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Posted: 9/23/2022 9:53:56 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
With what? |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 9:55:23 PM EST
[#2]
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/23/us/politics/putin-ukraine.html
Putin taking even more control of the invasion |
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IL, USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 9:56:05 PM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1Andy2: With what? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1Andy2: Originally Posted By HIPPO:
With what? 
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NZL
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Posted: 9/23/2022 9:56:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: TheLurker]
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1Andy2: With what? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1Andy2: Originally Posted By HIPPO:
With what? Hopium Edit. And rocks. 
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 9:58:59 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
"New"? I guess these guys never looked at....well, Russia's entire military history. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 9:59:31 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/23/us/politics/putin-ukraine.html Putin taking even more control of the invasion |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:00:46 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/23/us/politics/putin-ukraine.html Putin taking even more control of the invasion That worked out well for Hitler. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:08:45 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:12:16 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/23/us/politics/putin-ukraine.html Putin taking even more control of the invasion That will truly make things even better and smoother |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:13:18 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlabamaFan64: That worked out well for Hitler. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlabamaFan64: Originally Posted By stgdz: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/23/us/politics/putin-ukraine.html Putin taking even more control of the invasion That worked out well for Hitler. As well as Saddam Hussein |
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USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:22:03 PM EST
[#11]
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:24:13 PM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdWPemdXwAMbQsk?format=jpg&name=large For some reason, what's written in small letters isn't translated. It says: "However, in the future never expect Russia to liberate you. Now you know what happens when someone is counting on foreign invaders". Oh, it says "Time to go home" on the very top. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:26:21 PM EST
[#13]
Russia can’t help but continually prove WHY it’s border countries are armed to the teeth.
It’s one thing to act like a complete asshole- it’s completely infuriating when you try playing the victim. Of course the referendum is bullshit. And if you’re a true believer and want to be part of that goat fuck country then pack your shit and move there. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:33:53 PM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sq40: Wonder what would happen if all of the referendums failed for Putin? Would that give him an out?  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:38:33 PM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SkiShooter: I am about 4 months and 2/3 of the way through Duolngo’s Ukrainian lessons. I am learning words and phrases and probably know enough to get by as a tourist. Learning the grammar has been a challenge. I am supplementing it with resources and podcasts through Ukrainian.Lessons.com. The opportunity to practice with native speakers is critical to becoming fluent. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SkiShooter: Originally Posted By CenterMass762: Originally Posted By sq40: Originally Posted By dillydilly: Originally Posted By sq40: Thank you! Any other major city/oblast pronunciations that westerners get wrong? I don’t want to misspeak again. Ya Kharkiv. Same thing, K is silent. That’s about all I can think of. I’m sure someone else will chime in with some others. Thank you. Now I need to learn the alphabet. Hell, I might learn Ukrainian on one of those apps. It may come in handy one day. Duolingo is a pretty good app. I am about 4 months and 2/3 of the way through Duolngo’s Ukrainian lessons. I am learning words and phrases and probably know enough to get by as a tourist. Learning the grammar has been a challenge. I am supplementing it with resources and podcasts through Ukrainian.Lessons.com. The opportunity to practice with native speakers is critical to becoming fluent. Good luck with that. I lived there and studies for two years before I became halfway proficient, another to become fluent. Still takes me two weeks to get it back after not using it. In Ukraine there will be a ton of slang or mixed Ukrainian/Russian. You have to go live there to learn it. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:45:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: Capta]
