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Link Posted: 12/29/2019 11:23:46 AM EDT
[#1]
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Quoted:
The Ruger family isn't even part of the company anymore and it is publicly traded. Everyone running.Ruger today isn't connected to Bill Ruger. This is like blaming the current owners of S&W for the Clinton agreement the previous owners agreed too.
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Which still happens around here, on the reg  People just need to justify their prejudices.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 11:27:00 AM EDT
[#2]
Waiting for stats on the gun, weight, capacity, price, reliability.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 11:38:12 AM EDT
[#3]
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Quoted:

@Redarts

THANKS for that.  That is the single best and most sensible assessment of the cartridge for reloading I've read.

Makes total sense.  Thanks!
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@EVR

To further illustrate the beating the brass takes, I grabbed some from storage.

On the left is an FNss198 I think. Whatever the standard 40gr vmax load is.

Second is once fired of the same. No case prep has been done.

On the right is the second reload of the same type of brass. I don't recall what exactly the load would have been for this batch of brass but it would have been with a 40gr nosler with true blue and it certainly wasn't a super hot rod load.



This was from a PS90. As I stated a couple of times, the 5-7 pistol is considerably less abusive.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 11:41:17 AM EDT
[#4]
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Quoted:
Hmmmm...a sub-$500 5.7?

I'd be game!
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This.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 11:47:54 AM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
A very fast perusal of the interwebs says this cartridge is a bear to handload...
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I used to handload this cartridge, in fact it was the first cartridge that I handloaded.  It was not really that difficult to handload them, once I got the case cleaning down.  Can’t tumble the casings, they have a protective coating over the brass.  So instead I used Simple Green to wash them.  Worked pretty well.  Powder was Ramshot True Blue.  To be completely honest, I have had more issues handloading .223 Remington than I ever did with 5.7mm.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:03:45 PM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:
The only thing that could make the FiveseveN pistol less appealing is if it was made by Ruger
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I see this silliness all over the gun world. "I won't buy it unless it has no safety!!!" WTF is it with this derpiness?

It IS possible to choose to ignore the safety if that's how you wanna rock.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:04:20 PM EDT
[#7]
Soon...Tula steel case FTW!

Fluted chamber?
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:15:13 PM EDT
[#8]
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Quoted:

Ruger makes good bolt rifles, 22 rifles and pistols, and revolvers. Semi-auto pistols in any caliber other than 22LR are not their forte
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What? The LCP and LC9 are some of the best selling pocket pistols on the market.

Ruger has their shit together.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:17:14 PM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:
I would buy one.
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Just spotted the thread, reading on hoping this is going to be real.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:18:12 PM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:
Well that sucks.
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Quoted:
Make it Optic ready and with a threaded barrel I can use my SiCo Sparrow on and I would buy in a heartbeat.
That describes Kel Tecs PMR 30.
Except even if you ignore the caliber, the PMR30 specifically says not to use it w/ a suppressor unless I've missed something.
Well that sucks.
That is the reason I don't have a PMR-30.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:25:00 PM EDT
[#11]
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Quoted:
Out of a FN 4.8" pistol barrel: MV of approximately 1560 fps and ME of 216 ft. lbs. for the 5.7x28mm 40 grain

22 WMR out of a 6.5" barrel: Fired from a 6.5" pistol barrel the 40 grain loads register 1480 fps MV and 195 ft. lbs.

I couldn't find data for an equivalent barrel length
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Quoted:
Quoted:
.22 Mag performance at three times the price no thank you.
Out of a FN 4.8" pistol barrel: MV of approximately 1560 fps and ME of 216 ft. lbs. for the 5.7x28mm 40 grain

22 WMR out of a 6.5" barrel: Fired from a 6.5" pistol barrel the 40 grain loads register 1480 fps MV and 195 ft. lbs.

I couldn't find data for an equivalent barrel length
Ballistics by the inch
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:25:55 PM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:
What? The LCP and LC9 are some of the best selling pocket pistols on the market.

