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Posted: 1/5/2022 7:23:49 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not .30 Federal Automatic Gun?   I'm kind of interested, but thats funny |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 7:25:11 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is one of my favorite pistols. It’s slim,soft shooting and accurate. https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/y86/mossie500/kerpow/.highres/ED70BF67-B482-4864-A91D-949294E7909C.jpg An improved version of the round certainly has me interested. Okay, but what is it 
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Posted: 1/5/2022 7:49:07 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistorySo there selling point is it’s the first caliber designed for the CC market! What a crock |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 7:52:09 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So there selling point is it’s the first caliber designed for the CC market! What a crock Quote HistoryQuoted: So there selling point is it’s the first caliber designed for the CC market! What a crock Buy it! A fat man in flannel said so. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 7:57:40 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Okay, but what is it Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is one of my favorite pistols. It’s slim,soft shooting and accurate. https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/y86/mossie500/kerpow/.highres/ED70BF67-B482-4864-A91D-949294E7909C.jpg An improved version of the round certainly has me interested. Okay, but what is it MAC 1935S. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:02:44 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Buy it! A fat man in flannel said so. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So there selling point is it’s the first caliber designed for the CC market! What a crock Buy it! A fat man in flannel said so. I am a fat man in flannel well not right now but most of the time hahaha and I don’t think so. I’m not saying they won’t sell I’m sure they will to the target audience in droves especially if they ran the line and got pallets of ammo ready to ship with guns. I just can’t fathom why when they can’t meet current ammo demands of the most popular calibers why they’d add new ones. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:29:10 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am a fat man in flannel well not right now but most of the time hahaha and I don’t think so. I’m not saying they won’t sell I’m sure they will to the target audience in droves especially if they ran the line and got pallets of ammo ready to ship with guns. I just can’t fathom why when they can’t meet current ammo demands of the most popular calibers why they’d add new ones. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: So there selling point is it’s the first caliber designed for the CC market! What a crock Buy it! A fat man in flannel said so. I am a fat man in flannel well not right now but most of the time hahaha and I don’t think so. I’m not saying they won’t sell I’m sure they will to the target audience in droves especially if they ran the line and got pallets of ammo ready to ship with guns. I just can’t fathom why when they can’t meet current ammo demands of the most popular calibers why they’d add new ones. Because 9mm is $17/50 and this new stuff will be $25/20? |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:30:22 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am a fat man in flannel well not right now but most of the time hahaha and I don’t think so. I’m not saying they won’t sell I’m sure they will to the target audience in droves especially if they ran the line and got pallets of ammo ready to ship with guns. I just can’t fathom why when they can’t meet current ammo demands of the most popular calibers why they’d add new ones. Student: "What's it for?" Jeff Cooper: "It's for sale, of course!" |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:31:00 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Buy it! A fat man in flannel said so. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So there selling point is it’s the first caliber designed for the CC market! What a crock Buy it! A fat man in flannel said so. Arf used to talk and talk and talk about Jim Gillian’s and loved him when he wore green. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:32:43 PM EDT
[#10]
.32 Federal Action Pistol
For when you’re alone at the range. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:35:31 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Arf used to talk and talk and talk about Jim Gillian’s and loved him when he wore green. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: So there selling point is it’s the first caliber designed for the CC market! What a crock Buy it! A fat man in flannel said so. Arf used to talk and talk and talk about Jim Gillian’s and loved him when he wore green. Who? Is the guy in the video someone important? |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:38:07 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: .32 Federal Action Pistol For when you’re alone at the range. 
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:38:43 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who? Is the guy in the video someone important? No, but he killed someone from fair distance and the nuthuggers came out. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:41:51 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: .32 Federal Action Pistol For when you’re alone at the range. That works What lube for .32FAP? |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:49:20 PM EDT
[#15]
Vista would rather waste primers on this than let them hit the reloader market at any price.
