I used to know is unforgivable. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 11:24:29 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No I don’t favor censorship or Facebook determining what is truth. But I see how social media conspiracies prey on people like my father and yes, it inclines me to favor whatever would shut them down. Real life is messy like that. Having gone through a divorce that wrecked my life, I can imagine how “Tyler Durden” can hate the courts, the government, and everything threatening to turn him into an indentured servant to his ex wife; but the way his site has twisted a man who I used to know is unforgivable. "but" But you do favor some sort of censorship because of what you incorrectly blame Zero Hedge for. You need to blame the individual (your father) and deal with it that way. Real life and accountability IS messy like that. |
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Posted: 9/3/2023 11:59:04 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I love how the paid agitators and propagandist's, always make a subtle appearance in these threads. Can't have factual dialog being exchanged, amongst people that think for themselves.  Every_single_day 
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Posted: 9/4/2023 12:21:33 AM EDT
[#29]
So what did we decide, is Zero Hedge Russian propaganda or not?
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Posted: 9/4/2023 12:31:08 AM EDT
[#30]
So the USA is NOT in fact $32 trillion in debt, with hordes of invaders pouring over the border, showing all the signs of an empire in the later stages of collapse? What a relief to discover this, thanks OP!
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Posted: 9/4/2023 12:38:49 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Iraq war was illegal and breached UN charter, says Annan It must suck to lack historical perspective Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Are you in favor of seizing Russian assets in Western countries and giving them to Ukraine as reparations? I'm guessing no, you will find some excuse to back the Kremlin even on things that don't cost the US taxpayer a penny. So then all your protestations... You've posted this before, and a number of people pointed out that would make the US a more direct party to the war than it is already, and put US companies and investors at a heighted risk of expropriation in their turn, as many parts of the US economy have direct dealing supporting the DOD or US Government more broadly. So your position is based off a false premise, namely that your obvious policy of seizure of assets is even legal, let alone a good policy for the majority of Americans. Things would change is a war were declared, but right now we have people wanting the US to take further actions permissible in war, but not at the current state of peace. The United Nations has already declared the invasion illegal. We have already imposed various sanctions on Russia as a result. These are assets belonging to Russian oligarchs that are within the territory of NATO countries. Seizing them and giving them to Ukraine is really quite in line with what we have already done and far less belligerent than sending weapons. It's a wedge question that brings out the hypocrisy in those claiming to be thinking only of the poor American taxpayer. The Russians have executed a very successful propaganda campaign. They have taken distrust of the American government and done a bit of jujitsu to turn people from critics of the government to opponents of the United States, and aligned them to outright pro Russian positions. We literally now have people who present themselves as partiots but who believe and say things like the US government is a bigger threat to freedom than the Kremlin, who think everything is a CIA plot while forwarding talking points generated by the FSB, and consider their own country to be their primary enemy. So the UN supersedes 100s of years of precedence and norms for nations? You are aware the UN has declared climate change a global emergency,as such what will you allow them to seize based on that proclamation? I think a pretty good argument could be made that elements of the so called deep are as greater a threat to the survival of the US than the Russians. Remember the FBI making up the Russia Hoax? Suppressing the Hunter Biden laptop? And it was not 51 Russian officials cited by POTUS to shut down any questions of him receiving bribes during the last campaign. Russia superceded the precedents and norms for nations when it illegally invaded Ukraine. We are well supported by the community of nations in bringing Russia to justice. What we're discussing is how. Iraq war was illegal and breached UN charter, says Annan The United Nations secretary general, Kofi Annan, declared explicitly for the first time last night that the US-led war on Iraq was illegal. It must suck to lack historical perspective Is it your view that the United States is the biggest threat to freedom in the world and that Russia is the victim here? Because that's what you're implying with this whatabouting. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 1:51:14 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So what did we decide, is Zero Hedge Russian propaganda or not? If you don't already know, then it shows you don't have the intellect nor ability to make the cognitive decision that it is. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 2:19:12 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you don't already know, then it shows you don't have the intellect nor ability to make the cognitive decision that it is. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So what did we decide, is Zero Hedge Russian propaganda or not? If you don't already know, then it shows you don't have the intellect nor ability to make the cognitive decision that it is.  |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 5:38:13 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is it your view that the United States is the biggest threat to freedom in the world and that Russia is the victim here? Because that's what you're implying with this whatabouting. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Are you in favor of seizing Russian assets in Western countries and giving them to Ukraine as reparations? I'm guessing no, you will find some excuse to back the Kremlin even on things that don't cost the US taxpayer a penny. So then all your protestations... You've posted this before, and a number of people pointed out that would make the US a more direct party to the war than it is already, and put US companies and investors at a heighted risk of expropriation in their turn, as many parts of the US economy have direct dealing supporting the DOD or US Government more broadly. So your position is based off a false premise, namely that your obvious policy of seizure of assets is even legal, let alone a good policy for the majority of Americans. Things would change is a war were declared, but right now we have people wanting the US to take further actions permissible in war, but not at the current state of peace. The United Nations has already declared the invasion illegal. We have already imposed various sanctions on Russia as a result. These are assets belonging to Russian oligarchs that are within the territory of NATO countries. Seizing them and giving them to Ukraine is really quite in line with what we have already done and far less belligerent than sending weapons. It's a wedge question that brings out the hypocrisy in those claiming to be thinking only of the poor American taxpayer. The Russians have executed a very successful propaganda campaign. They have taken distrust of the American government and done a bit of jujitsu to turn people from critics of the government to opponents of the United States, and aligned them to outright pro Russian positions. We literally now have people who present themselves as partiots but who believe and say things like the US government is a bigger threat to freedom than the Kremlin, who think everything is a CIA plot while forwarding talking points generated by the FSB, and consider their own country to be their primary enemy. So the UN supersedes 100s of years of precedence and norms for nations? You are aware the UN has declared climate change a global emergency,as such what will you allow them to seize based on that proclamation? I think a pretty good argument could be made that elements of the so called deep are as greater a threat to the survival of the US than the Russians. Remember the FBI making up the Russia Hoax? Suppressing the Hunter Biden laptop? And it was not 51 Russian officials cited by POTUS to shut down any questions of him receiving bribes during the last campaign. Russia superceded the precedents and norms for nations when it illegally invaded Ukraine. We are well supported by the community of nations in bringing Russia to justice. What we're discussing is how. Iraq war was illegal and breached UN charter, says Annan The United Nations secretary general, Kofi Annan, declared explicitly for the first time last night that the US-led war on Iraq was illegal. It must suck to lack historical perspective Is it your view that the United States is the biggest threat to freedom in the world and that Russia is the victim here? Because that's what you're implying with this whatabouting. Whataboutism was a term invented to prevent people from having to address the elephant in the room, both their ignorance of the subject and often their hypocrisy Did you not understand that you said the UN is justification for something, while I posted something to shows why using the UN to justify something is stupid. I will make it even simpler for you. The same organization has said the same thing about the US, meaning the same action you want could be taken against the US if one was dumb enough to believe that had any authority on the subject. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 6:35:31 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just ignore every piece of evidence and try to make the subject thread about Biden or the “MSM.” That’s the general gist for these things. Don't forget "ukebros". |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 9:54:44 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not really. More than and by far the bulk of Ukraine threads and the bulk of the antagonizing is from the anti Ukraine crowd. Many time the pro Ukraine crowd does make attempts to provide reasonable post on the topic. Meanwhile the anti crowd pumps a thread of worthless in before, play victim and such post. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Ukraine broke this website The mods have allowed a handful of posters to "own" an issue in stark contrast to the actual sentiment of the userbase.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:07:02 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So I guess according to you that it's just me and faded that are making a mess. You don't name others because why ? It not like we aren't responding to post that aren't there. If you are going to try and hold just two members accountable then it seems you are one sided in this. If you had taken the time to even hint that hat I've been called a cuck, simp and sucked Zelensky's cocktail you might come across as somewhat reasonable. I don't think I have seen once say those acts are wrong. Yet you sure are quick to blame faded and I. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:10:19 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I honestly don't give a rip either way. it's not in our best interest to be involved over there. We have massive domestic issues that need attention, and money, and we're blowing billions of dollars overseas and taking our eye off what's most important-our country- you know, where we live. Rather than impeaching the bums Washington, securing our boarders, stopping the drugs, gangs, and human trafficking, we're bickering here about Ukraine vs Russia after 8 years of BS "Russian election interference" propaganda and the current sitting president who took bribes from and extorted Ukraine for personal gain. These are facts. This whole issue is a scam on all of us and if you fight about this issue more than whats happening ON OUR DOORSTEP then i hope you realize soon that we're all getting played. https://www.politico.com/news/2023/08/30/fema-disaster-low-funds-00113468 |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:11:40 AM EDT
[#39]
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:23:26 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Really?? The vast majority of Ukraine threads are posted by 3 people- AC Doctor, sketti, and 84pookie or whatever his name is. And every single one of them posts deliberate misinformation, or has a pro-Russian slant. Then, Ben and faded jump in to set the record straight. That isn't sliding. And it's hardly an example of the pro-Ukraine members spamming GD. Yes we're drawn like moths to a flame, but for the most part we're being drawn by absolute dogshit propaganda that should be called out. Example: some guy in Egypt with a YouTube channel said Zlensky bought a mansion in Egypt. 7 pages of FUCK ZLENSKY FUCK UKRIANE follows. Or, AC posts a thread saying Ukrainian officials have stolen 64 MILLION!!! without specifying it's hyvyrna Monopoly money and the real value is 1.7 million US dollars. Doesn't matter, still got 6 pages of FUCK UKRAINE out of stupid GD'ers. You want to complain about spam and propaganda, start with the big 3 thread starters They all said Robytne is completely in UKR hands. Well as of today it actually isn't and never was. https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/ukraine-wants-to-break-through-russian-defenses-thats-only-the-first-step-d49c6bd3 Russian forces have launched localized counterattacks to impede Ukrainian gains outside Robotyne, said a platoon commander with Ukraine's 47th Brigade who is operating on the town's eastern outskirts. Russian forces fiercely defended the heavily mined road from Robotyne to Verbove, he said of the recent advance. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:31:16 AM EDT
[#41]
I usually stay out of these threads, what else is there to say anyway ?
