Ed Snowden SUED by the US Govt - Page 4

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Posted: 9/18/2019 12:28:35 PM EST

[#1]

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Only a VERY small percentage of your government is elected. Seems that, as usual, you are the one who needs the civic lesson.

Should we post the percentage of the government that is elected? Your arguments are even dumber than the usual statist garbage I read regularly here.

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I should have kept reading, excellent post, I reaffirmed this sentiment in my own.

Posted: 9/18/2019 12:31:22 PM EST

[#2]

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To all of the NSA defenders and those who say Snowden is a traitor, are you saying that the NSA is in fact not monitoring American citizens?

Or if they are spying on us, Snowden simply made this up and they are spying on us in different ways?

To those who say he broke the law, you’d be correct. But that isn’t evidence enough for me because of the whole founding fathers were traitors analogy.

I have not kept up on the propaganda from either side. I find it plausible that the NSA’s massive classified computer centers could be spying on us. But what I haven’t heard is the evidence refuting him, other than from Obama’s trustworthy mouth. I’m interested to get a summary of what that is (as long as it is not conjecture).

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This might come to you as an odd concept, but both NSA and Snowflake broke the law and both should face the consequences.

Posted: 9/18/2019 1:47:10 PM EST

[#3]

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So your evidence is your belief that Russia/China would never do such a thing without an exchange of some damaging intelligence but we don’t know for sure if that’s true?

Hopefully you don’t misconstrue my question with an assumption about what I do or do not know. These are not meant to be leading questions. I have no knowledge or expertise to know what motivates a country to harbor Snowden. One thought of mine is that an irritant to my unfriendly neighbor is my friend (but that may entirely not be the case in this situation, how can you know for sure).

The Bradly Manning incident resulted in some harm, correct? Is there anything similar with Snowden’s leaks?

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The alternative is to believe that Russia and China acted out of altruistic charity. If you believe that, you’re probably shocked to hear that the government spies on people.

So your evidence is your belief that Russia/China would never do such a thing without an exchange of some damaging intelligence but we don’t know for sure if that’s true?

Hopefully you don’t misconstrue my question with an assumption about what I do or do not know. These are not meant to be leading questions. I have no knowledge or expertise to know what motivates a country to harbor Snowden. One thought of mine is that an irritant to my unfriendly neighbor is my friend (but that may entirely not be the case in this situation, how can you know for sure).

The Bradly Manning incident resulted in some harm, correct? Is there anything similar with Snowden’s leaks?

I'm not privy to the internal operations of Chinese and Russian intelligence, so it's hard to say. They allowed some information to be leaked because it was helpful in terms of their anti-American intel distribution. Do you really think that's all they got out of it?

Posted: 9/18/2019 3:46:59 PM EST

[#4]

Its funny how some people in this thread are just here to agitate and refuse to pose a serious argument for several of the most glaring points.

Posted: 9/18/2019 4:01:39 PM EST

[#5]

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There is a video from prager u that I think you should watch, in short, the majority of our government is not elected. They are appointed lifetime burocrats and the video rightly refers to them as little "kings" that actually run the day to day decisions of the NSA, FBI, EPA, and any other alphabet letter you want to pick from.

Edit to add: There is also no constitutional ammendment that gives a burocracy like the NSA the right to lie to their governing body, specifically congress.

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Your understanding of Civics is non existent.

"the government" is elected here. It's not an oligarchy. Snowden evidently prefers such a thing, as that's where he defected to -- but that's not what we have. Doing harm to "the government" is by definition doing harm to this country and its interests, as this country put the government in place.

There is no Constitutional amendment that enshrines the right to leak national security secrets and run away to Russia, so your 12" barrel comment is absurd.

There is a video from prager u that I think you should watch, in short, the majority of our government is not elected. They are appointed lifetime burocrats and the video rightly refers to them as little "kings" that actually run the day to day decisions of the NSA, FBI, EPA, and any other alphabet letter you want to pick from.

Edit to add: There is also no constitutional ammendment that gives a burocracy like the NSA the right to lie to their governing body, specifically congress.

