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This is the engineer tank, is that correct? What's that bump (cupola?) on the right side of the turret on top of the hull? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/59/M60A2-drives-off-LARC-60-198510513-2.JPG M60A2. It fired the 152mm Shillelagh guided missile. It didn't last very long because of technical problems. It was the same missile used by the M551 Sheridan |
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Tank Question. Could the final versions of the M-60 fire the main gun while on the move? When I was at the fire power demo at Camp Pendleton in 1988 they were firing on the move, both the main gun and the 50 cal turret. That's not definitive of course. You could fire on the move if you were on a flat, smooth road, had a good driver, had a good gunner, and had good luck. The suspension was so stiff that it precluded firing on the move like the M1 series (which has true "fire on the move" capability with a very high probability of a first round hit). |
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Ah, yes, the M60.
This 'ol 11Bravo spent much time running around the F.R.G. and Fort Polk, LA with THOSE babies. I can't remember who we rolled with in the 2nd BDE of the 5th ID, but our tanker outfits at Coleman Kaserne were the 1st and 3rd BN, 33rd AR (2nd "Iron" BDE, 3rd AD). They transitioned to the M-1's in 1985. |
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Quoted: No, that's an M60A2. You might be thinking of the CEV (M728). I got to watch those dudes fire one year and it was awesome (!) The roundThis is the engineer tank, is that correct? What's that bump (cupola?) on the right side of the turret on top of the hull? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/59/M60A2-drives-off-LARC-60-198510513-2.JPG is slow enough to see in the air and they were pounding all holy hell out of a bunch of old railroad tank cars. |
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I went to Knox in march of '96. I recall seeing bout a hundred M60 all lined up in a maintenace pen.
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Quoted: Those are AWESOME man!Quoted: OP - What did you think of the M48? If I recall correctly, Godzilla killed the crap out of those things. Godzilla has only fought JGSDF type 61s, type 74s and later on type 90s. My TC for the first half of My time with the 7TH Cav' was a Korean guy (I know your vid's are Japanese). SSG HUNG HA. He was the fuckin' shit. One day we were doing a BII layout and He kept asking me about "Wenges" (?) I was like..."SGT Ha, what ARE you talking about?" "What's a 'wenge'?"!?? He got himself ALL spun the fuck up because I couldn't understand him and finally said to me..."You know, WENGES, reh, gree, brue!" LOL!!!! He was talking about the LENSES that we used on the M-105D (Red, Green, Blue and yellow). When I finally figured out what the hell he was talking about and said..."Do you mean LENSES?" he was like "YA!...wenges!" |
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I'm not sure if it was a widespread problem (?) but, back in '84 when 1/7 Cav (My unit) was netting on the M1 we (FT Hood) lost a couple
I loved workig on them.. you could get to everything easly! Not like the M1 where you have to remove 12 guards to get to the part you need to fix. of Turret Mech's when they were leaning over the main gun breech and somehow turret power got switched on and the gun went to whatever "stab" position (Usually hull down) was last inputted. You know how fast that damn gun moves.... OH GOD YA! about crushed my hand a few times! and we were warned over and over and over. |
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Remember THESE at Holder?
Yep, I was a Tanker from 75 to 79. Driver, loader, gunner and TC. 1/13 Armor in Germany. Loved every second of it. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af249/American_Society_Of_Military_History/Exhibits/89.jpg hey we had those at knox for training! |
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4/69th Armor SPEED AND POWER Or properly translated into French "We eat pussy" |
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There are about 50 of the M60s sitting in a fenced area on Eglin AFB,near one of the ranges. I wish there was a way that I could save one.
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No, that's an M60A2. You might be thinking of the CEV (M728). I got to watch those dudes fire one year and it was awesome (!) The round
This is the engineer tank, is that correct? What's that bump (cupola?) on the right side of the turret on top of the hull? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/59/M60A2-drives-off-LARC-60-198510513-2.JPG is slow enough to see in the air and they were pounding all holy hell out of a bunch of old railroad tank cars. http://www.fsmm.org/collection_images/m728(1).jpg I guess I could've read the pic name - LOL! I like the CEV and the HESH round, or what I've read about it. Never got to see them live though. I apologize, I was remiss before - Thank you for your service! |
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Some awesome tank porn.
