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Posted: 6/11/2016 12:54:02 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That doesn't make a shit.  Look at medieval weapons like the mace and Warhammer which killed the fuck outta people.
When a grown man swings a heavy ass axe, dull or not, it can crush your bones if its hits right. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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something doesn't compute when they dig up battlefield dead from those days, the bodies have sword strikes that took off arms and legs The axes have dull blades. That doesn't make a shit. Look at medieval weapons like the mace and Warhammer which killed the fuck outta people.
When a grown man swings a heavy ass axe, dull or not, it can crush your bones if its hits right. Never figured you for a damsel in distress. 
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Posted: 6/11/2016 1:01:14 AM EDT
[#2]
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Agincourt Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I wish I could remember when and where I read it, but I do remember reading of one battle that involved most of the participants wearing heavy plate armor. If I remember correctly (been a VERY long time) the battle took place in the rain, so bows of either long or cross variety were not involved. The battle went for hours. It finally ended with no one dead and everyone going back to their sides out of exhaustion.  Agincourt Thousands of the French were killed by the English bowmen. Wikipedia says 7-10k french deaths and 1500 noble prisoners vs 112 English casualties. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 1:18:52 AM EDT
[#3]
I've quite literally trained to kill people with swords, knives, and sticks for over 40 years of my life.
Now that I'm old...I still don't think that it was a waste of time. 
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Posted: 6/11/2016 1:25:14 AM EDT
[#4]
Very interesting. I'll be watching these later. Tag
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Posted: 6/11/2016 1:35:39 AM EDT
[#5]
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God its just unorganized retards smacking each other. Says the guy with the retarded avatar.... |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 1:51:36 AM EDT
[#6]
This is the most sick-house thing I've seen all week. Daaaaaaaaaamn.
Go Team USA! Crush them all! |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 1:58:15 AM EDT
[#7]
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Posted: 6/11/2016 2:00:54 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'll take a wild guess and suggest that those dead weren't wearing much for armor. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: something doesn't compute when they dig up battlefield dead from those days, the bodies have sword strikes that took off arms and legs I'll take a wild guess and suggest that those dead weren't wearing much for armor. Full plate armor was expensive. Like buying a tank today. Only the rich nobility could afford it. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 2:14:04 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Knocking him to the ground, or whacking him over the head with a mace. People overestimate the effectiveness of plate armor.  A helmet is only as good as the padding under it, and no matter how good the armor is, a solid hit to the side of the knee will bring you down, hard.
And a morning star fucks armor up, leaving the wearer with sever puncture wounds and broken bones. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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something doesn't compute when they dig up battlefield dead from those days, the bodies have sword strikes that took off arms and legs a full suit of plate was extremely expensive. you know how everyone on arfcom owns a rifle, but only a few guys could afford to show up for militia duty with their own tank? that kind of expensive. Yup. And you'd kill a knight by knocking him down, then shanking. These tournaments don't use piercing weapons. Also seems like the impact weapons are reasonably light - still pretty brutal, but no sledgehammers or anything. That said, I've seen a guy in a plate helmet knocked out cold with a broadsword to the back of the head. Knocking him to the ground, or whacking him over the head with a mace. People overestimate the effectiveness of plate armor. A helmet is only as good as the padding under it, and no matter how good the armor is, a solid hit to the side of the knee will bring you down, hard.
And a morning star fucks armor up, leaving the wearer with sever puncture wounds and broken bones. this post is interesting. tell us more. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 2:57:10 AM EDT
[#10]
That is pretty cool to watch, looks intense. I wonder what kind of money it takes to get outfitted so you don't become brain dead.
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Posted: 6/11/2016 3:43:59 AM EDT
[#11]
Having fought in the SCA and taken part in multiple skirmishes, I can say with authority that all of those guys suck.
No shield wall, no knight guiding their team, just scream and charge. They really suck. Badly. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 3:48:39 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
this post is interesting. tell us more. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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something doesn't compute when they dig up battlefield dead from those days, the bodies have sword strikes that took off arms and legs a full suit of plate was extremely expensive. you know how everyone on arfcom owns a rifle, but only a few guys could afford to show up for militia duty with their own tank? that kind of expensive. Yup. And you'd kill a knight by knocking him down, then shanking. These tournaments don't use piercing weapons. Also seems like the impact weapons are reasonably light - still pretty brutal, but no sledgehammers or anything. That said, I've seen a guy in a plate helmet knocked out cold with a broadsword to the back of the head. Knocking him to the ground, or whacking him over the head with a mace. People overestimate the effectiveness of plate armor. A helmet is only as good as the padding under it, and no matter how good the armor is, a solid hit to the side of the knee will bring you down, hard.