There is no one appointed to a lifetime appointment in our government, with the exception of federal judges.

Government service bureaucrats are not in lifetime positions. They can all be fired, and the many of them are just political appointees who last as long as the President does. The ones who aren't are all subject to being fired or removed as their agency policies direct subject to federal employment law. They're just employees.

Posted: 9/18/2019 4:05:10 PM EST

[#6]

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Its funny how some people in this thread are just here to agitate and refuse to pose a serious argument for several of the most glaring points.

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You mean of course the Snowden defenders? Yes, you're correct. They present no argument or evidence other than "government bad! Snowden good!" and quoting a traitor/defector who currently lives under the control of a foreign intelligence service in direct contravention of his oath and pretending his words are gospel truth.

Posted: 9/18/2019 4:54:26 PM EST

[#7]

I do believe the argument here is, "government bad, ~~snowden~~ exposing a non elected body that was unlawfully and indiscriminately spying on every American citizen good"

Edit to add: some heros don't wear capes.

Posted: 9/18/2019 5:01:28 PM EST

[#8]

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I do believe the argument here is, "government bad, ~~snowden~~ exposing a non elected body that was unlawfully and indiscriminately spying on every American citizen good"

Edit to add: some heros don't wear capes.

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That's the narrative the FSB is pushing anyway.

Posted: 9/18/2019 7:21:08 PM EST

[#9]

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I do believe the argument here is, "government bad, ~~snowden~~ exposing a non elected body that was unlawfully and indiscriminately spying on every American citizen good"

Edit to add: some heros don't wear capes.

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So now that we’ve established that (for some) treason is ok if you deliver some good news along with it, let’s quantify exactly how much good news is required to turn a treasonous malcontent into a hero...

Posted: 9/18/2019 9:07:08 PM EST

[#10]

snowden and manning should hang side by side

Posted: 9/19/2019 7:49:14 AM EST

[#11]

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So now that we’ve established that (for some) treason is ok if you deliver some good news along with it, let’s quantify exactly how much good news is required to turn a treasonous malcontent into a hero...

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I don't consider revealing unconstitutional and immoral government programs to the American people to be treason. I consider the people implementing the programs to be treasonous.

Posted: 9/19/2019 8:28:02 AM EST

[#12]

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I don't consider revealing unconstitutional and immoral government programs to the American people to be treason. I consider the people implementing the programs to be treasonous.

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So now that we’ve established that (for some) treason is ok if you deliver some good news along with it, let’s quantify exactly how much good news is required to turn a treasonous malcontent into a hero...

I don't consider revealing unconstitutional and immoral government programs to the American people to be treason. I consider the people implementing the programs to be treasonous.

We’ve already established that, but what about the rest? How much good news justifies giving away actionable intelligence to foreign governments? That’s now the question, so what’s your answer?

Is Hillary Clinton a hero for derailing her own campaign even though she gave away classified information via unsecured email? You got something you wanted, so she’s a hero, right? Unlike Snowden, though, her case was driven by arrogance and stupidity not pure malice, though. Still, both hate their country and want to do as much damage as possible, so you like them, right?

Hillary may not be the best comparison though, considering that Snowden likely had no idea what he was even copying- he just copied what he could and bolted for his buddies across the Pacific. Let’s find another person that was disgruntled with their job, mad at their country, and, motivated purely by butthurt and self-interest, gave shit to an enemy... ah: Benedict Arnold... I suppose he was a hero too, right?

Posted: 9/19/2019 8:44:01 AM EST

[#13]

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We’ve already established that, but what about the rest? How much good news justifies giving away actionable intelligence to foreign governments? That’s now the question, so what’s your answer?

Is Hillary Clinton a hero for derailing her own campaign even though she gave away classified information via unsecured email? You got something you wanted, so she’s a hero, right? Unlike Snowden, though, her case was driven by arrogance and stupidity not pure malice, though. Still, both hate their country and want to do as much damage as possible, so you like them, right?

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What actionable intelligence? That we were collecting data on US citizens? That the US was involved in cyber attacks against other countries? I think you should define the harms against the US that have occurred.

