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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:22:18 PM EDT
Assuming a WWIII style conventional war, where we need to reactivate warships and transports, do we have the industrial/shipbuilding capacity to make it happen?
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:23:56 PM EDT
[#1]
I would definitely say no for some of those unless we were in a fight for our very existence as a nation.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:25:54 PM EDT
[#2]
Any mechanical object from the 20th Century, and most from the 19the Century, can be restored to working condition with the application of enough money.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:26:42 PM EDT
[#3]
In my completely unqualified position, I'd say they're too far gone.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:27:44 PM EDT
[#4]
Can, probably. Ever will, not a chance in hell.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:27:59 PM EDT
[#5]
I don't think there's very many ships there anymore. So, none to "bring back"
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:28:54 PM EDT
[#6]
They'd be worth more in scrap applied to new ships than they would be retrofitted and restored.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:29:11 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any mechanical object from the 20th Century, and most from the 19the Century, can be restored to working condition with the application of enough money. Well yes, but at a certain point I would imagine that t's more time and cost effective to build a new ship. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:30:47 PM EDT
[#8]
We could. It wouldn't take as long to refurb those ships as it would to build new ones, and it would cost less than building new ones. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:35:05 PM EDT
[#9]
Voted yes, and;
Like 'murica as much as I like 'dag. AMERICA DOG |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:39:40 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think there's very many ships there anymore. So, none to "bring back" Seems like since Bush was first elected the Navy's been doing yeoman's work scrapping, sinking, selling, or giving away the warships in the reserve fleet. The NVR doesn't list very many warships in Categories B-D and Z (that are not being dismantled), or even X for that matter (stricken ships still in USN custody), or in MARAD custody. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:40:39 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We could. It wouldn't take as long to refurb those ships as it would to build new ones, and it would cost less than building new ones. How many of these ships have asbestos and other materials on board that would need to be removed and the ship decontaminated? Shit gets expensive quick.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:40:54 PM EDT
[#12]
There isn't much left of the mothball fleet anymore anyway. Those pictures are several years old.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:47:04 PM EDT
[#13]
We would have to re-learn a LOT of manufacturing.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:47:24 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How many of these ships have asbestos and other materials on board that would need to be removed and the ship decontaminated? Shit gets expensive quick. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
We could. It wouldn't take as long to refurb those ships as it would to build new ones, and it would cost less than building new ones. How many of these ships have asbestos and other materials on board that would need to be removed and the ship decontaminated? Shit gets expensive quick. I know that in the past when vessels with asbestos were returned to service they just made sure to seal it off in place, only removing it where they had to do actual work on the vessel. Not sure it would be feasible to remove all of the asbestos on a ship built using it for insulation. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:49:14 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How many of these ships have asbestos and other materials on board that would need to be removed and the ship decontaminated? Shit gets expensive quick. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
We could. It wouldn't take as long to refurb those ships as it would to build new ones, and it would cost less than building new ones. How many of these ships have asbestos and other materials on board that would need to be removed and the ship decontaminated? Shit gets expensive quick. How harmful is asbestos at the bottom of a deep ocean trench? |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:56:09 PM EDT
[#16]
It's fucked. No where near enough amphibs to support the Marine Corps either.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 7:57:58 PM EDT
[#17]
What's the current size? The last time I was at Eustis, I was shocked with how many ships of that reserve fleet had been cleared out.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:00:18 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How many of these ships have asbestos and other materials on board that would need to be removed and the ship decontaminated? Shit gets expensive quick. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
We could. It wouldn't take as long to refurb those ships as it would to build new ones, and it would cost less than building new ones. How many of these ships have asbestos and other materials on board that would need to be removed and the ship decontaminated? Shit gets expensive quick. There are still ships in the fleet that have asbestos in them. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:00:30 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What's the current size? The last time I was at Eustis, I was shocked with how many ships of that reserve fleet had been cleared out. I have no idea. I was watching something the other day about Liberty Ships and was wondering if we could do something like that today. They also made the point that US used a lot of WWI destroyers for escort early in the war and gave them to the Brits (or Canadians...I forget). It just got me thinking about whether we could do that today. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:00:50 PM EDT
[#20]
I spy with my little eye, a battleship in Suisun Bay (second Picture)
Bring Back the Battleships |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:00:57 PM EDT
[#21]
Assuming a WWIII style conventional war, where we need to reactivate warships and transports, do we have the industrial/shipbuilding capacity to make it happen? I doubt it. Given the state of current tech, the war would either be over before we could get the refurb stuff into action or we would never countenance sending men into battle in +40 year old gear. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:05:04 PM EDT
[#22]
Probably not .
