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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:19:22 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Instead of smoke grenades it'll have glitter grenades  Please, it's called chaff. 
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:26:11 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: i really hope they got rid of that stupid turbine engine. I am a tanker, why is the turbine stupid? The whole thing comes out transmission and all in one lift. Takes no time at all really. It is incredibly quiet, much quieter than a diesel engine. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:32:31 AM EDT
[#3]
Diesel power packs also come out with the transmission and engine together FWIW.
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:32:32 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: oh i know. there is a reason they never made the jet car into production. each engine was near $100,000 in todays money. they are extremely expensive. A Abrams is like what? 10 million? would not be surprised if 3 million of that is just of the engine itself. sure back in the 70s conventional engines could not do the power output required but now? fuck we can make a v12 have 2000 hp easy, maybe even multi fuel just put a fucking normal engine in it already for half the cost. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Hey, now - That turbine shares the same lineage as the mighty Mopar you're driving! oh i know. there is a reason they never made the jet car into production. each engine was near $100,000 in todays money. they are extremely expensive. A Abrams is like what? 10 million? would not be surprised if 3 million of that is just of the engine itself. sure back in the 70s conventional engines could not do the power output required but now? fuck we can make a v12 have 2000 hp easy, maybe even multi fuel just put a fucking normal engine in it already for half the cost. A Abrams is not 10 million dollars. When I was a supply SGT my whole property book was only 64 million dollars. 14 SEP V2 tanks, 2 HMMWV, a M113 a, LMTV and a water trailer was the only big items. Everything else was cheap shit like chem detectors, radios and pistols and rifles. Tanks are pretty fucking cheap actually. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:49:31 AM EDT
[#5]
The value listed in the book isn’t necessarily what was spent on it, nor does it include the lifetime of spares, support and training that are often procured in a capital expenditure. Polands V3s we’re something like $20m each all up.
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Posted: 6/22/2022 2:09:17 AM EDT
[#6]
if cornpop and AOC get their way, it'll be a solar-powered EV.
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Posted: 6/22/2022 2:14:47 AM EDT
[#7]
You can only add so much steel. I wonder if some new wonder armor will be on it.
Could it be lighter? |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 2:17:20 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You can only add so much steel. I wonder if some new wonder armor will be on it. Could it be lighter? See the weird shape around the gun? They lowered the turret roof in the front but kept the gun up to not lose elevation and depression. They wanted to lose weight. The army has said before that if they really wanted it, the Abrams could shed 20% of its weight. I bet they’ve taken a good chunk out. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 8:05:58 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So they put a suppressor on an Abrams? Or is it an electric Abrams? I’m calling it now, it’s electric. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 8:18:14 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dear god don't be an EV. CHARGE!!!!!! |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 9:01:35 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think the solution is clearly 2 Hiroshima hair dryers and an LS from Texas Speed.  |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 9:04:34 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A Abrams is not 10 million dollars. When I was a supply SGT my whole property book was only 64 million dollars. 14 SEP V2 tanks, 2 HMMWV, a M113 a, LMTV and a water trailer was the only big items. Everything else was cheap shit like chem detectors, radios and pistols and rifles. Tanks are pretty fucking cheap actually. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:02:09 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought the silent killer was alzheimers And all this time I thought it was Taco Tuesday farts. 
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:04:18 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was at ft hood when they got rolled out. That's what we were told. They locked them down fairly quick. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That is the best part. I was stationed with a guy who claimed ungoverned that it would go over 80 mph. I was at ft hood when they got rolled out. That's what we were told. They locked them down fairly quick. No doubt right after some PFC took one off some really sweet jumps wide open. 
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:12:29 AM EDT
[#15]
In fairness the hull and powerpack probably only represent together less than a third of the price of the vehicle. The turrets are replaced in some of the major upgrades.
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:13:32 AM EDT
[#16]
I remember hearing once that the Abrams has thousands of pounds of copper wiring in it that could be shaved off by switching to fiber optic. Did they ever do that?
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:16:42 AM EDT
[#17]
 "New '23 Abrams are in early this year." |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:17:32 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It’d be funny if it ends up having a welded cage on top 
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:23:33 AM EDT
[#19]
Did they finally give it an apu and air conditioning?
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:28:52 AM EDT
[#20]
It must have its own drone swarm. It would be epic to tell the gunner...Gunner...enemy troops on the reverse slope of that ridgeline...switch to drone swarm and launch them...
