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Posted: 5/24/2022 5:43:01 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: And what you said shows how overwhelming with multiple avenues of communication those assets are that we have, which we are currently unable to share with Ukraine. Watching Ukraine make do with a hodgepodge of various donated artillery, dispersed and able to use commercial high bandwidth satellites from Elon to adapt is what amazes me. I'm dorky like that.  Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Originally Posted By R0N: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: My takeaway was that I'm not in any way comparing the Ukrainian artillery system to ours, as you alluded to that's a completely different ball game. The interesting part is their adaptation of using Starlink for jam resistant comms, and like you said, they cut the times down to call in fire which is causing Russian casualties. Basically digital firing data in the western world comes in the form of a K series message, that K series message can be carried over the air, via the tactical internet, via the various LINK tactical distribution systems, via traditional sat comm or the newer low earth orbit systems like MUOS (basically the militaries version of starlink) And what you said shows how overwhelming with multiple avenues of communication those assets are that we have, which we are currently unable to share with Ukraine. Watching Ukraine make do with a hodgepodge of various donated artillery, dispersed and able to use commercial high bandwidth satellites from Elon to adapt is what amazes me. I'm dorky like that. IMO, they are doing "OK", but barely that. None of that is taking anything away from them, but there is nothing special about what they are doing with comms or dissemination of targeting info. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 5:45:16 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By belted_guns: What is up with those pointy ends of the missiles? They do not look symmetrical. They are not meant to be. aids in the separation of the boosters from the main missile body. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 5:46:35 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FDC: No. If there is any major JAG interference it is for preplanned stuff. Folks need to get out of weird the GWOT mindset. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FDC: Originally Posted By AZ_Mike: Originally Posted By R0N: So I took the time to watch it, I’m not really sure what is revolutionary about their system. Systems like TACFIRE, IFSAS and AFATDS have been doing that for going on 40 years. The biggest hangup in firing indirect fire is not the technical or tactical fire direction it’s always been the coordination with the battle and airspace owners. If that was not required we can generally getting a fire mission down the guns in under a minute. The Ukrainians are basically taking the FIFI, fuck it ,fire it, approach to fire direction. They are not only assuming big sky little bullet, but also little bullet a lot of ground. I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. No. If there is any major JAG interference it is for preplanned stuff. Folks need to get out of weird the GWOT mindset. I had a JAG once step in when I was asked if they could repeat a mission on a TB, the observer reported there were wounded after the first mission. After asking if they were attempting to surrender and got a negative response, I told them change shell-fuze to shell mix, fuze mix repeat and kill them in place. Don’t know it was more me telling them to kill them in place or if it was the transmission from the observer of about wounded. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 5:47:52 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Every farmer should be looking for armor kits for tractors. This is going to be a thing for years.  I'd try to make some kind of implement to push ahead of (or mount behind and reverse) to activate the mines far in front of the tractor. Armor the cab to protect the driver from any flying shrapnel. Ersatz mine-sweeper. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 5:48:49 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By spydercomonkey: https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-zelenskyy-kyiv-0c74a0c16b834732b81e460450da3131 the governor of the Luhansk region of the Donbas said the area is facing its “most difficult time” in the eight years since separatist fighting erupted there. “The Russians are advancing in all directions at the same time. They brought over an insane number of fighters and equipment,” the governor, Serhii Haidai, wrote on Telegram. “The invaders are killing our cities, destroying everything around.” He added that Luhansk is becoming “like Mariupol.” Christ. Ukraine needs more people and more weapons right fucking now.
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CA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 5:49:55 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: OIF - operation Iraqi freedom Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CarmelBytheSea: Originally Posted By 74HC: GWB was doing much of the same thing on Iraq. OIF - operation Iraqi freedom |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 5:54:09 PM EDT
[#7]
Ok, this is fucking funny.
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:03:52 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: I had a JAG once step in when I was asked if they could repeat a mission on a TB, the observer reported there were wounded after the first mission. After asking if they were attempting to surrender and got a negative response, I told them change shell-fuze to shell mix, fuze mix repeat and kill them in place. Don’t know it was more me telling them to kill them in place or if it was the transmission from the observer of about wounded. And did you tell him to go look it up, then go fuck himself, and complete the fire mission? 
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VA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:04:34 PM EDT
[#9]
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VA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:05:12 PM EDT
[#10]
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:07:12 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Shell shocked Russians. https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/uwxet9/multiple_hits_on_russian_positions_by_ukrainian/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb Is there supposed to be a video? |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:07:40 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: I had a JAG once step in when I was asked if they could repeat a mission on a TB, the observer reported there were wounded after the first mission. After asking if they were attempting to surrender and got a negative response, I told them change shell-fuze to shell mix, fuze mix repeat and kill them in place. Don’t know it was more me telling them to kill them in place or if it was the transmission from the observer of about wounded. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Originally Posted By FDC: Originally Posted By AZ_Mike: Originally Posted By R0N: So I took the time to watch it, I’m not really sure what is revolutionary about their system. Systems like TACFIRE, IFSAS and AFATDS have been doing that for going on 40 years. The biggest hangup in firing indirect fire is not the technical or tactical fire direction it’s always been the coordination with the battle and airspace owners. If that was not required we can generally getting a fire mission down the guns in under a minute. The Ukrainians are basically taking the FIFI, fuck it ,fire it, approach to fire direction. They are not only assuming big sky little bullet, but also little bullet a lot of ground. I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. No. If there is any major JAG interference it is for preplanned stuff. Folks need to get out of weird the GWOT mindset. I had a JAG once step in when I was asked if they could repeat a mission on a TB, the observer reported there were wounded after the first mission. After asking if they were attempting to surrender and got a negative response, I told them change shell-fuze to shell mix, fuze mix repeat and kill them in place. Don’t know it was more me telling them to kill them in place or if it was the transmission from the observer of about wounded. It still shows up in training, but is going away and is good to see. JAG will always have a place, but we have good 13/08 folks and maneuver commanders who know how to do proportionate and discriminate responses. Best thing for the JAG folks-a blind fold and ear plugs. |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:09:07 PM EDT
[#13]
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NV, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:10:36 PM EDT
[#14]
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:12:59 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: Is there supposed to be a video? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Shell shocked Russians. https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/uwxet9/multiple_hits_on_russian_positions_by_ukrainian/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb Is there supposed to be a video? Sorry, they removed it, but it's in this thread posted by others, 3rd Mechanized. https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/uww5uf/artillery_from_the_3rd_mechanized_brigade_hitting/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:14:33 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By THOT_Vaccine: I see that celebrated enemy of the state Henry Kissinger poked his head out of the grave to run his corpse like tongue. The man is responsible for Vietnam. Implementing the concept of Detente with China. Pakistan's whole shitty existence. Iran falling to fundamentalists. A literal litany of super fucked, broke dicked "diplomacy" that is still killing thousands today. Everywhere from Kansas to Timbukfuckingtu. How can we not listen to his sage advice? Look at the results! Bravo |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:17:47 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 7empest: Dude is like Keith Richards or the Energizer Bunny but unlike KR and the EB Henry Kissinger is a cunt... Also he is German so.... Someone should contact Herr Kissinger and ask if he's be willing to give up 1/3 of his house to placate an invader. What an ass. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:18:39 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Every farmer should be looking for armor kits for tractors. This is going to be a thing for years. Metal detecting ground drone |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:23:55 PM EDT
[#19]
What's the standoff range of orc rockets and artillery when they're beginning to lay siege to a town or city (not including cruise missiles or air resources)?
