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Posted: 11/7/2019 4:53:36 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Usually engineers and people in physics talk and think like Neil Degrasse Tyson and aren't scared of change. Neil doesn't know shit about engineering products, he's an Astrophysicist which doesn't deal with engineering. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 4:59:16 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now I feel really stupid, I should have just suggested that we make NASCARs our daily drivers. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 4:59:28 PM EDT
[#3]
Tantalum and Niobium are the future for barrel linings.
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:01:42 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
First, I'm NOT an engineer obviously and never on this website ever claimed to be one. I never claimed to build rifles. Quote HistoryQuoted:
First, I'm NOT an engineer obviously and never on this website ever claimed to be one. I never claimed to build rifles. I created a thread and soon the garage kit builders jumped in who claimed to be engineers There's a reason why the supposed "engineers" here aren't being hired by Elon Musk and Tesla or any company that demands aggressive creating thinking and pushing the limits 
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:02:23 PM EDT
[#5]
The steel/aluminum composites are interesting.
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:03:51 PM EDT
[#6]
If you want really high temp material, we need to make barrels out of ceramics.
That'll do it. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:03:59 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
SME's response: "Use a cheap steal $5 dollar gas tube." |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:05:52 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actually, according to some "SME's" here, guns used at Battlefield Las Vegas see higher round counts than theater weapons.
Theater is not where weapons are tested prior to acceptance. Even a first year engineering student knows that. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:06:05 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, the stellite-lined small armed barrels are also chrome-plated, so yes. Many exotic aerospace alloys are preferred due to their high-temperature creep properties - they don't suffer a continuous deformation under a constant stress value. I am not of the opinion that they are really great materials for a firearms application. In order to save money, the M2 barrel has a partial stellite liner than runs from the case neck to a little over a foot down the bore. The remainder of the barrel is regular steel which is chrome lined. The short liner is both less expensive to manufacture and easier to assemble than a full length liner, and protects the highest wear area of the barrel. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:07:02 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're a Liar. No SME has said that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
SME's response: "Use a cheap steal $5 dollar gas tube." You don't run off entertainment like this. It doesn't come along all that often. 
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:07:06 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, the stellite-lined small armed barrels are also chrome-plated, so yes. Many exotic aerospace alloys are preferred due to their high-temperature creep properties - they don't suffer a continuous deformation under a constant stress value. I am not of the opinion that they are really great materials for a firearms application. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:07:30 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Range Rovers. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted:
And to and extent - vice versa. I mean, why not have a commuter car that needs to have its engine rebuilt every 1000 miles.  
I love you man - no homo. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:10:22 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think stellite was in common use in .50 cal aircraft machine gun barrels during WWII. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:11:09 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not in they way you make it sound like. Stellite liners are not chrome plated. In order to save money, the M2 barrel has a partial stellite liner than runs from the case neck to a little over a foot down the bore. The remainder of the barrel is regular steel which is chrome lined. The short liner is both less expensive to manufacture and easier to assemble than a full length liner, and protects the highest wear area of the barrel. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Well, the stellite-lined small armed barrels are also chrome-plated, so yes. Many exotic aerospace alloys are preferred due to their high-temperature creep properties - they don't suffer a continuous deformation under a constant stress value. I am not of the opinion that they are really great materials for a firearms application. In order to save money, the M2 barrel has a partial stellite liner than runs from the case neck to a little over a foot down the bore. The remainder of the barrel is regular steel which is chrome lined. The short liner is both less expensive to manufacture and easier to assemble than a full length liner, and protects the highest wear area of the barrel. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:13:44 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you want really high temp material, we need to make barrels out of ceramics. That'll do it. You might not even need hand guards it deals with heat so well. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:15:19 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not sure that's true, but I will admit that it had been a few years since I have had access to that information. Is there not chrome flashing on the extreme rear of the barrel, indicating that the steel chamber had been plated? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: Well, the stellite-lined small armed barrels are also chrome-plated, so yes. Many exotic aerospace alloys are preferred due to their high-temperature creep properties - they don't suffer a continuous deformation under a constant stress value. I am not of the opinion that they are really great materials for a firearms application. In order to save money, the M2 barrel has a partial stellite liner than runs from the case neck to a little over a foot down the bore. The remainder of the barrel is regular steel which is chrome lined. The short liner is both less expensive to manufacture and easier to assemble than a full length liner, and protects the highest wear area of the barrel. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:17:03 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I can absolutely guarantee what is said above is true, and no there is no chrome flashing on the extreme rear of the barrel. The rear of the barrel which includes the barrel threads and the chamber is a third separate piece of the barrel called the retainer that threads in and holds the liner in place in addition to the shrink fit. These three pieces are all assembled after the steel portion of the bore is chrome plated. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:23:48 PM EDT
[#18]
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:25:18 PM EDT
[#19]
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:29:01 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You're not an engineer, nor do you know mathematics. Quote HistoryQuoted: You're not an engineer, nor do you know mathematics. Why would a random angry petulant kid on here turn down a job at Tesla] Space X is still working on getting to another planet. Neat stuff, and the resusablity aspect is game changing; but call me when they get to Pluto, we've already been there. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:29:14 PM EDT
[#21]
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:34:07 PM EDT
[#22]
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:34:49 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think stellite was in common use in .50 cal aircraft machine gun barrels during WWII. Work started in 1942 to develop an erosion resistant barrel for heavy machine guns. By October 1944, the designs for a Stellite liner for the .50 cal and .30 cal MGs were ready and production started soon afterwards. Used, yes, common, hardly. OH and for the OP, during this time, Hastelloy was examined and discarded as a suitable liner material for a variety of reasons. So, you ain't the first one to think if this stuff.... |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:38:22 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
(Says in gay lisp).. "Little Forest, where are you Forest?" You must have got the shi* kicked out of you in school with that name. Little Forest, I'll make a deal with you, show us your degrees in engineering and mathematics on webcam skype, just to prove you're not a random garage builder. 
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:41:05 PM EDT
[#25]
Ridgerunner, all joking aside, I wanted to know your opinion on the U.S. Marines choosing the HK M27 for their rifle. Do you think it was a good decision?
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:42:55 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ridgerunner, all joking aside, I wanted to know your opinion on the U.S. Marines choosing the HK M27 for their rifle. Do you think it was a good decision? |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:46:52 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a stupid decision. What does that have to do with your stupid idea? Sig AMT for the win. 
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Posted: 11/7/2019 5:54:08 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
... What are your credentials? You seem to make light of others accomplishments, but where do you come from, and what have you done? |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:02:09 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
BTW.... What are your credentials? You seem to make light of others accomplishments, but where do you come from, and what have you done? And it's amazing how supposed self proclaimed engineers can't figure out ways to improve on an AR 15 platform. It's like the DI faithful who hate short stroke pistons even though almost every machine gun uses a short stroke piston to good effect like the SCAR 16. This is a common theme here, as I posted about how real ceo's and engineers have posted here and a bunch of faceless "SME's" have attacked them... https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/CherryBalmz-vs-SlideGlide/5-2105715/ |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:02:45 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a stupid decision. What does that have to do with your stupid idea? |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:09:40 PM EDT
[#31]
On a side note, I am a fan of Larry Vickers and the HK program. Also, Chris Bartocci at Small Arms Solutions on YouTube is awesome too...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCn_AGhwovzeWrnqHFJpYWaw/featured There are a lot of gun guys on YouTube who are great like... IraqVeteran8888 MrGunsnGear Mishaco |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:11:04 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Has anyone on this thread ever built their own rifles from their own factory with their own materials? Who are the engineers here? Get on webcam or skype and show us your degrees Msc in engineering, minors in mathematics etc. We got a bunch of garage builders here with low IQ's. lol 
Omg this is great..... @ziarifleman |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:13:00 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The U.S. military I guess thought that there was more upside and a higher ceiling of development with the short stroke piston than the DI. 
