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Posted: 10/3/2023 4:27:52 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Link to cheaper colt? Or one of the same price? https://armsunlimited.com/colt-le6920-oem-rifle---no-furniture/ You’ll have to complete the parts list yourself but it’s less than $100 difference all together. That’s not the cheapest I’ve seen an OEM but it’s close and was one of the first results. I don’t know why people think a RAS is $300. P&S owns the contract now and they usually sell for $120-$150 from various sources. Brownell’s has them and Primary Arms sells them under their Expo line and just ended a sale on them for $60. Unless they hunted old KAC’s down, PSA is probably buying these in bulk from P&S for a pack of cigarettes and a six pack. Rip off artists like Charlie’s custom clones and Thoroughbred are selling them for crazy money still, because a lot of people don’t know they’re actually dirt cheap now. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 4:31:20 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://armsunlimited.com/colt-le6920-oem-rifle---no-furniture/ I don't know why people think a RAS is $300. P&S owns the contract now and they usually sell for $120-$150 from various sources. Brownell's has them and Primary Arms sells them under their Expo line and just ended a sale on them for $60. Unless they hunted old KAC's down, PSA is probably buying these in bulk from P&S for dirt cheap. Rip off artists like Charlie's custom clones and Thoroughbred are selling them for crazy money still, because a lot of people don't know they're actually dirt cheap now. <<< Not a hardcore cloner. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 4:37:21 PM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: p&s ras https://armsunlimited.com/colt-le6920-oem-rifle---no-furniture/ You’ll have to complete the parts list yourself but it’s less than $100 difference all together. That’s not the cheapest I’ve seen an OEM but it’s close and was one of the first results. I don’t know why people think a RAS is $300. P&S owns the contract now and they usually sell for $120-$150 from various sources. Brownell’s has them and Primary Arms sells them under their Expo line and just ended a sale on them for $60. Unless they hunted old KAC’s down, PSA is probably buying these in bulk from P&S for dirt cheap. Rip off artists like Charlie’s custom clones and Thoroughbred are selling them for crazy money still, because a lot of people don’t know they’re actually dirt cheap now. Might want to double check.. P&s was sold to prudent.. expo and the brownells are from prudent. P&s sell for around 200+ still. p&s ras But if you want a Nib kac ras and want the case as well you will pay 300 + for it and not talking from ccc. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:32:11 PM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://armsunlimited.com/colt-le6920-oem-rifle---no-furniture/ You’ll have to complete the parts list yourself but it’s less than $100 difference all together. That’s not the cheapest I’ve seen an OEM but it’s close and was one of the first results. I don’t know why people think a RAS is $300. P&S owns the contract now and they usually sell for $120-$150 from various sources. Brownell’s has them and Primary Arms sells them under their Expo line and just ended a sale on them for $60. Unless they hunted old KAC’s down, PSA is probably buying these in bulk from P&S for a pack of cigarettes and a six pack. Rip off artists like Charlie’s custom clones and Thoroughbred are selling them for crazy money still, because a lot of people don’t know they’re actually dirt cheap now. Still need to have the barrel cut and threaded along with pinned and welded. Not a CHF barrel that the PSA comes with so you really are not getting a better rifle just opinion that you think it is better. I really do not get it sometimes we started a thread about the PSA M4A1 clone and sure enough the Colt fans come in here and shit on the PSA claiming the Colt is better like it is made with unicorn foreskin or something. I swear this site has some of the weirdest habits that if someone wants something they do not like or does not meet their approval they do exactly what you do. How is the Colt objectively better serious question? I know now all AR’s are created equally but at some point the differences between one and the other is literally a stamping. What does the Colt do that this does not? Will it last 100 more rounds or 2636 more rounds? The elitist attitude from some of you all on this site get olds I must say … I remember the days of 1/9 vs 1/7 barrels that if you did not have a 1/7 you were not elite and your rifle sucked or was trash in many people’s eyes here. It was almost the end of the world for some people and I bet for a good portion of those guys they shot mostly 55gr ball in their 1/7 and never shot a 77gr. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:36:47 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Might want to double check.. P&s was sold to prudent.. expo and the brownells are from prudent. P&s sell for around 200+ still. p&s ras But if you want a Nib kac ras and want the case as well you will pay 300 + for it and not talking from ccc. Yes they sold to Prudent, but they’re not $200. As mentioned previously, Primary Arms was selling them for $60 just a couple weeks ago. OOS at the moment but still showing $140 off sale. https://www.primaryarms.com/expo-arms-m4-ras-quad-rail-handguard-carbine-length Brownell’s no longer lists theirs but they’re dumping their retro and clone stuff like it’s radioactive. I’m guessing this was part of that exodus from the market. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:38:01 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Still need to have the barrel cut and threaded along with pinned and welded. Not a CHF barrel that the PSA comes with so you really are not getting a better rifle just opinion that you think it is better. I really do not get it sometimes we started a thread about the PSA M4A1 clone and sure enough the Colt fans come in here and shit on the PSA claiming the Colt is better like it is made with unicorn foreskin or something. I swear this site has some of the weirdest habits that if someone wants something they do not like or does not meet their approval they do exactly what you do. How is the Colt objectively better serious question? I know now all AR’s are created equally but at some point the differences between one and the other is literally a stamping. What does the Colt do that this does not? Will it last 100 more rounds or 2636 more rounds? The elitist attitude from some of you all on this site get olds I must say … I remember the days of 1/9 vs 1/7 barrels that if you did not have a 1/7 you were not elite and your rifle sucked or was trash in many people’s eyes here. It was almost the end of the world for some people and I bet for a good portion of those guys they shot mostly 55gr ball in their 1/7 and never shot a 77gr. The Colt won't have the proper markings either unless you get a property of gov lower, so it's not like it really matters anyways. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:44:14 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Still need to have the barrel cut and threaded along with pinned and welded. Not a CHF barrel that the PSA comes with so you really are not getting a better rifle just opinion that you think it is better. I really do not get it sometimes we started a thread about the PSA M4A1 clone and sure enough the Colt fans come in here and shit on the PSA claiming the Colt is better like it is made with unicorn foreskin or something. I swear this site has some of the weirdest habits that if someone wants something they do not like or does not meet their approval they do exactly what you do. How is the Colt objectively better serious question? I know now all AR’s are created equally but at some point the differences between one and the other is literally a stamping. What does the Colt do that this does not? Will it last 100 more rounds or 2636 more rounds? The elitist attitude from some of you all on this site get olds I must say … I remember the days of 1/9 vs 1/7 barrels that if you did not have a 1/7 you were not elite and your rifle sucked or was trash in many people’s eyes here. It was almost the end of the world for some people and I bet for a good portion of those guys they shot mostly 55gr ball in their 1/7 and never shot a 77gr. The PSA comes in 16” and 14.5” with the P&W coming in at a higher cost. It’s not elitist to say that the logo matters to people. That’s just how the game works. I’m not part of that game but if someone offers you a PSA or a Colt lower, which one are you picking? Now how about a PSA, Colt, or pre ambi normal KAC lower? PSA has a very serious presence as a budget brand and punching above their weight. I love them for that like everyone else. This rifle doesn’t follow that model. Imagine if their M110 clone was $12,000. Imagine if their Mk12 was $2,500. That’s what this rifle is. Just because FN is out there selling $1500 4140 barreled clones doesn’t mean these are a good value, it means the FN is a rip off. And I’ve never once insinuated the PSA is an inferior rifle as a reminder. I just don’t think this is a value priced clone like their others, and selling a retro/clone configuration like this at the same cost as the real deal will be a harder sell. They should have made a Freedom model. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:45:30 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes they sold to Prudent, but they’re not $200. As mentioned previously, Primary Arms was selling them for $60 just a couple weeks ago. OOS at the moment but still showing $140 off sale. https://www.primaryarms.com/expo-arms-m4-ras-quad-rail-handguard-carbine-length Brownell’s no longer lists theirs but they’re dumping their retro and clone stuff like it’s radioactive. I’m guessing this was part of that exodus from the market. I never saw them for 60.00 for the expo from primary arms. I never said the prudent was 200, I said the p&s were still over 200 sonce you mentioned p&s. The prudent are around 150 to 130 such as expo primary arms and brownells ones. These are always limited runs though. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:46:37 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who cares what something is worth in 20 years? I do not buy guns to sell them just like cars I do not buy a car and worry about resale value. I shoot my guns and drive the wheels off a car and will keep fixing it till it is expensive to fix or I really really want something else. I never understood this mentality you buy a gun and your thought is resale value not fun factor or just want? Colt does make a nice AR probably will buy one of those one day probably. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If you can install a P&S rail, pistol grip, and stock yourself the M4 marked Colt OEM1 is a better buy. May not be M4A1 profile but no one is going to choose a PSA gun over that, nor will the PSA be worth a fourth as much 20 years from now. It’s cool they’re doing all these clones don’t get me wrong, but this one is kind of meh. Who cares what something is worth in 20 years? I do not buy guns to sell them just like cars I do not buy a car and worry about resale value. I shoot my guns and drive the wheels off a car and will keep fixing it till it is expensive to fix or I really really want something else. I never understood this mentality you buy a gun and your thought is resale value not fun factor or just want? Colt does make a nice AR probably will buy one of those one day probably. Why not? You should always have that in the back of your mind when buying assets. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:49:32 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are they selling P&S ones or KAC? I think hard core cloners still have a hardon for KAC made ones. <<< Not a hardcore cloner. Even cloners will admit that the P&S RAS are clone correct. They were proper government contract parts and are legit the same thing. Literally no need to pay $300+ for a KAC RAS any more, and I have a shit ton of the KAC ones because I love that rail system so much. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:51:54 PM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The PSA comes in 16” and 14.5” with the P&W coming in at a higher cost. It’s not elitist to say that the logo matters to people. That’s just how the game works. I’m not part of that game but if someone offers you a PSA or a Colt lower, which one are you picking? Now how about a PSA, Colt, or pre ambi normal KAC lower? PSA has a very serious presence as a budget brand and punching above their weight. I love them for that like everyone else. This rifle doesn’t follow that model. Imagine if their M110 clone was $12,000. Imagine if their Mk12 was $2,500. That’s what this rifle is. Just because FN is out there selling $1500 4140 barreled clones doesn’t mean these are a good value, it means the FN is a rip off. And I’ve never once insinuated the PSA is an inferior rifle as a reminder. I just don’t think this is a value priced clone like they’re others, and selling a retro/clone configuration like this at the same cost as the real deal will be a harder sell. They should have made a Freedom model. The FN is definitely a rip off they are selling it high based solely off their brand name. That is the thing about AR’s now days the difference is roll mark with some exceptions where a company actually does innovate. Huge chunk of brands out now are almost nothing more than different roll mark. With many sharing parts made by X for one part and Y for another. Look at PSA using FN barrel in this rifle. Then you have examples where brand Y and Z almost part for part are identical or nearly identical but one is 300-500 more because of the brand roll mark. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:55:14 PM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why not? You should always have that in the back of your mind when buying assets. Because I do not buy something based on the idea I will keep it pristine to sell some day. If I buy something to use it I am going to try and use it up or wear it out. If someone wants to buy it after I wear it out that is fine but it is going to be well used or I just did not like it. Guns for me are something that is fun to me and I am buying stuff for me not anyone else. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 5:56:08 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Couple hundred, no.. 400-500 more, yes. This all comes down to a persons budget.. Is the colt worth it.. Yes.. If a person doesn't want to spend more than that, there are other options. Hell Im building one and spending far more all because I didnt want an a2 flash hidder pin and welded. I wanted surefire can capabilities. So it is taking me time to buy all the colt parts for my upper and i am using a stripped psa m4 lower as that is what I was issued when we first transitioned from the m16a2 to the block 1 when I got to group. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Isnt an actual Colt socom only a couple hundred more? Couple hundred, no.. 400-500 more, yes. This all comes down to a persons budget.. Is the colt worth it.. Yes.. If a person doesn't want to spend more than that, there are other options. Hell Im building one and spending far more all because I didnt want an a2 flash hidder pin and welded. I wanted surefire can capabilities. So it is taking me time to buy all the colt parts for my upper and i am using a stripped psa m4 lower as that is what I was issued when we first transitioned from the m16a2 to the block 1 when I got to group. Socom $1230 Like new Socom $1140 |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 6:02:41 PM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryThat was a lucky auction not a set price and the other is a used rifle. That's not the normal going rate for factory new rifles. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 6:04:51 PM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That was a lucky auction not a set price and the other is a used rifle. That's not the normal going rate for factory new rifles. Quote HistoryQuoted: That was a lucky auction not a set price and the other is a used rifle. That's not the normal going rate for factory new rifles. Honestly I see them go for around that price all the time in auction. With minimal patience they can be had for way less than $1400-$1500 |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 6:21:27 PM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://armsunlimited.com/colt-le6920-oem-rifle---no-furniture/ You’ll have to complete the parts list yourself but it’s less than $100 difference all together. That’s not the cheapest I’ve seen an OEM but it’s close and was one of the first results. I don’t know why people think a RAS is $300. P&S owns the contract now and they usually sell for $120-$150 from various sources. Brownell’s has them and Primary Arms sells them under their Expo line and just ended a sale on them for $60. Unless they hunted old KAC’s down, PSA is probably buying these in bulk from P&S for a pack of cigarettes and a six pack. Rip off artists like Charlie’s custom clones and Thoroughbred are selling them for crazy money still, because a lot of people don’t know they’re actually dirt cheap now. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Link to cheaper colt? Or one of the same price? https://armsunlimited.com/colt-le6920-oem-rifle---no-furniture/ You’ll have to complete the parts list yourself but it’s less than $100 difference all together. That’s not the cheapest I’ve seen an OEM but it’s close and was one of the first results. I don’t know why people think a RAS is $300. P&S owns the contract now and they usually sell for $120-$150 from various sources. Brownell’s has them and Primary Arms sells them under their Expo line and just ended a sale on them for $60. Unless they hunted old KAC’s down, PSA is probably buying these in bulk from P&S for a pack of cigarettes and a six pack. Rip off artists like Charlie’s custom clones and Thoroughbred are selling them for crazy money still, because a lot of people don’t know they’re actually dirt cheap now. 16.1" barrel  |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:06:04 PM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why not? You should always have that in the back of your mind when buying assets. What percentage of arfcom considered their Umteenth AR an asset? Mine eat a lot, probably a liability |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:24:17 PM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What percentage of arfcom considered their Umteenth AR an asset? Mine eat a lot, probably a liability Good point unless it is a branded rifle assembled by a maker they are not easy to just sell. Sure you could put together an amalgamation of top tier parts and to you it is worth top tier price. But Joe Bob sees that and he see a Frankenstein’s monster and if you use cheap whatever brand lowers it is even harder. A 3K build on an Anderson lower for instance… |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:46:09 PM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 16.1" barrel Yep, so is the base PSA M4A1 offering. Have to pony up even more money for the 14.7” P&W PSA. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:54:18 PM EST
[#20]
that is sexy.
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Posted: 10/4/2023 6:33:38 AM EST
[#21]
If you're buying your rifles to be assets, I would question your sanity as an investor.
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Posted: 10/4/2023 7:31:45 AM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep, so is the base PSA M4A1 offering. Have to pony up even more money for the 14.7” P&W PSA. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: 16.1" barrel Yep, so is the base PSA M4A1 offering. Have to pony up even more money for the 14.7” P&W PSA. The rifle in the OP is 14.7. You're still coming up behind when you add furniture and factor in a chf barrel. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:18:40 AM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Colt won't have the proper markings either unless you get a property of gov lower, so it's not like it really matters anyways. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Still need to have the barrel cut and threaded along with pinned and welded. Not a CHF barrel that the PSA comes with so you really are not getting a better rifle just opinion that you think it is better. I really do not get it sometimes we started a thread about the PSA M4A1 clone and sure enough the Colt fans come in here and shit on the PSA claiming the Colt is better like it is made with unicorn foreskin or something. I swear this site has some of the weirdest habits that if someone wants something they do not like or does not meet their approval they do exactly what you do. How is the Colt objectively better serious question? I know now all AR’s are created equally but at some point the differences between one and the other is literally a stamping. What does the Colt do that this does not? Will it last 100 more rounds or 2636 more rounds? The elitist attitude from some of you all on this site get olds I must say … I remember the days of 1/9 vs 1/7 barrels that if you did not have a 1/7 you were not elite and your rifle sucked or was trash in many people’s eyes here. It was almost the end of the world for some people and I bet for a good portion of those guys they shot mostly 55gr ball in their 1/7 and never shot a 77gr. The Colt won't have the proper markings either unless you get a property of gov lower, so it's not like it really matters anyways. As mentioned before, the colt Socoms that are $350 more than the PSA are advertised as US government property marked. And you get a socom profile barrel, and kac marked RAS. That’s way more than a $350 value difference imho. Value wise the colt socom is a way way better deal. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:22:46 AM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As mentioned before, the colt Socoms that are $350 more than the PSA are advertised as US government property marked. And you get a socom profile barrel, and kac marked RAS. That’s way more than a $350 value difference imho. Value wise the colt socom is a way way better deal. The PSA still has a CHF barrel... |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:26:17 AM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So the only people who care about that crap are old Fudd collectors, but guys who carried them and care about that crap are different how in your insinuation? If you cannot see it then you are blind. In this very thread you have guys bitching about stupid details only idiots fight over. Most vetbros don't give a fuck and want a gun that is available easy and done. Just what psa offers. Saying colt is better after multiple company failures and NO new innovations in 40 years is laughable. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:27:09 AM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The PSA still has a CHF barrel... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: As mentioned before, the colt Socoms that are $350 more than the PSA are advertised as US government property marked. And you get a socom profile barrel, and kac marked RAS. That’s way more than a $350 value difference imho. Value wise the colt socom is a way way better deal. The PSA still has a CHF barrel... I’d take a colt socom profile cl barrel over any chf gov profile barrel all day long. If the barrel on the PSA was a socom chf fn then it would close the gap. But that $50 receiver vs a $800 receiver is a big value gap. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:28:19 AM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Except the thing is they carried a Colt. Why clone something that is available? Because they are not available at the same scale. Please show me the Colt warehouse where I can pick up a ready to go gun |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:39:02 AM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because they are not available at the same scale. Please show me the Colt warehouse where I can pick up a ready to go gun But but if you source all this stuff for a more money you will have a perfect clone. I get it some of you guys really want every detail to match down to the last roll pin. That is fine if you want to do that journey but some of us want to buy something take it out of the box slap in a mag and get shooting. Being perfectly clone correct and having a Colt does not matter that much to me I just want something along the line of the M4A1 or M4 which I have a DD rail I can toss on it and it will look close enough. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:42:58 AM EST
[#29]
This is why we can’t have nice things, Sorry PSA
Does this happen in dagger threads that a blue label Glock is $125 more? |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:49:45 AM EST
[#30]
It's been a few years, but when I was looking for an RAS for an M16A4 build, I saw bins of used carbine-length RAS rails for $60-80 each at gun shows. Is that no longer the case?
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:51:43 AM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As mentioned before, the colt Socoms that are $350 more than the PSA are advertised as US government property marked. And you get a socom profile barrel, and kac marked RAS. That’s way more than a $350 value difference imho. Value wise the colt socom is a way way better deal. I'm commenting on the individual that keeps pushing the oem 1 not the colt socoms... |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:51:59 AM EST
[#32]
Also, you're never going to be "correct" when it comes to "cloning" a select-fire weapon. Why get caught-up in the minutia?
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:54:38 AM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's been a few years, but when I was looking for an RAS for an M16A4 build, I saw bins of used carbine-length RAS rails for $60-80 each at gun shows. Is that no longer the case? Very much doubt it now. Anything KAC is treated like they are coated in unicorn blood and the die hard cloners will pay the sticker price for them. If it were me and I were paying that price I would just get a DD Omega rail it at least is free float and keeps the delta ring/nut so you have the look but also free float. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 10:08:46 AM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because they are not available at the same scale. Please show me the Colt warehouse where I can pick up a ready to go gun Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Except the thing is they carried a Colt. Why clone something that is available? Because they are not available at the same scale. Please show me the Colt warehouse where I can pick up a ready to go gun What are you talking about? https://gun.deals/search/apachesolr_search/le6920socom |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 10:32:48 AM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryStill 1300, 16", and not CHF |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 1:20:39 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Still 1300, 16", and not CHF Quote HistoryQuoted: Still 1300, 16", and not CHF It's an actual Colt 14.5" M4A1 SOCOM barrel pinned and welded to 16.1", made by the company that makes tens of thousands of actual M4A1 SOCOM barrels. It's not a clone, it's the actual real thing. This doesn't meet your requirements?  |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 5:01:20 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's an actual Colt 14.5" M4A1 SOCOM barrel pinned and welded to 16.1", made by the company that makes tens of thousands of actual M4A1 SOCOM barrels. It's not a clone, it's the actual real thing. This doesn't meet your requirements? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Still 1300, 16", and not CHF It's an actual Colt 14.5" M4A1 SOCOM barrel pinned and welded to 16.1", made by the company that makes tens of thousands of actual M4A1 SOCOM barrels. It's not a clone, it's the actual real thing. This doesn't meet your requirements? The colt socom is the closest thing to the real deal and if I didn't have one I'd jump on the psa version. I kinda want one anyway  Probably should spend it on an H&R flavor if I dropped close to that though. Love gwot stuff |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 5:30:54 PM EST
[#38]
I think it's a solid rifle. Might think about the 16 for a beater.
