User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:37:59 PM EDT
[#1]
I wonder how similar it's 'targeting system' or whatever will be to a Javelin.
-K |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:38:36 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
Everything old is new again. Naval Air Warfare Center (China Lake) experimented with the sidewinder in A2G roles as far back as Vietnam. AGM-87 Focus. Shot 'em at campfires & trucks on the Hi Chi Mihn trail. Yes Sir, there's even accounts of the old F-102 shooting their AIM-4 Falcon air to air missiles in similar fashion |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:39:59 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
I wonder how similar it's 'targeting system' or whatever will be to a Javelin. -K I believe both are 'imaging IR' seekers so probably rather similiar.. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:40:22 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
You'd be amazed what can be done with an AIM-9X... http://www.shephard.co.uk/news/3889/ Hunted becomes Hunter - Raytheon demos sub-launched SidewinderSeptember 14, 2009
Raytheon has successfully fired an AIM-9X Sidewinder from a submarine.
Although the test is part of an ongoing effort to improve the flexibility of submarines, it marks a new chapter in the development of surface-to-air weapons for submarines, and could force anti-submarine helicopters to tread much more carefully in the future.
The AIM-9X, was fired from a submerged Tomahawk Capsule Launching System as part of the Littoral Warfare Weapon (LWW) program managed by the Department of the Navy's Program Executive Office of Submarines.
"The Littoral Warfare Weapon program will test and develop increased capabilities as the U.S. Navy continues to expand undersea warfare in the littoral arena," said Michael Del Checcolo, vice president of Engineering, Raytheon Integrated Defense Systems.
"This successful launch demonstrates a new degree of submarine self-defense capability against threats our warfighters may encounter from the air, land and sea."
There is a great deal of work taking place to deliver a surface-to-air missile capability.
Germany's Diehl-BGT is working on the Interactive Defence and Attack System for Submarines (IDAS) for its Type-212 diesel submarines, and fired directly from the torpedo tubes. It is understood that some Russian submarines may have carried a SAM system in the sail.
Nonetheless, the development of such new weapons puts extra demands on the helicopters and crews hunting them.
This now, I see major applications. Again, an amateur. Taking down a sub hunter from a surface to air missle, adaptable from a previous air-to-air model, awesome. I hope they go places with this. We've underspent missle technology for years (see the age of this model). I'm actually a big supporter of missile defense systems. I think more money and time should be spent here. It comes down that I'm a strict fiscal conservative and want my money's worth. Is that so bad? If this system, the AIM-9X, can be developed as a useful tool for reasonable operations - awesome. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:40:23 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
I bet if you compared the actual guts (not just the form factor) of the original with the -9X, you'd find practically nothing in common.
Wikipedia reports the missile is 57 years young... Wow! Kharn |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:42:25 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
The language is just odd. Why a cigar boat? I can see some applications, but this seems a stretch for massive development to standard targets the US military might encounter. I'm not trying to be a dick. I'm trying to ask legit questions. So please, with sugar on top, keep this in mind. The Navy uses similar targets all the time to test the Mk 15 Block IB Phalanx, the 5" HE-ET and KE-ET rounds, the Mk38 Mod 2 25mm, the 57mm Bofors, and the Mk75 76mm. These boats are used for more than just recon, by the way. If you would have read my link you'd see that. Similar boats were used by the Iranians during the 1980-1988 war with Iraq. In fact, the USS VINCENNES was engaging boats similar to this with her 5" guns at the time of the Airbus tragedy. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:43:09 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Everything old is new again. Naval Air Warfare Center (China Lake) experimented with the sidewinder in A2G roles as far back as Vietnam. AGM-87 Focus. Shot 'em at campfires & trucks on the Hi Chi Mihn trail. Yes Sir, there's even accounts of the old F-102 shooting their AIM-4 Falcon air to air missiles in similar fashion I wonder if the AIM-4 had a better Pk against ground targets, because it sucked at air targets. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:45:01 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
This now, I see major applications. Again, an amateur. Taking down a sub hunter from a surface to air missle, adaptable from a previous air-to-air model, awesome. I hope they go places with this. We've underspent missle technology for years (see the age of this model). I'm actually a big supporter of missile defense systems. I think more money and time should be spent here. It comes down that I'm a strict fiscal conservative and want my money's worth. Is that so bad? If this system, the AIM-9X, can be developed as a useful tool for reasonable operations - awesome. So you like the idea of using an AIM-9X to shoot air targets from a sub, but not at surface targets from an aircraft? What navies have ASW aircraft? How many of them are threat nations? How many countries have or use small boats? How many of them are threat nations? You really should stop now. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:45:20 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Everything old is new again. Naval Air Warfare Center (China Lake) experimented with the sidewinder in A2G roles as far back as Vietnam. AGM-87 Focus. Shot 'em at campfires & trucks on the Hi Chi Mihn trail. Yes Sir, there's even accounts of the old F-102 shooting their AIM-4 Falcon air to air missiles in similar fashion I wonder if the AIM-4 had a better Pk against ground targets, because it sucked at air targets. They never released the Pk results so who knows...I remember at my old squadron we had an AIM-4 as a bar decoration! |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:45:39 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted: While I'm not against the idea of a air to surface missile, using on a cigar boat seems rather overkill when the aircraft has a cannon that would do the job just fine...  Cannon fire is overkill compared to an AIM-9. Besides, it'd ain't exactly easy for a fighter to engage ground targets with their cannon because of how fast they fly.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:45:52 PM EDT
[#11]
dport, on a slightly related note, does RAM have an anti-surface capability?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:46:59 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
dport, on a slightly related note, does RAM have an anti-surface capability? I avoid ships with RAM like the plague. I like to be on shooters not haze grey short buses. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:52:47 PM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
Quoted:
This now, I see major applications. Again, an amateur. Taking down a sub hunter from a surface to air missle, adaptable from a previous air-to-air model, awesome. I hope they go places with this. We've underspent missle technology for years (see the age of this model). I'm actually a big supporter of missile defense systems. I think more money and time should be spent here. It comes down that I'm a strict fiscal conservative and want my money's worth. Is that so bad? If this system, the AIM-9X, can be developed as a useful tool for reasonable operations - awesome. So you like the idea of using an AIM-9X to shoot air targets from a sub, but not at surface targets from an aircraft? What navies have ASW aircraft? How many of them are threat nations? How many countries have or use small boats? How many of them are threat nations? You really should stop now. OK. I will. You are right. Honestly, I'm not trying to be the antogonist here. From time to time I question spending by our government. I wonder about influences on spending, from things I agree upon (military R&D) and social programs like Obamacare. I'm a strict fiscal conservative that has seen millions wasted by government (I live in New York for Christ's sakes!!!) You have an upper hand here, so I will trust that your knowledge is accurate and worthy. Again, I was wrong. You were right. I appreciate your service to our country and apparent knowledge on the subject. Can we just call it even and suspect that my questioning was at least worthy of debate? Chill man, it's almost Caturday!!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:53:06 PM EDT
[#14]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I bet if you compared the actual guts (not just the form factor) of the original with the -9X, you'd find practically nothing in common.
Wikipedia reports the missile is 57 years young... Wow! Kharn +1 My guess is the AIM-9B to the AIM-9X is analogous to a 1st gen 1950s Corvette to a 6th gen 2000s Corvette. Still a Sidewinder/Corvette, but underneath it's GREATLY changed. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:55:40 PM EDT
[#15]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
This now, I see major applications. Again, an amateur. Taking down a sub hunter from a surface to air missle, adaptable from a previous air-to-air model, awesome. I hope they go places with this. We've underspent missle technology for years (see the age of this model). I'm actually a big supporter of missile defense systems. I think more money and time should be spent here. It comes down that I'm a strict fiscal conservative and want my money's worth. Is that so bad? If this system, the AIM-9X, can be developed as a useful tool for reasonable operations - awesome. So you like the idea of using an AIM-9X to shoot air targets from a sub, but not at surface targets from an aircraft? What navies have ASW aircraft? How many of them are threat nations? How many countries have or use small boats? How many of them are threat nations? You really should stop now. OK. I will. You are right. Honestly, I'm not trying to be the antogonist here. From time to time I question spending by our government. I wonder about influences on spending, from things I agree upon (military R&D) and social programs like Obamacare. I'm a strict fiscal conservative that has seen millions wasted by government (I live in New York for Christ's sakes!!!) You have an upper hand here, so I will trust that your knowledge is accurate and worthy. Again, I was wrong. You were right. I appreciate your service to our country and apparent knowledge on the subject. Can we just call it even and suspect that my questioning was at least worthy of debate? Chill man, it's almost Caturday!! A software change and a couple of test shots are not wasteful government spending. It is a cheap way of increasing the flexibility of an air force and navy that will surely dwindle in numbers in the coming decade and will therefore require more flexibility, not less. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 2:59:41 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I bet if you compared the actual guts (not just the form factor) of the original with the -9X, you'd find practically nothing in common.
