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Posted: 5/7/2020 9:20:37 PM EDT
[#1]
I really don’t find it any more difficult to carry a G17 over a G19, with both in a supertuck. Since they carry the same for me, I carry the G17.
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:03:56 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Garandboy: NYPD has been using the G19 as a duty weapon since the 90's. Has worked just fine. Come again? Same NYPD that has like a 2% hit rate? |
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:05:09 PM EDT
[#3]
For those who know how much does 9mm benefit from the extra .7-1" of barrel a full size offers over something like the G19?
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:10:18 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bcw107: My son's M18 came with a 17 round flush fit and two 21 round magazines. M18 has a compact barrel and a full size grip. |
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:13:10 PM EDT
[#5]
between my G17 and my G19.....i actually shoot my G19 better.....odd considering i have big gorilla mits but the targets dont lie.
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:15:50 PM EDT
[#6]
To me a CCW pistol is a compromise that's used to Un-ass the situtation or to access the TRUNK OF DEATH™
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:21:46 PM EDT
[#7]
43x with a 15 round mag will replace the g19 as the thinking mans gun
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:25:33 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By inkaybee: 43x with a 15 round mag will replace the g19 as the thinking mans gun But a Glock 17 or 34 will be the shooting man's gun. 
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Posted: 5/7/2020 10:50:43 PM EDT
[#9]
We're trading in our P2000s for Glock 19s.
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Posted: 5/7/2020 11:04:21 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 45FMJoe: We're trading in our P2000s for Glock 19s. How do you feel about that? |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 12:07:58 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By vanilla_gorilla: Apparently, a compact slide and full-sized grip is the new combat pistol. I'm not sure how that makes sense, but it's the new hotness. Have you tried it? This configuration is about as good as it gets when it comes to a balanced platform IMO. It's a configuration that is scalable and works equally well with pistols like the G19 and P320 as well as smaller ones like the G43X and the P365 with an XL module. I can see the benifits of using a smaller pistol like the 43X/48 and P365/XL but while capacities are up there with the G19 and P320 I don't know that shootability, durability, as well as configurability is on par with the G19 and P320. So while the 43X/48 and P365/XL make great EDC pistols, I don't think they would make as great of combat pistols. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 12:13:57 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By INV136: Why would anyone use a "backup" pistol as their primary, duty weapon? Seems stupid to me. I've always carried full size pistols on/off duty and I continue to after I retired. What is really pathetic is people carrying only a pocket pistol as their EDC primary weapon, especially if they don't carry spare magazines. Sorry, bro. Not putting on full battle rattle when I’m throwing sweatpants on to grab brewskies and frozen pizza. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 12:30:55 AM EDT
[#13]
Every little bit of weight that can be saved, and bulk too for that matter helps.
I don't think we need the heavier Beretta 92's, Sig 226's, or ever Glock full size pistols to be the standard per say. The G19, Sig229, Sig 320C, etc, are all worth it, they suffer not from a shorter barrel or shorter sight radius. I carry a Sig 320C/9mm on duty. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 12:32:08 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SemperFo: Sorry, bro. Not putting on full battle rattle when I’m throwing sweatpants on to grab brewskies and frozen pizza. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SemperFo: Originally Posted By INV136: Why would anyone use a "backup" pistol as their primary, duty weapon? Seems stupid to me. I've always carried full size pistols on/off duty and I continue to after I retired. What is really pathetic is people carrying only a pocket pistol as their EDC primary weapon, especially if they don't carry spare magazines. Sorry, bro. Not putting on full battle rattle when I’m throwing sweatpants on to grab brewskies and frozen pizza. 
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Posted: 5/8/2020 12:37:37 AM EDT
[#15]
Pistol with barrel 4" or greater
15+ rounds Service Pistol. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 1:14:37 AM EDT
[#16]
CZ P01 / PCR and P225 sized guns have been service pistols in Europe for a while now. We are going to catch up eventually - or not. It is merica after all.
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Posted: 5/8/2020 1:18:06 AM EDT
[#17]
Absolutely not. Maybe for women or men with small hands (I'm not trying to be a dick) but for a lot of adult men, a full size service pistol fits the hand much more comfortably. If concealment is not an issue, why not carry a larger more comfortable pistol with a higher capacity?