It is making my dick hard. Thanks for posting & congrats on 10K. And thanks for 30 years of service - I salute you. |
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how would they do against a T72? When crewed by Israelis, quite well. ETA: Did any USMC M-60s engage T-72s in Kuwait in 1991? U.S. crewed VS Soviet crewed The russians crewed 72s in DS? |
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Tank Question. Could the final versions of the M-60 fire the main gun while on the move? Hell yes it could! We had stabilization too. The M1 was/is a hell of a tank but the M60 could do one thing better. We had more main gun depression and so could fire better from defilade (is that the right word?) position. I didn't know that. The Israelis supposedly used that characteristic to great effect in the rolling terrain in the Golan Heights. I think they still use M60s. |
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I'm not sure if it was a widespread problem (?) but, back in '84 when 1/7 Cav (My unit) was netting on the M1 we (FT Hood) lost a couple
I loved workig on them.. you could get to everything easly! Not like the M1 where you have to remove 12 guards to get to the part you need to fix. of Turret Mech's when they were leaning over the main gun breech and somehow turret power got switched on and the gun went to whatever "stab" position (Usually hull down) was last inputted. You know how fast that damn gun moves.... That sucks. I was always paranoid of working over the breech like that. I would always power down the tank completely and install the elevation lock when working over the breech. If I needed more room, I'd manually elevate the gun with the hand crank and traverse the turret so the gun was over the back deck where it couldn't go all the way down. I did get beaned in the cheek pretty good one time when I was checking out a bad MRS and the dipshits inside, not 30 sec after I told them to not fucking touch the palms, did so anyways without yelling "Clear!" and the gun jumped. Almost knocked me off the back deck. Told the fuckers they can go qualify table 8 as-is because I wasn't touching their tank after that. It took a lot of willpower not to drag them out of the turret and beat their asses. |
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Quoted: The Israelis supposedly used that characteristic to great effect in the rolling terrain in the Golan Heights. I think they still use M60s. IIRC, they used heavily upgraded M4s into the 80s. |
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No, that's an M60A2. You might be thinking of the CEV (M728). I got to watch those dudes fire one year and it was awesome (!) The round
This is the engineer tank, is that correct? What's that bump (cupola?) on the right side of the turret on top of the hull? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/59/M60A2-drives-off-LARC-60-198510513-2.JPG is slow enough to see in the air and they were pounding all holy hell out of a bunch of old railroad tank cars. http://www.fsmm.org/collection_images/m728(1).jpg Damn thats a short barrel. Awsome pictures and stories! Congrats on 10K, and thank you for your service! |
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Quoted: They really weren't all that different (at least the 'A5's) from the '60's. The ONE thing I DO remember though were the seats. They wereOP - What did you think of the M48? If I recall correctly, Godzilla killed the crap out of those things. made of a steel mesh that, on a cold day, could freeze your ass through a set of BDU's, field pants AND a MOPP suit..... |
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Betther thermal sight then the M1 series and more room to sleep, plus the autobahn chair for the TC. Id rather fight an M1 with the M2 vs the M85 and the 240's vs the 219, but the M60A3 I crewed in 84-85 had its charms!
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Quoted: http://www.strategypage.com/gallery/images/tank_reef.jpg One of dozens of U.S. Cold War surplus M48 and M60 tanks dumped off the coast of Florida to create another tourist attraction. I can't wait to get out to one of these sites and dive them. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Last year in AFG the Marines we were attached to ripped out of Dwyer. The guys leaving left (60 hulled) AVLB's but the guys that replaced themQuoted: Don't the Marines still have some active M60s? M60A1 AVLB vehicles. IIRC the USMC stuck with M60's until after Desert Storm. They have M1A1's. They were concerned about how the M1A1's heavier weight would effect sealift and amphib operations. only had experience on AVBs(M1 based). I was heading into the COC one day at Leatherneck and this "gigantic" Gunny looked at me and said "Hey, are you 'treadhead'? the old guy who used to crew 60's?" I said yeah Gunny, what'cha need? They needed someone to go to Dwyer and load the bridges on the hulls and then drive the hulls onto a HETT to get them back to Leatherneck. It was great. I asked if I could just "Rommel" one back across the desert (There is NOTHING between Dwyer and Leatherneck) but they didn't want to take the chance of having to recover in it something took a shit on the old girl.... You ever think "screw their rules!" and get your own personal M60? I remember at least one member had one. I've pulled Guard Duty around them often enough. I was a Road Guard for the M16A1 & A2 versions at Fort Hood often enough. At times I think I became Paratrooper just to get away from Tread Heads. There's a VFW Post that has one of their very own out front. I have Got to take a picture of that one of these days. |
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Quoted: I've taken a LOT of naps on Banana boxes....Betther thermal sight then the M1 series and more room to sleep, plus the autobahn chair for the TC. Id rather fight an M1 with the M2 vs the M85 and the 240's vs the 219, but the M60A3 I crewed in 84-85 had its charms! |
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Not sure about "firing" on the move, but when I was at Ft. Carson in the late 70s I was assigned to work with a bunch of GS civilians retrofitting the new stabilized sighting systems on M60s. I think they were A2s. After getting everything mounted we'd take it out on the test range and lock the gun on the Will Rogers Shrine or the doors of Cheyenne Mountain and drive around like lunatics trying to screw up the aim. It would never be perfect when we stopped but it was always awful damn close!