Ruger has their shit together.
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Quoted:
Quoted:

Ruger makes good bolt rifles, 22 rifles and pistols, and revolvers. Semi-auto pistols in any caliber other than 22LR are not their forte
What? The LCP and LC9 are some of the best selling pocket pistols on the market.

Ruger has their shit together.
I will admit that after Ruger fixed my LCP 2 (which they did quickly), it has slowly become one of my favorites because it’s ease of use and it’s convenient to carry
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:27:06 PM EDT
[#13]
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Quoted:  @EVR

To further illustrate the beating the brass takes, I grabbed some from storage.

On the left is an FNss198 I think. Whatever the standard 40gr vmax load is.

Second is once fired of the same. No case prep has been done.

On the right is the second reload of the same type of brass. I don't recall what exactly the load would have been for this batch of brass but it would have been with a 40gr nosler with true blue and it certainly wasn't a super hot rod load.

https://i.imgur.com/mbKZIND.jpg

This was from a PS90. As I stated a couple of times, the 5-7 pistol is considerably less abusive.
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The P90/PS90 & AR57 are straight blowback, and it's unsurprising the necks blow forward.  The FN 57 is delayed blowback - I would assume the Ruger would be short-recoil operated, both being easier on brass.

The polymer coating  on the 5.7x28mm case is almost certainly for extraction from the P90 chamber, given that 5.7x28mm is likely the highest pressure round ever successfully run in a straight blowback action.  The hottest Elite loads are specifically not for use in the P90 or PS90 for that reason.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:31:54 PM EDT
[#14]
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Quoted:

Yes, I'm well aware asshole Bill is dead. But *I* refuse to give Ruger ANY of my hard earned money. He sold gunowners out in order to appease the gun grabbers & he also REFUSED to sell Mini mags to civilians. He was a first class ASSHOLE to gun owners.

Nor has a single person in the current management staff apologized nor even bothered to say what he did was wrong. Not one.
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You guys act like hurt lovers.

It was 30 years ago.

Get over it, already.

You MAGA maniacs don't remember Trump making Feinswine cackle like she got her first hard orgasm in 30 years?

Now THAT'S unforgettable.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:32:38 PM EDT
[#15]
Would be interesting to see a cheap 5.7 pistol option that’s not a MPA brick of a MAC clone. Maybe ammo production will be ramped up if the Ruger takes off and prices will drop. But ultimately I see this new Ruger going into production for a few years, eventually being sold off by CDNN or a wholesaler for 40% the MSRP, Ruger discontinuing it, and prices climbing to a few hundred under FIveSeven prices.

Will be interesting to watch, but the mag cap is shitty...  I’ll stick with this for now.

Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:32:40 PM EDT
[#16]
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Quoted:

I see this silliness all over the gun world. "I won't buy it unless it has no safety!!!" WTF is it with this derpiness?

It IS possible to choose to ignore the safety if that's how you wanna rock.
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Same people who can "keep the finger off the trigger", "this is my safety" crowd, seems incapable of ignoring another switch on the gun, for some reason.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:32:42 PM EDT
[#17]
The polymer coating on the 5.7x28mm case is almost certainly for extraction from the P90 chamber  
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It may serve that purpose.  But, if it is absent/worn away, the P90 magazine loses its reliability.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:37:42 PM EDT
[#18]
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Quoted:

The Five Seven can push a 40gr over 2,000 FPS. The velocity out of a similar length barrel would be the PMR30.

Kel-Tec PMR 4.3" barrel
Calibers: .22 Magnum (.22WMR)
Energy (40gr): 138ft-lbs 187J (1250 - 1300fps)

FiveseveN Pistol 4.75 inch barrel
40gr EA Protector 2,092fps-389 ft LBS
28gr EA Trident T6 2,570fps-411 fl LBS
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Two dollars per round.

