10 year old Sarah Murnaghan receives second double lung transplant - Page 3

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - 10 year old Sarah Murnaghan receives second double lung transplant (Page 3 of 5)

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:31:22 AM EST

[#1]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I comprehend just fine. Work harder and maybe you can afford some decent medical care too.

I design medical equipment for a living. Lovely medical plan. Also have real world honest to gosh medical experience. EE and medical certifications.

Mostly saves. One loss. Everyone from first on scene (me) to the tertiary care facility to the Medevac guys to the trauma team at Children's did everything humanly possible.

You?

I could guess at what you're attempting to say through that horribly written paragraph but I won't...

No answer?

Expected.

Let me try that again, Rachel: What medical experience do you have with patients whose lives are hanging in the balance?

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:31:42 AM EST

[#2]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

We should just take the organs from hateful adults when a child needs a transplant

You have no clue of the facts of the case.

This girl would died without the lungs and you call it "emotional bullshit". Think about that!!

The girl got adult lungs (never done before and was a 1 in 1,000,000 chance it would work), a ticket to the front of the line, and they have had to throw away a viable set of lungs already.

Yes and that is a chance to save a child

And kill a possible responsible tax paying adult who would have had a much greater likelihood of surviving the procedure.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:33:27 AM EST

[#3]

She had a chance and regretfully it failed, make her comfortable and let nature take its course.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:33:30 AM EST

[#4]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Every last person here would do the same for their kid that this mother did. Fair or not, you would fucking do the same thing.

True.

False.

How old is your daughter? You mean you would let her die when the doctors told you she could receive a transplant but a rule by HHS wouldn't even allow her to have a shot?

I would LOVE to be part of your family. You really have their backs.

"My baby dint do nuffin!! My family is always right!!!!!"

The mantra of society today.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:35:05 AM EST

[#5]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

We should just take the organs from hateful adults when a child needs a transplant

You have no clue of the facts of the case.

This girl would died without the lungs and you call it "emotional bullshit". Think about that!!

The girl got adult lungs (never done before and was a 1 in 1,000,000 chance it would work), a ticket to the front of the line, and they have had to throw away a viable set of lungs already.

Yes and that is a chance to save a child

Would you choose to save a child who would live at most 10 more years, or an adult who would live 4x times that?

Sure and why not just exterminate all disabled people so they don't use up resources that productive people could use? Who else has used this logic???

Without social programs , that is what would happen naturally, in many to most cases.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:38:00 AM EST

[#6]

So what happens when this next set fails as well? Does she get a third set of lungs? At what point do we finally realize that this girl's chance of survival is zero?

This situation sucks but we have to realize the reality of the situation, and getting politics and the media involved will not magically fix it. I feel for her parents.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:38:14 AM EST

[#7]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

I dont know about that....I think the lungs came from a dead person already unless you mean someone else not getting the second set of lungs..

Two other far more applicable candidates were denied so that these games could be played.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:44:22 AM EST

[#8]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

I dont know about that....I think the lungs came from a dead person already unless you mean someone else not getting the second set of lungs..

well, if you include the donors, it's 4. Little girls almost inevitable, immediate death, or death 10 years down the road makes 5.

If she survives, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if she offs herself from survivors guilt if she fully realizes why she's alive.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:45:49 AM EST

[#9]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I comprehend just fine. Work harder and maybe you can afford some decent medical care too.

I design medical equipment for a living. Lovely medical plan. Also have real world honest to gosh medical experience. EE and medical certifications.

Mostly saves. One loss. Everyone from first on scene (me) to the tertiary care facility to the Medevac guys to the trauma team at Children's did everything humanly possible.

You?

I could guess at what you're attempting to say through that horribly written paragraph but I won't...

No answer?

Expected.

Let me try that again, Rachel: What medical experience do you have with patients whose lives are hanging in the balance?

None of the bleeding hearts in here have responded...typical.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:48:43 AM EST

[#10]

Quoted:

Quoted:
As a father I would have fought tooth and nail for my daughter.

Right or wrong, I would have done the same thing.

When my son was ten, I would have strangled that little girl with my bare hands to save his life. So what? All that means is that parents act emotionally and medical decisions should be made rationally. That said, the real villains here are the media - in all likelihood they effectively killed two people for ratings.