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:06:24 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What's the current size? The last time I was at Eustis, I was shocked with how many ships of that reserve fleet had been cleared out. Somewhere between 10-14 ships remaining in Suisun Bay. There really isn't a mothball fleet anymore. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:07:40 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any mechanical object from the 20th Century, and most from the 19the Century, can be restored to working condition with the application of enough money. Truth. Most people drastically underestimate just how much money it would take, though. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:09:53 PM EDT
[#25]
last time I drove over that bridge there was substantially less ships out there, including the Battleship, which is now a museum somewhere (or in process of becoming one, either way its not out there).
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:11:30 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I spy with my little eye, a battleship in Suisun Bay (second Picture) Bring Back the Battleships That's ex-USS Iowa, she's been in Los Angeles Harbor (San Pedro) for a couple years now. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:11:47 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In my completely unqualified position, I'd say they're too far gone. Hell, I've sailed on stuff that looked worse than some of those. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:12:17 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have no idea. I was watching something the other day about Liberty Ships and was wondering if we could do something like that today. They also made the point that US used a lot of WWI destroyers for escort early in the war and gave them to the Brits (or Canadians...I forget). It just got me thinking about whether we could do that today. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What's the current size? The last time I was at Eustis, I was shocked with how many ships of that reserve fleet had been cleared out. I have no idea. I was watching something the other day about Liberty Ships and was wondering if we could do something like that today. They also made the point that US used a lot of WWI destroyers for escort early in the war and gave them to the Brits (or Canadians...I forget). It just got me thinking about whether we could do that today. Of course we could. And then some. I do shipbuilding, commercial and military. Know why it takes two years to build a Navy ship? Because they're insanely complex. Liberty ships are a hull and an engine and not a whole lot else. The Navy also can't afford to pay to either buy a large enough number of ships or for fast enough production schedules to even tickle top shipbuilding speed. It's buying a few hulls a year, from a dozen different shipyards just to try to keep everyone in business and the capability spread out. On the commercial side, ships have become insanely efficient and incredibly reliable. Combine that with 25-kt or higher cruising speeds for anything modern, plus the size advantage, and one ship today can do the work of ten ships from 50 years ago. Look at the Lewis and Clark class (keeping in mind that they're insanely more capable than a Liberty ship). Following the initial design period, one third of one yard delivered 13 ships in 6 years. You ramp up production, put on extra lines, and get a bus in a shitload of welders from across the country? I'll bet you could make a T-AKE every few weeks. It'd be insanely expensive, but it could absolutely be done. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:12:34 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's ex-USS Iowa, she's been in Los Angeles Harbor (San Pedro) for a couple years now. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I spy with my little eye, a battleship in Suisun Bay (second Picture) Bring Back the Battleships That's ex-USS Iowa, she's been in Los Angeles Harbor (San Pedro) for a couple years now. Sea Shadow, on the left of that row is gone too 
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:18:41 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
last time I drove over that bridge there was substantially less ships out there, including the Battleship, which is now a museum somewhere (or in process of becoming one, either way its not out there). She's been a museum since about 2012. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:20:03 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sea Shadow, on the left of that row is gone too Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I spy with my little eye, a battleship in Suisun Bay (second Picture) Bring Back the Battleships That's ex-USS Iowa, she's been in Los Angeles Harbor (San Pedro) for a couple years now. Sea Shadow, on the left of that row is gone too Shit, so's HMB-1, the former Glomar Explorer of "let's scoop a Soviet missile sub off the bottom of the Pacific!" fame. IIRC it's been leased to an actual mineral exploration company (or maybe oil/gas? Can't recall much) |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:21:02 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I spy with my little eye, a battleship in Suisun Bay (second Picture) Bring Back the Battleships A lot of the other ships in the pics have been scrapped. Pull up a view on google maps and you'll see there is just about nothing left. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:21:35 PM EDT