And a morning star fucks armor up, leaving the wearer with sever puncture wounds and broken bones. this post is interesting. tell us more. Historically speaking, blunt weapons did a LOT more damage than edged weapons. And in Medieval Europe even the "edged" weapons were, for the most part, causing blunt force trauma. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 3:49:00 AM EDT
[#13]
I would do it, I just spent 30 min looking on a website that does the same thing here in the USA.
When I was younger and we had a serious disagreement or wanted drunken fun, we would fight like vikings. We used a 1 inch 4 foot wooden dowel and a metal garbage can lid. Got some good knots in and it could be a bit bloody but no one died. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 3:50:01 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
http://medieval-combat.org/  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPbTWDeqQf0
Fun sport to follow, I admire their dedication and toughness. Huge black knight with axe stuck in his helmet 
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Posted: 6/11/2016 3:59:58 AM EDT
[#15]
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Posted: 6/11/2016 4:43:14 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Historically speaking, blunt weapons did a LOT more damage than edged weapons. And in Medieval Europe even the "edged" weapons were, for the most part, causing blunt force trauma. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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People overestimate the effectiveness of plate armor. A helmet is only as good as the padding under it, and no matter how good the armor is, a solid hit to the side of the knee will bring you down, hard.
And a morning star fucks armor up, leaving the wearer with sever puncture wounds and broken bones. this post is interesting. tell us more. Historically speaking, blunt weapons did a LOT more damage than edged weapons. And in Medieval Europe even the "edged" weapons were, for the most part, causing blunt force trauma. i'm aware. just interested to hear about the purported ineffectiveness of plate, as well as the "severe puncture wounds" from flails. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 4:52:06 AM EDT
[#17]
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Having fought in the SCA and taken part in multiple skirmishes, I can say with authority that all of those guys suck. No shield wall, no knight guiding their team, just scream and charge. They really suck. Badly. They're champions in their countries. They're good. It's just that the rules force a certain play style. Shield wall is needed to fend off arrows and spear thrusts. The rules of that competition have neither, so no shield wall. And the whole SCA "feudal" leadership structure... Let's just say I'm not a fan, and having a team captain is perfectly sufficient for those sorts of matches. A well-trained team doesn't generally need one, even. I sort of liked the old days, when everything was crazy and the rules weren't as formalized. Didn't participate in any of the really big events in Russia, tho. Video of an old LARP castle siege and various insanity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDdTB1GzHJw This is one is 2010 Ukraine, looks like 500-1000 participants. Bigger than a lot of actual medieval battles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJshvMrrxJc |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 4:55:19 AM EDT
[#18]
My weapon of choice would be a 5lb sledgehammer... Then again that might be frowned upon because everyone you hit would need to be carried off in a stretcher.
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Posted: 6/11/2016 4:58:24 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
i'm aware. just interested to hear about the purported ineffectiveness of plate, as well as the "severe puncture wounds" from flails. Not everyone here has done medieval reenactment
Flails are VERY fun to use, but only work in certain situations/rule sets (they're useless if the opponent's weapon is much longer OR much shorter than the flail). Even then, they're usually banned because ones heavy/flexible enough to be useful can also hit really hard if spinning at top speed. pic related: 
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Posted: 6/11/2016 5:04:49 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thousands of the French were killed by the English bowmen. Wikipedia says 7-10k french deaths and 1500 noble prisoners vs 112 English casualties. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I wish I could remember when and where I read it, but I do remember reading of one battle that involved most of the participants wearing heavy plate armor. If I remember correctly (been a VERY long time) the battle took place in the rain, so bows of either long or cross variety were not involved. The battle went for hours. It finally ended with no one dead and everyone going back to their sides out of exhaustion. Agincourt Thousands of the French were killed by the English bowmen. Wikipedia says 7-10k french deaths and 1500 noble prisoners vs 112 English casualties. