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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:02:58 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: See you think that anyone that has any issue with police behavior is "shitting on police". I believe that the police are absolutely necessary for the order of a society. They have a hard thankless job, and are mostly underpaid. But, there are some bad actors out there. Pointing out the bad actors is not "shitting on the police". The bailiff did seems to be gunning for this guy. I certainly understand his feeling. I'm sure that they are fed up to the eyeballs with this asshole. But, I don't like to see law enforcement using any more than the required amount of force and this just didn't seem required. If you can make the argument that that use of force was *required* then maybe I'm wrong. This really isn't a huge deal in the vast scheme of things. The sovereign citizen wasn't really harmed. I'm just very cautious about the way the state treats citizens. Despite others attempting to explain police tactics, laws, and policies, you watch a video and declare it as bad use of force. You’re usually wrong and result to saying silly things. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:04:02 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Use of force isn't pretty. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:04:05 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think the disconnect here is that your opinion and the reality of what constitutes resisting in terms of the criminal sense simply are not the same, and your opinion simply isn't important because it is what it is. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I think if the officer had said, "I'm placing you under arrest" that you might indeed make a case that was active resisting. If a guy isn't actively posing a threat, it just seems to me that in a free country the police have some obligation to inform a person that they are being placed under arrest before grabbing them. Reasonable people can disagree I suppose. But I find it disturbing that people would think such an idea is completely outlandish. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:06:09 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: See you think that anyone that has any issue with police behavior is "shitting on police". I believe that the police are absolutely necessary for the order of a society. They have a hard thankless job, and are mostly underpaid. But, there are some bad actors out there. Pointing out the bad actors is not "shitting on the police". The bailiff did seems to be gunning for this guy. I certainly understand his feeling. I'm sure that they are fed up to the eyeballs with this asshole. But, I don't like to see law enforcement using any more than the required amount of force and this just didn't seem required. If you can make the argument that that use of force was *required* then maybe I'm wrong. This really isn't a huge deal in the vast scheme of things. The sovereign citizen wasn't really harmed. I'm just very cautious about the way the state treats citizens. Every on duty shooting I've been to hasn't looked pretty. Every citizen who has defended himself/herself I've been to didn't look pretty. Use of force isn't pretty. I know that probably offends your feelings. Tough. Get over it. Or, go join the sovereign citizen crowd. We have plenty here you can ally yourself with. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:07:20 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
Especially when it appears unjustified. Maybe it was, but the video makes me raise an eyebrow and question it. Quoted: Look, I'm not talking about legality here. For all I know, what that officer did was entirely legal. But surely we all know that what is legal and what is right sometimes diverge. If a guy isn't actively posing a threat, it just seems to me that in a free country the police have some obligation to inform a person that they are being placed under arrest before grabbing them. Reasonable people can disagree I suppose. But I find it disturbing that people would think such an idea is completely outlandish. this is embarrassing |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:07:25 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Especially when it appears unjustified. Maybe it was, but the video makes me raise an eyebrow and question it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Use of force isn't pretty. *That* is far more of a problem that what the office did. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:07:45 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Look, I'm not talking about legality here. For all I know, what that officer did was entirely legal. But surely we all know that what is legal and what is right sometimes diverge. If a guy isn't actively posing a threat, it just seems to me that in a free country the police have some obligation to inform a person that they are being placed under arrest before grabbing them. Reasonable people can disagree I suppose. But I find it disturbing that people would think such an idea is completely outlandish. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:07:53 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I learned very quick that you don't do it outside of places that prep it in front of you like subway. I don't like to eat out anyway so I just prep my own small meals and eat when I can while on shift. The only people that really make me go "Errrrr" are murderers who get out. One guy came up to me in the grocery store late at night and I almost jumped. I represented him on an unrelated matter, had done good by him and we had a nice chat. But it was one of the few "uh oh"s I had even though it wasn't rational and I doubt he'll bother anyone again |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:08:16 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You must be in a big city or something, I've never heard of that* *I did have a case where I found out the opposing counsel had been suspended over some weird fake court orders. But that's one of maybe two guys I can think I ran across in 20+ years and both guys from another county I barely knew. Remind me to tell you about arresting an attorney on out of county warrants at her law office some time. 