[#33]
We have a fleet of those near where I live. The last time they tried to put a few ships in service, the ships only went a few miles and broke down. The boilers were shot. They are not worth fixing up again. The technology is long obsolete.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:21:47 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Shit, so's HMB-1, the former Glomar Explorer of "let's scoop a Soviet missile sub off the bottom of the Pacific!" fame. IIRC it's been leased to an actual mineral exploration company (or maybe oil/gas? Can't recall much) Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I spy with my little eye, a battleship in Suisun Bay (second Picture) Bring Back the Battleships That's ex-USS Iowa, she's been in Los Angeles Harbor (San Pedro) for a couple years now. Sea Shadow, on the left of that row is gone too Shit, so's HMB-1, the former Glomar Explorer of "let's scoop a Soviet missile sub off the bottom of the Pacific!" fame. IIRC it's been leased to an actual mineral exploration company (or maybe oil/gas? Can't recall much) I think the Glomar Explorer is currently owned and operated by the same oil rig owner that had the one sink in the gulf a couple of years ago ETA: Transocean |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:24:26 PM EDT
[#35]
I know it can be done. I saw em do it on TV!
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:25:07 PM EDT
[#36]
It would be cheaper and faster to build new ships, assuming that we bypass 99.9% of the government rules and regulations so that we can build them exactly as they were when they were originally built.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:28:59 PM EDT
[#37]
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:45:02 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryI know it is fiction, but this scene brings both a tear to my eye and a rock hard diamond cutter to my pants. Every...damn....time. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:45:07 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any mechanical object from the 20th Century, and most from the 19the Century, can be restored to working condition with the application of enough money. While true, I doubt we could. Or that it would be worth it. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:46:02 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think there's very many ships there anymore. So, none to "bring back" This. They're mostly gone. |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:47:51 PM EDT
[#41]
Those are not the only mothballed fleets. Their are several aircraft carriers, subs and other large ships tied together at anchor near me.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:54:25 PM EDT
[#42]
A lot of those ships are there because it's too expensive to junk them.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:56:14 PM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Assuming a WWIII style conventional war, where we need to reactivate warships and transports, do we have the industrial/shipbuilding capacity to make it happen?
goddamn that water is fucking disgusting |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 8:58:20 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: goddamn that water is fucking disgusting Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Assuming a WWIII style conventional war, where we need to reactivate warships and transports, do we have the industrial/shipbuilding capacity to make it happen? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/James_River_Reserve_Fleet_source.jpg goddamn that water is fucking disgusting |
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Posted: 10/17/2014 9:17:26 PM EDT
[#46]
Nothing in those pictures looks like it would be worth reactivating anyways.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 9:26:21 PM EDT
[#47]
I believe we as a nation could if the need arose. There would be a lot of obstacles like the lack of qualified people to do the work. A lot of steel and aluminum would be needed for patch work and such. The Chinese are buying up a lot of local scrap yards and paying top dollar. Three scrap yards in this area have recently been sold to Chinese companies.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 9:34:38 PM EDT
[#48]
Short answer, no, we do not, nor would it make sense to do so.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 9:36:14 PM EDT
[#49]
Depends on the ship,and what maintenance state it's in on how fast/cheaply it can be done, but it can be done, and was just recently - M/V CAPE RAY was taken out or the RRF, activated, and sent to the Med for Syrian chemical weapons demil. Back in layup now.
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Posted: 10/17/2014 9:46:00 PM EDT
[#50]
Wow they are almost gone. I caught a 44lb sturgeon between the 3rd and fourth row. Have to fish the flats now.
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spent 4 years on her 03-07 but in actuality it wasnt in bad of shape when it decommed.