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Posted: 11/4/2022 12:55:17 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By borderpatrol: It's dog like..... Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By borderpatrol: Originally Posted By stone-age: Nobody loves dogs more than I do. But I'm not sure that counts as a "dog". It's dog like..... What ever it was, I got all blinky when it shot out into the doods arms. Id name it hair ball or hair bag. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 12:57:25 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: I think you are confusing bio labs with bio WEAPONS labs. Just prior to the invasion, it was the Biden State Department spokeswoman that told the press about US funded bio labs in Ukraine that are being evacuated and expressed concern over Russians capturing their data. The bio labs in Ukraine had JACK SHIT to do with the Russian invasion and has been explained away as being there for studying Soviet era bio weapons stuff (BS imho). But to say there were no US bio labs in Ukraine makes you sound dishonest, like you are covering up something and probably triggering some of the paranoid people on the right. Now back to the war... Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: Originally Posted By weptek911: Me too. His first mention of Ukrainian bio labs I was out. That and his generally anti Ukraine POV. I think you are confusing bio labs with bio WEAPONS labs. Just prior to the invasion, it was the Biden State Department spokeswoman that told the press about US funded bio labs in Ukraine that are being evacuated and expressed concern over Russians capturing their data. The bio labs in Ukraine had JACK SHIT to do with the Russian invasion and has been explained away as being there for studying Soviet era bio weapons stuff (BS imho). But to say there were no US bio labs in Ukraine makes you sound dishonest, like you are covering up something and probably triggering some of the paranoid people on the right. Now back to the war... "US bio labs in Ukraine" sounds dishonest. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:05:40 PM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Et2ss: Damn, you can see the jet blow right through that turret Pretty sure that's an NLAW because of the top attack mode. You can see the seeker head go skittering off after the downward warhead does its thing |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:08:45 PM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By meistermash: What ever it was, I got all blinky when it shot out into the doods arms. Id name it hair ball or hair bag. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:13:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: trapsh00ter99]
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cincinnatus: "US bio labs in Ukraine" sounds dishonest. Maybe we are bordering on off-topic, but what is going on in the information space is very much news, and is worthy of being shared, especially personal encounters and how things are developing. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:19:55 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: I'm glad to see so many of us have noticed the same things. Independently we each have come to very similar conclusions. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: We had a new commercial tenant stop by yesterday I had to give some paperwork too and he saw my multicam hat and asked if I served, I said no I just like the hat. He said he served and had full totes of old gear if I needed anything and I said "I don't, but I am collecting and shipping stuff to soldiers in Ukraine if you have anything you want to get rid of. My wife is from there and her whole family still lives there." Within 30 seconds, he had mentioned "Zelensky comedian, what's that about" and "but did you hear of the biolabs" and "we have no idea what the truth is". We talked for about 15 minutes, and I could tell he wasn't very informed of the day to day evolution of the war. It seemed he had the illusion of it was like the GWOT, with FOBs and such. I had to explain this is much more like a WWI or WWII type, as there is a very well defined general front line. I tried to not address the political stuff as much as the humanitarian angle. People are forming their opinions with little or no knowledge outside of what Posobiec or Tucker say, talk about that stuff with authority, but then claim "we have no idea what the truth is". Edit: also, good post Ryan_Ruck Wait... You guys aren't getting a paycheck from Zman like me?  