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 5:22:18 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They're champions in their countries. They're good. It's just that the rules force a certain play style. Shield wall is needed to fend off arrows and spear thrusts. The rules of that competition have neither, so no shield wall. And the whole SCA "feudal" leadership structure... Let's just say I'm not a fan, and having a team captain is perfectly sufficient for those sorts of matches. A well-trained team doesn't generally need one, even. I sort of liked the old days, when everything was crazy and the rules weren't as formalized. Didn't participate in any of the really big events in Russia, tho. Video of an old LARP castle siege and various insanity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDdTB1GzHJw I disagree with your assessment of the use of a shield wall. Did you notice that those melees degenerated into multiples on one very quickly? Typically the side who had a few fast chargers lost those quickly, meaning that everyone else got double (or more) teamed ASAP. A shield wall prevents this. It then comes down to who's better at individual combat until one side's shield wall breaks. After that you get the general melee and mop up. This is one is 2010 Ukraine, looks like 500-1000 participants. Bigger than a lot of actual medieval battles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJshvMrrxJc Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Having fought in the SCA and taken part in multiple skirmishes, I can say with authority that all of those guys suck. No shield wall, no knight guiding their team, just scream and charge. They really suck. Badly. They're champions in their countries. They're good. It's just that the rules force a certain play style. Shield wall is needed to fend off arrows and spear thrusts. The rules of that competition have neither, so no shield wall. And the whole SCA "feudal" leadership structure... Let's just say I'm not a fan, and having a team captain is perfectly sufficient for those sorts of matches. A well-trained team doesn't generally need one, even. I sort of liked the old days, when everything was crazy and the rules weren't as formalized. Didn't participate in any of the really big events in Russia, tho. Video of an old LARP castle siege and various insanity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDdTB1GzHJw I disagree with your assessment of the use of a shield wall. Did you notice that those melees degenerated into multiples on one very quickly? Typically the side who had a few fast chargers lost those quickly, meaning that everyone else got double (or more) teamed ASAP. A shield wall prevents this. It then comes down to who's better at individual combat until one side's shield wall breaks. After that you get the general melee and mop up. This is one is 2010 Ukraine, looks like 500-1000 participants. Bigger than a lot of actual medieval battles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJshvMrrxJc |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 5:42:02 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did you notice that those melees degenerated into multiples on one very quickly? Typically the side who had a few fast chargers lost those quickly, meaning that everyone else got double (or more) teamed ASAP. A shield wall prevents this. It then comes down to who's better at individual combat until one side's shield wall breaks. After that you get the general melee and mop up. That's cause SCA rules, IIRC, have a "kill" on a solid hit to the helm/torso. Ergo, you can actually "kill" an opponent without stepping out of your own shield wall. Under the rules of "Battle of the Nations" (or whatever their system is called), you actually have to knock someone down, which is nigh-impossible to do without maneuvering. Plus, looks like a shield wall would just get flanked and polearm'd to the legs (SCA also doesn't have shin sweeps, which makes polearms and greatswords a lot less useful than IRL). I'm not saying shield walls are always bad, and my guesses as to the specific reasons the competitors in the videos don't use em may be wrong... But rest assured most anyone in those matches knows very well how to use various tight formations; if they don't use em, it's for very good reasons. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 10:11:06 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's cause SCA rules, IIRC, have a "kill" on a solid hit to the helm/torso. Ergo, you can actually "kill" an opponent without stepping out of your own shield wall. Under the rules of "Battle of the Nations" (or whatever their system is called), you actually have to knock someone down, which is nigh-impossible to do without maneuvering. Plus, looks like a shield wall would just get flanked and polearm'd to the legs (SCA also doesn't have shin sweeps, which makes polearms and greatswords a lot less useful than IRL). I'm not saying shield walls are always bad, and my guesses as to the specific reasons the competitors in the videos don't use em may be wrong... But rest assured most anyone in those matches knows very well how to use various tight formations; if they don't use em, it's for very good reasons. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Did you notice that those melees degenerated into multiples on one very quickly? Typically the side who had a few fast chargers lost those quickly, meaning that everyone else got double (or more) teamed ASAP. A shield wall prevents this. It then comes down to who's better at individual combat until one side's shield wall breaks. After that you get the general melee and mop up. That's cause SCA rules, IIRC, have a "kill" on a solid hit to the helm/torso. Ergo, you can actually "kill" an opponent without stepping out of your own shield wall. Under the rules of "Battle of the Nations" (or whatever their system is called), you actually have to knock someone down, which is nigh-impossible to do without maneuvering. Plus, looks like a shield wall would just get flanked and polearm'd to the legs (SCA also doesn't have shin sweeps, which makes polearms and greatswords a lot less useful than IRL). I'm not saying shield walls are always bad, and my guesses as to the specific reasons the competitors in the videos don't use em may be wrong... But rest assured most anyone in those matches knows very well how to use various tight formations; if they don't use em, it's for very good reasons. Fair enough. They should all use UWM rules, that'd settle it.
