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Posted: 1/2/2019 11:56:46 AM EDT
[#1]
US parts shortage coming? http://www.armstek.com/
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Posted: 1/2/2019 11:57:21 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is Taiwan part of NATO or a protectorate of the USA? Why are we always the worlds policeman? |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 11:58:06 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
China has been saying this for decades. Many decades. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 11:58:36 AM EDT
[#4]
The communists stole China from the people and have been holding hostage ever since.
Formosa was where the freemen fled |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 11:59:21 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Blame the Brits for Hong Kong they are the ones who gave it up. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 11:59:59 AM EDT
[#6]
Resurrect the Sino-American Mutual Defense Treaty, formally and formerly known as Mutual Defense Treaty between the United States of America and the Republic of China.
We had this from 1955 - 1979. (Thanks, Jimmuh!!) |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:01:27 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The communists stole China from the people and have been holding hostage ever since. Formosa was where the freemen fled The situation is not as black and white as most Americans would like to fantasize it is. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:01:37 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Brilliant, so are you volunteering the USA to accept them? |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:02:26 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wonder if Taiwan has missile long-range enough to reach Three Gorge Dam. Hsiung Feng III Missile |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:02:31 PM EDT
[#10]
ROR
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:02:52 PM EDT
[#11]
Crazy Rich Asians II, digital boogaloo...
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:05:20 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not even sure China could beat Taiwan in a straight up fight. I don't think China is either, else it would have already been attempted. Now, if we REALLY had the weather machine the tinfoil crowd claims we do, we need to whip up a hurricane and wipe the PRC landfill bases out of the Spratley Island area. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:05:52 PM EDT
[#13]
If Taiwan had nukes, this would be a non-issue.
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:06:04 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The British rent expired in Hong Kong, so, they moved out according to the lease agreement. Oh and Britain got it by being the local opium dealers. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:06:36 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hong Kong was a 100 year British/Chinese treaty. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:06:37 PM EDT
[#16]
 Thousands march in Hong Kong against China 'suppression' |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:08:53 PM EDT
[#17]
China could and would defeat Taiwan but at a terrible price they can't afford to pay. For one, their Navy would cease tom exist. It would also destroy their economy as countries stop trading. The more severe the Taiwan carnage and butchery the more China will suffer consequences. China might have the largest population but it would be the largest starving nation in history.
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:09:01 PM EDT
[#18]
 Failed To Load Title  Why is China so nervous about democracy in Taiwan? | The World |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:13:08 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not sure my words had much impact on you. You would seriously see your sons dead for some fruitless war overseas? Are your sons aware that the freedom of people you don't know, who are unwilling to fight for their liberty is more important to you than your son's lives? As a father I am absolutely stunned and bewildered by your comments. Maybe the rest of us have caught on to something that you have not. Just out of curiosity when and where is it that you served? To not fight for your own freedom is foolish, you don't know what you have until it's gone, far too often the East Asian cultures have thrown away what little Freedom they had into the hands of a few, for 2,000 years Taoist have debated with confucianists and legalists over some of the unnecessary rigidity in their systems, but no one took heed. Really to me this battle is beyond America or China, is a war, it is one of the oldest Wars there is, freedom versus tyranny, calm versus chaos, Joy vs misery, hope versus fear, life versus death, a never ending circle of insanity, they are all Phantoms of each other, someday it needs to be broken on the right side of a coin. All that begins must end One day this Supreme war without a name will end, I just hope Humanity makes the right choice. Then again the right choice is always subjective Hence is why we have wars, and then tyranny tries to take over, and people do not fight to keep their freedom To not fight for your own freedom is foolish, you don't know what you have until it's gone, far too often the East Asian cultures have thrown away what little Freedom they had into the hands of a few, for 2,000 years Taoist have debated with confucianists and legalists over some of the unnecessary rigidity in their systems, but no one took heed. Really to me this battle is beyond America or China, is a war, it is one of the oldest Wars there is, freedom versus tyranny, calm versus chaos, Joy vs misery, hope versus fear, life versus death, a never ending circle of insanity, they are all Phantoms of each other, someday it needs to be broken on the right side of a coin. All that begins must end One day this Supreme war without a name will end, I just hope Humanity makes the right choice. Then again the right choice is always subjective Hence is why we have wars, and then ............ |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:13:49 PM EDT
[#20]
I know a couple of guys who used to serve in the Taiwanese and Singapore. The Taiwanese guy used to be a 5" gun crew on skimmer, the guy from Singapore was a snake eating infantryman.
One day they were talking. The guy from Singapore said "My orders were to kill 30 Chinese before I was killed". The guy from Taiwan said "you think that's something? I had to kill 6,000!" |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:16:23 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Are you willing to sacrifice your sons in a war over Taiwan? I'm not. Are you aware the majority of the population in Taiwan sees reunification with China as a good thing? It's not up to us to be the world's policemen and it will accomplish nothing but the downfall of the USA. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:16:51 PM EDT
[#22]
I've spent quite a bit of time in Taiwan over the last 18 months. Great people, humble culture and beautiful island. With that said, the situation is not nearly as clear cut as we may like.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Taiwan? No Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Don't they have a fairly decent military ? Quoted:
Quoted:
The communists stole China from the people and have been holding hostage ever since. Formosa was where the freemen fled The situation is not as black and white as most Americans would like to fantasize it is. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:17:15 PM EDT
[#23]
Nuke China over Taiwan? No thank you.