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GA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:29:44 PM EDT
[#20]
Don't worry about Ukraine, Germany has pledged all of it's remaining ME262 and ME109 fighter planes, as well as a handful of Pz4F2 tanks.
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:36:16 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By doc540: What's the standoff range of orc rockets and artillery when they're beginning to lay siege to a town or city (not including cruise missiles or air resources)? Most of their guns and rockets 20-30 KM, but they do have some long range systems on the ground that can shoot out to about 90KM. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:41:49 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Most of their guns and rockets 20-30 KM, but they do have some long range systems on the ground that can shoot out to about 90KM. good grief  |
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USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:43:02 PM EDT
[#23]
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Posted: 5/24/2022 6:48:04 PM EDT
[#24]
Vid:
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USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 7:06:17 PM EDT
[#25]
🔥CinC AF of Ukraine General Valerii Zaluzhnyi: «French howitzers «Caesar» are already at the forefront»
    Telegram Link |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 7:12:36 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mbinky: 🔥CinC AF of Ukraine General Valerii Zaluzhnyi: «French howitzers «Caesar» are already at the forefront» https://i.postimg.cc/HL6w8nSd/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-10.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/B6txT3yD/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-12.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/TwSnQSMs/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-15.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/8CpdCMmZ/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-17.jpg Telegram Link What's the range on those? |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 7:14:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AROKIE]
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Most of their guns and rockets 20-30 KM, but they do have some long range systems on the ground that can shoot out to about 90KM. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Originally Posted By doc540: What's the standoff range of orc rockets and artillery when they're beginning to lay siege to a town or city (not including cruise missiles or air resources)? Most of their guns and rockets 20-30 KM, but they do have some long range systems on the ground that can shoot out to about 90KM. What artillery do they have that reaches 20km?? Rockets or rocket assisted I can see but no actual run of the mill 152mm can reach 20km Nvm..I guess I am wrong..some of there long barrel 152 can reach 24 km..I was actually thinking in miles instead of km |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 7:18:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: What's the range on those? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By mbinky: 🔥CinC AF of Ukraine General Valerii Zaluzhnyi: «French howitzers «Caesar» are already at the forefront» https://i.postimg.cc/HL6w8nSd/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-10.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/B6txT3yD/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-12.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/TwSnQSMs/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-15.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/8CpdCMmZ/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-17.jpg Telegram Link What's the range on those? https://www.army-technology.com/projects/caesar/ Nice system, can fire the Ogre round, how ironic. The artillery system can fire six rounds and scoot within two minutes, providing enhanced survivability. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 7:27:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AROKIE]
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: https://www.army-technology.com/projects/caesar/ Nice system, can fire the Ogre round, how ironic. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Originally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By mbinky: 🔥CinC AF of Ukraine General Valerii Zaluzhnyi: «French howitzers «Caesar» are already at the forefront» https://i.postimg.cc/HL6w8nSd/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-10.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/B6txT3yD/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-12.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/TwSnQSMs/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-15.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/8CpdCMmZ/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-17.jpg Telegram Link What's the range on those? https://www.army-technology.com/projects/caesar/ Nice system, can fire the Ogre round, how ironic. The artillery system can fire six rounds and scoot within two minutes, providing enhanced survivability. 3 rounds in 15 seconds for rapid fire is damn quick! "A unit of eight Caesar self-propelled artillery vehicles can dispense, in less than one minute, more than 1t of projectiles, 1,500 bomblets or 48 smart anti-tank munitions on targets at ranges up to 40km" That's awesome! They need more of those too |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 7:43:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2A373]
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: 3 rounds in 15 seconds for rapid fire is damn quick! "A unit of eight Caesar self-propelled artillery vehicles can dispense, in less than one minute, more than 1t of projectiles, 1,500 bomblets or 48 smart anti-tank munitions on targets at ranges up to 40km" That's awesome! They need more of those too Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Originally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By mbinky: 🔥CinC AF of Ukraine General Valerii Zaluzhnyi: «French howitzers «Caesar» are already at the forefront» https://i.postimg.cc/HL6w8nSd/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-10.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/B6txT3yD/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-12.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/TwSnQSMs/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-15.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/8CpdCMmZ/photo-2022-05-24-19-04-17.jpg Telegram Link What's the range on those? https://www.army-technology.com/projects/caesar/ Nice system, can fire the Ogre round, how ironic. The artillery system can fire six rounds and scoot within two minutes, providing enhanced survivability. 3 rounds in 15 seconds for rapid fire is damn quick! "A unit of eight Caesar self-propelled artillery vehicles can dispense, in less than one minute, more than 1t of projectiles, 1,500 bomblets or 48 smart anti-tank munitions on targets at ranges up to 40km" That's awesome! They need more of those too The 8-wheeled version is cool to watch, but the maintenance has got to be a PITA.  Danish troops firing CAESAR 8x8 self-propelled artillery system |
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USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 7:47:10 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GTLandser: Has this been posted already? "Nothing says "FUCK YOU, SPECIFICALLY" quite like drone-directed artillery. 