And I'd say that learning about Clinton's corruption was a good thing. Wikileaks published a lot of revealing information and we benefited as whole with them having been published. But it's not like she leaked it with the intention of revealing her own wrongs. The two aren't remotely comparable. Hillary is a sociopath but I don't think she wanted "to do as much damage as possible." She wanted power. And I don't understand how you can interpret Snowden's motives as just wanting to damage the country. You can see it as wrong, or breach of his contract, or whatever, but the fact that you only attribute it to his supposed malice and hatred for America is absurd.

Posted: 9/19/2019 9:49:12 AM EST

[#14]

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That's the narrative the FSB is pushing anyway.

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I do believe the argument here is, "government bad, ~~snowden~~ exposing a non elected body that was unlawfully and indiscriminately spying on every American citizen good"

Edit to add: some heros don't wear capes.

That's the narrative the FSB is pushing anyway.

For once they might be close to the truth.

Posted: 9/19/2019 9:58:15 AM EST

[#15]

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Lack of self-awareness here, Uncle Sam.

Snowden is an American hero.

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I'm torn, but mostly this.

Some of the things Snowden exposed needed to be exposed and shut down.

.gov in this case is mad that they got outed more than they are about anything else.

Do your thing outside conus or people who are not citizens and are of special interest. But citizens, that where I got off the train. FBI should take care if that stuff, and they should have to be completely transparent about it.

Also, FISA courts need to go away.

Posted: 9/19/2019 11:15:57 AM EST

[#16]

Would be nice if all those clamoring for Snowden's death by simultaneous hanging and firing squad have the same kneejerk reaction towards the Fed.gov's unapologetic, unconstitutional "Fuck you, America. Deal with it." surveillance and intrusion in every facet of American Citizen's life.

Nary a peep when Clapper lied to Congress under oath about it.

Goes on and on, but never the same level of outrage towards our masters as towards those who dare prove that they are as corrupt and partisan as we suspected.

Yea Snowden will most likely get his just desserts, but the beat will go on in the Beltway and nobody will care.

Posted: 9/19/2019 9:18:32 PM EST

[#17]

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Would be nice if all those clamoring for Snowden's death by simultaneous hanging and firing squad have the same kneejerk reaction towards the Fed.gov's unapologetic, unconstitutional "Fuck you, America. Deal with it." surveillance and intrusion in every facet of American Citizen's life.

Nary a peep when Clapper lied to Congress under oath about it.

Goes on and on, but never the same level of outrage towards our masters as towards those who dare prove that they are as corrupt and partisan as we suspected.

Yea Snowden will most likely get his just desserts, but the beat will go on in the Beltway and nobody will care.

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It’s possible to be both pissed at the government’s actions (which should have surprised nobody except the chronically naive) AND understand that it’s only a part of the information Snowden delivered to the Russians and Chinese. That his handlers have only released a subset of the information (the “low hanging fruit” that helps their international Counter-Intel and creates internal dissent on the US) should surprise no one. Only they and the NSA know the contents of the rest and for obvious reasons neither are saying. The Russians and Chinese are always very forthcoming and honest about that stuff, right?

The Snowden jocksniffers are the only ones who can’t seem to understand this...

Posted: 9/19/2019 10:20:32 PM EST

[#18]

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snowden and manning should hang side by side

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+ Assange

Posted: 9/19/2019 11:40:04 PM EST

[#19]

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+ Assange

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Right after the trial of all the living former NSA Directors and CIA Directors and similar high ranking staffers of both agencies for Treason.

Posted: 9/20/2019 12:03:40 AM EST

[#20]

Posted: 9/20/2019 12:08:26 AM EST

[#21]

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Your understanding of Civics is non existent.

"the government" is elected here. It's not an oligarchy. Snowden evidently prefers such a thing, as that's where he defected to -- but that's not what we have. Doing harm to "the government" is by definition doing harm to this country and its interests, as this country put the government in place.

