Man, that's an attractive pairing!

It's on the internet so it must be true?

You mean nien.

I would take my PTR-91 in certain instances. It shoots right under 1 MOA with ZQI ammo.(I stocked up on it when. It was 40 cents per round!) The recoil isn't as bad as some people cry about. I also throw on a Hensoldt 4x on it when it is. Ot in storage. Mine is retro though with the original wood, leather sling, clipped and pinned steel lower and black plastic grip. Plus mags are cheap as hell. I stocked up on them during Firearmageddon 2013 for under $3 each. Im still putting my Israeli FAL together to compare.  FAL mags are not cheap.

I agree that it is the easier gun to modernize, and as a rule more accurate. I still like a FAL better tho.

Only thing I didn't like about the video was him harping on how the G3 was still in service.

Ignoring that HK sold dies to anyone, it's dirt cheap to make, and FN was restrictive about their rights and it's expensive to build.

They're both similar quality rifles, the G3 is just cheaper to make.

Brügger & Thomet approves of this thread.

Gun Jesus.

My brother got a new one for 545 bucks and it eats EVERYTHING, not a bad gun.

He's definitely the most annoying youtuber that covers my interests. The vehicles he reviews are great, he just sucks.

I don't care what anyone says Gun Jesus rules!

Watching Karl though make me cringe and I can't remember the last time I've watched InRange...

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I think the main reason is the countries that still use the G3s have a small military that they don't want to spend a lot of money on. Like Sweden and Norway. And like you said, they also build them in house and can put their employees to work rebuilding their own equipment.

FAL is still in use in places like South Africa, Brazil and even Australia used them in the early 2000s. And you can argue that the Brazilian and South African FALs saw more actual use than the ones in Norway/Denmark/Sweden in the past 20+ years.











These nations might not be European but it is safe to say the FAL has been modernized and is still seeing some use today.

Better than a bronze age sword?

Great results with that ammo as I struggle to get it under 2moa with ANY rifle. Greek SAR8(hk91), Steyr Ssg69 pii k, and multiple, very accurate hunting rifles. I stocked up on it too when Walmart had it cheap. I’ve gotten a couple 1.5moa groups out of the Steyr but I wouldn’t call that rifle/ammo combo 1.5 moa by any means.

that's karl with inrange who is friends with Ian

Ian himself is kinda whatever.

But Karl definitely is those things, not to mention he does poly relationships with other satanists...while being married to another woman. The collective gun community needs to stay far away from him. He's a complete degenerate.

Jealousy is an ugly thing, guys.

Beauty..!!!!

The G3 does suck, still it's better than a FAL.

On a more serious note. Watch his video and consider the proposed scenario.
You are the head of an underfunded military in Europe that needs to modernize the old .308 battle rile it had to give something to your reserve force.
Your likely available options:

1. M14: You're not likely to have as no one bought them.  So it's not really a likely option.
2. FAL: You might actually have this. Decent gun and you can modernize it. Not as accurate as a G3.
3. G3: Easiest of the list to modernize. Best when modernized of your two available options.

Didn't watch, modernizes better than what? An AK, sure, an AR, get outta here.

They've both seen extensive use, and both continue to be used in large numbers.  Both have been used in all sorts of conflicts in Africa, and still are, including by soldiers, civilian LE, and irregular or non-state forces.  Still issued in a number of African countries to some extent or another.

As you mentioned, the FAL was used on both sides of the Falklands War.  They both were used during the Gulf War, and the G-3 during the Iran-Iraq War.  Both have been used throughout Latin America in various conflicts, and still are issued in a number of countries.  Brazil and Argentina still have some degree of production, although much more limited than in the past (Brazil's new 7.62mm and 5.56mm weapons are essentially modified FALs, though).  The FAL was used in Vietnam by the Aussies, and IIRC the SEALs made some use of the G-3 during or shortly after that era.  Both have been used in a number of conflicts in the Middle East, including the Arab-Israeli wars, and are used in the conflicts there currently.

