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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:26:29 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lol, everybody starts demanding resumes once the outcome doesn't match their opinions. Meanwhile the dollar general employee ID flashed by 1andy2 and abakan are A-OK if the narrative is correct. You sure do think about me alot for someone who acts like my opinion shouldn't matter. 
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:29:25 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I haven't spent much time under rocket attack risk, but some of the people you're lecturing have been at real threat of death. It takes a lack of awareness to not recognize that. That's the point you missed. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Almost nobody wants to join a hot war, but there are plenty in these threads that have put their necks out more than a guy burning $20k an hour to drop PGMs on goat herders. Sorry guy, can only play the teams on the schedule. Perhaps you should cope harder. I haven't spent much time under rocket attack risk, but some of the people you're lecturing have been at real threat of death. It takes a lack of awareness to not recognize that. That's the point you missed. And some of those arguing on the other side have faced rocket attacks as well. My own Purple Heart attests to the efficiency of katusha rockets. So it’s your lack of awareness that assumes that those with a different opinion than you have not “seen the elephant.” How much indirect fire have YOU faced? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:30:51 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So America being nuked is fine, it just has to be for countries you deem “worth fighting for” Well okay Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Just like we got nuked in 1945-1991 during the various proxy wars and conflicts? Did Russia show the same hesitation when supporting our enemies? So because something didn’t happen means it won’t happen? Interesting take. Not worth the risk for an insignificant country like Ukraine. Plenty of other countries worth fighting for. 10% though right So America being nuked is fine, it just has to be for countries you deem “worth fighting for” Well okay Nonsense. Actions have risk to benefit ratio. Ukraine is all risk but no benefit for the US. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:31:17 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Big gov progressives like you have a lot more in common with Russia than the rest of us. Go unfuck your worthless state before wading into the deep end. Lol, unhinged. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:31:43 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lol, unhinged. Go team go! |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:31:46 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I’m saying the US will be poorer after this meeting than it was before it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So are you talking about a costly trip to take or “talking about what he will be promised while there”? I’m saying the US will be poorer after this meeting than it was before it. You’re saying whatever it takes at that moment to lash back. In this case you’ve played both sides of the position trying to make points but the one you made isn’t the one you intended. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:31:56 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My arms room is more depleted and affected by border missions than aid to Ukraine. No screeching there Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The fact that we have people screeching this hard over one european nation wanting to provide its own military hardware to another in order to better fight the Russians tells me all I need to know about certain people's actual motivations behind not wanting to help Ukraine. And its not actually about depleting our own supply or cost to our own taxpayers. My arms room is more depleted and affected by border missions than aid to Ukraine. No screeching there How? You’ve never fired a shot on the border. Y’all dump the contents of your arms room in the Rio Grand or something? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:33:12 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What’s our strategic relationship with Zimbabwe that makes them more preferred? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If I have to die in a nuclear blast I’d rather it be for Zimbabwe than Ukraine. But yes, there is a difference between fighting wars over real strategic interests and fight wars to line pocketbooks. See recent history. But this time will be different. Let’s talk in a decade when we are still paying for Ukraine. What’s our strategic relationship with Zimbabwe that makes them more preferred? A big supply of strategic minerals for a start. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:33:23 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You’re saying whatever it takes at that moment to lash back. In this case you’ve played both sides of the position trying to make points but the one you made isn’t the one you intended. Go team go! |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:35:42 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You either fail to read or comprehend when people do share. It’s one thing to disagree with their opinion, but people of folks have shared it and to pretend otherwise is intellectually dishonest. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: And like anyone else here, they can’t explain why zukraine is of such national importance to us when we are collapsing at home. Much less being able to explain the end game to this entire grift. Just “muh Russia” and supporting the current thing. That’s as deep as it gets. You either fail to read or comprehend when people do share. It’s one thing to disagree with their opinion, but people of folks have shared it and to pretend otherwise is intellectually dishonest. Ok. Please share with us the vital strategic interest of the US in Ukraine other than “killin’ Rooskies.” Please share with the class. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:35:46 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Go team go! I think you might need to do a hard reset or something. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:37:36 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: More than some dude from one of the most cucked country in Europe. Please share with us your military experience. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I’m amazed at the hubris of people who don’t know what they don’t even know, trying to explain to people who have lived this their entire life. If anyone should be ashamed, you definitely are the top of that list LOL This i a threath about F-16s, you know? You sound a bit like a triggered snowflake pretending to know shit yet you fail badly at reading, so there's that. No, I just annoyed at people who gaslight about shit they don’t know AND YOU’VE CONSTANTLY DEMONSTRATED YOU DON’T KNOW JACK OF SHIT ABOUT THE SUBJECT, BUT THAT DOESN’T STOP YOU FROM BLATHERING ON Aren’t you an artillery officer? The fuck do you know about Dutch and Danish F16s? More than some dude from one of the most cucked country in Europe. Please share with us your military experience. So what does a former navy doc know about Dutch and Danish F16s? 