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:10:08 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And that's the thing. I'm only questioning it. But, amongst the law enforcement people in this thread, just questioning that use of force is crazy, outlandish and white knighting the sovereign citizen. *That* is far more of a problem that what the office did. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:11:35 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
THE JUDGE JUST TOLD HIM HE WAS ISSUING ANNARREST WARRANT. HE FUCKING KNEW HE WAS UNDER ARREST. this is embarrassing Tell me, what would have been so crazy about the officer telling the guy he was under arrest? |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:12:20 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am AMAZED at how often I see marked patrol cars in fast food and Dunkin Donuts and going through drive through |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:13:09 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Look, I'm not talking about legality here. For all I know, what that officer did was entirely legal. But surely we all know that what is legal and what is right sometimes diverge. If a guy isn't actively posing a threat, it just seems to me that in a free country the police have some obligation to inform a person that they are being placed under arrest before grabbing them. Reasonable people can disagree I suppose. But I find it disturbing that people would think such an idea is completely outlandish. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:14:42 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
THIS IS RAPE! ARTICLE 4 FREE INHABITANT! GOLD FRINGE FLAG! P. BARNES! P. BARNES! P Barnes is a Legend! |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:15:16 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Look at Strasser's arrest history from a simple internet search. He's no stranger to cops having to having to go hands on. Since it happened in a court setting I would say the cops executed an order of "Habeas Grabus". Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Look, I'm not talking about legality here. For all I know, what that officer did was entirely legal. But surely we all know that what is legal and what is right sometimes diverge. If a guy isn't actively posing a threat, it just seems to me that in a free country the police have some obligation to inform a person that they are being placed under arrest before grabbing them. Reasonable people can disagree I suppose. But I find it disturbing that people would think such an idea is completely outlandish. Honest question - isn't that sort of standard procedure? |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:15:41 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Look, I'm not talking about legality here. For all I know, what that officer did was entirely legal. But surely we all know that what is legal and what is right sometimes diverge. If a guy isn't actively posing a threat, it just seems to me that in a free country the police have some obligation to inform a person that they are being placed under arrest before grabbing them. Reasonable people can disagree I suppose. But I find it disturbing that people would think such an idea is completely outlandish. Quote HistoryQuoted: Look, I'm not talking about legality here. For all I know, what that officer did was entirely legal. But surely we all know that what is legal and what is right sometimes diverge. If a guy isn't actively posing a threat, it just seems to me that in a free country the police have some obligation to inform a person that they are being placed under arrest before grabbing them. Reasonable people can disagree I suppose. But I find it disturbing that people would think such an idea is completely outlandish. When you learn about handcuffing and arrests, you'll learn about the most and least dangerous types of people to arrest. And those who are among the most dangerous are the ones who are potentially noncompliant. They will feign stupidity, they will stall, they will play silly games like pretending they can't reach back behind their back, or that the cuffs are too tight, or whatever. They will jerk away when you go to cuff them. They can kick back. They can spit, bite, whatever. Again, the guy in question had a history of violence. There are people you arrest who you know will give you no problems whatsoever. You will be polite, they will be polite, you'll probably talk about something mundane and pleasant all the way to booking. And there are people who will cause an unholy fuss and make shit super difficult, and it's not always the gang banging super thugs like you would expect. Sometimes it's the crotchety old drunk, sometimes it's the super bitch tramp who gets ripped and fights everyone after she gets caught stealing a bag of cheetos at the gas station. This guy is a known and understood troublemaker. He was not likely to go easy, and whatever he did or was going to do was likely to be a stall and delay tactic. I've had the pleasure of attending classes taught by two of the foremost experts on sovereigns, moorish nation, and similar groups, and their advice when dealing with them is to not take any of their shit and lock them up ASAP if they need to be arrested. Quoted:
