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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:14:26 PM EDT
The plane that burned into the ice on the St Louis river near the swing bridge in Duluth MN was flown by a design engineer for Cirrus. He helped design the Cirrus jet.
https://www.fox21online.com/2023/02/24/pilot-who-crashed-into-st-louis-river-was-cirrus-design-engineer/  "According to David’s brother, Daniel, he was a “brilliant” design engineer for Cirrus Aircraft in Duluth. “David was instrumental in the design of the Cirrus single engine private jet that recently won the coveted “Collier Aviation” award,” Daniel said in a social media post." Looks like it was a Cirrus GTS carbon SR22. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:30:07 PM EDT
[#1]
I wonder if one of those ballistic parachutes would have helped in that scenario. I'm not an aviation guy, though.
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:34:47 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wonder if one of those ballistic parachutes would have helped in that scenario. I'm not an aviation guy, though. I don't think so.. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N929DR/history/20230224/2203ZZ/KDLH/L%2b46%252e73689%2b%252d92%252e16015 I think he was too fast and too low. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:37:06 PM EDT
[#3]
I don’t trust carbon fiber.
Rip….. and prayers for the family. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:39:52 PM EDT
[#4]
Have these been grounded for some reason?
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:43:02 PM EDT
[#5]
This one in particular is grounded.
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:46:34 PM EDT
[#6]
Looks like he went in fast.
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:53:27 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks like he went in fast. Looks like it. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:58:45 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't think so.. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N929DR/history/20230224/2203ZZ/KDLH/L%2b46%252e73689%2b%252d92%252e16015 I think he was too fast and too low. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I wonder if one of those ballistic parachutes would have helped in that scenario. I'm not an aviation guy, though. I don't think so.. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N929DR/history/20230224/2203ZZ/KDLH/L%2b46%252e73689%2b%252d92%252e16015 I think he was too fast and too low.  2000 feet under 140 he can pull it |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 9:59:01 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't think so.. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N929DR/history/20230224/2203ZZ/KDLH/L%2b46%252e73689%2b%252d92%252e16015 I think he was too fast and too low. It was close Odd he was still low He was a Chief Engineer |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:29:18 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/284263/0790D0F5-2305-4C4C-898B-7C6D6B9D0D57-2725450.jpg 2000 feet under 140 he can pull it Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I wonder if one of those ballistic parachutes would have helped in that scenario. I'm not an aviation guy, though. I don't think so.. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N929DR/history/20230224/2203ZZ/KDLH/L%2b46%252e73689%2b%252d92%252e16015 I think he was too fast and too low. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/284263/0790D0F5-2305-4C4C-898B-7C6D6B9D0D57-2725450.jpg 2000 feet under 140 he can pull it Looks like he was heading for the Superior airport and burned in on the way. Everything I am finding, it looks like he was around 152 before the track ends. At one point he was doing 180. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:33:30 PM EDT
[#11]
This one doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:35:20 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This one doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Yeah.. I'm not sure.. He was stepping down like he was heading for the Superior airport. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:35:25 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Have these been grounded for some reason? Mostly those are pretty new, with low time engines under 200hr. One of my family members just got a new SR22 right around the same time Cirrus grounded their own fleet. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:37:11 PM EDT
[#14]
My oldest sons friend is engineer for Cirrus and was up in Minnesota last month snowmobiling and was up in one of their planes. Horrible news.
 Attached File |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:39:24 PM EDT
[#15]
Quoted: "According to David’s brother, Daniel, he was a “brilliant” design engineer for Cirrus Aircraft in Duluth. Sounds like he wasn't brilliant enough. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:40:59 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My oldest sons friend is engineer for Cirrus and was up in Minnesota last month snowmobiling and was up in one of their planes. Horrible news.https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/148262/Screenshot_20230225-213612_Instagram_jpg-2725538.JPG Somewhere I have pictures of my boys in a Cirrus Vision jet when people were still screaming "Vapor ware" at me for posting the pics. That is a cool plane.  It is horrible news. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:41:39 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like he wasn't brilliant enough. 
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Posted: 2/25/2023 10:44:09 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like he wasn't brilliant enough. That didn’t take long |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 11:28:31 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This one doesn't make a lot of sense to me. This. Not a simple engine failure. What was the weather? |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 11:33:06 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. Not a simple engine failure. What was the weather? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This one doesn't make a lot of sense to me. This. Not a simple engine failure. What was the weather? Weather reported about the accident time (2207Z) KDLH 242255Z 22006KT 10SM SCT085 M12/M22 A3046 RMK AO2 SLP361 T11221217 KDLH 242155Z VRB05KT 10SM CLR M12/M22 A3048 RMK AO2 SLP366 T11221222 |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 11:45:28 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like he wasn't brilliant enough. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: "According to David’s brother, Daniel, he was a “brilliant” design engineer for Cirrus Aircraft in Duluth. Sounds like he wasn't brilliant enough. If planes were the only transportation available, most people would only be able to walk. Of those who were able to fly, many would find that 3rd axis problematic at best. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 12:46:57 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like he wasn't brilliant enough. 