There is no Constitutional amendment that enshrines the right to leak national security secrets and run away to Russia, so your 12" barrel comment is absurd.

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Do you have a PhD in boot licking or is it a natural talent you were born with?

Posted: 9/20/2019 6:20:56 AM EST

[#22]

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So now that we’ve established that (for some) treason is ok if you deliver some good news along with it, let’s quantify exactly how much good news is required to turn a treasonous malcontent into a hero...

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I do believe the argument here is, "government bad, ~~snowden~~ exposing a non elected body that was unlawfully and indiscriminately spying on every American citizen good"

Edit to add: some heros don't wear capes.

So now that we’ve established that (for some) treason is ok if you deliver some good news along with it, let’s quantify exactly how much good news is required to turn a treasonous malcontent into a hero...

Are you talking about the treason of violating the constitution by spying on US citizens and selling our private, business national security secrets to our enemies?

Posted: 9/20/2019 6:50:03 AM EST

[#23]

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Read the report...

You've had the shitbag private work for you before, right? The one that has a problem with everything? The one that is always sea lawyering their way out of every bit of work? That was Snowden. He got butthurt, and he was on borrowed time with his clearance, so he was about to be out of work if he got caught. That's basically the sum of it.

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I think this guy is a worthless traitor, however the curious side of me wonders what was so bad that he chose to throw away his life to expose it?

Either he is a traitorous piece of shit/retarded or he felt the government was doing a disservice to its citizens.

Question is did he hate his country and just chose to betray it due to hate, or did he really think it was worth sacrificing his life to expose what he did.

Read the report...

You've had the shitbag private work for you before, right? The one that has a problem with everything? The one that is always sea lawyering their way out of every bit of work? That was Snowden. He got butthurt, and he was on borrowed time with his clearance, so he was about to be out of work if he got caught. That's basically the sum of it.

The report.....put out by our govt? Lol

Posted: 9/20/2019 6:52:04 AM EST

[#24]

Fuck Snowden. He is just a Russian tool with good enough PR that some idiots think he is some sort of hero rather than a spy.

Posted: 9/20/2019 7:16:59 AM EST

[#25]

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Fuck Snowden. He is just a Russian tool with good enough PR that some idiots think he is some sort of hero rather than a spy.

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So he did no good exposing what he did?

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:21:23 AM EST

[#26]

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So he did no good exposing what he did?

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Fuck Snowden. He is just a Russian tool with good enough PR that some idiots think he is some sort of hero rather than a spy.

So he did no good exposing what he did?

How much “good” does it take to excuse treason?

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:23:20 AM EST

[#27]

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Are you talking about the treason of violating the constitution by spying on US citizens and selling our private, business national security secrets to our enemies?

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I do believe the argument here is, "government bad, ~~snowden~~ exposing a non elected body that was unlawfully and indiscriminately spying on every American citizen good"

Edit to add: some heros don't wear capes.

So now that we’ve established that (for some) treason is ok if you deliver some good news along with it, let’s quantify exactly how much good news is required to turn a treasonous malcontent into a hero...

Are you talking about the treason of violating the constitution by spying on US citizens and selling our private, business national security secrets to our enemies?

Government doing governmenty things isn’t treason, it’s just the nature of the beast (insert lengthy treatise expounding on the need for limited government here).

Individuals who aid adversarial governments commit treason. This is what Snowden did.

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:29:05 AM EST

[#28]

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I'd love to see an open and honest trial for this guy. It will never happen, but it would be nice to actually see the real evidence.

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Evidence that he sold shit to the Chinese to pay his way to Russia where he sold more shit to keep himself fed until he could publish his book? The Chicoms & Russians weren't interested that the NSA betrayed its citizens, btw.

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:34:54 AM EST

[#29]

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Evidence that he sold shit to the Chinese to pay his way to Russia where he sold more shit to keep himself fed until he could publish his book? The Chicoms & Russians weren't interested that the NSA betrayed its citizens, btw.

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I'd love to see an open and honest trial for this guy. It will never happen, but it would be nice to actually see the real evidence.