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:15:23 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You mean non-standard DI (that's not a true DI) that gets crapped on by operators that don't understand the mechanics behind it. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:15:31 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Uh, ya.. So, how are you going to rifle the tube? And ream the chamber? Ya a hastaloy/inconell barrel would be tits in an overbored cartridge. But how ya going to make it? Once all said and done your going to have a $2K+ barrel, that's before fitting and final install. Out of the realm of most shooters. I've machined both materials in Question and both suck balls. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
@BURN @Fat_McNasty @badkarmaii @40xb @RictusGrin Hey come look at this. So, how are you going to rifle the tube? And ream the chamber? Ya a hastaloy/inconell barrel would be tits in an overbored cartridge. But how ya going to make it? Once all said and done your going to have a $2K+ barrel, that's before fitting and final install. Out of the realm of most shooters. I've machined both materials in Question and both suck balls. but to be fair I even hate machining on titanium unless its on a very nice and powerful CNC set up.... |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:22:02 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And what happens when your cheap steel gas tubes malfunctions during a home invasion or during your Walking Dead Zombie Apocalypse "STHF" paranoid scenario or when there's a Democrat president that you guys on here always think will happen that you prepare and buy guns for? Members on here ask: "I'm looking for a gun for STHF and it needs to function to save my life and my family's life." SME's response: "Use a cheap steal $5 dollar gas tube." Quote HistoryQuoted:
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$64 carbine length gas tubes. This is why steel gas tubes are still a thing. And those "reviews" seem a tad shilly.... Members on here ask: "I'm looking for a gun for STHF and it needs to function to save my life and my family's life." SME's response: "Use a cheap steal $5 dollar gas tube." |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:24:38 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Mini Halberds. Inconel coated mini halberds. It's the future. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Halberds are way too unwieldy for home defense. Shows what kind of SME you are. I'll take my wakazashi and tanto any day for CQB. I swear the posers around here are aggravating. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:26:37 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actually, according to some "SME's" here, guns used at Battlefield Las Vegas see higher round counts than theater weapons. BLV has a gun that gets rented every day for a few hours and is shot the whole time... Guy goes to Afghanistan and only shoots his rifle twice in theater for quals.... |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:30:02 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you want really high temp material, we need to make barrels out of ceramics. That'll do it. hold out pistol barrels out of osmium ... |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:31:28 PM EDT
[#40]
I'm a bit late for the serious replies but here goes.
My 'best barrel' material would be 300c maraging steel with a carbonitride surface treatment. Very high strength but retains good toughness at Rc50. Relatively easy to machine and a simple heat treatment. Only drawback is cost, a 20"x1" bar will run ~$400 or so. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:34:09 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ridgerunner, all joking aside, I wanted to know your opinion on the U.S. Marines choosing the HK M27 for their rifle. Do you think it was a good decision? Stoner also built some prototype rifle using a short stroke gas system.... then moved on to what he felt was a better design. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:35:49 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You mean non-standard DI (that's not a true DI) that gets crapped on by operators that don't understand the mechanics behind it. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:35:52 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not sure what you mean? Are you implying that SEALS and Delta don't understand the mechanics of DI AR's ? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You mean non-standard DI (that's not a true DI) that gets crapped on by operators that don't understand the mechanics behind it. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:44:07 PM EDT
[#44]
HKPOF at work -
 As a Vickers fan, he knows he is in good company here. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:48:11 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well I work with some special ops guys... and no just because they were/are special forces does not automatically make them "Firearm Experts"... |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:49:11 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Common, no. Work started in 1942 to develop an erosion resistant barrel for heavy machine guns. By October 1944, the designs for a Stellite liner for the .50 cal and .30 cal MGs were ready and production started soon afterwards. Used, yes, common, hardly. OH and for the OP, during this time, Hastelloy was examined and discarded as a suitable liner material for a variety of reasons. So, you ain't the first one to think if this stuff.