Make one with a 14.5 Socom profile, proper gas port size, H2 buffer, and a pinned SF4P and Id give you a grand for it.
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Posted: 10/4/2023 6:17:57 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm commenting on the individual that keeps pushing the oem 1 not the colt socoms... Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm commenting on the individual that keeps pushing the oem 1 not the colt socoms... So wanting US property markings is valid, but wanting a Colt logo instead of PSA is boomer Fudd crap as it was called? Why get an M4A1 clone at all if you’re not looking for a clone? This conversation went from “it’s as close as you can get without spending a ton of money” to “none of that shit matters unless you’re a boomer” when other similarly priced options are presented. I don’t own a single Colt product and own two PSA rifles. I’m just not a fan boi so I don’t see value in this rifle. It’s a clone of an outdated configuration coming in too close in price to the real deal. Quoted: If you cannot see it then you are blind. In this very thread you have guys bitching about stupid details only idiots fight over. Most vetbros don't give a fuck and want a gun that is available easy and done. Just what psa offers. Saying colt is better after multiple company failures and NO new innovations in 40 years is laughable. Tell me where I said Colt was better, or PSA is inferior. I’ll wait…. What I really said is if someone wants a clone of this level of detail, stuff like brand will likely matter, and cost doesn’t prohibit them from getting a rifle made by the same manufacturer they carried compared to the PSA. Saying only Fudds care about the markings is stupid, because this whole rifle is built on authenticity, including the markings to the legal extent PSA was capable. It’s like building a kit car made to look exactly like a Ferrari then saying Ferraris look gay. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 6:38:45 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So wanting US property markings is valid, but wanting a Colt logo instead of PSA is boomer Fudd crap as it was called? Why get an M4A1 clone at all if you’re not looking for a clone? This conversation went from “it’s as close as you can get without spending a ton of money” to “none of that shit matters unless you’re a boomer” when other similarly priced options are presented. I don’t own a single Colt product and own two PSA rifles. I’m just not a fan boi so I don’t see value in this rifle. It’s a clone of an outdated configuration coming in too close in price to the real deal. Tell me where I said Colt was better, or PSA is inferior. I’ll wait…. What I really said is if someone wants a clone of this level of detail, stuff like brand will likely matter, and cost doesn’t prohibit them from getting a rifle made by the same manufacturer they carried compared to the PSA. Saying only Fudds care about the markings is stupid, because this whole rifle is built on authenticity, including the markings to the legal extent PSA was capable. It’s like building a kit car made to look exactly like a Ferrari then saying Ferraris look gay. Tell me where I ever said anything about fudds anything? I could care less if someone wants a colt collectors socom, fn collectors, or a psa rifle. As I stated both rifles have a market and value. Hell many prior service guys and team/oda guys use psa stripped lowers to build our block 1 and block II builds because the parts we put into them and the look is more important than having Colt stamped on the lower. People keep harping that Colt is what the rifles were, well guess what. There were Fn rifles as well and other sub contracted uppers and barrels and parts that went on the rifles and not just Colt. Companies like DSarms were contractors, remington, rosco, and more. So there were a hodge podge of uppers and parts throughout the gwot the m4 and m4a1. Just the fact you are trying to compare a Colt to a Ferrari is laughable in itself. My first civilian m4 was a Rra Entry Tactical right after the awb expired and I set it up like my duty rifle. Reason I got it vs a colt was it was about half the price yet just as reliable at the time and didn't have all the stupid civilian features colt put on theirs. I did this so I could have more range time during my off time. This was while I was still Enlisted. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 7:34:54 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tell me where I ever said anything about fudds anything? I could care less if someone wants a colt collectors socom, fn collectors, or a psa rifle. As I stated both rifles have a market and value. Hell many prior service guys and team/oda guys use psa stripped lowers to build our block 1 and block II builds because the parts we put into them and the look is more important than having Colt stamped on the lower. People keep harping that Colt is what the rifles were, well guess what. There were Fn rifles as well and other sub contracted uppers and barrels and parts that went on the rifles and not just Colt. Companies like DSarms were contractors, remington, rosco, and more. So there were a hodge podge of uppers and parts throughout the gwot the m4 and m4a1. Just the fact you are trying to compare a Colt to a Ferrari is laughable in itself. My first civilian m4 was a Rra Entry Tactical right after the awb expired and I set it up like my duty rifle. Reason I got it vs a colt was it was about half the price yet just as reliable at the time and didn't have all the stupid civilian features colt put on theirs. I did this so I could have more range time during my off time. This was while I was still Enlisted. I never said you called them Fudd crap. It’s obvious you could care less by arguing with me over things that I haven’t even argued. I’ve never once said PSA is inferior. I said if someone is going to look for a rifle as true to spec as PSA is offering in that price range, they’ll likely prefer the Colt as this doesn’t offer a significant price reduction like every other single PSA clone. I didn’t compare Colt to Ferrari. That’s what’s called an analogy. And of course you bought the RRA at half the price. It was a clone of the Colt at a significantly reduced cost. Which is exactly the point I’ve been making this entire time. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 7:48:13 PM EST
[#42]
Close enough for me. I like it.
