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Originally Posted By odiedodi: That was so cringe that I half think they were paid to be there. (Apparently it was put on by a college and participation was mandatory) View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By odiedodi: Originally Posted By outofbattery: . (Apparently it was put on by a college and participation was mandatory) Remember the videos US schools with children singing praise to Obama? |
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Originally Posted By juan223: yea, I wonder if they'll start boarding and searching stuff in international waters like we do View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By juan223: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can't see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn't discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. yea, I wonder if they'll start boarding and searching stuff in international waters like we do But of course I didn't think he was stupid enough to invade Ukraine either so what do I know. |
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"This is the Way"
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Originally Posted By SheltiePimp: They are backing Russia, they will back Russia, they have stated many times they are backing Russia and their role is to negotiate peace (on behalf of Russia). They have made their position extremely clear. They are a hair length away from signing a joint security agreement, similar to what Nato is. This was just before the Olympics when everyone thought Russia wouldn't invade. Russia and China Unveil a Pact Against America and the West In their matching mauve ties, Russia’s Vladimir Putin and China’s Xi Jinping last week declared a “new era” in the global order and, at least in the short term, endorsed their respective territorial ambitions in Ukraine and Taiwan. The world’s two most powerful autocrats unveiled a sweeping long-term agreement that also challenges the United States as a global power, nato as a cornerstone of international security, and liberal democracy as a model for the world. “Friendship between the two States has no limits,” they vowed in the communiqué, released after the two leaders met on the eve of the Beijing Winter Olympics. “There are no ‘forbidden’ areas of cooperation.” Agreements between Moscow and Beijing, including the Treaty of Friendship of 2001, have traditionally been laden with lofty, if vague, rhetoric that faded into forgotten history. But the new and detailed five-thousand-word agreement is more than a collection of the usual tropes, Robert Daly, the director of the Kissinger Institute on China and the United States, at the Wilson Center, in Washington, told me. Although it falls short of a formal alliance, like nato, the agreement reflects a more elaborate show of solidarity than anytime in the past. “This is a pledge to stand shoulder to shoulder against America and the West, ideologically as well as militarily,” Daly said. “This statement might be looked back on as the beginning of Cold War Two.” The timing and clarity of the communiqué—amid tensions on Russia’s border with Europe and China’s aggression around Taiwan—will “give historians the kind of specific event that they often focus on.” Beyond security, the declaration also pledged collaboration on space, climate change, the Internet, and artificial intelligence. Politically, the document claimed that there is “no one-size-fits-all” type of democracy, and heralded both forms of authoritarian rule in Moscow and Beijing as successful democracies. “It’s a pretty striking step closer to an alliance and shows that they’re very much aligned in their vision of the world order in the twenty-first century,” Alexander Vershbow, a former U.S. Ambassador to Russia, told me. Putin described the broader strategic partnership with China as “unprecedented.” Xi said that their joint strategy would have a “far-reaching influence on China, Russia, and the world.” U.S. experts described the lengthy statement, which was riddled with false and accusatory language, as startling. “I’ve never seen a joint statement from both leaders using this kind of language. They’ve joined forces,” Angela Stent, a Russia expert who served at the National Intelligence Council and wrote “Putin’s World: Russia Against the West and with the Rest,” told me. She described the communiqué as “quite Orwellian” and called it an “inflection point” in which Russia and China are challenging the balance of power that has defined the global order since the Cold War ended, three decades ago. “We could be at the beginning of a new era as the Russian relationship with the West deteriorates and China’s does as well.” The agreement puts Washington and its key allies “in a terrible bind,” she added. “The fact is, whatever we do to counter what Russia is doing only reinforces its reliance on China.” The joint statement is, at least for the moment, a diplomatic boon for Putin amid his showdown with the United States and Europe over Ukraine. For the first time in any of Russia’s recent aggressions, Putin has won the open support of China’s leader. China did not back Russia’s war in Georgia in 2008, or its invasion of Ukraine in 2014, nor has it recognized Russia’s annexation of Crimea. Now Moscow and Beijing, which both have the ability to veto any resolution at the United Nations, have declared their opposition to further enlargement of nato and to the formation of other regional security alliances. “Russia and China stand against attempts by external forces to undermine security and stability in their common adjacent regions, intend to counter interference by outside forces in the internal affairs of sovereign countries under any pretext, oppose colour revolutions, and will increase cooperation,” the often unwieldy statement declared. “This is where they pledge their troth,” Daly said. Washington had been pressuring Beijing, including in a call last month between Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi, in an attempt to keep China neutral or out of the Ukraine crisis. Now, at least on paper and in public voice, it has budged, Andrew Weiss, a former National Security Council official who is currently at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, told me. “Russia now has China as an endorser of the egregious and inflammatory position that Putin has staked out on Ukraine.” Hints of China’s shift have been emerging in the past two weeks, as the Ukraine crisis began spilling over onto already tense U.S.-China relations. President Biden’s foreign policy had hoped to steer relations with Beijing toward stable and manageable competition. Instead, China, which is normally discreet in its diplomacy, is visibly pushing back. After his conversation with Blinken last month, the Chinese foreign minister said publicly that Russia’s security concern about nato expansion is legitimate and must be addressed. The Biden Administration countered last week with an admonition. The State Department warned that the West has “an array of tools” to deploy against foreign companies—including in China—that help Russia evade punitive sanctions. In the new agreement, Russia, in turn, reaffirmed its support for Beijing’s One China policy that Taiwan is “an inalienable part of China, and opposes any forms of independence.” The joint communiqué also supported Beijing’s ruthless crackdown on dissidents in Hong Kong in the past two years. The bold assertions in the joint statement follow deepening military ties between the two nations in the past decade, Weiss noted. Russia and China have conducted dozens of joint exercises and war games that have involved as many as ten thousand troops to hone tactical and operational capabilities. Russian officials have boasted that the growing defense partnership was designed to warn the United States and nato not to pressure Moscow. The naval operations have included mock seizures of islands, patrols by long-range bombers over the Sea of Japan and the East China Sea, and surface-to-air missile targeting. Last summer, Putin and Xi both witnessed military exercises in China. In October, they held joint naval exercises off Russia’s far-eastern coast. “The frequency, complexity, and geographic scope has steadily increased, reflecting the growth in the overall bilateral defense relationship,” the U.S. Naval Institute reported last year. As two nuclear-armed countries that span Europe and Asia, the more muscular alignment between Russia and China could be a game changer militarily and diplomatically. “They want this to be as threatening as a formal alliance to the West, but don’t want to formally commit to mutual defense,” Daly said. “They don’t have to. The spectre of their mutual aid will serve as a deterrent.” The joint announcement reflects a shift in the balance of power between Russia and China as well. “The Russians for the longest time were condescending in their view of China as an uninteresting rural society,” Weiss said. “Now China looks at Russia and says, ‘What are you good for?’ China’s ambitions do not run through Moscow.” China has become “canny” in exploiting Russia’s neediness, he said. “It uses Russia as a cat’s paw to disrupt the U.S. pivot to Asia. The fact that we have to keep coming back to Putin, as the neighborhood bully, is beneficial to China.” Putin was the highest-profile leader to show up for the opening of the Winter Olympics in Beijing. The U.S. and other major powers opted not to send high-profile delegations, to protest China’s human-rights abuses, particularly against its Uyghur minority. Russia had received a two-year ban from officially sending teams to the Olympics after conducting a years-long, state-sponsored doping scheme. Russian athletes—who are not supposed to carry their nation’s flag, wear the Russian insignia, or play the national anthem—instead compete as part of the Russian Olympic Committee. After his meeting with Xi, Putin applauded the team during the opening ceremony’s Parade of Nations on Friday. But his visit clearly had another purpose. The question now is how far Russia and China will take their agreement. “Words are one thing,” Vershbow, the former Ambassador, said. “We still have to see if the statement will translate into greater tangible Chinese support for Russia’s aggressive behavior—or whether they’ll say, ‘We’re with you, good luck,’ and then turn the other way.” The Chinese have different and sometimes more pragmatic interests in their relations with the U.S. and Europe, which are vital to their economy. “They don’t want to burn all bridges for the sake of a relationship with Russia.” ---------------------------------------------------- View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By SheltiePimp: Originally Posted By TheLurker: China won't seriously back Russia. Russia just fucked their Taiwan plans. They are backing Russia, they will back Russia, they have stated many times they are backing Russia and their role is to negotiate peace (on behalf of Russia). They have made their position extremely clear. They are a hair length away from signing a joint security agreement, similar to what Nato is. This was just before the Olympics when everyone thought Russia wouldn't invade. Russia and China Unveil a Pact Against America and the West In their matching mauve ties, Russia’s Vladimir Putin and China’s Xi Jinping last week declared a “new era” in the global order and, at least in the short term, endorsed their respective territorial ambitions in Ukraine and Taiwan. The world’s two most powerful autocrats unveiled a sweeping long-term agreement that also challenges the United States as a global power, nato as a cornerstone of international security, and liberal democracy as a model for the world. “Friendship between the two States has no limits,” they vowed in the communiqué, released after the two leaders met on the eve of the Beijing Winter Olympics. “There are no ‘forbidden’ areas of cooperation.” Agreements between Moscow and Beijing, including the Treaty of Friendship of 2001, have traditionally been laden with lofty, if vague, rhetoric that faded into forgotten history. But the new and detailed five-thousand-word agreement is more than a collection of the usual tropes, Robert Daly, the director of the Kissinger Institute on China and the United States, at the Wilson Center, in Washington, told me. Although it falls short of a formal alliance, like nato, the agreement reflects a more elaborate show of solidarity than anytime in the past. “This is a pledge to stand shoulder to shoulder against America and the West, ideologically as well as militarily,” Daly said. “This statement might be looked back on as the beginning of Cold War Two.” The timing and clarity of the communiqué—amid tensions on Russia’s border with Europe and China’s aggression around Taiwan—will “give historians the kind of specific event that they often focus on.” Beyond security, the declaration also pledged collaboration on space, climate change, the Internet, and artificial intelligence. Politically, the document claimed that there is “no one-size-fits-all” type of democracy, and heralded both forms of authoritarian rule in Moscow and Beijing as successful democracies. “It’s a pretty striking step closer to an alliance and shows that they’re very much aligned in their vision of the world order in the twenty-first century,” Alexander Vershbow, a former U.S. Ambassador to Russia, told me. Putin described the broader strategic partnership with China as “unprecedented.” Xi said that their joint strategy would have a “far-reaching influence on China, Russia, and the world.” U.S. experts described the lengthy statement, which was riddled with false and accusatory language, as startling. “I’ve never seen a joint statement from both leaders using this kind of language. They’ve joined forces,” Angela Stent, a Russia expert who served at the National Intelligence Council and wrote “Putin’s World: Russia Against the West and with the Rest,” told me. She described the communiqué as “quite Orwellian” and called it an “inflection point” in which Russia and China are challenging the balance of power that has defined the global order since the Cold War ended, three decades ago. “We could be at the beginning of a new era as the Russian relationship with the West deteriorates and China’s does as well.” The agreement puts Washington and its key allies “in a terrible bind,” she added. “The fact is, whatever we do to counter what Russia is doing only reinforces its reliance on China.” The joint statement is, at least for the moment, a diplomatic boon for Putin amid his showdown with the United States and Europe over Ukraine. For the first time in any of Russia’s recent aggressions, Putin has won the open support of China’s leader. China did not back Russia’s war in Georgia in 2008, or its invasion of Ukraine in 2014, nor has it recognized Russia’s annexation of Crimea. Now Moscow and Beijing, which both have the ability to veto any resolution at the United Nations, have declared their opposition to further enlargement of nato and to the formation of other regional security alliances. “Russia and China stand against attempts by external forces to undermine security and stability in their common adjacent regions, intend to counter interference by outside forces in the internal affairs of sovereign countries under any pretext, oppose colour revolutions, and will increase cooperation,” the often unwieldy statement declared. “This is where they pledge their troth,” Daly said. Washington had been pressuring Beijing, including in a call last month between Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi, in an attempt to keep China neutral or out of the Ukraine crisis. Now, at least on paper and in public voice, it has budged, Andrew Weiss, a former National Security Council official who is currently at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, told me. “Russia now has China as an endorser of the egregious and inflammatory position that Putin has staked out on Ukraine.” Hints of China’s shift have been emerging in the past two weeks, as the Ukraine crisis began spilling over onto already tense U.S.