Evidence that he sold shit to the Chinese to pay his way to Russia where he sold more shit to keep himself fed until he could publish his book? The Chicoms & Russians weren't interested that the NSA betrayed its citizens, btw.

You believe the NSA/CIA?

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:36:37 AM EST

[#30]

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Lack of self-awareness here, Uncle Sam.

Snowden is an American hero.

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"This lawsuit will ensure that Edward Snowden receives no monetary benefits from breaching the trust placed in him."

Lack of self-awareness here, Uncle Sam.

Snowden is an American hero.

He's a POS cunt traitor who will never see a dime from his book.

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:39:29 AM EST

[#31]

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It'll be the same thing as every other thread.

Person 1: You're a piece of shit useful idiot for not saying this guy is a traitor.

Person 2: How do you know he's a traitor?

Person 1: Because he gave all kinds of intel to our enemies.

Person 2: How do you know?

Person 1: Because the government told me so.

Person 2: Is there any proof other than people with vested interests and horrible track records of truthfulness telling you this happened?

Person 1: You're a piece of shit useful idiot for not saying this guy is a traitor.

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Two distinct sides on this.... This thread is going to get good.

Time to sit back with some popcorn and watch the fireworks.

It'll be the same thing as every other thread.

Person 1: You're a piece of shit useful idiot for not saying this guy is a traitor.

Person 2: How do you know he's a traitor?

Person 1: Because he gave all kinds of intel to our enemies.

Person 2: How do you know?

Person 1: Because the government told me so.

Person 2: Is there any proof other than people with vested interests and horrible track records of truthfulness telling you this happened?

Person 1: You're a piece of shit useful idiot for not saying this guy is a traitor.

But isn't that true of EVERY spy who has ever stolen and compromised classified information?

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:39:37 AM EST

[#32]

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They don't always disappear. Depends on how highly placed they are. If you mean to suggest whistleblowers never disappear then I think your argument is specious but I can't prove that anymore than the NSA can credibly allege anything of anyone involved in this case. They destroyed the last shreds of credibility they once had.

It's unfortunate that such talent has to go to waste spying on ones own citizens.

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It's not "highly doubtful", it's not what happened.

And you might want to check with William Binney if you think whistleblowers disappear.

They don't always disappear. Depends on how highly placed they are. If you mean to suggest whistleblowers never disappear then I think your argument is specious but I can't prove that anymore than the NSA can credibly allege anything of anyone involved in this case. They destroyed the last shreds of credibility they once had.

It's unfortunate that such talent has to go to waste spying on ones own citizens.

He did no wrong. And if he did, the NSA fabricated it. And if they don't, he can't get a fair trial. And if he can, they'll just bankrupt him. And if they don't, he'll just be murdered. And if they don't, he should have never had to go through all this.

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:40:18 AM EST

[#33]

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Trump should pardon him and watch the swamp go crazy.

Then drop declassify and set fire to all the traitors

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Right after declaring an open season on Antifa via a MG amnesty.

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:43:39 AM EST

[#34]

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I think this guy is a worthless traitor, however the curious side of me wonders what was so bad that he chose to throw away his life to expose it?

Either he is a traitorous piece of shit/retarded or he felt the government was doing a disservice to its citizens.

Question is did he hate his country and just chose to betray it due to hate, or did he really think it was worth sacrificing his life to expose what he did.

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Both, plus promises of living well once he defected.

Posted: 9/20/2019 8:48:48 AM EST

[#35]

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I think this guy is a worthless traitor, however the curious side of me wonders what was so bad that he chose to throw away his life to expose it?

Either he is a traitorous piece of shit/retarded or he felt the government was doing a disservice to its citizens.

Question is did he hate his country and just chose to betray it due to hate, or did he really think it was worth sacrificing his life to expose what he did.

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Imagine if this was actually an FSB operation....

You get a dweeb who resets passwords for a living to steal millions of classified documents and military plans. He delivers them to you.

You create an Information Operations campaign that convinces American Useful Idiots to cry from the mountaintops that "Snowden is a HERO! The NSA needs to be abolished!"