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:20:09 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cincinnatus: "US bio labs in Ukraine" sounds dishonest. It's peak intellectual dishonesty. And folks here gobble it up. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:21:07 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Maybe we are bordering on off-topic, but what is going on in the information space is very much news, and is worthy of being shared, especially personal encounters and how things are developing. I know some people view it as off topic, but you are 100% correct- what's happening in the information space very much matters to the war effort in a variety of ways. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:22:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: SuperSixOne]
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: It's peak intellectual dishonesty. And folks here gobble it up. They are closer culturally than the US/Canada, but Russian IO has GD lost in the sauce. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:27:48 PM EST
[#10]
 Failed To Load Title |
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USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:36:42 PM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fadedsun: It's peak intellectual dishonesty. And folks here gobble it up. The problem is partly impossible to avoid. The US clearly does do biological research at labs in Ukraine. The Pentagon says this: "The Biological Threat Reduction Program (BTRP), part of the Department of Defense’s Cooperative Threat Reduction (CTR) Program, is implemented by the Defense Threat Reduction Agency (DTRA). Since 2005, BTRP has partnered with the Government of Ukraine to support peaceful and safe biological detection and diagnostic capabilities and to reduce the threats posed by pathogens." In the information war, neither side wants to admit to anything anyone could ever use as propaganda, so the initial claims of "US bioweapon labs in Ukraine" were fiercely denied as misinformation. The problem comes when people realize that the Pentagon does do biological research in Ukraine, except it's at labs owned by Ukraine, not the US, and the research is said to be defensive in nature. Some people feel like they were lied to or tricked by the government. While the initial Russian claims were false, the rebuttal was not the entire truth, and so the arguments and propaganda continue. At the same time the US didn't want to say yeah we do research at these labs when the claim first came out, since you don't want to seem like you're agreeing or justifying something said or done by Russia. It's the nature of propaganda, it makes you question everything. In a way, while it seems like dumb Russian propaganda, it's actually very ingenious. It's a partially true claim, which whatever the US says in response allows Russia to claim a propaganda 'win'. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:37:08 PM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ludder093:
Wipe your tears. Mourn and honor your fallen. Return to the battle filled with implacable and terrible resolve. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:42:12 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Crazy how much the Netherlands is doing for such a small country. Must be the wooden shoes |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:42:53 PM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Circuits: Wipe your tears. Mourn and honor your fallen. Return to the battle filled with implacable and terrible resolve. This f**king war has just created about 100 years of Russian-hating Ukrainians. Generations . . . . CMOS |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:45:07 PM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CMOS: This f**king war has just created about 100 years of Russian-hating Ukrainians. Generations . . . . CMOS |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:53:58 PM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: Kind of like yellow journalism with a different approach? pretty much. We have been lied to pretty much forever. It was cranked up to 11 in this century. Praise xenu that we have so much information available now, it makes it tough for the lies to stick now. 
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:56:30 PM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Ruck: Wait... You guys aren't getting a paycheck from Zman like me? You bastard!
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Posted: 11/4/2022 1:58:14 PM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CharlieR: Nice post. That's excellent fieldcraft. Not "impressive"...but professionally done. Both sides would have been far better off building fighting positions like this then these silly trenches they build. And other then getting lumber, its not really much more difficult. Put a layer of sandbags on the roof and that would be a pretty good bunker. As is, the wood could direct a drone grenade's blast upward. The trashbag keeps you dry. If they had a spaceblanket or somethign reflective under the trashbag it would help out with thermal quite a bit. Take a look, kiddies, and compare/contrast with the orc-o-matic WWI trenches you see. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CharlieR: Originally Posted By Prime: Claimed to be a Ukrainian observation post by Russian TG. Actually pretty impressive.
Nice post. That's excellent fieldcraft. Not "impressive"...but professionally done. Both sides would have been far better off building fighting positions like this then these silly trenches they build. And other then getting lumber, its not really much more difficult. Put a layer of sandbags on the roof and that would be a pretty good bunker. As is, the wood could direct a drone grenade's blast upward. The trashbag keeps you dry. If they had a spaceblanket or somethign reflective under the trashbag it would help out with thermal quite a bit. Take a look, kiddies, and compare/contrast with the orc-o-matic WWI trenches you see. Are grenade sumps not a thing anymore? It seems to me that having a sump at the bottom of those stairs would be worth the effort. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:02:01 PM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Ruck: Wait... You guys aren't getting a paycheck from Zman like me? |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:02:37 PM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: You bastard! Still no ten percent here. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:04:08 PM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Yes. I have yet to encounter anyone that is making any sort of precision with that argument. It's always in a way used to justify why Russia invaded. Never what exactly it was, or why the purpose was, or evidence. You know if Russia had real nefarious evidence, it would be out. Maybe we are bordering on off-topic, but what is going on in the information space is very much news, and is worthy of being shared, especially personal encounters and how things are developing. I tell folks I have been in many "bio labs" similar to what was in Ukraine. I also tell them there is an agricultural "bio lab" within 200 miles of them. Most likely closer. Agricultural areas have them to keep an eye on what is making livestock and plants sick. They also look for the best ways to stop the sickness, and to prevent it in the future. There is nothing nefarious about making sure the stuff you eat is healthy, and doing your best to keep it that way. I'm kind of glad they are around. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:07:14 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: I just get death threats. Don't for get the big guy's 10% though. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: Originally Posted By Ryan_Ruck: Wait... You guys aren't getting a paycheck from Zman like me? Yeah, that part sucks. But what are you gonna do? 
