Tesla tried that.  Toyota bailed out of the collaboration, and sold their Tesla stock when it was around $300/share.  
http://fortune.com/2017/06/04/toyota-tesla-collaboration-sale/

To my knowledge they've offered it but no one has signed up. It's also not for sale in their own cars yet so we'll see where it goes.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-06-03/tesla-s-secret-source-of-cash-unmasked-as-gm-and-fiat-chrysler

cold for bloomterd, up 7% today

$420m in revenue last year was their EV credits... That's the real money maker right now, that's govt intervention for you.

No one is going to hook up a Titan to an auto carrier or a flat bed or claim they can tow a D4 dozer across country or pull a double wide trailer for an install.

The star of Disney's live-action version of "Aladdin" is suing Tesla, claiming a defect in the car's suspension caused the front wheel of his Model 3 to pop off as he was changing lanes on Hollywood Boulevard, spinning the car out of control and into a tree.
The actor Mena Massoud had bought the car the day before and Geico, his insurer, ultimately found that the issue was with Tesla, not Mena, according to the complaint.  Massoud is suing Tesla, alleging negligence and breach of warranty, among other things.  
https://www.businessinsider.com/aladdin-stars-problem-with-tesla-known-as-whompy-wheels-2019-6

Hahahahahahahaha. Those tent built Teslas lack quality who woulda thunk it.

The one person that I know with one is an engineering manager.  His entire career has been in the automotive industry.  People actually think he is pretty smart.  He is one of those people that will reword something you just said are restate it and think he is clever.

Granted my sample size is very small and totally not statistically significant, but...

Clearly Massoud is running a scheme to short Tesla stock. We've been assured, all of Tesla's failings are from those that short the stock, nothing to see here.

Another name added to Elons Pedo List

I think the real problem is that electric cars are still too expensive to produce. That is probably why we are not seeing all the manufacturers jump in. That or people just don’t want them.

People are just slow to adopt to change. 20 years from now it will seem ludicrous that we all didn't just pull up on a charging pad on our garage floor to power up each night sooner.

The other manufacturers figured out electric cars aren't profitable.

20 years? Not happening.

I think 20 years from now the electric guys will be saying the same thing they are now.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-bull-im-buying-as-many-shares-as-i-can-150646601.html

Poor Galileo Russell.  The last time we were in a bear market, he was in the eleventh grade and had no idea that he wanted to be a youTube-based stock analyst for a career.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/galileo-russell-6560993b

He's the epitome of starry eyed dreamer millennials who invest on stories and not fundamentals.  Last year Russell gave an interview where he said, "I actually like that Tesla is losing money."  He's already deeply in the red based on statements he made last year about how many shares he had.  When TSLA eventually reaches a reasonable valuation based on fundamentals, he's going to be looking at an overall 70-100% loss.

Also, lol @ starting a youTube channel making you a "CEO."  

Good luck with the new China plant!  China car sales fell 16.4% last month.

https://fingfx.thomsonreuters.com/gfx/editorcharts/CHINA-AUTOS/0H001PGDM6RJ/index.html

I'm sure that's just every other automaker but Tesla. Tesla sales are up in China, if not the world over. We'll all see, it's just the media and short sellers trying to destroy Elon because they are jealous of the future.

I've actually seen some electric news articles popping in my feed that go along the lines above. Figurative fingers in the ears, screaming at the world to block all criticism out.

ETA: Just got a notification for this one.

Tesla Delivering 1k a day, record quarter

"Tesla is trying to achieve record deliveries this quarter and it is counting on the North American market to do it with quick deliveries by the end of the month.

Electrek has learned that Tesla is currently delivering cars at a rate of approximately 1,000 a day.
In recent weeks, CEO Elon Musk signaled that Tesla is within reach of a new record quarter for deliveries, but they have some obstacles to overcome.

As we reported earlier this month, Tesla aims to deliver between 33,000 and 36,000 vehicles in June in North America to break its delivery record.

The company is also offering incentives to employees in order to motivate them to reach the goal.

According to sources familiar with the matter, Tesla has been delivering cars at a rate of approximately 1,000 a day in North America so far this month.

Furthermore, there are almost 7,000 more deliveries planned over the next 7 days and even more last-minute deliveries are expected over the last week of the quarter as buyers try to get deliveries before the federal tax credit on Tesla vehicles goes down again."

"In North America."