Wikipedia reports the missile is 57 years young... Wow! Kharn +1 My guess is the AIM-9B to the AIM-9X is analogous to a 1st gen 1950s Corvette to a 6th gen 2000s Corvette. Still a Sidewinder/Corvette, but underneath it's GREATLY changed. 5 generations of missiles now since the original with AIM-9X and Python 5 being the latest and greatest.. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:00:29 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
dport, on a slightly related note, does RAM have an anti-surface capability? OK, I did a little digging. Raytheon is advertising a HAS (helicopter, aircraft and surface) capability for a variant of the RAM. http://www.raytheon.com/capabilities/products/ram/ |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:01:37 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
This now, I see major applications. Again, an amateur. Taking down a sub hunter from a surface to air missle, adaptable from a previous air-to-air model, awesome. I hope they go places with this. We've underspent missle technology for years (see the age of this model). I'm actually a big supporter of missile defense systems. I think more money and time should be spent here. It comes down that I'm a strict fiscal conservative and want my money's worth. Is that so bad? If this system, the AIM-9X, can be developed as a useful tool for reasonable operations - awesome. So you like the idea of using an AIM-9X to shoot air targets from a sub, but not at surface targets from an aircraft? What navies have ASW aircraft? How many of them are threat nations? How many countries have or use small boats? How many of them are threat nations? You really should stop now. OK. I will. You are right. Honestly, I'm not trying to be the antogonist here. From time to time I question spending by our government. I wonder about influences on spending, from things I agree upon (military R&D) and social programs like Obamacare. I'm a strict fiscal conservative that has seen millions wasted by government (I live in New York for Christ's sakes!!!) You have an upper hand here, so I will trust that your knowledge is accurate and worthy. Again, I was wrong. You were right. I appreciate your service to our country and apparent knowledge on the subject. Can we just call it even and suspect that my questioning was at least worthy of debate? Chill man, it's almost Caturday!! A software change and a couple of test shots are not wasteful government spending. It is a cheap way of increasing the flexibility of an air force and navy that will surely dwindle in numbers in the coming decade and will therefore require more flexibility, not less. I'm cool with this. If it works, don't fix it. The .50bmg originated from 1921 if memory serves and has been improved over time, mostly with optics. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:01:48 PM EDT
[#19]
There are accounts of AF F-102's using their IR guided Falcon missiles, ancient tech compared to a Sidewinder, to hit campfires and hot vehicle hoods at night on the Ho Chi Minh trail.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:06:03 PM EDT
[#20]
Quoted: Or let's say you're a special forces group in an observation post on the ground. You decide not to shoot the sheepherder kid and he alerts the local militia. I really wish they would have shot those 3 fuckers. May those three rest in peace, and I hope the fourth gets to live a normal life after.  |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:06:53 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
Seriously? It's a cigar boat. A shot from a decently placed .308 would disable it. The small explosive charge of any munition would definitely affect the weak composition of its frame. I smell lobbyist here. Sometime you don't just want to stop the drug boat, you want to kill everyone on the Iranian missle/gun boat. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:13:00 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Seriously? It's a cigar boat. A shot from a decently placed .308 would disable it. The small explosive charge of any munition would definitely affect the weak composition of its frame. I smell lobbyist here. Sometime you don't just want to stop the drug boat, you want to kill everyone on the Iranian missle/gun boat. Psst. I always want to kill everyone on the Iranian missile/gun boat. Why go half-ass? I'm not an advocate for wounding shots. I have a .308 because a llama calls for it. Fuckers always try to kill me with their lasers. 223. isnt' suitable for the job. If anything, they should continue development to enlarge the warhead for universal usage, if plausible. (member of the llama resistance since 2003) |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:15:18 PM EDT
[#23]
A Navy ( I think) F4 was returning to the carrier from a mission and saw a convoy of NVA trucks on the road. He got a good tone with a Sidewinder and blew up a truck. They painted a truck on the splitter plate rather than a red star. This was in the book Mig Alley.....And Kill Migs. Mig Alley was about the Korean War and And Kill Migs was about the Vietnam War.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:24:46 PM EDT
[#24]
cool
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:25:55 PM EDT
[#25]
What is a cigar boat? Is that like a big cigarette boat?
