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Posted: 6/22/2022 9:59:45 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: CA has continually rejected desalinization plants. There was a great article (can't find it at the moment) that discussed CA's overall energy/water needs and what direction made the most sense. Very detailed included analysis of energy usage to what sector, etc. More or less, they aren't doing the right things for a multitude of stupid reasons. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Restock it with Desalinated water? It's really really stupid that a hugely populated area that is also pretty dry, doesn't have more desalination plants. CA has continually rejected desalinization plants. There was a great article (can't find it at the moment) that discussed CA's overall energy/water needs and what direction made the most sense. Very detailed included analysis of energy usage to what sector, etc. More or less, they aren't doing the right things for a multitude of stupid reasons. Desalination plants are nothing new to California This plant provides San Diego with 7% of their water This plant in Carlsbad took 14 years to permit  Construction The plant construction started in December 2012, and was originally scheduled to be completed in 2016.[6][7] However, due to the continuing drought in California, plant completion was advanced to late 2015.  The plant began regular operations in December 2015.[9] It was named after former Carlsbad mayor, Claude "Bud" Lewis, who held the position for almost a quarter of a century.[10] Lewis died in 2014 and was a supporter of construction of the desalination plant.[11] After completion, it underwent six months of testing before being put online.[12]The fresh water output from the plant is sent by a 10 mi (16 km) long, 4.5 ft (1.4 m) diameter pipeline, utilizing six pumps, to connect to the SDCWA distribution system in San Marcos.[13] Pipeline construction began in 2013,[14] and was completed June 28, 2015.[15] Poseidon Water built the plant.[16] The main engineering companies on this project were GHD Group and U.S.-based Butier Engineering Inc.[17][18][19] IDE Americas Inc., a subsidiary of Israel-based IDE Technologies, designed the plant. IDE Technologies is jointly owned by Delek Group and Israel Chemicals.[20][21] Simon Wong Engineering was subcontracted to provide the design and structural engineering services.[22] J.F. Shea Company and Kiewit Corporation constructed the plant.[23] The plant took nearly 14 years to permit, design, and build.[4] The total project cost was expected to reach near $1 billion; initial cost estimates were a quarter-billion in 2004, to six hundred ninety million in 2010.[24] The cost of construction was funded by bond sales.[6] In late-2012, Fitch Ratings gave the bonds the lowest investment grade rating.[25] Upon completion, it became the largest desalination plant in the Western Hemisphere Claude "Bud" Lewis Carlsbad Desalination Plant |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 4:01:35 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Desalination plants are nothing new to California This plant provides San Diego with 7% of their water This plant in Carlsbad took 14 years to permit Construction The plant construction started in December 2012, and was originally scheduled to be completed in 2016.[6][7] However, due to the continuing drought in California, plant completion was advanced to late 2015. The plant began regular operations in December 2015.[9] It was named after former Carlsbad mayor, Claude "Bud" Lewis, who held the position for almost a quarter of a century.[10] Lewis died in 2014 and was a supporter of construction of the desalination plant.[11] After completion, it underwent six months of testing before being put online.[12]The fresh water output from the plant is sent by a 10 mi (16 km) long, 4.5 ft (1.4 m) diameter pipeline, utilizing six pumps, to connect to the SDCWA distribution system in San Marcos.[13] Pipeline construction began in 2013,[14] and was completed June 28, 2015.[15] Poseidon Water built the plant.[16] The main engineering companies on this project were GHD Group and U.S.-based Butier Engineering Inc.[17][18][19] IDE Americas Inc., a subsidiary of Israel-based IDE Technologies, designed the plant. IDE Technologies is jointly owned by Delek Group and Israel Chemicals.[20][21] Simon Wong Engineering was subcontracted to provide the design and structural engineering services.[22] J.F. Shea Company and Kiewit Corporation constructed the plant.[23] The plant took nearly 14 years to permit, design, and build.[4] The total project cost was expected to reach near $1 billion; initial cost estimates were a quarter-billion in 2004, to six hundred ninety million in 2010.[24] The cost of construction was funded by bond sales.[6] In late-2012, Fitch Ratings gave the bonds the lowest investment grade rating.[25] Upon completion, it became the largest desalination plant in the Western Hemisphere Claude "Bud" Lewis Carlsbad Desalination Plant 14 years…to build a desalination plant… We built the A-bomb in under 4 years and the Apollo mission in Less then 9 and that involved putting a man in outer buttfucking space! Honestly just tell the Army Corps of Engineers just start building nuclear power desalination plants across the West Coast and any of the governors give him any shit just arrest them on the spot enough of this shit. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 7:25:07 PM EDT
[#3]
So, yesterday, Lake Mead apparently hit its dead pool level, which means no water for turbines.