You would murder an innocent child to save the life of your own child???? You and a bunch of other sociopaths apparently think that is not just OK, but admirable. Our society deserves to fail.

Let me re-iterate: you are not saying you would shoot and kill somebody who was attacking and trying to kill your child. That is self defense and is OK. You would murder an innocent child and seem proud of that fact!

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:52:41 AM EST

[#11]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Every last person here would do the same for their kid that this mother did. Fair or not, you would fucking do the same thing.

This too.

I am sure the family of the two people who didn't get lung transplants would do the same.

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:53:29 AM EST

[#12]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

We should just take the organs from hateful adults when a child needs a transplant

You have no clue of the facts of the case.

This girl would died without the lungs and you call it "emotional bullshit". Think about that!!

The girl got adult lungs (never done before and was a 1 in 1,000,000 chance it would work), a ticket to the front of the line, and they have had to throw away a viable set of lungs already.

Yes and that is a chance to save a child

Would you choose to save a child who would live at most 10 more years, or an adult who would live 4x times that?

Sure and why not just exterminate all disabled people so they don't use up resources that productive people could use? Who else has used this logic???

Um... Barack Obama and company?

What do I win!?!

Posted: 6/29/2013 8:53:48 AM EST

[#13]

Quoted:

Quoted:

When you politicize healthcare, this is what you end up with.

Welcome to my world. Politicians are making medical practice a nightmare. The regulations get more Byzantine every year, with diminishing reimbursements tied to arbitrary goals that don't always help patient care. Many white-coat political appointee doctors to advisory panels are so far removed from the trenches that they get consumed by groupthink. The limousine liberal physicians work in an entirely different world, which has led to some interesting dinner conversations between my siblings. One of my sisters fits that mold, and is happy to tell her "working class physician" siblings how things should be done.

Here's one example of .gov making medicine pear-shaped:
The government-mandated electronic health record systems are still not robust enough for widespread use, yet everyone is transitioning to them. Why? Because they used a carrot and stick approach - first the carrot of incentive money, now the stick of withholding money. Rushed EMR integration leads to downtime, lost productivity, and possible jeopardy to patient safety.

Thank you.

Posted: 6/29/2013 9:01:24 AM EST

[#14]

Quoted:

Quoted:
As a father I would have fought tooth and nail for my daughter.

Right or wrong, I would have done the same thing.

When my son was ten, I would have strangled that little girl with my bare hands to save his life. So what? All that means is that parents act emotionally and medical decisions should be made rationally. That said, the real villains here are the media - in all likelihood they effectively killed two people for ratings.

You would murder an innocent child to save the life of your own child???? You and a bunch of other sociopaths apparently think that is not just OK, but admirable. Our society deserves to fail.

Let me re-iterate: you are not saying you would shoot and kill somebody who was attacking and trying to kill your child. That is self defense and is OK. You would murder an innocent child and seem proud of that fact!

well, that little girl's family used the media to murder two other patients by proxy, and you're supporting their actions.

If I misunderstood your argument, then I believe you misunderstood Jane's which I believe was not that it was ok to murder innocent people for your own benefit, but that it is normal to have those urges when it concerns your loved ones; therefore emotion should have precisely nothing to do with medicine.

Posted: 6/29/2013 9:07:24 AM EST

[#15]

Can't fault the parents for doing this - if my kid, or grandkid was in a strait like this, you can be damned sure I'm doing everything possible to give them a life.

As to the morality of saving a child over an adult....should there even be a question? Yeah, I know...value to society, etc. Guess what, children are and should be a priority.

Posted: 6/29/2013 9:11:29 AM EST

[#16]

Quoted:
Can't fault the parents for doing this - if my kid, or grandkid was in a strait like this, you can be damned sure I'm doing everything possible to give them a life.

As to the morality of saving a child over an adult....should there even be a question? Yeah, I know...value to society, etc. Guess what, children are and should be a priority.

What about quality and length of life?

Posted: 6/29/2013 9:37:22 AM EST

[#17]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Can't fault the parents for doing this - if my kid, or grandkid was in a strait like this, you can be damned sure I'm doing everything possible to give them a life.

As to the morality of saving a child over an adult....should there even be a question? Yeah, I know...value to society, etc. Guess what, children are and should be a priority.