ETA:

TCM Pistol 5.0 inch barrel
40gr .22TCM 2,070fps-381ft LBS

Thirty five cents per round.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:38:53 PM EDT
[#19]
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Quoted:
That pistol and a PCC in 5.7 would be a good combo
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Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:48:24 PM EDT
[#20]
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Quoted:

Two dollars per round.
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SS198 is 2,200ish FPS out of the Five Seven for around $.50 - $.60
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:50:03 PM EDT
[#21]
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Wow, this actually makes me excited!! Finally Ruger makes something new I want! (10/22 and mini 14 are the only other Rugers I want but they have been around awhile).
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 12:51:31 PM EDT
[#22]
Honestly they could bill it in much the same way as the 17HMR was sold on release. The 5.7 would be a hell of a varmint gun in that same spectrum of uses... not so much 600 yard pdogs, but good for closer in stuff in really light and handy guns.

I mean to say if they made a small and handy boltgun or small carbine for it.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:00:36 PM EDT
[#23]
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Quoted:
I really don't understand what demographic this is aimed at.
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Says the guy with that...thing in his avatar
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:13:37 PM EDT
[#24]
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Quoted:
SS198 is 2,200ish FPS out of the Five Seven for around $.50 - $.60
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Quoted:
Quoted:

Two dollars per round.
SS198 is 2,200ish FPS out of the Five Seven for around $.50 - $.60
SS198 has a 27gr bullet.  EA Protector has a 40gr bullet.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:19:13 PM EDT
[#25]
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Quoted:

Cost.

It was $1 per rd when it first came out. Now it's roughly 50 cents a rd. That's expensive for a semi handgun rd, IMO.
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That's expensive for 5.7 ammo, too; check the prices again
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:21:36 PM EDT
[#26]
sad truth, this will hurt

we all get old, this caliber is very easy to shoot. The crypt keeper prefers this round.

an old timer with a FN loaded with 20 rounds could keep many of these rounds on target.

what many call a niche some will call a solution to what they have been looking for.

good on Ruger for stirring the autistic nerve in gun owners
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:27:41 PM EDT
[#27]
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Quoted:
5.7 is fairly miserable to reload in quantity.

The brass is fragile. Very fragile. The 57 pistol is a LOT gentler than the PS90, but the PS90 absolutely mangles the brass. The shoulder requires a (relatively) enormous resizing process to get it back in spec. After the second reloading my cartridges in relatively warm loads in a PS90 come out damn near straightwall.

Trim length is fairly critical to good function. Thin brass, (relatively) high pressures, and a hefty resizing operation means trimming is fairly critical because its going to stretch a good deal.

The vast majority of the brass has primer crimps. This isn't that big of a deal but the size of the case and the lack of reasonably priced progressive loading options means you have to remove the crimps individually- I can't just toss it in my 1050.

Cases are relatively easy to crush if you aren't careful. I use an M die, chamfer the case mouths, and then use a die with a sliding sleeve to avoid this.

I've personally found that some dies are incapable of setting the shoulder back correctly. Or rather, a combination of dies and shellholders. I am completely incapable of setting the proper length with hornady dies and lee or hornady shellholders. With a redding shellholder I am able to set it. I i bought one of the cutaway Sheridan gauges and it was helpful. I also have an Elite Ammunition gauge and it is too tight. It just shows that manufacturers aren't in perfect agreement about the 5.7.

The hubbub about it being super intolerant of powder charge and it's going to blow up if you go 0.1 over is dumb so don't worry about that so much, as long as the loads are reasonable.

I don't know if the fuss about the lube on the cases is important or not. There is a lot of fuddlore as to what purpose it serves. Some same it is needed for ps90 extraction, some say for ps90 magazines to be reliable. The pistol is considerably more tolerant. I've only gotten 4 loadings out of a piece of brass before I was so suspicious of it I tossed it, and I never bothered to try and clean it. Those who do use simple green and an ultrasonic.

The 5.7 is safe to reload... it's just a gigantic pain in the ass for the sort of gun you're going to be pumping tons of rounds through.
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Quoted:
@armoredman

The more I skim thru the "interwebs", the more the reloading problems seem to revolve around poor practices and fear set up by FN reps who like all gunmakers, discourage reloading.

There does seem to be some debate as to the actual purpose of the case coating, that is, whether it is for "storage" or to facilitate extraction.  Maybe both?

