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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:06:52 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dbal D2 master race. This. I own two laser eights. A Dbal and a pistol IR laser. I haven’t even taken the pistol laser out of the box.it may eventually go on my FNX nightstand gun. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:07:08 PM EDT
[#2]
I still think they're cool
 
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:09:09 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 30+ years ago there was an article in the newspaper where my neighbor was arrested in the McDonald’s parking lot with bricks of cocaine. A few nights later his house got raided. I could see them ripping up all of the insulation in his attic through the gable vent, I could hear them tossing his woodpile in the basement. I guess they generally ransacked the place. He never did any jail time beyond a week I believe but a nice guy arrived with a Rolls Royce limo and driver about 3 months later. He was inside my neighbors house for about 3 hours before leaving. He then ventured into flipping pallets. Pick up trailer loads of cracked pallets, repair them as needed and take them out to resell. The trailer would be stacked just under 16 foot high. He ended up having two workers that helped him with the carpentry repairs on the pallets. Stated he cleared $110k in cash two years in a row doing that. No idea where the money went because he lived in absolute squalor. Fast forward about 5 years I had this super bright laser pointer and I shined it through his front picture window while he was asleep watching Tv in his chair. Took a bit to wake him up by flipping the red beam past his face. When he did come to, I moved the laser to the center of his chest. He sat for about 5 seconds looking at it before jumping up to turn off all of the lights ad Tv. So I shut off the laser and watched. I was in the shadows but could see his face in the moonlight looking out various windows of his house. About 10 years later I was bullshitting with him when I bought his dads rifle from him. I came clean about the laser and he was relieved it was me. He lived all that time looking over his shoulder thinking the coke guy was going to come back for him. He eventually ended up dead of a heart attack on the side of the road while picking up firewood.  |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:12:09 PM EDT
[#4]
A few years ago I talked a couple of my older buddies into getting their carry permits and training a bit. They both bought Ruger LCR's with lasers.
Sweet Jeezus Watching them try and shoot could put you into an epaleptic fit. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:13:10 PM EDT
[#5]
I've heard one viable use for Lasers
Apparently it was useful to have visible green lasers for gate guards in Iraq/Afghanistan as the laser hitting the windshield was enough to alert most drivers they were about to fuck up badly. Side benefit- the machine gunners were aimed and set if the laser show didn't stop them. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:15:11 PM EDT
[#6]
If you want to see something really stupid watch this. I thought of this because of another thread a couple of weeks ago and I'm amazed they're apparently still in business. Sorry for linking an InRange video, it's the only place I could find someone covering their dangerous nonsense.
 Scariest Product of SHOT 2016: Trigger-Activated Light for Snipers |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:16:16 PM EDT
[#7]
I have a TLR 8 with one. Optional..on or off
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:18:56 PM EDT
[#8]
It’s a simple answer for me. I never ever liked shooting with one. Iron sights and red dots work well for me.
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:27:21 PM EDT
[#9]
I have an ancient pair of CT Grips for a 1911. Have them on my Ruger .22 for varmint duty at night.
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:29:28 PM EDT
[#10]
My dad has a crimson trace laser on his 38 special. Even with brand new batteries, you can't see the laser dot on a wall during daylight hours. The thing is useless for 12 hours out of the day.
Are there lasers made by other brands that you can see the red dot in bright daylight?? His absolutely sucks. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:31:21 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have a TLR 8 with one. Optional..on or off Good. Leave it off. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:45:12 PM EDT
[#12]
Red dots optics are better in every way.
The laser tech became outdated. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 6:57:35 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In a defensive situation they make no sense; let's point a gun, look for a dot "somewhere over there". You're attention is on looking for a fucking dot. RDS is the only way. Ironic post |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:04:30 PM EDT
[#14]
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:10:31 PM EDT
[#15]
I think I might technically have one on my 43, as it's part of my TLR6.
 Never use that feature, though. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:12:04 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Target focus is the same for RDS or a laser. If you are searching for the dot your presentation sucks I don't search for a dot. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:13:56 PM EDT
[#17]
Because iron sights rule.
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:29:35 PM EDT
[#18]
I just tried to take pics, but it is too difficult to get the camera on my phone lined up and properly focused (looking THROUGH the optic instead of AT the optic) while holding the upper pointed at a target 50 yards away.