I've driven up to drive throughs and seen people I was surprised weren't in prison "Uh hi!" The only people that really make me go "Errrrr" are murderers who get out. One guy came up to me in the grocery store late at night and I almost jumped. I represented him on an unrelated matter, had done good by him and we had a nice chat. But it was one of the few "uh oh"s I had even though it wasn't rational and I doubt he'll bother anyone again Quoted: I'm sure this guy is a chronic pain in everyone's neck and a complete asshole. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of telling the guy you're placing him under arrest? Honest question - isn't that sort of standard procedure? |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:16:27 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And the sovereign citizen was still at the "huh, pardon?"stage of processing. I don't think he expected it and I don't think he comprehend what had just occurred. Yes, I know his comprehension isn't required to place him under arrest. Tell me, what would have been so crazy about the officer telling the guy he was under arrest? This was also not the sovereigns first time going into handcuffs. He knew exactly what was going on. Like i said, you're not even in the ball park of understanding when it comes to this incident. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:21:14 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're seriously highlighting your ignorance here. Sovereigns are not exactly reasonable people. That "pardon" stage you're referencing is not some sheer confusion, It's him attempting to conjure an additional argument they do not accept an order. They twist, yell, argue, and demand. Further, the deputy appears familiar with the guy and seeing how he cites his knowledge of previously dealing with the sovereign while he was aggressive with court employees, gaining the advantage and handcuffing before attempting a conversation with a person that isn't going to go anywhere is the smart move. This was also not the sovereigns first time going into handcuffs. He knew exactly what was going on. Like i said, you're not even in the ball park of understanding when it comes to this incident. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: And the sovereign citizen was still at the "huh, pardon?"stage of processing. I don't think he expected it and I don't think he comprehend what had just occurred. Yes, I know his comprehension isn't required to place him under arrest. Tell me, what would have been so crazy about the officer telling the guy he was under arrest? This was also not the sovereigns first time going into handcuffs. He knew exactly what was going on. Like i said, you're not even in the ball park of understanding when it comes to this incident. I've heard two inconsistent arguments here: 1.) The guy knew the score and knew that he was being arrested. 2.) Grabbing him straight away gave the officer the element of surprise and made the arrest easier, therefore not going through the formality of telling him he was under arrest was a tactical element. Which is it? They can't both be true. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:24:01 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm sure this guy is a chronic pain in everyone's neck and a complete asshole. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of telling the guy you're placing him under arrest? Honest question - isn't that sort of standard procedure? 
The is no standard procedure for announcing to the person that they are under arrest. Once you interact with the person, they know exactly why they are being arrested. Just like this guy knew exactly why he was being arrested. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:24:51 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Look, I'll grant you everything you just said about Duck Dynasty there. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of saying "I'm placing you under arrest" before putting your hands on him? I've heard two inconsistent arguments here: 1.) The guy knew the score and knew that he was being arrested. 2.) Grabbing him straight away gave the officer the element of surprise and made the arrest easier, therefore not going through the formality of telling him he was under arrest was a tactical element. Which is it? They can't both be true. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:25:25 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Look, I'll grant you everything you just said about Duck Dynasty there. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of saying "I'm placing you under arrest" before putting your hands on him? I've heard two inconsistent arguments here: 1.) The guy knew the score and knew that he was being arrested. 2.) Grabbing him straight away gave the officer the element of surprise and made the arrest easier, therefore not going through the formality of telling him he was under arrest was a tactical element. Which is it? They can't both be true. Don't overthink it. You don't have to mirandize someone when you throw cuffs on them, you know. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:26:27 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Like for divorce and child support contempt? I represented an ex cop who got brought in for contempt on his divorce. There were two or three deputies in the courtroom. The judge said "you better do x" and he said "okay but..." and I could see the deputies m closing in with looks in their faces like the cartoon dogs right before they beat up the cat from Tom and Jerry  He noticed me kind of shuffling away from him, then noticed the cops kind of meandering towards him and switched to "yup yup no problem" There is an even a term for that - voluntary impoverishment. Combine that with the ex who tries to get you fired from every job you hold so they find you guilty if contempt. and when you do find work, they hit with the current CS payments, back payments (arrears) and a penalty. The whole thing is Idiocracy stupid. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:31:43 AM EDT
[#23]
What the judge should have issued the warrant for is impersonating ZZTop.