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http://www.primeportal.net/images/m60a3mh/Night%20Firing.jpg NIGHT FIRE http://www.namsa.nato.int/gallery/systems/m60-GR-3.jpg Greek M60A3 brake test. http://images6.fotki.com/v92/photos/1/133612/1182031/M60A3_3-vi.jpg http://www.strategypage.com/gallery/images/tank_reef.jpg One of dozens of U.S. Cold War surplus M48 and M60 tanks dumped off the coast of Florida to create another tourist attraction. http://www.wallpaperpimper.com/wallpaper/Military/Tank/M60-A3-Patton-Tank-1-1024x768.jpg http://images6.fotki.com/v95/photos/1/133612/1182031/patton-vi.jpg http://images6.fotki.com/v94/photos/1/133612/1182031/M60A3_4-vi.jpg http://images6.fotki.com/v91/photos/1/133612/1182031/m60a2_2-vi.jpg Sarcastically referred to as the "Starship" by its crews due to its complexity, the M60A2 was an overall disappointment. During testing, numerous problems with the new turret arose, and production did not commence until 1973, and actually ceased in 1975. Eventually the new turrets were scrapped. Phase-out of the SHILLELAGH/M60A2 system from active Army units was completed in 1981. The "A-deuce" was essentially a failure, but provided valuable technical research in preparation for the M-1s. http://images6.fotki.com/v92/photos/1/133612/1182031/01-vi.jpg The M60A3 with Tank Thermal Sight (TTS), incorporates hybrid solid-state ballistic computer, laser rangefinder, and turret stabilization system. The tank combat full-tracked, 105mm gun M60A3 (TTS) is an improved version of its predecessor, with the addition of an improved fire control system, thermal sight device, top loading air filters, and a laser range finder. The tank combat full-tracked, 105mm gun (TTS), (M60A3), has the capability to engage the full spectrum of enemy ground targets with a variety of accurate, point and area fire weapons, incorporated with a shoot-on-the-move capability. http://images6.fotki.com/v95/photos/1/133612/1182031/sabra1-vi.jpg Sabra Main Battle Tank In the mid-80’s, the Israeli Defense Force (IDF) upgraded it’s M60 tank force. The early model M60, with the rounded turret, received a series of much needed upgrades and was renamed the Magach-7 configuration. This upgrade included thick slabs of passive armour added to the turret and hull front, armoured side skirts, new fire control and a thermal sleeve for the 105mm. A key IMI export is an upgrade program for the US-built M60A3 main battle tank (MBT). It features a 120mm gun, developed to fit the relatively small turret dimensions of older tanks. This upgrade is ideal: no machining or welding is necessary on the turret to match the 120mm with the M60. The characteristics, including dimensions, recoil force and range, are almost identical to those of the existing 105mm system. Within the turret, the only major changes are for ammunition racking and the fire control system. IMI prototype has been tested and fired. http://images6.fotki.com/v94/photos/1/133612/1182031/sabra4b-vi.jpg The Sabra Main Battle Tank is a modernised upgraded M60A3, orignally developed for a proposal to Turkey by Israel Military Industries. The Sabra upgrade package is now being marketed elsewhere internationally. The original 60s and 70s technology is replaced by new systems which will extend the life of the M60 into the next century as an effective weapon system capable of defeating modern tanks. The Sabra's main armament is a new 120mm Gun system which is interoperable with NATO weapon systems and ammunition. Similar to the gun developed for the Merkava Mark 3 main battle tank, it is mated with thermal imaging sights and the "Knight" fire control system and which provides a fire on the move capability. The 120mm gun was developed to fit the relatively small turret dimensions of older tanks. No machining or welding is necessary on the turret to match the 120mm with the M60. characteristics, including dimensions, recoil force and range, are almost identical to those of the existing 105mm system. Within the turret, the only major changes are for ammunition racking and the fire control. The enhanced turret and add-on ballistic protection improve survivability against shaped charge and kinetic projectiles. Great Thread Bro That Sabra is nice, but I always liked the M1-2000/120S modification, which put an Abrams turret on the M60 chassis. Seemed like a good idea to me, probably because I don't know anything about program development, logistics or such like. |
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Crewed both the 60A3 and the M1. If I had to go into battle I would want the M1, but always liked the look of the 60. Yes we did fire on the move in the 60 and they were roomy compared to the M1. Loved the time spent as an armor crewman. Will always remember the looks we got from the infantry as we RODE by.