What about quality and length of life?

I guess we'll know when she dies, eh? Might be a fast death, might have a complete life and give birth to the next Albert Einstein - or Dahmer.

We don't know, but what we do know is that if she isn't given a reasonable chance (and of course my "reasonable" will be different from your "reasonable"), it's certain she won't do anything other than be fertilizer.

Quality and length of life aren't up to you, me, or the forum to decide. It's up to that person, and God, in the end.

Posted: 6/29/2013 9:50:51 AM EST

[#18]

Quoted:
We can't save everyone, death is part of life.

That gave me a flashback to the Benghazi hearings.

Posted: 6/29/2013 9:57:10 AM EST

[#19]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

I dont know about that....I think the lungs came from a dead person already unless you mean someone else not getting the second set of lungs..

well, if you include the donors, it's 4. Little girls almost inevitable, immediate death, or death 10 years down the road makes 5.

If she survives, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if she offs herself from survivors guilt if she fully realizes why she's alive.

So according to your impressive mental calculus they murdered the organ donors to obtain the transplanted lungs.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:01:37 AM EST

[#20]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

pure class you are

He's right, she killed two people because her mother cried on TV.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:02:45 AM EST

[#21]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

We should just take the organs from hateful adults when a child needs a transplant

You have no clue of the facts of the case.

This girl would died without the lungs and you call it "emotional bullshit". Think about that!!

The girl got adult lungs (never done before and was a 1 in 1,000,000 chance it would work), a ticket to the front of the line, and they have had to throw away a viable set of lungs already.

Yes and that is a chance to save a child

And kill a possible responsible tax paying adult who would have had a much greater likelihood of surviving the procedure.

More likely kill someone who is a smoker and is getting what they deserve.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:03:29 AM EST

[#22]

Quoted:

Quoted:

That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

Yep. Someone else loses their chance--actually TWO people lost their chances--because of the media-savvy mother. There's always more to the story.

When you politicize healthcare, this is what you end up with.

ayup

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:10:21 AM EST

[#23]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Can't fault the parents for doing this - if my kid, or grandkid was in a strait like this, you can be damned sure I'm doing everything possible to give them a life.

As to the morality of saving a child over an adult....should there even be a question? Yeah, I know...value to society, etc. Guess what, children are and should be a priority.

What about quality and length of life?

Regarding the original quote, but including smith's for posterity

yeah, kids are the future, but where do you draw the line? or do you? would you commit infinite resources to nearly infinite odds against you, when option b is a 50/50 shot and requires finite resources that can be measured?

It's a cold, heartless decision, that should ALMOST be made purely by numbers, but really needs human intervention for reasons of judgement i.e. "This patient has a much better chance at survival, but they're also in a family full of meth addicts...so give it to the other patient who has a slightly worse chance, but lives in relatively sane conditions"

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

I dont know about that....I think the lungs came from a dead person already unless you mean someone else not getting the second set of lungs..

well, if you include the donors, it's 4. Little girls almost inevitable, immediate death, or death 10 years down the road makes 5.

If she survives, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if she offs herself from survivors guilt if she fully realizes why she's alive.

So according to your impressive mental calculus they murdered the organ donors to obtain the transplanted lungs.

no, the guy I quoted thought the guy he quoted thought that. I was just saying IF that was the case, it would be 4, not 2. Although, technically, the donor's did have to die, they just weren't murdered for the purpose of being a donor.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:15:17 AM EST

[#24]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I comprehend just fine. Work harder and maybe you can afford some decent medical care too.

I design medical equipment for a living. Lovely medical plan. Also have real world honest to gosh medical experience. EE and medical certifications.

Mostly saves. One loss. Everyone from first on scene (me) to the tertiary care facility to the Medevac guys to the trauma team at Children's did everything humanly possible.

You?

I could guess at what you're attempting to say through that horribly written paragraph but I won't...

No answer?

Expected.

Let me try that again, Rachel: What medical experience do you have with patients whose lives are hanging in the balance?

Huh? What does that have to do with your libtard opinions about Wall Street you voiced earlier? Where did I make a comment about your medical experience? More importantly -- what gave you the indication that I gave a fuck? Like I said DU is to the left.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:16:06 AM EST

[#25]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Can't fault the parents for doing this - if my kid, or grandkid was in a strait like this, you can be damned sure I'm doing everything possible to give them a life.