-China relations. President Biden’s foreign policy had hoped to steer relations with Beijing toward stable and manageable competition. Instead, China, which is normally discreet in its diplomacy, is visibly pushing back. After his conversation with Blinken last month, the Chinese foreign minister said publicly that Russia’s security concern about nato expansion is legitimate and must be addressed. The Biden Administration countered last week with an admonition. The State Department warned that the West has “an array of tools” to deploy against foreign companies—including in China—that help Russia evade punitive sanctions. In the new agreement, Russia, in turn, reaffirmed its support for Beijing’s One China policy that Taiwan is “an inalienable part of China, and opposes any forms of independence.” The joint communiqué also supported Beijing’s ruthless crackdown on dissidents in Hong Kong in the past two years. The bold assertions in the joint statement follow deepening military ties between the two nations in the past decade, Weiss noted. Russia and China have conducted dozens of joint exercises and war games that have involved as many as ten thousand troops to hone tactical and operational capabilities. Russian officials have boasted that the growing defense partnership was designed to warn the United States and nato not to pressure Moscow. The naval operations have included mock seizures of islands, patrols by long-range bombers over the Sea of Japan and the East China Sea, and surface-to-air missile targeting. Last summer, Putin and Xi both witnessed military exercises in China. In October, they held joint naval exercises off Russia’s far-eastern coast. “The frequency, complexity, and geographic scope has steadily increased, reflecting the growth in the overall bilateral defense relationship,” the U.S. Naval Institute reported last year. As two nuclear-armed countries that span Europe and Asia, the more muscular alignment between Russia and China could be a game changer militarily and diplomatically. “They want this to be as threatening as a formal alliance to the West, but don’t want to formally commit to mutual defense,” Daly said. “They don’t have to. The spectre of their mutual aid will serve as a deterrent.” The joint announcement reflects a shift in the balance of power between Russia and China as well. “The Russians for the longest time were condescending in their view of China as an uninteresting rural society,” Weiss said. “Now China looks at Russia and says, ‘What are you good for?’ China’s ambitions do not run through Moscow.” China has become “canny” in exploiting Russia’s neediness, he said. “It uses Russia as a cat’s paw to disrupt the U.S. pivot to Asia. The fact that we have to keep coming back to Putin, as the neighborhood bully, is beneficial to China.” Putin was the highest-profile leader to show up for the opening of the Winter Olympics in Beijing. The U.S. and other major powers opted not to send high-profile delegations, to protest China’s human-rights abuses, particularly against its Uyghur minority. Russia had received a two-year ban from officially sending teams to the Olympics after conducting a years-long, state-sponsored doping scheme. Russian athletes—who are not supposed to carry their nation’s flag, wear the Russian insignia, or play the national anthem—instead compete as part of the Russian Olympic Committee. After his meeting with Xi, Putin applauded the team during the opening ceremony’s Parade of Nations on Friday. But his visit clearly had another purpose. The question now is how far Russia and China will take their agreement. “Words are one thing,” Vershbow, the former Ambassador, said. “We still have to see if the statement will translate into greater tangible Chinese support for Russia’s aggressive behavior—or whether they’ll say, ‘We’re with you, good luck,’ and then turn the other way.” The Chinese have different and sometimes more pragmatic interests in their relations with the U.S. and Europe, which are vital to their economy. “They don’t want to burn all bridges for the sake of a relationship with Russia.” ---------------------------------------------------- ChinaIsAsshoe only supports ChinaIsAsshoe. They wouldn't piss on Russia if they were on fire unless they could get something out of the deal. Right now, they are salivating at the prospect of getting oil and rare earth metals from Russia at bargain basement prices. As for a defense pact, not going to happen. Again, ChinaIsAsshoe has a historical hatred of the Russians that goes back a century. If you want to see what ChinaIsAsshoe's position on the Ukrainian conflict and it's support of Russia, all you have to do is look at them letting the ruble float against the Yuan. They aren't supporting Russia, they are supporting themselves as usual. |
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Originally Posted By hondaciv:
View Quote Azeris have very little love for russians |
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"Anytime a liberal mentions fairness, you can be assured they want something that belongs to someone else." Calgood
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Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can’t see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn’t discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. View Quote They know they will lose. There is a 50/50 chance the west pusses out and backs off so why not try the threat? |
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Originally Posted By skid2041: Any confirmation on Russians saying to "self-supply"? View Quote It doesn't matter if it's official as its been going on since day one. If it is official it's the Russian government saying oh yeah we meant to do that. Their supply lines broke down almost immediately and armed an organized men (term used loosely in this case) aren't going hungry if there's food to be had. |
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Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can’t see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn’t discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. View Quote Agree. Putin is painting himself into a coffin corner w/o someone giving him a big fucking off ramp. |
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Russia intensifies artillery shelling on Kyiv | Ukraine latest news |
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Patrick Henry is the greatest Founding Father because without him there would be no Bill of Rights!
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Originally Posted By _disconnector_: Can you imagine what would happen if we came to blows with the fucking Russian *navy*? Because that's what happens if they start boarding and seizing US flagged vessels. They would be on the bottom before the ink was dry on the Russian order. They are incredibly weak in that arena - I can't imagine Putin being that stupid. But of course I didn't think he was stupid enough to invade Ukraine either so what do I know n View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By _disconnector_: Originally Posted By juan223: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can't see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn't discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. yea, I wonder if they'll start boarding and searching stuff in international waters like we do But of course I didn't think he was stupid enough to invade Ukraine either so what do I know n These constant tit for tat verbal threats and exchanges appear to be taking this towards eventual escalation between us and Russia. |
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"This is not about freedom or personal choice" - Joe Biden to America
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Lots of old cold war weapons being dumped on Ukraine. Polish RPG-76 Komar single-use RPG.
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Award: 24/365 Most likely to be an appendix.
"Arfcom makes me happy. Arfcom is like a giant, heavily armed, dysfunctional family that smells like cheetos and gun oil." - Undefined |
Originally Posted By Nailcrusher: These constant tit for tat verbal threats and exchanges appear to be taking this towards eventual escalation between us and Russia. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Nailcrusher: Originally Posted By _disconnector_: Originally Posted By juan223: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can't see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn't discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. yea, I wonder if they'll start boarding and searching stuff in international waters like we do But of course I didn't think he was stupid enough to invade Ukraine either so what do I know n These constant tit for tat verbal threats and exchanges appear to be taking this towards eventual escalation between us and Russia. They won’t step into a NATO country and attack us, nor will they randomly sink freighters in into waters…..but they know there are some pussies leading some western countries. Maybe the threats will keep working? |
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Three Ukrainian AN26 flying over Poland on a 346 degree track. Entered from Czeck airspace. These are small military transport planes. Those three are in a line about 50m apart.