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:34:34 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm sure this guy is a chronic pain in everyone's neck and a complete asshole. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of telling the guy you're placing him under arrest? Honest question - isn't that sort of standard procedure? Not text book, but it was what he chose for it to be. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:42:56 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Look, I'll grant you everything you just said about Duck Dynasty there. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of saying "I'm placing you under arrest" before putting your hands on him? I've heard two inconsistent arguments here: 1.) The guy knew the score and knew that he was being arrested. 2.) Grabbing him straight away gave the officer the element of surprise and made the arrest easier, therefore not going through the formality of telling him he was under arrest was a tactical element. Which is it? They can't both be true. The hand on his arm kind of prevents that. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:44:09 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have absolutely zero problem with any law officer using force to perform a legal arrest if the suspect resists. Clearly this bailiff was performing a legal arrest. The judge just issued the warrant. But the sovereign citizen was still at the "huh what?" stage. He never was given the opportunity to comply. He didn't resist in any definition of the word that isn't ridiculous. These sovereign citizens are idiots. But being an idiot isn't justification to over react and frankly the commission of a (minor) abuse of state power. Americans used to be very suspect of the state overstepping it's bounds. Lately we seem to be cheerleaders for this sort of thing. Given how unpopular we gun owners are with a lot of people in power you'd think we'd be a bit more cautious about these sort of tactics that are justified on the basis of whether we like the person or not. OTOH, you commit a minor infraction and risk a fine, arrest, etc. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:45:22 AM EDT
[#27]
I've only had contact with a few of these people but they always- always act like they can do what ever they feel like doing and that never works out well for them. As far as the Officer's actions- I'm with him all the way. The SC was attempting to belittle the Judge's control over the domain of the courtroom. The Officer gained control through violence of action and that's what's needed in a situation such as this. The Officer- being alone- had to gain control of the situation. He did.
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:45:45 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Appearing before the court isn't just simply being there. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: When the judge called his case the idiot said he wasn't the defendant. Therefore the defendant isn't present and failed to appear for court so the judge issued a bench warrant for him. The deputy knew who the guy was so he immediate arrested him on the warrant the judge issued merely seconds prior. It's beautiful. Typical libtrard court logic, adding 2+2 and getting minus 10. Idiocracy is an upgrade from where we are. https://i.imgur.com/uYTvLq0.jpg That arrest was pure vindictiveness and "I am going to show you who the boss is". Further alienating the thinking people. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:49:03 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In my experience you should inform the arrestee what the charges are prior to initiating the physical detention and depravation of the freedom of movement except when the advisement may hinder executing the arrest or pose an officer safety issue. That being said, he appears to have a known history and his being a sovereign poses a good probability that informing him will result in a verbal argument over his belief in regards to the legality, authority, jurisdiction and the qualifications of the officer making the arrest. This is pretty much born out by the abundance of videos of what happens when you arrest sovereign citizens (pulling away and breaking car windows are pretty common). He was present in person to hear that a warrant was issued for his arrest, which occurred after he did not want to (chose on his own) acknowledge his presence to the court and then address the court. Not text book, but it was what he chose for it to be. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I'm sure this guy is a chronic pain in everyone's neck and a complete asshole. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of telling the guy you're placing him under arrest? Honest question - isn't that sort of standard procedure? Not text book, but it was what he chose for it to be. And that's the crux of my issue - I just don't hear that command. I've listened to that segment multiple times with headphones on and the sound up and I just don't hear it. If I did hear it everything that followed would be copacetic. The fact that the deputy claims to have given that command and I don't hear it perks my ears up because that is what *he* claimed was the justification for his use of force. I can hear every syllable that Strasser uttered as clear as a bell, I just don't hear the deputy give the command. Given the clarity that I hear everything else, if I don't hear it then either it wasn't said or it was said at such low volume that Stasser might not have reasonably been expected to hear it. The deputy was cleared and life goes on. I just don't like the idea of guys taken down for resisting arrest by not complying with a command that was either not given or spoken so softly that he was unlikely to hear - even if the arrestee is a sovereign asshole that probably deserved what he got. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 12:49:03 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: wow, what a brilliant response. That explains everything. That arrest was pure vindictiveness and "I am going to show you who the boss is". Further alienating the thinking people. Here, though? I think we have a live one. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:08:46 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: wow, what a brilliant response. That explains everything. That arrest was pure vindictiveness and "I am going to show you who the boss is". Further alienating the thinking people. Government and law is nothing but polite violence. The Sovereign Citizens are goofy, because they attempt to emulate the same language, tone and demeanor to resist the government, as the government uses to justify it's use of force and application of violence. They're goofy because they think it's about words and ideas, when in reality it's about force. It's all gold fringes, admiralty courts, and petitions until the body slam. The simple truth is one man can't resist. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:24:11 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thinking people already understand the situation. Government and law is nothing but polite violence. The Sovereign Citizens are goofy, because they attempt to emulate the same language, tone and demeanor to resist the government, as the government uses to justify it's use of force and application of violence. They're goofy because they think it's about words and ideas, when in reality it's about force. It's all gold fringes, admiralty courts, and petitions until the body slam. The simple truth is one man can't resist. I'll admit, when I was 12 that argument might have had some appeal to me. But down that road all that lies is chaos. Men are not angels. We actually do need a government, sadly. Anarchy has never worked. Now, we definitely should have as little government as possible. And we have *far* too much government in this country now. And nothing justifies the state treating citizens with contempt, even the likes of an idiot like Ronald Strasser. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:28:04 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you are out of work and cannot work, for whatever reason, they keep the clock running and the debt accumulates.That's called arrears. Even the IRS is not that evil. Imagine the IRS telling you, after you file 0 taxes after making 0 all year - well you should have made xx,xxx there for we will tax you for xx,xxx, that you could have made, but didn't. That's how the 'family court' gang operates. There is an even a term for that - voluntary impoverishment. Combine that with the ex who tries to get you fired from every job you hold so they find you guilty if contempt. and when you do find work, they hit with the current CS payments, back payments (arrears) and a penalty. The whole thing is Idiocracy stupid. Guy went through a nasty divorce, was making his court ordered payments, decided he wasn't going to take overtime/details anymore because the more he made, the more he would have to pay to his ex. Ex took him to court over it and the judge ordered him to take overtime/details again. Last I heard he resigned from the force shortly after that and started living life on the other side of the law. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:37:21 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
While there is no love lost in my mind between SC and society, it saddens me that freedom loving folks like those here woudl be so gleeful about this. There are very few freedom loving people here. Most of the people here are happy to see the heavy hand of government come down on the people. I'm not even talking about the stupid auditors and PINAC guys. I'm talk about people who have been busted for NFA violations and ARFCOM cheers for government to fuck these people over. So if you're looking for freedom loving this is not the place for you. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:38:36 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The freedom that most people want is the freedom to use the power of government to hurt people they don't like. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
While there is no love lost in my mind between SC and society, it saddens me that freedom loving folks like those here woudl be so gleeful about this. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:45:21 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Plea colloqouys in NY now have a warning to let illegals know the conviction could get them deported Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wish the judge and bailiffs treated illegal aliens with the same energy. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:51:47 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think what he said (maybe I misheard it) was "I'm not mister whatever but I'm here in that matter" I assume from context that he had a long winded explanation about how his real person name was Marvin the Martian or whatever. Obviously they knew he was there and he was him as the cops jumped on him immediately, not like they asked "wait are you saying your his lawyer, are you mr whatever" Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Can someone who isn't the defendant, represent someone else in court if they aren't a lawyer? Obviously they knew he was there and he was him as the cops jumped on him immediately, not like they asked "wait are you saying your his lawyer, are you mr whatever" |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:54:36 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm sure this guy is a chronic pain in everyone's neck and a complete asshole. But I still ask, why wouldn't you go through the formality of telling the guy you're placing him under arrest? Hell one of his arrests was for attacking a police officer with a weapon, dude is a psycho. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 1:57:53 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Seems like a finding of contempt would be cleaner, but either way he was asking to get his pee pee smacked. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:00:12 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The sovereign citizens are goofy because what they're essentially saying is "Your laws don't apply to me because I never agreed to them. The state has no contract with me". |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:03:53 AM EDT