Engage in conventional war with China over Taiwan? Again- no thank you. For the same reason we didn't go into Ukraine following the Crimean invasion, it's not in our national security interest to lose thousands of men tussling with a near-peer state. If you're so inclined, feel free to join the Taiwan defense force and repel invaders... |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:18:11 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're damn right, they have to be stopped, if it was me the whole Mainland would be embargoed, I would even Ally with the Russians to make that happen Their government is soon-to-be ingsoc incarnate, they must be stopped. Eta, I'm a defacto Taoist, so perhaps I have more skin in the game then most @NickGunar Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Oh, another thing. Nuke China over Taiwan?  Their government is soon-to-be ingsoc incarnate, they must be stopped. Eta, I'm a defacto Taoist, so perhaps I have more skin in the game then most @NickGunar So let me get this straight.....you would be willing to kick off WWIII and instantly sacrifice millions of American lives and cities, our economy, basically our entire way of life and country as we know it for an attack against Taiwan? That's beyond bat shit crazy and in no way a defensible or logical position..... |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:24:18 PM EDT
[#25]
Pretty decent bet that Taiwan will handle the Beijing-nuking on its own if PRC decides it’s really fo time.
I’d love to see the retiring LA-class SSNs go to the Taiwanese. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:24:55 PM EDT
[#26]
Last July we sailed 2 US Navy Warships through Taiwan strait.
 
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:30:08 PM EDT
[#27]
Obvious nobody posting in this thread follows PACOM press releases https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3383954
 Attached File |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:30:21 PM EDT
[#28]
By sea, I think they have the ability to move 4 divisions across the strait at this point. So it might be within their means but the cost China would pay, militarily, politically and economically, would be enormous, even without direct outside intervention. Taiwan's survival depends on keeping it that way.
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:32:29 PM EDT
[#29]
This
With s bunch of these on its deck 
Is going be a huge problem for China very soon. I am all about turning Japan loose in the Wester Pacific just to fuck with Chink/NoKo/Russia |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:33:47 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
By sea, I think they have the ability to move 4 divisions across the strait at this point. So it might be within their means but the cost China would pay, |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:36:30 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/35855.htm “White House is legally obligated by the Taiwan Relations Act (TRA) to provide defensive arms and services to Taiwan, and to maintain the U.S. military's capacity to respond to any Chinese use of force against the island.” Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Is Taiwan part of NATO or a protectorate of the USA? Why are we always the worlds policeman? |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:39:49 PM EDT
[#32]
 China's reaction to Donald Trump's call with Taiwan |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:41:22 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We promised the Ukraine we would protect them from Russia if they gave up their nukes.... Lets see how that worked out. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Is Taiwan part of NATO or a protectorate of the USA? Why are we always the worlds policeman? |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:41:59 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We promised the Ukraine we would protect them from Russia if they gave up their nukes.... Lets see how that worked out.  Attached File |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:44:39 PM EDT
[#35]
It’s a good thing that you will fight for Taiwan OP
When the bullets start flying you can count on me to send you a couple of bucks for your airfare to fight for the Independence of Taiwan. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:44:58 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We promised the Ukraine we would protect them from Russia if they gave up their nukes.... Lets see how that worked out. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:51:33 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sometimes I wish I could have served but because of my site and some mild neurological impairment I can't, unless there's a draft or something, well I probably could be an auxiliary. To not fight for your own freedom is foolish, you don't know what you have until it's gone, far too often the East Asian cultures have thrown away what little Freedom they had into the hands of a few, for 2,000 years Taoist have debated with confucianists and legalists over some of the unnecessary rigidity in their systems, but no one took heed. Really to me this battle is beyond America or China, is a war, it is one of the oldest Wars there is, freedom versus tyranny, calm versus chaos, Joy vs misery, hope versus fear, life versus death, a never ending circle of insanity, they are all Phantoms of each other, someday it needs to be broken on the right side of a coin. All that begins must end One day this Supreme war without a name will end, I just hope Humanity makes the right choice. Then again the right choice is always subjective Hence is why we have wars, and then tyranny tries to take over, and people do not fight to keep their freedom To not fight for your own freedom is foolish, you don't know what you have until it's gone, far too often the East Asian cultures have thrown away what little Freedom they had into the hands of a few, for 2,000 years Taoist have debated with confucianists and legalists over some of the unnecessary rigidity in their systems, but no one took heed. Really to me this battle is beyond America or China, is a war, it is one of the oldest Wars there is, freedom versus tyranny, calm versus chaos, Joy vs misery, hope versus fear, life versus death, a never ending circle of insanity, they are all Phantoms of each other, someday it needs to be broken on the right side of a coin. All that begins must end One day this Supreme war without a name will end, I just hope Humanity makes the right choice. Then again the right choice is always subjective Hence is why we have wars, and then ............ What was Bin Laden's strategy again? To bleed the US to death by forcing it to fight a series of small low intensity conflicts. It's not the fucking liberals who send their sons to die on foreign battlefields it's the flag waving conservatives. Ever wonder why the Allied nations of WW2 all took huge left turns 18 years after the war ended? It's almost as though there weren't any replacement conservatives but what the hell at least their fathers could thump their chests and talk about bravely their sons fought. Genetic death be damned. Keep your sons at home where they will live long, worthwhile lives and have sons of their own instead of them laying dead thousands of miles from home with their bodies twisted and mutilated. You never served, not everyone can or has to so there's no shwme in that. Take it from someone who has witnessed combat and the effects it can have on destroying a family and a nation: IT'S NOT WORTH IT |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:52:55 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It wouldn't be a war over Taiwan, it would be a war against communism. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:57:07 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