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:05:47 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: CZ P01 / PCR and P225 sized guns have been service pistols in Europe for a while now. We are going to catch up eventually - or not. It is merica after all. Europe also was using .32 and .380 as primary police cartridges for a long time, too... |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:10:45 AM EDT
[#19]
My Duty weapon was a G19.
I loved it. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:19:21 AM EDT
[#20]
If I was a cop, I would want something like a P-09 with 3 round mag extensions or a 2011. I shoot bigger guns better, faster, and as a primary weapon I'd rather have 22+1 and a full size grip, full size WML.
If I have a rifle as a primary weapon I absolutely see the utility in a G19 or even a G48 sized sidearm. I can and do conceal a G19 with an RDS and WML and I shoot it well, but it wouldn't be my choice if I thought carrying OWB unconcealed made practical sense. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:23:01 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By vanilla_gorilla: Apparently, a compact slide and full-sized grip is the new combat pistol. I'm not sure how that makes sense, but it's the new hotness. I hear you. I would rather have a G17 slide with a G19 grip. The slide is easy to hide, the grip is what prints. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:38:11 AM EDT
[#22]
As a rule, I would say not for uniform patrol.
Admins, plain clothed, etc, sure |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:38:20 AM EDT
[#23]
You will pry my G17 from my cold, dead, hands.
I have big hands, the 19 is just a little cramped. The Gen 5 without the finger grooves help quite a bit, but if I have to grab quick and draw, the extra grip space that the 17 gives me is worth it. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:42:26 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: I hear you. I would rather have a G17 slide with a G19 grip. The slide is easy to hide, the grip is what prints. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: Originally Posted By vanilla_gorilla: Apparently, a compact slide and full-sized grip is the new combat pistol. I'm not sure how that makes sense, but it's the new hotness. I hear you. I would rather have a G17 slide with a G19 grip. The slide is easy to hide, the grip is what prints. Everyone says this until they actually try that set up. It's garbage. It doesn't balance well and you gain nothing more than a slightly longer sight radius and a negligible amount bullet velocity. If you are using a red dot though that longer sight radius is pointless. It is the least useful set up for a pistol IMO. The carry/commander set up just works better for a combat pistol. You get capacity, you clear the holster faster, it balances better and if you are wearing it on your belt while driving the muzzle is not getting pressed into the seat. It still conceals just fine. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:51:29 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lacoochee: I know right? A real man would be able to hide a Glock 19 in his shorts pocket under a t-shirt walking around in Florida. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lacoochee: Originally Posted By Weasel1201: Yeah 5 rds of .357 magnum in my front pocket is pathetic. P01 aiwb isn't that bad with a t-shirt, though it helps if your waist is smaller than your chest, which is less and less common these days. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:53:42 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By C4H10FO2P: I think so. The whole point of a handgun is to be unobtrusive, and a Glock 19 or SIG M18 doesn't give up much compared to a Glock 17 or SIG M17. Smaller is easier to carry. Yep. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:54:56 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bourbonator: P01 aiwb isn't that bad with a t-shirt, though it helps if your waist is smaller than your chest, which is less and less common these days. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bourbonator: Originally Posted By Lacoochee: Originally Posted By Weasel1201: Yeah 5 rds of .357 magnum in my front pocket is pathetic. P01 aiwb isn't that bad with a t-shirt, though it helps if your waist is smaller than your chest, which is less and less common these days. I was surfing YT yesterday and came across a guy that makes AIWB holsters for fat guys.  The holster rides lower almost below the belt line and then the guy has to lift his fat up to get to the pistol. ETA: Found it.   The FAT GUY Holster // How FAT GUYS Appendix Carry |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:56:33 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Everyone says this until they actually try that set up. It's garbage. It doesn't balance well and you gain nothing more than a slightly longer sight radius and a negligible amount bullet velocity. If you are using a red dot though that longer sight radius is pointless. It is the least useful set up for a pistol IMO. The carry/commander set up just works better for a combat pistol. You get capacity, you clear the holster faster, it balances better and if you are wearing it on your belt while driving the muzzle is not getting pressed into the seat. It still conceals just fine. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:58:24 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Charlie_Foxtrot: I was surfing YT yesterday and came across a guy that makes AIWB holsters for fat guys. The holster rides lower almost below the belt line and then the guy has to lift his fat up to get to the pistol. ETA: Found it.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFcdMHF7PYcQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By Charlie_Foxtrot: Originally Posted By Bourbonator: Originally Posted By Lacoochee: Originally Posted By Weasel1201: Yeah 5 rds of .357 magnum in my front pocket is pathetic. P01 aiwb isn't that bad with a t-shirt, though it helps if your waist is smaller than your chest, which is less and less common these days. I was surfing YT yesterday and came across a guy that makes AIWB holsters for fat guys. The holster rides lower almost below the belt line and then the guy has to lift his fat up to get to the pistol. ETA: Found it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFcdMHF7PYcIt's called pannus |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 2:59:12 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kuraki: Then why are 5" barrels still the norm in competition? Everything you cited should be a competitive advantage. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kuraki: Originally Posted By Charlie_Foxtrot: Everyone says this until they actually try that set up. It's garbage. It doesn't balance well and you gain nothing more than a slightly longer sight radius and a negligible amount bullet velocity. If you are using a red dot though that longer sight radius is pointless. It is the least useful set up for a pistol IMO. The carry/commander set up just works better for a combat pistol. You get capacity, you clear the holster faster, it balances better and if you are wearing it on your belt while driving the muzzle is not getting pressed into the seat. It still conceals just fine. Because of rules and weight advantages. Also the holsters used in competion do not use hardly any retention and most are open designs that are not practical outside of gun games. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 3:02:53 AM EDT
[#31]
Shortly after I started LE in 1988 I bought and carried the 17. Later got a Gen2 17, had problems with it (the same problem that led to a widespread recall of Glocks to have all the internals changed) and had to send it back to Glock. I needed a gun in a hurry so I traded my folding stock Chinese AK for a new Glock 19. I liked carrying and shooting that 19 so much that I never used the replacement 17 Glock sent me and sold it to my brother, who later sold it again. The 19 seemed like such a small pistol compared to the 17 at the time, but now a 19 seems big to me what with the slimline Glocks I also have.
I really wish I had kept that AK though. It later became worth a lot of money. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 3:06:44 AM EDT
[#32]
Already been done. I carried a G19 as a patrolman back in 1995. I was carrying a P7M13 when I first started back in 1993 - it’s not much bigger than a G19.
Compact models have been carried for decades as service pistols. Service pistol isn’t synonymous with full size. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 3:08:20 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bourbonator: It's called pannus Gross.
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Posted: 5/8/2020 3:29:57 AM EDT
[#34]
You can make an argument for the longer sight radius and sight bump in velocity from a full-size pistol, but as a practical matter I don't see a G19-sized handgun doing any worse for duty use.
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Posted: 5/8/2020 3:32:33 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When Glock introduced the 19, they dubbed it the 'Pocket Glock'. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 3:52:02 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By crazymoose: The 19 is not the perfect pistol if you have large hands. I have large hands and prefer shooting/carrying a G27 more than my G19 sized G23. I shoot the fat little 27 better. Preferences are subjective. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 3:57:47 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Discolite: This is a very good trend. Less is definitely more Go too small on slide weight and they get rather snappy. My attention was drawn to try a Sig P365. Thought it would be a great CCW to replace my trusty old G27. That little 365 was just as snappy as my fotay. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 4:06:39 AM EDT
[#38]
As much as I prefer a full sized 92FS to anything else, yeah, a G19 is a great package.
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Posted: 5/8/2020 4:10:29 AM EDT
[#39]
I own two 19’s albeit one is a Roland special. I carry a 17 at work. I’ve never been .mil so I can’t/won’t speak to that purpose in regards to this topic.