As far as current Western and NATO use goes, Turkey still uses the G-3 extensively, being still in the process of replacing them with the MPT-76 (an AR-10 derivative, which interestingly uses a bolt carrier much closer to the original than to more recent 7.62mm ARs).  Greece primarily uses the G-3, but issues the FAL to its National Guard and Coast Guard, as well as to civilian LE agencies.  Portugal still primarily issues the G-3, but is now replacing it with the SCAR-L.  The Scandinavian countries still make considerable use of the G-3, and I think the Baltic countries do as well.  Ireland uses the FAL as a DMR and for naval use.  Most maritime NATO or Western countries that used the G-3 or FAL (or other older battle rifle) still make naval use of them, at minimum as line throwing guns.  Cyprus uses the G-3.  Some countries have adapted their battle rifles for DMR use as well.

Honestly, they're both tried and true rifles that will work well and have considerable longevity, and both were produced in large numbers.  In that sense, they aren't too different from one another.  Their main pros and cons relative to each other are in other areas.  IMO, in most of them, the FAL is better than the G-3.  I don't know if the updated G-3 handguards are free-floating or not, but if not, then the FAL has some comparable upgrades (DSA and AIM MLOK handguards; DSA also has Picatinny handguards, and AIM has Keymod handguards; VLTOR has its own proprietary system on its handguards).  Both have ways of securely mounting optics, although the G-3 wins on weight in this context.  There are more ways to lighten a FAL if desired.  Both have more modern stock systems available, as well as more grip options than just the original issue ones.

The FAL is easier to field strip and is much more ergonomic, IMO, and somewhat more comfortable to shoot.  It also has a better trigger, not that either rifle is great in this regard.  Mechanically, the G-3 is a bit more intrinsically accurate, but the FAL is no slouch, either, and would surprise some people.  I think the FAL has better sights, but I know some disagree.  Some of the pros and cons really come down to individual preference.

Pretty much.  I'm about to watch the video, but if that's the extent of his claims, then I don't see how he can make the claim the the G-3 is conclusively better in this context.

How many rounds did he put through that rifle?  And is it his?

Not that anyone is going to see this down here at the bottom of page 2, but some of the info I’ve seen him put out isn’t particularly accurate. I mean, if that’s your shtick, you should know what you’re talking about.

As an example, I recently watched his video on the CETME L, and a lot of what he said about it was completely incorrect. I’ve kinda seen the same thing in some of his other videos as well. Yeah, he handles some neat stuff. But I tend to look at his info like anything else on the internet, in that I verify it if I need it for something important.

Both rifles are still in service.  I see the claim here all of the time that the G-3 was still in service, while the FAL not so much.  Both still see quite a lot of use.  Among NATO countries, though, the G-3 today sees much more extensive use than the FAL, although both are in service with NATO countries (so is the Garand, I believe).  

Cost definitely factored in to adoption.  Portugal wanted the FAL, for example, with the AR-10 for some troops, but the G-3 was much more affordable and could be produced domestically, so they ultimately made that the primary rifle, with the other two mainly used by more elite troops until their military standardized on the G-3 by the 1980s.  My understanding is that troops that got to use multiple rifle types preferred the others to the G-3.  A number of countries bought both, or even both plus other battle rifles, but the G-3 tended to get acquired in larger numbers in some of those cases due to cost.  In others, the G-3 was just supplemental, and in those countries the FAL tended to also be preferred (like South Africa and Rhodesia).  Licensing obviously was an issue, too, which is why Germany switched from the FAL to the G-3 (although the BGS used the FAL into the 1980s).

FALs are inferior to the G3 master race. Uber alles.

M14s are just a joke lol.

He has said as much previously, perhaps more diplomatically. At some point someone hooked him up with a left handed G3, he shot it a bunch and seems to have come around to it.

I can see how a lefty would hate the G3. The charging handle is somehow even harder to use and the brass ejects at about mach 5 right into your right arm. Fix those issues and it'd be fine, particularly if you've never owned a well made FAL.

Yeah, he does put out incorrect info in a number of his videos.  I watched his FR-8 video a while back and it had a number of inaccuracies.  That one stood out to me the most.  Most of the time, the inaccuracies are minor, but sometimes they're more significant.

