User Panel
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Quoted:
Intent. Braces aren't intended to be fired from the shoulder. If you put a brave on a pistol with the intent of firing it from the shoulder you've created an SBR. If you happen to shoulder your braced pistol, you're golden. View Quote |
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It has a smooth bore, oval bore, release only trigger, barrel part of the receiver, telescoping rifled muzzle brake, telescoping telescoping buffer tube stock that's also pinned, shoots 2 bullets at a time when pulled, requires 2 pulls to fire once, muzzle loads. what else???????? Gonna be one hell of a special weird ass gun that nobody would possibly buy!!!!
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I think Franklin Armory's announcement is the greatest
Failed To Load Title Ever. Lol. Maybe. Hope not. But think about the memes and rick roll opportunities |
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While we're all distracted by this puzzle, the deadline for comments on the federal ruling against bumpstocks and binary triggers is looming. Go make some comments. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/12/26/2017-27898/application-of-the-definition-of-machinegun-to-bump-fire-stocks-and-other-similar-devices#open-comment View Quote |
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"And" in this usage means the both the firearms would meet the definition. "Or" would mean only one "or" the other but not both. The definition is describing this and this not this or this. In the first example ANY rifle with a barrel or barrels less than 16" meets the definition. In the second example any weapon made from a rifle meets the definition only if it is not shoulder fired (that would be rifle so it must have a 16" or greater barrel) and in less than 26" in overall length. This would be arguable that you can take a rifle and cut off the stock, or put a pistol grip on it and cut the barrel to less than 16" provided it remains 26" or greater in OAL it would not be a NFA firearm. View Quote |
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haven't read the whole thread
could it be smooth bore for fin stabilised ammunition? like the SPIW? |
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That bullpup would be an SBR if it was under 26" View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted: Another example that would apply as an SBR would be a bullpup that is less that 26" OAL but still had a barrel 16" or greater. People seem to question how in the world could a rifle could have a barrel greater than 16" but still be less than 26" OAL to still be classified as an SBR. I was merely pointing out that a bullpup could easily be designed to still be an SBR even with a 16" barrel. |
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It's not going to be "special" ammo.
Who's going to build it? Who's going to be willing to buy it? |
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Quoted: That is literally the exact same thing I said. People seem to question how in the world could a rifle could have a barrel greater than 16" but still be less than 26" OAL to still be classified as an SBR. I was merely pointing out that a bullpup could easily be designed to still be an SBR even with a 16" barrel. View Quote If the recall article is true, they don't even have a letter from the ATF |
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No they don't. ATF always measures with stock in the fully extended position. And they always measure barrel length with any muzzle device removed unless it's permanently attached. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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haven't read the whole thread could it be smooth bore for fin stabilised ammunition? like the SPIW? View Quote Besides, who wants an AR that sounds like "SPIW SPIW SPIW" when they shoot it. |
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Why the hell do people like this attorney use stupid comments like "loophole"? It's either legal, or it's not. Next, the Recoil attorney will be speaking about the "gun show loophole". View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Next, the Recoil attorney will be speaking about the "gun show loophole". |
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https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ab/Gyrojet_at_National_Firearms_Museum_%28460776909%29.jpg/1200px-Gyrojet_at_National_Firearms_Museum_%28460776909%29.jpg http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/gyrojet-cover.jpg http://14544-presscdn-0-64.pagely.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/GyroJetCartridge.jpg View Quote |
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Is this going to be a pin and welded barrel extension, like the Larue SURG surly not a first but would pass NFA and be a SBR like appearance.
The picture in their press release the pic is of their current Libertas sbr so it has me thinking the Restoration might look much differently and all the speculation is based on a invalid photo. |
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Is this going to be a pin and welded barrel extension, like the Larue SURG surly not a first but would pass NFA and be a SBR like appearance. The picture in their press release the pic is of their current Libertas sbr so it has me thinking the Restoration might look much differently and all the speculation is based on a invalid photo. View Quote |
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Maybe they just ship it with a certificate stating that the employee who assembled it intended for it to be fired with one hand.
After all, the intent during design and construction is the only thing that keeps a pistol with a brace from being an SBR |
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Quoted: Someone posted earlier that Franklin has said, it is not the trigger system. View Quote A new-ish, low post count, member who reads more than he "contributes". Link to the post; with summary of what we "know". ^^^ Oooooh, I know how to hotlink too. |
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Have we done this one?