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Posted: 2/26/2023 1:02:22 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wonder if one of those ballistic parachutes would have helped in that scenario. I'm not an aviation guy, though. You don't pull the chute when you're on fire. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 1:23:24 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You don't pull the chute when you're on fire. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I wonder if one of those ballistic parachutes would have helped in that scenario. I'm not an aviation guy, though. You don't pull the chute when you're on fire. I don't know if he was on fire or not. Smoke in the cockpit is possible. But I would think he may have mentioned that to ATC if that was the case. This was the result of smoke in the cockpit.  
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Posted: 2/26/2023 1:32:27 AM EDT
[#25]
Sticking a plane in a river ranks right up with the top places I would NOT want to crash.
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Posted: 2/26/2023 2:03:24 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sticking a plane in a river ranks right up with the top places I would NOT want to crash. the channel at Grassy Point Draw is about 23Ft... It gets shallow quick from there... That said, on a river/lake would not be my 1st choice.. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 2:07:36 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like he wasn't brilliant enough.  I don't agree with the sentiment, but felt oddly compelled to furnish the appropriate gif. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 2:49:43 AM EDT
[#28]
The last 600 ft of descent was at -1161 fpm avg, for 31 seconds.
Last 600 ft down slowed from 135 kts to 128 kts. Last 54 seconds had pretty steady heading about 140 deg. Starting the last two minutes, speed was about 150 kts for the first minute and a half and then decreased to 128 kts at the end. During the last minute and forty five seconds descent started at -441 fpm and gradually increased to the -1161 fpm average, probably higher at impact. It's a puzzler for sure. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 4:21:58 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The last 600 ft of descent was at -1161 fpm avg, for 31 seconds. Last 600 ft down slowed from 135 kts to 128 kts. Last 54 seconds had pretty steady heading about 140 deg. Starting the last two minutes, speed was about 150 kts for the first minute and a half and then decreased to 128 kts at the end. During the last minute and forty five seconds descent started at -441 fpm and gradually increased to the -1161 fpm average, probably higher at impact. It's a puzzler for sure. Suicide? |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 6:22:15 AM EDT
[#30]
Prayer sent for family.
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Posted: 2/26/2023 7:45:21 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The last 600 ft of descent was at -1161 fpm avg, for 31 seconds. Last 600 ft down slowed from 135 kts to 128 kts. Last 54 seconds had pretty steady heading about 140 deg. Starting the last two minutes, speed was about 150 kts for the first minute and a half and then decreased to 128 kts at the end. During the last minute and forty five seconds descent started at -441 fpm and gradually increased to the -1161 fpm average, probably higher at impact. It's a puzzler for sure. Not a pilot but if it helps you guys to figure it out, I’ve driven through this city on our way up around Lake Superior and the whole area is built on a hill. The decline starts from about the edge of the green shaded area all the way to the water.  Attached File |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 9:37:56 AM EDT
[#32]
Wasn't the Cirrus on on episode of Dangerous Flights? Seemed like a amazing aircraft.
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Posted: 2/26/2023 9:38:23 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yeah.. I'm not sure.. He was stepping down like he was heading for the Superior airport. Ice buildup on the wing and control surfaces could be barely noticeable until there's no lift anymore...drop like a rock |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 9:44:52 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ice buildup on the wing and control surfaces could be barely noticeable until there's no lift anymore...drop like a rock Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Yeah.. I'm not sure.. He was stepping down like he was heading for the Superior airport. Ice buildup on the wing and control surfaces could be barely noticeable until there's no lift anymore...drop like a rock Possible. I can't seem to find any info on the fog/icing situation over the lake that day. Its not uncommon to see ice fog over the lake in the winter. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 9:57:02 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don’t trust carbon fiber. Rip….. and prayers for the family. It's in a lot of the commercial planes you fly on. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 11:41:44 AM EDT
[#36]
Could of had a heart attack or something.
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Posted: 2/26/2023 1:24:00 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ice buildup on the wing and control surfaces could be barely noticeable until there's no lift anymore...drop like a rock SRs have an effective optional de-icing setup. https://wikiwings.com/heres-a-summary-of-cirrus-aircraft-tks-de-icing-systems/#:~:text=Summary%20Cirrus%20Aircraft%20TKS%20De-Icing%20Systems%20The%20first,system%20was%20expanded%20to%20cover%20the%20entire%20wing. |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 1:27:54 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The last 600 ft of descent was at -1161 fpm avg, for 31 seconds. Last 600 ft down slowed from 135 kts to 128 kts. Last 54 seconds had pretty steady heading about 140 deg. Starting the last two minutes, speed was about 150 kts for the first minute and a half and then decreased to 128 kts at the end. During the last minute and forty five seconds descent started at -441 fpm and gradually increased to the -1161 fpm average, probably higher at impact. It's a puzzler for sure. Heart Attack? |
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Posted: 2/26/2023 1:51:50 PM EDT
[#39]
Severe carbon monoxide?