Somebody that's high ranking, and/or family, is leaving Ukraine, so it seems. I doubt that Poland would allow a regular Ukrainian military plane to overfly their air space. Also, a USAF Rivet Joint, JAKE11, flew a complete circle around Kaliningrad, and is now on a usual N/S racetrack pattern about 50m from the Belarusian and NW corner of Ukraine. I've not seen that before. |
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Originally Posted By planemaker: ChinaIsAsshoe only supports ChinaIsAsshoe. They wouldn't piss on Russia if they were on fire unless they could get something out of the deal. Right now, they are salivating at the prospect of getting oil and rare earth metals from Russia at bargain basement prices. As for a defense pact, not going to happen. Again, ChinaIsAsshoe has a historical hatred of the Russians that goes back a century. If you want to see what ChinaIsAsshoe's position on the Ukrainian conflict and it's support of Russia, all you have to do is look at them letting the ruble float against the Yuan. They aren't supporting Russia, they are supporting themselves as usual. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By SheltiePimp: Originally Posted By TheLurker: China won't seriously back Russia. Russia just fucked their Taiwan plans. They are backing Russia, they will back Russia, they have stated many times they are backing Russia and their role is to negotiate peace (on behalf of Russia). They have made their position extremely clear. They are a hair length away from signing a joint security agreement, similar to what Nato is. This was just before the Olympics when everyone thought Russia wouldn't invade. Russia and China Unveil a Pact Against America and the West In their matching mauve ties, Russia’s Vladimir Putin and China’s Xi Jinping last week declared a “new era” in the global order and, at least in the short term, endorsed their respective territorial ambitions in Ukraine and Taiwan. The world’s two most powerful autocrats unveiled a sweeping long-term agreement that also challenges the United States as a global power, nato as a cornerstone of international security, and liberal democracy as a model for the world. “Friendship between the two States has no limits,” they vowed in the communiqué, released after the two leaders met on the eve of the Beijing Winter Olympics. “There are no ‘forbidden’ areas of cooperation.” Agreements between Moscow and Beijing, including the Treaty of Friendship of 2001, have traditionally been laden with lofty, if vague, rhetoric that faded into forgotten history. But the new and detailed five-thousand-word agreement is more than a collection of the usual tropes, Robert Daly, the director of the Kissinger Institute on China and the United States, at the Wilson Center, in Washington, told me. Although it falls short of a formal alliance, like nato, the agreement reflects a more elaborate show of solidarity than anytime in the past. “This is a pledge to stand shoulder to shoulder against America and the West, ideologically as well as militarily,” Daly said. “This statement might be looked back on as the beginning of Cold War Two.” The timing and clarity of the communiqué—amid tensions on Russia’s border with Europe and China’s aggression around Taiwan—will “give historians the kind of specific event that they often focus on.” Beyond security, the declaration also pledged collaboration on space, climate change, the Internet, and artificial intelligence. Politically, the document claimed that there is “no one-size-fits-all” type of democracy, and heralded both forms of authoritarian rule in Moscow and Beijing as successful democracies. “It’s a pretty striking step closer to an alliance and shows that they’re very much aligned in their vision of the world order in the twenty-first century,” Alexander Vershbow, a former U.S. Ambassador to Russia, told me. Putin described the broader strategic partnership with China as “unprecedented.” Xi said that their joint strategy would have a “far-reaching influence on China, Russia, and the world.” U.S. experts described the lengthy statement, which was riddled with false and accusatory language, as startling. “I’ve never seen a joint statement from both leaders using this kind of language. They’ve joined forces,” Angela Stent, a Russia expert who served at the National Intelligence Council and wrote “Putin’s World: Russia Against the West and with the Rest,” told me. She described the communiqué as “quite Orwellian” and called it an “inflection point” in which Russia and China are challenging the balance of power that has defined the global order since the Cold War ended, three decades ago. “We could be at the beginning of a new era as the Russian relationship with the West deteriorates and China’s does as well.” The agreement puts Washington and its key allies “in a terrible bind,” she added. “The fact is, whatever we do to counter what Russia is doing only reinforces its reliance on China.” The joint statement is, at least for the moment, a diplomatic boon for Putin amid his showdown with the United States and Europe over Ukraine. For the first time in any of Russia’s recent aggressions, Putin has won the open support of China’s leader. China did not back Russia’s war in Georgia in 2008, or its invasion of Ukraine in 2014, nor has it recognized Russia’s annexation of Crimea. Now Moscow and Beijing, which both have the ability to veto any resolution at the United Nations, have declared their opposition to further enlargement of nato and to the formation of other regional security alliances. “Russia and China stand against attempts by external forces to undermine security and stability in their common adjacent regions, intend to counter interference by outside forces in the internal affairs of sovereign countries under any pretext, oppose colour revolutions, and will increase cooperation,” the often unwieldy statement declared. “This is where they pledge their troth,” Daly said. Washington had been pressuring Beijing, including in a call last month between Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi, in an attempt to keep China neutral or out of the Ukraine crisis. Now, at least on paper and in public voice, it has budged, Andrew Weiss, a former National Security Council official who is currently at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, told me. “Russia now has China as an endorser of the egregious and inflammatory position that Putin has staked out on Ukraine.” Hints of China’s shift have been emerging in the past two weeks, as the Ukraine crisis began spilling over onto already tense U.S.