They're discounting heavily to move inventory cars in the US.  They have 34k cars in inventory, mostly stored in the US.  They'll get a tiny bit of help from the opening of Model 3 right hand drive car sales in UK, AUS, and JPN this quarter, but maybe not even enough to overcome the drops we see in the registration reporting in European countries.  They'll also get some help from the pull-forward of demand in America as the FIT credit prepares to fall by 50% again on July 1.

I think they have a good shot at meeting, or at least only barely missing, the bottom end of their implied delivery guidance for Q2, 90k cars.  Even if they only hit 80k, they can weasel-word their way into saying it's a good thing.  But it's going to be an absolute blood bath at the bottom line when the Q2 financials come out in August.  I'm looking to load up on puts again the first week of July after the delivery numbers are released.

Well that goes full circle, if they were dirt cheap, or at least cheaper than conventional cars for day to day tasks without sacrificing too much, we'd see more demand for them.

On paper things like the Bolt look damn promising, used prices are starting to drop below the 20k mark, 250 miles of range easily covers commuting and day to day trips for 90+% of the public and costs less than gas to keep charged. Blah blah road trips, meh most families have more than one car nowadays anyway and one is probably a CUV/SUV to fit all the kids in. But dad or mom still drives to work every day in the other car. Hell if I can find a 500e for under $6k I said I'd get one to drive to work and back so I don't have to take my F150 everywhere.

But getting that cost down is key, very few families can honestly look at a model 3 and go, gee that's the right balance of cost effectiveness and convenience solution for my family. It just isn't compared to gas cars. And that's while Tesla has to still be losing thousands on each car. I'm not sure what the next step is. I dont think EV is going away, just adoption can't take off at it's current state. I think in the EU and CN markets where there are more overbearing markets that don't mind pushing EV on feels and adding massive tax incentives in the form of either gas taxes, reduced registration or charging rates, car subsidies, etc, but not here. Hell even the 500e was only built as a compliance car as it is. I bet we see more of those as the governments keep pushing EVs on people for whatever reasons they justify them with.

I don't think EVs are going away either.  There's a certainly market for some percentage of electric vehicles.  And hybrids.  And Diesels...
But Tesla can't continue losing billions.   Eventually the lenders will stop providing money to finance Tesla's losses.

EVs sales are also tanking in China.  
https://qz.com/1641512/chinas-electric-vehicle-sales-grew-126-a-year-ago-now-theyre-at-2/

EVs have a place, just like hybrids and diesels do.

Universally? No. As soon as you get away from city infrastructure and journeys longer than 15 miles (the average commute) they don't work so well.

Or apartments with street parking (common in big cities where range is not otherwise an issue), or cold weather, or other things ic cars are better at.

How could Elon Musk delete his Twitter account, if he can tweet that he deleted his Twitter account?

Just deleted my Twitter account

Daddy DotCom  (@elonmusk) June 17, 2019

Apartment buildings and even street parking are getting more and more chargers though... I think Seattle has legislated  that new construction has 20% of their parking lots EV ready... And they're allowing chargers to be installed on public streets outside of said apartments without parking... It's coming...

https://www.seattle.gov/transportation/projects-and-programs/programs/new-mobility-program/electric-vehicle-charging-in-the-public-right-of-way

The heat death of the universe is coming, that doesn’t mean I’m spending a lot of time thinking about it.  20% of new construction is a long way from 100%, especially since Seattle is limiting the total number of parking spots for new apartments. It will be a couple of decades before a majority of apartments have a majority of their parking spots capable of ev charging. It will be even longer for street parking.

Why would you need 100% of an apartment parking lot EV powered unless 100% of tenants have EVs which is no where in the near future? With 20% EV spots don't you think the apartment managers would increase the number of chargers if demand increased?

Unless parking spots are assigned and patroled your EV might get stuck in the back 40 with no hook up.

No.  Have you ever lived in an apartment? Apartment managers are not known for undertaking large, capital intensive, upgrade projects.

Uh like the EV only signs they already put on the charger stalls? If there were complaints they'd be ticketed or towed just like non residents parking in someone's spot... This problem isn't a problem, EV chargers are already everywhere, many employers, every major shopping center, they don't get ICE'd often enough to matter as it's just normal around here. They get signed spots usually somewhat close to the handicap spots. And I'm not just talking in the city, they're all over the surrounding areas.