As to the morality of saving a child over an adult....should there even be a question? Yeah, I know...value to society, etc. Guess what, children are and should be a priority.

What about quality and length of life?

I guess we'll know when she dies, eh? Might be a fast death, might have a complete life and give birth to the next Albert Einstein - or Dahmer.

We don't know, but what we do know is that if she isn't given a reasonable chance (and of course my "reasonable" will be different from your "reasonable"), it's certain she won't do anything other than be fertilizer.

Quality and length of life aren't up to you, me, or the forum to decide. It's up to that person, and God, in the end.

So the Dr's saying that based on her disease and the chances of the lungs taking don't mean anything? We do have a pretty good idea based on previous cases how this will play out. But because she's a child, we throw experience and science to the wind and rely on emotion? I feel for the kid and I'm with you that a child should be given every opportunity to live they have, but in this situation thats not the case. A child with a life expectancy of 10 average to crappy years should not trump an adult with the potential for a full life. Its the sad harsh truth...

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:18:25 AM EST

[#26]

Here's a counter argument.....the more they can do stuff like this, the more they can learn from trial and error and make it such that transplants like this can have better results.

The problem is the whole injection of government into the sphere of medicine.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:19:01 AM EST

[#27]

So if I'm reading this article right

Lung transplants are very sketchy and don't have a very high success rate to begin with. [/div]
[div]

There are rules that say kids are last on the list to get lung transplants (like out of the 1600ish on the list, only 12 or 16 are kids, the numbers make sense to me for this).

This girl's mom lobbied and sued and raised hell to bump her daughter forward of other people on the list. [/div]
[div]

I don't really know what to say here. I don't know any parent that wouldn't get emotional when their kids are sick, but this wasn't really fair to the thousands of other folks out there.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:20:14 AM EST

[#28]

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

This.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:23:31 AM EST

[#29]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

pure class you are

He's right, you know. And while we will never know for sure, that first set of lungs could be keeping someone else alive right now.

Seems to me transplants should be "one time only". You shouldn't be able to keep getting the same organ transplant time and time again.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:23:41 AM EST

[#30]

Quoted:
Every last person here would do the same for their kid that this mother did. Fair or not, you would fucking do the same thing.

Of course, but as AK pointed out, that's why there need to be medical professionals who make these kinds of calls, not the media.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:25:12 AM EST

[#31]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Can't fault the parents for doing this - if my kid, or grandkid was in a strait like this, you can be damned sure I'm doing everything possible to give them a life.

As to the morality of saving a child over an adult....should there even be a question? Yeah, I know...value to society, etc. Guess what, children are and should be a priority.

What about quality and length of life?

I guess we'll know when she dies, eh? Might be a fast death, might have a complete life and give birth to the next Albert Einstein - or Dahmer.

We don't know, but what we do know is that if she isn't given a reasonable chance (and of course my "reasonable" will be different from your "reasonable"), it's certain she won't do anything other than be fertilizer.

Quality and length of life aren't up to you, me, or the forum to decide. It's up to that person, and God, in the end.

So the Dr's saying that based on her disease and the chances of the lungs taking don't mean anything? We do have a pretty good idea based on previous cases how this will play out. But because she's a child, we throw experience and science to the wind and rely on emotion? I feel for the kid and I'm with you that a child should be given every opportunity to live they have, but in this situation thats not the case. A child with a life expectancy of 10 average to crappy years should not trump an adult with the potential for a full life. Its the sad harsh truth...

No, of course not - the assessment of the professional definitely means something. But I'm also aware that one professional will say something, and another professional will say something 180 degrees in opposition - yet both can be correct. Agreed that the past history does give us a pretty good idea, but I'm approaching this from the viewpoint of a Grandfather. I'd sacrifice myself to give my kids, or grandkids extra time. Life expectancies are nothing more than statistical blocks of data that suggest what will happen, and they're not always correct. I know what you're saying, but I still have to look at it from the personal standpoint. It's a sad harsh truth agreed, but it would be sadder if the parents just fell back and said "well, that's the way it is then, no use fighting it...".

