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WI, USA
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:33:52 PM EDT
[#1]
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:35:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BustinCaps: Can anyone speak to how much of this Soledar operation is in keeping with Russian doctrine? It seems they have done a decent job of the wall of zombies wearing down defenders and most importantly tossing more waves of zombies after success. Eventually defenders need to sleep, rotate, or fail. These 8 man drip attacks followed by more drip attacks and focused shelling of located Ukrainian positions has to be thoroughly exhausting for the defense. At some point they have to be too exhausted to continue, or they have to rotate, at which point another 8 man goon squad is still attacking. It seems like a brutally cynical way to wear down defenses, achieve some kind of success, and prevent one-off mass assault slaughters with rest in between each wave for the defenders. It seems they’ve been tweaking tactics and it is allowing some level of success. Sustainable? Who knows. This is the kind of situation FASCAM and 155mm ADAM were made for. 
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:36:31 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fervid_dryfire: Fun infographic. Makes me sick to learn that we named a carrier after McCain though. Not a carrier, a destroyer/cruiser or something and it was named after his grandfather and father who were both admirals. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:44:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#4]
20 min ago.
   Salt is salt, they are faking claims of capturing the Soledar salt mine as of yet.
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:48:53 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Squatch: Even a shitty D30 can achieve first-round-fire-for-effect if the five elements of accurate predicted fire are achieved - accurate target location and size, firing unit location, weapon and ammunition information, met information, and computational procedures. Barring that, capable observer/FDO teams can FFE after one or two adjusting rounds, giving enemy forces minimal time to find cover. I can't speak to all of those elements, but we know they have ammo supplies from all over the place, and we don't know how good their training for FO's is. I also think that some of our donated M777s had their "boxes" removed before being sent, don't some of those have to do with receiving Met data before firing? All I am saying is, they are probably running backwards uphill in a number of respects. "Free" donated ammo is especially cheap to them when they want to stay in one piece. 
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:51:54 PM EDT
[#6]
Originally Posted By m00ler03:
This is true it appears; I saw pics of Russian units this morning with some kitted in the Ukr cammo, head to toe. I didn’t save the pics, though. Originally Posted By weptek911: Not a carrier, a destroyer/cruiser or something and it was named after his grandfather and father who were both admirals. Yes and worth noting - John “Slew” McCain was a real hot-shot and pioneer in carrier aviation. He ran the air war over Guadalcanal, and also had Marc Mitscher’s job at Okinawa - command of all fast carriers. Very trusted and capable. His son John “Jack” McCain was ComPac during much of VietNam - e.g., Halsey’s job. These were big guys in WWII and the Cold War navy. John Jr. fell a little further from the tree in some ways… |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:52:02 PM EDT
[#7]
13 min ago.
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:57:09 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Easterner: A lot of people can't grasp the concept that there are people in this world that aren't afraid to leave the comfort zone and do something to bring about changes. People here are sick of any corruption. Many of the youth leave for places like Poland to work. Of course they want to be a part of Europe and have more opportunities here at home. They made that clear in Maiden. When this war really kicked off i was overwhelmed to see how many people showed up to volunteer. The military office was packed, the park that became a volunteer center was packed. It was full of cars and trucks full of donations of clothes and food, thousands of people, classes on making Molotovs, people volunteering to serve. Despite what was happening, it was the most calm and organized effort. I was truly shocked how everyone kept their heads. It is a stark difference from what I would expect in America these days.  I love America, but many Americans have become too comfortable. They show this in their disbelief, that people exist in this world that will stand up for their beliefs. I've said this before but Ukraine is acting more American than America. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 5:58:53 PM EDT
[#9]
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:00:38 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m00ler03:
They lose any Geneva Convention protections doing that. Summary executions for any they capture. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:04:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Jack67]
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet: They lose any Geneva Convention protections doing that. Summary executions for any they capture. Here’s an actual video of Wagner guys, one conspicuously in full Ukr gear, giving an interview. This vid clip is edited down to focus on him:
I *heard* they were using it tactically - to confuse Ukraine defenders. OTOH, they could be so desperate they are using captured stores. But they aren’t mixing the gear it appears but rather consciously kitting out a few in full Ukr gear. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:05:42 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Awesome! Just down the road from me |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:06:42 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: Here’s an actual video of Wagner guys, one conspicuously in full Ukr gear, giving an interview. This vid clip is edited down to focus on him:
I *heard* they were using it tactically - to confuse Ukraine defenders. OTOH, they could be so desperate they are using captured stores. But they aren’t mixing the gear it appears but rather consciously kitting out a few in full Ukr gear. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet: They lose any Geneva Convention protections doing that. Summary executions for any they capture. Here’s an actual video of Wagner guys, one conspicuously in full Ukr gear, giving an interview. This vid clip is edited down to focus on him:
I *heard* they were using it tactically - to confuse Ukraine defenders. OTOH, they could be so desperate they are using captured stores. But they aren’t mixing the gear it appears but rather consciously kitting out a few in full Ukr gear. They aren't wearing ID color bands either. |
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WY, USA
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:10:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Rorschach test?