Large, capital intensive project to add chargers? I bet it costs less than a months rent to get another charger installed. These are usually pretty basic commercial level 2 chargers. They don't even have to provide them for free, plenty of vendor chargers are happy to contract to put in chargers for a fee, but to attract high rent tech worker renters that actually drive these things they happily let tenants charge for free or at cost. And before the energy demand comments the commercial chargers even limit charge rates during high utilization of all chargers to allow higher density, it's a mostly solved problem. On the lower end, it's not exactly monumental to add 240v 30a or 50a outlets either, every apartment already has one behind their range and one behind their dryer.

While I understand what works in Seattle isn't going to work in every place, but it's spreading just as fast as EV adoption is which is all I was a saying. A lot of the commercial technologies like those started by start ups and tried on the west coast will get bugs worked out and get costs down to spread to property managers in other urban areas too trying to do the same things trying to attract the tenants that drive these things.

I think you're going to see a bigger uptick in adoption to first time EV owners as a lot of the higher priced earlier tech EVs age too and become affordable to those interested. First gen leafs are dirt cheap. The i3, 500e, spark EV, e-tron, smart fortwo EV, are all getting well in to the extra toy price range, I sure see a lot of them on the streets now. It's the new market that is intriguing to me, as it's mostly government intervention that sells them in the form of tax credits on the same, pollution credits, EV percentage mandates, and not actual value in the car. How long will OEMs either play the game losing out due to govt BS or figure out how to actually make profitable EVs. IDK.

Unpossible, GD tells me robots will be taking over 87% of jobs within a few years

That has literally nothing to do with what we are talking about here.  If you have 10 people who want to charge their EVs and 8 charge points, who gets priority?

You say EV chargers are already "everywhere" but what percentage the spots of your employers parking lot are setup for EV charging?  5%?  That's fine when EVs are <2% of the vehicle market but how are EVs supposed to get to 50% or 75% of the market if they are charging at the same 5% of parking spots?

You'd bet wrong, it costs Tesla around $250,000 on average to install a supercharging station with an average of around 10 charge points and Tesla builds their own equipment so they get that at cost.  Yes, each charge point is lower power for an apartment building but the total power consumption will be higher do to the larger number of chargers installed.  You can't just add twenty to fifty 50 amp outlets.  You're talking about a months long process with multiple engineering approvals, permits, and significant construction.  You don't understand it because you've only dealt with residential power which is a completely different world from commercial power.  Yes, it's a "solved problem," it's just expensive and apartment building financing is not setup to add large expenses after the fact, they are fully leveraged and can't pay for it out of free cash flow.

Ask Elon, I hear he's working on it.

Very, very slowly?

If you're seriously comparing the equipment and infrastructure of a supercharger site capable of pulling nearly a MW of power to an average commercial level 2 charger installation I think you're talking about something else... Superchargers are capable of delivering 100kW to a single stall (which would be something like 400A+@240v on a single stall assuming they even ran off 240V service, which they don't). Fuck yeah they require some major power and infrastructure cost to do that. That's not what overnight type chargers need.

If an apartment building dedicated a single 240v 200A panel to their EV row in their parking lot with a 2:1 to 4:1 over subscription rate for 40A chargers that's 10-20 level 2 chargers. Commercial chargers like Charge Point let you set breaker, panel, and site level max charging rates so you can oversubscribe as much as you want. Think of a gas station with a fixed pumping rate from their tank, 99% of the time everyone car fill their car at full speed, but if all the pumps are occupied they fill slightly slower. Need more chargers? Yeah you have to have to have more panels and more service from the power company and all the costs that comes with that. But comparing level 2 chargers to supercharger sites is an absurd comparison. My quick Googling puts equipment and installation estimates close to $6-10k/charger with the lower end being when more chargers are installed at once. Ok, more than a months rent, but when newer construction urban apartments are starting at $2-$3k+/mo it's not that absurd for property managers to want EV chargers in their lots.

And I assume when mentioned above about spots being filled you were talking about being ICE'd on community spots (apartment/condo chargers can be setup community style or assigned/fixed tenant style, obviously the latter is easier to account for, EV owners simply usually pay more to get an assigned EV charger spot over a regular spot), but if you're talking about community style and having them filled by other EVs, yeah there is a demand problem. At some point tenants become upset and leave and either the property manager makes more investment or they don't but I have to imagine if it starts pushing tenants away eventually making an equipment investment is in their best interest.

As far as adoption, yeah, it's damn near non-existent in many states. It's not on the west coast. You could argue a lot of it is tied to govt incentives, it is, no one would sanely argue that, but it's also practicality in certain areas.