-China relations. President Biden’s foreign policy had hoped to steer relations with Beijing toward stable and manageable competition. Instead, China, which is normally discreet in its diplomacy, is visibly pushing back. After his conversation with Blinken last month, the Chinese foreign minister said publicly that Russia’s security concern about nato expansion is legitimate and must be addressed. The Biden Administration countered last week with an admonition. The State Department warned that the West has “an array of tools” to deploy against foreign companies—including in China—that help Russia evade punitive sanctions. In the new agreement, Russia, in turn, reaffirmed its support for Beijing’s One China policy that Taiwan is “an inalienable part of China, and opposes any forms of independence.” The joint communiqué also supported Beijing’s ruthless crackdown on dissidents in Hong Kong in the past two years. The bold assertions in the joint statement follow deepening military ties between the two nations in the past decade, Weiss noted. Russia and China have conducted dozens of joint exercises and war games that have involved as many as ten thousand troops to hone tactical and operational capabilities. Russian officials have boasted that the growing defense partnership was designed to warn the United States and nato not to pressure Moscow. The naval operations have included mock seizures of islands, patrols by long-range bombers over the Sea of Japan and the East China Sea, and surface-to-air missile targeting. Last summer, Putin and Xi both witnessed military exercises in China. In October, they held joint naval exercises off Russia’s far-eastern coast. “The frequency, complexity, and geographic scope has steadily increased, reflecting the growth in the overall bilateral defense relationship,” the U.S. Naval Institute reported last year. As two nuclear-armed countries that span Europe and Asia, the more muscular alignment between Russia and China could be a game changer militarily and diplomatically. “They want this to be as threatening as a formal alliance to the West, but don’t want to formally commit to mutual defense,” Daly said. “They don’t have to. The spectre of their mutual aid will serve as a deterrent.” The joint announcement reflects a shift in the balance of power between Russia and China as well. “The Russians for the longest time were condescending in their view of China as an uninteresting rural society,” Weiss said. “Now China looks at Russia and says, ‘What are you good for?’ China’s ambitions do not run through Moscow.” China has become “canny” in exploiting Russia’s neediness, he said. “It uses Russia as a cat’s paw to disrupt the U.S. pivot to Asia. The fact that we have to keep coming back to Putin, as the neighborhood bully, is beneficial to China.” Putin was the highest-profile leader to show up for the opening of the Winter Olympics in Beijing. The U.S. and other major powers opted not to send high-profile delegations, to protest China’s human-rights abuses, particularly against its Uyghur minority. Russia had received a two-year ban from officially sending teams to the Olympics after conducting a years-long, state-sponsored doping scheme. Russian athletes—who are not supposed to carry their nation’s flag, wear the Russian insignia, or play the national anthem—instead compete as part of the Russian Olympic Committee. After his meeting with Xi, Putin applauded the team during the opening ceremony’s Parade of Nations on Friday. But his visit clearly had another purpose. The question now is how far Russia and China will take their agreement. “Words are one thing,” Vershbow, the former Ambassador, said. “We still have to see if the statement will translate into greater tangible Chinese support for Russia’s aggressive behavior—or whether they’ll say, ‘We’re with you, good luck,’ and then turn the other way.” The Chinese have different and sometimes more pragmatic interests in their relations with the U.S. and Europe, which are vital to their economy. “They don’t want to burn all bridges for the sake of a relationship with Russia.” ---------------------------------------------------- ChinaIsAsshoe only supports ChinaIsAsshoe. They wouldn't piss on Russia if they were on fire unless they could get something out of the deal. Right now, they are salivating at the prospect of getting oil and rare earth metals from Russia at bargain basement prices. As for a defense pact, not going to happen. Again, ChinaIsAsshoe has a historical hatred of the Russians that goes back a century. If you want to see what ChinaIsAsshoe's position on the Ukrainian conflict and it's support of Russia, all you have to do is look at them letting the ruble float against the Yuan. They aren't supporting Russia, they are supporting themselves as usual. China wants to dominate the world. They are watching 1 of their 2 competitors for that take a fall. They have to be giddy with anticipation. They would like nothing better than to see the US and Russia beat the shit out of each other. |
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"This is not about freedom or personal choice" - Joe Biden to America
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Grammatik Faschist-Yes that's me in the hat
OK, USA
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Originally Posted By Ryan_Scott: Missouri not New York. Dougout Doug passed the Chinese red line, got his ass kicked and wanted to kill millions of people to recover from that. I will never understand where his reputation comes from. View Quote Certainly not due to the stellar performance of Charles Willoughby as his S2. |
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What may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. Nothing makes a man's jollies feel more secure than a big bore handgun protecting the goods. Justabulletaway |
Originally Posted By HIPPO: Agree. Putin is painting himself into a coffin corner w/o someone giving him a big fucking off ramp. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By HIPPO: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can’t see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn’t discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. Agree. Putin is painting himself into a coffin corner w/o someone giving him a big fucking off ramp. And that’s what makes this situation so dangerous to the world. Cornering a powerful, desperate man might cause him to do unthinkable things. |
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"This is not about freedom or personal choice" - Joe Biden to America
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Originally Posted By hondaciv:
View Quote Wow, so Trump was right again. |
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Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can’t see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn’t discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. View Quote I don't think that we are shipping Stingers on liberty ships through the North Atlantic... |
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Grammatik Faschist-Yes that's me in the hat
OK, USA
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Macarthur got his reputation early on and he kept it by mostly having it, so the reputation became more valuable than what the reputation was supposedly for. It's kind of a cult of personality version of too big to fail. IMO. From the chairborne historian regiment.
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What may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. Nothing makes a man's jollies feel more secure than a big bore handgun protecting the goods. Justabulletaway |
Originally Posted By M-1975: Meanwhile, in Russia: https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/comments/tci1dt/russia_today_no_war/ View Quote Misinformation. This video is at least six years old, and supposedly for a television program. |
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Originally Posted By Brok3n: Loitering munitions.. looks like Russia is employing their homebuilt stuff. "The first evidence Russia is using loitering munitions in Ukraine. This looks like a Kalashnikov ZALA Aero KUB-BLA loitering munition." https://nitter.net/RALee85/status/1502550038731497474#m https://nitter.net/pic/media%2FFNogsrmXEAEW_95.jpg%3Fname%3Dorig https://nitter.net/pic/media%2FFNoePoTWUAUCyjH.jpg%3Fname%3Dorig This is what I think we should be pushing to Ukraine by the boatload, Switchblade loitering munitions: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-ZtFUxXzQg View Quote That and the drone jamming systems. |
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It's not stupid, it's advanced!!