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:08:31 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Ryan_Ruck: Yeah, that part sucks. But what are you gonna do? Stay in PANTSCON3, and see how things shake out. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:09:19 PM EST
[#24]
Wait you guys are getting paid?
Dammit I always miss out. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:11:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: Erno86]
[#25]
"WATCH: Secretary Of State Blinken Promises Continued U.S. Support For Ukraine At G-7 Meeting"  WATCH: Secretary of State Blinken promises continued U.S. support for Ukraine at G-7 meeting |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:12:03 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CMOS: This f**king war has just created about 100 years of Russian-hating Ukrainians. Generations . . . . CMOS Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CMOS: Originally Posted By Circuits: Wipe your tears. Mourn and honor your fallen. Return to the battle filled with implacable and terrible resolve. This f**king war has just created about 100 years of Russian-hating Ukrainians. Generations . . . . CMOS They have been hating on Russia for a lot longer |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:13:32 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: Stay in PANTSCON3, and see how things shake out. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: Originally Posted By Ryan_Ruck: Yeah, that part sucks. But what are you gonna do? Stay in PANTSCON3, and see how things shake out. Solid advice.
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MN, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:14:41 PM EST
[#28]
Any ideas on why we are seeing so many Russian lancets now instead of at the outset?
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:22:08 PM EST
[#29]
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:22:41 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Star_Scream: A good line from GD about this: " I don't care if he's factually correct he says what I want to hear" "The truth will set you free...but first it's going to piss you off." |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:23:44 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By johnh57: WW2 Pacific theatre, island hopping. Surround and bypass. I've been thinking the bypassing places could work. Like, surrounding Kherson, then "opening" a front door to allow the good guys out, monitored and controlled, and let the bad guys try to stay or scurry out the back. I think some cities were declared "Open Cites?" when the defenders knew the choice was complete destruction in city fighting, so they were yielded to the oncoming attackers to avoid massive destruction and civilian casualties?? Not sure that's a precedent that fits the Russian mindset, though. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:24:50 PM EST
[#32]
Our lawyer in Split sent us these pictures today. The USS H.W. Bush is in Split, Croatia. It's been quit a spectacle she says. Anyway, just thought I'd share since it was mentioned earlier in the thread.
 Attached File Attached File |
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AL, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:26:26 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: I just get death threats. Don't for get the big guy's 10% though. I seriously don't get it. I've seen others here mention getting them. Is it the same type of ppl clamoring our money should be spent elsewhere? If it is almost humorous that they aren't doing shit to improve anything yet will keyboard commando threaten others just for believing something they don't. "I'm not doing shit yet fuck you" |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:28:50 PM EST
[#34]
"Kharkiv Town Near Russian Border Vacant But Still Being Shelled"  Kharkiv Town Near Russian Border Vacant But Still Being Shelled |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:29:31 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BlackHoleSon: I seriously don't get it. I've seen others here mention getting them. Is it the same type of ppl clamoring our money should be spent elsewhere? If it is almost humorous that they aren't doing shit to improve anything yet will keyboard commando threaten others just for believing something they don't. "I'm not doing shit yet fuck you" |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:32:54 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: Any ideas on why we are seeing so many Russian lancets now instead of at the outset? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: Any ideas on why we are seeing so many Russian lancets now instead of at the outset? https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidhambling/2022/11/04/russian-videos-reveal-new-details-of-loitering-munitions/?sh=18d6e7c5dbce A series of videos released by the Russian Ministry of Defense reveal some interesting features of this new and dangerous weapon. “Lancets may not have been employed in large numbers earlier because Russia's initial invasion plans and the opening weeks and months of the war did not anticipate massive Ukrainian resistance and therefore the MOD may not have placed enough orders for these to be manufactured in large numbers,” Samuel Bendett, an expert on the Russian defense scene and adviser to the CNA and CNAS think tanks, told me. That now seems to have changed, though as we will see there are questions about the actual numbers. Made by a subsidiary of the Kalashnikov concern, the Lancet 3 weighs about thirty pounds, and has a distinctive profile thanks to its X-shaped wings. The weapon used is claimed to be a new, upgraded version of the Lancet-3 with an eleven-pound warhead compared to the original seven-pound one, and is distinguished by a larger wingspan. The gunboat video gives allows us to estimate size compared to the 4.8 metre width of the boat — the wingspan looks to be about 2.4 meters, compared to one meter for the original). The videos show Lancet strikes on a variety of targets, including S-300 air defense systems, tanks, artillery, trucks, self-propelled howitzers and radar systems, even a gunboat. The volume of such videos released in a few days suggests a propaganda push to persuade people that Russia has at least one weapon that works. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:43:39 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Easterner: Well our rolling blackouts are supposed to start today in Dnipro. There is a website where you enter your address to see what times you go dark. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/526834/Screenshot_2022-11-04-14-47-48-613_com_a-2587142.JPG |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:44:08 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lokifox: FIFY. Which marks one of the perplexing aspects of this war. Americans generally love the underdog and identify with them. Most people's understanding/knowledge of history is pathetic now though, so everything is topsy-turvy. Russian propaganda has been very prolific pushing the idea that russia is basically like conservative america and Ukraine wants to steal american money. It's a good tactic, effective points. Even putin says the right words in his speeches. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:45:53 PM EST
[#39]
"Ukraine's counter-offensive in Kherson: Trailing a Tank"  Ukraine's counter-offensive in Kherson: Trailing a tank unit • FRANCE 24 English |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:47:05 PM EST
[#40]
I wonder how the winter cold will effect the drones. Seems like it'd zap the battery. Not to mention icing
Especially the moped drones. aren't they gas powered? Hopefully they're carb'd.. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:50:07 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Cincinnatus: "US bio labs in Ukraine" sounds dishonest. I have no idea what the hell they are. The State dept. was talking about "evacuating" the 'US funded' bio labs in Ukraine. For all I know it could mean we gave them $500 total. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:51:43 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: That was a pretty epic close range tank kill. Wow!! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest: Originally Posted By Prime: 17 missing sailors from the cruiser "Moskva" were officially recognized as dead by a court in Sevastopol. For those who suddenly forgot, we gave Serpent's Island for these sailors, concluded an unnecessary "grain deal" for us, and also endangered our fleet and Crimea. https://t.me/separ_13/4798 UA soldier steps in close behind a Russian tank. Also reported as 1st Air Mobile.
That was a pretty epic close range tank kill. Wow!! Man, the balls on that guy stepping out in front of a tank with the gun pointed right at him. Couldn’t have been 100 yards. Maybe the UA infantry figured out the second (unhit) tank had a disabled gun or was out of ammo. Probably the unhit tank radioed the hit tank to warn them because they tried to spin the turret around. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:54:29 PM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By amanbearpig: The problem is partly impossible to avoid. The US clearly does do biological research at labs in Ukraine. The Pentagon says this: "The Biological Threat Reduction Program (BTRP), part of the Department of Defense’s Cooperative Threat Reduction (CTR) Program, is implemented by the Defense Threat Reduction Agency (DTRA). Since 2005, BTRP has partnered with the Government of Ukraine to support peaceful and safe biological detection and diagnostic capabilities and to reduce the threats posed by pathogens." In the information war, neither side wants to admit to anything anyone could ever use as propaganda, so the initial claims of "US bioweapon labs in Ukraine" were fiercely denied as misinformation. The problem comes when people realize that the Pentagon does do biological research in Ukraine, except it's at labs owned by Ukraine, not the US, and the research is said to be defensive in nature. Some people feel like they were lied to or tricked by the government. While the initial Russian claims were false, the rebuttal was not the entire truth, and so the arguments and propaganda continue. At the same time the US didn't want to say yeah we do research at these labs when the claim first came out, since you don't want to seem like you're agreeing or justifying something said or done by Russia. It's the nature of propaganda, it makes you question everything. In a way, while it seems like dumb Russian propaganda, it's actually very ingenious. It's a partially true claim, which whatever the US says in response allows Russia to claim a propaganda 'win'. Exactly!! |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:57:19 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DPeacher: Are grenade sumps not a thing anymore? It seems to me that having a sump at the bottom of those stairs would be worth the effort. First thing I thought also. The grenade sump is detailed in all the old manuals. Plus, after seeing all footage of both sides lobbing grenades into various positions, I would think having a sump would be minimum. Still it was a very nice position imo. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 2:58:09 PM EST
[#45]
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FL, USA