It's hard to get per state data for 2018, but Washington is nearly 5% of new car sales, California is nearing 10% and was supposed to go up quite a bit in 2018. If we're simply talking adoption rates, the numbers aren't horrible and have been increasing. The real question is at what cost and how sustainable is it, and can any of the OEMs actually make any money doing it... I think Nissan, Chevy, and BMW did ok on their cars, but I don't know the full numbers. And eventually with tax incentives you have to run out of other peoples money eventually.
So we'll see.

https://evadoption.com/ev-market-share/ev-market-share-state/
https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/us-electric-vehicle-sales-increase-by-81-in-2018#gs.jms8mz
https://insideevs.com/news/341331/november-2018-us-plug-in-ev-sales-report-card/
https://insideevs.com/news/352626/ev-sales-scorecard-may-2019/

A few weeks ago, Goldman Sachs made millions from recommending/selling Tesla's debt to investors.  
Now, Goldman Sachs downgrades Tesla's stock, with a stock price target of 158.  
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/06/20/goldman-sachs-cuts-tesla-price-target.html

Leaked documents indicate Tesla will not meet Elon Musk's Model 3 production goals for this quarter.  
https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-model-3-goal-not-met-leaked-documents-suggest-2019-6

That's 10-20 level 2 charge points charging at level 1 charge rates.  You'd need to triple the incoming power to have decent Qos and you'd still be below what most people recommend for a home charger.  The only way a single 200 amp panel would work is if it was installed in senior housing and half the people stay home all day and even they would be angry about the wait.

Another wave of Tesla executives leaving, before Q2 deliveries are announced.

Jan Oehmicke, head of Tesla Europe.  
https://electrek.co/2019/07/02/tesla-head-of-europe-out/

Steve MacManus, VP engineering.  
https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-engineering-vp-steve-macmanus-departs-company-2019-6

Last week it was the third biggest name at the company, Head of Production Peter Hochholdinger, who quit to join rival EV maker Lucid Motors.

Production and delivery numbers for Q2 should be coming after the close today or tomorrow.

Still dreaming.

Tesla reported 95,200 vehicle delivered last quarter.  
Tesla reported 87,000 vehicles produced last quarter.  Tesla is running a bit short of Musk's guidance of 500k vehicles produced in 2019.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/02/business/tesla-electric-vehicle-sales.html

Attached File

They did fantastic compared to the average predictions.

Missing elons goal, but his goals are always lofty.

So, I assume the prediction for the remaining two quarters has been updated to (500k - 87k - 77.1k)/2 = 167950?

Seeing as he's the leader of a company, that's a nice way of saying his business predictions are bullshit.  Well, except for the people investing in "lofty goals" which does seem to be his target audience.

So an officer of a company knowingly gave bad forecasts and thats ok?

Concensus was 87k-89k.  They could have surprised with 90 or 91 or 92 and it would have been believable.  Fleet sales are the unpredictable wildcard, and to hit 95k they definably resorted to several thousand units sold at even more than normal losses to fleets.  It looks great on the delivery numbers, and keeps alive the illusion of growth, but the discounts required to move that many cars are going to be murder on the bottom line six weeks from now.

Like a reusable rocket dropping the price of space travel by an order of magnitude?

So production is up 0.6% in the past 6 months?  I mean, I guess it is technically "record production" but it's very underwhelming.

Compared to Q4, sales of the highly profitable S/X models are trending way down, and model 3 sales are trending way up.
If Tesla wasn't profitable last quarter (Q2), I don't see how they can ever be profitable.

Stock price rallied on record deliveries.  And it rallied again on the leaked email about increasing production at Fremont.  Only today has the stock price finally barely touched the $243 level that they raised capital at just 10 weeks ago.

Fremont has a current maximum capacity of about 350k vehicles/year, but they've slowed S/X production in the face of falling demand.  Fremont produced 430k cars in 2006, its best year when it was owned and run jointly by Toyota and GM.  Given Tesla's history of wildly inefficient manufacturing, and the recent loss of Hochholdinger, I wouldn't expect Tesla to hit even 400k/year from Fremont in the next several years.  That doesn't even start factoring in the problems with their paint shop at current production levels.  I'd rate the leaked email about increasing Fremont production somewhere between "wishful thinking" and "fake news."

Remember two years ago when people thought Fremont was going to produce 10k Model 3s per week, as well as 2k S/X per week?    lol

yes