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Originally Posted By 74HC: Three Ukrainian AN26 flying over Poland on a 346 degree track. Entered from Czeck airspace. These are small military transport planes. Somebody that's high ranking, and/or family, is leaving Ukraine, so it seems. I doubt that Poland would allow a regular Ukrainian military plane to overfly their air space. Also, a USAF Rivet Joint, JAKE11, flew a complete circle around Kaliningrad, and is now on a usual N/S racetrack pattern about 50m from the Belarusian and NW corner of Ukraine. I've not seen that before. View Quote Could it be the delegation of 10 or so Ukrainian MP's that was out of the country for negotiations on kicking Russia out of the council of europe? |
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Originally Posted By GlockZen:
View Quote Attached File |
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Decisions are based on circumstances
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Originally Posted By hondaciv:
View Quote Ah, yes, the yappy small dog approach to foreign relations. Hey Vlad, your crack troops are getting their asses handed to them by western weaponry. If you could have cut off the supply, you would have already. STFU and take your losses. |
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Originally Posted By kncook: They won’t step into a NATO country and attack us, nor will they randomly sink freighters in into waters…..but they know there are some pussies leading some western countries. Maybe the threats will keep working? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By kncook: Originally Posted By Nailcrusher: Originally Posted By _disconnector_: Originally Posted By juan223: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can't see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn't discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. yea, I wonder if they'll start boarding and searching stuff in international waters like we do But of course I didn't think he was stupid enough to invade Ukraine either so what do I know n These constant tit for tat verbal threats and exchanges appear to be taking this towards eventual escalation between us and Russia. They won’t step into a NATO country and attack us, nor will they randomly sink freighters in into waters…..but they know there are some pussies leading some western countries. Maybe the threats will keep working? Until whoever is really pulling the strings in our government decides to escalate. This is a shit sandwich. |
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"This is not about freedom or personal choice" - Joe Biden to America
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Originally Posted By spydercomonkey: Russia can still be paid; many of their banks are not under sanction, and even then there are workarounds. Iran and North Korea - far less capable and resource rich countries then Russia - are still able to generate money and build military equipment. https://www.bourseandbazaar.com/articles/2022/2/28/iran-russia-and-the-limits-of-financial-war In terms of Russian equipment not working; eh. We're seeing a lot of poorly maintained shit break down, and we're seeing that a whole shitload of Russias military budget has likely been straight up stolen, which paired with poor morale has hollowed out their forces. But the weapons themselves seem to be working fine. The ballistic and cruise missiles for example are hitting their targets and fucking shit up. The MLRS is working plenty well. Small arms obviously work. Hellicopters and Jets seem to work fine, just rather bizzarely employed (using jets at low alitude manpad range, for example.) Their tanks and BMPs are being blown up left and right...but I suspect US/NATO/Chinese tanks would also be rapidly destroyed by Javelins as well. The only weapon that really seems to be shitting the bed is their air defense assets against the TB2 drones. A country like India looking to achieve a 'strategic independence' from China or the US has pretty limited other options for foreign weapon sales. Russia is the clear leader there, with countries like Israel and possibly South Korea being alternatives for some systems. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By spydercomonkey: Originally Posted By MattyCR: Originally Posted By spydercomonkey: Originally Posted By TheLurker: Originally Posted By FrankyRay: Originally Posted By Durka-Durka: Originally Posted By sq40: Originally Posted By FrankyRay: Originally Posted By elcope: Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad: @Zhukov Have you read any Peter Zeihan? He's spent the past decade writing a series of books and making many, many presentations about the history of the Global Order (America Police guaranteeing free trade, aka Globalism), why it's folding up shop, and how there'd be a wildfire of regional wars and enormous power shifts following it. We are living in the post America Police/smoldering wildfires are igniting/power is shifting fast stage right now. He's a demographic/geographic determinist who backs up his theories with reams of data. He's not always right on the micro level but I think he's got the broad outline nailed. He's got a higher opinion of the Russian military than I can currently credit them, I guess we'll see about that. And he didn't predict the instant global cancellation of the Russia economy IIRC. His books are interesting and there's a thousand videos of his presentations on Youtube. His opinion has been rapidly becoming more mainstream, he just gave a presentation at Fort Benning. He recently freaked out this professional financial news reporter about four times in half an hour: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bq75Av59-YU Well worth the 30 min to watch. Yes, it is. Some very thought provoking stuff in there. "We are living in the post America Police/smoldering wildfires are igniting/power is shifting fast stage right now." That actually makes a lot of sense and explains the global craziness we are seeing. Hell, America doesn't even want police on it's own streets these days. I heard him on an interview last night. He said Russia has 4-8 weeks left to end this conflict or Russia will completely collapse because of sanctions. Which begs the question: What happens if they stop? Does the world just go back to normal? Will the world end up trying to compensate to make russia stable again? Putin isn't going to stop. He wants to crush Ukraine. I think this whole World-Gangs-Up-On-Big-Bad-Leader frenzy may have put something in motion that no one really knows what to do with. As Peter says in that video, "The sanctions surprised EVERYONE." As far as Russia collapsing in 4-8 weeks... I wouldn't be surprised to see them pull some kind of diabolical rabbit out of a hat that lets them stay afloat. What does Russia have left that can keep them afloat economically? Oil? That's dead and about 20 years from restarting. Wheat? No one will insure anyone to ship it. What else do they have? Russia is already dead, they just don't know it yet All of their Nat Gas exports to europe are still intact. As are their exports to China. They also still have decent weapon sales to India and other countries. Their economy is taking a massive hit but its incorrect to say they have no money coming in. Their NG exports are intact FOR NOW. Id expect those pipelines to looking like a bay area PG&E mishap x1000 if or when Russia has taken military control of UKR and the hardcore insurgency/sabotage fighting ramps up They cant sell to India if they can neither build nor cash checks for military Exports to China may be moot if they cant even maintain a workforce to export shit. I also question what countries want to buy when they are seeing how poorly it works by the builders of it. Russia can still be paid; many of their banks are not under sanction, and even then there are workarounds. Iran and North Korea - far less capable and resource rich countries then Russia - are still able to generate money and build military equipment. https://www.bourseandbazaar.com/articles/2022/2/28/iran-russia-and-the-limits-of-financial-war In terms of Russian equipment not working; eh. We're seeing a lot of poorly maintained shit break down, and we're seeing that a whole shitload of Russias military budget has likely been straight up stolen, which paired with poor morale has hollowed out their forces. But the weapons themselves seem to be working fine. The ballistic and cruise missiles for example are hitting their targets and fucking shit up. The MLRS is working plenty well. Small arms obviously work. Hellicopters and Jets seem to work fine, just rather bizzarely employed (using jets at low alitude manpad range, for example.) Their tanks and BMPs are being blown up left and right...but I suspect US/NATO/Chinese tanks would also be rapidly destroyed by Javelins as well. The only weapon that really seems to be shitting the bed is their air defense assets against the TB2 drones. A country like India looking to achieve a 'strategic independence' from China or the US has pretty limited other options for foreign weapon sales. Russia is the clear leader there, with countries like Israel and possibly South Korea being alternatives for some systems. India already terminated a joint fighter aircraft development with Russia. Given how poorly Russian gear seems to be performing against western weaponry, India is likely to start shopping elsewhere. |