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:32:44 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yeah, what's wrong with the turbine? The only real weakness I know of is that it consumes a lot of fuel - but being a very multi-fuel capable engine in a time where they were expecting to be retreating with supply lines that would have been getting shorter (and the ability to scrounge fuel from wherever they happened to find it), the turbine made sense. Low coolant requirements and a small size helped too. It's too bad they didn't follow through with the re-engening that got canceled with the Crusader. Same power with a lot less fuel consumption and a seamless drop-in swap. The engine management improvements have reduced fuel consumption substantially. The idle fuel consumption is still crap but making APUs standard also fixed that. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:33:09 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yeah, what's wrong with the turbine? The only real weakness I know of is that it consumes a lot of fuel - but being a very multi-fuel capable engine in a time where they were expecting to be retreating with supply lines that would have been getting shorter (and the ability to scrounge fuel from wherever they happened to find it), the turbine made sense. Low coolant requirements and a small size helped too. It's too bad they didn't follow through with the re-engening that got canceled with the Crusader. Same power with a lot less fuel consumption and a seamless drop-in swap. High fuel consumption. They require a tremendous amount of air when operating and this poses problems longer term in desert/arid conditions. The fine sand particulate is sucked up and through the V-Packs and into the turbine, thus causing damage. In the case of my M1A1 in Desert Storm, total turbine destruction. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:36:44 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: High fuel consumption. They require a tremendous amount of air when operating and this poses problems longer term in desert/arid conditions. The fine sand particulate is sucked up and through the V-Packs and into the turbine, thus causing damage. In the case of my M1A1 in Desert Storm, total turbine destruction. I’m told they’ve got much better filters now. Apparently every time they rebuild the turbines they last a little less time than the last time. And the AGT-1500 is about twice as big and thirsty as it has to be, it was designed in the 1960s. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:37:57 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I remember hearing once that the Abrams has thousands of pounds of copper wiring in it that could be shaved off by switching to fiber optic. Did they ever do that? I believe not, but I would expect that they did in this one, to move to all digital everything. Be curious to see if they use an autoloader or semi-autoloader. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:54:50 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And all this time I thought it was Taco Tuesday farts. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I thought the silent killer was alzheimers And all this time I thought it was Taco Tuesday farts. Well if you have taco Tuesday farts and Alzheimer's, you can shit your pants and forget about it |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 12:37:13 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: they belong in the air not on the ground. were the only ones that have made them work but at a needless cost. I think you are forgetting the STRV-103 and T-80. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 12:47:49 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I believe not, but I would expect that they did in this one, to move to all digital everything. Be curious to see if they use an autoloader or semi-autoloader. Would they be able to make an autoloader work with the separated, armored ammo storage. IIRC the Russians have had a bit of a problem with their autoloaders, since it resulted in filling the crew compartment with exposed cartridges just waiting to get hit by some Ukrainian rocket and become an ARFCOM GIF... |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:09:15 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Would they be able to make an autoloader work with the separated, armored ammo storage. IIRC the Russians have had a bit of a problem with their autoloaders, since it resulted in filling the crew compartment with exposed cartridges just waiting to get hit by some Ukrainian rocket and become an ARFCOM GIF... There are at least two designed from Meggit, one for a full autoloader for the existing Abrams turret, one is a semi autoloader that presents a shell of the requested type at a small hole with a miniature blast door. That promises to be lighter, faster and more safe than the existing arrangement, and you can keep your loader. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:20:40 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It is an all of the crews will be LBGTQ whatever the fuck they're called Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Dear god don't be an EV. It is an all of the crews will be LBGTQ whatever the fuck they're called What happens in the turret STAYS in the turret. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:23:02 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What happens in the turret STAYS in the turret. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Dear god don't be an EV. It is an all of the crews will be LBGTQ whatever the fuck they're called What happens in the turret STAYS in the turret.