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Posted: 6/11/2016 10:28:33 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thousands of the French were killed by the English bowmen. Wikipedia says 7-10k french deaths and 1500 noble prisoners vs 112 English casualties. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I wish I could remember when and where I read it, but I do remember reading of one battle that involved most of the participants wearing heavy plate armor. If I remember correctly (been a VERY long time) the battle took place in the rain, so bows of either long or cross variety were not involved. The battle went for hours. It finally ended with no one dead and everyone going back to their sides out of exhaustion. Agincourt Thousands of the French were killed by the English bowmen. Wikipedia says 7-10k french deaths and 1500 noble prisoners vs 112 English casualties. Yup. Lots stuck in the mud and couldn't escape. I ignored his part about no one dying because that battle never happened as described but the battle where mud affected those in plate was Agincourt. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 10:31:05 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Having fought in the SCA and taken part in multiple skirmishes, I can say with authority that all of those guys suck. No shield wall, no knight guiding their team, just scream and charge. They really suck. Badly. Most of those guys are SCA members lol |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 10:33:48 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryDude some of those neck chops looked bad. Those guys are fucking nuts.
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Posted: 6/11/2016 10:40:55 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll take a wild guess and suggest that those dead weren't wearing much for armor. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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something doesn't compute when they dig up battlefield dead from those days, the bodies have sword strikes that took off arms and legs I'll take a wild guess and suggest that those dead weren't wearing much for armor. well that's obvious but this thread is talking about AMAZING FULL CONTACT FIGHTING usually the term full contact implies some kind of bad-ass risk of grave injury full contact karate means the loser ends up incapacitated in some way, not just tired suppose you and I have a karate battle wearing this armor? is that full contact karate? if they had just two guys fighting with shields and maces, that could potentially be like real fighting or if they were jousting |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 10:50:27 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Says the guy with the retarded avatar.... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: God its just unorganized retards smacking each other. Says the guy with the retarded avatar.... Says the guy with no avatar. Thanks for the compliment. ETA: donate $24 to the site and I'll make you your own retarded avatar. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 11:19:57 AM EDT
[#29]
The american team should really be dressed as the indians would have going into battle with budkskins , wood or stone wardlubs, and sinew bows and arros (but doesnt look like those are allowed)
Are the axe or pike/halbred heads steel or something lighter? Padding or not under those helmets, I don't see how more guys aren't knocked unconscious if they are steel. Thats a lot of mass on some of those weapons. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 1:16:42 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The american team should really be dressed as the indians would have going into battle with budkskins , wood or stone wardlubs, and sinew bows and arros (but doesnt look like those are allowed) Are the axe or pike/halbred heads steel or something lighter? Padding or not under those helmets, I don't see how more guys aren't knocked unconscious if they are steel. Thats a lot of mass on some of those weapons. Modern materials. When I was in the SCA (80s) there was a welder who made the helmets. The inside was lined with (I believe) closed cell foam. I'm not a small guy, nor weak by anyone's imagination (back then, anyway). I did a full strength overhand smash to my friend wearing his helm. He just looked at me and told me to hit him harder. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 2:16:25 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yup. Lots stuck in the mud and couldn't escape. I ignored his part about no one dying because that battle never happened as described but the battle where mud affected those in plate was Agincourt. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I wish I could remember when and where I read it, but I do remember reading of one battle that involved most of the participants wearing heavy plate armor. If I remember correctly (been a VERY long time) the battle took place in the rain, so bows of either long or cross variety were not involved. The battle went for hours. It finally ended with no one dead and everyone going back to their sides out of exhaustion. Agincourt Thousands of the French were killed by the English bowmen. Wikipedia says 7-10k french deaths and 1500 noble prisoners vs 112 English casualties. Yup. Lots stuck in the mud and couldn't escape. I ignored his part about no one dying because that battle never happened as described but the battle where mud affected those in plate was Agincourt. |
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Posted: 6/11/2016 2:31:17 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've quite literally trained to kill people with swords, knives, and sticks for over 40 years of my life. Now that I'm old...I still don't think that it was a waste of time.
http://i.imgur.com/z7UL9WY.jpg What's your opinion on European knight vs Japanese samurai?
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Posted: 6/11/2016 2:57:54 PM EDT
[#33]
Looked interesting at first when I clicked on the video. But then, I saw people in the same colors hitting each other ? Looked stupid after that.
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Posted: 6/11/2016 3:15:19 PM EDT
[#34]
Badass - absolutely. But did you notice at the beginning during the "safety" briefing there was a no smoking sign
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Posted: 6/11/2016 4:16:32 PM EDT
[#35]
Tis but a scratch . . . A scratch . . . your arm's off ! ! !  |
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