Jane |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:28:28 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted: Quoted: Nit quite. The Sidewinder has a specific and different frag pattern compared to a grenade. Sort of a ring of fragments rather than all directions. It' not an optimum warhead for ground target maybe, but this seems more like something you use when you're out of the good stuff.Quoted: Does it have a new warhead too? I thought the Sidewinders had some kind of promixity warhead that shot out a bunch of steel rods or something to destroy control surfaces on enemy aircraft? AAMs have proximity-fused frag warheads... Think 'Big Grenade'.... Such a warhead, with proper guidance, would do quite well against surface targets such as light vehicles, troops in the open, and/or small boats.... Depends on attack profile... A 'Top attack' vertical-dive profile, with the right fusing, would be quite effective with such a warhead.... |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:32:41 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted: A Navy ( I think) F4 was returning to the carrier from a mission and saw a convoy of NVA trucks on the road. He got a good tone with a Sidewinder and blew up a truck. They painted a truck on the splitter plate rather than a red star. This was in the book Mig Alley.....And Kill Migs. Mig Alley was about the Korean War and And Kill Migs was about the Vietnam War. Duke Cunningham destroyed a NVA truck with a Sidewinder. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:37:05 PM EDT
[#28]
I wish I could a replica or demilled unit of this thing.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:49:33 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
What is a cigar boat? Is that like a big cigarette boat? Jane I think that is what they meant. Universal go fast floaty thing |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:50:17 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: Quoted: A Navy ( I think) F4 was returning to the carrier from a mission and saw a convoy of NVA trucks on the road. He got a good tone with a Sidewinder and blew up a truck. They painted a truck on the splitter plate rather than a red star. This was in the book Mig Alley.....And Kill Migs. Mig Alley was about the Korean War and And Kill Migs was about the Vietnam War. Duke Cunningham destroyed a NVA truck with a Sidewinder. That happened on May 8, 1972, immediately following his and Driscoll's second MiG kill. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:50:52 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
Woohoo! More possible escalation of the War on [Some] Drugs! Because until now, the military had no other weapons used by aircraft that could possibly take out a cigar boat. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:52:53 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
I can think of several scenarios where this Black Shoe would love that capability on an F/A-18 flying SUCAP. I may or may not have locked up various less than friendly boats with a 9X. Never shot one, but it tracks them just fine. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 3:53:46 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I can think of several scenarios where this Black Shoe would love that capability on an F/A-18 flying SUCAP. Bu-bu-bu-but F-18888888's are tooooo slowwwwww..... We can catch (most) boats. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:01:24 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
Of course, what do I know? My ship's CSSQT was HSMST intensive. We fired everything fro 5" to 20mm to SM-2s to Hellfires at similar targets, so what do I know? Hey, I was one of the first drivers of those! Here's one: 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:03:26 PM EDT
[#35]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I can think of several scenarios where this Black Shoe would love that capability on an F/A-18 flying SUCAP. I may or may not have locked up various less than friendly boats with a 9X. Never shot one, but it tracks them just fine. As an ABM, that's awesome 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:03:33 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
Quoted:
While I'm not against the idea of a air to surface missile, using on a cigar boat seems rather overkill when the aircraft has a cannon that would do the job just fine...