Also, allusions to the shoulder angle being too sharp for reloading appears to be bunk, too, as it is listed on CIP as 35 degrees while other cartridges have shoulder angles of 40, etc.  There's not a lot of taper on the case so that could come into play to make it a bit "sticky" at max loads.  And maybe factory/GI ammo is run hot?  Which indicates a handloader could back off a bit, get good performing, safe loads even if not turning in absolute max velocities.

Anyway, I would be interested to read a really knowledgeable handloaders full report on reloading the thing.  I guess I just don't see what the big mystery is all about.  I've handloaded since the '70's and have done case forming, etc and this thing just doesn't look like it should be voodoo to handload.
5.7 is fairly miserable to reload in quantity.

The brass is fragile. Very fragile. The 57 pistol is a LOT gentler than the PS90, but the PS90 absolutely mangles the brass. The shoulder requires a (relatively) enormous resizing process to get it back in spec. After the second reloading my cartridges in relatively warm loads in a PS90 come out damn near straightwall.

Trim length is fairly critical to good function. Thin brass, (relatively) high pressures, and a hefty resizing operation means trimming is fairly critical because its going to stretch a good deal.

The vast majority of the brass has primer crimps. This isn't that big of a deal but the size of the case and the lack of reasonably priced progressive loading options means you have to remove the crimps individually- I can't just toss it in my 1050.

Cases are relatively easy to crush if you aren't careful. I use an M die, chamfer the case mouths, and then use a die with a sliding sleeve to avoid this.

I've personally found that some dies are incapable of setting the shoulder back correctly. Or rather, a combination of dies and shellholders. I am completely incapable of setting the proper length with hornady dies and lee or hornady shellholders. With a redding shellholder I am able to set it. I i bought one of the cutaway Sheridan gauges and it was helpful. I also have an Elite Ammunition gauge and it is too tight. It just shows that manufacturers aren't in perfect agreement about the 5.7.

The hubbub about it being super intolerant of powder charge and it's going to blow up if you go 0.1 over is dumb so don't worry about that so much, as long as the loads are reasonable.

I don't know if the fuss about the lube on the cases is important or not. There is a lot of fuddlore as to what purpose it serves. Some same it is needed for ps90 extraction, some say for ps90 magazines to be reliable. The pistol is considerably more tolerant. I've only gotten 4 loadings out of a piece of brass before I was so suspicious of it I tossed it, and I never bothered to try and clean it. Those who do use simple green and an ultrasonic.

The 5.7 is safe to reload... it's just a gigantic pain in the ass for the sort of gun you're going to be pumping tons of rounds through.
I've heard the reloading foibles likened to 22 Hornet, before; kinda fussy can be worth it for a bolt rifle, but is frustrating for impatient semi-auto users

Speaking of, Ruger needs to make a 5.7 target bolt rifle.  Youth size stock option would be even better.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:32:15 PM EDT
[#28]
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Quoted:
I really don't understand what demographic this is aimed at.
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Plate in gold and will be in demand south of the border
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:38:22 PM EDT
[#29]
Cartels are sick of paying FN prices...
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:39:57 PM EDT
[#30]
Does 2000 FPS at close range have anyone concerned shrapnel?
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:42:30 PM EDT
[#31]
The guys saying that in practice many hits are used to bring down targets are completely ignoring the fact that it is exceedingly easy to land multiple hits quickly on targets with the round.  It's got 1/3 less recoil than 9mm from a much lighter gun; why *wouldn't* you follow the target down to the ground with successive shots?

Each shot's damage is comparable to 9mm; not world-ending, but no one's taking ten to center-mass without dying either, despite the 'reports' of 15-20 dumps by P90s being 'necessary.'  I can sure believe 15-20 shots landed on a target in a single, controlled burst as easily as half as many rounds of 9mm, though.

That story by the guy claiming a perp was able to ask to stop being shot repeatedly is the epitome of Fudd-lore; it's laughable under even the weakest scrutiny.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:44:01 PM EDT
[#32]
This has been in the works for a while. Rumor has it, it is Tabor Bright's brainchild. He was at FN in the sales department for almost a decade and went over there in 2016 if I recall. I suspect that the difficulties inherent in trying to design for this cartridge are what took so long, as Ruger usually doesnt have a long lead time between concept and product. Such is the benefit of being primarily oriented towards the commercial market and thus unburdened by heavy validation and endurance testing requirements I suppose.