That being said, stock vs. stock, I pick the g17 every time. Prefer how the slide tracks, the way the recoil feels, and obviously the capacity. I also have large hands, so the 17 is significantly far more comfortable. I have an x300u on most of my guns, so slide length is rarely a concern and the way modern squad cars are, unless you’re petite, most retention OWB holsters get uncomfortable after 6ish hours IMO. As my primary gun, the capacity makes it a no brainer. Off duty? I carry my RS daily (that is until my 2011 is thoroughly broken in and proven trustworthy, another 600 rounds to go), I have 5k on my 17, and over 8k on my Roland. I feel like I’ve got pretty good experience with both models. YMMV |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 4:25:20 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The 19 is not the perfect pistol if you have large hands. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 4:31:32 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I hope so. The 5-inch + "service pistol" is an antiquated concept that goes back to horse mounted cavalry, but just won't seem to go away. As a civvie - something the size of a G19 will do everything I need it to do. I carry it on the weekends (can't really carry it to work), classes, etc. If I really need more rounds on board, then the spare G17 mags should do. Am I in before "muh sight radius" crowd? |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 4:45:59 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have large hands and prefer shooting/carrying a G27 more than my G19 sized G23. I shoot the fat little 27 better. Preferences are subjective. I'm really thinking about trying a G48 with the Shield mags. Tossed around the idea of switching to Sig, but fuck me - I just have too many glock mags, holsters, etc. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 5:00:09 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By boerseun: I actually shoot my G26 better than my G19 or the G17 (when I still had it). Wife is the same...shoots the 26 better. Don't know why that is, but it is. I'm really thinking about trying a G48 with the Shield mags. Tossed around the idea of switching to Sig, but fuck me - I just have too many glock mags, holsters, etc. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By boerseun: Originally Posted By Flysc: I have large hands and prefer shooting/carrying a G27 more than my G19 sized G23. I shoot the fat little 27 better. Preferences are subjective. I'm really thinking about trying a G48 with the Shield mags. Tossed around the idea of switching to Sig, but fuck me - I just have too many glock mags, holsters, etc. I was in the same boat. I shoot the P320 better than the Glock. That is one of the reasons I made the switch. I don't regret my decision at all. The P320 is an excellent pistol. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 5:10:45 AM EDT
[#44]
There's definitely a move toward smaller guns. To each their own. Should the need ever arise to defend your life, having a slightly lighter, smaller gun is unlikely to end up with you being deaded because of that.
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Posted: 5/8/2020 5:39:36 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was in the same boat. I shoot the P320 better than the Glock. That is one of the reasons I made the switch. I don't regret my decision at all. The P320 is an excellent pistol. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 5:57:08 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've carried full size (service) guns. I don't own any of them anymore. I simply don't understand the allure of packing something like a Glock21, 34 or even 17 sized pistolas. As a civvie - something the size of a G19 will do everything I need it to do. I carry it on the weekends (can't really carry it to work), classes, etc. If I really need more rounds on board, then the spare G17 mags should do. Am I in before "muh sight radius" crowd? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I hope so. The 5-inch + "service pistol" is an antiquated concept that goes back to horse mounted cavalry, but just won't seem to go away. As a civvie - something the size of a G19 will do everything I need it to do. I carry it on the weekends (can't really carry it to work), classes, etc. If I really need more rounds on board, then the spare G17 mags should do. Am I in before "muh sight radius" crowd? And I carry a G34 every day. Some days, I even get paid to carry it. For a openly-worn duty gun, I can see a very limited use for G19-sized guns, but it is limited indeed. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 6:08:17 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Garandboy: NYPD has been using the G19 as a duty weapon since the 90's. Has worked just fine. Part of the reason for that is they are required to carry their duty weapon off duty as well. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 8:17:18 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LoneWolf545: Europe also was using .32 and .380 as primary police cartridges for a long time, too... Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By LoneWolf545: Originally Posted By kymarkh: CZ P01 / PCR and P225 sized guns have been service pistols in Europe for a while now. We are going to catch up eventually - or not. It is merica after all. Europe also was using .32 and .380 as primary police cartridges for a long time, too... And not only those calibers, but single stack pistols with “heel” magazine releases at the bottom of the grip, and magazines designed to not drop free. Of course, many European police officers are still unarmed. There is video of one who was executed by a islamic terrorist in Paris. American cops aren’t the ones who need to catch up. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 8:18:55 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: I hear you. I would rather have a G17 slide with a G19 grip. The slide is easy to hide, the grip is what prints. I had that done to the 17 I carry off duty iwb appendix. |
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Posted: 5/8/2020 8:21:41 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Charlie_Foxtrot: Everyone says this until they actually try that set up. It's garbage. It doesn't balance well and you gain nothing more than a slightly longer sight radius and a negligible amount bullet velocity. If you are using a red dot though that longer sight radius is pointless. It is the least useful set up for a pistol IMO. The carry/commander set up just works better for a combat pistol. You get capacity, you clear the holster faster, it balances better and if you are wearing it on your belt while driving the muzzle is not getting pressed into the seat. It still conceals just fine. How much experience do you have with it? I’ve been carrying one concealed iwb for 3 years and routinely place top 5 with it in matches. I also carried it in daily for 2 years when I was in a plainclothes assignment, mostly aiwb, but at about 4 o’clock when I had a light on it. |
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