[#41]
Seems excessive but I wouldn't be shocked if there is much more to the story than we see or hear in the video
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:06:12 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've found talking to Sovereign Citizens is like arguing with a bratty little kid. They want to break the rules and then pretend that the rules don't apply to them because they are special. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The sovereign citizens are goofy because what they're essentially saying is "Your laws don't apply to me because I never agreed to them. The state has no contract with me". |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:06:46 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One of them filed a three trillion dollar lien against all my real and personal property. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
SC's love to file liens and shit against cops, along with filing false complaints and whatever other abuses of the legal process they can dream up, while at the same time saying they're outside of it. Kharn
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:09:54 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The guy created his own problems and got what he deserved. There are very few freedom loving people here. Most of the people here are happy to see the heavy hand of government come down on the people. I'm not even talking about the stupid auditors and PINAC guys. I'm talk about people who have been busted for NFA violations and ARFCOM cheers for government to fuck these people over. So if you're looking for freedom loving this is not the place for you. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:16:31 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When the judge called his case the idiot said he wasn't the defendant. Therefore the defendant isn't present and failed to appear for court so the judge issued a bench warrant for him. The deputy knew who the guy was so he immediate arrested him on the warrant the judge issued merely seconds prior. It's beautiful. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:18:57 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So, basically just like talking to the poster you quote. I don't know how many times several posters have pointed out his confusion but he still keeps spouting the same bullshit...over and over and over. Just like sovereign citizens do. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The sovereign citizens are goofy because what they're essentially saying is "Your laws don't apply to me because I never agreed to them. The state has no contract with me". Different people can look at the same facts and arrive at different conclusions. Deputy O'Keef said that Strasser resisted because he didn't comply with a command to put his hands behind his back. I've listened to that tape many times and I don't hear his command, and I hear every utterance of Strasser and everyone else in that courtroom clearly (they really have an excellent mic system in that court). Either O'Keef never gave that command, or he gave it so softly that it is likely that Strasser never heard it either. Since O'Keef hinged his use of force on that fact, I have to question it because I don't hear it in the recording. It's just that simple. Now an investigation found in O'Keef's favor so maybe they have access to a better recording or some forensic technique. Or everyone agrees that Strasser is an asshole and no one was willing to ding the Deputy for his action. I don't know. All I know is I hear no command to Strasser on that recording. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:28:18 AM EDT
[#47]
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Since you feel this place is the heart of pro big government, feel free to leave so you aren't part of the big government conspiracy you believe this place is. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The guy created his own problems and got what he deserved. There are very few freedom loving people here. Most of the people here are happy to see the heavy hand of government come down on the people. I'm not even talking about the stupid auditors and PINAC guys. I'm talk about people who have been busted for NFA violations and ARFCOM cheers for government to fuck these people over. So if you're looking for freedom loving this is not the place for you. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:39:14 AM EDT
[#48]
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(Removed -40xb) |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 2:45:29 AM EDT
[#49]
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Like they do with illegal aliens Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: When the judge called his case the idiot said he wasn’t the defendant. Therefore the defendant isn’t present and failed to appear for court so the judge issued a bench warrant for him. The deputy knew who the guy was so he immediate arrested him on the warrant the judge issued merely seconds prior. It’s beautiful. |
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Posted: 12/28/2018 3:05:20 AM EDT
[#50]
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Sovereign Citizens are cocks and bring on every beating they get. Love this one.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfVbiefMdNU
Holy hell are these types just absolutely insufferable. They always have that same nasally "I'm such smarter than you" condescending voice too. Can't tell which types are the most annoying. -Sovereign Citizens -Guys that intentionally provoke arguments with traffic cops and try to use some insane legal position (and always lose) -Guys that walk around with an AK slung on their backs and get pissy when cops simply ask why they're doing it. It's like they're all cut from the same cloth. Same annoying autistic mannerisms, intentionally looking for confrontation, nasally "I'm so smart" voices, completely oblivious of common sense or pretends to be obtuse, etc.. |
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