For our next topic, we'll discuss liver transplants for adult alcoholics.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:28:54 AM EST

[#32]

Got this story beat:

Happened in NC in the early 2000's.

Illegal family shows up in NC from Mexico.
Daughter needs a transplant.
News was full of sob stories about the girl.
Duke University agreed to do the transplant.
Doctor screwed up and didn't cross check the blood types of the girl and the organ.
She got a second transplant, too.
Still died.
Family sued and won a bunch of cash.

And the kicker? Turns out the mother snuck her across the border because she knew indigents weren't turned away in this country. They snuck here specifically for the transplant.

eta: JESICA SANTILLAN

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:32:23 AM EST

[#33]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

pure class you are

He's right, you know. And while we will never know for sure, that first set of lungs could be keeping someone else alive right now.

Seems to me transplants should be "one time only". You shouldn't be able to keep getting the same organ transplant time and time again.

Do you have any reason for that stance besides this SNAFU? If transplants were an actual cure, you might have a valid point. Transplants are a treatment; a successful one can last for many years. However, there is always the risk of rejection, which can happen even when the regimen of drugs is strictly followed.

Should someone whose 20-year transplant was just rejected be denied a second just because they already got one?

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:35:00 AM EST

[#34]

Quoted:

wasn't this the girl who was low on the priority list because of the lower success rate for people that age? And want she bumped up to the top after publicity? No wonder they kept the failure a secret - someone else is going to die because they wasted a pair of lungs to appease the public.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

YES. 2 other people with better chances to adapt to those lungs didn't get them. Fuck the age doctors have determined can easily adapt to those lungs. We'll let EMOTIONS rule us. And so many ARFCOMers were acting like liberals supporting this.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:38:51 AM EST

[#35]

Quoted:

Quoted:

That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

We should just take the organs from hateful adults when a child needs a transplant

You have no clue of the facts of the case.

This girl would died without the lungs and you call it "emotional bullshit". Think about that!!

The girl got adult lungs (never done before and was a 1 in 1,000,000 chance it would work), a ticket to the front of the line, and they have had to throw away a viable set of lungs already.

In her state alone there were 40 people classified as urgent need. That's not counting nearby states. 40 people who had, statistically, a MUCH. MUCH better chance of adapting to those 2 sets of lungs.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:39:25 AM EST

[#36]

Quoted:

Quoted:

That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

We should just take the organs from hateful adults when a child needs a transplant

You have no clue of the facts of the case.

This girl would died without the lungs and you call it "emotional bullshit". Think about that!!

The girl got adult lungs (never done before and was a 1 in 1,000,000 chance it would work), a ticket to the front of the line, and they have had to throw away a viable set of lungs already.

Yes and that is a chance to save a child

While denying life to 2 other people who happen to be over 12.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:41:00 AM EST

[#37]

Quoted:

Every last person here would do the same for their kid that this mother did. Fair or not, you would fucking do the same thing.

True.

That's why there should be doctors making the call, not the media.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:43:55 AM EST

[#38]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Can't fault the parents for doing this - if my kid, or grandkid was in a strait like this, you can be damned sure I'm doing everything possible to give them a life.

As to the morality of saving a child over an adult....should there even be a question? Yeah, I know...value to society, etc. Guess what, children are and should be a priority.

What about quality and length of life?

I guess we'll know when she dies, eh? Might be a fast death, might have a complete life and give birth to the next Albert Einstein - or Dahmer.

We don't know, but what we do know is that if she isn't given a reasonable chance (and of course my "reasonable" will be different from your "reasonable"), it's certain she won't do anything other than be fertilizer.

Quality and length of life aren't up to you, me, or the forum to decide. It's up to that person, and God, in the end.

So the Dr's saying that based on her disease and the chances of the lungs taking don't mean anything? We do have a pretty good idea based on previous cases how this will play out. But because she's a child, we throw experience and science to the wind and rely on emotion? I feel for the kid and I'm with you that a child should be given every opportunity to live they have, but in this situation thats not the case. A child with a life expectancy of 10 average to crappy years should not trump an adult with the potential for a full life. Its the sad harsh truth...