The dam generates about 4 billion kilowatt-hours of electricity each year for use in the states of Nevada, Arizona, and California. It has been said that about 36% of all power used in Las Vegas is generated by the Hoover dam. When it was constructed in the mid-30s, the Hoover Dam was said to be the largest hydroelectric power plant in the world and it remains one of the largest yet today. The dam contains 17 hydroelectric turbines that spin electric generators as water flows through them as it is released through the dam to continue from Lake Mead down the Colorado River. Nevada uses nearly 25% of this electricity while Arizona uses almost 20% with southern California using much of the rest. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 7:32:52 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, yesterday, Lake Mead apparently hit its dead pool level, which means no water for turbines.[/i] click bait bullshit. dead pool is 895, inactive pool is 1050 there is a difference. Current is about 1040. Mohave will start dropping next. When Havasu makes the news then Shit has officially hit the fan. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 7:44:17 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: click bait bullshit. dead pool is 895, inactive pool is 1050 there is a difference. Current is about 1040. Mohave will start dropping next. When Havasu makes the news then Shit has officially hit the fan. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So, yesterday, Lake Mead apparently hit its dead pool level, which means no water for turbines.[/i] click bait bullshit. dead pool is 895, inactive pool is 1050 there is a difference. Current is about 1040. Mohave will start dropping next. When Havasu makes the news then Shit has officially hit the fan. To be fair, I haven't been tracking the difference between inactive/dead levels. *I* said dead; the article said inactive. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 7:51:09 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To be fair, I haven't been tracking the difference between inactive/dead levels. *I* said dead; the article said inactive. Ok, sorry to be snappy, but the out of BS is really annoying. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 7:57:09 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok, sorry to be snappy, but the out of BS is really annoying. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: To be fair, I haven't been tracking the difference between inactive/dead levels. *I* said dead; the article said inactive. Ok, sorry to be snappy, but the out of BS is really annoying. No worries. I just needed to know there was a real difference between the two terms, and that's not unwelcome. I *am* curious about what's coming, policywise, across all the affected states, if the Hoover Dam turbines have to start spooling down. And that seems possible (to my distant eyes). The upstream snowpack isn't great. Next year, who knows. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 7:57:32 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How long will 150' last at current rate of drop?? I think worst case is still several years away if there's no improvement in precipitation and there's some big curtailment steps in there. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:01:35 PM EDT
[#9]
The government predicts over the next 2 years the lake will drop another 30 ft. With the way things are going it might drop even much lower.
 Lake Mead Is Drying Up Before Our Eyes! |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:07:11 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, yesterday, Lake Mead apparently hit its dead pool level, which means no water for turbines. The dam generates about 4 billion kilowatt-hours of electricity each year for use in the states of Nevada, Arizona, and California. It has been said that about 36% of all power used in Las Vegas is generated by the Hoover dam. When it was constructed in the mid-30s, the Hoover Dam was said to be the largest hydroelectric power plant in the world and it remains one of the largest yet today. The dam contains 17 hydroelectric turbines that spin electric generators as water flows through them as it is released through the dam to continue from Lake Mead down the Colorado River. Nevada uses nearly 25% of this electricity while Arizona uses almost 20% with southern California using much of the rest. Well, unless something changed in allocation and credits, CA was getting 95% of the power from the dam. There is a reason why PG&E have power lines and workers in Nevada in order to maintain their lines going to the dam. Lines that were added and resized over the past 20 years. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:11:16 PM EDT
[#11]
I believe the new number to watch is 950.
Under its original design, the dam would no longer be able to generate power once the water level fell below 1,050 feet (320 m), which might have occurred in 2017 had water restrictions not been enforced. To lower the minimum power pool elevation from 1,050 to 950 feet (320 to 290 m), five wide-head turbines, designed to work efficiently with less flow, were installed. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:22:23 PM EDT
[#12]
Don't live in the desert. Don't build golf courses in the desert.