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:00:59 PM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who cares what something is worth in 20 years? I do not buy guns to sell them just like cars I do not buy a car and worry about resale value. I shoot my guns and drive the wheels off a car and will keep fixing it till it is expensive to fix or I really really want something else. I never understood this mentality you buy a gun and your thought is resale value not fun factor or just want? Colt does make a nice AR probably will buy one of those one day probably. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If you can install a P&S rail, pistol grip, and stock yourself the M4 marked Colt OEM1 is a better buy. May not be M4A1 profile but no one is going to choose a PSA gun over that, nor will the PSA be worth a fourth as much 20 years from now. It's cool they're doing all these clones don't get me wrong, but this one is kind of meh. Who cares what something is worth in 20 years? I do not buy guns to sell them just like cars I do not buy a car and worry about resale value. I shoot my guns and drive the wheels off a car and will keep fixing it till it is expensive to fix or I really really want something else. I never understood this mentality you buy a gun and your thought is resale value not fun factor or just want? Colt does make a nice AR probably will buy one of those one day probably. you dont save your girlfriend for the next guy either |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:01:42 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I never said you called them Fudd crap. It’s obvious you could care less by arguing with me over things that I haven’t even argued. I’ve never once said PSA is inferior. I said if someone is going to look for a rifle as true to spec as PSA is offering in that price range, they’ll likely prefer a Colt and that this doesn’t offer a significant price reduction like every other single PSA clone. I didn’t compare Colt to Ferrari. That’s what’s called an analogy. And of course you bought the RRA at half the price. It was a clone of a Colt at a significantly reduced cost. Which is exactly the point I’ve been making this entire time. At the time colt had all sorts of civilian bs on their guns, so it was far more than that and bushmaster and rra had gov contracts as well at the time. Colt was charging way more for a rifle that was nothing like my military rifle. Had oversized trigger pins, sear block shelf for the bolt so it couldn't have a full auto bcg, etc. So I got a better rifle with the RRa than the Colt offerings at the time. Your last time addressing me you said I said or implied " So wanting US property markings is valid, but wanting a Colt logo instead of PSA is boomer Fudd crap as it was called?" Never once did I ever say or imply any of that.. that was another poster.. " I’ve never once said PSA is inferior" again you are putting words in my mouth. Where did I ever say you said this or accuse you of this? I made a statement about people talking about colt being the rifle that was issued and then explained it wasn't the only one issued and that there were also a hodge podge of parts on those rifles as well. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:05:16 PM EST
[#45]
Some of you bitch about everything.
It's a cool carbine; I dig it. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 8:15:49 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Also, you're never going to be "correct" when it comes to "cloning" a select-fire weapon. Why get caught-up in the minutia? never underestimate the ridiculousness of some cloners. People were getting hung up on the font size/spacing of PSA clone lowers. Having UID labels made. As far as I see it, this is a good enough option at a reasonable price for 98% of the people that want a clone. The remaining 2% will spend hundreds of extra dollars to get as clone correct as possible. Why there is so much purse swinging out there I don't know. Either option is available based on individual wants/budget, that is not a bad thing. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 10:38:35 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: At the time colt had all sorts of civilian bs on their guns, so it was far more than that and bushmaster and rra had gov contracts as well at the time. Colt was charging way more for a rifle that was nothing like my military rifle. Had oversized trigger pins, sear block shelf for the bolt so it couldn't have a full auto bcg, etc. So I got a better rifle with the RRa than the Colt offerings at the time. Your last time addressing me you said I said or implied " So wanting US property markings is valid, but wanting a Colt logo instead of PSA is boomer Fudd crap as it was called?" Never once did I ever say or imply any of that.. that was another poster.. " I’ve never once said PSA is inferior" again you are putting words in my mouth. Where did I ever say you said this or accuse you of this? I made a statement about people talking about colt being the rifle that was issued and then explained it wasn't the only one issued and that there were also a hodge podge of parts on those rifles as well. You stated earlier that the markings wouldn’t be exact so markings didn’t matter on a clone anyway. Apologies as I misinterpreted that as agreeing with the one guy that “markings are for Fudds” but I see now where the conversation deviated. I’m not sure how this snowballed into all this. I’m not a Colt fan boy and love PSA, but I genuinely feel this rifle doesn’t fit well amongst their value packed clone offerings. That doesn’t mean it’s not a good rifle by any means, but in a PSA world of costing 50-90% off of the rifles they’re cloning normally, I just don’t see as much appeal. If someone else does I’m 100% sure I’m not going to stop them from buying it. If they offered a Freedom nitride version with the RAS but no Matech for $500, I’d be all over it. My only M4 profile rifle is a PSA and unfortunately I missed out on the $60 RAS sale. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 11:01:48 PM EST
[#48]
Clone lowers were my idea from the “PSA has lost a customer” thread in 2018.