Jesus, that is some scary shit. Makes me think of Akira with the fucking satellite laser system. Coming soon to a future battlefield near you. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:16:26 PM EDT
[#32]
 May 24, 7:00 pm ET Russian forces have likely abandoned efforts to complete a single large encirclement of Ukrainian forces in eastern Ukraine and are instead attempting to secure smaller encirclements—enabling them to make incremental measured gains. Russian forces are likely attempting to achieve several simultaneous encirclements of small pockets of Ukrainian forces in Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts: the broader Severodonetsk area (including Rubizhne and Lysychansk), Bakhmut-Lysychansk, around Zolote (just northeast of Popasna), and around Ukrainian fortifications in Avdiivka. Russian forces have begun steadily advancing efforts in these different encirclements daily but have not achieved any major “breakthroughs” or made major progress towards their stated objectives of securing the Donetsk Oblast borders or seizing all of Donbas. Luhansk Oblast Administration Head Serhiy Haidai reported that Ukrainian forces only controlled approximately 10 percent of Luhansk Oblast as of May 15 (compared to 30 percent prior to the full-scale Russian invasion on February 24, 2022).[1] Russian forces have secured more terrain in the past week than efforts earlier in May. However, they have done so by reducing the scope of their objectives—largely abandoning operations around Izyum and concentrating on key frontline towns: Russian performance remains poor. Russian forces will additionally likely face protracted urban combat if they successfully encircle Severodonetsk (as well as in other large towns like Bakhmut), which Russian forces have struggled with throughout the war. Russian forces are committing a significant number of their troops, artillery, and aircraft to defeat Ukrainian defenders in Luhansk Oblast and are likely pulling necessary resources from the Izyum axis, defensive positions around Kharkiv City, Donetsk City, and the Zaporizhia area. Luhansk Oblast Administration Head Serhiy Haidai has previously compared Ukrainian forces in Luhansk Oblast to the previous defenders of Mariupol, which aimed to wear out Russian forces and prevent further offensive operations.[2] The UK Defense Ministry also noted that a Russian victory over Severodonetsk will only worsen Russian logistical issues and extend Russian ground lines of communication (GLOCs).[3] Russian forces are making greater advances in the past week than throughout the rest of May—but these advances remain slow, confined to smaller objectives than the Kremlin intended, and face continued Ukrainian defenses; they do not constitute a major breakthrough. Senior Kremlin officials are increasingly openly admitting that the Russian offensive in Ukraine is moving slower than anticipated and are grasping for explanations to justify the slow pace. Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu claimed that Russian operations in Ukraine are progressing slowly because Russian forces want to afford civilians the opportunity to evacuate, though Russian forces have targeted Ukrainian civilians throughout the war and repeatedly denied Ukrainian attempts to negotiate humanitarian evacuation corridors.[4] Shoigu’s statement is notably his first admission that Russian forces are behind schedule and is the first official statement on the pace of the war since Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko stated that the operation was “dragging” on May 4.[5] Russian milbloggers are criticizing Shoigu’s claimed consideration for civilians and claimed that Soviet troops would not have cared if “Nazi” civilians evacuated, part of the growing Russian nationalist reaction that the Kremlin is not doing enough to win the war in Ukraine.[6] Director of the Russian Foreign Intelligence Service Sergey Naryshkin stated that the ultimate goal of the Russian offensive is to ensure “Nazism” is “100% eradicated, or it will rear its head in a few years, and in an even uglier form.”[7] Naryshkin and Shoigu’s statements indicate that Russian officials are likely setting conditions for a protracted war in Ukraine in order to justify slower and more measured advances than initially anticipated. Forcefully mobilized servicemen from the Donetsk and Luhansk People’s Republics continued to protest the Russian and proxy military command. Servicemen of the 3rd Infantry Battalion of the 105th Infantry Regiment from the Donetsk People’s Republic (DNR) recorded a video appeal to DNR Head Denis Pushilin wherein they claimed they were mobilized on February 23 and that they have been forced to actively participate in hostilities despite their lack of military experience. The battalion stated that they served on the frontlines in Mariupol and have been redeployed to the territory of the Luhansk People’s Republic (LNR) with only 60% of their original personnel and are now dealing with severe morale issues and physical exhaustion. The battalion notably claimed that the servicemen did not go through routine medical inspection prior to service and that many are suffering from chronic illnesses that should have rendered them ineligible for service. The video appeal is consistent with numerous reports from Ukrainian and Western sources that proxy forces are largely forcibly mobilized, poorly trained, and suffering from declining morale, but is notable due to the willingness of the DNR servicemen to publicly express their discontent.  Key Takeaways Russian forces have likely abandoned efforts to encircle large Ukrainian formations in eastern Ukraine and are instead attempting to secure smaller encirclements and focus on Severodonetsk. This change in the Russian approach is enabling gradual advances—but at the cost of abandoning several intended lines of advance and abandoning the Kremlin’s intended deep encirclement of Ukrainian forces in eastern Ukraine. Ukrainian forces are likely conducting a controlled withdrawal southwest of Popasna near Bakhmut to protect Ukrainian supply lines against Russian offensives in the southeast of Bakhmut. Russian occupation authorities in Mariupol announced that they will hold war crimes trials against Ukrainian soldiers in Mariupol in a likely effort to strengthen judicial control of the city and support false Kremlin narratives of Ukrainian crimes. Russian forces are attempting to retake Ternova in northern Kharkiv Oblast and seek to stabilize defensive positions near the Russian border against the Ukrainian counteroffensive. Russian forces are forming reserves and deploying S-400 missile systems in northwest Crimea to reinforce the southern axis. Several DNR servicemen openly released a video appeal to DNR leader Denis Pushilin stating they have been forced into combat operations without proper support, indicating increasing demoralization among Russian and proxy forces.  Main effort—Eastern Ukraine (comprised of one subordinate and three supporting efforts); Subordinate main effort—Encirclement of Ukrainian troops in the cauldron between Izyum and Donetsk and Luhansk Oblasts Supporting effort 1—Mariupol; Supporting effort 2—Kharkiv City; Supporting effort 3—Southern axis. Main Effort—Eastern Ukraine Subordinate Main Effort—Southern Kharkiv, Donetsk, Luhansk Oblasts (Russian objective: Encircle Ukrainian forces in Eastern Ukraine and capture the entirety of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts, the claimed territory of Russia’s proxies in Donbas) Russian forces did not launch offensive operations south of Izyum on May 24 but continued to reconnoiter Ukrainian positions in the region.