 Regardless, so far I like it more than I dislike it (I need to see how recoil impacts zero over time). As mentioned before, I completely understand why the military would dislike it, especially over IR. But I'm not raiding a compound at 3 in the morning. Or even in comp shooting, it could have some flaws. But in civilian HD/SD, you are not shooting at a known stationary target at a known distance that you know won't shoot back or attack, while in optimal conditions. When I was out lining up my bore laser with my green laser and my optic (at 50 yards), it only took about 5 minutes of me attempting to hold up the weapon and fidget with it for me to QUICKLY appreciate how much easier it was to keep the gun on/near target without having to fully shoulder/aim it. With the sling on, it is pretty easy to keep the gun on target with one hand....which would seem FAR more relevant in a HD/SD situation if you are using an off-hand to open a door, turn on lights, grabbing/carrying a child, dialing 911/talking on the phone, applying pressure to a wound, etc. Also, since this GD, this must be explained. The laser does not REPLACE my optic, it AUGMENTS my optic. There is nothing stopping me from not using the laser. I have a bunch of Sig Romeo 4's with Quad Plex/circle reticles that replaced a lot of my Romeo 5XDR's with the standard dot/circle.  When I'm looking THROUGH my optic, outside of being within about 3 yards, my red 1 MOA center cross hair is overlayed by a green dot when my laser is on. So I'm looking at a large red (65MOA) circle with a greenish/reddish/yellowish dot in the center and the red ballistics dots below it. When I am really really close to something (like 10 feet from a wall), the green laser sits slightly above the cross hair. Side note for the ATF/Pistol brace stuff. With a Tailhook style leverage brace, it is comically easy to point/aim from the hip one handed with a laser. You don't get tired as quickly being that you are not trying to hold a large format pistol straight out and in front of your body, aligned with your eye. I've had a cheap Amazon rechargeable green laser on my .22LR for years.  |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:40:40 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In a defensive situation they make no sense; let's point a gun, look for a dot "somewhere over there". You're attention is on looking for a fucking dot. RDS is the only way. Idk in my (civilian) use, they've been somewhere between neutral and decisive. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:42:32 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If there's a guy pointing a gun at him, is he going to be looking at his chest? Other people looking at him, ie the audience, are the ones looking at that. A visual device in movies is the best use of a vis laser. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I suppose it would have a psychological effect, if you're close range. A laser would tell them "yep, that gun is pointed right at my chest!" If there's a guy pointing a gun at him, is he going to be looking at his chest? Other people looking at him, ie the audience, are the ones looking at that. A visual device in movies is the best use of a vis laser. There's enough dust in the air they don't have to look down to see it's on them. And that's assuming you don't put it in their eyes |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:45:12 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They can’t see it though. I used to have one on my patrol rifle way back in the day. Had a suspect once (20 some years ago or more) who likely didn’t speak great english, and who was not getting the hint while having an AR pointed at him, laser dot was right on him. Sweeping the laser directly into his eyes did the trick though to get him to understand that he was gonna lose if he kept it up and decided to try his luck in a gunfight. So they have their uses I suppose. A good use would be if you just have an optic with no back up irons- the laser is the backup sight. Better than nothing. The issue is that most of them are low quality, or have some poorly thought out design issues. Once upon a time I happened to do a traffic stop on one of the founders of Crimson Trace, and we got to talking about the lasers they were making for pistols. At the time their design had the laser emitter in the upper right side of the pistol grip. I had to explain that I would never buy one or recommend it, simply because they put the laser where you trigger finger would always block it if you were keeping your trigger finger off the trigger until you were ready to fire- a basic firearm safety rule. It was like they knew a lot about lasers, but not much about how people were professionally trained to shoot, and indexing your trigger finger was a foreign concept or something. I personally liked the old DBAL for IR and visible laser use, but nowadays that is out of fashion due to concerns about your opponent also having NV capability. Maybe, but plenty of people still don’t have NV, nor know how to actually use it… That's the point. Wtf. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:46:04 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well they still are a thing but now IR and bootleg powerful that will melt your eyes. The scariest pistol I've heard of doesn't shoot matter (unless you get quantum). |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:47:04 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They are still a thing just not for us poors. Get some panoramic nods and it laser The poors love lasers  After they buy all the red anodized parts from Strike Industries and feel there are sufficient Punisher skulls on their AR they usually stick an NCStar laser somewhere. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:48:40 PM EDT
[#24]
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:49:16 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's enough dust in the air they don't have to look down to see it's on them. And that's assuming you don't put it in their eyes Yup, With a green laser at night, you can DEFINALTY see the beam. I can point the laser at trees 300 yards away at night and see the beam from basically bore to branch. It is almost comical when looking through my 3x when it is really dark outside. It isn't simply a green dot overlaying my red crosshair, it is a green line extending from bore to my crosshair. (Huge benefit of 12:00 position). I can also easily see the green dot when using the white light. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 7:50:35 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My dad has a crimson trace laser on his 38 special. Even with brand new batteries, you can't see the laser dot on a wall during daylight hours. The thing is useless for 12 hours out of the day. Are there lasers made by other brands that you can see the red dot in bright daylight?? His absolutely sucks. Only 10% (ish) of my encounters have been during the daylight. And those were close enough that no sights mattered. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 8:28:36 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ironic post Possibly |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 8:31:05 PM EDT
[#28]
My wife’s bodyguard came with a laser. Only reason is because it was on clearance at PSA for 30 or 40 bucks less than the model without one.