THAT FSB officer deserves a medal.

Posted: 9/20/2019 2:46:17 PM EST

[#36]

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The report.....put out by our govt? Lol

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I think this guy is a worthless traitor, however the curious side of me wonders what was so bad that he chose to throw away his life to expose it?

Either he is a traitorous piece of shit/retarded or he felt the government was doing a disservice to its citizens.

Question is did he hate his country and just chose to betray it due to hate, or did he really think it was worth sacrificing his life to expose what he did.

Read the report...

You've had the shitbag private work for you before, right? The one that has a problem with everything? The one that is always sea lawyering their way out of every bit of work? That was Snowden. He got butthurt, and he was on borrowed time with his clearance, so he was about to be out of work if he got caught. That's basically the sum of it.

The report.....put out by our govt? Lol

Did you read it? It's pretty clear. And it wasn't written for you. It was classified at just about the highest level of classification a document can be, with pretty much all the caveats that matter, when it was written. You can see that clearly when you look at it, they're still on the document, just lined through by the declassifying authority.

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:16:53 PM EST

[#37]

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No he isn’t. He is a criminal.

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Snowden is a hero.

No he isn’t. He is a criminal.

His actions accomplished nothing, there's more surveillance than ever. He did get people killed, he did harm us strategically, and he did massively erode faith in our system of government (which is only a "good" thing if it results in corrective actions , and is otherwise a very very bad thing, objectively)

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:19:06 PM EST

[#38]

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No. Chance he will get a fair anything. He exposed the man, and they will make him pay for it.

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This sentiment right is why no jury would ever convict him at this point.

So you're right about a fair trial being impossible.

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:21:01 PM EST

[#39]

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I see what you’re saying.

But how do we know that he specifically sold intelligence? For money? Or simply by the fact that he is getting safe harbor in one of those countries?

And how do we know it was damaging to our country? Is there evidence of that which isn’t from a gov press briefing if you know what I mean. I really have not dived into specifics of all what he did reveal other than the NSA spying program.

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It’s two completely separate issues.

What the cheerleaders want you to believe is that he was a hero, driven by conscience to do the right thing.

What he was, was a disgruntled fuckup who wanted to do as much damage to his country as he could. What he did do, in fact, was sell damaging US intelligence to Russia and China, some amount of which showed that there were some bad things done by the government (if you were naive enough to think they would never do such things beforehand, it’s a “you” problem). Because this told some malcontents what they wanted to hear, it’s a good thing. To thinking folks, it was treason, with a bitter dose of truth on top. So the question remains: what percentage of “feel good” information makes treason ok? Apparently that threshold is very low for some folks. Conveniently obfuscating and creatively editing the whole treason part makes them feel better about themselves.

I see what you’re saying.

But how do we know that he specifically sold intelligence? For money? Or simply by the fact that he is getting safe harbor in one of those countries?

And how do we know it was damaging to our country? Is there evidence of that which isn’t from a gov press briefing if you know what I mean. I really have not dived into specifics of all what he did reveal other than the NSA spying program.

You think the Chicoms ferried a defecting American to Russia with a bunch of classified data, and didn't demand a toll for their cooperation?

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:33:33 PM EST

[#40]

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Wild, ignorant charge. He chose treason. Whistleblowers don't run to Russia.

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No. Chance he will get a fair anything. He exposed the man, and they will make him pay for it.

Wild, ignorant charge. He chose treason. Whistleblowers don't run to Russia.

I will say that exposing oneself to the risk of legal consequences, is what differentiates a whistleblower from leaker/spy. That's why it's considered noble, not because of their "intentions."
Intentions are for liberals. Whistleblowing is basically like self-defense, where you have to admit the act in court to be cleared; you can't flee the nation after ending the thug who broke into your house, and expect your self defense claim to be honored absent a full-blown trial.