[9] The Ukrainian General Staff reported that Russian forces are likely preparing to resume an offensive toward Slovyansk and deployed additional artillery units to southern neighborhoods of Izyum.[10] Izyum City Council Deputy Maxim Strelnik claimed that over 20,000 Russian personnel in what he reported are 25 battalion tactical groups (BTGs) are preparing to resume a large encirclement of Ukrainian troops from the north.[11] ISW cannot independently confirm these Russian troop numbers or their unit structure, and Strelnik may be referencing a Ukrainian General Staff report from April 22 that twenty-five Russian BTGs were operating around Izyum.[12] The Russian units around Izyum are likely heavily degraded and it is highly unlikely Russia is operating twenty-five full strength BTGs (at 800-900 personnel per BTG, this would be 20,000-22,500 personnel in total). Many Russian personnel on this axis are likely in rear areas or not combat effective. Moreover, poor Russian tactics largely nullify the weight of numbers on this front, as Russian forces remain confined to launching narrow attacks down major roads that often do not employ more than a single BTG—at most—at a time.  Russian forces continued to prioritize attacks against Lyman rather than Slovyansk on May 24, likely to support a shallow encirclement of Ukrainian troops northwest of Severodonetsk. Pro-Russian military Telegram channels also noted that Russian and proxy forces have adopted a new strategy abandoning attacks toward Slovyansk and Barvinkove in favor of the Battle for Severodonetsk.[13] ISW previously forecasted that Russian forces would scale down their initial objectives of reaching the Donetsk Oblast border in favor of securing the Luhansk Oblast borders.[14] Donetsk People’s Republic (DNR) Head Denis Pushilin announced that Russian forces began an assault on Lyman but claimed to have only seized the northern half of the settlement.[15] ISW cannot independently confirm Pushilin’s claims. Geolocated social media videos showed that Russian forces heavily bombarded Lyman on May 23, likely in preparation for an assault on the town. Russian forces launched ground assaults on settlements approximately 20 km southwest of Severodonetsk, but have not reached the city.[16] The UK Defense Ministry noted that Russian advances towards Severodonetsk from Rubizhne and advances from the southwest remain separated by approximately 25 km, and Russian forces may be able to encircle Severodonetsk in the coming days.[17] Russian forces will likely struggle to capture the city itself, however, and Russian assaults on major urban terrain have been unable to quickly take ground throughout the war. Ukrainian forces likely conducted a controlled withdrawal southwest of Popasna to defend Ukrainian ground lines of communication (GLOCs) in Bakhmut against Russian offensives. Russian forces seized Svitlodarsk, approximately 21 km southwest of Popasna, after Ukrainian forces retreated and damaged a bridge and dam over the Myronivskyi Reservoir on May 23.[18] Ukrainian forces previously targeted the reservoir on May 14, likely in preparation for a gradual withdrawal from the area.[19] Russian forces continued to advance just northeast and east of Popasna, with social media footage showing the arrival of reinforcements to support the push toward the Lysychansk and Bakhmut highways.[20] DNR sources also claimed that Russian forces are attempting a shallow encirclement of weakening Ukrainian troops in Avdiivka, but ISW cannot confirm these claims.[21]  Supporting Effort #1—Mariupol (Russian objective: Capture Mariupol and reduce the Ukrainian defenders) Russian and proxy forces continued to “restore” Mariupol on May 24. Troops focused on demining the ruins of the city, the port, and the sea.[22] Head of the Russian National Defense Control Center Colonel-General Mikhail Mizintsev claimed on May 24 that Russian forces will open a humanitarian “green corridor” in the Black Sea to allow the safe exit of foreign ships from the Port of Mariupol on May 25.[23] Head of the Donetsk People’s Republic (DNR) Denis Pushilin stated that the DNR is developing rules and procedures for tribunals in Mariupol to try and punish Ukrainian soldiers for war crimes.[24] Pushilin’s statement notably comes the day after the first Russian soldier was found guilty in a Ukrainian war crimes trial. Mariupol’s occupation administration will likely use such tribunals to enforce their rhetorical agendas and strengthen judicial control over Mariupol and other occupied areas. Supporting Effort #2—Kharkiv City (Russian objective: Withdraw forces to the north and defend ground lines of communication (GLOCs) to Izyum) Russian forces continued to focus on maintaining and improving their positions north of Kharkiv City on May 24. The Ukrainian General Staff reported that Russian forces are conducting ground assaults on the outskirts of Ternova, a village recaptured by Ukrainian forces in early May in the far north of Kharkiv Oblast and 5 km from the international border.[25] A Russian Telegram channel claimed that Russian forces have restored control over the entirety of Ternova, and while this claim cannot be confirmed at this time, it indicates that Russian forces are focusing on retaking control of settlements near the border.[26] Russian troops additionally shelled Kharkiv City and its environs.[27] Sentinel satellite imagery from May 24 notably showed a Russian rear base constructed in Belgorod Oblast in early April within 15 km of the Ukrainian border.[28] Russian forces are likely using this and other rear bases to support operations in northern Kharkiv Oblast and seek to screen them from Ukrainian shelling.  Supporting Effort #3—Southern Axis (Objective: Defend Kherson against Ukrainian counterattacks) Russian forces continued to reinforce their positions on the Southern Axis but did not make any confirmed advances on May 24.[29] Russian troops are reportedly strengthening their grouping in Vasylivka and Kamyanske (both south of Zaporizhzhia City) in preparation for offensives to the north.[30] The Ukrainian General Staff noted that Russian troops in Crimea are forming reserves and a spokesman for the Odesa Military Administration stated that Russian forces are reportedly deploying S-400 missile systems to northwest Crimea. Russian milblogger Alexander Zhuchkovsky, however, called the situation on the Zaporizhia frontline of the Southern Axis “deplorable,” and indicated that Ukrainian artillery pressure has been effective in slowing Russian troop movements.[31] Zhuchkovsky noted that Zaporizhia Oblast is not a priority for Russian command and much of the Russian grouping in the area is comprised of reservists. His assertion is corroborated by the fact that Russian forces continued to shell Ukrainian positions in Kherson, Zaporizhia, and Dnipropetrovsk Oblasts on May 24, but did not engage in any active ground attacks.[32] Recent Ukrainian partisan actions in Zaporizhia Oblast continue to pressure Russian occupation forces, which are continuing actions to strengthen administrative control of occupied areas.[33] Occupation authorities in Kherson, Berdyansk, and Melitopol stated that both cities will be included in the ruble zone.[34]  Immediate items to watch Russian forces are likely reinforcing their grouping north of Kharkiv City to prevent further advances of the Ukrainian counteroffensive toward the Russian border. Russian forces may commit elements of the 1st Tank Army to Northern Kharkiv in the near future. The Russians will continue efforts to encircle Severodonetsk and Lysychansk at least from the south, possibly by focusing on cutting off the last highway connecting Severodonetsk-Lysychansk with the rest of Ukraine. Russian forces in Mariupol will likely shift their focus to occupational control of the city as the siege of Azovstal has concluded. Russian forces are likely preparing for Ukrainian counteroffensives and settling in for protracted operations in Southern Ukraine. |