Nobody knows what's really going on over there, who are you going to believe ? Russia ? Ukraine ? U.S. ? All three sides are known liars. None of you guys are ever going to change your stance on this topic, it's all been hashed out way too many times and every Ukraine thread should be automatically locked as a dupe at this point. All these threads do is create more division among us.
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:32:21 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You are right, your response and most others are textbook definitions of gaslighting. Since you got rightfully kicked from there you constantly shit spam the forum with pro Russian propaganda for the purpose of trolling the community. Thank you for pointing it out. He is right and you are one of the worst offenders. There are some ardent "ukebros" as well but every single day there are multiple BS threads started by you and few other people like you that are nothing more than pro Russian propaganda posted to troll the "ukebros" who apparently are everyone who isn't a Qtard or gobbling up the pro Russian false narratives pushed to western audiences. This behavior is cancerous to the forum and I'm disappointed in the staff for letting trolling happen at the expense of honest discourse. Free and open discussion only works when the parties involved actually believe in honest discussion.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:36:25 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have seen them try to set the record strait many times in which they had no idea what they were talking about just because the facts on the ground did not look great for their side. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:37:02 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You've got such a hard on for me, but you're just spewing nonsense. Trying to argue, over literally Nothing. You haven't even answered the first basic question that I asked. Let me simplify it: US To Arm Ukraine With Toxic Depleted Uranium Munitions Tyler Durden's Photo BY TYLER DURDEN SUNDAY, SEP 03, 2023 - 07:35 AM In the latest manifestation of the War State's depraved indifference to human suffering in Ukraine, the United States will soon pour depleted-uranium munitions into its proxy war against Russia, according to an exclusive report from Reuters. I posted This, as an example of Pro-Russian propaganda. Do you agree, or do you dispute it? We can't have an argument unless you take a position. Stop equivocating and answer the Question. It's the Internet for Christ sake. There's nothing to be scared of. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:48:07 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would wager the legit pro-ukraine posters generate the most hate for ukraine. As someone with friends that have been over and some that continue to go over to "help" Ukraine in one fashion or another and myself having donated lots of medical gear to the Ukrainian effort on more than one occassion...the most prolific pro Ukrainian posters here have all but completely turned me off with regards to Ukraine's current plight.  |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:48:38 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Except Ben and Faded don't set the record straight. They post opinions and UKR propaganda. They all said Robytne is completely in UKR hands. Well as of today it actually isn't and never was. https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/ukraine-wants-to-break-through-russian-defenses-thats-only-the-first-step-d49c6bd3 Russian forces have launched localized counterattacks to impede Ukrainian gains outside Robotyne, said a platoon commander with Ukraine's 47th Brigade who is operating on the town's eastern outskirts. Russian forces fiercely defended the heavily mined road from Robotyne to Verbove, he said of the recent advance. According to independent maps,  To be fair, completion of liberating Robotyne is a recent development and the WSJ is working under a longer time frame for publication. Russian counterattacks outside Robotyne are trying to advance on the town from the outside. Which is all beside the point. Zerohedge is tabloid crap and always has been. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:52:49 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Ukrainian partisans have a singular problem that their pet foreign policy problem is in the hands of, shall we say, a military and foreign policy team pretty unencumbered by prior success.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:53:29 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Again, calling me a Russian supporter. Tiresome. And in this thread we have people boasting that the pro Ukraine posters just want to have a reasonable conversation. Here is example one million of that being a lie. Do you support seizing my personal assets to give to Ukraine as reparations? Come on, let the mask slip a little. |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 10:56:31 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This could make an interesting poll. "Do you support the US government targetting foreign citizens who are not wanted for any crimes and stealing their assets to donate to Ukraine?" Do you want to pull their gold teeth also? |
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Posted: 9/4/2023 11:12:15 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Back the Kremlin, lol. You just can’t help yourself. How bout we stop paying for their pensions first? Haven’t seen one of the cult yet even try and defend my labor being used to fund Ukrainian pensions. Lol, the same chumps that bitch about ending social security are fine with funding it in Ukraine and euro social security schemes make ours look tame… |
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