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:14:56 PM EDT
[#15]
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:18:33 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: They aren't wearing ID color bands either. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Originally Posted By Jack67: Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet: They lose any Geneva Convention protections doing that. Summary executions for any they capture. Here's an actual video of Wagner guys, one conspicuously in full Ukr gear, giving an interview. This vid clip is edited down to focus on him:
I *heard* they were using it tactically - to confuse Ukraine defenders. OTOH, they could be so desperate they are using captured stores. But they aren't mixing the gear it appears but rather consciously kitting out a few in full Ukr gear. They aren't wearing ID color bands either. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:19:56 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet: They lose any Geneva Convention protections doing that. Summary executions for any they capture. Wagner has already proven they should not make it out of this alive. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:22:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: OBird]
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: So you want to argue over the degree? Fine the US was only a little bit pregnant Two things: 1) That’s not a fair comparison; pregnancy is an objective, binary, yes-or-no condition, like being dead vs alive or male vs female. “Involvement” in something is a subjective, gradient condition. For example, I am technically “involved” in the earth’s revolving around the sun, and “influencing” the US presidency by voting. That doesn’t mean I set the length of a year, or have any more impact on who is president than any other voting citizen. 2) I’m not exactly sure what point you’re making, but it seems to be moot regardless. Let’s assume, for a moment, that the CIA was the mastermind behind maidan. So they succeeded in helping Ukraine get rid of a Russian puppet (or at least “Russia-accommodating”) president, and replaced with someone else. So what? Doesn’t mean Russia can just start lobbing cruise missiles at Ukraine. Would Iran suddenly have the moral standing to invade Iraq, just because a third party (like Israel) helped orchestrate a revolution to get Iranian-influenced politicians out of power in Iraq? It’s pointless quibbling, even IF Russian propaganda was right. I don’t get the point of even really bringing it up. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:23:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#19]
8 min ago.
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:26:42 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: Wagner has already proven they should not make it out of this alive. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet: They lose any Geneva Convention protections doing that. Summary executions for any they capture. Wagner has already proven they should not make it out of this alive. Russia itself says Wagner is illegal and non-military. At best, they qualify for AQ and Taliban treatment under international law. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:29:53 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: Here's an actual video of Wagner guys, one conspicuously in full Ukr gear, giving an interview. This vid clip is edited down to focus on him:
I *heard* they were using it tactically - to confuse Ukraine defenders. OTOH, they could be so desperate they are using captured stores. But they aren't mixing the gear it appears but rather consciously kitting out a few in full Ukr gear. Yeah, since they're even having crowdfunding campaigns in Russia to get their troops ECW gear. It is reasonable to think they're raiding some abandoned Ukrainian positions or dead Ukrainians for better cold weather gear. Entirely different though if it's to confuse the Ukrainian forces. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:32:11 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m00ler03:
This is common tactic by Wagner and Khadyrovites. I could see it being a thing |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:38:37 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet: Yeah, since they're even having crowdfunding campaigns in Russia to get their troops ECW gear. It is reasonable to think they're raiding some abandoned Ukrainian positions or dead Ukrainians for better cold weather gear. Entirely different though if it's to confuse the Ukrainian forces. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet: Originally Posted By Jack67: Here's an actual video of Wagner guys, one conspicuously in full Ukr gear, giving an interview. This vid clip is edited down to focus on him:
I *heard* they were using it tactically - to confuse Ukraine defenders. OTOH, they could be so desperate they are using captured stores. But they aren't mixing the gear it appears but rather consciously kitting out a few in full Ukr gear. Yeah, since they're even having crowdfunding campaigns in Russia to get their troops ECW gear. It is reasonable to think they're raiding some abandoned Ukrainian positions or dead Ukrainians for better cold weather gear. Entirely different though if it's to confuse the Ukrainian forces. Turkey and Belorussia were making Ukrainian camo and uniforms, also patches etc before. I don’t think they are capturing large stores but could pull off captured guys too. However it only works once or twice. Unfortunately I ran into this in March. Heightened who the fuck are you and confusion. The need for mil passports etc that take weeks and a contract etc. slows reserve movements. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:53:23 PM EDT
[#24]
Some of you would argue about how brown a turd is.