Well see how it does. While it's awesome to see more support for the cartridge and it gaining more ground/becoming more accessible, I dont know that I'll be lining up to buy a first gen with my own money.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:55:31 PM EDT
[#33]
I have been all over searching for info.

No one else is reporting this.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 1:57:30 PM EDT
[#34]
Lots of posts saying "Ruger has no clue what people want, nobody will buy this" considering there's also a lot of posts saying "I'll totally buy this if real".
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:00:45 PM EDT
[#35]


The 5-7 is stupid expensive up here and the mags are steeply priced too.

And the 5-7 is just weird quirky.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:01:28 PM EDT
[#36]
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Quoted:
The P90/PS90 & AR57 are straight blowback, and it's unsurprising the necks blow forward.  The FN 57 is delayed blowback - I would assume the Ruger would be short-recoil operated, both being easier on brass.

The polymer coating  on the 5.7x28mm case is almost certainly for extraction from the P90 chamber, given that 5.7x28mm is likely the highest pressure round ever successfully run in a straight blowback action.  The hottest Elite loads are specifically not for use in the P90 or PS90 for that reason.
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Quoted:
Quoted:  @EVR

To further illustrate the beating the brass takes, I grabbed some from storage.

On the left is an FNss198 I think. Whatever the standard 40gr vmax load is.

Second is once fired of the same. No case prep has been done.

On the right is the second reload of the same type of brass. I don't recall what exactly the load would have been for this batch of brass but it would have been with a 40gr nosler with true blue and it certainly wasn't a super hot rod load.

https://i.imgur.com/mbKZIND.jpg

This was from a PS90. As I stated a couple of times, the 5-7 pistol is considerably less abusive.
The P90/PS90 & AR57 are straight blowback, and it's unsurprising the necks blow forward.  The FN 57 is delayed blowback - I would assume the Ruger would be short-recoil operated, both being easier on brass.

The polymer coating  on the 5.7x28mm case is almost certainly for extraction from the P90 chamber, given that 5.7x28mm is likely the highest pressure round ever successfully run in a straight blowback action.  The hottest Elite loads are specifically not for use in the P90 or PS90 for that reason.
would the CMMG PCC be easier on brass than the PS90?
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:02:18 PM EDT
[#37]
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Quoted:

The P90/PS90 & AR57 are straight blowback, and it's unsurprising the necks blow forward.  The FN 57 is delayed blowback - I would assume the Ruger would be short-recoil operated, both being easier on brass.

The polymer coating  on the 5.7x28mm case is almost certainly for extraction from the P90 chamber, given that 5.7x28mm is likely the highest pressure round ever successfully run in a straight blowback action.  The hottest Elite loads are specifically not for use in the P90 or PS90 for that reason.
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Negative. P(S)90 is also recoil delayed blowback. The travel is less however as the reciprocating mass is higher.

5.7x28 is an exceptionally hard cartridge to design for and achieve good reliability. Very high pressures, low recoil energy, relatively fast burning power without much gas volume. It makes most conventional configs unworkable for the type of reliability required for .mil/LE applications, well at least not without knowing some of the tricks. The cartridge case design helps significantly, with its unique shoulder design and special coating among other things, but it's not a panacea. The limited number of entities like AR57, CMMG, and MPA that have tried have all certainly struggled, with varying results, and those guys are by no means dummies.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:04:57 PM EDT
[#38]
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Quoted:
Says the guy with that...thing in his avatar
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Quoted:
I really don't understand what demographic this is aimed at.
Says the guy with that...thing in his avatar
Attachment Attached File

At least it has more confirmed kills than a Ruger 5.7 (for now )

To expound on my original statement: it seems to me that most people who are looking for an "inexpensive" handgun aren't really in the market for comparatively expensive ammunition, whereas those comfortable shooting pistol ammo that's $.40ish and up per round wouldn't be too hard pressed to shell out $1k or so for the FN. That said there are a lot of positive responses in this thread so maybe I'm way off base.