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:51:52 PM EDT
[#16]
Ghey
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:52:53 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://youtu.be/fGHxrE9HXBs Overpriced 1911 and a flannel-adorned beer gut in the first ten seconds…Pass |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:56:07 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is so dumb. I just drove from Missouri to New Mexico and back this week stopping at gun shops, bass pro, cabelas, and so on. Aside from some 9mm and .40 the pistol ammo shelf's were empty. I can not recall the last time I walked in somewhere and saw a 50 round box of .357 magnum. But now all of the sudden federal wants to come out with this new cartridge? Jesus. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:57:36 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://youtu.be/fGHxrE9HXBs  Again, using a 1911 as a launch platform this cartridge is a BAD IDEA. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:58:36 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bring back the .356 TSW |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 8:59:23 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Okay, but what is it Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is one of my favorite pistols. It's slim,soft shooting and accurate. https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/y86/mossie500/kerpow/.highres/ED70BF67-B482-4864-A91D-949294E7909C.jpg An improved version of the round certainly has me interested. Okay, but what is it |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:06:35 PM EDT
[#22]
Actually, I am looking at a Cartridges Of the World book right now and it states the factory load of the 7.65 French longue has an 85 Grain bullet that has a muzzle velocity of 1150 FPS. So if S&W decided to develop this round as a close relative to 30 Peterson (AKA 7.65 French Longue), then ballistics would be the same, if not enhanced due to powder developments over the past century...
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:08:55 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The idea of the cartridge is good. The timing and name is horrible. The guns they are introducing it in suck. They should be selling a Glock 48 in this caliber. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:09:39 PM EDT
[#24]
Yeah that video was a bit cringey for sure but I'm certain many will be entertained by exploded cabbages and milk jugs. Overall I think it's a solid idea, I see no issue with the name, it certainly could have been worse. If they can keep practice ammo somewhere between 9mm and 380 price wise it may do okay, which would be about $20/50rds, it needs to be affordable to some degree or nobody will buy it, that and Glock, Springfield, SIG and Ruger need to adopt it.
I do find it odd they're showcasing a Nighthawk 1911 chambered in it though, who the hell is going to buy a pricey ass Nighthawk 1911 in a 30 SC, that's a stretch for a cartridge designed for people who largely aren't about to buy such a gun. Whether it does well or not is yet to be seen and honestly the odds are stacked against it, but performance wise it should be adequate. I'd buy one if the right gun comes along. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:09:53 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That commercial had me go: /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/0c96c781a5e6260d0827848aec47d205-381.gif Again, using a 1911 as a launch platform this cartridge is a BAD IDEA. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: https://youtu.be/fGHxrE9HXBs /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/0c96c781a5e6260d0827848aec47d205-381.gif Again, using a 1911 as a launch platform this cartridge is a BAD IDEA. $1500 pistol in a $15 holster |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:14:24 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actually, I am looking at a Cartridges Of the World book right now and it states the factory load of the 7.65 French longue has an 85 Grain bullet that has a muzzle velocity of 1150 FPS. So if S&W decided to develop this round as a close relative to 30 Peterson (AKA 7.65 French Longue), then ballistics would be the same, if not enhanced due to powder developments over the past century... If you take a cartridge and run ammunition at double the pressure you'll either destroy the gun, or end up wearing it on your face. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:16:54 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wonder if this is some new wonder round being introduced at SHOT show and a few retailers jumped the gun. Found something saying the 100 grain ammo runs around 1200fps... so basically it's a smaller diameter 9mm... and for what? The answer to a question that nobody was asking. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:17:53 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actually, I am looking at a Cartridges Of the World book right now and it states the factory load of the 7.65 French longue has an 85 Grain bullet that has a muzzle velocity of 1150 FPS. So if S&W decided to develop this round as a close relative to 30 Peterson (AKA 7.65 French Longue), then ballistics would be the same, if not enhanced due to powder developments over the past century... 100g @ 1129fps per flannel video = not enhanced |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:23:32 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 100g @ 1129fps per flannel video = not enhanced |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:23:48 PM EDT
[#30]
If they are going to introduce a new cartridge, it should be really new. Like polymer cases so they can sell ball ammo for 15 cents a round.
