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ITT the cops tell the citizens that they are afraid of a well armed citizenry.
![]() The 2A exists to protect our ability to (hypothetically) wage war against the government. Part of fighting the government could (and logically should) require breaching the homes of government agents and killing them while they sleep. Stacking dudes at their weakest moments is part of war. This argument has nothing to do with Jamal and his section 8 housing or his presumed criminal history, that’s just a ruse. It’s about certain people (justifiably) worrying about protecting their loved ones against the eventual wrath of the citizens they oppress. I can’t hold that concern against them. |
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Quoted: So which ships sailed without the letter. Do you think the British once encountering such a ship without such letter would treat them as a legitimate combatant? They sailed with lots of rope in those days. View Quote |
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Quoted: First, the law utmost in this country is the US Constitution. Without that law being primary nothing else is worth the paper it's written on. Second, I twisted nothing. Armaments are all of the things that can be used to prosecute military power. That includes explosives and all of those things are exactly what the constitution covers with the words "the right of the people to keep and bear arms". Those letters aren't issued today for the plain reason that modern American government regularly and with impunity violate the rights of their citizens. Not least of which is their 2nd Amendment rights. Government, at every level, is no longer restrained by the Constitution and operates as if the people are to be ruled. View Quote |
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Quoted:
Don't be obtuse, you know the subject is not about black powder. I was in Civil War reenacting. Black powder and cannons are common. Duh! The discussion is about C-4, semtex, etc. People are here arguing for the right to make bombs and couch it under the 2A. Not ever going to happen. Stick with chewing bubble gum. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted: Still waiting for a response on this one... @Chisum Except that black powder used to shoot musket balls is an explosive. Modern powder = burns rapidly Black Powder = Low order explosive. Study more history https://historyexplorer.si.edu/resource/revolutionary-war-grenade Are you trying to say when the Founding Fathers wrote the 2nd Amendment they did not consider "Explosives" to be part of "Arms" even though explosives were used to fight the British forces? |
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Not without a lot of requirements being met including a license. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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you can literally do that now You gotta get your chemistry game on. Explosives are all around us. And I'm not saying go cook some up, you can literally go to Home Depot right now and buy explosives. |
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Quoted:
ITT the cops tell the citizens that they are afraid of a well armed citizenry. ![]() The 2A exists to protect our ability to (hypothetically) wage war against the government. Part of fighting the government could (and logically should) require breaching the homes of government agents and killing them while they sleep. Stacking dudes at their weakest moments is part of war. This argument has nothing to do with Jamal and his section 8 housing or his presumed criminal history, that’s just a ruse. It’s about certain people (justifiably) worrying about protecting their loved ones against the eventual wrath of the citizens they oppress. I can’t hold that concern against them. View Quote If it ever came to a fighting war on our own soil, there would be enough explosives to go around, probably more than we'd care to deal with. Meanwhile in the real world civil society here and now, there's absolutely no use for this stuff in circulation amongst the general population. |
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Quoted:
It has EVERYTHING to do with the rabble like Jamaal, because while you're all in your basement jerking off to your fantasies on taking on the government someday, Jamal and his buddies would be out there using the stuff against you and me. If it ever came to a fighting war on our own soil, there would be enough explosives to go around, probably more than we'd care to deal with. Meanwhile in the real world civil society here and now, there's absolutely no use for this stuff in circulation amongst the general population. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
ITT the cops tell the citizens that they are afraid of a well armed citizenry. ![]() The 2A exists to protect our ability to (hypothetically) wage war against the government. Part of fighting the government could (and logically should) require breaching the homes of government agents and killing them while they sleep. Stacking dudes at their weakest moments is part of war. This argument has nothing to do with Jamal and his section 8 housing or his presumed criminal history, that’s just a ruse. It’s about certain people (justifiably) worrying about protecting their loved ones against the eventual wrath of the citizens they oppress. I can’t hold that concern against them. If it ever came to a fighting war on our own soil, there would be enough explosives to go around, probably more than we'd care to deal with. Meanwhile in the real world civil society here and now, there's absolutely no use for this stuff in circulation amongst the general population. |
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Quoted: Nah......I'm good.......done that "Shall not be infringed" https://d.newsweek.com/en/full/701299/1103-liberia-warlords.jpg View Quote |
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I don't think the intent of "arms" in the context of the second amendment was intentionally meant to include explosives, especially in the context of bombs. However, I think the waters get a little murky when you start to introduce things like exploding projectiles, canons that fire explosive shells; basically things that would probably fall under the traditional purview of "arms". I tend to err on the side of these would be part of the 2A's purview. As to bombs, which explosive breaching charges would be, I would say no. And I voted no. View Quote |
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Quoted:
I am not being "Obtuse" I am arguing the original intent of the 2nd amendment. Study more history https://historyexplorer.si.edu/resource/revolutionary-war-grenade Are you trying to say when the Founding Fathers wrote the 2nd Amendment they did not consider "Explosives" to be part of "Arms" even though explosives were used to fight the British forces? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Quoted: Still waiting for a response on this one... @Chisum Except that black powder used to shoot musket balls is an explosive. Modern powder = burns rapidly Black Powder = Low order explosive. Study more history https://historyexplorer.si.edu/resource/revolutionary-war-grenade Are you trying to say when the Founding Fathers wrote the 2nd Amendment they did not consider "Explosives" to be part of "Arms" even though explosives were used to fight the British forces? Bomb Vessel Wikipedia |
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To avoid philosophical hypocrisy, must feel the exact same way about firearms. You've been breathing too much NY air comrade. View Quote |
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Tell us what Jamal in the section 8 apartment complex is likely to do with a breaching charge. Anything constructive? Good? Self-defensive? Probably NOT. Look, if the government wants to make these things available with the same restrictions as there are for dynamite, then go for it. Certainly not any acceptable reason for these things to be readily available to the general public. View Quote ![]() Ban fertilizer, ban ball bearings, ban pressure cookers, ban knives, ban swords, ban cars, ban straws, ban soda ![]() |
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There are multiple legitimate societal uses for firearms. Completely different category of "stuff" than explosives. This has absolutely nothing to do with what state we respectively live in. View Quote |
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Yes, and without the letter the British were free to hang you. When was the last letter issued by Congress? When was the last merchant ship allowed to have 8" guns? Oh, never. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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This is the moment I would like to point out the difference between an armed merchantman, a privateer, and a pirate is the action not the object. The letter did not allow you to arm your ship, it allowed you to capture prizes. |
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It has EVERYTHING to do with the rabble like Jamaal, because while you're all in your basement jerking off to your fantasies on taking on the government someday, Jamal and his buddies would be out there using the stuff against you and me. If it ever came to a fighting war on our own soil, there would be enough explosives to go around, probably more than we'd care to deal with. Meanwhile in the real world civil society here and now, there's absolutely no use for this stuff in circulation amongst the general population. View Quote ![]() |
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Not small arms. edit: this is pretty normal training stuff for SWAT teams View Quote If these are in the TO&E for a light infantry battalion, then they're legit under the 2A. |
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There are multiple legitimate societal uses for firearms. Completely different category of "stuff" than explosives. This has absolutely nothing to do with what state we respectively live in. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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To avoid philosophical hypocrisy, must feel the exact same way about firearms. You've been breathing too much NY air comrade. Firearms are made for killing and control, and thus they fit right into the role of Second Amendment. Explosives can be used for myriad purposes in construction, mining, farming, etc. Lots of houses in this area were only able to be constructed because explosives due to hardpan. There’s a good use for you right there. |
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Quoted: If that’s Liberia, possession of that RPG (and nearly any other sort of repeating firearm) is very illegal. View Quote The people in this thread saying their rights are being infringed because they can't buy breaching charges cash-and-carry OTC are , or have recently been, smoking crack This aint the 1920's anymore when you went with grandpappy to the hardware store to buy dynamite to blow a few stumps |
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Quoted: It was the best pic I could find to demonstrate what happens when the general populace has unrestricted access to everything...... The people in this thread saying their rights are being infringed because they can't buy breaching charges cash-and-carry OTC are , or have recently been, smoking crack This aint the 1920's anymore when you went with grandpappy to the hardware store to buy dynamite to blow a few stumps View Quote ![]() |
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Quoted:
You seriously want to live in a nation where there are revolutions every fifty years? There are plenty of third world nations where you can live that dream. I'll opt for a stable society. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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wow, we're a million miles apart I think it's time for you to dig deep, find your principles, and start donating to Moms Demand Action instead of the NRA. Nothing you've said defends the use of AR15s, standard capacity mags, or civilian firearms training. buy a shotgun We see America differently |
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It has EVERYTHING to do with the rabble like Jamaal, because while you're all in your basement jerking off to your fantasies on taking on the government someday, Jamal and his buddies would be out there using the stuff against you and me. If it ever came to a fighting war on our own soil, there would be enough explosives to go around, probably more than we'd care to deal with. Meanwhile in the real world civil society here and now, there's absolutely no use for this stuff in circulation amongst the general population. View Quote |
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Quoted:
So you are saying there are no legitimate uses for explosives? I can think of dozens. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
So you are saying there are no legitimate uses for explosives? I can think of dozens. Quoted:
There are far more industrial uses for explosives than there are for firearms. |
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All explosives should be protected by 2nd Amendment. I want some C4 or at minimum some RDX.