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:31:48 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have no idea if this is what they did, but there was a proposal years ago to go with a diesel generator and electric drive train. Saved fuel, weight and maint costs. Gave you more acceleration and range. I have an Army dual axle truck with just that. Was listed as a standard Eaton Fuller manual transmission in the auction. Nope. It's still sitting in the same spot it was parked because I'm not screwing around with that shit. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:31:55 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It is an all of the crews will be LBGTQ whatever the fuck they're called Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Dear god don't be an EV. It is an all of the crews will be LBGTQ whatever the fuck they're called M-69 Fabulous? |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:48:51 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did they really do a Jeep and give it angry eyes? There has always been a shield/guard for the headlights there. The fenders are sheet metal so there has to be something there to protect the headlights. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:53:53 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have an Army dual axle truck with just that. Was listed as a standard Eaton Fuller manual transmission in the auction. Nope. It's still sitting in the same spot it was parked because I'm not screwing around with that shit. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I have no idea if this is what they did, but there was a proposal years ago to go with a diesel generator and electric drive train. Saved fuel, weight and maint costs. Gave you more acceleration and range. I have an Army dual axle truck with just that. Was listed as a standard Eaton Fuller manual transmission in the auction. Nope. It's still sitting in the same spot it was parked because I'm not screwing around with that shit. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:56:52 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What happens in the turret STAYS in the turret. Hope they put AC in this version. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 1:59:19 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think you are forgetting the STRV-103 and T-80. As I said We are the ONLY ones that have made them "work" |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 2:04:16 PM EDT
[#37]
Looks like they chopped a foot off of the height of the turret, like the Korean K2. How much will that reduce internal space for the crew?
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Posted: 6/22/2022 2:06:30 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks like they chopped a foot off of the height of the turret, like the Korean K2. How much will that reduce internal space for the crew? Loader or the other guys? |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 2:08:13 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks like they chopped a foot off of the height of the turret, like the Korean K2. How much will that reduce internal space for the crew? I could not tell you that even though I'm a Korean hardware nerd The DV27K is a sweet engine though with 1500 hp |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 4:04:19 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have no idea if this is what they did, but there was a proposal years ago to go with a diesel generator and electric drive train. Saved fuel, weight and maint costs. Gave you more acceleration and range. Interesting concept. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 4:27:40 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Interesting concept. Look at the QinetiQ EX drive. It’s the future. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 7:36:27 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: See the weird shape around the gun? They lowered the turret roof in the front but kept the gun up to not lose elevation and depression. They wanted to lose weight. The army has said before that if they really wanted it, the Abrams could shed 20% of its weight. I bet they’ve taken a good chunk out. https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/next-generation-m1-abrams-tank-teased-by-general-dynamics The main gun may be a variant of the XM360 developed for the FCS and significantly lighter than the M256. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:23:05 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They're quiet, powerful, easy to swap, and reliable. They can swap a power pack out of an Abrams in an hour. The major drawback is specific consumption but with the addition of the APU the consumption while not actually moving is greatly reduced. Still thirsty but better than it was. |
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:37:53 PM EDT
[#44]
Torque is overrated.
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Posted: 6/22/2022 11:47:56 PM EDT
[#45]
I bet it is the same chassis with upgraded powerplant, sensors and control systems. Apparently we have a ton of Abrams chassis being constantly rebuilt just to keep the factory open.
What is on everyone's wish list for abrams upgrades after watching Russian tanks blow up left and right? Here is my list: - Improved fuel economy - Faster turret and improved targeting and tracking - Missile detection and jamming. - Automatic missile/artillery defense lasers. - Targeting laser jamming chaff dispensers. - Infantry sensors that actually work in an suburban or urban environment. - Recon drones. - IED detection and jammer. - 2x Mine clearing charges. #shorter than dedicated mine clearing charges for IEDs or short and lazy mine deployment like in ukraine. - AC and satelite dish - Beer fridge. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 1:47:25 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We haven't actually built new ones in decades, they just go to Lima and get rebuilt, several times. The latest upgrade to the Abrams, the Abrams M1A2 SEPv3, consists of new build and upgraded tanks. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 6:15:06 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The latest upgrade to the Abrams, the Abrams M1A2 SEPv3, consists of new build and upgraded tanks. I didn't realize we were still making new Abrams hulls. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 10:04:09 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The most awesome part of that turbine engine is proving that horsepower is the number to look at when you need to evaluate an engine's ability to do work. 73.6 tons is moved quite nicely by an engine that makes 395 ft-lbs of torque at peak which drops to 277 ft-lbs at the 30,000 rpm speed where 1500 hp is produced. Horsepower is literally a measure of work per unit time. What else would you look at? Torque is what engines actually produce that we can measure directly. But HP has always been the measure of work done. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 10:06:27 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The latest upgrade to the Abrams, the Abrams M1A2 SEPv3, consists of new build and upgraded tanks. We built like 6k hulls in the 80s. We only keep 1500 or so updated. |
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Posted: 6/23/2022 10:10:30 AM EDT
[#50]
But why.
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