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: We all know that. He is just wondering what putin would do if somehow it went against him. IF putin wants out of this, it would be a great opportunity. But I think putin is only willing to win or burn the world if he can't have it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By Dominion21: Is that a joke? The Russians determined the outcome of this referendum long before it ever began. There is no “referendum.” It is a complete, total, 100% farce. We all know that. He is just wondering what putin would do if somehow it went against him. IF putin wants out of this, it would be a great opportunity. But I think putin is only willing to win or burn the world if he can't have it. OK, to answer the question seriously, no. First, it would be essentially a full admission to the Russian public that the war against Ukraine all the way back to 2014 was hogwash. The Russian public can (now) question the tactics, the preparation, and the competence of certain individuals, but they will NEVER be allowed to question the justifications for the war, which of course is the only important question. Second, if he wanted to bail out via that method, he wouldn’t be mobilizing. Mobilization will be a disaster, but Putin believes not mobilizing will be worse at least for his goals. Mobilization is a massive escalation and not one that I would file under “escalate to de-escalate.” The ramifications are too bad and long term. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:50:01 PM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Chaingun: Pellets will take out drones They need an shotgun type ammo that ignites so many feet out Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Chaingun: Originally Posted By 4xGM300m: They only use small burst when hunting drones, 8 to 12 rounds, the BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT videos aren't showing the normal use of the Gepard. And the Germans delivered more ammo earlier, 53k plus 4k training ammo. 2,1k per vehicle with the latest delivery, not much but better than nothing. The Swiss are blocking more ammo, the German Army had no more ammo because the Gepard was decommissioned years ago. They need an shotgun type ammo that ignites so many feet out watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones.  MATADOR DE DRONES (ENXAMES) Counter UAS - RheinMetall Oerlikon MK3 - GUN X DRONE REAL FIRE 23-06-21 |
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WI, USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 10:57:12 PM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
Trés riche. 1%??? They have 30.000.000 reserves???  Doubt.
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FL, USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:00:37 PM EST
[Last Edit: Saltwater-Hillbilly]
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: OK, to answer the question seriously, no. First, it would be essentially a full admission to the Russian public that the war against Ukraine all the way back to 2014 was hogwash. The Russian public can (no) question the tactics, the preparation, and the competence of certain individuals, but they will NEVER be allowed to question the justifications for the war, which of course is the only important question. Second, if he wanted to bail out via that method, he wouldn’t be mobilizing. Mobilization will be a disaster, but Putin believes not mobilizing will be worse at least for his goals. Mobilization is a massive escalation and not one that I would file under “escalate to de-escalate.” The ramifications are too bad and long term. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By Dominion21: Is that a joke? The Russians determined the outcome of this referendum long before it ever began. There is no “referendum.” It is a complete, total, 100% farce. We all know that. He is just wondering what putin would do if somehow it went against him. IF putin wants out of this, it would be a great opportunity. But I think putin is only willing to win or burn the world if he can't have it. OK, to answer the question seriously, no. First, it would be essentially a full admission to the Russian public that the war against Ukraine all the way back to 2014 was hogwash. The Russian public can (no) question the tactics, the preparation, and the competence of certain individuals, but they will NEVER be allowed to question the justifications for the war, which of course is the only important question. Second, if he wanted to bail out via that method, he wouldn’t be mobilizing. Mobilization will be a disaster, but Putin believes not mobilizing will be worse at least for his goals. Mobilization is a massive escalation and not one that I would file under “escalate to de-escalate.” The ramifications are too bad and long term. The problem with the "Escalate to Deescalate" strategy is it can quickly spiral out of control if the other side doesn't respond in the desired fashion, or if the escalating party miscalculates. The Cuban Missile Crisis, the Japanese takeover of French Indochina, the Serbian-sponsored assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand, The Russian Czar's mobilization against the Imperial Germans, and so forth. Ultimately, things can end badly for one side (such as such as the USSR's partial backdown over Cuba and Khrushchev's removal from power) or both sides (WWI, The Pacific portion of WWII, etc). |
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USA
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:11:05 PM EST
[#20]
Developing pending corroboration. |
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SOM
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:11:06 PM EST
[#21]
I just watched the return of the POWs from Azov on Zolkins youtube channel. They said that they lost 20 to 25 kilos on average while in captivity and they look it. All were very skinny to almost gaunt.