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Quoted: Yeah, if it came down to a shootin' war I'd want to be back in an M1 (For all SORTS of reasons) but I'm also glad to have spent a lot ofCrewed both the 60A3 and the M1. If I had to go into battle I would want the M1, but always liked the look of the 60. Yes we did fire on the move in the 60 and they were roomy compared to the M1. Loved the time spent as an armor crewman. Will always remember the looks we got from the infantry as we RODE by. My time on a tank that was "essentially" the last evolution of WW-II technology. Like someone else said too, I always felt bad for the crunchies until we threw a track or a hub burned up.... |
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I'm not sure if it was a widespread problem (?) but, back in '84 when 1/7 Cav (My unit) was netting on the M1 we (FT Hood) lost a couple
I loved workig on them.. you could get to everything easly! Not like the M1 where you have to remove 12 guards to get to the part you need to fix. of Turret Mech's when they were leaning over the main gun breech and somehow turret power got switched on and the gun went to whatever "stab" position (Usually hull down) was last inputted. You know how fast that damn gun moves.... That sucks. I was always paranoid of working over the breech like that. I would always power down the tank completely and install the elevation lock when working over the breech. If I needed more room, I'd manually elevate the gun with the hand crank and traverse the turret so the gun was over the back deck where it couldn't go all the way down. I did get beaned in the cheek pretty good one time when I was checking out a bad MRS and the dipshits inside, not 30 sec after I told them to not fucking touch the palms, did so anyways without yelling "Clear!" and the gun jumped. Almost knocked me off the back deck. Told the fuckers they can go qualify table 8 as-is because I wasn't touching their tank after that. It took a lot of willpower not to drag them out of the turret and beat their asses. That's because you were smart. There was a young Marine from 2nd Tk Bn (loader, IIRC) a few years back that suffered serious brain injury when the main gun depressed and his head was caught between the breach block and the roof of the turret. Last I heard his parents wouldn't allow his life support to be terminated, hoping that he'll recover. Just awful. |
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The Israelis supposedly used that characteristic to great effect in the rolling terrain in the Golan Heights. I think they still use M60s. IIRC, they used heavily upgraded M4s into the 80s. The ISherman. It was up-gunned with a French 105mm main gun, among other upgrades. |
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I'm not sure if it was a widespread problem (?) but, back in '84 when 1/7 Cav (My unit) was netting on the M1 we (FT Hood) lost a couple
I loved workig on them.. you could get to everything easly! Not like the M1 where you have to remove 12 guards to get to the part you need to fix. of Turret Mech's when they were leaning over the main gun breech and somehow turret power got switched on and the gun went to whatever "stab" position (Usually hull down) was last inputted. You know how fast that damn gun moves.... That sucks. I was always paranoid of working over the breech like that. I would always power down the tank completely and install the elevation lock when working over the breech. If I needed more room, I'd manually elevate the gun with the hand crank and traverse the turret so the gun was over the back deck where it couldn't go all the way down. I did get beaned in the cheek pretty good one time when I was checking out a bad MRS and the dipshits inside, not 30 sec after I told them to not fucking touch the palms, did so anyways without yelling "Clear!" and the gun jumped. Almost knocked me off the back deck. Told the fuckers they can go qualify table 8 as-is because I wasn't touching their tank after that. It took a lot of willpower not to drag them out of the turret and beat their asses. That's because you were smart. There was a young Marine from 2nd Tk Bn (loader, IIRC) a few years back that suffered serious brain injury when the main gun depressed and his head was caught between the breach block and the roof of the turret. Last I heard his parents wouldn't allow his life support to be terminated, hoping that he'll recover. Just awful. hey cgrant26 you were a turret rat too? 45E/N here! |
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http://www.strategypage.com/gallery/images/tank_reef.jpg One of dozens of U.S. Cold War surplus M48 and M60 tanks dumped off the coast of Florida to create another tourist attraction. I can't wait to get out to one of these sites and dive them. As a certified diver and an ex-19E (M60A3 armor crewman) I demand to know where these lie. I absolutely have to dive them! |