ATF definitions in shorthand: shotgun: shoulder fired and uses shotgun shell and smooth bore and fires (shot or single projectile) for each single pull rifle: shoulder fired and single projectile through rifled bore for each single pull sbr: rifle < 16" or made from a rifle with oal < 26 or barrel(s) < 16 sbs: shotgun < 18" or made from a shotgun with oal < 26" or barrel(s) < 18" aow: capable of being concealed on the person or (smooth bore pistol and shot shell) or combo shotgun / rifle 12" - 18". Does not include rifled pistol Not a smooth bore = not a shotgun Fires shot shells = not a rifle Not a rifle = not an SBR Not a shotgun = not an SBS 26" = not an AOW It's a .410. Possibly capable of but not designed to fire some flavor of .45? |
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Have we done this one? ATF definitions in shorthand: shotgun: shoulder fired and uses shotgun shell and smooth bore and fires (shot or single projectile) for each single pull rifle: shoulder fired and single projectile through rifled bore for each single pull sbr: rifle < 16" or made from a rifle with oal < 26 or barrel(s) < 16 sbs: shotgun < 18" or made from a shotgun with oal < 26" or barrel(s) < 18" aow: capable of being concealed on the person or (smooth bore pistol and shot shell) or combo shotgun / rifle 12" - 18". Does not include rifled pistol Not a smooth bore = not a shotgun Fires shot shells = not a rifle Not a rifle = not an SBR Not a shotgun = not an SBS 26" = not an AOW It's a .410. Possibly capable of but not designed to fire some flavor of .45? View Quote Personally, I like “The Senator” or maybe even “The City Councilman” |
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I'm still thinking that it's a loophole that has been there all along.
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Maybe they just ship it with a certificate stating that the employee who assembled it intended for it to be fired with one hand. After all, the intent during design and construction is the only thing that keeps a pistol with a brace from being an SBR View Quote |
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They're calling it the reformation, perhaps this year at shot show they are going to announce that the SBR NFA rules are going away.
A guy can dream right |
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Is this going to be a pin and welded barrel extension, like the Larue SURG surly not a first but would pass NFA and be a SBR like appearance. The picture in their press release the pic is of their current Libertas sbr so it has me thinking the Restoration might look much differently and all the speculation is based on a invalid photo. View Quote That seems par the course, somehow... |
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What in tarnation is a "smooth bore rifle", when a rifle's key designating feature is its rifling? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes |
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Have we done this one? ATF definitions in shorthand: shotgun: shoulder fired and uses shotgun shell and smooth bore and fires (shot or single projectile) for each single pull rifle: shoulder fired and single projectile through rifled bore for each single pull sbr: rifle < 16" or made from a rifle with oal < 26 or barrel(s) < 16 sbs: shotgun < 18" or made from a shotgun with oal < 26" or barrel(s) < 18" aow: capable of being concealed on the person or (smooth bore pistol and shot shell) or combo shotgun / rifle 12" - 18". Does not include rifled pistol Not a smooth bore = not a shotgun Fires shot shells = not a rifle Not a rifle = not an SBR Not a shotgun = not an SBS 26" = not an AOW It's a .410. Possibly capable of but not designed to fire some flavor of .45? View Quote I wouldn't mind a magazine fed 45/70 sbr for HD |
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They do sell .450BM products. Hmmmm.... Also, magazine selection is very important with the .450BM. ACS 5rd mags are all I use. |
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Yes, it’s been so fun wading through all the bullshit View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I love how every page of is thread is essentially the same, with people suggesting the same three or four suggestions over and over and over again. |
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Hey I read the whole thread and I'm pretty sure my theory was original, here on page 20 View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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I love how every page of is thread is essentially the same, with people suggesting the same three or four suggestions over and over and over again. Second would be the one that the SL stock has a strap on it and is considered a brace. I will have zero interest in this if it is only applicable to this specific firearm that they’ll probably want $1800-2000 for. And I fully expect to be disappointed. |
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I doubt that's it but if it was I would imagine that .444 marlin or 45/70 would work in it also... I wouldn't mind a magazine fed 45/70 sbr for HD View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Have we done this one? ATF definitions in shorthand: shotgun: shoulder fired and uses shotgun shell and smooth bore and fires (shot or single projectile) for each single pull rifle: shoulder fired and single projectile through rifled bore for each single pull sbr: rifle < 16" or made from a rifle with oal < 26 or barrel(s) < 16 sbs: shotgun < 18" or made from a shotgun with oal < 26" or barrel(s) < 18" aow: capable of being concealed on the person or (smooth bore pistol and shot shell) or combo shotgun / rifle 12" - 18". Does not include rifled pistol Not a smooth bore = not a shotgun Fires shot shells = not a rifle Not a rifle = not an SBR Not a shotgun = not an SBS 26" = not an AOW It's a .410. Possibly capable of but not designed to fire some flavor of .45? I wouldn't mind a magazine fed 45/70 sbr for HD |
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How's about a double telescoping butt stock to extend beyond 26" OAL? I do know that I'm going to wait until after the ShotShow to file my form 1 SBR.
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Regardless of what it ends up being, I expect to be underwhelmed. Owning both SBRs and pistols with braces, it would have to be something pretty special to get me to buy it.
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So what company is going to fill the need for a tactical vest/carrier that has a front padded shoulder with recessed socket area for the buffer tube.....
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Are we not talking about an AOW with a butstock?
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