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I think stellite was in common use in .50 cal aircraft machine gun barrels during WWII. Work started in 1942 to develop an erosion resistant barrel for heavy machine guns. By October 1944, the designs for a Stellite liner for the .50 cal and .30 cal MGs were ready and production started soon afterwards. Used, yes, common, hardly. OH and for the OP, during this time, Hastelloy was examined and discarded as a suitable liner material for a variety of reasons. So, you ain't the first one to think if this stuff.... https://books.google.com/books?id=h5xqVTVPO3QC&pg=PT308&lpg=PT308&dq=stellite+lined+machine+gun+barrels+1943&source=bl&ots=Y2TT8kEKu1&sig=ACfU3U0jhMYUaDgPtEtJp2GoOy2ykHRClw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwisnqSfjNnlAhVdCTQIHb5WD6cQ6AEwDnoECAkQAQ#v=onepage&q=Stellite&f=false I'm not sure how adopted as standard a year or so begore the war ended = not commonly used, but whatever. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:49:11 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And it's amazing how supposed self proclaimed engineers can't figure out ways to improve on an AR 15 platform. It's like the DI faithful who hate short stroke pistons even though almost every machine gun uses a short stroke piston to good effect like the SCAR 16. Quote HistoryQuoted:
And it's amazing how supposed self proclaimed engineers can't figure out ways to improve on an AR 15 platform. It's like the DI faithful who hate short stroke pistons even though almost every machine gun uses a short stroke piston to good effect like the SCAR 16. Define 'Improve'. Because that could me more durability to wear, more corrosion resistance, higher MTBF, lower weight, better accuracy, better terminal performance, more modularity, better "over the beach" performance, and/or lower cost. All of those would be 'improvement' but you can't have ALL of them at the same time, that's what we call 'engineering tradeoffs'. This is a common theme here, as I posted about how real ceo's and engineers have posted here and a bunch of faceless "SME's" have attacked them...
https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/CherryBalmz-vs-SlideGlide/5-2105715/ I saw no data in that thread comparing different brands under specified conditions telling us anything. It was all marketing hype without an iota of data. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:52:11 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Again, I never once on this website claimed to be an engineer or gun builder because I'm not. I simply started a thread that was based on hypotheticals and supposed self proclaimed engineers here got really offensive for some weird reason. And it's amazing how supposed self proclaimed engineers can't figure out ways to improve on an AR 15 platform. It's like the DI faithful who hate short stroke pistons even though almost every machine gun uses a short stroke piston to good effect like the SCAR 16. This is a common theme here, as I posted about how real ceo's and engineers have posted here and a bunch of faceless "SME's" have attacked them... https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/CherryBalmz-vs-SlideGlide/5-2105715/ Quote HistoryQuoted: Again, I never once on this website claimed to be an engineer or gun builder because I'm not. I simply started a thread that was based on hypotheticals and supposed self proclaimed engineers here got really offensive for some weird reason. And it's amazing how supposed self proclaimed engineers can't figure out ways to improve on an AR 15 platform. It's like the DI faithful who hate short stroke pistons even though almost every machine gun uses a short stroke piston to good effect like the SCAR 16. This is a common theme here, as I posted about how real ceo's and engineers have posted here and a bunch of faceless "SME's" have attacked them... https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/CherryBalmz-vs-SlideGlide/5-2105715/ To wit: First, write down the functions of a gun barrel. First a smooth bore, then a rifled bore.
Then, write down the characteristics a gun barrel must possess. Along side each characteristic write down the minimum acceptable performance, the "dream" maximum performance goal. After that, add the new characteristics you want to add, along with the performance goals. After that, examine each performance metric and define how it can be met; that will establish a list of candidate materials, or processes, or materials plus processes. Include the cost of each candidate. After making this huge matrix of information, strike out the impossible. Stack each metric against current common practice, then make an honest evaluation of the improvement over state of the art, and its cost. And you seem to be enamored by the CB thread, but at least the CB guys could answer technical criticisms with something approaching logic, not just a link to the next "gee-whiz" material and dismissal of those that have experience in the very field you're asking about. |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 6:57:59 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And what is it that you do that requires you to work with some special ops guys? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Well I work with some special ops guys... and no just because they were/are special forces does not automatically make them "Firearm Experts"... |
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Posted: 11/7/2019 7:06:16 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why don't you work with special ops guys?
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