While some argue these are silly and how cloners are weird, PSA has sold THOUSANDS. |
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Posted: 10/4/2023 11:11:00 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You stated earlier that the markings wouldn’t be exact so markings didn’t matter on a clone anyway. Apologies as I misinterpreted that as agreeing with the one guy that “markings are for Fudds” but I see now where the conversation deviated. I’m not sure how this snowballed into all this. I’m not a Colt fan boy and love PSA, but I genuinely feel this rifle doesn’t fit well amongst their value packed clone offerings. That doesn’t mean it’s not a good rifle by any means, but in a PSA world of costing 50-90% off of the rifles they’re cloning normally, I just don’t see as much appeal. If someone else does I’m 100% sure I’m not going to stop them from buying it. If they offered a Freedom nitride version with the RAS but no Matech for $500, I’d be all over it. I do feel it should be closer to 800 or 750 than 950, but I don't know what they are paying for the fn barrel or ras. Dsarms sold their version for 1200 dsarms m4a1 No my refrence for the markings not being the same again was just directed at the person that kept pushing the 6920 oem 1 as the better option at the same or less price than the psa when the markings were not correct, barrel was too long, you had to buy the extra parts etc. All this did not make the 6920 oem 1 anywhere near a good option compared to the psa. It would be a much better option to just buy the Colt collectors socom than buy the 6920 oem 1. I think some people the psa will be a good choice and perfectly fine. They can spend the 950 and the 300 to 400 on ammo that the Colt would run them.. Then there are people that will want the Colt because the markings and pay more. That's fine also.. Then people like me that wants a different muzzle device, so I'm spending more money on Colt parts mostly and using a stripped psa lower because I won't find a colt gov lower or pay price for one. As long as my lower says property of us gov and m4, I don't care if it says Colt, fn, or psa. I'm building the rifle, so I know the quality and I don't ever plan on selling it. |
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Posted: 10/5/2023 12:04:59 AM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I do feel it should be closer to 800 or 750 than 950, but I don't know what they are paying for the fn barrel or ras. Dsarms sold their version for 1200 dsarms m4a1 No my refrence for the markings not being the same again was just directed at the person that kept pushing the 6920 oem 1 as the better option at the same or less price than the psa when the markings were not correct, barrel was too long, you had to buy the extra parts etc. All this did not make the 6920 oem 1 anywhere near a good option compared to the psa. It would be a much better option to just buy the Colt collectors socom than buy the 6920 oem 1. I think some people the psa will be a good choice and perfectly fine. They can spend the 950 and the 300 to 400 on ammo that the Colt would run them.. Then there are people that will want the Colt because the markings and pay more. That's fine also.. Then people like me that wants a different muzzle device, so I'm spending more money on Colt parts mostly and using a stripped psa lower because I won't find a colt gov lower or pay price for one. As long as my lower says property of us gov and m4, I don't care if it says Colt, fn, or psa. I'm building the rifle, so I know the quality and I don't ever plan on selling it. That was me that said I’d go with an OEM myself. That’s a difference of opinion though. If I was a clone guy I’d want the Colt logo with the M4 markings and UID engraving more than the US property. But I’m not much of a clone guy and don’t like the Block 1 much anyway. The URGI would be more my style but I don’t have the self control to not change things to the way I like. |
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