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:37:44 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lol, unhinged. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:38:57 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I always laugh when posters insult someone's state and they don't even list their own. Well according to the Uke bros I’m in Russia. I’ve had so many states I don’t feel any one fits me. I could list my current state but don’t like it here. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:39:11 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would say that they are going to have to rebuild their conventional threat, which will cost them what would have been spent on their strategic capabilities. That could mean they can't build new strategic capabilities, or maintain their current capabilities. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That's not what he said. What he said, and what is true, is that Russia's pathetic conventional war in Ukraine, win or lose in that theater, will not degrade their strategic assets one iota so the concept that we are stopping Russia as a world threat in th Ukraine is rather a moronic positin. A conventional threat that is demonstratably pathetic and they will try to rebuild it regardless of where postwar lines are drawn. The only way to take that off the table is to roll tanks through Moscow which will not happen. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:40:12 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think you might need to do a hard reset or something. Go team go! Hey like I told Mr Air Force, your side won. Bask in the glory of unlimited spending in Ukraine. Own it. But also own it in ten years. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:42:31 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You're calling people like me who support the Ukrainians people fight Biden supporters, so I really don't have much sympathy. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Maybe you could save some of that energy for the posters accusing others of being Russians? But nah, being objective isn't the point with the Uke crowd. Go team go! Conversely, those who don’t support US intervention in Ukraine are called Putin supporters so we don’t have much sympathy back at you. Perhaps UKbros could concede that there are reasonable counter arguments to involvement |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:45:17 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A conventional threat that is demonstratably pathetic and they will try to rebuild it regardless of where postwar lines are drawn. The only way to take that off the table is to roll tanks through Moscow which will not happen. Or we could preemptively sacrifice Ukraine to the gods of weakness, capitulation, and appeasement for a chance that would be the end of Russia's 'terror'tory expansions. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:46:11 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So because something didn’t happen means it won’t happen? Interesting take. Not worth the risk for an insignificant country like Ukraine. Plenty of other countries worth fighting for. 10% though right I disagree with you on one point. Ukraine is insignificant to the US, but to Russia it is entirely significant. The Uke Bros fail to acknowledge that previous proxy wars were fought in far off lands, like the Middle East or Southeast Asia. The analog for this if flipped to the US side would be China flipping Mexico's government and putting a hostile state right against our borders. We would not allow that. The closest comparable previous proxy incident was the Cuban Missile crisis and we were much closer to nuclear war than anyone knew. Coupled with the Russians' paranoia about being invaded, this is extremely dangerous AND unprecedented. I greatly enjoy watching Ivan getting smoked, I want Ukraine to win, I'd like to see Putin defenestrated, but I don't want the US involved more than we already are. The only way this ends well for the US is a political solution and that probably does not result in a return to 2014 borders. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:46:23 PM EDT
[#20]
Carmel - I apologize for my part in derailing this threat from the OP topic
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:47:24 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Carmel - I apologize for my part in derailing this threat from the OP topic https://d3lcr32v2pp4l1.cloudfront.net/Pictures/2000xAny/0/2/2/93022_ukrainef16scmikemareen_shutterstock_949769.jpg Is that supposed to be a TGP on a wing station? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:48:18 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Conversely, those who don’t support US intervention in Ukraine are called Putin supporters so we don’t have much sympathy back at you. Perhaps UKbros could concede that there are reasonable counter arguments to involvement I’ve been called a Russian agent and Putin puffer for the last year and not a single Uke bro has ever came out and said that was going too far. So I say piss on all Uke bros at this point and will call it like I see it. They loved giving fire but aren’t keen on receiving it, bunch of progressive hypocrites. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:48:19 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Carmel - I apologize for my part in derailing this threat from the OP topic https://d3lcr32v2pp4l1.cloudfront.net/Pictures/2000xAny/0/2/2/93022_ukrainef16scmikemareen_shutterstock_949769.jpg No problem I can’t find any new info for updates and no clue when we’ll get real info on what and when it’s being provided so we’re all on standby no matter what. I can while the time watching Moscow issue outrage and threats over this I guess 