No, of course not - the assessment of the professional definitely means something. But I'm also aware that one professional will say something, and another professional will say something 180 degrees in opposition - yet both can be correct. Agreed that the past history does give us a pretty good idea, but I'm approaching this from the viewpoint of a Grandfather. I'd sacrifice myself to give my kids, or grandkids extra time. Life expectancies are nothing more than statistical blocks of data that suggest what will happen, and they're not always correct. I know what you're saying, but I still have to look at it from the personal standpoint. It's a sad harsh truth agreed, but it would be sadder if the parents just fell back and said "well, that's the way it is then, no use fighting it...".

For our next topic, we'll discuss liver transplants for adult alcoholics.

I understand where you're coming from and I agree with you, anyone else would act the same. The parents are not wrong for the way they feel, they should fight tooth and nail. The problem occurred when government got involved because of an emotional ploy by the mother to the media. Emotionally, it makes sense. Rationally it does not.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:48:50 AM EST

[#39]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Kid threads always bring out the White-Knighting.

Kid anything always brings out political expediency.

Our representatives will do anything, and I mean anything to save their own skins and careers.

How many officials would pull a Johnny Iselin today? I'm guessin 98-99%

This is why they use kids to piggy back gun laws. But some arfcommers are STILL dumb enough to fall for it.

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:49:25 AM EST

[#40]

Quoted:

She had a chance and regretfully it failed, make her comfortable and let nature take its course.

No, that didn't fit the narrative! Get another set of lungs!

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:50:43 AM EST

[#41]

Quoted:

Quoted:

As a father I would have fought tooth and nail for my daughter.

Right or wrong, I would have done the same thing.

When my son was ten, I would have strangled that little girl with my bare hands to save his life. So what? All that means is that parents act emotionally and medical decisions should be made rationally. That said, the real villains here are the media - in all likelihood they effectively killed two people for ratings.

You would murder an innocent child to save the life of your own child???? You and a bunch of other sociopaths apparently think that is not just OK, but admirable. Our society deserves to fail.

Let me re-iterate: you are not saying you would shoot and kill somebody who was attacking and trying to kill your child. That is self defense and is OK. You would murder an innocent child and seem proud of that fact!

well, that little girl's family used the media to murder two other patients by proxy, and you're supporting their actions.

If I misunderstood your argument, then I believe you misunderstood Jane's which I believe was not that it was ok to murder innocent people for your own benefit, but that it is normal to have those urges when it concerns your loved ones; therefore emotion should have precisely nothing to do with medicine.

BINGO!

Posted: 6/29/2013 10:51:54 AM EST

[#42]

Quoted:

So if I'm reading this article right

Lung transplants are very sketchy and don't have a very high success rate to begin with. [/div][div]

There are rules that say kids are last on the list to get lung transplants (like out of the 1600ish on the list, only 12 or 16 are kids, the numbers make sense to me for this).

This girl's mom lobbied and sued and raised hell to bump her daughter forward of other people on the list. [/div][div]

I don't really know what to say here. I don't know any parent that wouldn't get emotional when their kids are sick, but this wasn't really fair to the thousands of other folks out there.

BUT IT'S A CHILD!!!!!!! /arfcomer

Posted: 6/29/2013 11:43:40 AM EST

[#43]

Politics + medicine = tragedy

Posted: 6/29/2013 11:44:58 AM EST

[#44]

Quoted:
Politics + medicine = tragedy

Politics+Anything=Tragedy

Posted: 6/29/2013 11:52:50 AM EST

[#45]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

pure class you are

Organ transplants are the use of a commodity in a life and death market. If a Doctor has to make a decision that is going to equal someone lives/

someone else dies, conscience seems to require that the Doctor make the decision that would give the person chosen to live the longest possible

life, or at least longest chance at life. After all, someone else died to give them life. These decisions aren't made frivolously without understanding

of the cost. At least, not until this case.

Yep, they should go to those with the best chance of success and survivability.

Posted: 6/29/2013 11:58:12 AM EST

[#46]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That's two people killed for emotional bullshit.

We should just take the organs from hateful adults when a child needs a transplant

You have no clue of the facts of the case.

This girl would died without the lungs and you call it "emotional bullshit". Think about that!!

The girl got adult lungs (never done before and was a 1 in 1,000,000 chance it would work), a ticket to the front of the line, and they have had to throw away a viable set of lungs already.

Yes and that is a chance to save a child

Oh for fucks sake. Click.