Cannon fire is overkill compared to an AIM-9. Besides, it'd ain't exactly easy for a fighter to engage ground targets with their cannon because of how fast they fly. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:07:32 PM EDT
[#37]
As far as warhead change think more along the lines of kenitc energy. Does much more damage to surface targets (unless 9x has a flare manuver). Just because the warhead detonates dosen't mean the rest of the missile goes away
As far as cigar boat as a target, think an underway version of the USS Cole with Iranian speed boats.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:08:46 PM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Of course, what do I know? My ship's CSSQT was HSMST intensive. We fired everything fro 5" to 20mm to SM-2s to Hellfires at similar targets, so what do I know? Hey, I was one of the first drivers of those! Here's one: http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q94/junker46/hsmst.jpg Unless you were doing it by remote, I doubt you would have wanted to be driving.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:13:29 PM EDT
[#39]
Sounds like it would also be good to arm a Reaper with. A2A and A2G in one package.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:13:30 PM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Of course, what do I know? My ship's CSSQT was HSMST intensive. We fired everything fro 5" to 20mm to SM-2s to Hellfires at similar targets, so what do I know? Hey, I was one of the first drivers of those! Here's one: http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q94/junker46/hsmst.jpg Unless you were doing it by remote, I doubt you would have wanted to be driving.
Nope. I've seen the effects. I'd never want to take on an alerted US navy ship. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:38:00 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
The language is just odd. Why a cigar boat? I can see some applications, but this seems a stretch for massive development to standard targets the US military might encounter. Hello, McFly....
The Navy needs to use some sort of a target that approximates real life threats. Now they could use a Wally World Donald Duck inflatable raft, I doubt that would have the desired effect in creating a real life threat. The Navy uses remote controlled boats for targets. Why did they call it a "cigar boat"? To get people like you to read the article. You read "cigar boat" and you think Miami Vice.... 
I read "cigar boat" and in the context of this article I think "QST". 
The 56 foot QST-35 can simulate a medium to high speed patrol boat. The SEPTAR may be operated manually or by remote control and may be augmented actively or passively. The 18 foot QST-33 can simulate a high speed target to train crews in surface to surface and air to surface weapons firings. Operated manually or by remote control, the QST-33 can be augmented to simulate small boat threats during exercises. The QST-33/35 are highly maneuverable, remote controlled, fiberglass boats used as moving targets for inert rocket and/or bomb practice. The QST-33 Seaborne Powered Target (SEPTAR) is 18-feet long, and the QST-35 SEPTAR is 55-feet long. Remote control of the SEPTAR is accomplished by either a PRTCS, ITCS, or Control Target Transmitter System (CTTS). Scoring is done by the participating aircrews. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:41:12 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: While I'm not against the idea of a air to surface missile, using on a cigar boat seems rather overkill when the aircraft has a cannon that would do the job just fine... Cannon fire is overkill compared to an AIM-9. Besides, it'd ain't exactly easy for a fighter to engage ground targets with their cannon because of how fast they fly. http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s238/bradly2795/lol_wut.jpg Tekka is an interesting character, claims to be an expert on .mil stuff for some reason. I have no expertise on .mil stuff.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:42:29 PM EDT
[#43]
|
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 4:48:48 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
Quoted:
The language is just odd. Why a cigar boat? I can see some applications, but this seems a stretch for massive development to standard targets the US military might encounter. Hello, McFly....
The Navy needs to use some sort of a target that approximates real life threats. Now they could use a Wally World Donald Duck inflatable raft, I doubt that would have the desired effect in creating a real life threat. The Navy uses remote controlled boats for targets. Why did they call it a "cigar boat"? To get people like you to read the article. You read "cigar boat" and you think Miami Vice....