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MA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:22:38 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GLHX2112: <------runs and hugs pet kitteh. Why do i click on these damn vids........  Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GLHX2112: <------runs and hugs pet kitteh. Why do i click on these damn vids........ Just to be 100% clear, the cats asleep at the end and not dead right? I cant tell of the guy has hung his head because he's tired or something has happened to the kitty. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:22:44 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AZ_Mike: I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AZ_Mike: Originally Posted By R0N: So I took the time to watch it, I’m not really sure what is revolutionary about their system. Systems like TACFIRE, IFSAS and AFATDS have been doing that for going on 40 years. The biggest hangup in firing indirect fire is not the technical or tactical fire direction it’s always been the coordination with the battle and airspace owners. If that was not required we can generally getting a fire mission down the guns in under a minute. The Ukrainians are basically taking the FIFI, fuck it ,fire it, approach to fire direction. They are not only assuming big sky little bullet, but also little bullet a lot of ground. I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. No we dont. JAGs would say no if there is collateral damage. JAGs were actually predictable. If the blast radius overlapped a house or civilian thing, they'd say no. They were wrong as hell, but predictable. You could plan around them. If you kept eyes on and teh bad guys moved away from abuilding, game on. The US Air Force is the only organization that can defeat US Field Artillery. They could do it with incompetence like noone else. "The bad guys are running away but the jets are 15 minutes out, but you cant clear the skies for artillery because the jets I cant track might be overhead." All at once. All over the statistical absurdity of an artillery shell hitting a fast mover and actually killing a pilot. The fact that the Ukrainians can figure it out in a month what we couldnt unravel in twenty years shows the clarity of thought that happens when your country's ass is on the line. More power to them. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:26:06 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CharlieR: No we dont. JAGs would say no if there is collateral damage. JAGs were actually predictable. If the blast radius overlapped a house or civilian thing, they'd say no. They were wrong as hell, but predictable. You could plan around them. If you kept eyes on and teh bad guys moved away from abuilding, game on. The US Air Force is the only organization that can defeat US Field Artillery. They could do it with incompetence like noone else. "The bad guys are running away but the jets are 15 minutes out, but you cant clear the skies for artillery because the jets I cant track might be overhead." All at once. All over the statistical absurdity of an artillery shell hitting a fast mover and actually killing a pilot. The fact that the Ukrainians can figure it out in a month what we couldnt unravel in twenty years shows the clarity of thought that happens when your country's ass is on the line. More power to them. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CharlieR: Originally Posted By AZ_Mike: Originally Posted By R0N: So I took the time to watch it, I’m not really sure what is revolutionary about their system. Systems like TACFIRE, IFSAS and AFATDS have been doing that for going on 40 years. The biggest hangup in firing indirect fire is not the technical or tactical fire direction it’s always been the coordination with the battle and airspace owners. If that was not required we can generally getting a fire mission down the guns in under a minute. The Ukrainians are basically taking the FIFI, fuck it ,fire it, approach to fire direction. They are not only assuming big sky little bullet, but also little bullet a lot of ground. I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. No we dont. JAGs would say no if there is collateral damage. JAGs were actually predictable. If the blast radius overlapped a house or civilian thing, they'd say no. They were wrong as hell, but predictable. You could plan around them. If you kept eyes on and teh bad guys moved away from abuilding, game on. The US Air Force is the only organization that can defeat US Field Artillery. They could do it with incompetence like noone else. "The bad guys are running away but the jets are 15 minutes out, but you cant clear the skies for artillery because the jets I cant track might be overhead." All at once. All over the statistical absurdity of an artillery shell hitting a fast mover and actually killing a pilot. The fact that the Ukrainians can figure it out in a month what we couldnt unravel in twenty years shows the clarity of thought that happens when your country's ass is on the line. More power to them. They are doing a combination of big sky, little bullet and little bullet, a lot of ground. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:27:59 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: That is because, as predicted earlier, the war is devolving into a WWI-style war of attrition. The Ukrainians proved to be much more adept at a war of maneuver, so the Russians will no longer advance beyond overwhelming Artillery coverage. Also, the Russians are not moving beyond their (limited) logistic capabilities, which is why they are essentially advancing 1-2km at a time under rolling artillery barrages. Meanwhile, the Ukrainians are in a combination Defensive fight, with external lines at near the end of their logistical lines. The Russians are throwing everything they have into maintaining an offensive to try to force either a negotiated settlement of an armistice. The goal of the Russians is to force (or have the Ukrainians forced by others) into a ceasefire before the Ukrainians integrate all of the newest donations and complete training of the 500,000 or so new troops they are fixin' to field. A good analogy would be the German Spring 1918 offensive. That is why everyone in Ukraine keep talking about the Russians being defeated between June and August and Zelensky was warning about a major Russian push in the Donbas over a month ago. Hopefully, the Ukrainian equivalent of Monash is planning the summer offensive. For using Monash in a sentence, +1. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:38:43 PM EDT
[#37]
Remember that mortar from the other day?