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Posted: 1/10/2023 6:53:24 PM EDT
[#25]
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:04:07 PM EDT
[#26]
G. C. From MI boxes received and appreciated
Will fill in once the stuff goes out! Might get rerouted to Soledar unfortunately but that’s what we do. Bhakmut and Soledar are same general supply route so no big deal there. Mila says 🙏  Attached File |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:18:37 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: But we are being told that the 25mm will punch clean through the turrets on the Missouri... iirc the Brad gunner can switch ammo types he will shoot. Can it switch back and forth between HEI and the APDS? There are two feed chutes, one for the HEI-T and one for APFSDS-T. Loading them is a pain in teh ass and will slice your hands. Feed chutes are sharp. You flip a switch and it will fire whatever round is next up, then the round you selected. The feedchutes run back to the ammo cans under the dismounts floorboards. Obviously there are ballistics algorithms associated with different trajectories. HEI-T is really effective for punching HE rounds into the face of a defender and you can keep it right in front of the trench clearing guys...closer then a tank, obviously. SO the sweet spot is 400 meters. Outside of RPG-7 range but close enough you can punch HEI to help clear teh trench...or COAX if you are really cutting it close. |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:21:34 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: So you want to argue over the degree? Fine the US was only a little bit pregnant What an incredibly simpleminded statement. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:27:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: CharlieR]
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BustinCaps: Can anyone speak to how much of this Soledar operation is in keeping with Russian doctrine? It seems they have done a decent job of the wall of zombies wearing down defenders and most importantly tossing more waves of zombies after success. Eventually defenders need to sleep, rotate, or fail. These 8 man drip attacks followed by more drip attacks and focused shelling of located Ukrainian positions has to be thoroughly exhausting for the defense. At some point they have to be too exhausted to continue, or they have to rotate, at which point another 8 man goon squad is still attacking. It seems like a brutally cynical way to wear down defenses, achieve some kind of success, and prevent one-off mass assault slaughters with rest in between each wave for the defenders. It seems they’ve been tweaking tactics and it is allowing some level of success. Sustainable? Who knows. Its the sort of things Russians do, but it is not written down. SO no, it isn't doctrine. In general, patrolling to identify positions and pound them with HE is everyone's doctrine...the suicidal squad attacks aren't accomplishing anything. Sending a patrol forward to ID a position, losing a soldier or two, then pounding that newly discovered position with HE and killing a dozen is a brutal way of doing it, but numbers don't lie. In the US Army an attack on a trench is a platoon task. You need 20 guys to shoot at the bad guys to pin them down. Squads don't generate enough firepower to pin anyone down and close with the trench. I think night attacks may work better, also. No matter how good night vision is, it cant be much worse then a daylight frontal assault. Crawl up at three in the morning and rush with automatic weapons and grenades, trench raid style. There have been periods of no moon that would have worked better then broad daylight over the last few weeks. A frontal daylight assault on a trench is really the 1st percentile of tactics. Anything is better. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:29:20 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BustinCaps: Can anyone speak to how much of this Soledar operation is in keeping with Russian doctrine? It seems they have done a decent job of the wall of zombies wearing down defenders and most importantly tossing more waves of zombies after success. Eventually defenders need to sleep, rotate, or fail. These 8 man drip attacks followed by more drip attacks and focused shelling of located Ukrainian positions has to be thoroughly exhausting for the defense. At some point they have to be too exhausted to continue, or they have to rotate, at which point another 8 man goon squad is still attacking. It seems like a brutally cynical way to wear down defenses, achieve some kind of success, and prevent one-off mass assault slaughters with rest in between each wave for the defenders. It seems they've been tweaking tactics and it is allowing some level of success. Sustainable? Who knows. He says Wagner forces are used as cannon fodder to find weak links and then professional soldiers are sent to those positions.  10 Jan: Ukrainians FACE THE HARDEST DECISIONS | War in Ukraine Explained |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:39:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: AlmightyTallest]
[#31]
Turkey began sending Ukraine a form of U.S.-designed, artillery-fired cluster bomb in late 2022 after months of Kyiv pleading with the Biden administration for the munitions, current and former U.S. and European officials familiar with the decision told Foreign Policy, giving Kyiv a powerful—but controversial—weapon to destroy Russian tanks and kill troops on the battlefield. The NATO ally began sending the first batches of so-called dual-purpose improved conventional munitions (DPICMs) in November 2022, which were made during the Cold War era under a co-production agreement with the United States. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:41:33 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: This is the kind of situation FASCAM and 155mm ADAM were made for. https://man.fas.org/dod-101/sys/land/m692_m731_adam_usafas.jpg Mmmm hope the orcs like cheese! |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:42:27 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