Snowden didn't even try to go through proper channels, or even semi-controlled channels (which Manning sort of did, since the guy he leaked to censored the most sensitive data). He went straight to our enemies' with God knows what, since they never divulged it either, and then publicly embarrassed* the US by releasing documents of outrageous info gathering (some apparently fabricated)

*Right or wrong, one of the main reasons for classifying data is to protect our nation's image from damage. Whether you think it is right for a nation to conceal embarrassing info (be it criminal or comical) is a different question from whether Snowden broke very clear rules that we've agreed to enforce.

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:43:36 PM EST

[#41]

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For there to be treason, there would need to be damage to the country. "The country", meaning American citizens and things that are in their interests. I'm not convinced he damaged "his country" in any way whatsoever. Those saying he did have zero credibility. ZERO.

If he damaged anything at all he damaged "his government", which considering the contempt it holds for its citizens I cannot be arsed to give a fuck about.

But...but...HE BROKE THE LAW.

Again, I don't care. You break the law if you have an AR-15 with a 12" barrel without paying the king's tax. Who is the victim of this "crime"? Who's the victim of Snowden's? Again, it's the government, and the misdeeds he revealed justify breaking his oath. What is an oath to someone/something that constantly lies and violates the trust of the people it supposedly serves really worth anyway?

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Did the leaks cause you to lose faith in the US government? There's your damage. Seriously, that's why he disclosed that info, to turn you against your nation. "But they deserve it!" Yeah, but he still chose to reveal information to you that would cause anger toward the US government.

Another example; the big Chinese hack of everyone's SF86 & "advantageous information" dossier. That dossier contains any info that could be used to compromise a clearance holder, however they get it. The main worry is the Chicoms using it for blackmail, but they could just as easily dump all the data, revealing affairs, drugs, gambling, abortions, porn habits, embarrassing purchases, prostitution, and who knows what else, letting the chips fall chaotically (but crippling much of our MIC a d government for a good while). That's basically what Snowden did, saying "it's for your own good, lol!"

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:48:45 PM EST

[#42]

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Only a VERY small percentage of your government is elected. Seems that, as usual, you are the one who needs the civic lesson.

Should we post the percentage of the government that is elected? Your arguments are even dumber than the usual statist garbage I read regularly here.

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Your understanding of Civics is non existent.

"the government" is elected here. It's not an oligarchy. Snowden evidently prefers such a thing, as that's where he defected to -- but that's not what we have. Doing harm to "the government" is by definition doing harm to this country and its interests, as this country put the government in place.

There is no Constitutional amendment that enshrines the right to leak national security secrets and run away to Russia, so your 12" barrel comment is absurd.

Only a VERY small percentage of your government is elected. Seems that, as usual, you are the one who needs the civic lesson.

Should we post the percentage of the government that is elected? Your arguments are even dumber than the usual statist garbage I read regularly here.

This seditious mindset (call it what it is) is quite common now, and will undoubtedly make for interesting responses should we endure another major terrorist attack or assassination. You're all but advocating for our government to be overthrown, while claim Snowden committed no treason. The Founders were proudly treasonous.

"If this be treason, make the most of it."

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:50:46 PM EST

[#43]

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Imagine if this was actually an FSB operation....

You get a dweeb who resets passwords for a living to steal millions of classified documents and military plans. He delivers them to you.

You create an Information Operations campaign that convinces American Useful Idiots to cry from the mountaintops that "Snowden is a HERO! The NSA needs to be abolished!"

THAT FSB officer deserves a medal.

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The NSA doing what it was/is doing opened the door for them to get their clock cleaned whenever they got caught. Whomever exposed these issues deserves a raise and a medal. To be clear I wouldnt care if it was a foreign OP from the get go. Our government was well off the reservation on this one no matter how much paper congress and the courts try to throw over it.

I am more concerned with our elected government and appointed alphabet agencies war on Liberty than I am with the Russians. The government's own actions forfeits any right to be credible IMO.

Posted: 9/20/2019 3:54:46 PM EST

[#44]

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Did the leaks cause you to lose faith in the US government? There's your damage. Seriously, that's why he disclosed that info, to turn you against your nation. "But they deserve it!" Yeah, but he still chose to reveal information to you that would cause anger toward the US government.