Quoted:

Uhhmm..broke ass "urban Yutes" dat want dat gun, dat shoots "Lil' K Bullets".

Seriously(20 yrs in the industry).
That's... alarming.
Quoted:

Shootee or shooter?
Ok, I laughed. "Coming soon to an evidence locker near you..."
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:05:26 PM EDT
[#39]
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Quoted:
Lots of posts saying "Ruger has no clue what people want, nobody will buy this" considering there's also a lot of posts saying "I'll totally buy this if real".
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Ruger is doing an excellent job of responding to the market request quickly.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:10:04 PM EDT
[#40]
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Quoted:
I have been all over searching for info.

No one else is reporting this.
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It hasnt made industry press yet that I've seen, but it's been something of an open secret that they intended to drop it at SHOT along side some other related stuff that is dropping. My guess would be one of their distributors accidentally (or "accidentally" as often occurs) went live with it or somebody started digging into distributors site code looking for scoops on upcoming products.  Now is the time of year where all the big distributors have already been allowed to get a peak behind the curtain and have started placing initial orders so that when the launch of a given product at SHOT occurs they are ready to start taking PO's. So the more inquisitive gun writers will start scouring their sites looking for tidbits on items getting ready to drop.  Sometimes distributors will intentionally violate their NDA but claim "oops" to scoop the competition on hot product.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:18:07 PM EDT
[#41]
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Quoted:
Would be interesting to see a cheap 5.7 pistol option that’s not a MPA brick of a MAC clone. Maybe ammo production will be ramped up if the Ruger takes off and prices will drop. But ultimately I see this new Ruger going into production for a few years, eventually being sold off by CDNN or a wholesaler for 40% the MSRP, Ruger discontinuing it, and prices climbing to a few hundred under FIveSeven prices.

Will be interesting to watch, but the mag cap is shitty...  I’ll stick with this for now.

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/2980/712693CF-7DD1-46BA-95AA-DD04B65525CE_jpeg-1212698.JPG
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How well does it suppress?

Want one for a varmint truck gun
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:19:59 PM EDT
[#42]
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Quoted:
5.7 isn’t that expensive,unless all you can afford is bulk pack 9mm.
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I wait until PSA or someone has it on sale for $15 (FN) and buy a case or two.  The American Eagle variety is usually $1 cheaper per box, but slower.  If you go to a LGS and pay $25 or $30, yeah, that's too much.  I shot quite a bit this summer and I think I still probably have over 5,000 rounds left.  Buy a lot when it is on sale.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:22:36 PM EDT
[#43]
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Quoted:

Negative. P(S)90 is also recoil delayed blowback. The travel is less however as the reciprocating mass is higher.

5.7x28 is an exceptionally hard cartridge to design for and achieve good reliability. Very high pressures, low recoil energy, relatively fast burning power without much gas volume. It makes most conventional configs unworkable for the type of reliability required for .mil/LE applications, well at least not without knowing some of the tricks. The cartridge case design helps significantly, with its unique shoulder design and special coating among other things, but it's not a panacea. The limited number of entities like AR57, CMMG, and MPA that have tried have all certainly struggled, with varying results, and those guys are by no means dummies.
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Everything I've been able to find says the P90/PS90 is straight blowback.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:36:29 PM EDT
[#44]
MAIN POINT OF SELLING BELGIAN FIVE SEVEN PISTOL IS EXTREME PRICE OF WEAPON AND CARTRIDGE.

BELGIAN FIVE SEVEN IS WEAPON OF MAN WHO WEARS EXPENSIVE ITALIAN FASCIST SUIT OF HAND SEWING, DRIVE HUGE EXPENSIVE NAZI MERCEDES OF A.M.G. SHOP, SAIL ON MASSIVE YACHT TO GREEK ISLANDS. I THINK YOU GET PICTURE. BELGIAN FIVE SEVEN IS WEAPON THAT SAYS IS NO SUCH THING AS CONCERN OF MONEY.