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Quoted:
And in those situations the government grants explosive licenses so that the stuff can be used and proper safeguards followed; mining, for instance We aren't talking about industrial explosives. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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So you are saying there are no legitimate uses for explosives? I can think of dozens. Quoted:
There are far more industrial uses for explosives than there are for firearms. ![]() |
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Quoted:
It has EVERYTHING to do with the rabble like Jamaal, because while you're all in your basement jerking off to your fantasies on taking on the government someday, Jamal and his buddies would be out there using the stuff against you and me. If it ever came to a fighting war on our own soil, there would be enough explosives to go around, probably more than we'd care to deal with. Meanwhile in the real world civil society here and now, there's absolutely no use for this stuff in circulation amongst the general population. View Quote LOL |
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And in those situations the government grants explosive licenses so that the stuff can be used and proper safeguards followed; mining, for instance We aren't talking about industrial explosives. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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So you are saying there are no legitimate uses for explosives? I can think of dozens. Quoted:
There are far more industrial uses for explosives than there are for firearms. |
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Quoted: And in those situations the government grants explosive licenses so that the stuff can be used and proper safeguards followed; mining, for instance We aren't talking about industrial explosives. View Quote “It is a violation of federal law to use this product in a manner inconsistent with its labeling.” ![]() |
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".........It's for the community." love'n every minute of it. Looks like good stuff, Make yer own.
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Quoted:
So which ships sailed without the letter. Do you think the British once encountering such a ship without such letter would treat them as a legitimate combatant? They sailed with lots of rope in those days. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted: The Letter of Marque does not constitute Congressional permission to own the vessel. It simply gave them the cover of law to engage other nationalities vessels openly, in order to potentially avoid the crime of piracy. The "government" didn't have to give them permission to own or arm it, just to use those arms in offensive operations against foreign-flagged vessels. And the largest conversion I could find was 44-guns, which puts some of those vessels as larger than most frigates, but smaller than most ships-of-the-line. Also, don't forget the capability to conduct amphibious operations with the completely legal naval infantry onboard. They might have only had 12-20 guns or so, but they were still armed for self-defense. Those ships, their crews, and their owners didn't need permission to arm them, ONLY to use them offensively. |
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Its a big reason why they stay shitholes. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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Proof you are twisting the Constitution to say what you want it to say. Being absurd doesn't make your argument correct. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted: "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms up to but not including 8" naval guns, shall not be infringed.” ![]() *WHOOOSH* |
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“What’s legal isn’t always right, and what’s right isn’t always legal.” I’ve had this discussion with friends before. It’s usually those personality types that are always concerned about “what’s the rule on this” as a way of avoiding personal responsibility for their decisions. “I was only following the rule/orders/policy/law” is a great scapegoat for poor decision making.
I’m not trying to imply that I haven’t made made my share of poor decisions, but I try to own them, and learn from them, so as not to repeat them. I do my best not to place the blame on others or circumstances. There seems to be a lot of bickering in here about semantics, and not a lot of introspect on the basic principals and beliefs of a “free” society. There seems to be a certain segment of our society that operates under a “ruling class” mentality, and has taken advantage of another segment of our society that lives by the “just tell me what to eat/think/drink/breathe so I don’t have to do it for myself” motto. They are hellbent on spreading their misery, poverty, subjugation, and violence into every city and small town in America. The most frustrating part is that they don’t even see that it’s their very own desire to have someone else be responsible for their safety that is creating their own suffering, and soon ours. I heard an interview with Mike Rowe (dirty jobs guy), where he was reminiscing about a lesson he learned on a crab boat. While retrieving the pots during a bad storm, he asked the Captain about his duty to keep his crew safe. The Captain replied that it’s the crew’s job to keep themselves safe, it’s his job to put them on the crab and keep them paid. As soon as someone takes responsibility for the safety of others, it lessens that obligation on the others, and negligent accidents happen, and people die. I’m paraphrasing of course, but having spent some time on construction sites where “safety is everyone’s job”, it really sunk in what that means. Similar logic can be applied to the police state we seem to be developing in recent years. Freedom comes with a price. And to me, that price is that I will have to learn to live with a certain amount of chaos that comes with free will. I’m ok with this, as long as I’m not deprived of my ability to stand firm against tyranny, in whatever form it may choose to enter my life. (This is my duty as a man, a husband, and a father.) If I abdicate that ability to another, thus making it “not my job”, I have effectively weakened my family and society in the process. This type of shit is really the last thing I want to be dealing with today. I’m on “vacation” and have a long list of honey do’s to get started on. I really just want to earn an honest living, live my life, love my wife, raise my boys to be honest, ethical husbands and fathers, and then die in peace as a happy (and tired) old man. Just let me do that, and there will no no trouble from me. Please, I’m asking nicely. Now...where did I put that multi-tester? |
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Quoted: You realize that many merchant vessels were armed even if not engaged in war, right? They might have only had 12-20 guns or so, but they were still armed for self-defense. Those ships, their crews, and their owners didn't need permission to arm them, ONLY to use them offensively. View Quote 14,872 guns amongst 1700 ships amounts to an average of 8 guns per Privateer. https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/navy/privateer.htm |
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I'm not talking about firearms...... I give up.....you guys are right.... I fully support your right to walk around with a fucking block of Semtex in your pocket everywhere you go...... View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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You think unrestricted access to firearms is why those countries went to shit? ![]() I give up.....you guys are right.... I fully support your right to walk around with a fucking block of Semtex in your pocket everywhere you go...... ![]() |
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You're vastly over-estimating the numbers in armament available to Privateers during the War 14,872 guns amongst 1700 ships amounts to an average of 8 guns per Privateer. https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/navy/privateer.htm View Quote |
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