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Posted: 2/26/2023 6:51:12 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This one doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Same. |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 12:28:40 PM EDT
[#41]
Betting engine failure/fire shortly after takeoff. Flight track seems to suggest that.
Not sure what him being an engineer has to do with it, has absolutely zero bearing on his pilot abilities. The news seems to think otherwise. |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 12:30:35 PM EDT
[#42]
ATC AUDIO - N929DR Plane Crash St Louis River Duluth Minnesota
 Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 12:39:42 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not sure what him being an engineer has to do with it, has absolutely zero bearing on his pilot abilities. The news seems to think otherwise. Don't tell the engineers that. |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 12:51:46 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don't tell the engineers that. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Not sure what him being an engineer has to do with it, has absolutely zero bearing on his pilot abilities. The news seems to think otherwise. Don't tell the engineers that. You can't tell engineers anything. That is why the old school airplanes didn't even let them look out of the front. 
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Posted: 2/27/2023 12:58:50 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Possible. I can't seem to find any info on the fog/icing situation over the lake that day. Its not uncommon to see ice fog over the lake in the winter.  Attached File |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 1:02:34 PM EDT
[#46]
man that really sucks....GA aircraft will let you get all crossed up in a hurry.
I always wondered why they just couldn't write some simple logic into the flight instruments....basically like having computer CFI in your ear. The workload for single pilot GA is a lot for someone that doesn't fly every single day |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 2:00:05 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: man that really sucks....GA aircraft will let you get all crossed up in a hurry. I always wondered why they just couldn't write some simple logic into the flight instruments....basically like having computer CFI in your ear. The workload for single pilot GA is a lot for someone that doesn't fly every single day A lot of GA (majority?) are still on steam gauges. The cost to get something like that developed, certified, installed and maintained are crazy retarded expensive. The vast majority of GA accidents are still VFR pilots flying into IMC or something along those lines. Cessna 172 tend to be pretty dated airplanes and yet have an accident rate less than half of average. |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 2:17:20 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A lot of GA (majority?) are still on steam gauges. The cost to get something like that developed, certified, installed and maintained are crazy retarded expensive. The vast majority of GA accidents are still VFR pilots flying into IMC or something along those lines. Cessna 172 tend to be pretty dated airplanes and yet have an accident rate less than half of average. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: man that really sucks....GA aircraft will let you get all crossed up in a hurry. I always wondered why they just couldn't write some simple logic into the flight instruments....basically like having computer CFI in your ear. The workload for single pilot GA is a lot for someone that doesn't fly every single day A lot of GA (majority?) are still on steam gauges. The cost to get something like that developed, certified, installed and maintained are crazy retarded expensive. The vast majority of GA accidents are still VFR pilots flying into IMC or something along those lines. Cessna 172 tend to be pretty dated airplanes and yet have an accident rate less than half of average. glass panels have come down a lot recently, but they are still missing the safety aspect and there really needs to be some kids of HUD for synthetic vision. |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 2:30:54 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The last 600 ft of descent was at -1161 fpm avg, for 31 seconds. Last 600 ft down slowed from 135 kts to 128 kts. Last 54 seconds had pretty steady heading about 140 deg. Starting the last two minutes, speed was about 150 kts for the first minute and a half and then decreased to 128 kts at the end. During the last minute and forty five seconds descent started at -441 fpm and gradually increased to the -1161 fpm average, probably higher at impact. It's a puzzler for sure. No, it’s not a puzzler. Look at the weather. 8F, humidity on the rise, Snow, fog, ice. Look at the flight speed/altitude track. He iced up. |
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Posted: 2/27/2023 2:31:27 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, it’s not a puzzler. Look at the weather. 8F, humidity on the rise, Snow, fog, ice. Look at the flight speed/altitude track. He iced up. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The last 600 ft of descent was at -1161 fpm avg, for 31 seconds. Last 600 ft down slowed from 135 kts to 128 kts. Last 54 seconds had pretty steady heading about 140 deg. Starting the last two minutes, speed was about 150 kts for the first minute and a half and then decreased to 128 kts at the end. During the last minute and forty five seconds descent started at -441 fpm and gradually increased to the -1161 fpm average, probably higher at impact. It's a puzzler for sure. No, it’s not a puzzler. Look at the weather. 8F, humidity on the rise, Snow, fog, ice. Look at the flight speed/altitude track. He iced up. You would htink the cirrus would have boots |
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