FOR MAN WITHOUT EXPENSIVE SUIT, BIG BLACK MERCEDES, AND MASSIVE YACHT, BELGIAN FIVE SEVEN IS FOR PRETENDING OF BE RICH LIKE BLACK GANGSTER OF AMERICAN CITY WITH GOLD CHAINS OF LOW QUALITY AND JEWELS OF COLORED GLASS. WHEN YOU EXPLAIN USE OF BELGIAN FIVE SEVEN PISTOL IS ONLY FOR SHOOT MAN WITH BULLET VEST WITH CARTRIDGE ILLEGAL TO CIVILIAN, THIS MAN HAS NUCLEAR RAGE. WHOLE IDENTITY OF THIS MAN IS SPENT IN PRETEND PISTOL SHOWS HE IS RICH. IS VERY AMUSE.

FOR REST OF WORLD THERE IS 9 MILLIMETERS OF LUGER WHICH IS SAME WOUND FOR COST LESS.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:37:47 PM EDT
[#45]
 Everything I've been able to find says the P90/PS90 is straight blowback.  
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My PS90 barrel has just the slightest bit of play.  So I would not call it straight blowback.

The bullet would pull the barrel forward when fired.  Then, the barrel and bolt, held together by pressure on the fired case, would start to recoil rearwards.  The barrel would come to a halt, and the bolt would travel rearwards, with the extractor pulling  the case out of the chamber.

I am surprised that this type of action hasn't seen more use.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:38:28 PM EDT
[#46]
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Quoted:

Negative. P(S)90 is also recoil delayed blowback. The travel is less however as the reciprocating mass is higher.

5.7x28 is an exceptionally hard cartridge to design for and achieve good reliability. Very high pressures, low recoil energy, relatively fast burning power without much gas volume. It makes most conventional configs unworkable for the type of reliability required for .mil/LE applications, well at least not without knowing some of the tricks. The cartridge case design helps significantly, with its unique shoulder design and special coating among other things, but it's not a panacea. The limited number of entities like AR57, CMMG, and MPA that have tried have all certainly struggled, with varying results, and those guys are by no means dummies.
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The P90 is straight blowback. The FiveSeven is delayed blowback.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:39:18 PM EDT
[#47]
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Quoted:

How well does it suppress?

Want one for a varmint truck gun
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It’s quieter than a suppressed 5.56 rifle.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:44:45 PM EDT
[#48]
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Quoted:
My PS90 barrel has just the slightest bit of play.  So I would not call it straight blowback.

The bullet would pull the barrel forward when fired.  Then, the barrel and bolt, held together by pressure on the fired case, would start to recoil rearwards.  The barrel would come to a halt, and the bolt would travel rearwards, with the extractor pulling  the case out of the chamber.

I am surprised that this type of action hasn't seen more use.
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View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
 Everything I've been able to find says the P90/PS90 is straight blowback.  
My PS90 barrel has just the slightest bit of play.  So I would not call it straight blowback.

The bullet would pull the barrel forward when fired.  Then, the barrel and bolt, held together by pressure on the fired case, would start to recoil rearwards.  The barrel would come to a halt, and the bolt would travel rearwards, with the extractor pulling  the case out of the chamber.

I am surprised that this type of action hasn't seen more use.
The barrel definitely has some play, and it’s by design. When I first noticed it I thought mine was broken before I really understood how it works. Turns out it’s broken if it doesn’t have that play.

What kinda blowback does that make it? I dunno, but they say the hot rodded ammo is only safe in the pistol so I can assume it’s different enough to warrant that ammo differentiation.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:50:53 PM EDT
[#49]
If the price is right... I'm likely to grab one.

I keep eyeing the FN, but after handling and shooting one several times the wonky safety slows me way down.
I *want* to love the FN, but I just haven't been able to bring myself there yet.

If they release this optic ready with a threaded barrel?... yeah, I'm in.
Link Posted: 12/29/2019 2:53:21 PM EDT
[#50]
People here are on drugs thinking that thing will be under $500.
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