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:48:39 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe you could save some of that energy for the posters accusing others of being Russians? But nah, being objective isn't the point with the Uke crowd. Go team go! |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:49:18 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Carmel - I apologize for my part in derailing this threat from the OP topic https://d3lcr32v2pp4l1.cloudfront.net/Pictures/2000xAny/0/2/2/93022_ukrainef16scmikemareen_shutterstock_949769.jpg They aren’t getting shot at so doesn’t count. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:50:17 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did you skip some meds today? You're way too emotionally involved in this thread. Being called names for a year tends to do that. Now, I just call them like I see them. Ukraine has proven many so called conservatives here are just progressives. Hilarious and sad. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:50:34 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Go team go! Why don’t you list your own state for us? Or is the thought too terrifying to you? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:50:34 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ukraine was part of the USSR, and a good deal of Ukrainians didn’t want to be. Peasants’ land was seized for collective farms throughout the USSR, and resistance to it could be found throughout the country, but Ukrainian nationalism combined with opposition to collectivization likely made for especially strong opposition in Ukraine, and Stalin crushed it, deliberately, and took food away from people and left them to starve, because he was such a bastard. What about the Baltic countries? They were all forcibly “integrated” into the USSR in the late 1930s/early 1940s when Soviet troops marched into those countries and took them, and then started doing commie BS like shipping people off to Siberia and seizing private property. So much of the USSR was brought together by force, so many people, Ukrainians included, didn’t want to be a part of it, but what is a contestant for the most cruel regime in human history, bar none, used force and terror, including mass starvation, to bring them into the USSR or keep them there. Besides outspending the USSR, you have to take into account, when examining its collapse, that it was made up of so many nationalities and peoples who didn’t want to be a part of it in the first place. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: They also ignore that the Ukraine was part of the original USSR. They forget that Stalin was from Georgia. The are unable to comprehend that the USSR was more than just Russia. Ukraine was part of the USSR, and a good deal of Ukrainians didn’t want to be. Peasants’ land was seized for collective farms throughout the USSR, and resistance to it could be found throughout the country, but Ukrainian nationalism combined with opposition to collectivization likely made for especially strong opposition in Ukraine, and Stalin crushed it, deliberately, and took food away from people and left them to starve, because he was such a bastard. What about the Baltic countries? They were all forcibly “integrated” into the USSR in the late 1930s/early 1940s when Soviet troops marched into those countries and took them, and then started doing commie BS like shipping people off to Siberia and seizing private property. So much of the USSR was brought together by force, so many people, Ukrainians included, didn’t want to be a part of it, but what is a contestant for the most cruel regime in human history, bar none, used force and terror, including mass starvation, to bring them into the USSR or keep them there. Besides outspending the USSR, you have to take into account, when examining its collapse, that it was made up of so many nationalities and peoples who didn’t want to be a part of it in the first place. A good deal of Russians didn’t want their land collectivized either. Poland, the Baltics, east Germany, Hungary, etc. were taken by force during WWII. The Ukrainians were willing participants in the Revolution of 1917, the revolution starting in October in Russia and in November in Ukraine. After a few years of fighting among various factions both Russia and Ukraine became fully Marxist by 1922. So, yes, if we are taking about being commies, Ukraine is just as Commie as Russia and to conflate them with the Baltics is disingenuous. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:52:33 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why don’t you list your own state for us? Or is the thought too terrifying to you? You know, if you would have asked in an even somewhat respectful manner I’d be happy to tell you. But since you decided to act a fool, you can go piss up a rope. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:54:41 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's not the only way. Ukraine builds nukes, or joins NATO. If that doesn't happen we are probably back here again in 10 years. Or we could preemptively sacrifice Ukraine to the gods of weakness, capitulation, and appeasement for a chance that would be the end of Russia's 'terror'tory expansions. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: A conventional threat that is demonstratably pathetic and they will try to rebuild it regardless of where postwar lines are drawn. The only way to take that off the table is to roll tanks through Moscow which will not happen. Or we could preemptively sacrifice Ukraine to the gods of weakness, capitulation, and appeasement for a chance that would be the end of Russia's 'terror'tory expansions. Sacrifice Ukraine or not my circus not my monkeys? Two former communist countries fighting over territory that has traded hands multiple times over the years is our problem how? I get it that you are emotionally invested, given your wife is from there, but US taxpayer involvement must be based on pragmatic value not emotion. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:55:27 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did you skip some meds today? You're way too emotionally involved in this thread. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Maybe you could save some of that energy for the posters accusing others of being Russians? But nah, being objective isn't the point with the Uke crowd. Go team go! Lol. The irony. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:58:45 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Being called names for a year tends to do that. Now, I just call them like I see them. Ukraine has proven many so called conservatives here are just progressives. Hilarious and sad. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 3:58:46 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A good deal of Russians didn’t want their land collectivized either. Poland, the Baltics, east Germany, Hungary, etc. were taken by force during WWII. The Ukrainians were willing participants in the Revolution of 1917, the revolution starting in October in Russia and in November in Ukraine. After a few years of fighting among various factions both Russia and Ukraine became fully Marxist by 1922. So, yes, if we are taking about being commies, Ukraine is just as Commie as Russia and to conflate them with the Baltics is disingenuous. I’ll concede your point…but I’m of the opinion that Putin wouldn’t have stopped with Ukraine, or maybe after taking everything east of the Dnipro if not for all the military aid pouring in from NATO countries. I think he would have gone for Poland next if he had successfully taken all of Ukraine, or the Baltic countries if he had taken all or half of Ukraine, maybe after a brief period of allowing his forces to regroup and resupply. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:00:42 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Conversely, those who don't support US intervention in Ukraine are called Putin supporters so we don't have much sympathy back at you. Perhaps UKbros could concede that there are reasonable counter arguments to involvement I would expect in a gentleman discussion that could be done (I know me and you have had this before). I would expect those wanting that concession should also concede there are reasonable arguments for our current involvement. You might not like them, but that doesn't mean they aren't reasonable. Same is I might not like your arguments, but doesn't mean they aren't valid considerations. Every situation, especially something like this topic, has pros and cons. I would submit if you only see one or the other, that person isn't doing an objective evaluation. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:02:49 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's not the only way. Ukraine builds nukes, or joins NATO. If that doesn't happen we are probably back here again in 10 years. Or we could preemptively sacrifice Ukraine to the gods of weakness, capitulation, and appeasement for a chance that would be the end of Russia's 'terror'tory expansions. Which anyone who has ever read a book knows that works out well for us 100% of the time. 
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:03:23 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No problem I can't find any new info for updates and no clue when we'll get real info on what and when it's being provided so we're all on standby no matter what. I can while the time watching Moscow issue outrage and threats over this I guess |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:06:37 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You know, if you would have asked in an even somewhat respectful manner I’d be happy to tell you. But since you decided to act a fool, you can go piss up a rope. Quote HistoryQuoted: You know, if you would have asked in an even somewhat respectful manner I’d be happy to tell you. But since you decided to act a fool, you can go piss up a rope. You said this….about Arizona. Quoted: Big gov progressives like you have a lot more in common with Russia than the rest of us. Go unfuck your worthless state before wading into the deep end. I have friends in Arizona, I like the state when it’s cooler. I get blamed by enough people here in GD for things I have no control over when they go on their rants about Californians being behind half the evils in the world. You weren’t being respectful when you told him to go “un**** your state”. Two wrongs may not make a right, but it’s not easy to be respectful to someone who is being disrespectful. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:12:04 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I’ll concede your point…but I’m of the opinion that Putin wouldn’t have stopped with Ukraine, or maybe after taking everything east of the Dnipro if not for all the military aid pouring in from NATO countries. I think he would have gone for Poland next if he had successfully taken all of Ukraine, or the Baltic countries if he had taken all or half of Ukraine, maybe after a brief period of allowing his forces to regroup and resupply. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: A good deal of Russians didn’t want their land collectivized either. Poland, the Baltics, east Germany, Hungary, etc. were taken by force during WWII. The Ukrainians were willing participants in the Revolution of 1917, the revolution starting in October in Russia and in November in Ukraine. After a few years of fighting among various factions both Russia and Ukraine became fully Marxist by 1922. So, yes, if we are taking about being commies, Ukraine is just as Commie as Russia and to conflate them with the Baltics is disingenuous. I’ll concede your point…but I’m of the opinion that Putin wouldn’t have stopped with Ukraine, or maybe after taking everything east of the Dnipro if not for all the military aid pouring in from NATO countries. I think he would have gone for Poland next if he had successfully taken all of Ukraine, or the Baltic countries if he had taken all or half of Ukraine, maybe after a brief period of allowing his forces to regroup and resupply. So you think Putin act to invoke Art V? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:12:27 PM EDT