I read "cigar boat" and in the context of this article I think "QST". http://www.vaq34.com/junk/qst-33_001.JPG http://www.vaq34.com/junk/qst-33_002.JPG http://www.vaq34.com/junk/qst-35.JPG The 56 foot QST-35 can simulate a medium to high speed patrol boat. The SEPTAR may be operated manually or by remote control and may be augmented actively or passively. The 18 foot QST-33 can simulate a high speed target to train crews in surface to surface and air to surface weapons firings. Operated manually or by remote control, the QST-33 can be augmented to simulate small boat threats during exercises. The QST-33/35 are highly maneuverable, remote controlled, fiberglass boats used as moving targets for inert rocket and/or bomb practice. The QST-33 Seaborne Powered Target (SEPTAR) is 18-feet long, and the QST-35 SEPTAR is 55-feet long. Remote control of the SEPTAR is accomplished by either a PRTCS, ITCS, or Control Target Transmitter System (CTTS). Scoring is done by the participating aircrews. i used to drive all those. the -33s are phased out. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 5:02:57 PM EDT
[#45]
Quoted:
i used to drive all those. the -33s are phased out. Really? How long ago? The article I got the pictures from was from 2007, that's when it was launched from the USS San Antonio. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 5:06:58 PM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
Quoted:
i used to drive all those. the -33s are phased out. Really? How long ago? The article I got the pictures from was from 2007, that's when it was launched from the USS San Antonio. Might be some operated by contractors. I was in the last active duty unit that had 'em and were not suspose to bring them back. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 5:12:17 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: While I'm not against the idea of a air to surface missile, using on a cigar boat seems rather overkill when the aircraft has a cannon that would do the job just fine... Cannon fire is overkill compared to an AIM-9. Besides, it'd ain't exactly easy for a fighter to engage ground targets with their cannon because of how fast they fly. http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s238/bradly2795/lol_wut.jpg Tekka is an interesting character, claims to be an expert on .mil stuff for some reason. I have no expertise on .mil stuff. I wouldn't say I'm an expert... I just keep track of what goes on because I never stop analyzing and learning about the goings of the things that interest me. Military stuff just happens to be one of those things. Anyway, close air support kind of grew out of favor after Vietnam, but the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq brought it back into favor because of the need to support ground operations. Traditionally close air support has been done with slower moving aircraft like the A-10. They are more stable at lower speeds and it's much easier to target something on the ground with your cannon when going slower because you can have more time on target. Increasingly F-16s and what not have been supporting the troops on the ground with cannon fire, but it's really tricky because they can't come in as slow and don't have quite as much time to aim. They sometimes have to make a few extra passes to ensure kills on the ground. It can be done, but it's a little dangerous because you can crash if you're not careful and you might not get as many kills as you want because you can't stay on target as long as you'd like on each pass. BTW, it would have probably helped if I said in my first post that I was talking about higher speed fighters like the F-16. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 5:23:39 PM EDT
[#48]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
i used to drive all those. the -33s are phased out. Really? How long ago? The article I got the pictures from was from 2007, that's when it was launched from the USS San Antonio. Might be some operated by contractors. I was in the last active duty unit that had 'em and were not suspose to bring them back. I think it is all either DoD civilian or contractor now. |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 5:28:08 PM EDT
[#49]
Quoted:
Everything old is new again. Naval Air Warfare Center (China Lake) experimented with the sidewinder in A2G roles as far back as Vietnam. AGM-87 Focus. Shot 'em at campfires & trucks on the Hi Chi Mihn trail. +1 Sidewinder was used against ground targets in VN...... |
|
|
|
Posted: 12/4/2009 5:33:33 PM EDT
[#50]
A Navy ( I think) F4 was returning to the carrier from a mission and saw a convoy of NVA trucks on the road. He got a good tone with a Sidewinder and blew up a truck. They painted a truck on the splitter plate rather than a red star. This was in the book Mig Alley.....And Kill Migs. Mig Alley was about the Korean War and And Kill Migs was about the Vietnam War. A certain Navy F-4 Phantom pilot destroyed an NVA truck with an early model AIM-9 Sidewinder. The pilot? Then Lieutenant Randy "the Duke" Cunningham! One of the first and few aces of the Viet Nam war. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