It’s battery died years ago and never bothered replacing it. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 8:36:31 PM EDT
[#29]
I had one on my Glock until I broke it.
honestly, I never used it anyway, and it is worthless in the daylight. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 8:41:34 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My dad has a crimson trace laser on his 38 special. Even with brand new batteries, you can't see the laser dot on a wall during daylight hours. The thing is useless for 12 hours out of the day. Are there lasers made by other brands that you can see the red dot in bright daylight?? His absolutely sucks. From the horses mouth: https://www.crimsontrace.com/complete-focus/education/red-green-laser/ If you google red vs green laser, it will tell you about the human eye and different wavelengths. Basically, in bright daylight, we see green lasers a hell of a lot better than red lasers. I have green and red lasers I looked at side-by-side, there is no contest. However, green lasers are usually more expensive, and use up far more energy. If I remember correctly, between the two TLR-RM2's, the red version was something like 11 hours of laser, while the green version was something like 1.5 hours. Side question. Is this lasers and handguns or lasers on sub-guns, CQB rifles and shotties? |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 8:57:24 PM EDT
[#31]
1. With a red dot sight on your pistol they are no longer necessary.
2. AMT stopped producing the .45 Longslide mit Later sightings ( said with an Austrian accent). |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 9:00:51 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 1. With a red dot sight on your pistol they are no longer necessary. 2. AMT stopped producing the .45 Longslide mit Later sightings ( said with an Austrian accent). Cool. How do you clear a blind corner on a short room off a cramped hallway? |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 9:00:52 PM EDT
[#33]
Because they are stupid and slow
Only people who still use them are boomers who never train |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 9:01:51 PM EDT
[#34]
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:10:16 PM EDT
[#35]
A friend of mine has a Glock 36 with a guide rod laser.
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:13:33 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because they are stupid and slow Only people who still use them are boomers who never train pretty much nails it |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:14:31 PM EDT
[#37]
My work gun has both a visible and IR laser. It’s a small club, and you ain’t in it. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:18:04 PM EDT
[#38]
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:23:30 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cool. How do you clear a blind corner on a short room off a cramped hallway? First you number your numbered options, then you weigh your choices, then you divide your angles. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:27:55 PM EDT
[#40]
I kind of want one, for fun. I grew up in the 80's and thought they were the coolest thing you could have.
Maybe I should get that Gen1 Glock 17 reissue and find an old Lasermax guide rod for it. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:30:17 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: First you number your numbered options, then you weigh your choices, then you divide your angles. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Cool. How do you clear a blind corner on a short room off a cramped hallway? First you number your numbered options, then you weigh your choices, then you divide your angles. I'm just blasting the drywall and yeeting my way in. #fucktraining |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:31:03 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm just blasting the drywall and yeeting my way in. #fucktraining Writing on the wall as it was? |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:33:15 PM EDT
[#43]
They were a thing?
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:36:47 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Target focus is the same for RDS or a laser. If you are searching for the dot your presentation sucks Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: In a defensive situation they make no sense; let's point a gun, look for a dot "somewhere over there". You're attention is on looking for a fucking dot. RDS is the only way. Target focus is the same for RDS or a laser. If you are searching for the dot your presentation sucks This |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:36:57 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Snubbys with useless sights are one of the few places I can understand their use. Then again getting a gun with proper sights/optics is a much better idea. |
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Posted: 8/5/2023 10:37:36 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They were a thing? Nighttime emissions, while gross, are still satisfying. 
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Posted: 8/6/2023 12:20:48 AM EDT
[#47]
The only one I have is on my P-32.
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Posted: 8/6/2023 12:36:42 AM EDT
[#48]
Even the expensive ones are very hard to see outdoors at any distance beyond 5 yards.
At 5 yards I’m pointing without “aiming” in almost every situation. Indoors in low light maybe pick up a few yards. But how many shots farther than 5 yards are you going to have? I have two of the expensive Surefire models white-light/laser combo. The white light is more useful for aiming than the laser. |
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Posted: 8/6/2023 12:46:23 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even the expensive ones are very hard to see outdoors at any distance beyond 5 yards. At 5 yards I’m pointing without “aiming” in almost every situation. Indoors in low light maybe pick up a few yards. But how many shots farther than 5 yards are you going to have? I have two of the expensive Surefire models white-light/laser combo. The white light is more useful for aiming than the laser. It’s seven yards down my hallway. I have a 25 yard shot inside my house. |
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Posted: 8/6/2023 1:04:50 AM EDT
[#50]
Lasers have their uses - just like air soft guns do.
1. For me, if I'm holding someone at gunpoint I want to be able to see their hands and bodily movements so taking initial aim with an rds and maintaining aim with a laser while removing my firearm from the core of my vision cone can be useful. I can see a lot more without that weapon jammed in the middle of it all. It's even more true with a rifle. 2. If you find yourself shooting from a vehicle there are TONS of positions where your sights are unusable. If you have a very high brightness (PERST-4 g3 Plus) laser, you can use it to direct fire. 3. At night. If they don't have NODS, carry on. If they do, a "negligent IR discharge" makes a pretty good cookie for the baited ambush cookie jar. Maneuver warfare don't end cause the sun took a break. |
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