Another example; the big Chinese hack of everyone's SF86 & "advantageous information" dossier. That dossier contains any info that could be used to compromise a clearance holder, however they get it. The main worry is the Chicoms using it for blackmail, but they could just as easily dump all the data, revealing affairs, drugs, gambling, abortions, porn habits, embarrassing purchases, prostitution, and who knows what else, letting the chips fall chaotically (but crippling much of our MIC a d government for a good while). That's basically what Snowden did, saying "it's for your own good, lol!"

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And the damage was committed by the government, not the person or foreign intel agency that exposed it. Once they did it, it was only a matter of time until someone exposed it, it is just too juicy for it not to be.

Posted: 9/20/2019 4:04:58 PM EST

[#45]

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The report.....put out by our govt? Lol

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I think this guy is a worthless traitor, however the curious side of me wonders what was so bad that he chose to throw away his life to expose it?

Either he is a traitorous piece of shit/retarded or he felt the government was doing a disservice to its citizens.

Question is did he hate his country and just chose to betray it due to hate, or did he really think it was worth sacrificing his life to expose what he did.

Read the report...

You've had the shitbag private work for you before, right? The one that has a problem with everything? The one that is always sea lawyering their way out of every bit of work? That was Snowden. He got butthurt, and he was on borrowed time with his clearance, so he was about to be out of work if he got caught. That's basically the sum of it.

The report.....put out by our govt? Lol

Vs the info... released by the Russians/Chicoms?

Posted: 9/20/2019 4:07:17 PM EST

[#46]

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The NSA doing what it was/is doing opened the door for them to get their clock cleaned whenever they got caught. Whomever exposed these issues deserves a raise and a medal. To be clear I wouldnt care if it was a foreign OP from the get go. Our government was well off the reservation on this one no matter how much paper congress and the courts try to throw over it.

I am more concerned with our elected government and appointed alphabet agencies war on Liberty than I am with the Russians. The government's own actions forfeits any right to be credible IMO.

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Imagine if this was actually an FSB operation....

You get a dweeb who resets passwords for a living to steal millions of classified documents and military plans. He delivers them to you.

You create an Information Operations campaign that convinces American Useful Idiots to cry from the mountaintops that "Snowden is a HERO! The NSA needs to be abolished!"

THAT FSB officer deserves a medal.

The NSA doing what it was/is doing opened the door for them to get their clock cleaned whenever they got caught. Whomever exposed these issues deserves a raise and a medal. To be clear I wouldnt care if it was a foreign OP from the get go. Our government was well off the reservation on this one no matter how much paper congress and the courts try to throw over it.

I am more concerned with our elected government and appointed alphabet agencies war on Liberty than I am with the Russians. The government's own actions forfeits any right to be credible IMO.

You have taken on the role of one of the players in my story of the FSB agent!

Bravo!

Posted: 9/20/2019 4:08:22 PM EST

[#47]

He needs to have an accident.

Posted: 9/20/2019 4:09:16 PM EST

[#48]

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So he did no good exposing what he did?

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Fuck Snowden. He is just a Russian tool with good enough PR that some idiots think he is some sort of hero rather than a spy.

So he did no good exposing what he did?

Okay, shoot; tell us all the wrongs he righted through his actions. Or did he just get a lot of Americans pissed at their own government as he fled to it's enemies with secrets in tow?

You have to actually be loyal to the US (a patriot, one might say) to think what he did was wrong. Personally, it looks to me like did the Ruskies a lot of simultaneous favors, and was rewarded with a dacha.

Posted: 9/20/2019 4:10:42 PM EST

[#49]

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You believe the NSA/CIA?

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I'd love to see an open and honest trial for this guy. It will never happen, but it would be nice to actually see the real evidence.

Evidence that he sold shit to the Chinese to pay his way to Russia where he sold more shit to keep himself fed until he could publish his book? The Chicoms & Russians weren't interested that the NSA betrayed its citizens, btw.

You believe the NSA/CIA?

You kind of have to if you believe espionage against the US is a thing, or wrong.

Talk about playing chess with pidgeons...