Pro-Putin journalist accidentally reveals position of Russian mega mortar in propaganda report... and Ukraine blows it up the next day    Aleksandr Kots was proudly showing off the 2S4 Tyulpan 240mm self-propelled heavy mortar in a propaganda report in Severodonetsk after it was moved from Mariupol. The weapon is the largest caliber mortar system in service, firing huge 288-pound F864 shells to a range of six miles. Kots' report in Rubizhne showed several angles of the giant mortar, which can also fire Smel'chak laser-guided rounds, 3B11 nuclear shells, and 308 rocket-assisted cargo shells, in his report showing off the weapon to Russians back home. But less than 24 hours after his footage was aired, the mortar was blown to pieces by Ukrainian forces, who gleefully shared footage of their scalp.  The weapon systems are designed to destroy large buildings and heavy fortifications and was developed during the Cold War  Kots (pictured) has been described as one of Putin's most 'valuable assets' and is regularly deployed as a war correspondent to spread propaganda to the Russian masses Earlier this month, the 2S4 was seen firing at the Azovstal steelworks in Mariupol where surrounded Ukrainian soldiers had been holed up. The mortar destroyed by Ukraine is believed to have previously destroyed a bridge between Lyschansk and Severodonetsk. Kots has been described as one of Putin's most 'valuable assets' and is regularly deployed as a war correspondent to spread propaganda to the Russian masses. In 2014, Putin even gave him an Order of Merit for the Fatherland medal for his 'objectivity in reporting on events in Crimea. More |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 8:42:14 PM EDT
[#38]
Those CAESAR 155mm SPH pieces will tear the Russians a new asshole, as will the AS-90 tracked SPH the British are sending. The PzH-2000 that the Germans and the (Dutch?) are sending will be even more capable. And of course the Ukrainians are doing good work with the towed M777 pieces we've been sending.
It is going to be curious to see how the Ukrainians mix and match this huge variety of equipment they are getting from so many different sources. At least all of these big guns should be able to use most NATO standard rounds. But we'll probably see a situation where one artillery battalion is equipped with the AS-90, while another in equipped with the PzH-2000, and yet another with the CAESAR. Maybe as they receive more equipment they can at least get enough guns of each type to standardize around one of the platforms within a given brigade. This mix and match hodgepodge certainly isn't the way one would want to procure equipment but this is a national emergency for them and I'm sure they'll figure out a way to make it work. Now we need to start getting some M270 MLRS or HIMARS in there. And we (as well as many other western nations0 have quite a few M109 self propelled howitzers in service or in storage. While these don't have the same high rate of fire or as much range as newer systems like the CAESAR, PzH-2000, K9 Thunder, AS-90 or other such systems, they can still pump out 4 rounds per minute. And it is pretty much the only self propelled howitzer that exists in the west in the sort of numbers that would be useful for equipping a large amount of Ukrainian artillery battalions with the same type of system. The M109 has more range, a heftier payload and an equal rate of fire to the old 2S1 122mm self propelled systems the Ukrainians use at the brigade level among their mechanized and tank brigades. Maybe we could get them enough M109s and M777/198 guns to outfit their maneuver brigades in the east and let them use the longer range PzH-2000 and CAESAR systems they will have in smaller numbers at the corps level. But they need lots of it, as fast as we can get it there. They can worry about standardization when the war is over. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:05:19 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Charging_Handle: Those CAESAR 155mm SPH pieces will tear the Russians a new asshole, as will the AS-90 tracked SPH the British are sending. The PzH-2000 that the Germans and the (Dutch?) are sending will be even more capable. And of course the Ukrainians are doing good work with the towed M777 pieces we've been sending. It is going to be curious to see how the Ukrainians mix and match this huge variety of equipment they are getting from so many different sources. At least all of these big guns should be able to use most NATO standard rounds. But we'll probably see a situation where one artillery battalion is equipped with the AS-90, while another in equipped with the PzH-2000, and yet another with the CAESAR. Maybe as they receive more equipment they can at least get enough guns of each type to standardize around one of the platforms within a given brigade. This mix and match hodgepodge certainly isn't the way one would want to procure equipment but this is a national emergency for them and I'm sure they'll figure out a way to make it work. Now we need to start getting some M270 MLRS or HIMARS in there. And we (as well as many other western nations0 have quite a few M109 self propelled howitzers in service or in storage. While these don't have the same high rate of fire or as much range as newer systems like the CAESAR, PzH-2000, K9 Thunder, AS-90 or other such systems, they can still pump out 4 rounds per minute. And it is pretty much the only self propelled howitzer that exists in the west in the sort of numbers that would be useful for equipping a large amount of Ukrainian artillery battalions with the same type of system. The M109 has more range, a heftier payload and an equal rate of fire to the old 2S1 122mm self propelled systems the Ukrainians use at the brigade level among their mechanized and tank brigades. Maybe we could get them enough M109s and M777/198 guns to outfit their maneuver brigades in the east and let them use the longer range PzH-2000 and CAESAR systems they will have in smaller numbers at the corps level. But they need lots of it, as fast as we can get it there. They can worry about standardization when the war is over. Russia has said that mlrs and himars given to Ukraine would be a redline that would mean they would have to respond militarily towards other nato countries so biden is being a pussy about giving Ukraine those..but I sure someone with balls does get them some long range rocket artillery |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:07:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Saltwater-Hillbilly]
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CharlieR: No we dont. JAGs would say no if there is collateral damage. JAGs were actually predictable. If the blast radius overlapped a house or civilian thing, they'd say no. They were wrong as hell, but predictable. You could plan around them. If you kept eyes on and teh bad guys moved away from abuilding, game on. The US Air Force is the only organization that can defeat US Field Artillery. They could do it with incompetence like noone else. "The bad guys are running away but the jets are 15 minutes out, but you cant clear the skies for artillery because the jets I cant track might be overhead." All at once. All over the statistical absurdity of an artillery shell hitting a fast mover and actually killing a pilot. The fact that the Ukrainians can figure it out in a month what we couldnt unravel in twenty years shows the clarity of thought that happens when your country's ass is on the line. More power to them. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CharlieR: Originally Posted By AZ_Mike: Originally Posted By R0N: So I took the time to watch it, I’m not really sure what is revolutionary about their system. Systems like TACFIRE, IFSAS and AFATDS have been doing that for going on 40 years. The biggest hangup in firing indirect fire is not the technical or tactical fire direction it’s always been the coordination with the battle and airspace owners. If that was not required we can generally getting a fire mission down the guns in under a minute. The Ukrainians are basically taking the FIFI, fuck it ,fire it, approach to fire direction. They are not only assuming big sky little bullet, but also little bullet a lot of ground. I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. No we dont. JAGs would say no if there is collateral damage. JAGs were actually predictable. If the blast radius overlapped a house or civilian thing, they'd say no. They were wrong as hell, but predictable. You could plan around them. If you kept eyes on and teh bad guys moved away from abuilding, game on. The US Air Force is the only organization that can defeat US Field Artillery. They could do it with incompetence like noone else. "The bad guys are running away but the jets are 15 minutes out, but you cant clear the skies for artillery because the jets I cant track might be overhead." All at once. All over the statistical absurdity of an artillery shell hitting a fast mover and actually killing a pilot. The fact that the Ukrainians can figure it out in a month what we couldnt unravel in twenty years shows the clarity of thought that happens when your country's ass is on the line. More power to them. Yep! The real frustration is when your AFATADS is linked to AMDWS and you have a spinning SENTINEL radar on the roof of the next building and can 3d depict that 1) the jets are 25 minutes out, not 15, 2) the Max ord/max alt will the 5000' below the jets, and 3) the Gun/Target Line is in the opposite direction of the jets approach quadrant, and 4) the fire mission will be rounds complete 20 minutes before CAS is on-station, and they STILL shut down the mission. 