[#39]
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:14:48 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sacrifice Ukraine or not my circus not my monkeys? Two former communist countries fighting over territory that has traded hands multiple times over the years is our problem how? I get it that you are emotionally invested, given your wife is from there, but US taxpayer involvement must be based on pragmatic value not emotion. We sacrifice Ukraine on 2/24/22, and then when Putin starts blabbering that Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania are historically Russian areas and that they are really Russians, I can see the posters here saying "no nuclear war over Tallinn, Riga, and Vilnius." Fighting in Ukraine is the best chance of keeping Americans from dying for Tallinn, Riga, and Vilnius. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:17:46 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why don’t you list your own state for us? Or is the thought too terrifying to you? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Go team go! Why don’t you list your own state for us? Or is the thought too terrifying to you? Why? You gonna AROCK him? Perhaps you should look to your problems in California before worring about the world stage? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:18:37 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wasn't asking for sympathy, flynavy was. None needed here. I would expect in a gentleman discussion that could be done (I know me and you have had this before). I would expect those wanting that concession should also concede there are reasonable arguments for our current involvement. You might not like them, but that doesn't mean they aren't reasonable. Same is I might not like your arguments, but doesn't mean they aren't valid considerations. Every situation, especially something like this topic, has pros and cons. I would submit if you only see one or the other, that person isn't doing an objective evaluation. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Conversely, those who don't support US intervention in Ukraine are called Putin supporters so we don't have much sympathy back at you. Perhaps UKbros could concede that there are reasonable counter arguments to involvement I would expect in a gentleman discussion that could be done (I know me and you have had this before). I would expect those wanting that concession should also concede there are reasonable arguments for our current involvement. You might not like them, but that doesn't mean they aren't reasonable. Same is I might not like your arguments, but doesn't mean they aren't valid considerations. Every situation, especially something like this topic, has pros and cons. I would submit if you only see one or the other, that person isn't doing an objective evaluation. I totally agree, thank you so much. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:18:54 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You're probably to sensitive for gd. Maybe stick to team and tech so you don't get your feeling hurt. Coming from you, I’ll take the compliment. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:19:25 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wasn't asking for sympathy, flynavy was. None needed here. I would expect in a gentleman discussion that could be done (I know me and you have had this before). I would expect those wanting that concession should also concede there are reasonable arguments for our current involvement. You might not like them, but that doesn't mean they aren't reasonable. Same is I might not like your arguments, but doesn't mean they aren't valid considerations. Every situation, especially something like this topic, has pros and cons. I would submit if you only see one or the other, that person isn't doing an objective evaluation. I wasn’t asking from sympathy, certainly not from a progressive. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:21:36 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Whenever my arguments start getting refuted with my wife's family ties instead of the merits of the arguments...tells me I'm making one of those "reasonable counter arguments We sacrifice Ukraine on 2/24/22, and then when Putin starts blabbering that Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania are historically Russian areas and that they are really Russians, I can see the posters here saying "no nuclear war over Tallinn, Riga, and Vilnius." Fighting in Ukraine is the best chance of keeping Americans from dying for Tallinn, Riga, and Vilnius. I didn't say that. I said I understand, which is not a negative assertation. I understand. I get it. That is not a bad thing. Given the poor achievments of the Russians in Ukraine, I would counter that fears of invasion into other nations not a practical concern. Im am Ukrainian, on my mother's side so I completely understand the impetus to support the homeland. However, I'm also an American, born and raised, and my total allegience is to the United States. I liken this to Americans of Irish descent supporting the IRA. Yes, they were of Irish descent but they, based on emotion, supported the IRA even though the troubles were not America's problem nor affected America. I see the same motivation in current UKA supporters in the US now that I saw American IRA supporters in the US 30 years ago. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:31:05 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I didn't say that. I said I understand, which is not a negative assertation. I understand. I get it. That is not a bad thing. Given the poor achievments of the Russians in Ukraine, I would counter that fears of invasion into other nations not a practical concern. It's easy for us to say "Given the poor achievments of the Russians in Ukraine, I would counter that fears of invasion into other nations not a practical concern" in hindsight, but that misses where I said on 2/24/22. If we/the west did absolutely nothing on 2/24/22 and Putin rolls up Ukraine, we have to consider what does Putin think going forward? Does Putin think he can pull off the same BS in the Baltics? I think the chance of a Nato v Russia direct engagement is higher in that situation than the current path, which is obviously elevated some too. But that chance is elevated because Putin is evil commie filth. It only takes one to start a fight. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:31:59 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I didn't say that. I said I understand, which is not a negative assertation. I understand. I get it. That is not a bad thing. Given the poor achievments of the Russians in Ukraine, I would counter that fears of invasion into other nations not a practical concern. Should the Baltic countries spend less on their defense than they currently do or more? |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:36:49 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Giving them the tools they need to win will not only prevent US troops from fighting in Ukraine but also fighting Russian troops in Syria or anywhere else. Showing Russia a limp dick and acting like cowards will guarantee that we will be fighting them somewhere eventually. When did so many Americans puss out over Russia. I dont remember so much bed-whetting during the Cold War... Having a peace agreement might also ensure US troops don't end up fighting in Ukraine. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:44:18 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Roger that...apologize for misunderstanding. It's easy for us to say "Given the poor achievments of the Russians in Ukraine, I would counter that fears of invasion into other nations not a practical concern" in hindsight, but that misses where I said on 2/24/22. If we/the west did absolutely nothing on 2/24/22 and Putin rolls up Ukraine, we have to consider what does Putin think going forward? Does Putin think he can pull off the same BS in the Baltics? I think the chance of a Nato v Russia direct engagement is higher in that situation than the current path, which is obviously elevated some too. But that chance is elevated because Putin is evil commie filth. It only takes one to start a fight. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I didn't say that. I said I understand, which is not a negative assertation. I understand. I get it. That is not a bad thing. Given the poor achievments of the Russians in Ukraine, I would counter that fears of invasion into other nations not a practical concern. It's easy for us to say "Given the poor achievments of the Russians in Ukraine, I would counter that fears of invasion into other nations not a practical concern" in hindsight, but that misses where I said on 2/24/22. If we/the west did absolutely nothing on 2/24/22 and Putin rolls up Ukraine, we have to consider what does Putin think going forward? Does Putin think he can pull off the same BS in the Baltics? I think the chance of a Nato v Russia direct engagement is higher in that situation than the current path, which is obviously elevated some too. But that chance is elevated because Putin is evil commie filth. It only takes one to start a fight. Is Putin a commie? Not any more than other of the post cold war oligarchs are. If they are unable to take over a former client state with a supply line that is essentially zero, I would respectfully suggest that other incursions to the Baltics, or Poland, are not practical concerns. Ukraineian farmers towed off Russian APC's with their tractors when they broke down. The Russian military is a pathetic shadow of the myth of their ability during the height of the cold war. If you read "MIG Pilot," by Viktor Belenko, you see that even at the hight of Soviet strength, with the most sophisticated jets they had, pilots had to check their hydraulic fluid levels themselves for fear tehat the ground crew had siphoned the fluid off to drink. That was the height of the SOviet Union. |
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Posted: 5/20/2023 4:54:06 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is Putin a commie? Not any more than other of the post cold war oligarchs are. If they are unable to take over a former client state with a supply line that is essentially zero, I would respectfully suggest that other incursions to the Baltics, or Poland, are not practical concerns. Ukraineian farmers towed off Russian APC's with their tractors when they broke down. The Russian military is a pathetic shadow of the myth of their ability during the height of the cold war. If you read "MIG Pilot," by Viktor Belenko, you see that even at the hight of Soviet strength, with the most sophisticated jets they had, pilots had to check their hydraulic fluid levels themselves for fear tehat the ground crew had siphoned the fluid off to drink. That was the height of the SOviet Union. And yet, they tried anyways. Even tho they can't complete the conquest. Which doesn't make the couple of hundred thousand likely dead Ukrainians any less dead. Or give the displaced people their homes back. Or fix their wrecked economy. Sweden, Finland, Poland, and the Baltic countries seem to think there's some cause for practical concern with regard to Russian military capability. |
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