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:24:14 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That commercial had me go: /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/0c96c781a5e6260d0827848aec47d205-381.gif Again, using a 1911 as a launch platform this cartridge is a BAD IDEA. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: https://youtu.be/fGHxrE9HXBs /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/0c96c781a5e6260d0827848aec47d205-381.gif Again, using a 1911 as a launch platform this cartridge is a BAD IDEA. Right! I’d be interested in compact or subcompact gun maybe |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:26:30 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @ 50 yards, which isn't bad and suggests north of 1200 fps muzzle. Not bad for a relatively long bullet in a case notably smaller than 9mm. Kick it up to 1,650 and it will be major power factor [do not attempt  ]1250 would just make minor. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:28:35 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kick it up to 1,650 and it will be major power factor [do not attempt ]1250 would just make minor. It’ll do neither, because it doesn’t meet minimum case dimensions or bullet diameter for any division including Open |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:33:51 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It’ll do neither, because it doesn’t meet minimum case dimensions or bullet diameter for any division including Open Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Kick it up to 1,650 and it will be major power factor [do not attempt ]1250 would just make minor. It’ll do neither, because it doesn’t meet minimum case dimensions or bullet diameter for any division including Open and so with no plausible use in competition, no proven history in defensive use, no inventory of guns or ammo on any shelf anywhere, sales will languish. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:35:47 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The idea of the cartridge is good. The timing and name is horrible. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is so dumb. I just drove from Missouri to New Mexico and back this week stopping at gun shops, bass pro, cabelas, and so on. Aside from some 9mm and .40 the pistol ammo shelf's were empty. I can not recall the last time I walked in somewhere and saw a 50 round box of .357 magnum. But now all of the sudden federal wants to come out with this new cartridge? Jesus. I thought the ammo panic was over? It’s been normal stock around here for months. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:37:24 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If they are going to introduce a new cartridge, it should be really new. Like polymer cases so they can sell ball ammo for 15 cents a round. Or caseless. Materials science has advanced a whole lot since HK tried it. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:37:43 PM EDT
[#37]
I love the idea of this cartridge. I already like the .30 Luger, this is basically that with a form factor allowing for higher capacity. Win/win.
From a marketing standpoint, I don't know that this will pan out. The launch platform should've been a full size double stack they could cram at least 20 rounds into. Maybe even use a double-stack double-feed mag like the old Steyr GB. Getting into numbers starting with "2" would cross a mental barrier where it sounds like a huge capacity. Yes, even though going from 17 to 20rds is less of a % increase than from 10 to 12 and less likely to matter in a fight. You just want to make people think "Say that again, it holds how many rounds in a pistol?". Also, DON'T say "it's not designed for police or military". That's literally the opposite of effective marketing in this industry. Instead say it's a project designed for the most elite special forces and fighter pilots to give them a handgun with firepower approximating a PDW. It doesn't matter if any .mil has expressed interest, just say you're shopping it around and can't talk about the details. If your flagship product is a Shield EZ you are going to get mentally filed away as "that weak caliber for grandmas", which is a decent niche, but maybe not a big enough one to sustain a whole caliber. If your flagship product is something Billy Badass can call a "weapons system" or a "platform", you can still easily expand into the Shield EZ space without being boxed in there. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:38:31 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:The answer to a question that nobody was asking. Yeah…I think that was brought up on the first page or two…  Attached File |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:49:23 PM EDT
[#39]
Tinfoil hat time:
Vista Outdoors (parent company of Federal) is a left leaning company. Wanna know why Savage dropped the Indian head logo? So get this...Vista owns a good chunk of ammuniton manufacturing in the US. Vista may also have an inkling that some sort of ammo restriction is likely during this administration. Similar to what is seen in Europe and South America in regards to civilians owning weapons chambered in 'military and police' cartridges. The promo video placed a lot of emphasis on this cartridge not being a military or police developed cartridge. Vista is putting themselves in a position to profit in the face of gun control. 
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:52:42 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I love the idea of this cartridge. I already like the .30 Luger, this is basically that with a form factor allowing for higher capacity. Win/win. From a marketing standpoint, I don't know that this will pan out. The launch platform should've been a full size double stack they could cram at least 20 rounds into. Maybe even use a double-stack double-feed mag like the old Steyr GB. Getting into numbers starting with "2" would cross a mental barrier where it sounds like a huge capacity. Yes, even though going from 17 to 20rds is less of a % increase than from 10 to 12 and less likely to matter in a fight. You just want to make people think "Say that again, it holds how many rounds in a pistol?". Also, DON'T say "it's not designed for police or military". That's literally the opposite of effective marketing in this industry. Instead say it's a project designed for the most elite special forces and fighter pilots to give them a handgun with firepower approximating a PDW. It doesn't matter if any .mil has expressed interest, just say you're shopping it around and can't talk about the details. If your flagship product is a Shield EZ you are going to get mentally filed away as "that weak caliber for grandmas", which is a decent niche, but maybe not a big enough one to sustain a whole caliber. If your flagship product is something Billy Badass can call a "weapons system" or a "platform", you can still easily expand into the Shield EZ space without being boxed in there. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:54:52 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tinfoil hat time: Vista Outdoors (parent company of Federal) is a left leaning company. Wanna know why Savage dropped the Indian head logo? So get this...Vista owns a good chunk of ammuniton manufacturing in the US. Vista may also have an inkling that some sort of ammo restriction is likely during this administration. Similar to what is seen in Europe and South America in regards to civilians owning weapons chambered in 'military and police' cartridges. The promo video placed a lot of emphasis on this cartridge not being a military or police developed cartridge. Vista is putting themselves in a position to profit in the face of gun control. As |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:57:16 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tinfoil hat time: Vista Outdoors (parent company of Federal) is a left leaning company. Wanna know why Savage dropped the Indian head logo? So get this...Vista owns a good chunk of ammuniton manufacturing in the US. Vista may also have an inkling that some sort of ammo restriction is likely during this administration. Similar to what is seen in Europe and South America in regards to civilians owning weapons chambered in 'military and police' cartridges. The promo video placed a lot of emphasis on this cartridge not being a military or police developed cartridge. Vista is putting themselves in a position to profit in the face of gun control. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 9:59:58 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tinfoil hat time: Vista Outdoors (parent company of Federal) is a left leaning company. Wanna know why Savage dropped the Indian head logo? So get this...Vista owns a good chunk of ammuniton manufacturing in the US. Vista may also have an inkling that some sort of ammo restriction is likely during this administration. Similar to what is seen in Europe and South America in regards to civilians owning weapons chambered in 'military and police' cartridges. The promo video placed a lot of emphasis on this cartridge not being a military or police developed cartridge. Vista is putting themselves in a position to profit in the face of gun control. I would maybe take a deep breath on that one. 1: there are already so many rounds of 9mm and 5.56 in circulation, plus dies and brass, that any ban would be meaningless and harder to enforce than “it’s only an SBR if you put the brace against your shoulder.” 2: even lots of the countries that had prohibited “military” cartridges for the civilian market have done away with those restrictions by this point. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 10:00:05 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That was my first feeling Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Tinfoil hat time: Vista Outdoors (parent company of Federal) is a left leaning company. Wanna know why Savage dropped the Indian head logo? So get this...Vista owns a good chunk of ammuniton manufacturing in the US. Vista may also have an inkling that some sort of ammo restriction is likely during this administration. Similar to what is seen in Europe and South America in regards to civilians owning weapons chambered in 'military and police' cartridges. The promo video placed a lot of emphasis on this cartridge not being a military or police developed cartridge. Vista is putting themselves in a position to profit in the face of gun control. Its the next lowest hanging fruit for gun control. Nobody needs military calibers, keep your guns but keep dangerous baby killing rounds out of civilian hands. 
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Posted: 1/5/2022 10:02:54 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kick it up to 1,650 and it will be major power factor [do not attempt ]1250 would just make minor. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: @ 50 yards, which isn't bad and suggests north of 1200 fps muzzle. Not bad for a relatively long bullet in a case notably smaller than 9mm. Kick it up to 1,650 and it will be major power factor [do not attempt ]1250 would just make minor. USPSA power factor is dumb and is only still a thing because it’s become entrenched in the culture of the game. It should have been ditched the second that Jeff Cooper had the dirt poured over him. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 10:09:38 PM EDT
[#46]
Ya know, If the French had decided to magnumize this round, which this pistol's quality is certainly capable of taking, they would have had the same round back in the early 30's....The same with the old Spanish Super "b" series....
They had what was essentially the 9x23 Winchester magnum (38 super comp) and detuned it... But even today, those Star Super B's are easily capable of taking the hot 9x23 round and handling it with a spring upgrade. Quote HistoryQuoted: This is one of my favorite pistols. It’s slim,soft shooting and accurate. https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/y86/mossie500/kerpow/.highres/ED70BF67-B482-4864-A91D-949294E7909C.jpg An improved version of the round certainly has me interested. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 10:14:23 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The guns they are introducing it in suck. They should be selling a Glock 48 in this caliber. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The idea of the cartridge is good. The timing and name is horrible. The guns they are introducing it in suck. They should be selling a Glock 48 in this caliber. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 10:17:33 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The guns are absolutely horrible. At least a S&W Shield Plus would have been a much better option. But a 1911 of all things is the worst. And I actually do like and own 1911s, even 9mm ones. If they had an MP7 in this caliber I suspect ARF would have had a simultaneous orgasm. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 10:32:39 PM EDT
[#49]
The gun control that's written and waiting for a winnable vote includes mag cap limits.
Yet they're pushing this based first on mag cap advantage. Seems like a good sign, if anything. |
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Posted: 1/5/2022 10:33:41 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: USPSA power factor is dumb and is only still a thing because it’s become entrenched in the culture of the game. It should have been ditched the second that Jeff Cooper had the dirt poured over him. Sir, we are in agreement. |
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