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:07:46 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By realwar: Remember that mortar from the other day? Pro-Putin journalist accidentally reveals position of Russian mega mortar in propaganda report... and Ukraine blows it up the next day https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/05/24/17/58231785-10850089-image-a-37_1653408753784.jpg https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/05/24/17/58231783-10850089-image-a-38_1653408764945.jpg https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/05/24/17/58231813-10850089-image-m-36_1653408721612.jpg Aleksandr Kots was proudly showing off the 2S4 Tyulpan 240mm self-propelled heavy mortar in a propaganda report in Severodonetsk after it was moved from Mariupol. The weapon is the largest caliber mortar system in service, firing huge 288-pound F864 shells to a range of six miles. Kots' report in Rubizhne showed several angles of the giant mortar, which can also fire Smel'chak laser-guided rounds, 3B11 nuclear shells, and 308 rocket-assisted cargo shells, in his report showing off the weapon to Russians back home. But less than 24 hours after his footage was aired, the mortar was blown to pieces by Ukrainian forces, who gleefully shared footage of their scalp. https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/05/24/17/58231309-10850089-image-a-46_1653408839715.jpg The weapon systems are designed to destroy large buildings and heavy fortifications and was developed during the Cold War https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/05/24/17/58230309-10850089-image-a-54_1653408924567.jpg Kots (pictured) has been described as one of Putin's most 'valuable assets' and is regularly deployed as a war correspondent to spread propaganda to the Russian masses Earlier this month, the 2S4 was seen firing at the Azovstal steelworks in Mariupol where surrounded Ukrainian soldiers had been holed up. The mortar destroyed by Ukraine is believed to have previously destroyed a bridge between Lyschansk and Severodonetsk. Kots has been described as one of Putin's most 'valuable assets' and is regularly deployed as a war correspondent to spread propaganda to the Russian masses. In 2014, Putin even gave him an Order of Merit for the Fatherland medal for his 'objectivity in reporting on events in Crimea. More Yea this was stated several pages back. It's like the second time he aired something of Russia that Ukraine destroyed the next day, lol Hopefully he keeps airing more footage
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:20:19 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: Yep! The real frustration is when your AFATADS is linked to AMDWS and you have a spinning SENTINEL radar on the roof of the next building and can 3d depict that 1) the jets are 25 minutes out, not 15, the Max ord/max alt will the 5000' below the jets, and 3) the Gun/Target Line is in the opposite direction of the jets approach quadrant, and 4) the fire mission will be rounds complete 20 minutes before CAS is on-station, and they STILL shut down the mission. This is why airspace should belong to the Army. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:22:26 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NEXT23: Because they are getting their ass handed to them. They can't defend large cities in the East because they have no offensive weapons and Russians just shell the ever living f^c& out of the city and win. Russia is going to get the coast. No, they’ll be lucky to keep Mauriopol when it’s all said and done. They (the Russians) are loosing 4-1 in men and equipment. The Ukrainians are attriting them, letting them blow their load and waiting for wester systems to arrive in large #. They have 100,000’s of troops not even forward deployed yet. They are just waiting till the Russians play themselves out. Then they will pinch them off. I’ve got 25$ on it. It might be another 2-3 months but you will see. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:23:35 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: Yep! The real frustration is when your AFATADS is linked to AMDWS and you have a spinning SENTINEL radar on the roof of the next building and can 3d depict that 1) the jets are 25 minutes out, not 15, the Max ord/max alt will the 5000' below the jets, and 3) the Gun/Target Line is in the opposite direction of the jets approach quadrant, and 4) the fire mission will be rounds complete 20 minutes before CAS is on-station, and they STILL shut down the mission. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: Originally Posted By CharlieR: Originally Posted By AZ_Mike: Originally Posted By R0N: So I took the time to watch it, I’m not really sure what is revolutionary about their system. Systems like TACFIRE, IFSAS and AFATDS have been doing that for going on 40 years. The biggest hangup in firing indirect fire is not the technical or tactical fire direction it’s always been the coordination with the battle and airspace owners. If that was not required we can generally getting a fire mission down the guns in under a minute. The Ukrainians are basically taking the FIFI, fuck it ,fire it, approach to fire direction. They are not only assuming big sky little bullet, but also little bullet a lot of ground. I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. No we dont. JAGs would say no if there is collateral damage. JAGs were actually predictable. If the blast radius overlapped a house or civilian thing, they'd say no. They were wrong as hell, but predictable. You could plan around them. If you kept eyes on and teh bad guys moved away from abuilding, game on. The US Air Force is the only organization that can defeat US Field Artillery. They could do it with incompetence like noone else. "The bad guys are running away but the jets are 15 minutes out, but you cant clear the skies for artillery because the jets I cant track might be overhead." All at once. All over the statistical absurdity of an artillery shell hitting a fast mover and actually killing a pilot. The fact that the Ukrainians can figure it out in a month what we couldnt unravel in twenty years shows the clarity of thought that happens when your country's ass is on the line. More power to them. Yep! The real frustration is when your AFATADS is linked to AMDWS and you have a spinning SENTINEL radar on the roof of the next building and can 3d depict that 1) the jets are 25 minutes out, not 15, the Max ord/max alt will the 5000' below the jets, and 3) the Gun/Target Line is in the opposite direction of the jets approach quadrant, and 4) the fire mission will be rounds complete 20 minutes before CAS is on-station, and they STILL shut down the mission. That is why establishing either a TAOR or OOB is so important, you own air above the normal coordinating point, and only a few types of mission require the AOC involvement |
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NV, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:27:24 PM EDT
[#45]