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Posted: 11/4/2022 3:01:37 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BlackHoleSon: I seriously don't get it. I've seen others here mention getting them. Is it the same type of ppl clamoring our money should be spent elsewhere? If it is almost humorous that they aren't doing shit to improve anything yet will keyboard commando threaten others just for believing something they don't. "I'm not doing shit yet fuck you" I dont see why it is so hard to believe in BOTH: that Ukraine is worthy of our full support AND that Joe Biden (and his family) is a totally corrupt grifter of the worst order and anything they say or do has to be viewed with suspicion. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 3:03:48 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By governmentman: Bakhmut is pretty much a giant woodchipper that Russians keep feeding themselves into. I do not understand their obsession with it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By governmentman: Originally Posted By borderpatrol: Originally Posted By TheLurker: Originally Posted By Zam18th: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fgs_3dMXoAAPoIe?format=png&name=medium The brutal kill rate continues Roughly another BTG in troops, tanks and APCs lost in a day. They've lost 3 or 4 btgs worth in the last few days. That just can't be sustainable for much longer. Russia has never been known to consider their losses when engaging in conflicts. When senior politburo members start dying in droves, they may reconsider their policies. Bakhmut is pretty much a giant woodchipper that Russians keep feeding themselves into. I do not understand their obsession with it. It doesn’t look like much until you look at a road and rail map. Basically their intent is to take Bakhmut and drive northwest to Sloviansk. After Bakhmut is there is little to stop them and the UA would have to fall back to Sloviansk. Ukraine has a lot of its industrial base in this area and Russia is trying to capture/destroy it. Losing Bakhmut is not a disaster for the UA and does not lose the war. The UA can just fall back and continue to play defense in depth. But it loses a good chunk of valuable territory and imposes economic costs on Ukraine they would probably like to avoid. Russia probably also wants to KISS for themselves - turn the fight into a toe-to-toe slugging match where they throw mobiks (which they don’t care about) into the grinder and force the UA to do likewise. Unless the UA can pull off another surprise attack against Melitopol (for example) which forces Russia to react, the UA may have little choice but to continue to fight the meatgrinder war in Bakhmut. Send in a few more M270s and give the Russians what they’re asking for. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 3:06:31 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: Crazy how much the Netherlands is doing for such a small country. Must be the wooden shoes Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By stgdz: Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Crazy how much the Netherlands is doing for such a small country. Must be the wooden shoes Before the start we sent a lot of Stingers and a lot of anti tank material. Due to NL's role in NATO being focussed on aviation and sea power we have don't have many big land based assets to send. That's also the reason to that construction with the refurbished tanks. |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 3:08:02 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bama_Rebel: I wonder how the winter cold will effect the drones. Seems like it'd zap the battery. Not to mention icing Especially the moped drones. aren't they gas powered? Hopefully they're carb'd.. Extreme cold makes most drone batteries unchargeable. You can warm them up indoors to a point where you can charge them but you better get them on the drone and pulling power out of them quickly to keep them warm once you take them outside. Cold also generally reduces the capacity of the packs. There's a pretty good likelihood the Shithead-136s are using carb'd engines based on what we've seen in the pictures. That would mean they'd probably not fire up on launch since it appears from the pictures we've seen they can't run the engines in the launcher beforehand. There may be a mixture control on the carb to account for that. That may be one of the reasons the Iranians have people on the ground there (that, and the rooskies are "f**king stupid".) |
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Posted: 11/4/2022 3:11:05 PM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: It doesn’t look like much until you look at a road and rail map. Basically their intent is to take Bakhmut and drive northwest to Sloviansk. After Bakhmut is there is little to stop them and the UA would have to fall back to Sloviansk. Ukraine has a lot of its industrial base in this area and Russia is trying to capture/destroy it. Losing Bakhmut is not a disaster for the UA and does not lose the war. The UA can just fall back and continue to play defense in depth. But it loses a good chunk of valuable territory and imposes economic costs on Ukraine they would probably like to avoid. Russia probably also wants to KISS for themselves - turn the fight into a toe-to-toe slugging match where they throw mobiks (which they don’t care about) into the grinder and force the UA to do likewise. Unless the UA can pull off another surprise attack against Melitopol (for example) which forces Russia to react, the UA may have little choice but to continue to fight the meatgrinder war in Bakhmut. Send in a few more M270s and give the Russians what they’re asking for. Ukraine has a pipeline of troops graduating every week. They have thousands going through training in and out of the country. |
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