He does get to handle and sometimes shoot a bunch of cool weapons, though.

Yeah, he does put out incorrect info in a number of his videos.  I watched his FR-8 video a while back and it had a number of inaccuracies.  That one stood out to me the most.  Most of the time, the inaccuracies are minor, but sometimes they're more significant.

He does get to handle and sometimes shoot a bunch of cool weapons, though.

Those are the same reasons I like the Mini 14 over the AR. That and the higher cost of mags.

Oh, and you can “modernize” a FAL just as easily as a G3/HK91. DSA has a bunch of that kind of stuff. Much like PTR has similar items for the HKs, and others have for the M1A/M14s.

Semi on-topic...

Anyone have any idea if the Spuhr hand guard fits a PTR91 SC (16 inch barrel)?

This guy.  I don’t see specs listed anywhere.
https://www.milehighshooting.com/spuhr-r-401-g3-forend/

OST

Not really "modernized" much here, but this is still operator as f**k.

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I too, like my mini-14.

If I had a big pile of guns that could be upgraded to fit a role instead of cutting them up, I'd upgrade them.

I think this is the point of the video.

Edit, I missed the point entirely.  

Out of the 2, the G3 seems to have been adapted better to collapsing stocks, but they still had to work around that awful cheek weld.  As well as not having a gas piston hanging over the barrel and being able to just weld a rail on top instead of having to deal with a dust cover mount.  There are better options out there but I doubt either, when outfitted, makes that terrible of a designated marksman's rifle.

But I'd still prefer an AR10 based rifle.

I like my two PTR-91, and I like my two DSA FAL.

I shot a swede G3 about 10-12yrs ago in AFG and I thought it was fucking rad. It had the collapsible stock which was sub-optimal for cheekweld but I thought it was a great solution for AFG. It had an aimpoint, a rattlecan paint job and a whole lot of swag.

A modern turd is still a turd tho

Are you high?   Look up an LRB M25. How many Competitors used any of the rifles Ian  discussed?  

The G-3 was used EXTENSIVELY in the African Bush Wars of the 70's & 80's.  

And all through Central America insurgencies & Contra revolutions' too!

In the Middle East.  The G-3 was the primary rifle for the Iranians in the Iran - Iraq war.

The Saudis field the G-3 in their battles in Yemen.

And by several Forces from nations supporting the NATO / USA in Afghanistan since the Invasion  

and closer to home, widespread use by Mexico & Columbia in the Drug Wars from the 70's to today...

The G-3 is still around still going strong ... from being one of the primary weapons in the battles of the Bush throughout Africa & Central America, to still being issued (& improved) by several significant forces in Europe who are still slinging 7.62x51 NATO.

This.

We're trying to pick a "winner" based upon a bunch of countries, and a bunch of after-market accessories, many of which we don't have any way to estimate the cost to that government. What a country prefers to buy is often different from what Pvt. Schmuckatelli wants to tote around and shoot, and the reasoning differs.

I generally agree with Ian in this case, but if you like other things, that's cool too.

The only indisputably incorrect answer in this contest is M-14.

The G3 was a great rifle for its era but as a modern rifle? No way. The SCAR H is better in every way. Sigs MCX platform is supposed to be better still.

I’m not sure what that dudes deal is or why he seems to be obsessed with taking outdated platforms and trying to make them new. His Stoner rifle thing he did was pure derp and was really a step backwards to 2002 IMO. Then there was that CETME model L thing.

The FAL gets over looked a lot. It has been heavily updated over the years. Weight aside the rifle is very well refined at this point.

Most of that is true of the FAL as well.

I used to own a Cetme. Smooth shooter, but kinda heavy and not all that customizable like an AR.

I don't love the G3, but there's no denying that it's held on far longer than any of it's contemporaries in frontline service in major militaries.

Gun jesus should learn a thing or two before he spouts off.

Guy is a real winner.

Him and that hiccup45 shill

Can we nail gun jesus to a stick and then drop a rock on him for 3 days ?