Russian troops plunge through Ukraine lines in Donbas as fighting enters decisive week
https://www.militarytimes.com/flashpoints/ukraine/2022/05/24/russian-troops-plunge-through-ukraine-lines-in-donbas-as-fighting-enters-decisive-week/ A month into Russia’s Donbas offensive, Moscow’s troops were still searching for a breakthrough. That may have finally arrived. On May 18, Russian forces broke through Ukrainian lines west of the town of Popasna. Russia massed units there after capturing the town on May 8, preparing for a larger assault to drive into the open terrain to the west. Their primary objective appears to be cutting the highway leading from Bakhmut to the cities of Lysychansk and Severodonetsk, the last remaining Ukrainian outposts in Luhansk Oblast and the scene of fierce urban fighting for weeks. The situation on the ground indicates they are close to achieving this goal and the coming week will be pivotal.... |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:37:54 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1Andy2: I'd try to make some kind of implement to push ahead of (or mount behind and reverse) to activate the mines far in front of the tractor. Armor the cab to protect the driver from any flying shrapnel. Ersatz mine-sweeper. Do all that, then set it up for remote control. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:55:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Saltwater-Hillbilly]
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: That is why establishing either a TAOR or OOB is so important, you own air above the normal coordinating point, and only a few types of mission require the AOC involvement Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Originally Posted By Saltwater-Hillbilly: Originally Posted By CharlieR: Originally Posted By AZ_Mike: Originally Posted By R0N: So I took the time to watch it, I’m not really sure what is revolutionary about their system. Systems like TACFIRE, IFSAS and AFATDS have been doing that for going on 40 years. The biggest hangup in firing indirect fire is not the technical or tactical fire direction it’s always been the coordination with the battle and airspace owners. If that was not required we can generally getting a fire mission down the guns in under a minute. The Ukrainians are basically taking the FIFI, fuck it ,fire it, approach to fire direction. They are not only assuming big sky little bullet, but also little bullet a lot of ground. I've been told we have the same system with a 1-hour JAG review in the loop. No we dont. JAGs would say no if there is collateral damage. JAGs were actually predictable. If the blast radius overlapped a house or civilian thing, they'd say no. They were wrong as hell, but predictable. You could plan around them. If you kept eyes on and teh bad guys moved away from abuilding, game on. The US Air Force is the only organization that can defeat US Field Artillery. They could do it with incompetence like noone else. "The bad guys are running away but the jets are 15 minutes out, but you cant clear the skies for artillery because the jets I cant track might be overhead." All at once. All over the statistical absurdity of an artillery shell hitting a fast mover and actually killing a pilot. The fact that the Ukrainians can figure it out in a month what we couldnt unravel in twenty years shows the clarity of thought that happens when your country's ass is on the line. More power to them. Yep! The real frustration is when your AFATADS is linked to AMDWS and you have a spinning SENTINEL radar on the roof of the next building and can 3d depict that 1) the jets are 25 minutes out, not 15, the Max ord/max alt will the 5000' below the jets, and 3) the Gun/Target Line is in the opposite direction of the jets approach quadrant, and 4) the fire mission will be rounds complete 20 minutes before CAS is on-station, and they STILL shut down the mission. That is why establishing either a TAOR or OOB is so important, you own air above the normal coordinating point, and only a few types of mission require the AOC involvement Agree, and it works well in Training/Exercises. However, in combat, TICs show up in the most unexpected places (especially when your AO is larger than the State of New Hampshire), and the 48-72 hour ATO/ACO cycle is not your friend when trying to establish a TAOR or OOB on short notice! Not to mention the fact that the Air Force doesn't seem to care for the entire "Digital Clearance of Fires" concept.
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:57:11 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By gentlemanfarmer: No, they’ll be lucky to keep Mauriopol when it’s all said and done. They (the Russians) are loosing 4-1 in men and equipment. The Ukrainians are attriting them, letting them blow their load and waiting for wester systems to arrive in large #. They have 100,000’s of troops not even forward deployed yet. They are just waiting till the Russians play themselves out. Then they will pinch them off. I’ve got 25$ on it. It might be another 2-3 months but you will see. @gentlemanfarmer I’ll take that bet. I bet Ukraine doesn’t get back to pre special operation lines of control. |
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Posted: 5/24/2022 9:59:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Jack67]
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By gentlemanfarmer: No, they’ll be lucky to keep Mauriopol when it’s all said and done. They (the Russians) are loosing 4-1 in men and equipment. The Ukrainians are attriting them, letting them blow their load and waiting for wester systems to arrive in large #. They have 100,000’s of troops not even forward deployed yet. They are just waiting till the Russians play themselves out. Then they will pinch them off. I’ve got 25$ on it. It might be another 2-3 months but you will see. +1, I agree. But I think the Russians will be lucky to keep ROSTOV in the end, if the Ukrainians want it (they don't). This is already like the ETO in '43. The Urkainians are fighting where they can, holdng where they must, and the material and men are just piling up for the push later. Except it won't take a year and might well get off before winter interferes. There are SO many opportunities to create pockets and encirclements that they may bag huge numbers. Oh Snap, here's a good one from Darth Putin:
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Posted: 5/24/2022 10:04:59 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: +1, I agree. But I think the Russians will be lucky to keep ROSTOV in the end, if the Ukrainians want it (they don't). This is already like the ETO in '43. The Urkainians are fighting where they can, holdng where they must, and the material and men are just piling up for the push later. Except it won't take a year and might well get off before winter interferes. There are SO many opportunities to create pockets and encirclements that they may bag huge numbers. Oh Snap, here's a good one from Darth Putin:
Let's hope for multiple Falaiskov pockets. |
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