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VA, USA
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:48:33 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
I'm thinking we may have seen a video of a strike using one of these in late December? We sort of said, "That looks like clusters but surely not." |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:51:53 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CharlieR: I think night attacks may work better, also. No matter how good night vision is, it cant be much worse then a daylight frontal assault. Crawl up at three in the morning and rush with automatic weapons and grenades, trench raid style. There have been periods of no moon that would have worked better then broad daylight over the last few weeks. A frontal daylight assault on a trench is really the 1st percentile of tactics. Anything is better. agree. it's like infantry 101. depart after dark moving as slow / stealthfully as possible to get into position. attack at bmnt. but that necessitates a bunch of infantry skills that may be lacking (by both sides) at this point in the war. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:53:42 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Interesting. I wonder which country they're importing the parts from? Looks like they've got a pretty good assembly line going. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:55:00 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By vahog: I'm thinking we may have seen a video of a strike using one of these in late December? We sort of said, "That looks like clusters but surely not." Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By vahog: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
I'm thinking we may have seen a video of a strike using one of these in late December? We sort of said, "That looks like clusters but surely not." That was an Israeli cluster mortar round. This will hurt more. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 7:56:10 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By centex_SR-15: He says Wagner forces are used as cannon fodder to find weak links and then professional soldiers are sent to those positions.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERQA0uoPWYUNot at all surprising. The prisoners with wagner have no value. |
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USA
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:04:44 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Banditman: Some of you would argue about how brown a turd is. Are you saying that all turds are brown? Beware of brown poop echo chambers Click To View Spoiler |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:05:26 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:09:14 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By vahog: What an incredibly simpleminded statement. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By vahog: Originally Posted By R0N: So you want to argue over the degree? Fine the US was only a little bit pregnant What an incredibly simpleminded statement. I used to enjoy his insight on artillery, foreign policy is not his forte so I just ignore it. |
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USA
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:09:20 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
 Attached FileThat will save some lives, for sure. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:11:00 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
 Attached File |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:11:56 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:12:07 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Not to put too fine point on it, but basically it’s a Roshak test for intellectual honesty, for months any talk of the US being involved was Russian propaganda. Now, it’s the US was involved but the degree was so small it’s immaterial. It’s like arguing about the degree of pregnancy. I followed the events real time, the people got pissed when the EU deal was scrapped and a deal done with russia against the people's will. If the us orchestrated that, they are way better than I give them credit for. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:13:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ArmyInfantryVet]
[#46]
I guess Russians have put bounties on Brads? Lol, we(USA) live rent free in their heads. At the same time, I guarantee they're saying American equipment is junk compared to Rooshia Stronk AFVs.
 Attached File |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:14:18 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By absael: Better late than never. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By absael: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
this slow roll is bs mismanagement
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:18:03 PM EDT
[#48]
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:21:05 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: So you want to argue over the degree? Fine the US was only a little bit pregnant Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By R0N: Originally Posted By Jack67: Originally Posted By R0N: Not to put too fine point on it, but basically it’s a Roshak test for intellectual honesty, for months any talk of the US being involved was Russian propaganda. Now, it’s the US was involved but the degree was so small it’s immaterial. It’s like arguing about the degree of pregnancy. Please cite one factual, credible source that the US organized the Maidan uprising. Really want to know. So you want to argue over the degree? Fine the US was only a little bit pregnant As usual, talking points with no backup. |
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Posted: 1/10/2023 8:23:39 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryIf Russia really was at war with NATO, we'd have had American servicemen throwing parties inside the Kremlin a long time ago. |
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