Fortunately it seems that the women were treated much better. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:17:25 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
Developing pending corroboration. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:30:24 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By wildturkey09: I just watched the return of the POWs from Azov on Zolkins youtube channel. They said that they lost 20 to 25 kilos on average while in captivity and they look it. All were very skinny to almost gaunt. Fortunately it seems that the women were treated much better. They may have actually been fed but I'd be surprised if they were actually treated better. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:32:55 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp2irqTXikgQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By Chaingun: Originally Posted By 4xGM300m: They only use small burst when hunting drones, 8 to 12 rounds, the BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT videos aren't showing the normal use of the Gepard. And the Germans delivered more ammo earlier, 53k plus 4k training ammo. 2,1k per vehicle with the latest delivery, not much but better than nothing. The Swiss are blocking more ammo, the German Army had no more ammo because the Gepard was decommissioned years ago. They need an shotgun type ammo that ignites so many feet out watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp2irqTXikg |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:36:03 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Chaingun: It took out what looks like static UAVs sitting in one location. Some room for improvement Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Chaingun: Originally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By Chaingun: Originally Posted By 4xGM300m: They only use small burst when hunting drones, 8 to 12 rounds, the BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT videos aren't showing the normal use of the Gepard. And the Germans delivered more ammo earlier, 53k plus 4k training ammo. 2,1k per vehicle with the latest delivery, not much but better than nothing. The Swiss are blocking more ammo, the German Army had no more ammo because the Gepard was decommissioned years ago. They need an shotgun type ammo that ignites so many feet out watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp2irqTXikgIn a 38 minute video no one will watch. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:46:39 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: I'd really like to know what the plan is. Ukraine is chewing up russian troops. If putin gets the idea he is going to lose this, he is going to launch a tactical nuke on the battlefield. Then what? Biden has issued a very stern warning. What could we possibly do to russia now without actually shooting at them with american forces? If we do that, it's war. Are we ready to get into an actual war with russia after they have proven they will use nukes? I'm sure everybody is hoping somebody inside russia is going to remove or kill him. Or russia will revolt. We better not depend on that. People already said putin would not use national mobilization. He's doing it while calling it something else. And the second he made the announcement, agents with lists were going door to door handing out notices for people to show up. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By 4xGM300m: I don't think that Biden decides anything. He is doing what he is getting told. I'd really like to know what the plan is. Ukraine is chewing up russian troops. If putin gets the idea he is going to lose this, he is going to launch a tactical nuke on the battlefield. Then what? Biden has issued a very stern warning. What could we possibly do to russia now without actually shooting at them with american forces? If we do that, it's war. Are we ready to get into an actual war with russia after they have proven they will use nukes? I'm sure everybody is hoping somebody inside russia is going to remove or kill him. Or russia will revolt. We better not depend on that. People already said putin would not use national mobilization. He's doing it while calling it something else. And the second he made the announcement, agents with lists were going door to door handing out notices for people to show up. I think the answer to this question from the west’s perspective is “what is next?” Let’s say Russia uses nuclear weapons in Ukraine. IMO, most likely it will be multiple, possibly including population centers. A “demonstration” nuke will almost certainly not produce any results against the Ukrainian will to fight, so why bother? No, they will try to blow holes in the Ukrainian army, and destroy the infrastructure (including cities) necessary to bring in western supplies. I’ve said before that we already had indications that the Ukrainian army is in a nuclear defensive posture - i.e. dispersed as much as possible. So this won’t be a case of dropping a nuke on a brigade or two and being done with it. It would probably take a dozen tactical nukes to have the desired effect on a sector of the line. Point is, having demonstrated the will to win at any cost in Ukraine - what next for Russia? Can there be any doubt whatsoever in the West that Putin will do the same against the Baltics? Poland? Finland? If Russia goes nuclear it is IMMEDIATELY an existential issue for Europe. Not a new cold war. Not a “lets see how this plays out.” The question that should be asked is not “how will the west respond” but “will the west give Russia that chance?” |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:48:49 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: Hopefully they can get to the artillery and raise hell. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: Originally Posted By HIPPO:
Developing pending corroboration. That wuld be good, but they may be going for the rail tracks. That’s a railhead and an axis of advance that puts them astride the main route supplying the Southern and Western front.  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:49:24 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: OK, to answer the question seriously, no. First, it would be essentially a full admission to the Russian public that the war against Ukraine all the way back to 2014 was hogwash. The Russian public can (no) question the tactics, the preparation, and the competence of certain individuals, but they will NEVER be allowed to question the justifications for the war, which of course is the only important question. Second, if he wanted to bail out via that method, he wouldn’t be mobilizing. Mobilization will be a disaster, but Putin believes not mobilizing will be worse at least for his goals. Mobilization is a massive escalation and not one that I would file under “escalate to de-escalate.” The ramifications are too bad and long term. He bet he could take Ukraine in a week, he lost. So he doubled down. Then doubled down again. I really do think at this point he is a poker player on tilt. He has to win it all back, he has to. I think for him admitting he lost and facing the music back home would be a lot worse than launching a nuke in the hopes of winning. |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:50:12 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: That wuld be good, but they may be going for the rail tracks. That's a railhead and an axis of advance that puts them astride the main route supplying the Southern and Western front. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/556465/8BDEAD90-2CAC-4C4E-B90A-33CAF61F52E3_jpe-2537072.JPG |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:52:27 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jack67: That wuld be good, but they may be going for the rail tracks. That’s a railhead and an axis of advance that puts them astride the main route supplying the Southern and Western front. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/556465/8BDEAD90-2CAC-4C4E-B90A-33CAF61F52E3_jpe-2537072.JPG Is it plausible that the entire reason the russians bought the Iranian loitering suicide drones was specifically to find and destroy the himars? |
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Posted: 9/23/2022 11:58:15 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HIPPO:
In May? |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 12:11:49 AM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kagetora: In a 38 minute video no one will watch. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kagetora: Originally Posted By Chaingun: Originally Posted By AROKIE: Originally Posted By Chaingun: Originally Posted By 4xGM300m: They only use small burst when hunting drones, 8 to 12 rounds, the BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT videos aren't showing the normal use of the Gepard. And the Germans delivered more ammo earlier, 53k plus 4k training ammo. 2,1k per vehicle with the latest delivery, not much but better than nothing. The Swiss are blocking more ammo, the German Army had no more ammo because the Gepard was decommissioned years ago. They need an shotgun type ammo that ignites so many feet out watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp2irqTXikgIn a 38 minute video no one will watch. the first 3 mins is all you need to watch. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 12:40:39 AM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: I think the answer to this question from the west’s perspective is “what is next?” Let’s say Russia uses nuclear weapons in Ukraine. IMO, most likely it will be multiple, possibly including population centers. A “demonstration” nuke will almost certainly not produce any results against the Ukrainian will to fight, so why bother? No, they will try to blow holes in the Ukrainian army, and destroy the infrastructure (including cities) necessary to bring in western supplies. I’ve said before that we already had indications that the Ukrainian army is in a nuclear defensive posture - i.e. dispersed as much as possible. So this won’t be a case of dropping a nuke on a brigade or two and being done with it. It would probably take a dozen tactical nukes to have the desired effect on a sector of the line. Point is, having demonstrated the will to win at any cost in Ukraine - what next for Russia? Can there be any doubt whatsoever in the West that Putin will do the same against the Baltics? Poland? Finland? If Russia goes nuclear it is IMMEDIATELY an existential issue for Europe. Not a new cold war. Not a “lets see how this plays out.” The question that should be asked is not “how will the west respond” but “will the west give Russia that chance?” Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By 4xGM300m: I don't think that Biden decides anything. He is doing what he is getting told. I'd really like to know what the plan is. Ukraine is chewing up russian troops. If putin gets the idea he is going to lose this, he is going to launch a tactical nuke on the battlefield. Then what? Biden has issued a very stern warning. What could we possibly do to russia now without actually shooting at them with american forces? If we do that, it's war. Are we ready to get into an actual war with russia after they have proven they will use nukes? I'm sure everybody is hoping somebody inside russia is going to remove or kill him. Or russia will revolt. We better not depend on that. People already said putin would not use national mobilization. He's doing it while calling it something else. And the second he made the announcement, agents with lists were going door to door handing out notices for people to show up. I think the answer to this question from the west’s perspective is “what is next?” Let’s say Russia uses nuclear weapons in Ukraine. IMO, most likely it will be multiple, possibly including population centers. A “demonstration” nuke will almost certainly not produce any results against the Ukrainian will to fight, so why bother? No, they will try to blow holes in the Ukrainian army, and destroy the infrastructure (including cities) necessary to bring in western supplies. I’ve said before that we already had indications that the Ukrainian army is in a nuclear defensive posture - i.e. dispersed as much as possible. So this won’t be a case of dropping a nuke on a brigade or two and being done with it. It would probably take a dozen tactical nukes to have the desired effect on a sector of the line. Point is, having demonstrated the will to win at any cost in Ukraine - what next for Russia? Can there be any doubt whatsoever in the West that Putin will do the same against the Baltics? Poland? Finland? If Russia goes nuclear it is IMMEDIATELY an existential issue for Europe. Not a new cold war. Not a “lets see how this plays out.” The question that should be asked is not “how will the west respond” but “will the west give Russia that chance?” The use of a nuclear bluff to scare the west appears at this point to be a non-issue in terms of dissuading the west from supplying Ukraine with arms and keeping the sanctions on Russia. If Russia uses a nuke at all in Ukraine, that immediately changes the calculus from a blustering bluff to an immediate nuclear threat to NATO. Once that genie is let out of the bottle, it can't be put back in. NATO won't give Russia the chance to do that again because they know that an attack on NATO is a foregone conclusion once a nuclear weapon, even a tactical one, is used anywhere in Europe. Further, the Russian economy is in freefall and can't support a war effort much longer. If Putin thinks Russia is going to collapse or he is going to take a dirt nap, he may very well think it's time to go out with a bang. NATO knows that once it looks like he's going to go out in a blaze (no glory, just a blaze), they have to launch. There has been speculation that the US or a western country has an asset very high up in Putin's inner circle. Most likely between "regular" ISR that monitors their nuclear posture and locations of their mobile nuclear forces and the asset's intel, NATO will know very quickly if something is up. It's also possible that the "asset" somebody in the west has would be in a position to put a bullet in Putin's forehead should Putin decide to try to bring about WW3 or at a minimum would be in a position to start a successful coup. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 1:10:50 AM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By gentlemanfarmer: Good luck with that. I lived there and studies for two years before I became halfway proficient, another to become fluent. Still takes me two weeks to get it back after not using it. In Ukraine there will be a ton of slang or mixed Ukrainian/Russian. You have to go live there to learn it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By gentlemanfarmer: Originally Posted By SkiShooter: Originally Posted By CenterMass762: Originally Posted By sq40: Originally Posted By dillydilly: Originally Posted By sq40: Thank you! Any other major city/oblast pronunciations that westerners get wrong? I don’t want to misspeak again. Ya Kharkiv. Same thing, K is silent. That’s about all I can think of. I’m sure someone else will chime in with some others. Thank you. Now I need to learn the alphabet. Hell, I might learn Ukrainian on one of those apps. It may come in handy one day. Duolingo is a pretty good app. I am about 4 months and 2/3 of the way through Duolngo’s Ukrainian lessons. I am learning words and phrases and probably know enough to get by as a tourist. Learning the grammar has been a challenge. I am supplementing it with resources and podcasts through Ukrainian.Lessons.com. The opportunity to practice with native speakers is critical to becoming fluent. Good luck with that. I lived there and studies for two years before I became halfway proficient, another to become fluent. Still takes me two weeks to get it back after not using it. In Ukraine there will be a ton of slang or mixed Ukrainian/Russian. You have to go live there to learn it. Yep, I understand that. Hoping to be able to spend time in Ukraine to do that in the future. My grandparents from both sides of my family are from there and I want to visit there where they lived. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 1:50:32 AM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp2irqTXikgI’ve been lusting after Rhinemetals creations for years hoping one day to see them in use in a theater of war. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 2:21:26 AM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: I think the answer to this question from the west’s perspective is “what is next?” Let’s say Russia uses nuclear weapons in Ukraine. IMO, most likely it will be multiple, possibly including population centers. A “demonstration” nuke will almost certainly not produce any results against the Ukrainian will to fight, so why bother? No, they will try to blow holes in the Ukrainian army, and destroy the infrastructure (including cities) necessary to bring in western supplies. I’ve said before that we already had indications that the Ukrainian army is in a nuclear defensive posture - i.e. dispersed as much as possible. So this won’t be a case of dropping a nuke on a brigade or two and being done with it. It would probably take a dozen tactical nukes to have the desired effect on a sector of the line. Point is, having demonstrated the will to win at any cost in Ukraine - what next for Russia? Can there be any doubt whatsoever in the West that Putin will do the same against the Baltics? Poland? Finland? If Russia goes nuclear it is IMMEDIATELY an existential issue for Europe. Not a new cold war. Not a “lets see how this plays out.” The question that should be asked is not “how will the west respond” but “will the west give Russia that chance?” Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By stone-age: Originally Posted By 4xGM300m: I don't think that Biden decides anything. He is doing what he is getting told. I'd really like to know what the plan is. Ukraine is chewing up russian troops. If putin gets the idea he is going to lose this, he is going to launch a tactical nuke on the battlefield. Then what? Biden has issued a very stern warning. What could we possibly do to russia now without actually shooting at them with american forces? If we do that, it's war. Are we ready to get into an actual war with russia after they have proven they will use nukes? I'm sure everybody is hoping somebody inside russia is going to remove or kill him. Or russia will revolt. We better not depend on that. People already said putin would not use national mobilization. He's doing it while calling it something else. And the second he made the announcement, agents with lists were going door to door handing out notices for people to show up. I think the answer to this question from the west’s perspective is “what is next?” Let’s say Russia uses nuclear weapons in Ukraine. IMO, most likely it will be multiple, possibly including population centers. A “demonstration” nuke will almost certainly not produce any results against the Ukrainian will to fight, so why bother? No, they will try to blow holes in the Ukrainian army, and destroy the infrastructure (including cities) necessary to bring in western supplies. I’ve said before that we already had indications that the Ukrainian army is in a nuclear defensive posture - i.e. dispersed as much as possible. So this won’t be a case of dropping a nuke on a brigade or two and being done with it. It would probably take a dozen tactical nukes to have the desired effect on a sector of the line. Point is, having demonstrated the will to win at any cost in Ukraine - what next for Russia? Can there be any doubt whatsoever in the West that Putin will do the same against the Baltics? Poland? Finland? If Russia goes nuclear it is IMMEDIATELY an existential issue for Europe. Not a new cold war. Not a “lets see how this plays out.” The question that should be asked is not “how will the west respond” but “will the west give Russia that chance?” Good assessment. Regardless of the hand wringing by the Neville Chamberlain types, even a single act of nuclear aggression by Russia could not go unanswered. And it's more likely to be multiples, which will guarantee a response. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 2:43:03 AM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By grambosc: Good assessment. Regardless of the hand wringing by the Neville Chamberlain types, even a single act of nuclear aggression by Russia could not go unanswered. And it's more likely to be multiples, which will guarantee a response. People keep using this word. I don't know what you can do to somebody who has just proven they will launch nukes, unless you nuke them first. You can't do something to somebody who just launched a nuke and expect they won't launch a nuke at you. Or a half dozen nukes at you. They just nuked somebody. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 3:07:01 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AROKIE: watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp2irqTXikgAHEAD ammo, in 35 mm for Oerlikon guns. Which principally is the gun system of the Gepard. Hermann |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 3:09:13 AM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DPeacher: I smell bullshit. https://countryeconomy.com/countries/compare/italy/cuba?sc=XE34 Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DPeacher: Originally Posted By THOT_Vaccine: Italy has a per capita GDP slightly lower than Cuba. Turn off the EU money spigot and that tard won't have a paycheck. I smell bullshit. https://countryeconomy.com/countries/compare/italy/cuba?sc=XE34 Because it is. ruSSia has the economic power of italy, Cuba is a dwarf. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 3:34:21 AM EST