I for one have no fucks to give. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:33:58 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No worries. I just needed to know there was a real difference between the two terms, and that's not unwelcome. I *am* curious about what's coming, policywise, across all the affected states, if the Hoover Dam turbines have to start spooling down. And that seems possible (to my distant eyes). The upstream snowpack isn't great. Next year, who knows. Quote HistoryQuoted: No worries. I just needed to know there was a real difference between the two terms, and that's not unwelcome. I *am* curious about what's coming, policywise, across all the affected states, if the Hoover Dam turbines have to start spooling down. And that seems possible (to my distant eyes). The upstream snowpack isn't great. Next year, who knows. Policywise there is a Drought Contingency Plan (DCP) that has the lower basin states each taking temporary cuts to their allocation based on the elevations of Lake Mead. We're already into the first tier, and depending on what they do with Powell releases we may or may not see the second tier invoked next year. From the draft agreement Arizona a. Lake Mead elevation is projected to be between 1,045 and 1,090 feet on January 1, Arizona shall make DCP Contributions in the total amount of 192,000 acre-feet. b. Lake Mead elevation is projected to be at or below 1,045 feet on January 1, Arizona shall make DCP Contributions in the total mount of 240,000 acre-feet Nevada a. Lake Mead January 1 elevation projected to be between 1,045 feet and 1,090 feet Nevada shall make annual DCP Contributions in the total amount of 8,000 acre-feet. b. Lake Mead January 1 elevation projected to be at or below 1,045 feet Nevada shall make annual DCP Contributions in the total amount of 10,000 acre-feet. California a. Lake Mead January 1 elevation projected to be between 1,040 and 1,045 feet California shall make annual DCP Contributions in the total amount of 200,000 acre-feet. b. Lake Mead January 1 elevation projected to be between 1,035 feet and 1,040 feet California shall make annual DCP Contributions in the total amount of 250,000 acre-feet. c. Lake Mead January 1 elevation projected to be between 1,030 feet and 1,035 feet California shall make annual DCP Contributions in the total amount of 300,000 acre-feet. d. Lake Mead January 1 elevation projected to be at or below 1,030 feet California shall make annual DCP Contributions in the total amount of 350,000 acre-feet. It's worth noting that Nevada's whole allocation is only 300,000 acre-feet. From a Nevada standpoint a significant amount of water gets left in the system. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:37:05 PM EDT
[#14]
Greetings from Lake Powell last month. Not much coming down the Colorado these days..
 Attached File |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:43:09 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I believe the new number to watch is 950. Under its original design, the dam would no longer be able to generate power once the water level fell below 1,050 feet (320 m), which might have occurred in 2017 had water restrictions not been enforced. To lower the minimum power pool elevation from 1,050 to 950 feet (320 to 290 m), five wide-head turbines, designed to work efficiently with less flow, were installed. As the dam loses power head some interesting operational changes can occur, like putting the water through fewer turbines which may slow the rate of decline in Lake Mead which in turn is used to hold off on water curtailment thresholds, which are somewhat in place to try to slow that very decline. The states, not wanting to have to do with less water will put pressure on BOR to slow the releases to maintain elevation. Part of the reason that Mead is dropping so rapidly right now is that releases from Powell were held off to try to maintain power head a little longer. They have until January to hold off on Lake Mead being under 1,045 on Jan 1 which causes the next tier of water curtailment. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:51:19 PM EDT
[#16]
The 950 elevation is the interesting one. That's the dead pool elevation where no water goes through the Hoover Dam.
Which means no water to Arizona, and no water to California, and 3 million acre-feet storage where Las Vegas still has access, that's 10 years of Nevada's allocation in storage in a condition where there is zero flow on the Colorado, a condition that has no historical precedent, not even through tree ring studies is there evidence that the river has stopped completely. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:54:46 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don't live in the desert. Don't build golf courses in the desert. I for one have no fucks to give. Or ability to read. Issue is farming in the desert in mainly CA. Food that feeds the rest of the country and using farming techniques which are not designed for the desert. Shoot, even Israel grows bananas in a similar climate. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 8:56:18 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Policywise there is a Drought Contingency Plan (DCP) that has the lower basin states each taking temporary cuts to their allocation based on the elevations of Lake Mead. We're already into the first tier, and depending on what they do with Powell releases we may or may not see the second tier invoked next year. From the draft agreement It's worth noting that Nevada's whole allocation is only 300,000 acre-feet. From a Nevada standpoint a significant amount of water gets left in the system. Considering I get 4.4 acre feet for my property, it really puts it into perspective how little that water amount is in the grand scheme with only 2% going to Nevada. |
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Posted: 6/24/2022 4:56:42 PM EDT
[#19]
 Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 6/24/2022 5:06:38 PM EDT
[#20]
Cut off all water to California would be a big start to solving Lake Mead.