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Quoted: Thank you for your service axl. I can't even begin to imagine the sort of reception you guys got coming home compared to mine.Ref the CEV, this was just after the Cambodia excursion in 1970. We removed the blade and attached mine rollers then added two .50s and two m60s to the top. Used it for minesweeps and road security. http://www.hunt101.com/watermark.php?file=604506&size=1 Most of My Drill SGT's back in '81 were vet's of Vietnam and they've been My hero's ever since. |
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Yeah, they're spooky lethal and all that but a TANK smells like DIESEL damnit! At 1,200-1,400 MTRS firing Battle-Sight APDS a '60 will fuck you up (!) Besides, a TT-8 just ain't the same if you're NOT trying to pull rounds out of the "Honeycomb" while balancing yourself on hot brass (The smells of the green shit leaking out of the L7/M68 mixed with the soles of your "Tanker" boots melting while you tried and keep your balance....sigh....). Ahh yes, the ole '60! Even though I was born well into the reign of the M1, theres just something about the M-60's... Personally I like the way they look fitted with the ERA like the USMC used them. On the subject of M-60's and APDS rounds... Is it true that some M-60 crewed used to cram a few APDS rounds in the tank well after APFSDS became the standard? I heard a while back that there were a few spaces in the tank where ONLY APDS rounds could fit! |
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Quoted: Um...I don't know (?). I crewed the '60 CONUS and I honestly don't remember us ever having fin-stabilized APDS on the menu. That "Might've" beenQuoted: Yeah, they're spooky lethal and all that but a TANK smells like DIESEL damnit! At 1,200-1,400 MTRS firing Battle-Sight APDS a '60 will fuck you up (!) Besides, a TT-8 just ain't the same if you're NOT trying to pull rounds out of the "Honeycomb" while balancing yourself on hot brass (The smells of the green shit leaking out of the L7/M68 mixed with the soles of your "Tanker" boots melting while you tried and keep your balance....sigh....). Ahh yes, the ole '60! Even though I was born well into the reign of the M1, theres just something about the M-60's... Personally I like the way they look fitted with the ERA like the USMC used them. On the subject of M-60's and APDS rounds... Is it true that some M-60 crewed used to cram a few APDS rounds in the tank well after APFSDS became the standard? I heard a while back that there were a few spaces in the tank where ONLY APDS rounds could fit! an OCONUS thing (?) We DID fire a bunch of service HEP and HEAT just before we netted on the M1 and THAT was a lot of fun but even though We had a few classes that included APFSDSDU for the M-68 I don't remember ever doing a TT-8 (On a '60) with that as choice. |
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Congrats! A-1-1 @ Knox in '81 and then my first duty station was HHC 3/33 at The Rock in Germany. A1's & 3's.
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My brother crewed '60's while in the Army before moving to the M1. He claimed the best thing about the '60 vs the M1 was an escape hatch in the bottom that was often used as a relief hole. True, or was he BS'ing me?
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My brother crewed '60's while in the Army before moving to the M1. He claimed the best thing about the '60 vs the M1 was an escape hatch in the bottom that was often used as a relief hole. True, or was he BS'ing me? Those hatches were a bitch to get back in place...also only the driver could really use it. They ditched it on the M1 for that and because it seriously wekened the bottom armor against smaller mines. BTW, our last M-60 gunnery before transitioning to M1s, we totally outscored the active unit that fired before us on their M-1IPs. The M-60A3 had, IMHO better fire control systems than the early M1s and was easier to fight in. Of course, armor and mobility wise, not so much... |
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I'm glad you're a member of AR15.com, treadhead. Congrats on your 10,000th post. That's a lot.
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I spent some time hanging off of the barrel of an M-60 stuffing a potato in the muzzle. that was a fun field problem
Congrats on 10k, DAT!
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You liked the M60? Better than the M1. Seriously?
I was on both and I strongly suspect that you are just waxing nostalgic. We tend to forget the shit and remember the good. I like the smell of Diesel, but God, I hated running PT behind M60's. I get flashbacks about it every-time I get too close to a truck. |
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