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Originally Posted By 74HC: Three Ukrainian AN26 flying over Poland on a 346 degree track. Entered from Czeck airspace. These are small military transport planes. Somebody that's high ranking, and/or family, is leaving Ukraine, so it seems. I doubt that Poland would allow a regular Ukrainian military plane to overfly their air space. Also, a USAF Rivet Joint, JAKE11, flew a complete circle around Kaliningrad, and is now on a usual N/S racetrack pattern about 50m from the Belarusian and NW corner of Ukraine. I've not seen that before. View Quote Or more simply logistical flights for more weapons. |
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Originally Posted By 74HC: Three Ukrainian AN26 flying over Poland on a 346 degree track. Entered from Czeck airspace. These are small military transport planes. Those three are in a line about 50m apart. Somebody that's high ranking, and/or family, is leaving Ukraine, so it seems. I doubt that Poland would allow a regular Ukrainian military plane to overfly their air space. Also, a USAF Rivet Joint, JAKE11, flew a complete circle around Kaliningrad, and is now on a usual N/S racetrack pattern about 50m from the Belarusian and NW corner of Ukraine. I've not seen that before. View Quote Lead aircraft is descending at 2,000ft/min. Down to 11900ft in altitude. Looks like they are landing in Poland. Maybe the pilots picking up those MIG-25s, and departing families of high ranking officials? |
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Originally Posted By outofbattery: Or more simply logistical flights for more weapons. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By outofbattery: Originally Posted By 74HC: Three Ukrainian AN26 flying over Poland on a 346 degree track. Entered from Czeck airspace. These are small military transport planes. Somebody that's high ranking, and/or family, is leaving Ukraine, so it seems. I doubt that Poland would allow a regular Ukrainian military plane to overfly their air space. Also, a USAF Rivet Joint, JAKE11, flew a complete circle around Kaliningrad, and is now on a usual N/S racetrack pattern about 50m from the Belarusian and NW corner of Ukraine. I've not seen that before. Or more simply logistical flights for more weapons. It's a twin engine turbo prop with seats. Much like those small regional airlines we have. |
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Originally Posted By Arty8: Lots of old cold war weapons being dumped on Ukraine. Polish RPG-76 Komar single-use RPG. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6CxOov3Mz8 View Quote Might be useful for someone. RPG 76 KOMAR (POLAND) |
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Originally Posted By outofbattery: This “they’ve seen the West” thinking is flawed because it is leaving something out: yes,young Russians have been able to eat at McDonald’s,shop at Uniqlo,look at Instagram…BUT they have also been raised in a school system that promotes nationalism and have a media that presents Russia as a victim,something that has been only increasingly and now exclusively the case. The organization was dismantled and restructured but read up about Naschi or watch a documentary called Putin’s Kiss or look at the Young Russians doing this . to understand that a great many have been entirely brainwashed to support totalitarian. Meanwhile,a fair of apolitical younger Russians are doing things like posting to Telegram or Insta crying,literally,that the sanctions are horrible because they won’t have any Lipton tea or McDonald’s anymore because they don’t really grasp why the sanctions are in place. Putin isn’t being blamed and the Russian military isn’t being blamed. They are enablers even if they don’t understand it. The only parallel I can make is this: there are a tremendous number of Muslims who adore KFC,they think it’s the greatest food ever. They love wearing Nike shoes and owning an iPhone and all that but does having a bucket of chicken and a pair of Jordans mean they have anti-Islamist tendencies? Hardly. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By outofbattery: Originally Posted By Stretchman: Originally Posted By hondaciv: 100% totally emphatically disagree. Russian boomers, sure. Not normal Russians, especially those 30 or younger who have never experienced Soviet-style communism or doctrine. These people have lived their entire life 100% exposed to the west and western news and culture. Really? Now say that about millenials too. Who knows what they were exposed to there? This “they’ve seen the West” thinking is flawed because it is leaving something out: yes,young Russians have been able to eat at McDonald’s,shop at Uniqlo,look at Instagram…BUT they have also been raised in a school system that promotes nationalism and have a media that presents Russia as a victim,something that has been only increasingly and now exclusively the case. The organization was dismantled and restructured but read up about Naschi or watch a documentary called Putin’s Kiss or look at the Young Russians doing this . to understand that a great many have been entirely brainwashed to support totalitarian. Meanwhile,a fair of apolitical younger Russians are doing things like posting to Telegram or Insta crying,literally,that the sanctions are horrible because they won’t have any Lipton tea or McDonald’s anymore because they don’t really grasp why the sanctions are in place. Putin isn’t being blamed and the Russian military isn’t being blamed. They are enablers even if they don’t understand it. The only parallel I can make is this: there are a tremendous number of Muslims who adore KFC,they think it’s the greatest food ever. They love wearing Nike shoes and owning an iPhone and all that but does having a bucket of chicken and a pair of Jordans mean they have anti-Islamist tendencies? Hardly. |
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Originally Posted By M-1975: These guys are having fun:
View Quote Hell yeah. We have any arty guys on here? I imagine even with doubled up ear pro that probably rattles your skull lol |
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Remorse is for the dead
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Originally Posted By hondaciv:
View Quote They might want to speed that up a bit. Since the Russian infrastructure relied on western workers to keep it actually working (and Russia might conscript a bunch of their own to go get blown up in Ukraine), they may not be able to keep oil flowing to Europe thru next year. |
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Originally Posted By M-1975: These guys are having fun:
View Quote "You gonna keep your brass?" |
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Originally Posted By 74HC: Lead aircraft is descending at 2,000ft/min. Down to 11900ft in altitude. Looks like they are landing in Poland. Maybe the pilots picking up those MIG-25s, and departing families of high ranking officials? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By 74HC: Originally Posted By 74HC: Three Ukrainian AN26 flying over Poland on a 346 degree track. Entered from Czeck airspace. These are small military transport planes. Those three are in a line about 50m apart. Somebody that's high ranking, and/or family, is leaving Ukraine, so it seems. I doubt that Poland would allow a regular Ukrainian military plane to overfly their air space. Also, a USAF Rivet Joint, JAKE11, flew a complete circle around Kaliningrad, and is now on a usual N/S racetrack pattern about 50m from the Belarusian and NW corner of Ukraine. I've not seen that before. Lead aircraft is descending at 2,000ft/min. Down to 11900ft in altitude. Looks like they are landing in Poland. Maybe the pilots picking up those MIG-25s, and departing families of high ranking officials? Looks like they are landing in Bydgoszcz, Poland. |
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Originally Posted By Durka-Durka: I guess my question had more to do with the West, rather than russia. What will WE do if they stop? Will we just go back to normal and start doing business with them again, forgetting the shit they pulled? Or, I imagine this will be the case, will we even work to compensate them to make their oligarchs happy again? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Durka-Durka: Originally Posted By sq40: Originally Posted By Durka-Durka: Originally Posted By sq40: Originally Posted By FrankyRay: Originally Posted By elcope: Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad: @Zhukov Have you read any Peter Zeihan? He's spent the past decade writing a series of books and making many, many presentations about the history of the Global Order (America Police guaranteeing free trade, aka Globalism), why it's folding up shop, and how there'd be a wildfire of regional wars and enormous power shifts following it. We are living in the post America Police/smoldering wildfires are igniting/power is shifting fast stage right now. He's a demographic/geographic determinist who backs up his theories with reams of data. He's not always right on the micro level but I think he's got the broad outline nailed. He's got a higher opinion of the Russian military than I can currently credit them, I guess we'll see about that. And he didn't predict the instant global cancellation of the Russia economy IIRC. His books are interesting and there's a thousand videos of his presentations on Youtube. His opinion has been rapidly becoming more mainstream, he just gave a presentation at Fort Benning. He recently freaked out this professional financial news reporter about four times in half an hour: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bq75Av59-YU Well worth the 30 min to watch. Yes, it is. Some very thought provoking stuff in there. "We are living in the post America Police/smoldering wildfires are igniting/power is shifting fast stage right now." That actually makes a lot of sense and explains the global craziness we are seeing. Hell, America doesn't even want police on it's own streets these days. I heard him on an interview last night. He said Russia has 4-8 weeks left to end this conflict or Russia will completely collapse because of sanctions. Which begs the question: What happens if they stop? Does the world just go back to normal? Will the world end up trying to compensate to make russia stable again? That’s the big what if. If they leave Ukraine and get sanctions removed, they will have it rough for a few years, but survive. If they don’t stop aggression, they will have to seek alliances fast, which may involve a broadening war, a world war. They could pop off a nuke or two in Ukraine, and then use threats to get sanctions lowered, like North Korea does. Last resort, they go nuclear and try to sace their economy with a state of total war. I guess my question had more to do with the West, rather than russia. What will WE do if they stop? Will we just go back to normal and start doing business with them again, forgetting the shit they pulled? Or, I imagine this will be the case, will we even work to compensate them to make their oligarchs happy again? I think the carrot-stick approach is something the west would follow through with, cautiously. They will start rolling back sanctions more quickly if Russia pulls out more quickly. It would take a decade and regime change or more for things to go back to how they were in 2020. |
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“This is America damnit! I don’t think we will become like these other countries. I don’t think we can. Courage is too contagious here.” -James O’Keefe, 1/17/22
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Originally Posted By Nailcrusher: And that's what makes this situation so dangerous to the world. Cornering a powerful, desperate man might cause him to do unthinkable things. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Nailcrusher: Originally Posted By HIPPO: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can't see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn't discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. Agree. Putin is painting himself into a coffin corner w/o someone giving him a big fucking off ramp. And that's what makes this situation so dangerous to the world. Cornering a powerful, desperate man might cause him to do unthinkable things. At this point what does the golden bridge look like? Putin has to be able to save face. FWIW, I still believe that this invasion happened because there was no way for him to back off without losing face. I think he wanted to make Crimea official, along with the Donbass region, but the west and Ukraine offered resistance that he hadn't planned for. He likely thought that he would have gotten what he wanted purely through intimidation. "The mighty Russian military has terrified the Ukrainian Nazis and liberated our ethnic Russian brothers without ever firing a shot" would have made him a hero at home, with no military losses to explain and no exposure of his military's actual capability. |
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Originally Posted By GlockZen:
View Quote Stop talking, start doing. Typical hand-wringing. |
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Originally Posted By 74HC: It's a twin engine turbo prop with seats. Much like those small regional airlines we have. View Quote I know what an Antonov 26 is. While there is some similarity in configuration and they can have either jump seats or passenger seats,Q400s and ATRs don’t have cargo ramps: Attached File |
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Originally Posted By XJ: Remember the videos US schools with children singing praise to Obama? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By XJ: Originally Posted By odiedodi: Originally Posted By outofbattery: . (Apparently it was put on by a college and participation was mandatory) Remember the videos US schools with children singing praise to Obama? ALPHA OMEGA ALPHA OMEGA |
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Originally Posted By planemaker: Ah, yes, the yappy small dog approach to foreign relations. Hey Vlad, your crack troops are getting their asses handed to them by western weaponry. If you could have cut off the supply, you would have already. STFU and take your losses. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By planemaker: Originally Posted By hondaciv:
Ah, yes, the yappy small dog approach to foreign relations. Hey Vlad, your crack troops are getting their asses handed to them by western weaponry. If you could have cut off the supply, you would have already. STFU and take your losses. i'm wondering why the russian forces in Belarus haven't moved south into western Ukraine to try to throttle that resupply. |
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Originally Posted By Cobradriver: I just got done watching his Ft. Benning presentation. Jesus. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0CQsifJrMc It's an hour but worth it. View Quote Holy cow. Mind = blown. The stuff around 44 minutes was super enlightening. |
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Daddy loves you. Now go away.
Ruthless ruler of cubicle B300.2C.983 |
Originally Posted By hondaciv: Units of the occupying forces were instructed to move to "self-sufficiency". This means that the command of the Russian army has legalized looting. It also may mean they might be having trouble re-supplying them. View Quote That might work for food and water. How about fuel and ammo? Seems to me that whatever stores there are for that are in Ukrainian military's hands. |
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Originally Posted By Nailcrusher: And that’s what makes this situation so dangerous to the world. Cornering a powerful, desperate man might cause him to do unthinkable things. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Nailcrusher: Originally Posted By HIPPO: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can’t see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn’t discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. Agree. Putin is painting himself into a coffin corner w/o someone giving him a big fucking off ramp. And that’s what makes this situation so dangerous to the world. Cornering a powerful, desperate man might cause him to do unthinkable things. Putin has to be made to sit the fuck down and ultimately be removed from power. The off ramp has to be mixed with an equal measure of overwhelming force and resolve so the west proves that it cannot be blackmailed by his threats of strategic forces, nuclear fallout, other cbrn hostilities, and further imperialist actions against Europe. It can’t be resolved and settled without that, including the complete handover of Crimea, independence of Donbas, and sea change in UKR governance and alliances, etc. If it is, then this is just the set-up for a subsequent and much larger war. The west should do everything it can to remove Putin and beat the Russian army in the field. That remains to be seen so far. The west is afraid to take decisive direct action because they think Putin has the means and mindset to follow through on his threats. |
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Originally Posted By _disconnector_: Can you imagine what would happen if we came to blows with the fucking Russian *navy*? Because that's what happens if they start boarding and seizing US flagged vessels. Their entire rinky dink blue water force would be on the bottom before the ink was dry on the Russian order. They are incredibly weak in that arena - I can't imagine Putin being that stupid. But of course I didn't think he was stupid enough to invade Ukraine either so what do I know. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By _disconnector_: Originally Posted By juan223: Originally Posted By outofbattery: Russia said that ships carrying weapons to Ukraine would be considered legitimate military targets. I assume this is a ploy to try to get merchant ships scared to sail,I can't see them being stupid enough to do something like trying to sink a freighter in the North Sea or Med they came to the conclusion was carrying weapons. Every day that passes without a Russian flag over Kyiv the greater the chances Putin behaves even more irrationally so I honestly wouldn't discount the possibility of anything,including something to provoke NATO. yea, I wonder if they'll start boarding and searching stuff in international waters like we do But of course I didn't think he was stupid enough to invade Ukraine either so what do I know. Need to remind you, we have Biden as President. This is the guy that was one of two votes not to take out Bin Laden (Valerie Jarrett was the other no vote). |
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