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Posted: 6/24/2022 5:07:49 PM EDT
[#21]
That 30 in a year feet to me sounds like BS. From what I have been following it seems to be dropping feet per day right now.
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Posted: 6/24/2022 5:11:09 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That 30 in a year feet to me sounds like BS. From what I have been following it seems to be dropping feet per day right now. Imagine the idealized cross section as an upside down triangle. The lower it goes, the less volume, and if use is not restricted, the faster it empties. |
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Posted: 6/24/2022 5:39:56 PM EDT
[#23]
 Drying up! Impact of the Lake Mead drought on Callville Bay, Nevada 2022 Update |
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Posted: 6/24/2022 8:37:28 PM EDT
[#24]
'There was nothing I could do,' Man's boat gets stuck at Lake Mead after water levels drop
 'There was nothing I could do,' Man's boat gets stuck at Lake Mead after water levels drop |
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Posted: 6/24/2022 9:03:52 PM EDT
[#25]
Mouth of the Colorado River into Lake Mead Helicopter Tour May 12 2022
 Mouth of the Colorado River into Lake Mead Helicopter Tour May 12 2022 |
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Posted: 6/24/2022 11:45:58 PM EDT
[#26]
YouTubers recover stuck houseboat at Lake Mead
 YouTubers recover stuck houseboat at Lake Mead |
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Posted: 6/25/2022 6:36:28 PM EDT
[#27]
 Lake Mead Is Dropping FAST- Emergency Houseboat Recovery Before It's Too Late |
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Posted: 6/25/2022 6:44:56 PM EDT
[#28]
In all those predictions was there any mention of precipitation in the next years ?
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Posted: 6/25/2022 6:55:47 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That 30 in a year feet to me sounds like BS. From what I have been following it seems to be dropping feet per day right now. https://mead.uslakes.info/Level/ |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 11:46:53 AM EDT
[#30]
 Lake Mead Marinas Are In Serious Trouble | Drought Update |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 12:39:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The government predicts over the next 2 years the lake will drop another 30 ft. With the way things are going it might drop even much lower.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CV4XEPFTgQits too small to become a space battleship...Gamelon is safe for now |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 12:43:48 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don't live in the desert. Don't build golf courses in the desert. I for one have no fucks to give. How do you feel about people living in an area that is consistently ravaged by hurricanes? |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 12:46:39 PM EDT
[#33]
Certainly ain't gonna run out of a life source, ie water.