if Taiwan doesn’t have nukes, it needs them. |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 12:58:38 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh, another thing. Nuke China over Taiwan? |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:03:40 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Genetic death be damned.  Attached File |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:05:20 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote History |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:09:52 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't believe the cost would be as much as people think militarily. Yes, there are antiship missiles, but the general military strength of Taiwan and the willingness of the people to die for her was lower than I expected. Now I have no idea of Taiwan's military strength or lack thereof but suffice to say that imho, we should NOT be obligated to protect those who don't take their own safety and well being seriously. I have a similar issue with regard to Seoul when people get all weak in the knees about the amount of carnage NK can inflict on the city. They have had 60+ years to mitigate the issue of having such a large portion of their people and industry being in range of artillery or short range rockets and have continued to expand in the area under the expectation that we would be their "trip wire". Now I won't knock them as they seem to be actively trying to defend themselves BUT, the whole Seoul thing baffles me. It puts us in an incredibly bad position when they have basically left their collective ass hanging out over Grand Canyon. Am I wrong? |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:10:47 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, China isn't communist and hasn't been for decades. Plus we know how well that worked out for us last time.  Attached File Jack Ma, China's richest man, is a Communist Party member |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:10:57 PM EDT
[#45]
I'll have a Coke
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:11:44 PM EDT
[#46]
One day the Chinese will just sail/fly right over there and take it over, nothing will be done.
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:12:06 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No worries, millions of Mexicans are headed this way to keep those numbers up! |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:13:42 PM EDT
[#48]
I guess vacationing in Taipei is not a good idea at this time.
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:14:26 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not trying to insult you when I say this but these are the words of a man who has no understanding of the consequences of getting involved in a war. War is an ugly nasty thing and with rare exception very little good has ever come from two groups of people killing eachother. To you and me not fighting for your freedom is insanity but for most of the world the opposite is true. Most people on this planet are subjected to enough violence on a regular basis that they have no desire to see more regardless of the consequences. We live in a sheltered world due to our success. Just like Victorian Britain fighting endless colonial wars the US is now making all the same mistakes and the end result will be the same. The end of the Empire is nigh. What was Bin Laden's strategy again? To bleed the US to death by forcing it to fight a series of small low intensity conflicts. It's not the fucking liberals who send their sons to die on foreign battlefields it's the flag waving conservatives. Ever wonder why the Allied nations of WW2 all took huge left turns 18 years after the war ended? It's almost as though there weren't any replacement conservatives but what the hell at least their fathers could thump their chests and talk about bravely their sons fought. Genetic death be damned. Keep your sons at home where they will live long, worthwhile lives and have sons of their own instead of them laying dead thousands of miles from home with their bodies twisted and mutilated. You never served, not everyone can or has to so there's no shwme in that. Take it from someone who has witnessed combat and the effects it can have on destroying a family and a nation: IT'S NOT WORTH IT I hate the price of freedom, its so damn High, sometimes costing hundreds of millions of people, is it worth It? ... it has to be. However there's one thing that always depresses me, we don't seem to change, I mean this in the regards of humanity, ever since we as a species discovered agriculture, we have been on this ride of never ending insanity, with either four outcomes in the end, either we finally win and freedom mostly wins over the Earth, or tyranny wins and all is under an Iron Fist of a few, or somehow we keep chugging along the way we are now for the next million years, perhaps the worst outcome, we completely destroy each other and the planet along with it. What bothers me most, is that I don't know, I will never live long enough to see the end of this, the outcome is still so far away, perhaps another ten thousand years. I can only think in silence |
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Posted: 1/2/2019 1:17:54 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This ^ is where I get pissed off. Now I have no idea of Taiwan's military strength or lack thereof but suffice to say that imho, we should NOT be obligated to protect those who don't take their own safety and well being seriously. I have a similar issue with regard to Seoul when people get all weak in the knees about the amount of carnage NK can inflict on the city. They have had 60+ years to mitigate the issue of having such a large portion of their people and industry being in range of artillery or short range rockets and have continued to expand in the area under the expectation that we would be their "trip wire". Now I won't knock them as they seem to be actively trying to defend themselves BUT, the whole Seoul thing baffles me. It puts us in an incredibly bad position when they have basically left their collective ass hanging out over Grand Canyon. Am I wrong? |
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