[Last Edit: Jack67]
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stone-age: People keep using this word. I don't know what you can do to somebody who has just proven they will launch nukes, unless you nuke them first. You can't do something to somebody who just launched a nuke and expect they won't launch a nuke at you. Or a half dozen nukes at you. They just nuked somebody. They just nuked a non-nuclear somebody. Bullies think differently when someone can hit back. But honestly, it may not even require a reaction. Global outrage would cut off Russia in a heartbeat. It’s moving that way anyway. Their own territories would likely start seceding - what’s Moscow going to do, nuke Vladivostock? The Russian far east would split off rapidly, for a start, I bet. Using a nuke would end Russia as it now as a political entity. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:07:20 AM EST
[#41]
Perspective on nuke usage starts about 3:25:
 Russia''s threats ''don''t add up'' | Justin Bronk |
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NZL
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:28:19 AM EST
[#42]
Wtf? Russia issuing large black bags with their uniforms to the newly conscripted victims. Is the idea to save on the logistics by issuing everyone with their own bodybag? |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:37:16 AM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alex9661: For some reason, what's written in small letters isn't translated. It says: "However, in the future never expect Russia to liberate you. Now you know what happens when someone is counting on foreign invaders". Oh, it says "Time to go home" on the very top. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Alex9661: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdWPemdXwAMbQsk?format=jpg&name=large For some reason, what's written in small letters isn't translated. It says: "However, in the future never expect Russia to liberate you. Now you know what happens when someone is counting on foreign invaders". Oh, it says "Time to go home" on the very top. I don't understand what all of that means in context. |
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NZL
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:37:31 AM EST
[#44]
A few days back someone was joking about new orc conscripts being issued rusty rifles.... Looks like that is already the accepted approach.
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:45:06 AM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By THOT_Vaccine: Google the phrase "EU PIGS" You can buy houses throughout Italy for one shiny euro... people left because the place sucks, and their birthrate is non-existent. Literally half the houses are vacant and have been owned by the state for years. Please stop posting when you have zero clue what you are talking about, thanks. |
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NZL
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:45:23 AM EST
[#46]
Those Russian girls be cold and calculating, yo... 
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:50:33 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BerettaGuy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQVrcaBfsCwEmotional Goodbyes Across Russia As Ukraine Mobilization Begins As hardcore pro-Ukrainian I have been all of my life, this is sad to watch what Putin is doing to Russian families. I hope the fucker gets it like Mussolini did. And soon. I hope none of them comes back. Ends 6 feet deep in Ukrainian soil or deserts the second they can and never goes back to that shithole ruSSia. |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:53:53 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dillydilly: I’ve been lusting after Rhinemetals creations for years hoping one day to see them in use in a theater of war. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By dillydilly: Originally Posted By AROKIE: watch this video of Rhinemetal anti UAS drone system. this needs to be in Ukraine! it shoots shells that explode pellets right in front of the drone or swarms of drones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp2irqTXikgI’ve been lusting after Rhinemetals creations for years hoping one day to see them in use in a theater of war. Would be awesome to see!! |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 4:59:23 AM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TheLurker:
Those Russian girls be cold and calculating, yo... cant let a chance at a new car go to waste! hahahahaha |
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Posted: 9/24/2022 5:28:39 AM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1Andy2: With what? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1Andy2: Originally Posted By HIPPO:
With what? With finely crafted trebuchet, made from stronk Siberian pine. |
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