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Posted: 6/27/2022 12:59:00 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How do you feel about people living in an area that is consistently ravaged by hurricanes? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Don't live in the desert. Don't build golf courses in the desert. I for one have no fucks to give. How do you feel about people living in an area that is consistently ravaged by hurricanes? Phoenix, AZ is the only logical place to live. No earthquakes, hurricanes, tornadoes, or catastrophic floods. Just constant drought. And occasional thunderstorms. Sometimes hail. |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 1:06:27 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryStarted watching Sin City Outdoors because of this thread (or one of the other Lake Mead threads?). Cool they were able to help this dude out. |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 2:15:40 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mouth of the Colorado River into Lake Mead Helicopter Tour May 12 2022 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfTk0ml_T4cI can't tell. Is that dry, brown riverbed or is the river just flowing muddy water into the lake? |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 2:18:06 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Phoenix, AZ is the only logical place to live. No earthquakes, hurricanes, tornadoes, or catastrophic floods. Just constant drought. And occasional thunderstorms. Sometimes hail. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Don't live in the desert. Don't build golf courses in the desert. I for one have no fucks to give. How do you feel about people living in an area that is consistently ravaged by hurricanes? Phoenix, AZ is the only logical place to live. No earthquakes, hurricanes, tornadoes, or catastrophic floods. Just constant drought. And occasional thunderstorms. Sometimes hail. Sounds easier to deal with than SoCal. |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 2:20:55 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Phoenix, AZ is the only logical place to live. No earthquakes, hurricanes, tornadoes, or catastrophic floods. Just constant drought. And occasional thunderstorms. Sometimes hail. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Don't live in the desert. Don't build golf courses in the desert. I for one have no fucks to give. How do you feel about people living in an area that is consistently ravaged by hurricanes? Phoenix, AZ is the only logical place to live. No earthquakes, hurricanes, tornadoes, or catastrophic floods. Just constant drought. And occasional thunderstorms. Sometimes hail. Summer is our only natural disaster. |
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Posted: 6/27/2022 11:20:00 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Summer is our only natural disaster. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Don't live in the desert. Don't build golf courses in the desert. I for one have no fucks to give. How do you feel about people living in an area that is consistently ravaged by hurricanes? Phoenix, AZ is the only logical place to live. No earthquakes, hurricanes, tornadoes, or catastrophic floods. Just constant drought. And occasional thunderstorms. Sometimes hail. Summer is our only natural disaster. |
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Posted: 6/28/2022 11:57:37 AM EDT
[#40]
 We Found This Truck At The Bottom Of Lake Powell |
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Posted: 6/28/2022 12:13:51 PM EDT
[#41]
Like others have said, the real problem here is CA. When the deal was struck, Vegas was about 1/80th the size it is now. 1922!
It was never changed because there was no real need. Personally, having lived in Vegas for a few years, when the casinos want something, they generally get it. Plus, possession is still 90% of the law. This is mostly just another doomer news story that in reality has a very obvious correct solution. Plus, fuck CA. |
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Posted: 6/28/2022 12:17:02 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Like others have said, the real problem here is CA. When the deal was struck, Vegas was about 1/80th the size it is now. 1922! It was never changed because there was no real need. Personally, having lived in Vegas for a few years, when the casinos want something, they generally get it. Plus, possession is still 90% of the law. This is mostly just another doomer news story that in reality has a very obvious correct solution. Plus, fuck CA. And Nevada still doesn't fully use its allotment, so you can't leave that out either. |
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Posted: 6/28/2022 12:17:32 PM EDT
[#43]
Arizona is building new communities every day here. There are at least 20 new subdivisions around me with about 500+ new homes going in, never mind that Verrado in Buckeye AZ, has 14000 homes in it so far and they are not done building.
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Posted: 6/28/2022 12:19:01 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I can't tell. Is that dry, brown riverbed or is the river just flowing muddy water into the lake? Colorado is that nice color on the lower end normally. Any time there is a flow change, it turns brown pretty quick. |
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Posted: 6/28/2022 10:21:11 PM EDT
[#45]
 Why California is Running Out of Water |
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Posted: 6/29/2022 5:30:29 PM EDT
[#46]
 Water: Last Week Tonight with John Oliver (HBO) |
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Posted: 6/30/2022 9:31:54 PM EDT
[#47]
Lake Mead Marina Update. Hoover Dam Closed
 Lake Mead Marina Update.. Hoover Dam Closed Lake Mead Marina Report the Latest update on Current Moves being made and what to expect in next few Weeks. And Homeland Security Check Point turnaround declaring Hoover Dam Closed till further Notice |
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Posted: 6/30/2022 9:44:11 PM EDT
[#48]
Lake mead 60 day deadline by dept of Reclamation to restore water levels
 Lake mead 60 day deadline by dept of Reclamation to restore water levels The Dept of reclamation has issued an august deadline to come up with a conservation Solution between the 7 Upper and lower basin states or the Fed Government Threatens to step in. |
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Posted: 6/30/2022 9:52:41 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lake mead 60 day deadline by dept of Reclamation to restore water levels https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLMVXM-_7RwThe Dept of reclamation has issued an august deadline to come up with a conservation Solution between the 7 Upper and lower basin states or the Fed Government Threatens to step in. |
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Posted: 6/30/2022 11:56:39 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Arizona is building new communities every day here. There are at least 20 new subdivisions around me with about 500+ new homes going in, never mind that Verrado in Buckeye AZ, has 14000 homes in it so far and they are not done building. All Californians probably buying them. |
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